Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: jonah on January 31, 2008, 08:03:24 pm
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Despite initial apprehension I have started to clean several houses on local council estate . I charge same as anywhere and have had no problems , people pay on time and are great . Just wondered about other wc/s experiances cos some are negative concerning these .
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It's like playing with fire, sure you can do it, but your going to get burned now and then. Some people are respectful, but realistically speaking, in some estates the absolute worst of the worst live there, it's one thing having a chat with them, it's a hole different thing cleaning for them.
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yes but you can still be selective who you take on and quite a few are hard working and have bought and look after their homes .
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I do several council estates on my round ,good tippers at christmas . No worse payers than anyone else in my opinion but then Stroud isnt exactly the south peckham estates is it.
Gordon
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i have only 1 customer in a council estate, who is my brothers girlfriends parents, they are the nicest people you could know of, its a tiny little place and they cant really afford much - it takes 10 minutes and its £5 they are happy with that.
At the same time in a quite well off posh area of ipswich there is a horrible 60ish lady who is so fussy, and irritating, snotty old lady who begrudges paying me £7 for doing a great job wfp on her large new house because she doesnt like the water dripping down. She must go into a mental fit when it rains... takes 30-40 minutes and i only had because it was passed on from a round i bought, now i have not bothered to turn up again...
back to the people living on the council estate, - they just passed on their friends details and got me some more work!
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Do you collect Gordon or use envelopes ?
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one of my best days work is a council estate . never had any problems with these . allways pay on time .
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well its refreshing to meet wc/s who arnt snobs ;D
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The most reliable customers of all are the older residents on a mature council estate. They have old fashioned ideas about not owing anybody anything and treating everyone with respect.
I've had people going miles out of their way to come to my house to pay £6 that they owe because they weren't in when I called.
If only all my customers had their ethics. ::)
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with any luck the worst of the worst wont want their windows ccleaned but you never can tell and you can get burned anywhere,i just find them a bit depressing to work on you get this mix of well kept houses with smart well tended gardens right next door to utter crap holes with wrecked cars on the drive and six foot weeds out back
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Yes and you dont mind doing the odd favour just to help out .
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I do some which are a mix of council owned and ex-council (ie bought by the tenant). They are all superb. The only problem is I sometimes have to go collecting as they are working. Not a bad payer amongst them.
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cant you get them to send cheque Feen ?
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Jonah
all SAE
Gordon
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Yes, I know there are plenty of people that are nice in them. I think the greater the divide in peole who have it a bit better, and people who don't have a lot of money, is where you can really tell, on some estates they just seem to group together.
One of the things that I look for is, the state of the property, car wrecks and litter in the garden is obviously a no no.
You get a bit of a 6th sense for properties like this. I've been right on almost all occasions.
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i used to have a brilliant round down probably the scummiest road in town, and to be fair to em, they were the best payers ive ever had, and the only reason i sold them is it was a pain getting round back with the hose, but now ive got me backpack i wish i hadnt sold it >:( doh, id have it back any day
moneys MONEY
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Yes and you dont mind doing the odd favour just to help out .
glad its not just me i cant help it i end up checking down pipes etc for nothing cos i feel sorry for em living next to scum and they aint all old couples either used to do a house in a council "row" immaculate middle aged family two polite kids nice bloke and lovely wife x-trail 4x4 hot tub in a summerhouse out back really nice inside extended etc.......either side crap holes i felt like doing the windows for nothing even tho he was not short of money ::)
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nowt wrong with a good hart mate .
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Avoid Like the Plague
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Why ?
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Why ?
what he said
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90% of mine work is council/ex-council estates and no probs ever except some git who moved and never told me. I don't see the probelm here.
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mr rose check the chat ;D
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i live on a council estate. is ther a problem with that?
sound slike a few people think they are above council estates.
sad indeed thinking like that.
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you could say i live on a council estate (essex) the council built the houses in the 50"s
but my neighbor paid £370000 for an exc council house 4 yrs ago .
but i guess your right ;D
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mr rose check the chat ;D
eh?
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so rosy you agree council houses are ok to clean and we should stop being biggoted towards them ?
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of course he does "council" estates are no different from any other estate, most on "council" estates round my way own em anyway so whats difference
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Despite initial apprehension I have started to clean several houses on local council estate . I charge same as anywhere and have had no problems , people pay on time and are great . Just wondered about other wc/s experiances cos some are negative concerning these .
will that be the grove, mixenden or illingworh
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Illingworth ? plied my trade there .
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It's not the estates it's the people. Benefit recipients are a pain in the butt. I own and live in an ex council house, I've raised my kids here, two graduated and the one that didn't is on 50k per year.
The sad fact is, there are some people, usually single parents who have never worked and think the world owes them a living. You can't tar all of them with the same brush, but in my experience young people on council estates are the worst customers. Dai
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i think you can get problems any where not just the council estates
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Three children all successfull ! well done .
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Agree with Dai.
The few ruin it for the majority. Sooner or later you will get messers, the work cannot be priced high and some young gun living there will take up window cleaning and undercut you.
Chris
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Despite initial apprehension I have started to clean several houses on local council estate . I charge same as anywhere and have had no problems , people pay on time and are great . Just wondered about other wc/s experiances cos some are negative concerning these .
Give it time mate, around 3 months in our experience then the problems begin. The novalty at first is great then it's 'Oh don't do this time' etc etc. The sad thing is there will always be a few who want the full package and play ther game whilst most turn out to be a right pain and make those areas a waste of time.
Let us know in 3 months time how these areas are getting on.
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earning a living is what we all want but when i look on here i see something different ! There are a lot of egos and experts ! Dont you just want to provide a good service and be paid a fair price ?
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I have cleaned on council estates before, but I now stay well clear!! Too many bad payers for my liking >:(
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well i am going to continue with my round as i have had good feedback so far and all i can say is i take everyone as i find them .
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well i am going to continue with my round as i have had good feedback so far and all i can say is i take everyone as i find them .
