Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: L.J.Thorpe on December 02, 2008, 11:13:46 pm
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or to be precise the council ::)
working on an estate today,all small houses,close together,so i park in my usual spot and unwind the hose reel.From one spot i can do 8 houses simply walking from one to another dragging the hose behind.I have just finished the second house and as i come out from the rear garden i am confronted by a man and woman.
She starts (and i swear this is as close word for word as i can sum it up)
"Excuse me,I am from the council.Do you realise that your wires present a trip hazard?"
"Yes i did ,thats why there is a large yellow sign with CAUTION TRIP HAZARD placed over the hose where it crosses the pavement"
"Thats irrelevant! Do you realise that if someone tripped on these wires and hit their head on the kerb that i would be liable for a corporate manslaughter charge and that the court could take my house to pay that persons medical bills?
(That rather threw me because i could not grasp what she was talking about ::)why would she be open to a "corporate manslaughter charge" because somebody tipped on my hose ??? ???anyone ???)
anyway she continued
"So unless you have about 5 million pounds worth of insurance to cover yourself you had better think about what you are doing"
"Actually thats exactly the sort of insurance i do have ;D 5 million public liability and property damage cover as well. If you want to take my name and address you can visit me and see the certificates ;D ;D"
now her attitude changed a bit ::)
"Well no there is no need for that......I was just pointing out the problem"
"Is it a criminal offence then,to run a hose over the pavement ???"
"I dont know,I am not a police officer,I just dont want to lose my house on a corporate manslaughter charge"
anyway thats the general jist of it all
they had council issue fleece tops and a council corsa with highway maintenance stickers on
my general impression is a couple of council grunts spouting ill informed crap ( i mean whats all the manslaughter stuff about ??? ::)) i also wish i had thought to do what marcus mentioned later and aked her for her name and job title
so in summary anyone had any similar experience and does anyone know about the legal implications of running hoses over public roads and pavements ???
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JOBS WORTH
Tell her to go tell someone that cares, ooooo people like this wind me up. Aint they got owt else better to do.
And it must of been her day off yet shes coming out to you ranting...sad
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You should have just asked her this one question-
If it takes 1 man a week to walk a fortnight, how many apples would there be in a barrel of grapes?
Try it next time, it realy does work ;)
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wfp or ladder, either way your breaking some law/act. ::)
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The Coroprate Manslaughter Act came into law this year, It applies to anyone who employs anyone either, PAYE or Self-Employed.
If an accident happens and this person dies because you have not complied with all health and safety laws, then you can be charge and imprisoned for manslaughter.
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Stick a matt over your hoses then, that what workmen do working on the roads.
Try advertising at the same time :P
http://www.ukmats.co.uk/html/logo_mats.html
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LJThorpe are you on the council approved contractors list yet ?
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Stick a matt over your hoses then, that what workmen do working on the roads.
Try advertising at the same time :P
http://www.ukmats.co.uk/html/logo_mats.html
what a good idea!!
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Stick a matt over your hoses then, that what workmen do working on the roads.
Try advertising at the same time :P
http://www.ukmats.co.uk/html/logo_mats.html
what a good idea!!
already requested some sizing and pricing guide.
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Seen this posted some time back and now I do the same.
http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=42051.0
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I know what you mean!
However, like most things, there really is a serious point to these jobsworths point of view. The Corp Manslaughter legislation did in fact become law this year and this opens up all sorts of problems.
Having the relevant paperwork and insurance now really is only half the battle, you must ensure that all procedures are now in writing, and that they are actually followed, not forgetting of course, written training records of your staff, stating that they have had the correct training.
The reality is that the first test of the new law will come from some sort of accident on a building site or civil works, not necessarily cleaning related.
My own personal guess is that whoever is first will be made an example of, feeling the full wrath of the law.
Hose protectors are now a must I feel, as are signs whenever your hose crosses a pavement or road.
Also remember that joe public is not always the brightest firework in the box!
Regards,
Rob
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They couldnt take your house etc if your a limited company
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But they might make you move into a new one (HMP) for a few years. ;D
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You should have just asked her this one question-
If it takes 1 man a week to walk a fortnight, how many apples would there be in a barrel of grapes?
Try it next time, it realy does work ;)
14 apples per mile.
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They cant take my house coz I rent it
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Stick matt over your hoses then.
How do you feel about that Matt?...how much do you charge an hour to have people walk all over you? ::)
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if its a memeber of the public and you have highlighted that there is a trip hazard then you would nt get done for corperate manslaughter...thats what i think anyway
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if its a memeber of the public and you have highlighted that there is a trip hazard then you would nt get done for corperate manslaughter...thats what i think anyway
Hmm, is that how it works?
