Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: [GQC] Tim on May 31, 2008, 02:11:09 pm
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Some pictures of my van, needs a battery tray still, and wires tucked a way, also I'm going to get a pipe bender, and get some hooks to hang my pole on, with some rubber sleeves on them. Now I just have to put it under the sun visor, and on top of the tank cage.
Tank was installed by Crystal pure's mobile fitting service, they do Purefreedom systems as well, but are further to the south, they came to me, and installed the tank cage, I installed the rest.
[Click on pictures for larger view]
(http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.904627faa1.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?904627faa1.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.7904894600.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?7904894600.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.45b9021f70.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?45b9021f70.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/uploads/th.9b1474a964.jpg) (http://img2.freeimagehosting.net/image.php?9b1474a964.jpg)
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looks DIY and highly unsafe if you ask me
Also, the tank looks too far forward. Although you might be under the total payload weight, the load must be eveny distributed.
What I mean is, say your payload weight was 800kg, each axle must only bear 400kg. Otherwise its against the law bro.
From those pics, its pretty obvious that thing is gonna make one of your axles over the limit.
Thats besides the fact that fitting a tank that shape upright is just dangerous.
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looks DIY and highly unsafe if you ask me
Also, the tank looks too far forward. Although you might be under the total payload weight, the load must be eveny distributed.
What I mean is, say your payload weight was 800kg, each axle must only bear 400kg. Otherwise its against the law bro.
From those pics, its pretty obvious that thing is gonna make one of your axles over the limit.
Thats besides the fact that fitting a tank that shape upright is just dangerous.
The tank is right in the middle of the Van, Load is evenly distributed. Purefreedom fits those tanks upright no problem at all. When it's bolted properly through the van it's fine.
I notice the van isn't paneled or sealed (floor)!
Wont it get hot in summer and cold in winter and bring all the problems that go with the temperatures?
And what about the water situation, with the floor not being sealed it will find the lowest point of the van (recipe for rust!)!
Have you used this system before? :-\
is that the 300g system :-\
Tank looks to big/tall :-\
please tell me how much they charged you for this!
The van floor is sealed with protecta coat, it's just got a rubber mat in it. I'm using the system now yes. Don't think panelling would make that much of a difference in temps, it's the gaps in the door seals etc that let cold in.
In winter I'll have a little electric greenhouse heater in there. :)
It is the 300GPD from Purefreedom, funnily, at 100PSI pressure after prefilters, it fills the tank quite quick. :)
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Just noticed that the pics don't always load, I think that site is a bit slow, I'll try and get them hosted elsewhere. :)
Thanks LWC. :)
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looks great mate you must be really chuffed. well done ;D
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looks smart
only thing i can see, the strainer needs to be before the pump
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why didnt they install all if it instead of just the cage as i got mine from purefreedom and would travel up there again for a system
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looks smart
only thing i can see, the strainer needs to be before the pump
Hi, the strainer is before the pump. :)
why didnt they install all if it instead of just the cage as i got mine from purefreedom and would travel up there again for a system
Because I simply didn't want them to install everything else, I wanted to do it myself, so I could get the experience, and set it up like I want it. I had to solve a couple of problems, which is cool, because I can help others now as well, and if I ever would get a similar problem, I'm already half way into solving it myself. :)
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the reason i put it so bluntly was because i cant stand it how people say things like "looks DIY and highly unsafe if you ask me", "Tank looks to big/tall , please tell me how much they charged you for this!" , hes obviously very pleased with his system or he would not have posted pics on it, only in the first 2 posts to get completely ripped! thats what i was standing up for, not because of your advice! ... if there was any
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As a newbie, I'm not sure if I should be jumping into this debate!
DIY versus Manufactured does seem to cause some hot debate (which is a good thing in my book). At the end of the day, this is just a debate is it not? We all respect each other and want to impart our knowledge and wisdom for the benefit of all :)
I have all the respect in world for guys that can DIY a system and understand totally guys who go down the Manufactured route for the obvious time-saving/warranty issues.
....but you cant ignore the several thousand pounds saving with DIY can you?
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As a newbie, I'm not sure if I should be jumping into this debate!