;D ;D ;D ;D good for you mate
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well i am going to continue with my round as i have had good feedback so far and all i can say is i take everyone as i find them .
Good for you! but I'd rather go for better quality customers, the type who actually pay when you clean there windows!!!
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well so far everyone has payed after me cleaning their windows ! cant belive you are so closed minded !
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ignore and just do it you might get a few who mess about but that can happen anywhere and you soon get a nose for the messers there will be plenty who will pay fine and if not ....well its not like you built a house for em and they didnt pay is it we are talking 5 to 10 quid max surely so what go for it mate you cant make sweeping generalisations based on the type of house someone lives in
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Mr thorpe if ever you are in yorkshire please drop in .
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The reason most people live on council estates is that they don't have a lot of money, so therefore it makes good business sense to me to stay away from them and target more affluent areas! ;)
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groundhog you really need to get a balanced view of life !
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groundhog you really need to get a balanced view of life !
I'm in business to make money, so I go to were the money is! your welcome to the low paying council estate jobs if thats what you want, but its not for me. ;)
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who said the council houses were low paid ?
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The reason most people live on council estates is that they don't have a lot of money, so therefore it makes good business sense to me to stay away from them and target more affluent areas! ;)
no offence ::) but that is the biggest load of old toss i have ever read in my life
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weve all done it ! brovado and all that macho stuff .
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
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are you for real ? :o
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i was going to say something similar but profile says coventry so it may be different there...I can only speak about council estates in my area and generally we have a lot less crime round here however its still tarring every one who lives on a council estate with the same brush which seems a bit harsh
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The whole point of being in any business is to better yourself, be successful and make money,
we all clean windows and get paid for it, some council estates will work for some but not others,
The bottom line is if your round is paying well, wether your customers are black, white , rich or poor, then you should be happy ,and you are doing something right.
Council estastes make up a large prorportion of our clientel, some of us avoid the worst ones , some dont.
There really is no arguement here, if you are being paid in an estate wether its council or private then you are doing well,
Also may i add one more thing, customer relations kicks in at some point,
so what works for some characters may not work for others,
in other words, if you are an approachable person with a decent sense of humour, who gets on well with his customers, and works to a high standard you are , by far more likely to generate custom,.. keep it.. and get paid.
i personally targetted large houses from day one so i dont work in any council estates, but over the years i have worked them doing other jobs, and i always , always found, no matter how people live their lives, be fair be polite win people over and work to the best of your ability , and you will succeed anywhere.
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
I'm sorry but that's a very narrow minded post. I grew up on a council estate and it was nothing like you've mentioned above.
Andy
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I think the whole thing revolves around whether or not the customers have chequebooks. If they have chequebooks then at least some part of the financial system finds them creditworthy which means they are more likely to be creditworthy to you and your window cleaning services. More importantly if they owe you 5 times which might be 40 quid they will be able to write you a cheque when you find them in as the majority of people quite often don't have cash in the house.
This is the only reason I find council houses less disirable than private estates, i.e finding a chequebook is harder than locating bin laden!!!
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
I do very little work on council estates but I think your post is over the top.
I did blocks of work on council estates for some years. Quite simply, I find that I earn more money with a smaller number of customers in larger properties. I didn't have my £10 minimum charge back then either. Also, if I did get the odd one or two who messed me about, it was harder to get rid of them as they all seemed to know each other. So my reluctance is nothing to do with snobbery or false stereotyping. It's to do with my need to maximise my income.
I do live on a council estate and was brought up in one.
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I do council estates and have some lovely customers but they are in a minority on the estates these days.
Council estates are not what they used to be and the people who live on them are the first and the loudest to complain. They used to have the odd rough family but the rest were ordinary respectable folk who worked for a living and paid their way.
Today they are dumping grounds for all sorts of problem families that Social Services don't know what to do with and people that live totally outside the usual way of life that most people would find acceptable.
The best estates are ex-council where most of the houses are in private hands
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
was you born with a silver narrow minded spoon or did you post this for reaction? well here is mine:
I grew up on a council estate then in a very nice area.
I also bought my first house which was an ex council house as is the one I have just bought.
many people on council estate have alot of money, most are nice people but you do get the odd tw*t.
1, look at the areas where mums and dads in so called high powered job neglect there children you will find chavs there also, some people in council estate cannot afford expensive clothes why knock them for that (hate the name chav)
2, no dog poo in my road at all, nor in my last place, most look after their houses, as I said before you get the odd T=== that doesnt, thern again you get that in any area, even where you live.
3, in the main they are all workers, again you get the odd few that dont, they dont offend me as they are normal people some have no outlook I agree that is true.
4, I pay a good price for a good job and do ok for my family
I also smoke and play the lottery everyweek :P
5, I tend to find that the more money people have(or was given to them) the tighter they are and haggle on price. have quite a few people on a few council estates that pay higher price because they increased it and look after there house.
6, van window can get smashed anywhere (even where you live)
7, some are some not, then again same as some villages and town (that are not council estates)
8, I am offended by that, I dress nice have ambition happy and no way am I stupid and many are the same where ever they live, and to label people like that just because they live on a council estate, you may want to have a word with yourself.
9, I am gussing you are talking about children and young people, do you have any yourself, if you do look at what they wear it will be either the same or near on. council estates do tend to have alot of kids on as they are family homes (normally means with kids)
10,
Whatever.
Nuff said
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
;D Well said!! I'm fed up with all this political correctness, this post tells it like it is, well done!! Although I would like to add that there are some very decent people who live on council estates, unfortunately the scummy element is now becoming the majority!!
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tell you what, i do a really really nice estate in town, the one is where that idiot with 2 conservatories is like "sorry how much is it again" their next door neighbour hasnt sent me payment for the last 2 cleans, the one next to them are never in and are always late for sending out payment, and the other house she comes out and says "not today cheers"
all with BMW's and expensive 4 x 4's in their drives, double garages, 2 conservatories!
they are far from short of money, but they are my worst ones for paying. my old council estate paid there and then, or at least on the night. i never begrudged doing my council estate as im no snob, money IS money, the onloy reason i sold it was as i said awkward to get round the back with pipe.
