Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: daniel horne on November 24, 2008, 10:52:29 am
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looking for more work in and around keighley , bingly, skipton ,silsden
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proof if proof needed that we are all in it for ourselves
not one reply with an offer of help or support
sorry i live in scotland but by way of help hand write basic flyers saying 10% cheaper than your present window cleaner and when the out priced out of work rest of them come calling for work for you give them the same response you recieved.
my advice.....go get the work yourself its easy.
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proof if proof needed that we are all in it for ourselves
not one reply with an offer of help or support
sorry i live in scotland but by way of help hand write basic flyers saying 10% cheaper than your present window cleaner and when the out priced out of work rest of them come calling for work for you give them the same response you recieved.
my advice.....go get the work yourself its easy.
Bet your Mr popular aint you ;D
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i hope some one takes your avice and gos % 20 in scotland rownd your way
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proof if proof needed that we are all in it for ourselves
not one reply with an offer of help or support
sorry i live in scotland but by way of help hand write basic flyers saying 10% cheaper than your present window cleaner and when the out priced out of work rest of them come calling for work for you give them the same response you recieved.
my advice.....go get the work yourself its easy.
I,ve seen posts like this before some get a response, some dont, maybe round that area there is no spare work ? plus that poster has put quite a few up asking basically the same thing, your jumping on your fellow W/C without knowing everyones story ever heard the one about engaging your brain before you put your MOUTH in gear.
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proof if proof needed that we are all in it for ourselves
not one reply with an offer of help or support
sorry i live in scotland but by way of help hand write basic flyers saying 10% cheaper than your present window cleaner and when the out priced out of work rest of them come calling for work for you give them the same response you recieved.
my advice.....go get the work yourself its easy.
Most people who would be in a position to give away work they don't need would more than likely be out working today, cleaning what they have rather then replying to posts likle this. Not everybody is home typing into Cleanitup at 3.16pm.
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Gordons windows, you intrique me mate. Of course we are in it for ourselves. But if ,as you appear to do ,advocate undercutting, and poaching on cost then you simply turn this trade into a low paid , drudge that only those who need pocket money can survive in, not those with mortgages families and who want to run a business. Bring back the 1950's.
Look at manufacturing in the UK. It couldnt compete with the far East so it totally collapsed, until it could pay people minimum wage to come in from abroad and do it, with help given to them regarding their cost of living,b'cause the money is so poor.
What if we told him move to your part of Scotland and give out flyers saying 50% cheaper than your existing W/C.
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Daniel, your asking at a bad time mate, most of us are hanging on to the dross at the moment because we don't know how many customers we could be losing in the near future.
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It isnt a good move in business mate to ask for work, if people have too much will they will employ or sell, sadly not many give good work away, and be very wary of any work that is free!!It will be crap, you need to print some flyers and go posting and canvassing we all have to spend hours building our rounds mate so no one is gonna give it to you, i spend a fortune still building mine, have been for the last 12 months....ask some questions about how to find work, or read the many posts on this subject...
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iv ponted him to sum work for sale in browns laders walst i wos in ther last week all i tuke in wos £350 per munth not far from him
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yes looked in to that and its gone but they gave me a number so thanks for that :D :D :D and i no work dose not come for free but iv seen window cleaners give work away befor cose of things like they have had it with ladders and not all people like windows done with a pole
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Gordons windows, you intrique me mate. Of course we are in it for ourselves. But if ,as you appear to do ,advocate undercutting, and poaching on cost then you simply turn this trade into a low paid , drudge that only those who need pocket money can survive in, not those with mortgages families and who want to run a business. Bring back the 1950's.
Look at manufacturing in the UK. It couldnt compete with the far East so it totally collapsed, until it could pay people minimum wage to come in from abroad and do it, with help given to them regarding their cost of living,b'cause the money is so poor.
What if we told him move to your part of Scotland and give out flyers saying 50% cheaper than your existing W/C.
if you read gordons old posts he started out with ladder,bucket and no car,he now sits in an office in charge of several workers so his ideas are pretty sound even if we dont think much of them
He must be doing something right...... i think he meant it in the right way....in his mind... but the wording was a little off. :)
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Thanks to Stan and gazza
Honest good advice is never "worded the right way" and need never be sugared
When i was a lad.....take your medicine it is good for you
or better a lesson learnt hard
I do so apologise to you chaps for my incorrect of ...damn couldnt even keep that up, what i meant to say was , i am a window cleaner not well educated but enthusiastic and driven, i give an honest answer from my experiences and the lesson's i have learned. I am not on here to win friends because there are no such people in the busines world.Although there are one of two of you who have given me help previously and there are others whom i enjoy hearing from but when it comes down to business or money as we really mean I want it for me my family, i am not about to let someone else who just happens to be in the same trade as i am to go home with my money.
