Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: jikwan on February 11, 2008, 05:55:03 pm
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changing the drums-whipping the feed hose in and out always gives an airlock
and has to be blasted out turning pump on full to clear it out
ive noticed you can see the offending airlock in topmost part of the hose
anyone tried fitting an air valve at that place
im asking first before i try it myself
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I change my barrel's before it gets 2 low 2 suck air in.
other things iv done is put my finger in the hozelock connector turn pum on for a sec let go then pump switchers off connect hose again blas it for 1 or 2 secs seems 2 work.
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Been using my trolley since April and had very few airlocks. You must be causing the airlock by letting the water get too low.
I leave a couple of inches in the barrel before changing.
Bob
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it happens even barrels half full
if that airlock dont get blasted out youll have erratic pump performance
blasting it out is a real wast of water
takes me 3-4 secs full blast
im almost crying when isee it wasted like that
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must have air gettin in somewere then i imagion. have a look at it
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Okay, maybe Im a newbie with the trolley, but last week because I havent got a strainer on my pump I fitted the mesh with a jubilee-clip from a 75p tea-strainer onto the end of the intake pipe, I havent had an airlock since (not that I can remember anyway).
The mesh seems to create with the water surface tension a film across the inlet.
Matt
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airs getting in and i know exactly where its coming from
whipping it out-water runs out until the time you have it vertical then turn the valve
also when putting it into the fresh supply it drips creating more air
whipping it out---hell man iaint slow
anyone that wants to challenge me to a pipe whipping contest had better be on the ball! i sure got a mean wrist
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well matt
if your strainer idea works ill get you a nobel prize for it
gotta try it out
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Okay, maybe Im a newbie with the trolley, but last week because I havent got a strainer on my pump I fitted the mesh with a jubilee-clip from a 75p tea-strainer onto the end of the intake pipe, I havent had an airlock since (not that I can remember anyway).
The mesh seems to create with the water surface tension a film across the inlet.
I might try that as i havent got a strainer on my pump either
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No no no, I tell a lie; I did have one airlock, and remember having to take the strainer off, but it has cut down on them.
I have also tried (before the tea-bag thingy) filling an old GG4 bottle with RO water, when theres an airlock I upturned the inlet pipe (so nozzle pointed towards the sky) and poured RO into it, to prime it, that did sort it for sure)
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pouring water though effective will be time consuming
just had an idea you know those petrol filters they use for chainsaws
and strimmers a pretty dense filter that i imagine would stop any dribbling
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I'd check all your connections. I've only had one when I went too low in the barrel. I just stuck my finger in the hozelock stop and it cleared it straight away. All the little bits left in the barrel are just poured in to the last barrel.
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Airlocks are easy to rid of with the Freedom Trollley.
Take the hoselock connector off ( outlet one) the pole hose pipe, and stick your finger in to push down the widget that's in there, at this point have the pump running pretty high - hay presto the air is gushing out and full pressure is resumed. Try it - it works. I worked it by accident, but glad I did. ;D
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pouring water though effective will be time consuming
just had an idea you know those petrol filters they use for chainsaws
and strimmers a pretty dense filter that i imagine would stop any dribbling
I went to SCATS (agricultural supplier) to get a sprayer filter for a knapsack sp
rayer, like those petrol ones, the mesh was too dense, nothing would go through it. Generally those filters have liquid forced through them, we're just suckin' with the trolley ;D
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no matt
i worked with chainsaws and strimmers 5 years overhauling+use
the white 1 inch filter thats attatched to main fuel hose that goes to carburretor
is sucked not forced
our 60 or 100 psi pump is 1000 times the "sucking" power
could i ask you out of curiosity (and also that i might want to try it out)
did you try it out? did you find restriction in the flow?
this filter concept can squash many scorpions with one stone
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why not get a brass hoselock female connector with built in valve and male connector/ cut the suction hose, put the female one on the hose to the pump and have the other bit with a male one, then have a hole in the lid so its easier to change barrels. Just shut the valve before disconnection & changing.
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gofish yes i daresay your solution is effective
im trying to find some way of eliminating the airlock without doing anything
conecting disconecting filling the hose blasting it out etc pressing this or that
another idea is a one way valve at the end of the hose
im also getting the feeling im the only guy in the world that has this problem
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no matt
i worked with chainsaws and strimmers 5 years overhauling+use
the white 1 inch filter thats attatched to main fuel hose that goes to carburretor
is sucked not forced
our 60 or 100 psi pump is 1000 times the "sucking" power
could i ask you out of curiosity (and also that i might want to try it out)
did you try it out? did you find restriction in the flow?
this filter concept can squash many scorpions with one stone
We are talking about 2 different types of filter here, is the one you are talking about the one that sits on the end of the inlet pipe in the fuel tank?