Take the beware dog sign people have on their gates, by having that there, you know you have a dangerous animal on your property - if someone was to be bitten/attacked by it then thats your fault not theirs because of that sign.
If you didn't have the sign and your dog attacks them then its their fault as the dog is only protecting its owners and home, and is of a good natured pet, you didn;t need the sign.
Your stuffed if you do, and your stuff if you dont..
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or to be precise the council ::)
working on an estate today,all small houses,close together,so i park in my usual spot and unwind the hose reel.From one spot i can do 8 houses simply walking from one to another dragging the hose behind.I have just finished the second house and as i come out from the rear garden i am confronted by a man and woman.
She starts (and i swear this is as close word for word as i can sum it up)
"Excuse me,I am from the council.Do you realise that your wires present a trip hazard?"
"Yes i did ,thats why there is a large yellow sign with CAUTION TRIP HAZARD placed over the hose where it crosses the pavement"
"Thats irrelevant! Do you realise that if someone tripped on these wires and hit their head on the kerb that i would be liable for a corporate manslaughter charge and that the court could take my house to pay that persons medical bills?
(That rather threw me because i could not grasp what she was talking about ::)why would she be open to a "corporate manslaughter charge" because somebody tipped on my hose ??? ???anyone ???)
anyway she continued
"So unless you have about 5 million pounds worth of insurance to cover yourself you had better think about what you are doing"
"Actually thats exactly the sort of insurance i do have ;D 5 million public liability and property damage cover as well. If you want to take my name and address you can visit me and see the certificates ;D ;D"
now her attitude changed a bit ::)
"Well no there is no need for that......I was just pointing out the problem"
"Is it a criminal offence then,to run a hose over the pavement ???"
"I dont know,I am not a police officer,I just dont want to lose my house on a corporate manslaughter charge"
anyway thats the general jist of it all
they had council issue fleece tops and a council corsa with highway maintenance stickers on
my general impression is a couple of council grunts spouting ill informed crap ( i mean whats all the manslaughter stuff about ??? ::)) i also wish i had thought to do what marcus mentioned later and aked her for her name and job title
so in summary anyone had any similar experience and does anyone know about the legal implications of running hoses over public roads and pavements ???
you need a trolley mate ;D ;D
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The Coroprate Manslaughter Act came into law this year, It applies to anyone who employs anyone either, PAYE or Self-Employed.
If an accident happens and this person dies because you have not complied with all health and safety laws, then you can be charge and imprisoned for manslaughter.
Am I the only one that is confused by that?
I mean, if you are contracted okay, but on a residential property where you don't have a contract to clean?
This world is getting health and safety mad. I wanted to get something from the recyclers, sorry sir, you can't take anything with you, health and safety rules.
What is the point of recycling then! D'oh!
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my belief is that if you are getting paid to carry out a servive then you are a contractor. She is right in the theory but wrong in the application. Thats like being told you cant wash your car in the street with a garden hose, now no1 uses a sign about their trailing hoses when washing their car i9n the street but ultimately there are laws that blame you should anyone trip but if you have signs when working then you are warning people about the possible hazard....not likely hazard....but a possible hazard, what more can you do within reason...nothing.
Continue in my opinion give her the choice of finding another window cleaner with ladders and inform her that she is the one going to be liable if the fool falls from his laddert and she will be the one out of pocket.
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Well.... surely if it was a manslaughter charge, there wouldn't be any hospital bills....? Or if there were hospital bills....
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Stick a matt over your hoses then, that what workmen do working on the roads.
Try advertising at the same time :P
http://www.ukmats.co.uk/html/logo_mats.html
what a good idea!!
I've been saying just this for several years but have been accused of being too fussy. I use rubber matting where the hose crosses the footpath. I'm amazed that more don't do it. I still can't stand jobsworths though. Jobsworths are usually androids who have never had to go out there and grab an income. Instead, they get some cushy, mollycoddled job due to having certain qualifications and think that they serve humanity best by trying to destroy anyone who shows a bit of initiative and enterprise. I take great delight in the knowledge that they get parking tickets too.
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Hose mats only work at 90 degree angle right? What if your van is parked a bit further away and the hose runs diagonally?
Or is that only with the mats that have a gap to allow the hose through?