How many of you sent cash to a fellow poster who was injured and couldnt work?????????
hmmm thought so
As for my area I am already up against others who do undercut me and worse that that two of the so and so are people i started of in w/c
As for the for protecting the uk business it is because people wouldn't work cost effectively that we lost the work to other countries.
Where are the mines? why could we buy coal cheaper from abroad than digging it ourselves? cos our miners (not all of them) wouldn't work for a smaller amount and what happened now many of them don't work at all
As for drudge i too have a family (a new member last week a grandaughter) and a mortgage oh and a house in Spain and a 645i BMW a son at Uni that costs a fortune a monthly donation to charity an award from Job Centre Plus .............
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sorry forgot to add
i also just lost a client worth £36,000pa due to the so called "credit crunch" and that was an " undercut" price as the previous cleaner was charging 20% more than i was, that was three years ago but still.They gave us two months notice and i have already found 5 out of the 7 employees new positions and am determined not to let the other two go, probably by cutting someone else's price but rather that than put two people (one of them a family man) out of work in the new year
cheeers
Gordon
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you employed 7 men for a £36k contract ?????
Anyway you did it again " how many of you sent money to a w/c who was injured etc ? not many! thought so hmmm , What's all that about ?????
Are you one of them guys who likes to judge people without knowing them , it's a bit like people judging us because we're window cleaners.
It's not through lack of intelligence , you run a self made good business with a son at uni, it's not age , your a granpops, it must be just YOU.
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Gordonswindows, have you ever worked down a mine ?
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This is a good thread, it was about someone wanting work! But its turned out to be about undecutters and all in it for ourselves.
1. Yes I think we are in it for ourselves..thats why we started a business
2. If we had enough work to go round we would all employ people or more people. I have just taken on a new lad today.. But I have not taken him on because i am kind hearted.. I have more work than ever at this moment in time. But it benefits me, my company that I have taken him on. Amongst other people.
3. UNDERCUTTING
Ive said it many many times before.. not people like it neither! We can all offer value, reliability, professionalism and flash equipment if we have the money to invest or waste what ever way you look at it. I have just invested in WFP and purchase an RO Unit with water softener with DI that produces around 1000 litres in under 4 hours.
Now after you give all this, the customer will say oh, my window cleaner already does all that! So whats left... ask yourself how do you win the business.. By undercutting Now if you have a problem with it.. you are managing your business inefficiently if you cannot match the price of the new window cleaner.
Maybe you should not have purchased that flash new pole, or WFP system or new van. His over heads will be lower than yours. And best of luck too him.
People undercut all of the time, bigger companies do, people and companies take back handers to win work. ITS BUSINESS GET OVER IT. iTS PART OF EVERY DAY LIFE. Under cutting makes the world go round.
People do it to me and I will do it every time I can providing I make a worth while profit. NO Profit - No client! Profit even if I undercut the next person or company = new client... = NEW LUXURY ITEM BETTER WAY OF LIFE etc etc.
People on here undercut, even when they say they dont as they want to be liked! Gordon is right there are no friends in business!
Dave
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all publicity is good publicity/ there is no such thing as BAD PUBLICITY. just decide what you are going to do and tell the world any which way cou can.
and you may even get to do it for money 8)
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proof if proof needed that we are all in it for ourselves
not one reply with an offer of help or support
sorry i live in scotland but by way of help hand write basic flyers saying 10% cheaper than your present window cleaner and when the out priced out of work rest of them come calling for work for you give them the same response you recieved.
my advice.....go get the work yourself its easy.
Thats exactly what our PM (Gordon the Moron) would say. You scotts actually think you have your own parliment don't you, well ive got news for you Jock, Devolution was the worst thing you scotts could have asked for "This Unity Thing And All That Crap" but when it comes to making major parliamentary decisions; guess what, your name sake is discussed first, how unifying is that. lolololol
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Oh dear lovewindows how can u clean windows while balancing that large chip on your shoulder, I am PROUD of being a cleaner, I don't even have to make it sound better by adding WINDOW I am a cleaner. I didn't judge I tried to demonstrate how by being selfish with my business it allows me to offer support and help to others.you
Well done to pristine whose posts are always well written and presented. This time he gave sound facts with true honesty.
As too having worked down a pit although knowing a lot of hard working proud miners I never got the chance to go down one as they are all closed.
As too independance we have had our land raped and pillaged for too long and at last are not just having the last laugh as we are governing you while we enjoy our own rules and laws
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ye for sure i was only asking lolol i thought window cleaners stuck together but im so wrong ??? ??? ???