DIY versus Manufactured does seem to cause some hot debate (which is a good thing in my book). At the end of the day, this is just a debate is it not? We all respect each other and want to impart our knowledge and wisdom for the benefit of all :)
I have all the respect in world for guys that can DIY a system and understand totally guys who go down the Manufactured route for the obvious time-saving/warranty issues.
....but you cant ignore the several thousand pounds saving with DIY can you?
No you can't! ::)
My system, like the van above (his Baby... wants to shoe it off!) 8)
is just that my baby... unfortunately it's not as pretty as his, but it does the job! :P
Thankfully Each to their own! ;D
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As a newbie, I'm not sure if I should be jumping into this debate!
DIY versus Manufactured does seem to cause some hot debate (which is a good thing in my book). At the end of the day, this is just a debate is it not? We all respect each other and want to impart our knowledge and wisdom for the benefit of all :)
I have all the respect in world for guys that can DIY a system and understand totally guys who go down the Manufactured route for the obvious time-saving/warranty issues.
....but you cant ignore the several thousand pounds saving with DIY can you?
Forgot to add... I've only been doing wfp for.. well I don't know and don't care LESS than a year anyway.
My point is simply (like me!) we are all NEWBIES! 8)
Bit of advice ... Don't get narked too soon!
wish I could take my own advice! ::)
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re reading your post i can see where your coming from, wasnt so much a critism more of a asking so i apologise for that ;)
just tennet clean is gay
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re reading your post i can see where your coming from, wasnt so much a critism more of a asking so i apologise for that ;)
just tennet clean is gay
Bisexual actually.
Who cares whether you've fouled up your van with manky protectacote gunk.
Unless you're going to use it for 8 or 10 years it isn't going to rust that quick.
You'll just stuff up the re-sale value, that's why I haven't done it.
Great looking system though mate.
They're just jealous. ;)
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looks good and professional, and anyone who says otherwise is wrong......some people like to moan, the more they moan , the less freinds they have, and the less freinds they have , the more they moan......and the final product is a person who can,t intergrate with society....ie. a loner ;D
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has toilet ever posted any pics of his own van ??? ???
i for one would love to see what a perfectly fitted system looks like
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has toilet ever posted any pics of his own van ??? ???
i for one would love to see what a perfectly fitted system looks like
tennets van is that good you couldnt possibly look at it or you might die
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has toilet ever posted any pics of his own van ??? ???
i for one would love to see what a perfectly fitted system looks like
Toilet Clean. ;D ;D
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one isolating himself will seek his own selfish longing, against all practical wisdom he will break forth,,,,, and he will sit with his laptop on a saturday night, and talk nonsense ::)
;D ;D ;D ; ;D ;D ;D :P :P :P :-* :-* :-* :'( :'( :'( :'(
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before you ask it's "PEAR CIDER" ;D
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Lol, actually I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body.
Sorry cant help but gloat now as I have finally bitten the bullet and put down a deposit on a new van and system. Yes its Ionics, yes its hot water, and yes I am feeling highly superior. (Even more than before lol)
P holley, that sounds familiar. is your favourite year 1914
;D
I'll be posting plenty of pics of that van when i have it, especially the big REACH AND WASH logo. you can all see that and envy me even more than you already do
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why? it was the year of world war 1.... and you wern't alive, so why was that year your favourite.
i used the money i made from my diy system and put a deposit on a bigger house, and a nice holiday!
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I would like to see your van now Tennet.
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perry ???
yuk :-X :-X
get a grip man
try a mans drink ;D
back on topic tho
very easy to slag off everyone elses setup
especially on the safety front
i have 16 barrels in back of my scudo
in a couple of months it will be a 650 ibc
home baffles and 4 ton ratchets
i want to be able to rmove it and as such it is classed as cargo
so insurance is fine
will it kill me if i crash at over 60mph?
almost certainly (mind you getting a scudo over 60 mph is hard enough)
do i care?
have a wild guess
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why not post some pics of your existing setup toilet ???
the one your engineer mate did for you ::)
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LWC
Please refrain from homophobic remarks, calling people gay as a derogatory remark Just isnt acceptable.