The ones I looked at were for chemical sprayers, they filtered any debris out before it gets to the nozzle on a knapsack sprayer, therefore these ones have the spray forced through them, its forced through by manually pumping the machine. But the mesh on them was far too small, far far too small, I didnt even bother buying to just see, it was obvious they were no good.
Matt
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jon igot a rough idea of your concept
hows the tyres and suspension?
i forgot to mention that with 30psi it works with a heavy payload
but when the car is light youll get a lot of wear on the centre of tyre
got to change the pressure
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matt
definetly sticks on the end of fuel line
this nozzle type filter im not familiar with
its white fairly dense but not so too dense hell you can blow through it easy
put it in your mouth
get em from chainsaw/strimmer suppliers
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This is what I meant
(http://www.agratech.co.uk/images/pictures/photos/products/filters/standard-nozzle-filters-(product).jpg)
that nozzle is about 3/4 in height, so you can see how fine the mesh is.
Matt
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no no the nozzle thing is way off
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Dont forget my intention wasnt about trying to stop airlocks, it was about protecting my pump as theres no strainer, but that cheap 75p tea-strainer (remember?) was used instead of the nozzle mesh and seems to have ALSO helped regarding airlocks.
Matt
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You can get inline strainers that will fit straight inline with the 1/2'' hose between the pump and barrel from ebay or maybe ro man?, i have used this and brass connectors to stop this with no problems. Plastic are poo and just wont do, brass ones with a shutoff valve will do the trick or just a brass inline valve, use some jubilee clips, then turn the valve closed before changing barrels.
jon igot a rough idea of your concept
hows the tyres and suspension?
i forgot to mention that with 30psi it works with a heavy payload
but when the car is light youll get a lot of wear on the centre of tyre
got to change the pressure
( Hey Jikwan - yeah the tires are ok, i havent tried it fully loaded with 250 litres yet, but the 250ltr flat tank is positioned over the back axle with pump/batt/ underfloor in the spare wheel compartment, spare wheel behind drivers seat.
I found that the way i drive the tires would wear allot on the outside at 26, on 30 they do feel quite firm, but il do what you said put them down again when empty. I just had to get some new front tires because they were dead and worn right through at the sides. are you sure 30 is not too much for the tires with all the weight? )
thanks
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just sort of thinking but....my pond vac has a little flap thing over the inlet pipe.when pressure is on it opens motor stops it closes. it is simply a disc and oring setup back pressure from the water closes it when motor stops.principle would be very simple to apply to pipes on trollies.....but someone needs to make them ::)
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i might give the inline strainers a go
you think the tyres are worried about an extra 4psi?
i do believe the rule is more the load higher the pressure
your car manual should say that
where i position sometimes200lit is right in the middle of the car
back seats removed
then you have even distribution on all 4 suspension springs
your idea is put all the weight un the back springs
you must be crazy
why dont you type in new post="weres the best position for loaded 250lit tank?"
and ask why?
the heavyweights on this forum have experience can give you good advice
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lj
i do believe the flap thing would work
the dribble that comes out my hose is next to nothing pressure
but a real drag to get rid of airlock--imagine 8-9-10 times a day
problem is locating the flap valve
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i know what you mean about that its something i have been thinking about for awhile changing barrels is a pain i have just changed my set up ((its diy and i dont know about freedom trolley) I HAD a female hoselock on pump out to dual male adaptor and female on hose reel but this always leaked ::) i now use GECA fittings hard to describe them but so far very good ,less prone to airlocks ,BRASS,washers are replaceable,dirt cheap ,DO NOT LEAK AT ALL . Some one told me they are usedon compressors but i dont know maybe google it as for flap valve.....gap in market there perhaps unless we just aint found em yet
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I have just had a real moment of clarity on this dead simple and easy IF IT WORKS and i will try it out tomorrow and report ;Dfingers crossed (I would go out and try now but missus and kids all in bed)dont want to say what in case i lay myself open to ridicule or in case someone else has done it already
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lj
i think i know what it is
some simple non return valve idea
the hoselock femail non return devices dont work so well in my experience
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((I will post some pictures when i have time jikwan about the tank))
Alternatively, which i thought would be quite allot easier, is buy a 25 litre tank from Ro man, mount it permanantly on your trolley, and then you wont have to change barrels or consider airlock problems.