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like every one reading what people have said i thing we should all pack it in ???? i no that theres people out there that have a point to put across but all they are doing is making them selfs look bad... i was only asking lol if you dont ask thats why people are out priceing each other cose as we are not helping each other thats what happen so i think from now on ill do what every bobys doing and when theres no work you can look back at this and say i told you so :( :( :( :(
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thank you and if i can help in any let me no ;D ;D ;D
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we all have already helped
he already sounds more confident and determined to do well
well done all of you who posted
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Oh dear lovewindows how can u clean windows while balancing that large chip on your shoulder, I am PROUD of being a cleaner, I don't even have to make it sound better by adding WINDOW I am a cleaner. I didn't judge I tried to demonstrate how by being selfish with my business it allows me to offer support and help to others.you
Well done to pristine whose posts are always well written and presented. This time he gave sound facts with true honesty.
As too having worked down a pit although knowing a lot of hard working proud miners I never got the chance to go down one as they are all closed.
As too independance we have had our land raped and pillaged for too long and at last are not just having the last laugh as we are governing you while we enjoy our own rules and laws
Sorry totaly over my head ??? ??? ??? ???
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this post is worse than the tower of babel :D
a bit of clarity is called for here, so here goes:
guy wants work, other guys dont want to give the guy work, the other guys looking in are saying the guy is scum, so the 1st guy comes back in and says to the other guys that the other guys are right and that if he were a Scot he would rule the world because he is the best window cleaner in the world, and the second guy from the last took offence and said he aint coming back, and the 1st guy still hasent got any work....hey, that was simple wasnt it;D
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How many of you sent cash to a fellow poster who was injured and couldnt work?????????
hmmm thought so
Quite a few of us donated to a widow of a window cleaner who died from falling from his ladders; he had a family and no life insurance. Andrew McCann organised it.
hmmmm...
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How many of you sent cash to a fellow poster who was injured and couldnt work?????????
hmmm thought so
Quite a few of us donated to a widow of a window cleaner who died from falling from his ladders; he had a family and no life insurance. Andrew McCann organised it.
hmmmm...
yep totally agree.....when ross fell of his ladders up here in glasgow and died a week later from his injuries, 40 guys from ross's faith went out in one day and did a full months work/collected it and handed every cent over to his family.
still miss that guy. :'(
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i was only asking lol
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i was only asking lol
Daniel,
It takes time; years maybe; to build up a decent paying window cleaning business if you're starting from scratch, unless you're one of the 'special people' on this forum who claim stuff that sometimes I don't believe. Also, and this is a big 'also', don't go underpricing jobs just to get them. Act confident also, I'm sure there's a certain class of customer who can 'smell' a virgin window cleaner, and will mess them about.
My advice would be to find a wage-paying occupation that'll cover your bills, and will allow you the time to build up and work on a window cleaning round in your spare time.
I've known two guys local to me who are both doing that by driving vans delivering goods, starting early in the morning and finishing by 1-or-2 pm; then they go window cleaning. This mustn't give them much time in deepest darkest Winter, but I often see them during the day in the Summer.
I did weekend security work to help make ends meet when I first started window cleaning; though to be honest; the 'ends didn't meet' with the low pay I received.
Good luck.
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Daniel I'l give you the benefit of the doubt mate. I dont think your scum, nor do the others I would imagine.
I think that asking for work is the wrong move to make though. Trust me get out there and door knock. Qoute sensible prices, slightly over ,not under ,as you can negotiate at the doorstep if they are genuinely interested. Don't conciously undercut others in your area to get work.People will do it back to you!!!There is tons of work out there, and I get more enquiries than I can handle whilst working. Some I take on some I dont.
If you were in my neck of woods I would chuck you a few that I want to loose, because I cant be bothered dragging equipment through houses anymore, or their isolated jobs. But you would take others cast off's. No one will just give away good work if their honest.
The undercutting thing doesnt really affect me but it does bug me. And if you notice some of the replies its the ones who knowingly undercut, as is their business practice, who loose big jobs, or their former employees take work off of em, b'cause theyve been schooled that its OK to do so. Then they cant complain can they!
Do the right thing and people will respect and help you. You can build a good business by your own endevours, and price it as you want it.
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Daniel, ive been going since may, i now have 140 custys and still growing, dont be fased what some say on here as the more you come on here the more youll know who to listen to and who not too, keep posting questions and youll get some really good advice but youll also get some nonsense replys by some who get a buzz from slating and putting everything people say down, once you start door knocking it can become injoyable, you meet loads of people and i can honestly say i never had a bad word from anyone answering the door,
what tosh and johns window kleen have said is very good advice
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Daniel I'l give you the benefit of the doubt mate. I dont think your scum, nor do the others I would imagine.