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My local estate is full of East Europeans...not for me thanks!
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Does anyone on this site actually LIVE on a council estate (really renting, not owning thier house/flat/hovel?)
If so do you clean the houses there?
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your idiots .
didnt you read my post .
what with the price of houses ex council houses are becoming sort after .
big houses and big gardens for your money .
our council house is valued at around 350/400 k ;)
but i guess we must all be scum .
my m8 bought one in the docklands for 420 last year .
there are bad payers everywhere.
i think your just doing this post to winned people up
;D ;D council estates are becoming non excistant as they dont build anymore .its down to housing assocxiations these days.
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LOL why would I care less if you get wound up or "have a reaction" to my post. I don't.
This is a forum where the whole point is opinions, i don't care if you disagree.
Those I my reasons for avoiding council estates. I dont care if your offended by them. Its based on my own experiences.
I tend to find that the more money people have(or was given to them) the tighter they are and haggle on price. have quite a few people on a few council estates that pay higher price because they increased it and look after there house.
LOL totally wrong, for me anyway. Its the scruffy beggars who wont pay a high price, because they dont appreciate good quality. If your own customers are putting your prices up for you, then you are doing something seriously wrong mate.
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LOL why would I care less if you get wound up or "have a reaction" to my post. I don't.
This is a forum where the whole point is opinions, i don't care if you disagree.
Those I my reasons for avoiding council estates. I dont care if your offended by them. Its based on my own experiences.
I tend to find that the more money people have(or was given to them) the tighter they are and haggle on price. have quite a few people on a few council estates that pay higher price because they increased it and look after there house.
LOL totally wrong, for me anyway. Its the scruffy beggars who wont pay a high price, because they dont appreciate good quality. If your own customers are putting your prices up for you, then you are doing something seriously wrong mate.
been doing the same for years cant be doing that much wrong.
fair play to you for being honest, still think your wrong, but thats what forums are about other people opinion be it they are right or wrong
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Good comment windowashers. Have seen your web site pop up on several searches , looks really good , do you have plans to include any cleaners up north in the near future ?
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Good comment windowashers. Have seen your web site pop up on several searches , looks really good , do you have plans to include any cleaners up north in the near future ?
yep look on the website page ;) have one in leeds going on asap also swindon and preston
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tennetclean you are talking s@@t . the council estates i work on and have lived on are not how you are making out . the area i live now is most council tenants who besides 1 are all hard working . they all look after the propertys . i clean most of the windows and they all pay on time . theres no dog poo on the pavements . so i dont no where you are getting your ideas from but you got it all wrong . or maybe you are just a stuck up snob yourself who never lived on a council estate .
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mate, if you find that working on council estates is great then I'm really happy for you. I personally have not found that to be the case for the reasons I have given.
In fact, I think more window cleaners should work on council estates. Keep them away from me and my well paying areas.
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On council estates you get people who want their windows cleaned genuinley and who will pay you just like on the private estates you soon work out the wheat from the chaff
the only difference i can see is on the private estates you can charge more because the houses are bigger.
At the end of the day its down to the individual that you are cleaning for, in both sorts of areas you can get some real down to earth people and some right pompus pr**s
I goes without saying we all want the big private houses where the money is but some just dont get that luxury and can make a good living on council estates.
I myself wont put people down just because they are living on a council estate this forum is getting as if you dont earn £400 per day and live in a big posh house you are beneath people, i do take my hat off to people that have worked hard for years in this industry and have done well
In my years of window cleaning i have never seen as many window cleaners as there are now and a shortage of window cleaning business to buy so we had better hope they build some more council estates ;D
Brett
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TennetClean, I assume you hold the same kind of idiotic views about ethnic minorities, people with shaven heads, women who wear trousers, men who love men etc etc etc etc.
Your rash generalisation is as insulting as it is ignorant. Generalisations like this are no different to the generalisations given about the subjects listed above. You are biggotted in your views and narrow in your mind for basing your perception of entire sections of the community upon your own very limited experiences of one particular area of the country.
Thats like saying one doesn't like pakistanis cos they smell. I am sure one or two do smell, but not all people of pakistani descent or culture smell any different to you or I. Similar generalisations about Jews, gypsies, homosexuals, intelectuals etc are what enabled the nazi party to come to power in Germany in the 1930's. I do hope that anyone reading this site does not lump all window cleaners in with you in your expression of your views. I would hate to be associated with such a person as you.
Generalisations about any subject, particularly when made by someone as obviously as uneducated as yourself are worth nothing.
Pity those you who value the freedom of speech to enable you to spout such utter drivel do not value the freedom of thinking that should precede it...
I bet you don't have 'no coucil house customers please' on your van. Idiot.
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well said sanity . cant believe some people complete K. Head
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Unreal. i cannot believe some of the negatives on this post, there are a lot of builders, plumbers, sparkies, plasterers etc etc that by lack of a snobbish attitude still live in these area's and probably have a lot more disposable income than most on posh estates. With sky high mortgages, sure there is scum on all estates, posh and council its just some are wealthier scum.
also i am sure i don't need to remind most but a lot of people still regard windowcleaners as lowlife unfortunately, some people need to crawl back out of their own a**
simbo
grew up on one and proud of it, more importantly my parents still live in the same house.
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well said sanity and simbo ;D ;D ;D
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guess where you live then ;)
Mate, as I said I couldn't care less if you disagree with me or my views.
But this aint nothing like racism, and you are a fool to suggest it is. You can be politically correct all you like, and good luck to you for it. But when it comes to the sharp end of earning a living, it is what is REAL and not what you happen to believe is right that matters.
In my REAL experience, council estates are not worth it from a window cleaning purely business point of view.
You might think that isnt right, so what?
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Racism = generalisation.
Sexism = generalisation.
Homophobism = generalisation.
Taken to their logical conclusion, your views are as bad as any 'ism' you care to mention.