Dave
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Because it has my phone number and company name on it (which isnt tennetclean any more) and some idiot on here (like foxman for example) will use it to threaten/harrass me no doubt.
You're nice like that
you can see my new van pre-sign writing.
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so just blank out the numbers with photoshop you plum
surely a know all like you can fathom that ???
we would love to see the existing set up
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your back then Mr. Thorpe ??
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tim i like your system mate, at the end of the day aslong as your happy with it thats the main thing.
if it puts the bread on the table then great :)
this fourm is great and would nt be the same with out every1
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Because it has my phone number and company name on it (which isnt tennetclean any more) and some idiot on here (like foxman for example) will use it to threaten/harrass me no doubt.
You're nice like that
you can see my new van pre-sign writing.
It's not about the outside of the van, I want to see the inside, see how secure your van is.
I mean, if you don't have an Ionics system, surely you must be risking your life.
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Lol, actually I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body.
Sorry cant help but gloat now as I have finally bitten the bullet and put down a deposit on a new van and system. Yes its Ionics, yes its hot water, and yes I am feeling highly superior. (Even more than before lol)
P holley, that sounds familiar. is your favourite year 1914
;D
I'll be posting plenty of pics of that van when i have it, especially the big REACH AND WASH logo. you can all see that and envy me even more than you already do
sounds like you got some issues going on upstairs if anyone is home up there, so you brought a ionics system that's going to be a costly learning curve loads of filter at high costs, there logos on vans do look good i must admit but systems well you will find out in the long term,
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one isolating himself will seek his own selfish longing, against all practical wisdom he will break forth,,,,, and he will sit with his laptop on a saturday night, and talk nonsense ::)
;D ;D ;D ; ;D ;D ;D :P :P :P :-* :-* :-* :'( :'( :'( :'(
Arrh, Yes but I am not alone.. I have the wife nagging in the background...
WILL YOU GET OF THAT STUPID COMPUTER :o :o :o
good scripture though 8)
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;D Getting back to the thread,
If I were to post pics of my Vehicle a Kangoo
Used as a Family car (4 seats) and a set up in the rear,
I believe some might think its a joke (so I won't obviously!)
But my point is this if your making a living, paying your bills... and your HAPPY
Relax and enjoy life, you may not have as much left as you think! 8) ;D :o
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cmon toilet ;D ;D
you have had a couple of hours to write a smart reply
or come up with a plausible excuse
post some pics of your pro fitted system
not the ionics one you have put a deposit on
(amount you earn i thought a cash purchase would be more like it ;D)
or is it easier to slag off others and then find excuses not to show your own PERFECT system
is this not what we are all waiting for ???
show all us ams how a real PRO sets himself up ;D
anyone else just dying to see ???
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cmon toilet ;D ;D
you have had a couple of hours to write a smart reply
or come up with a plausible excuse
post some pics of your pro fitted system
not the ionics one you have put a deposit on
(amount you earn i thought a cash purchase would be more like it ;D)
or is it easier to slag off others and then find excuses not to show your own PERFECT system
is this not what we are all waiting for ???
show all us ams how a real PRO sets himself up ;D
anyone else just dying to see ???
Yes, I can't wait to see the top notch Armitage Shanks install. ;D
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my god!!
you sound like a gang of old women!
(can i say old women? that could be deemed as politicy in correct)
my vans better than yours, my grans harder than your gran!!
what dose it matter if it dont look 100% pro in side? do you get many custy ask to check all is looking tickty boo????
get a life
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looks smart
only thing i can see, the strainer needs to be before the pump
Hi, the strainer is before the pump. :)
good,
but then that makes the DI after the pump am i right?
the thing wrong with this is that the pressure can build up in the di, which isn't necessarily bad, but having it before the pump is better, and you will find that at some point in the future little bits of resin will come though the hose and onto the window which leaves spots,
or maybe im looking at the pictures right and you have got it all the right way round
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Your right, I've got the DI after the pump like everyone recommends. :)
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tennet, or your new adopted name, toilet
considering you know so much about everything, you surprise me to have gone for a ionics system. suprsed you didnt make it all yourself, why pay anyone to do it? ESPECIALLY their prices! i know someone who got one and although he likes it, hes told me he wishes he'd done it all himself and saved a packet...hmmm
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here you go heres my set up
ht tp://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p253/marcusnorton/100_2232.jpg
ht tp://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p253/marcusnorton/100_2231.jpg
Join the ts ie http
Does a great job of cleaning windows :-*
250 Litre flat tank
75 Metres minibore
75 psi pump + Strainer
mark 2 Varistream
i thank you ;D
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Now there is something that actually IS unsafe. You don't even have a strap lengthways.