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just to clear up a few points chaps ;D
firstly
the woman from the council was not claiming that I would be done for corporate manslaughter
she was claiming that SHE would be prosecuted and that SHE would lose her house(how that works i have no idea ??? ???)
secondly
I was cleaning private houses on a private (ie non council ) estate
thirdly
they were not her windows ,she just appeared ,as if by magic (like the shopkeeper in Mr. Benn except she had a corsa ;D)
hope that helps :)
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just to clear up a few points chaps ;D
firstly
the woman from the council was not claiming that I would be done for corporate manslaughter
she was claiming that SHE would be prosecuted and that SHE would lose her house(how that works i have no idea ??? ???)
secondly
I was cleaning private houses on a private (ie non council ) estate
thirdly
they were not her windows ,she just appeared ,as if by magic (like the shopkeeper in Mr. Benn except she had a corsa ;D)
hope that helps :)
you still need a trolley
this new fangled hose fad, it'll end in tears i tell ya ;D
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Hose mats only work at 90 degree angle right? What if your van is parked a bit further away and the hose runs diagonally?
Or is that only with the mats that have a gap to allow the hose through?
Not sure what you have in mind but I was referring to laying a sheet (or two) of matting over the top of the hose where it crosses the footpath (assuming I can't park on the property). I generally avoid doing it diagonally anyway by laying it along the gutter next to the kerb and crossing it over the path at a right angle. No problem with diagonal though but it might requyire more matting than you've got due to it being a longer span to cover.
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just to clear up a few points chaps ;D
firstly
the woman from the council was not claiming that I would be done for corporate manslaughter
she was claiming that SHE would be prosecuted and that SHE would lose her house(how that works i have no idea ??? ???)
secondly
I was cleaning private houses on a private (ie non council ) estate
thirdly
they were not her windows ,she just appeared ,as if by magic (like the shopkeeper in Mr. Benn except she had a corsa ;D)
hope that helps :)
Sounds to me like she is suffering from paranoia and an inflated sense of over responsibility. Did you suggest she goes for a mental health check?
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If you do several houses in a close from one parking postion you could spend a lot of time moving the matting and moving your signs. All I do is use a high visibility hose and try and make sure it is well laid out (i.e flat and not coiled) to reduce risk. Probably not ideal but to me is the most practical solution.
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if you pull up to do 1 house , but have to park on road , it is easy to put matting over hose.
however i do lots of houses in a row , normally i pull hose to the furthest house , that can be reached with 100 mtrs microbore , it goes alnog the pavement,then i work my way back to van,
moving my van from house to house to park on drives would take considerably
longer.
daz
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I had a mum have a bit of a go at me a while back because my hose was across a pavement and it was dangerous. Said she was going to report me
Best to just smile and blink a lot like Benny Hill used to. Eventually they form the opinion you are a half wit and give up.
Councils attract bossy self opinionated jobsworths, if you argue with them they love it because they know they can become even more bossy, even more self opinionated and even more of a jobsworth than they are already.
After me now..........grin,...... blink,......... blink,....... blink........
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After me now..........grin,...... blink,......... blink,....... blink........
And always agree and thank them for pointing it out ....
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If you do several houses in a close from one parking postion you could spend a lot of time moving the matting and moving your signs. All I do is use a high visibility hose and try and make sure it is well laid out (i.e flat and not coiled) to reduce risk. Probably not ideal but to me is the most practical solution.
if you pull up to do 1 house , but have to park on road , it is easy to put matting over hose.
however i do lots of houses in a row , normally i pull hose to the furthest house , that can be reached with 100 mtrs microbore , it goes alnog the pavement,then i work my way back to van,
moving my van from house to house to park on drives would take considerably
longer.
daz
both sensible points :)
i have the hose running in the gutter next to pavement and only lay it across pavement next to house
dont use mats but hose is bright yellow and warning sign is placed either next to it or over it
i do run hoses across roads from time to time as well
i reckon her and the sidekick had been out on a job somewhere and were looking for a quiet place to park up and read the paper instead of going back to the office to do some work
and by chance she found me and tried to get clever
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I had a mum have a bit of a go at me a while back because my hose was across a pavement and it was dangerous. Said she was going to report me
Best to just smile and blink a lot like Benny Hill used to. Eventually they form the opinion you are a half wit and give up.
Councils attract bossy self opinionated jobsworths, if you argue with them they love it because they know they can become even more bossy, even more self opinionated and even more of a jobsworth than they are already.
After me now..........grin,...... blink,......... blink,....... blink........
;D ;D ;D ;D i once got a load of work off a window cleaner who was a dead spit for a young benny hill
even had the same specs,just let down by the norfolk/wisbech accent
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I believe the council have a height limit on what is classed as a dangerous paving slab, raised or drop.
If this the case, is the height of a hose within the limit?
Has anyone made a claim yet ;D?
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just read on the daily mail website a school girl who slipped on a carrot got £200 compo and a teacher who fell over a workmans tools got £9000,sooner or later someone will claim compo for tripping over a hose
yep i agree
but aint that what my public liability is for
surely it has nowt to do with the council
does it ??? ???
and what about the warning signs
is it worth bothering with em ???
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I would have told her in no uncertain terms to **** off. Bloody Jobs worth