Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Matt_Benton on July 09, 2008, 03:44:31 pm
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Hi there,
I guess this is mainly directed at those who have people working for them or operate a policy of not collecting. At the beginning of the year, I took on a sizeable amount of work, intending to operate a non-collection policy (ie. Internet transfer and cheques). However, it doesn't seem to be working very well. I have a substantial number of small debts, which, while insignificant on their own, represent about £500 oustanding in total. Has anyone been in a similar position, and can the offer any advice. In particular:
Do you think geographical location affects standards of payment? To put it bluntly, am I better off collecting cash in rough areas?
Has anyone researched payment by card over the telephone? I understand that the majority of wheelie bin cleaning companies use this method and don't mind paying a small fee if it means i get paid on time.
How much money is worth pursuing through a small claims court?
FYI, each customer was given a letter at the outset, explaining clearly that I do not collect money, preferring instead to receive cheques of have money sent via the Internet. I don't mind going round in person to settle debts, in fact I have done once already, but it's a fair distance and I can't keep doing it every few months.
Thanks, Matt
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Good post.
Im awaiting the replies too :P
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Hi there,
I guess this is mainly directed at those who have people working for them or operate a policy of not collecting. At the beginning of the year, I took on a sizeable amount of work, intending to operate a non-collection policy (ie. Internet transfer and cheques). However, it doesn't seem to be working very well. I have a substantial number of small debts, which, while insignificant on their own, represent about £500 oustanding in total. Has anyone been in a similar position, and can the offer any advice. In particular:
Do you think geographical location affects standards of payment? To put it bluntly, am I better off collecting cash in rough areas?
Has anyone researched payment by card over the telephone? I understand that the majority of wheelie bin cleaning companies use this method and don't mind paying a small fee if it means i get paid on time.
How much money is worth pursuing through a small claims court?
FYI, each customer was given a letter at the outset, explaining clearly that I do not collect money, preferring instead to receive cheques of have money sent via the Internet. I don't mind going round in person to settle debts, in fact I have done once already, but it's a fair distance and I can't keep doing it every few months.
Thanks, Matt
When I first switched to non collecting the cashflow did slow down at first. However, as people realised that they would have to pay for two or three cleans eventually, they started to comply better. I did get more bad debts initially. However, it seemed to be the case that the people who were bad at sending cheques or paying by BACS, were also the ones I would lose no sleep over dropping. It probably cost me a couple of hundred quid (spread over a few weeks) to get rid of most of my worst customers. It's rare to get a bargain like that.
The money owed is always higher now that I don't collect. It's only the first time around that it leaves a shortfall because if people miss a payment, they will usually send two the next time anyway. Therefore, after that, the ones who miss are being balanced by the double payers.
If you have persistently bad payers - especially those who live a long way away, I suggest you first of all repeat that you do not collect and that the onus is on them to send/transfer the money. If that doesn't work, I reckon that you would be quite in order to replace and drop (or drop and replace if you aren't short of work).
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Try using a late payment fee (only a small amount) if not paid within xxxx days. Late paying customers are more prompt in paying now. I billed a few custies with late payment charge, now they pay online or stick a cheque in the post that little bit quicker now. :)
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I have been window cleaning for over 2.5 years now and have never been out collecting.
My customers usually pay me within 7 days of me cleaning their windows... Some take a little longer.
Although having said that I've just checked and I currently have £1077 outstanding! >:(
However, between the months of July - August payments do sometimes slow down as some people are away on hols.
Andy
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Most custies pay within a week or two of getting their bill - some within a day or two and some at about three weeks. That's fine by me.
If they haven't paid by the next clean (monthly) I remind them on my payment slip that they owe for two lots.
I operate a pretty strict "if you don't pay by the time the third clean comes round it don't get done until you do, policy.
If this happens more than once with no good reason then I drop them.
Oh, new custies I trust for the first clean only for the first six/nine months
My round is all within parameters at the mo'.
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All of the above , and also when you start out with new custy , put on advice slip " please send in next seven days " ! If they dont then make a home visit and politely explain that you can only do business with them if they send the payment within the seven day period ;D This does work by the way 8)
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I am out of here , got to visit my lad in hospital :(
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I am out of here , got to visit my lad in hospital :(
Hope hes better soon ;)
As for the post, add a late payment fee, they soon send payments, I have been doing that for a long time and it gets cheques in. No more "I forgot to send it" or "oh I thought I would pay you next time".
I would not collect payments unless they paid me to do it.
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Hi there,
Thanks for the responses. Although I was probably avoiding the realisation, i'd agreed that it's usually the worst customers that are the worst payers. Time to get a bit more stringent, new policy dictates that persistent late payers are gonna be dropped in future, there's plenty of replacement work out there!