That hosereel, will KILL YOU in an accident. Even that cone could snap your neck in two.
Dear me.
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who says put it after the pump?
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so how much did crystal pure charge for the system as the reason i showed mine is because it was installed by purefreedom who supply crystal pure purefreedom charged £2,240 and thats for the 2 man set up and all done in one day.
Chris
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Now there is something that actually IS unsafe. You don't even have a strap lengthways.
That hosereel, will KILL YOU in an accident. Even that cone could snap your neck in two.
Dear me.
It doesnt need a strap lenghtways the front seats will stop it moveing.
And the hosereel wont move as its fixed
Dear oh dear
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LWC no offense mate but you simply dont know what you are on about.
I wanted the best so i bought the best, what is it to you if I choose to get the best system? If you can't afford the best, then too bad for you. Work harder.
My existing setup I do not believe it is safe. Maybe safer than some, as it was properly made and not bodged together but I still dont think it is ok, which is why i am changing it. Also I want hot water.
I am not a bodge-it man, I would rather spend my time working and earning the cash than fannying around trying to cobble something together. If I was to spend say 2 days trying to find and then order the bits to buy, 3 days putting it together, and then another 2 days ironing out the kinks, that is already more than a weeks work down the pan, as well as the cost of the stuff itself.
The cash I would lose in that time (as well as the cost of the bits) would be more than the cost of just getting a ready-made system. And it STILL wouldnt be safe, as it would be a DIY job and not crash-tested. And it wouldnt be hot water either, unless I was to spend ANOTHER few days fannying around with ridiculous gas bottles and stuff which are also dangerous in my opinion.
AND if something goes wrong, it means yet more time and expense fannying around trying to sort it, whereas my new system will be under warranty.
What I simply do not understand is how anyone can think it is cheaper to lose all of that work time by cobbling bits of crap together. It isnt, unless you are earning a joke amount.
Marcus Norton, no offense but that is the most dangerous set up I have yet seen.
It doesnt need a strap lenghtways the front seats will stop it moveing.
LOL! That must be quite simply the most hilarious CIU quote ever.
A bit like saying - I dont need to wear a seatbelt because if I crash the dashboard will stop me going further forward. YOU WILL BE CRUSHED MATE. end of
Also, your website says 'reach and wash'. That aint reach and wash, so they'll be down on you like a ton of bricks if they see it.
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congratulations Tennent, you've made a good decision for all the right reasons. I agree with much of what you say although i do have a self installed system along with a gas bottle.
When this forum starts to hunt in a pack I find it so depressing. I know you often like this 'fun' side of things and can usually best the knockers anyway, but often, I would like to hear what you have to say because you are a good bloke to nick ideas off.
What package is it and what are the rough costs?
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Cheers discount.
I'm getting a 600 litre thrmo-pure system. I'm also getting a new van, renault traffic silver metallic.
As for the cost... well I'll keep that to myself tbh. If you really want to know email me and I'll tell ya.
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Also, your website says 'reach and wash'. That aint reach and wash, so they'll be down on you like a ton of bricks if they see it.
I dont think so Mr Tiolet Clean ;D ;D ;D
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but I'm gonnna report you.
I'll cc you in the email I send to them.
If I am paying top dollar to use the name, then why should you get to use it for your dangerous system for free.
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To go forth and earn money you need confidence that you have the best of everything and I think the vivaro/traffic with a 600 thermopure has to be almost perfect.It's a very good move.
As you point out the capital outlay is soon recouped by you concentrating on what you do best, earning money cleaning windows.