I am probably the least politically correct person you will meet, but therin I have the one thing you seem to lack. That is the ability to see people as individuals and not be judgemental because of where they happen to live.
From a purely business point of view, I would say that council estates are great for people who are just learning their trade. Lots of houses, close together, many small gardens so a good way to learn how to move ladders / wfp trolleys / hoses, many people who have lived their all their lives and who know each other and who make reccomendations to their friends.
Yes, sometimes their will be a difficult customer, yes sometimes it can be hard getting some customers to pay but I believe this to be the case on any WC round. It teaches negotiation skills, an eye for 'messers' etc.
None of the views expressed by you have been concerning a business aspect of window cleaning. You have simply made a series of statements in the hope that your trolling will get a cheer. Well my friend, I am glad to see many of the people who have replied see your views for what they really are. Biggoted drivel.
I have no problems with you expressing your views, indeed, I would gladly die to preserve your right to do so as have many of the people who 'council estates' were originally built for (returning soldiers in the 1940's...)
I do, however, wish you would learn some tact, morality and acceptance. No, we do not all live in 3 story townhouses in Mayfair, but we do not all live in dog-toffe strewn junkyards with 40 snotty nosed theiving kids.
Yes, there are some houses and families that I would gladly avoid. Other houses I would want to live in as thy are kept so beautifully.
You make assumptions that children from housing estates are theives. How is this different from 'gypsies are thieves', 'Scoucers are scallys', 'Scots are tight', Indians smell', 'Blacks are muggers'? All racist comments, clearly as wrong as your comments. I wonder how your customers would react to knowing they had a racist, biggotted snobby person clleaning their windows....
ah, a window cleaner. Hardly Richard Branson are you. Just like all the other window cleaners, scruffy whiners on the make, just jobbing between the dole office and their evening job. Learnt their trade on the QE2 the way they clean. Will rob ya by not doing the back then charging full price. Scruffy bunch. Not nice is it? Being genralised. (an example of generalisation, not my actual thoughts or opinions.)
Seems on your little planet, if people are not like you, they are scum. Well fella, who is the fool? The vast majority (thank god) are not like you, so we must all be scum.
Please, find a BNP forum to troll. Your biggoted and frankly disturbing twist on reality is abhorent.
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Reading some of the replies, I am appalled that the "class system" ( or so called U.K. class system) has reared its ugly head.
How can anyone reasonablyform an opinion of a general housing area?
Like all types, irrespective of where they live, some are trustworty and some not. For various reasons, some obvious and some not, people are stranded in the social background where they live.
Some of the worst problems re collection of debts have not been in these housing backgrounds, they have been in the "respectable areas" !
Get real and treat people on how they interact with you as a human being, not where they happen to live, chosen or not.
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Friday night's allright for fightin'!
Got to say there has been the usual over-reaction. How we got from window cleaning to the rise of national socialism in such a short space of time is quite something!
Come off it, we all have our prejudices, we are ALLOWED to be prejudiced, and i think that's far from a bad thing. Its far from a bad thing socially, as I will hate the day where we all become uniform monotonous robots, and it's a bad thing for work, because you should speak as you find, and if you find Asians to be crap to work for, then why not air your prejudice? Noone has to listen, and you're not bothering anyone as we've heard it all before anyway.
When did anyone start slagging off homos? Not me, not anyone as far as I can tell. When did we pick on jews? Never. When did blacks get the 'treatment'? Never. It's all pie in the sky.
Council estates? I don't work them, and if I can stay out of them you bet I bloody well do, only venturing there for one offs. Doesn't make me a Nazi, black-lynching, jew-hating woman-hater.
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sanity
cleanitup sr. member.
you should be a god! well put
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Sanity old friend, you are trying to make an issue where one doesn't exist.
I haven't said anything about races, sexuality and so on. If you are naive enough to believe that people and society in general don't make a judgement about someone on the basis of where and how they live, then you're either very innocent or very ignorant.
Apply for a loan anywhere and you'll find that one of the questions they will ask is if you are a homeowner, private tennant or a council tennant etc. Will they make a judgement about your credit worthiness on the basis of that? YES. Is that discrimination YES. Why do they do it? because they are in business and they know that council tennents are the biggest financial risk. They can prove that if you ask them.
Does that make the banks racist and homophobic? Are they run by BNP members? Dont think so.
We are in business too, and in my opinion it makes sense to be discriminating about the customers you choose if you want to earn good money.
I have merely explained things as I personally have found them with council estates. You saying that all generalisations are the same is simply a load of pants.
What about this one: I have generally found that drug dealers are scummy people. Does that make me racist too? What about this: I have generally found that women talk more than men do. Am I sexist for thinking that?
You need to wind your neck in.
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ah, a window cleaner. Hardly Richard Branson are you. Just like all the other window cleaners, scruffy whiners on the make, just jobbing between the dole office and their evening job. Learnt their trade on the QE2 the way they clean. Will rob ya by not doing the back then charging full price. Scruffy bunch.
Not trying to belittle your sentiments, Ssnity, but where did you think this came from? Have you thought about how these sterotypes arose from even?
Noone's going to disagree with your sentiments, you have just grabbed the moral highground, that's all, and are firing off your mortar and gaining widespread approval, but you are definitly over-reacting. I suggest you register on a truly racist/nationalist site and tell them what you think, as really you are just preaching to the converted here. Seems to me like you need a figure to hate, for ANY reason, and youthink you've found it here. Well I don't think you have. A more mild-mannerd forum than CIU I think you'll be hard pressed to find.
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i am going to cut to the chase pal, and u r a total tossa, end of!!!!! i was brought up on a council astate and u insult the entire working class population with your pathetic remarks. people like you knock this country down with your stupid philosophy on life. there might be plenty bad people on benefits on council estates in this country, but for every bad one there is 50 good ones.
richy
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richy
:-* :-*
nice1
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I would just like to say that when I started this thread I had no intention of wanting people to fall out and argue ! My intention was just to state that im my experience I have had no problems with customers in council housing ! All I am trying to say is that you should not bypass these customers because imo you are missing out on valuable custom .