Thanks again, Matt
PS. I would appreciate some views on the dodgy area question, cos it would influence my canvassing strategy in the future.
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I think the area doesn't matter so much. You will get some in the worst areas that wouldn't dream of being in dept, and you will get some rich folks that will try it on till the last day. you just hace to go by the person
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Do you think geographical location affects standards of payment? To put it bluntly, am I better off collecting cash in rough areas?
I'd love not to have to collect, but with a mortgage, bills, Wor Lasses hairdressing bill, etc I have to, but this is how I do it.
I only collect from my estate areas (about half of my work) in places where I can park the car up and walk round the houses. I have (small) areas where I'm the only window cleaner there, so pretty compact stuff.
I do this on a Saturday morning, I find between 10.00 am and 11.00 am is a good time. If they're not in, or haven't left a payment out for me, I leave them an SA envelope with payment instructions.
For my rural accounts (which is ever expanding), I leave an SAE; I don't collect for these, though they're usually larger (better priced) domestic accounts.
I find this keeps method keeps my cash flow good, isn't too onerus and my bills get paid without me stressing about waiting for customers to send me a cheque.
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It is important that you obtain both mobile and landline telephone numbers for every new account.
You then can keep contact with them and not rely on them being out, not answering the door or ignoring written requests etc.
If it gets really bad, hide your number and telephone them EARLY or LATE of a day - at least you get a feeling of satisfaction knowing that you have wound them up!
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It is important that you obtain both mobile and landline telephone numbers for every new account.
You then can keep contact with them and not rely on them being out, not answering the door or ignoring written requests etc.
If it gets really bad, hide your number and telephone them EARLY or LATE of a day - at least you get a feeling of satisfaction knowing that you have wound them up!
I stopped collecting 2 years ago and most are alright about sending a cheque. I have found though that if i don't get cheque within a couple of weeks i might have had to wait upto 3 cleans on some. ???
It was only a handful but i didn't like it. 2 months max, if the cost of the clean is less than a tenner.
I find calling after a couple of weeks speeds things up.
Some just need dropping, but 95% will not be a problem after a while.
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I wish all the services I used called me to ask to send payments :o
they dont do this they charge me if I am late paying and I think that is fair, hence why I do the same ;D
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If you can get some funds behind you having a grand or so outstanding is no big deal. As long as it comes in, it doesn't really matter.
Just imagine getting paid monthly in an office, its no different really.
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I wish all the services I used called me to ask to send payments :o
they dont do this they charge me if I am late paying and I think that is fair, hence why I do the same ;D
haha, there is a big part of me that would like to and maybe will. But i haven't got the balls to do it atm. I dislike phoning and if a call is a regular occurance they are not visited anymore. I work in a close knit (ish) community. And find it easier to drop the job than to introduce a late fee.
Funnily enough, i am in the process of doing this for 1 customer who only owes £15, but is for 3 cleans.
He did agree when i started to post a cheque every 2nd clean if i miss them twice. But it is now 3 dating back to mid april. I sent a letter today registered post saying i'd put a claim in if not received within 7 days.
I know the bloke cos he moved into the village i grew up in, so i am wondering how this is going to pan out. The last 1 i did this to paid and cancelled. ;D
Just imagine getting paid monthly in an office, its no different really.
This is how i manage to work myself up into action. If these people didn't get paid for 2 or 3 months, their life would grind to a halt. Why should they expect me to be different? I know the amounts are different but the principle is the same.
Some people thinking, 'it's like money in the bank.' Correct. But it's not in my bank where it should be. And that is not right. Owed money is only yours when you have got your hands on it. Not before.
I have and would take back customers who asked me to clean again. I say ok then tell them i stopped because i had trouble getting paid in a reasonable time.
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I wish all the services I used called me to ask to send payments :o
they dont do this they charge me if I am late paying and I think that is fair, hence why I do the same ;D
haha, there is a big part of me that would like to and maybe will. But i haven't got the balls to do it atm. I dislike phoning and if a call is a regular occurance they are not visited anymore. I work in a close knit (ish) community. And find it easier to drop the job than to introduce a late fee.
Funnily enough, i am in the process of doing this for 1 customer who only owes £15, but is for 3 cleans.
He did agree when i started to post a cheque every 2nd clean if i miss them twice. But it is now 3 dating back to mid april. I sent a letter today registered post saying i'd put a claim in if not received within 7 days.
I know the bloke cos he moved into the village i grew up in, so i am wondering how this is going to pan out. The last 1 i did this to paid and cancelled. ;D
Just imagine getting paid monthly in an office, its no different really.
This is how i manage to work myself up into action. If these people didn't get paid for 2 or 3 months, their life would grind to a halt. Why should they expect me to be different? I know the amounts are different but the principle is the same.