Hot makes the job a lot easier and faster. I never (hardly ever) get complaints, and you could take a novice and have them perfect inside twenty minutes because it just won't let you do a bad job.If you were confident you did a good job before, you just made yourself almost invincible.
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Now there is something that actually IS unsafe. You don't even have a strap lengthways.
That hosereel, will KILL YOU in an accident. Even that cone could snap your neck in two.
Dear me.
It doesnt need a strap lenghtways the front seats will stop it moveing.
And the hosereel wont move as its fixed
Dear oh dear
It's fixed to a crate. A plastic one. I don't need to say more.
The tank will take out the chairs so fast that you won't even make a sound when it hits you.
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but I'm gonnna report you.
I'll cc you in the email I send to them.
If I am paying top dollar to use the name, then why should you get to use it for your dangerous system for free.
Not taking sides but... his site only says...
"What ever your windows we can reach, and then wash them safely and economically !"
I have read almost all of it couldn't see the phrase "Reach & Wash" sorry! ::)
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no tennet, but you just wind people up for no apparant reason, every post i see you post in you always have to post something negative and im not the only one who notices this! wouldnt it be nice if everyone thought hes a nice helpful chap whos got his head screwed on instead on thinking why does he have to be like that all the time?
and personally i think thats a load of rubbish about buying a ionics system just because they fit the tanks well, you can find somebody somewhere other than ionics which could fit it just as well!
people who go ionics, yeh your doing well, but i think its like a new pair of nike trainers lol! all in the name.
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Asics made the first running shoes (japanese) and Nike started by importing these into the usa. These shoes made it possible for people (not just elite but children and 15 stone adults) to cover large weekly mileages on concrete.
In pumps this was not possible without regular injuries.
I run, and I wear Nike.
I also window wash and I use the best equipment available.
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oi Tiolet clean are you feeling a little flushed ;D ;D
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Marcus Norton, no offense but that is the most dangerous set up I have yet seen.
It doesnt need a strap lenghtways the front seats will stop it moveing.
LOL! That must be quite simply the most hilarious CIU quote ever.
A bit like saying - I dont need to wear a seatbelt because if I crash the dashboard will stop me going further forward. YOU WILL BE CRUSHED MATE. end of
No comparison you salesman's dream. ??? ;D
You won't get crushed by something that's flush with it's target.
It can't build up any momentum.
If you were to crash hard enough for that to happen you'd be squashed at the front anyway.
If you've got a tank in the middle of the van (which is insane) then yes, you'll have to have it seriously strapped down.
If it's flush with the front it can't go anywhere.
You clearly know lots about big brands and wasting money, but nothing about the laws of physics. ::)
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but I'm gonnna report you.
I'll cc you in the email I send to them.
If I am paying top dollar to use the name, then why should you get to use it for your dangerous system for free.
You're paying lots of money to have a name on your van that no customer has ever heard of?
It's not like it's Sony, or Canon or Asda. ;D
MUG!!!!!!! ;D
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Mate, have you not seen the video of the guy who becomes an elephant
Here it is
www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEtDbnnPnj8
Thats one guy, max 90kg, and he gets thrown forward with a force of 3.5 tonnes. That means your 250 litre tank will push against your back seat with a force of about 10 tonnes, and that is just at 30mph.
Yes yes call me toilet clean, thats all very well. But, please in all serioussness mate, SORT THIS OUT! Get a trailer or something!
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Are carpet cleaning machines crash tested ?
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Squeaky its nothing to do with having the tank resting against something at all. 10 tonnes will snap the seat and driver no problem at all.
You mate are giving dangerous advice. I am being serious now, marcus I would seriously think about that set up.
david i dont care less about carpet cleanng machines, i'm a window cleaner, and marcus needs to look again at that set up.
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Cheers discount.
I'm getting a 600 litre thrmo-pure system. I'm also getting a new van, renault traffic silver metallic.
As for the cost... well I'll keep that to myself tbh. If you really want to know email me and I'll tell ya.
Are you getting both through ionic.
