Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: jonisondell on December 31, 2008, 02:40:30 pm
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vegetableoildiesel.co.uk, very helpfull forum
its true run your van on filtered veg oil same property as diesel
brought my kit for 180 quid, very simple to fit, fitting approx 1 day
done all the research so know whats what any questions just ask
very important best to use bosch diesel injector/pumps lucus will fail and cause damage to pump and head/block. people do use other pumps but lucus have a bad reputation.
pro's, no fuel bills costs just filters 2 quid off ebay near zero emmisions, transfer kit to another van no problems just spend a few hours researching you will be amazed.
cons, filtering oil just a bit messy do it in your garden shed, collection of oil you need a licience 140 quid for 3 years ive already collected 300 litres without one in 2 days, just talk to your local chinese, they have to pay for collection, you are only allowed to use 2500 lit per year and you are supposed to document this, blar blar blar!! whoes going to police this, your fumes will smell of veg oil.
i would think fitting this kit would invalidate any warrentys on newer vans
once you have got you filtration process sorted its very simple all you need is a 200 l oil drum and filters link to it
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum/viewthread.php?tid=10249&page=1#pid107429
visit http://www.dieselveg.com have a good look most information but kits expensive but good
brought mine from http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/products.html 180 quid
people have been using veg oil foy many years running cars vans lorries tractors boats ect
remember bosch pumps are the best lucus are the worst, should have done this years ago would have saved many thousands is fuel costs
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NEW veg oil is now dearer than diesel :(
even old chipshop oil is fetching 60 p a L
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Just don't try to run your van on 100% veg oil or even below 50% in this cold weather or your fuel system will glog up.
Most forums will recommend using a max of 75% only in mid summer and others will recommend mixing with petrol prior to filling up.
Very true about the Bosch and Lucus pumps as most forums will agree with that.
You will also have to inform your home insurance company that you are at least storing the veg oil at home or you could find yourself uninsured if anything happened.
Regards
MR H
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do your research, years ago you buy oil much cheeper have a look http://www.vegoil.me.uk/ slightly cheeper but its all about filtering used oil collect this for free or you can buy graded filtered oil for 40p litre 70p saving, havnt realy looked into bio diesel yet but that is quite big people making diesel much cheeper
www.greenteam-supermarket.com/oil-prices-delivery/prices-of-our-wvo/
best option is to filter waste oil zero cost
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pouring that crap into your tank is asking for trouble, i ran my old diesel van on bio diesel cause it was cheaper and i had nothing but problems, any slight cold and it wouldnt start, it did less mpg, it knackered the injectors, clogged my tank and filter, my van stunk of poop and i was followed by a cloud of smoke everywhere
i foolishly kept filling up with the crap and it nearly killed my van, the place selling it closed down cause it was killing peoples cars was in the local paper and everyone knew about it, the local scrap yard was filling up with old diesel cars which had been ran on veg oil and bio diesel
anyone putting that crap in there tanks and expecting a reliable van think again,
i've bought a van which runs on LPG gas which is now 38p per litre and i would never change it, its by far cheaper than a diesel. £10 of fuel does 180 miles, beat that with your diesel, my van has never failed to start and has been 100 percent reliable
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if you stick to the rules you should have no problems..
1 bosch pump/injector best pump.
2 properly filtered oil if you do it youself you know what you are putting into your tank you monitor the quality if you use incorrect filtered oil your asking for trouble.
3 correct switch over temp, if you switch over at a too low temp you get lumpy running. (there are ways around this)
i think times have changed now the kits you can buy are very complex processor controlled monitoring temps.
filtering of the oil is very important but simple, its done progresivly 600 then 100 50 10 then to 1 micron.
there are a lot of people out there using this system with no problems, its very big in france and germany people
doing big milage no problems
A Mercedes 300TD has done 58,374 miles on veg oil!
A Mercedes benz 250 TD has done 62,100 miles on veg oil!
A VW Bus T2/3 has done 93,150 miles on veg oil!
A Ford Fiesta has done 66,500 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Corsa B Combo has done 76,500 miles on veg oil!
A AUDI AUDI -TDI has done 80,000 miles on veg oil!
A VW Golf III has done 65,205 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Astra 1.7D has done 60,237 miles on veg oil!