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i was brought up on a council astate and u insult the entire working class population with your pathetic remarks. people like you knock this country down with your stupid philosophy on life. there might be plenty bad people on benefits on council estates in this country, but for every bad one there is 50 good ones.
Great. You clean your comrades windows then mate. Because I wont.
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tell me about your childhood tennet........was it a happy one ?
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i dont forget where i came from thats all i am saying u plonka
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tell me about your childhood tennet........was it a happy one ?
lol,
sry that comment then looking at your pic on the side made me laugh
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is that the guy from thunderbirds, virgil or brains?
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Dunno think its brains .........or was it that fella from Er ?
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tell me about your childhood tennet........was it a happy one ?
lol,
sry that comment then looking at your pic on the side made me laugh
ww when you said that ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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not sure did not have a tv in our council house, some posh person nicked our tv when leaving dog poo on our road to keep people thinking bad about council estates, think they were miffed because we had more money than them, but smaller house :P
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Thats nothing ........we were so poor there was ten of us all sleeping in same bed ! 1st one out in morning was best dressed ;D
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Thats nothing ........we were so poor there was ten of us all sleeping in same bed ! 1st one out in morning was best dressed ;D
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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You laugh ......I had to go to school dressed as a belgium general ! took me years to realise why the kids were saluting me in assembly !
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Not a Rear Admiral?
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sorry rosy we couldnt afford the admiral section in army surplus !
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Well, the emphasis was on the 'rear' in rear admiral. LOL!
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Is that the guy at the back of the ship ?
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i dont forget where i came from thats all i am saying u plonka
Er.. ok then.
I don't know what that has got to do with me, as I wasn't brought up on a council estate, but if it makes you happy then its good I suppose?
All you people who are jumping on the "hard-done by council estate dwellers" bandwagon to have a go, if you think I am the only person in business who wont work council estates, then you are sadly misguided. I'm sorry if you find that offensive, terrible, emotionally unsettling or whatever else insecurity issues its bringing up for you then that's too bad, but guess what that is the world we live in.
If you think that's not fair, then guess what else, LIFE isnt fair. Thats capitalism. I dont think its fair that I pay taxes for people to sit at home and watch telly all day because they cant get off their lazy backsides. But that's life.
I don't care that you don't think its the right attitude or thing for me to say, but I can guarantee that there are plenty of other pro window cleaners who are reading this forum who are thinking exactly the same as me but aren't saying anything because of the flak it will cause.
I do care about getting a good price for my work and not having to deal with aggro from chavs and dog poo etc. For that reason I have made a conscious decision not to bother with council estates. If you live on a council estate and are not a chav, then I'm really pleased for you. Well done. Give yourself a pat on the back. But it doesnt make any difference to me one way or the other.
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Is that the guy at the back of the ship ?
That's the chap, but sometimes found in the heads helping ratings 'understand' the meaning of 'seamenship'.
My spelling's not so good tonight.
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sorry but you said your spelling what not good tonight ..............how do you know ?
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as i said before i came from a council estate and my mam and dad were ever on the dole as they always paid there way. u my friend are a total ars- ho-e and should be ignored in every thread you create. i would like to know your living status now, wot car u drive etc.....very interesting!!!!
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probs in a friends caravan with a push bike to get around with ur ladders u prat
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richyp who are you directing your comments to ?
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Me,
Because now I'm deserving of some good ol' fashioned aggro! "Cos thats wot we doo round our way wen sum1 seys sumfink we dont like"
Aint that right richyboy?
your not helping your case much mate
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jonah i would say richyps comments are directed at tennetclean .
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My books tell me that over the years most of my problem customers when it comes to paying live on council estates.
Vince Green is right, council estates have changed over the years, most of the hardworking decent tenants bought their houses and take pride in them. The problem I have is with tenants that are benefit recipients. They really can't afford to pay, but that doesn't stop them from taking on a window cleaner. The problem we have, is that we don't know if they are on benefit or not when we take them on.
My past experiences have taught me to leave this section of the community alone, I have learned from past mistakes.
If I go for a swim and see there are lots of jelly fish around, I don't carry on and get stung. I would find a part of the beach that had fewer of them, and the chance of getting stung was a lot less. DAI
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council est are loyal you get all walks of life there, they are the same as the rich stay away from the rich at christmas they are bad tipers. this goes to the top of this post.
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spot on daveshaw.... he is total knacker!!!!!!
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couldnt agree more richy ;D
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My books tell me that over the years most of my problem customers when it comes to paying live on council estates.
Vince Green is right, council estates have changed over the years, most of the hardworking decent tenants bought their houses and take pride in them. The problem I have is with tenants that are benefit recipients. They really can't afford to pay, but that doesn't stop them from taking on a window cleaner. The problem we have, is that we don't know if they are on benefit or not when we take them on.
My past experiences have taught me to leave this section of the community alone, I have learned from past mistakes.
If I go for a swim and see there are lots of jelly fish around, I don't carry on and get stung. I would find a part of the beach that had fewer of them, and the chance of getting stung was a lot less. DAI
your right m8
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i may have been brought up on a council estate but i now have top of the range bmw live in a nice house but i dont brag. u r a tosser pal,,, where do u live and what car do u drive? i reckon u r a poshie wanna be! grow up..............
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How you conduct your business is none of our concern and I for one wish you all the best with it.
I would like to point out to Rosy et al that my sentiments are those of somebody who does not like to see discrimination of any sort.
Come off it, we all have our prejudices, we are ALLOWED to be prejudiced, and i think that's far from a bad thing. Its far from a bad thing socially, as I will hate the day where we all become uniform monotonous robots, and it's a bad thing for work, because you should speak as you find, and if you find Asians to be crap to work for, then why not air your prejudice? Noone has to listen, and you're not bothering anyone as we've heard it all before anyway.