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Marcus look here:
Halfords Trailer (http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_268389_langId_-1_CarSelectorCatalogId__CarSelectorGroupId__varient__categoryId_78407_crumb_34005-55057_parentcategoryrn_78407)
You can pick up a nice trailer from halfords for only £220. Your tank and gear would fit in this no problem I think. At least give it some thought mate.
NWH, yes I am.
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Jokeing aside
The tank is held down by 2 x 2 tonne ratchet straps which are attached to the seatbelt fixings.
The front of the tank is pushed up against an angle iron which inturn is bolted through floor with spacers and 16mm nuts and bolts. It wont move
The reel is secured on the crate which inturn is fixed into the floorpan.
when i posted pics i knew id get some stick.......so what it works for me and im happy with it.
Any way thanks for the concern tiol sorry Tennant Clean ill sighn off now.
Marcus...
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Squeaky its nothing to do with having the tank resting against something at all. 10 tonnes will snap the seat and driver no problem at all.
You mate are giving dangerous advice. I am being serious now, marcus I would seriously think about that set up.
Rubbish, you clearly don't understand simple physics.
It ain't going to smash through a steel partition that it's already up against at 30mph.
There's no build up of momentum.
If that was the case then in a bendy bus or a 2 coach train crash the rear carriage would crush the front one. It doesn't though.
If it was travelling a few feet behind then it would.
A trailer would smash through the car for a start. Lets have some sense here! ;D
It's simple.
Don't believe the hype.
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Squeaky, no offense mate, but i seem to remember it wasnt all that long ago that you were denying the benefits of waterfed pole adamantly.
Then all of a sudden you went waterfed pole.
My point is, your opinion changes according to your own circumstances.
"I'm using ladders therefore all you pole users are wrong" is the way you used to go on, I remember it well.
Only all us pole users were not wrong, you were.
Now, its "I dont have a pro crash-tested system so if you do you are wrong"
I'm afraid I have absolutely no respect whatsoever for that viewpoint. You cannot afford one/dont want one, fine thats your choice, but it does not make it the wrong choice for others.
I was chatting with a guy at ionics last week when I was sorting something with my order and I mentioned about how ionics are always slated on forums etc. The guy just laughed a little and said it was nothing new and that it was the british nature to knock success. At the end of the day there are more reach and wash systems out there than all others put together, and thats not for no reason. The guy said the same was true of any industry, the market leaders are always criticized simply because they are successful.
I got thinking about that and do you it is right. Look at microsoft - they have produced the most successful and widely used computer product of all time - Windows - yet if you go on a computer forum and ask the geeks there what they think of microsoft, they will slate it, even though the PC as we know it would not exist without their products.
Coming back to ionics, I have great respect for others here (like discount) who have the attitude of "I dont have a system like that yet, but its a great system, good luck to you, I hope you make a success of it"
Squeaky, you are just unable to see anyone else's point of view, i'm sure I am not the first person to tell you this, and I also bet this goes way beyond window cleaning in your life. Just look at your attitude to those who charge a higher price than you. You think they are wrong. LOL How can it be wrong to earn more money per hour. Would it not be better to try to understand how more can be charged? No, because yet again your opinion is based on your own circumstances. You cant charge it so it is wrong that anyone else does.
Seriously mate, i think you may be one of those people who is closed minded and is only happiy being miserable, if you know what I mean.
That sort of attitude i just dont understand. Cheer up matey!
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Seriously mate, i think you may be one of those people who is closed minded and is only happiy being miserable, if you know what I mean.
That sort of attitude i just dont understand. Cheer up matey!
I didn't say that having a professionally built system was wrong, how could it be?
Stop misquoting me. ::)
I've said in the past (like many others) that it's unneccesary that's all.
You can't clean windows any better or any quicker because you've forked out 3 times as much.
And to be honest, I never mentioned it in this thread anyway...
I said that a tank up against a partition wasn't going to crush you at 30mph.
Oh yeah, and me? miserable? ???
How could anyone be miserable after reading some of your posts? ;D
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soory just wanted to say the system in despute looks bloody awfull! thats not a van ita a car. i serously would check how road leagle it is. i'd give you a ticket in a flash!!