I think that asking for work is the wrong move to make though. Trust me get out there and door knock. Qoute sensible prices, slightly over ,not under ,as you can negotiate at the doorstep if they are genuinely interested. Don't conciously undercut others in your area to get work.People will do it back to you!!!There is tons of work out there, and I get more enquiries than I can handle whilst working. Do the right thing and people will respect and help you. You can build a good business by your own endevours, and price it as you want it.
Hi There,
Althou it bugs you that people undercut, which I fully understand why it bugs you.. it bugs me when it happens to me.
But if he prices as he wants maybe he could undercut without knowing and can do the job alot less. Very easily.
However, if I did not undercut, I would not get half the work I have. Its mostly down to the customers anyway. Its their decision to go somewhere they see Value for money. Just because I undercut does not mean to say I do not do a better more professional work. Sometimes I undercut and even throw in extras.
Now I do not actually intentionally undercut but I have worked out a pricing structure where I can earn a good living, pay my employees, and have the things in life I want. (within reason) I am still working on the Lambourgini ;D
Now, surely every one wants more work, the more work generally if you have the right infrastructure, money and technolgy and by technology I do not mean a small RO unit in ones shed. You can work well, And by quantity you dont have to be rushing around either trying to catch up if it is well planned and organised.
Now would you never undercut to get the work? Lets say you had to pay a mortgage.. and you had no work..at all. And I mean no work.. But if you undercut you could pay your mortgage, and at christmas you can see your childrens eyes light up on Christmas morning with all the presents you have bought them.
Or would you rather over price, lose your house, move into a small flat, somewhere close to ghetto as can be with your kids and tell your kids santa will not be comming this christmas.
I know what I would choose. I can say with all honesty, my kids will have a fantastic christmas and tell them santa has been.
You cannot win work just on flash gimmicks, new technology, flash vans or cars or new microfibre clothes alone or a few T shirts that you had a logo put on for £6.95 including a contact number..you have to be comptitive.. By competitive that means lowering your price. And by lowering your price you then UNDERCUT.
Dave
Dave
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Theres a difference in putting a price in that you believe will win you a job and undercutting, I would never knock on a door or go to a commercial company, ask them what there paying and then put a cheaper price in just to get the job.
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thanks for that ;D ;D ;D
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No let me clarify. Intentionally undercut, not inadvertantly undercut. I have a mortgage, kids, expenses etc. When I started up and canvassed I asked do you have a W/C if they said yes, I would ask are you happy with the service provided if they said yes I would walk away, not ask how much, and then undercut the price considerably. Which I know some people do.
Easy as that, go find virgin work and price it as you want to.
I sleep easy at night knowing I havent nicked work. Thats desperate in my opinion.
I price realistically for my needs, they can take it or leave it, I have already said I pick up work or leads nearly every day without even trying, as I am sure many of you do, I take on some of these, and you know what these people havent got a window cleaner, thats why they approach.
I know about costings and business, supply and demand ,etc,etc, and even in these crap times there's loads of work out there, so why should I be a lazy parasite and intentionally nick off of others?
Lifes like a box of chocolates and Thats all I've got to say about that.
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John my quote was made to pristine, but i will say that when ive canvassed i have had custys say that they have a window cleaner and not happy, instead of giving a quote ive said that they need to sort there problems with there current cleaner, i give them my business card and say if your problems cant be solved with your current cleaner then give me a ring and ill give you a quote.
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I know Jaykie mate, my reply was to pristine as well, and yer know what I reckon he will agree!
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Sorry to go off topic but i think its because were both Spurs fans that we talk sense lol, Yid army.
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Oh no!! you'll set the Gooners off now, if they can drag themselves away from the 0-0 bore draw on the box!
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I last week picked up a new job knowing what her existing cleaner charged. I doubled it and she said yes ;D
Whats the term for that?
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Thats Over cutting.
Cant really knock that.
Sorry Gooners it's Chelsea thats 0-0
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I know Jaykie mate, my reply was to pristine as well, and yer know what I reckon he will agree!
Well, Yes I agree. To your previous post.
If thats what everyone is calling undercutting then I can safely say I have never undercut either. As I have never asked for a price not once. But I have found out after I have won contracts what the last company were cleaning. I am always around 30% - 40 % cheaper.
So just to clarify to others reading this, UNDERCUTTING is asking what a their current cleaner is charging and then deliberately going in at a cheaper rate.
Nope Ive never done that, never will but I will be cheaper.
Dave
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its onlly 22 men kicking a bag of wind ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
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You would never undercut ,yet you support Spurs
Ask Juande Ramos about "never been undercut"
And no i'm no Gooner