So because we have one bad experience then it is ok to categorise an entire section of the community like that? Even worse, to spread this predjudice in public (or private, depending on what you class this forum as...) shows a total lack of moral standards, tact and manners to say the least. As can be seen by the reactions in this thread of many people who grew up on council estates, the generalisation made about people from council estates was clearly ill-informed, no matter how 'valid' the staters experience was. Does a couple of bad experiences make a LARGE section of the British public not 'posh' enough to work for? As I said, freedom of thought rarely comes first for those who cry about freedom of speech...
When did anyone start slagging off homos? Not me, not anyone as far as I can tell. When did we pick on jews? Never. When did blacks get the 'treatment'? Never. It's all pie in the sky.
But its ok to 'slag off' (as you so elequently put it), people who happen to reside in houses built be local authorities? Same thing. Discrimination and predjudice.
Council estates? I don't work them, and if I can stay out of them you bet I bloody well do, only venturing there for one offs. Doesn't make me a Nazi, black-lynching, jew-hating woman-hater.
Venturing in there? Seems you feel the same way as TennetClean in your assumptions about people who live on council estates... Maybe it does'nt make you a black hating woman beater or whatever, but it sure makes you ignorant and pathetic. I suggest you get out more. See where airing your predjudices gets you...
My dear TennetClean. You are clearly out of your depth where this discussion is concerned when you make such statements as you did above. I will try to address your query in as simple a way as possible, using small words where I can...
I haven't said anything about races, sexuality and so on.
You don't need to. You made statements that could be taken as predjudice, derogatory and wrong.
(link attached so you can look up the meaning of the word...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination) Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of different groups of people based on certain characteristics.
Apply for a loan anywhere and you'll find that one of the questions they will ask is if you are a homeowner, private tennant or a council tennant etc. Will they make a judgement about your credit worthiness on the basis of that? YES
Actually, this is a RISK assessment, not a 'worthiness test'.
Is that discrimination YES.
Actually it is differentiation, see attached link to meaning of discrimination.
Why do they do it?
Risk,as I have just explained. But, hang on. I live in a private 3 bed semi, with decking, double glazing and a 200k mortgage. Yet I find it difficult to get a bank account and credit card. Is that because I am a council tennant? NO. It is because I am a credit RISK!. So, it is not just council tennants that are financial risks...
Council tennants are a financial risk to you are they? Well, ask them to pay up front. I am sure they won't mind.
We are in business too, and in my opinion it makes sense to be )discriminating (actually, this word should be discerning, but I shan't critisise your education level)... about the customers you choose if you want to earn good money.
I agree, one should be discerning in ones choice of customers, although doing it to maximise profit is questionable. I personally select my customers based upon my ability to do the job. If I can do it, I get a customer. If I can't I don't. simple. As long as I make my wages, I don't mind who I work for...
I have merely explained things as I personally have found them with council estates. You saying that all generalisations are the same is simply a load of pants.
You have not 'merely explained' at all. you made a series of derogatory, discriminatory and predjudicial comments about a large section of the British public. Generalisations are all 'generally speaking :D ) wrong.
What about this one: I have generally found that drug dealers are scummy people. Does that make me racist too? What about this: I have generally found that women talk more than men do. Am I sexist for thinking that?
The first is a moral judgement, that fits with the majority view and therefore is one that is not predjudicial but is discriminatory. If you had said 'white drug dealers' are scummy, then that would have been racist as you have brought race (which is actually a non-existant construct) to discriminate and cause you to express a predjudicial view.
The second point. No. Your statement is entirely correct. Women are more social than men and therefore are liable to talk more as part of their social networking. Men tend to be insular and as such suffer more depressive mental illnesses than women and are more likely to commit suicide.
But if you had said that ALL women talk more than men, that would have been a generalisation, but not untrue.
I know what I am talking about my friend, so maybe this 'winding the neck in' is something you ought to take your own advice upon...
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I personally dont care what people have as long as I earn the money I want and get paid thats good enough, I have the billionaires on my books also people on benifits and most in the middle of this, as long as they pay for the job I do its good enough for me. I can get on with all walks of life council estates to the billionaires mansions, we are all the same we all have blood in our veins,
Tennant you are getting stick because of your post because it paints you in a bad light (and I guess you dont care) not all are the same that was my point in the first place and if you think about it I am right. never tar everyone from one area of life with the same brush because we are all different, I am guessing you have had some bad experience somewhere along the line that has clouded your judgement somewhat.
A Long long time ago council estates were not a nice place to live, I know I lived on one, things change and most people do "not all granted" but they are the minority, hence why I got offended by the post in the first place we are not all the same.
Ian
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well said ian!!!!
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I only came in for a chicken !
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and you ended up with a cock ;D ;D
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sorry but that is my excuse when at tesco after scanning 58 items !
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Sanity, you're trying way too hard mate. That post must have taken a good hour to prepare. You remind me of someone I used to know who was a bit poor in the brains department but tried to sound clever by talking in an over-formal and patronising way.
The simple fact is, there are a greater proportion of bad payers in council estates than elsewhere. (So I have found, and it seems others have too - eg jellyfish example)
Granted, not everyone is like that who live there, but does it make business sense to work in an area that you know that to be the case just because if you don't its discriminating? I dont have the time or inclination to test out which householders in those areas are good and which are bad, and I already know from experience that they wont pay higher prices. I dont need to bother with them because there are less riskier, better paying areas to work in.
I agree, one should be discerning in ones choice of customers, although doing it to maximise profit is questionable
I dont agree with that at all. If you want to do your part for the community and work council estates so as not to be seen to be discriminating, then good for you and I wish you luck, but for me I don't care if its discriminating or not, I just want to earn good money and be paid withthe minimum of hassle. Right now there are more windows than window cleaners, so we have the luxury of making the choice. Why would anyone want to deliberately make life more difficult than it needs to be?
What you seem to be talking about is more like charity or publicly funded work. Business (in my opinion) exists to make profit.
This has nothing to do with race, sexuality or any of that guff you seem determined to try to bring into this argument, its about business plain and simple. I do it, I know others who do it, most businesses must do it to some degree or other.