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Squeaky its nothing to do with having the tank resting against something at all. 10 tonnes will snap the seat and driver no problem at all.
You mate are giving dangerous advice. I am being serious now, marcus I would seriously think about that set up.
Rubbish, you clearly don't understand simple physics.
It ain't going to smash through a steel partition that it's already up against at 30mph.
There's no build up of momentum.
If that was the case then in a bendy bus or a 2 coach train crash the rear carriage would crush the front one. It doesn't though.
If it was travelling a few feet behind then it would.
A trailer would smash through the car for a start. Lets have some sense here! ;D
It's simple.
Don't believe the hype.
Sorry to say this, Squeaky Clean, but it's YOUR knowledge of physics that is deficient here.
All you need to know is Newton's first law: Every body will continue in a state of uniform rest or motion unless acted upon by an external force. It's also known as the law of conservation of momentum.
What this means is that if your van and its contents are doing 30 mph and it is brought to a sudden stop in a collision, the contents are going to want to continue doing 30 mph whether they are up against a bulkhead or not.
If that was the case then in a bendy bus or a 2 coach train crash the rear carriage would crush the front one. It doesn't though. Yes, it does!
(http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en-commons/6/68/Amtrak_crash.jpg)
A trailer would smash through the car for a start. Yes, that's right. That's exactly what it tries to do.
(http://www.carchaos.com/car_crash_pictures/semi_crunch/semi_crunch_thumb.jpg)
If you don't believe me, here's a little experiment you can try at home. Take a supermarket trolley and run with it as hard and as fast as you can into a brick wall. As long as you are holding the trolley tightly, (i) you will not damage the trolley and (ii) the trolley will not hurt you. Right?
Wrong.
Don't do the experiment, and don't imagine that you are going to survive a 30mph crash with a load of water in a tank in the back. The restaining straps might be able to support a static load of 2 tonnes, but they are bolted to poor quality sheet metal and will very simply rip through the metal and the load will come right through into the front of the vehicle.
You would have just about long enough to say, "Oh, sh......."
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To be fair Wally this is what Squeaky said. He did have a poor grasp of inertia though. From what i understand this is from sitting in the cafe most of the day and thinking it's work.
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Wally I do love your posts mate , you know your stuff ;D
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No Squeeky said that it's fine because it doesn't build up any momentum, there doesn't need to be a momentum, because there is still a force being applied to the tank, and when the car actually has the momentum, and the tank wanting to still go in the same direction, well.....you don't need tank momentum for that.
That's not physics, that's physics Squeeky Clean way lol.
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I don't know why I bother with this forum of window cleaning halfwits. ::)
Everyone always thinks they know better.
Of course if I crash at 30 at my tank is going to leap 2ft vertically and still have enough forward momentum to smash through a steel panel. ::)
You planks.
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It won't have to go vertically, don't you understand that?
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It won't have to go vertically, don't you understand that?
Yes it will. ::)
I'm sat 2ft above my tank.
If it went through (which it wouldn't), it would go under my feet.
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The tank will make the bulkhead meet the engine a lot quicker with 500kg sat behind it, and squash whatever is sat between wether it be above or below.
In other words you will end up like a fray bentos pie, with you being the filling.
Dave
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I think that this is a lost cause.
How about some stuff on defensive driving?
My favourite is the "two-second rule."
And I try to drive as if I am carrying a delicate and precious cargo - my children's dad!
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Lets take this argument away from window cleaning for a moment and think about it in general terms
And lets use a theoretical van that has a maximum payload of 1000kg
If what you guys are saying is correct that means anybody who loads there van right upto the LEGAL maximum payload and is involved in a crash at anything over 30mph is going to be crushed to death by there cargo! :o
I suppose the reason we never hear about this is because its so common the newspapers dont even bother to report on it ???
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Squeaky its nothing to do with having the tank resting against something at all. 10 tonnes will snap the seat and driver no problem at all.
You mate are giving dangerous advice. I am being serious now, marcus I would seriously think about that set up.
Rubbish, you clearly don't understand simple physics.
It ain't going to smash through a steel partition that it's already up against at 30mph.
There's no build up of momentum.