These tanks are 25litres, strong and more upright than sideways so suited to a trolley. With a big lid on the top so you can easily pour the barrel straight in, or even better if you have a van mount, fill up straight from your van tank in seconds. You can choose an outlet at the bottom, so then the pump is gravity fed directly without any problems. They are durable and strong, and when you tilt your trolley you wont have any leaks or splashes out of the lid.
Im not sure if they will fit a freedom trolley though?
http://www.ro-man.com/shop/product_info.php/cPath/54_67/products_id/324
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john
im making calculations bout your big lid idea never thought about that
why dont you make a new subject on the forum
best place for 250lit tank?
im sure youll get blasted for putting it all on back springs
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air locks are great ain't they, here is my simple way of dealing with it, follow these word then look at pics i will try to get it in the right order, OK get trolley put hose in drum, then get pipe from hose lock bit i use a 8mm straight push fit connector and blanking plug, then pull out plug stick it to the top of drum and turn on flow controller to max you will hear when air lock is gone it takes about 10 too 20 seconds depending how much of a air lock you got, then turn off get your pole hose take off push fit cap connect to straight push fit and your up and running again, but the best bit about this way is it don't take long and more important you don't waste any water on the floor. (http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture167.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture169.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture172.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture173.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture174.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture175.jpg)(http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l190/grizzly69_2006/Picture171.jpg)
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smythy
great pcs and explination
thats what i used to do to save the water
got tired of it and said to hell with it and let the water waste
theres too much fiddling about
were working on it hang on there will come a time when airlock problem is solved
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lj
i think i know what it is
some simple non return valve idea
the hoselock femail non return devices dont work so well in my experience
well you got me there ;D but i have been using a cheap non return female connector all day and it works a treat ;D ;D ;Dproblem solved for me,maybe you need to try a few different makes of stop connectors and see if one works(the hozelock one i tried first"fluttered" but the cheap generic one worked fine with varistream at normal settings and only fluttered at low settings
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smithys sort them pics out man i thought my computer was bust ;D
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i reckon its the final answer
just about to set off fo poundland i think theyre shut
ill rifle through the hozlocks i got there must be a good one
if it works for you it will work for everyone
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go for it try a few the one i am using came out of a sprinkler set from wilkos it even worked when i ran the barrel dry :o just a minute or so to get back up to pressure.Do you use a reel with your trolley or is hose direct to pump outlet ??? ???
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no reel direct
at the end of the intake hose is the manual valve igot to be turning
the thing so many times a day
the hozlock non return could despense with that man valve
you say you ran dry..............no airlock???????????
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not NO airlock BUT the pump just drew it through..no real drama just a gap of 30 to 45 seconds with slow stream then it picked up.Also bear in mind i am using a reel with 10mtrs of half inch and 60 mtrs of microbore so it takes a while when thats rolled out ;D but honestly at no point today did i have to disconnect reel and free airlock then reconnect after changing barrels ;D i am well chuffed with it,cost pence cant believe i never thought about it before,well done for bringing it up to start with ;)
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My trolley is used as a van mount, and I run out of water regularly and if I run out I get air in the tube. The quickest way for me to clear the air out is to, lower the brush to ground level and let the pump move the water and air. It woks for me.
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Forpy, this is just an ordinary female hozelock connector on the end of the intake pipe is it?
Do you ALSO have the nozzle tap on there?
ALSO is it one of those that shuts off or just an ordinary open female connector?
Matt
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sorry mate missed this ::) my set up is diy so i cant be sure about freedom thingys BUT the problem is air getting in inlet pipe (in barrell ) so i put a female hozelock with a check valve in it on the end of the INTAKE pipe these are the sort of hozelock fittings that cut off supply when you pull out the spray gun if you are watering your garden.It worked for me ;D ;D
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sorry i dont know what nozzle tap is ???yes its one that shuts off ...pump opens it when you switch on/demand water back pressure closes it
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up date for jikwan :)two days now and its still working for me.best if you change over before barrel empties but if not just open tap on pole/reel whatever turn varistream to boost and wait for it to pull to full pressure ;D dead chuffed
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good for you lj
ive descovered that my hozlock "non return" leaks
the one that connects to pole hosing
got to replace that and get another to stick on end of feed hose
i know this trick works
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the connector that is on the hose you connect to take it off and remove the plastic bit inside that stops the water when hoses not plugged in and make sure the hose on the trolley is not dented anywhere especially at the bracket on the side . did this now have no trouble . also i run mine from a tank now as a tank system and never get a air lock . but as others have said the finger shoved in the end works great but this is because of the plastic bit .
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kary
this plastic bit is a loose floating bit eh?