A VW Golf SDI has done 65,000 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Astra 1.9 TD has done 70,000 miles on veg oil!
A Isuzu trooper (jackaroo in australia) four wheel drive has done 51,000 miles on veg oil!
A vauxhall 1.7td van astra has done 75,000 miles on veg oil!
A Hino FB14 has done 78,000 miles on veg oil!
A Citroen ZX Citroen ZX aura has done 120,000 miles on veg oil!
A toyota 1hz has done 75,000 miles on veg oil!
A fiat ulysse has done 256,000 miles on veg oil!
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If you spend an extra hour or 2 working instead messing about collecting from the Chinese and filtering oil you'd have covered the cost of your weeks fuel anyway ;) I think I'll give that one a miss thanks. :)
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you can filter a 200l drum in a coulpe of hours easy
1 litre at the pump @ roughly a quid??
saving 200 quid?
working at 100 pounds an hour??
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if you dont want to filter buy from
http://www.greenteam-supermarket.com/oil-prices-delivery/prices-of-our-wvo/
40 pence per ltre filtered to 1 micron very clear oil
or use bio diesel no mods to your engine at 61 pence a litre
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life is just too short ::)
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you can filter a 200l drum in a coulpe of hours easy
1 litre at the pump @ roughly a quid??
saving 200 quid?
working at 100 pounds an hour??
No what I'm saying is calculate how much time you spend start to finish including collecting the oil, changing filters, clearing up ect ect and then filling the van It wouldn't surprise me if it takes you an hour or 2 a week If your time is worth £20 or more an hour is it really worth it ?
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i get where your comming from but think long term.
i do approx 1500 miles month
1500/45mpg = 33 gals 4.5 lit to gal 150 quid saving
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I'll stick with the pumps, besides I don't need my exhaust making me hungry all day I spend enough time in the chippy as it is ;)
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i know loads of VW T4 owners who run 60 % 40 % and have done for years, they used to get it at cash and carry's for 19 quid a 25 L barrel, of course its now alot more and not worth it
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I run on bio and have had no probs as yet. But there was and will be those out there that say it's bad don't do it !! Do your home work and all will be ok . My 4x4 does 25 miles to the gallon so bio was a cheaper way to go, did look at chip fat and might have another look now it's coming down in price ( used that is).
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Once you have one of the high pressure injectors clog up/ pack in, and you pay £200 + vat + labour to replace it, not such a great bargain really.
Think very carefully about it in modern engines.
In pre common rail injection engines it is ok, until it gums the rings up and allows the engine to start sucking its own lubricating oil up into the cylinder, then it is impossible to switch off and will stop when it goes bang.
Other than those problems its great ;D
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1) you only get injector problems when viscocity of oil is wrong, ie not correct temp 35 deg or higher oil has to be thin, and oil has to be correctly filtered 5 or 1 micron. temp of oil should be measured off return hose.
2) yes contact kit suppliers for suiatability older diesels are suited better
3) veg oil burns nearly the same as diesel putting cold oil into a cold head will cause problems, switching over when warm is a must, problems start with cold oil and lucus pumps and poorly filtered oil
veg oil has been used since the 70s
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hey jonisondell that is not someting new i and some others in this forum and of course in the U K do it for a long time but now unfortunately veg oil is dearer than diesel by the lt
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Taxis and minicabs have been running on it for years, long before it was legal. The old nissan engine in the Fairway and TX1 taxis loved the stuff and many said their engines ran better on it than diesel.
However, in those days you could buy veg oil for half the price of diesel, today it is about the same price if not dearer.
Running on reclaimed oil is great if you can find a source ( thats the problem)and as long as its not contaminated with too much animal fat. The animal fat will block your injectors. There are ways of seperating out the animal fat but the problem is getting it all out.
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I looked into this early last year...
Yes it's relatively easy to set up!
Yes the end product is superior to diesel!
and depending on quality of oil it can be cheaper!
However time is a factor not mentioned in production (hence in my opinion, not viable!)
One other point no one seems to care about is the impact on the environment!
It's supposed to be "Green" absolute nonsense!!
People around the world are being pressured into growing crops to fund fuel production, when half the world go's to bed hungry!