Some people thinking, 'it's like money in the bank.' Correct. But it's not in my bank where it should be. And that is not right. Owed money is only yours when you have got your hands on it. Not before.
I have and would take back customers who asked me to clean again. I say ok then tell them i stopped because i had trouble getting paid in a reasonable time.
Mark, it really is not that better deal if you dont make it into one. People are used to paying late payment fees if they pay late, I dont have this problem, I may come across as hard nosed but tbh I am one of the nicest guys out there, but I just dont get messed about with money anymore.
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The important thing to remember that up to is up to the point of being paid for the work you have done, you have made NO PROFIT.
It is all very well adding up each individual day's work and contenting yourself that you are doing well, no profit is being made.
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Funnily enough, i am in the process of doing this for 1 customer who only owes £15, but is for 3 cleans.
He did agree when i started to post a cheque every 2nd clean if i miss them twice. But it is now 3 dating back to mid april. I sent a letter today registered post saying i'd put a claim in if not received within 7 days.
I know the bloke cos he moved into the village i grew up in, so i am wondering how this is going to pan out. The last 1 i did this to paid and cancelled. ;D
An update.
Woke up to a text from this bloke. Peed off and told me not to come back. He found it "pathetic" that i didn't just stop in when i was passing by. ::)
Funnily enough a cheque from him arrived this morning that was sent on thursday.
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i have done the cheque thing and online payment thing, but i have now gone back to the collecting way , and then an envelope if they are not in when i call back.....this means i am working an extra 3 hrs a week.... however i no longer have money outstanding, and admin costs . on the evenings i collect , i also drop leaflets or door knock, so the expense of fuel is put to good use .... i know most would not do the collecting thing, but after having done both, i know collecting earns me the most as i always get paid for the work iv done.
i do have some properties in rural areas that i leave an sae for.
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i have done the cheque thing and online payment thing, but i have now gone back to the collecting way , and then an envelope if they are not in when i call back.....this means i am working an extra 3 hrs a week.... however i no longer have money outstanding, and admin costs . on the evenings i collect , i also drop leaflets or door knock, so the expense of fuel is put to good use .... i know most would not do the collecting thing, but after having done both, i know collecting earns me the most as i always get paid for the work iv done.
i do have some properties in rural areas that i leave an sae for.
I always get paid for the work we do and I do not collect. I guess it is what works for you. I am always owed money then to me this is a good thing
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perhaps it is all about outgoings... at the moment mine are are high as i have just moved to nice new build 4 bed room detached etc ....but maybe in the coming years if my goals are reached i will revert back to s.a.e....i just want to have lots of surplus income to be able to not worry about outstanding money. ;
just to add ... i am a tight git ;D
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Why drive around collecting as a tight git :) Works out cheaper leaving SAE or getting custies to pay online. Cashflow maybe a problem initially, but then again most sensible people would have a reserve of funds to live off as an emergency anyway so save your fuel and let the postman do the work. :) Cheaper in the long run :)
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With the cost of fuel collecting can be expensive. We leave an SEA with the invoice which carries a £25.00 late payment charge after 7 days
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Why drive around collecting as a tight git :) Works out cheaper leaving SAE or getting custies to pay online. Cashflow maybe a problem initially, but then again most sensible people would have a reserve of funds to live off as an emergency anyway so save your fuel and let the postman do the work. :) Cheaper in the long run :)
i do have a reserve of funds, and i like to keep it as a reserve rather than use it to cover payments owed to me.
yes it is cheaper to leave a stamp , but on a round like mine, (condensed) it,s not much difference...all i know is from looking at my records i am better off by about £100 a week since i went back to collecting...not a lot i know, but it more than enough covers all the rising costs of late. fuel, energy, food etc :)
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I just leave an adressed envelope with no stamp and it works for me but like Tosh says having a small area is a big help because you can always pop in if you see the car is there , windows open lights on or whatever.
Wheelie bin cleaners get you to sign a standing order. I have thought about this but most of my customers are old and wouldn't go for it.
A bloke I know gave up window cleaning and started doing wheelie bins. He has a specially converted van and reckons he is doing better than he did on the windows (allegedly) but you are tied to a certain route and day because basically you have to follow the dustcart round.
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What would be a reasonable amount to charge for late payments? Do you state an amount or a % of amount due? I request that payment be made within 7 days but haven't introduced a late payment fee yet. If it's still not paid after 7 days what can you reasonably and cost effectively do about it?
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What would be a reasonable amount to charge for late payments? Do you state an amount or a % of amount due? I request that payment be made within 7 days but haven't introduced a late payment fee yet. If it's still not paid after 7 days what can you reasonably and cost effectively do about it?
After 7 days not very much as people go on holiday for 2 weeks IMO if payment is not made with 21 days of clean £2.50 is added to the bill each and every time payment is late.