If that was the case then in a bendy bus or a 2 coach train crash the rear carriage would crush the front one. It doesn't though.
If it was travelling a few feet behind then it would.
A trailer would smash through the car for a start. Lets have some sense here! ;D
It's simple.
Don't believe the hype.
Hitting something at 30mph can vary wildly if another cars is doing 70mph, hit a wall at 30mph the list goes on.
Little point really posting this as you have your own mind and what ever is said you will think you are right, and I am not about to try and change it.
I will say you are kidding yourself if you think a bulkhead will take the impact more like the whole thing will come forward half a ton lets say of water behind you coming forward it will lift as a tank is never full to the brim, logic says this
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Lets take this argument away from window cleaning for a moment and think about it in general terms
And lets use a theoretical van that has a maximum payload of 1000kg
If what you guys are saying is correct that means anybody who loads there van right upto the LEGAL maximum payload and is involved in a crash at anything over 30mph is going to be crushed to death by there cargo! :o
I suppose the reason we never hear about this is because its so common the newspapers dont even bother to report on it ???
Yea if not properly strapped in. Was on BBC a little while a go, accident, beer kegs flew through the front on the van, and continued to do so for quite a distance.
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The tank will make the bulkhead meet the engine a lot quicker with 500kg sat behind it, and squash whatever is sat between wether it be above or below.
In other words you will end up like a fray bentos pie, with you being the filling.
Dave
That's the case whether it's bolted down or not.
The weight would still be there regardless.
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I was sat behind a scafflod lorry a few days ago, 4ft pole not straped down, I slowed down so some could over take, a 10mph crash would have sent them straqight through my window killing me more than likely.
Some people just dont think, other think they know (clearly dont), have a car crash and you know the damage it can cause. I think the moral is "better safe that sorry".
Ian
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Lets face it, there's no point arguing about it.
If you crash a van with a heavy tank you will be squished.
So the only answer is... don't bloody have a crash!
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Lets face it, there's no point arguing about it.
If you crash a van with a heavy tank you will be squished.
So the only answer is... don't bloody have a crash!
Agree with you no point arguing at all.
It's not me, its the others. Accident happen, I know it happened to me at 50mph head on it hurts
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Yea if not properly strapped in. Was on BBC a little while a go, accident, beer kegs flew through the front on the van, and continued to do so for quite a distance.
Maybe so but I cant imagine theres many of us driving around with loose water tanks in the back.
We are talking about baffled tanks held down with fixing brackets or rachets straps attached to MANUFACTURER fitted anchor points.
So that means that every van on every road in every country that was bought with the intention of using its legal maximum payload will crush its driver to death in the event of an accident!
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Lets face it, there's no point arguing about it.
If you crash a van with a heavy tank you will be squished.
Not once I get my new van I wont.
You, on the other hand, will be mince meat.
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Tennet
Ionics only crash test upto 30mph and not with a full tank.
So stick to under 30mph with a 3/4 full tank, avoid head on collision with other vehicles and you will be fine.
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Hello again foxman!
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Lets face it, there's no point arguing about it.
If you crash a van with a heavy tank you will be squished.
Not once I get my new van I wont.
You, on the other hand, will be mince meat.
Dream on "Salesman's Dream"...
I used to love people like you in sales.;D
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i feel really safe with my 500 ltr tank strapped down if i was in a crash at 30mph or more i reckon i would be safe as regards to the tank coming forward , at the end of the day a crash can happen in a split second (ive been there) its up to the driver to make sure the loads secure and i feel mine is so i feel safe .
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Dream on "Salesman's Dream"...
I used to love people like you in sales.
Squeaky, if independant testing and certification to a recognised international standard doesnt convince you, you have to wonder what would?
I have a theory: If I was to prove to you white was white by reasoning, logic, expert opinion and scientific data, you would still say it was black.
That wally the window washer guy is obviously well clued up on the physics of it all, and yet you still remain unconvinced. And you will never ever admit you are wrong about anything. Wfp over ladders being a case in point.
You have issues.
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I think the thread has run it's coarse, sorry guys, I'm locking it now, thanks for the positive comments, and constructive criticism. :)