The word IMMORAL comes to mind! >:(
(if on the other hand, all who say they use nothing but waste oil, are, then ok... but I doubt it!) :-\
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yes i i agree to all your points first para
second yes it is very green, most people re-cycle waste oil for either bio or filtered oil or heating oil.
veg oil is more expensive than diesel, not economical to use virgin oil.
emmisions are less than diesel.
not sure about the real green issue ie food procustion, but as most users use re-cycle oil cant be bad, not being dumped in land fill.
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if you stick to the rules you should have no problems..
1 bosch pump/injector best pump.
2 properly filtered oil if you do it youself you know what you are putting into your tank you monitor the quality if you use incorrect filtered oil your asking for trouble.
3 correct switch over temp, if you switch over at a too low temp you get lumpy running. (there are ways around this)
i think times have changed now the kits you can buy are very complex processor controlled monitoring temps.
filtering of the oil is very important but simple, its done progresivly 600 then 100 50 10 then to 1 micron.
there are a lot of people out there using this system with no problems, its very big in france and germany people
doing big milage no problems
A Mercedes 300TD has done 58,374 miles on veg oil!
A Mercedes benz 250 TD has done 62,100 miles on veg oil!
A VW Bus T2/3 has done 93,150 miles on veg oil!
A Ford Fiesta has done 66,500 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Corsa B Combo has done 76,500 miles on veg oil!
A AUDI AUDI -TDI has done 80,000 miles on veg oil!
A VW Golf III has done 65,205 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Astra 1.7D has done 60,237 miles on veg oil!
A VW Golf SDI has done 65,000 miles on veg oil!
A Opel Astra 1.9 TD has done 70,000 miles on veg oil!
A Isuzu trooper (jackaroo in australia) four wheel drive has done 51,000 miles on veg oil!
A vauxhall 1.7td van astra has done 75,000 miles on veg oil!
A Hino FB14 has done 78,000 miles on veg oil!
A Citroen ZX Citroen ZX aura has done 120,000 miles on veg oil!
A toyota 1hz has done 75,000 miles on veg oil!
A fiat ulysse has done 256,000 miles on veg oil!
A mate of mine has a vw van, he phoned vw and asked if he could run it on veg oil and they defiantly said no as i will cause serious long term engine damage....So thats a no from me.
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thats incorrect, any diesel can run on veggi oil if its got a bosch injector pump no problems even moden diesels
a link of a seat incia which has been converted vw seat based van.
http://www.dieselveg.com/seat_inca.htm
you get problems with lucus pumps, but people still use these, cars vans lorries trucks boats tractors have been converted.
below is a data base from a kit manufacturer, vws that have been converted have a look, these are updated by their owners goes back years!!
http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/fuelsdatabase/database/
Volkswagen,Jetta see details
Volkswagen,Passat 35I Diesel see details
Volkswagen,T3 Bus/Van see details
volkswagen,lupo3liter tdi see details
Volkswagen,Golf 2 see details
Volkswagen,Golf see details
volkswagen,Golf GTD see details
Volkswagen,Passat 35i TurboDiesel see details
Volkswagen,Golf see details
Volkswagen,Beetle see details
Volkswagen,T3 Caravelle Minibus see details
Volkswagen,Golf see details
Volkswagen,Golf Mk3 see details
Volvo,V40SD see details
VW,Jetta Turbo-diesel see details
Vw,Jetta see details
VW,Bus T2/3 see details
VW,Rabbit see details
VW,Golf 2 see details
VW,Caravelle see details
VW,golf see details
VW,Passat Variant 35 i see details
VW,Golf III Combi see details
vw,lupo see details
VW,Lupo TDI see details
VW,Golf III see details
VW,Passat B32 Limousine see details
VW,Golf IV see details
VW,Golf see details
VW,LT 35 see details
VW,Golf see details
VW,Golf SDI see details
VW,Golf CL see details
VW,Caddy see details
vw,golf see details
VW,Bus Caravelle TD see details
VW,1.9 estate see details
VW,Jetta see details
VW,Rabbit see details
VW,Golf see details
vw,passat see details
VW,Rabbit see details
vw,golf td umwelt estate see details
vw,passat 1.9tdi see details
vw golf,mk.3 straight diesel see details
VW Golf II,Golf II Saugdiesel see details
VW Jetta GLS TDI, 2003,Jetta see details
VW Passat,Passat CL Estate NON Turbo see details
VW transporter Bus,Transporter see details
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VW Caddy with the VP37 pump, very suitable conversion
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Think this topic will get more positive response when deisel is about £2 a litre. Its cheaper now than it has been for years. So for the time being its a no for me.