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tenet is from cov. I've got some mates up there and have been visiting a couple of times in the past. 1 time i had to be chaperoned ;D around 1 estate. Can't remember the name now though. Not my choice, my mates. From an outsiders perspective cov estates were an eye opener.
I can see where and why he is fussy over where he will work. It doesn't make him the anti christ though, or racist or sexist or homophobic... yawn yawn yawn. Can see why he's getting flak from ex estate bods though. Roll on closing time!! ;D
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mark you really are the epitomy of diplomacy and you make a valid point .........COVENTRY IS A SH$$ HOLE FULL OF TOSSERS ,WITH NO HOPE OF SALVATION ;D ;D ;D ;D ;)
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JOKE ;D ;D ;D ;D ;) sorry could not stop myself
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i was going to say something similar but profile says coventry so it may be different there...I can only speak about council estates in my area and generally we have a lot less crime round here however its still tarring every one who lives on a council estate with the same brush which seems a bit harsh
see ;D
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How you conduct your business is none of our concern and I for one wish you all the best with it.
I would like to point out to Rosy et al that my sentiments are those of somebody who does not like to see discrimination of any sort. "Does not like to see"? That'sa bit like, "I hate to see blacks burning at the stake, but glad I'm not black" sort of post. RIDICULOUS!
Come off it, we all have our prejudices, we are ALLOWED to be prejudiced, and i think that's far from a bad thing. Its far from a bad thing socially, as I will hate the day where we all become uniform monotonous robots, and it's a bad thing for work, because you should speak as you find, and if you find Asians to be crap to work for, then why not air your prejudice? Noone has to listen, and you're not bothering anyone as we've heard it all before anyway.
So because we have one bad experience then it is ok to categorise an entire section of the community like that? Even worse, to spread this predjudice in public (or private, depending on what you class this forum as...) shows a total lack of moral standards, tact and manners to say the least. As can be seen by the reactions in this thread of many people who grew up on council estates, the generalisation made about people from council estates was clearly ill-informed, no matter how 'valid' the staters experience was. Does a couple of bad experiences make a LARGE section of the British public not 'posh' enough to work for? As I said, freedom of thought rarely comes first for those who cry about freedom of speech...
When did anyone start slagging off homos? Not me, not anyone as far as I can tell. When did we pick on jews? Never. When did blacks get the 'treatment'? Never. It's all pie in the sky.
But its ok to 'slag off' (as you so elequently put it), people who happen to reside in houses built be local authorities? Same thing. Discrimination and predjudice. eh? I went to a sec modern school too mate.
link=topic=49606.msg411954#msgEloquent,411954 date=1201890450]
Council estates? I don't work them, and if I can stay out of them you bet I bloody well do, only venturing there for one offs. Doesn't make me a Nazi, black-lynching, jew-hating woman-hater.
Venturing in there? Seems [DONT you worry about the way I 'feel' mate. You have no idea how I feel about the underclass. I spent six years selling the Big Issue so I reckon I know about being 'low'. DON't INSULT ME. you feel the same way as TennetClean in your assumptions about people who live on council estates... Maybe it does'nt make you a black hating woman beater or whatever, but it sure makes you ignorant and pathetic. I suggest you get out more. See where airing your predjudices gets you... That is disgusting. Have you ever slept on a cardboard box, Sanity? Have you any idea what its like to eat cold pizza out of a wet box off the pavement? I did that for two years mate. Dont talk to me about equality.
My dear TennetClean. You are clearly out of your depth where this discussion is concerned when you make such statements as you did above. I will try to address your query in as simple a way as possible, using small words where I can...
I haven't said anything about races, sexuality and so on.
You don't need to. You made statements that could be taken as predjudice, derogatory and wrong.
(link attached so you can look up the meaning of the word...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination) Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of different groups of people based on certain characteristics.
Apply for a loan anywhere and you'll find that one of the questions they will ask is if you are a homeowner, private tennant or a council tennant etc. Will they make a judgement about your credit worthiness on the basis of that? YES
Actually, this is a RISK assessment, not a 'worthiness test'.
Is that discrimination YES.
Actually it is differentiation, see attached link to meaning of discrimination.
Why do they do it?
Risk,as I have just explained. But, hang on. I live in a private 3 bed semi, with decking, double glazing and a 200k mortgage. Yet I find it difficult to get a bank account and credit card. Is that because I am a council tennant? NO. It is because I am a credit RISK!. So, it is not just council tennants that are financial risks...
Council tennants are a financial risk to you are they? Well, ask them to pay up front. I am sure they won't mind.
We are in business too, and in my opinion it makes sense to be )discriminating (actually, this word should be discerning, but I shan't critisise your education level)... about the customers you choose if you want to earn good money.
I agree, one should be discerning in ones choice of customers, although doing it to maximise profit is questionable. I personally select my customers based upon my ability to do the job. If I can do it, I get a customer. If I can't I don't. simple. As long as I make my wages, I don't mind who I work for...
I have merely explained things as I personally have found them with council estates. You saying that all generalisations are the same is simply a load of pants.
You have not 'merely explained' at all. you made a series of derogatory, discriminatory and predjudicial comments about a large section of the British public. Generalisations are all 'generally speaking :D ) wrong.
What about this one: I have generally found that drug dealers are scummy people. Does that make me racist too? What about this: I have generally found that women talk more than men do. Am I sexist for thinking that?
The first is a moral judgement, that fits with the majority view and therefore is one that is not predjudicial but is discriminatory. If you had said 'white drug dealers' are scummy, then that would have been racist as you have brought race (which is actually a non-existant construct) to discriminate and cause you to express a predjudicial view.
The second point. No. Your statement is entirely correct. Women are more social than men and therefore are liable to talk more as part of their social networking. Men tend to be insular and as such suffer more depressive mental illnesses than women and are more likely to commit suicide.
But if you had said that ALL women talk more than men, that would have been a generalisation, but not untrue.
I know what I am talking about my friend, so maybe this 'winding the neck in' is something you ought to take your own advice upon...
-
How you conduct your business is none of our concern and I for one wish you all the best with it.