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thats incorrect, any diesel can run on veggi oil if its got a bosch injector pump no problems even moden diesels
I'm sorry, but VW themselves say that it will cause long term engine damage and you dissagree.
I think I would take notice of the manufacturers who spend millions in developement and testing of their products rather than some faceless bloke on the internet.
I have given several reasons as to why veg oil is unsuitable to modern CDI type deisel engines,I did look into this a good while ago and am fairly mechanically minded, the high pressure injectors being the main concern as they are fragile and epensive - I speak from experience.
You are free to run your engine on what you like,but I wait for the day when you and the others who like to disagree with one of the largest motor manufacturers start to belly ache about the repair bills for your engines.
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hi scud
did you have a look at the vw data base on users using veg oil??
just looked at at 35 users reporting no porolems all having bosch pumps which is the key.
what would have vw say 10 years ago when you asked them can i run my vw on gas??
no sorry sir will cause long term damage to your engine.. but people have been using gas for 10 15 years no problems.
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for the record of the VW T4
i know a fair amount who have run it for years on veg oil, mainly as i said stuff from cash and carry's
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It's called CYA. Covering your rear.
So that if I put in unfiltered ex-chippy/kebab oil over a year or two and the fat residue clogs up my system then I cannot claim that VW said it was ok.
Why not "cut" your fuel? - put in say a third good quality veggie to normal diesel in winter and say half and half in summer. Make sure you mod the pump and filters properly too.
My Fiat diesel van still has a year of warranty to run and so I won't even mix my fuels.
But I did put the occasional ten litres of used but filtered (through a 15 denier stocking! ;D) into a full tank of normal diesel on my 9 year old Pug406 .....
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Can't see how you can make the coment at the start about "not going to the petrol station again" You still need to run on diesel to get the engine up to temp and you still need to mix the oil with fuel or it will clog up the system. Then their is the extra cost involved and time and space needed in the garage. We already use bio-diesel when we fill up from the petrol pumps. Yes it is a good idea as it does save money and helps to reduce landfill etc and I'm all for mixing it with pump diesel but your original statement was well off from the actual truth of it........
Regards
Mr H
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It's called CYA. Covering your rear.
So that if I put in unfiltered ex-chippy/kebab oil over a year or two and the fat residue clogs up my system then I cannot claim that VW said it was ok.
Why not "cut" your fuel? - put in say a third good quality veggie to normal diesel in winter and say half and half in summer. Make sure you mod the pump and filters properly too.
My Fiat diesel van still has a year of warranty to run and so I won't even mix my fuels.
But I did put the occasional ten litres of used but filtered (through a 15 denier stocking! ;D) into a full tank of normal diesel on my 9 year old Pug406 .....
that just about sums it up really
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come on mr h a little picky, yes true you will have to go to the petrol station for the odd tenner but what a gain!!, warm up times a couple of miles/mins.
yes true mixing fuel for winter 10/15% winter, lots of people wunning 100% no problems, oil only clogs up when cold but is heated up via heat exchanger within system.
when i said bio diesel i ment to say homemade bio diesel
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It's called CYA. Covering your rear.
So that if I put in unfiltered ex-chippy/kebab oil over a year or two and the fat residue clogs up my system then I cannot claim that VW said it was ok.
Why not "cut" your fuel? - put in say a third good quality veggie to normal diesel in winter and say half and half in summer. Make sure you mod the pump and filters properly too.
My Fiat diesel van still has a year of warranty to run and so I won't even mix my fuels.
But I did put the occasional ten litres of used but filtered (through a 15 denier stocking! ;D) into a full tank of normal diesel on my 9 year old Pug406 .....
no mods required to pump/filter just a simple switch switching from oil to diesel, would be asking for trouble using non filtred oil
filltering to at least 5 micron most filter to 1, (fuel filters filter to 10 micron)