I would like to point out to Rosy et al that my sentiments are those of somebody who does not like to see discrimination of any sort. "Does not like to see"? That'sa bit like, "I hate to see blacks burning at the stake, but glad I'm not black" sort of post. RIDICULOUS!
Come off it, we all have our prejudices, we are ALLOWED to be prejudiced, and i think that's far from a bad thing. Its far from a bad thing socially, as I will hate the day where we all become uniform monotonous robots, and it's a bad thing for work, because you should speak as you find, and if you find Asians to be crap to work for, then why not air your prejudice? Noone has to listen, and you're not bothering anyone as we've heard it all before anyway.
So because we have one bad experience then it is ok to categorise an entire section of the community like that? Even worse, to spread this predjudice in public (or private, depending on what you class this forum as...) shows a total lack of moral standards, tact and manners to say the least. As can be seen by the reactions in this thread of many people who grew up on council estates, the generalisation made about people from council estates was clearly ill-informed, no matter how 'valid' the staters experience was. Does a couple of bad experiences make a LARGE section of the British public not 'posh' enough to work for? As I said, freedom of thought rarely comes first for those who cry about freedom of speech...
When did anyone start slagging off homos? Not me, not anyone as far as I can tell. When did we pick on jews? Never. When did blacks get the 'treatment'? Never. It's all pie in the sky.
But its ok to 'slag off' (as you so elequently put it), people who happen to reside in houses built be local authorities? Same thing. Discrimination and predjudice. eh? I went to a sec modern school too mate.
link=topic=49606.msg411954#msgEloquent,411954 date=1201890450]
Council estates? I don't work them, and if I can stay out of them you bet I bloody well do, only venturing there for one offs. Doesn't make me a Nazi, black-lynching, jew-hating woman-hater.
Venturing in there? Seems [DONT you worry about the way I 'feel' mate. You have no idea how I feel about the underclass. I spent six years selling the Big Issue so I reckon I know about being 'low'. DON't INSULT ME. you feel the same way as TennetClean in your assumptions about people who live on council estates... Maybe it does'nt make you a black hating woman beater or whatever, but it sure makes you ignorant and pathetic. I suggest you get out more. See where airing your predjudices gets you... That is disgusting. Have you ever slept on a cardboard box, Sanity? Have you any idea what its like to eat cold pizza out of a wet box off the pavement? I did that for two years mate. Dont talk to me about equality.
My dear TennetClean. You are clearly out of your depth where this discussion is concerned when you make such statements as you did above. I will try to address your query in as simple a way as possible, using small words where I can...
I haven't said anything about races, sexuality and so on.
You don't need to. You made statements that could be taken as predjudice, derogatory and wrong.
(link attached so you can look up the meaning of the word...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination) Discrimination is the prejudicial treatment of different groups of people based on certain characteristics.
Apply for a loan anywhere and you'll find that one of the questions they will ask is if you are a homeowner, private tennant or a council tennant etc. Will they make a judgement about your credit worthiness on the basis of that? YES
Actually, this is a RISK assessment, not a 'worthiness test'.
Is that discrimination YES.
Actually it is differentiation, see attached link to meaning of discrimination.
Why do they do it?
Risk,as I have just explained. But, hang on. I live in a private 3 bed semi, with decking, double glazing and a 200k mortgage. Yet I find it difficult to get a bank account and credit card. Is that because I am a council tennant? NO. It is because I am a credit RISK!. So, it is not just council tennants that are financial risks...
Council tennants are a financial risk to you are they? Well, ask them to pay up front. I am sure they won't mind.
We are in business too, and in my opinion it makes sense to be )discriminating (actually, this word should be discerning, but I shan't critisise your education level)... about the customers you choose if you want to earn good money.
I agree, one should be discerning in ones choice of customers, although doing it to maximise profit is questionable. I personally select my customers based upon my ability to do the job. If I can do it, I get a customer. If I can't I don't. simple. As long as I make my wages, I don't mind who I work for...
I have merely explained things as I personally have found them with council estates. You saying that all generalisations are the same is simply a load of pants.
You have not 'merely explained' at all. you made a series of derogatory, discriminatory and predjudicial comments about a large section of the British public. Generalisations are all 'generally speaking :D ) wrong.
What about this one: I have generally found that drug dealers are scummy people. Does that make me racist too? What about this: I have generally found that women talk more than men do. Am I sexist for thinking that?
The first is a moral judgement, that fits with the majority view and therefore is one that is not predjudicial but is discriminatory. If you had said 'white drug dealers' are scummy, then that would have been racist as you have brought race (which is actually a non-existant construct) to discriminate and cause you to express a predjudicial view.
The second point. No. Your statement is entirely correct. Women are more social than men and therefore are liable to talk more as part of their social networking. Men tend to be insular and as such suffer more depressive mental illnesses than women and are more likely to commit suicide.
WHAT?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!????
But if you had said that ALL women talk more than men, that would have been a generalisation, but not untrue. Utterly sexist, of course.
I know what I am talking about my friend, so maybe this 'winding the neck in' is something you ought to take your own advice upon...
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rosy you need to get out more ! must of taken ages to get those boxes with them quotes in em ! In my spare time I collect stamps .....takes me ages to steam em off and re send em !
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Only took three days.
:) Oh, did I say, Pinch punch (in the mouth) first of the month?
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7 pages of mostly shi*e i think the majority of you need to get a life and this pile of dross should be well and truly locked.
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Thanks for that in depth analysis ronaldo ! We could use men like u on here
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7 pages of mostly shi*e i think the majority of you need to get a life and this pile of dross should be well and truly locked.
he has apoint this is getting effing stupid (why is rosy a guest now???)oh and ronaldo who was the carrot character in your lads home work??? i gots to know ;D
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Show me which of your comments were business orientated? The one about dog-poo? Thieving kids? Chavs? you talk more sh*te than you ever dragged your hose through.
1st class degree in Mental Health Nursing. (with my dissertation being about, amongst other things, the reasons for the higher suicide rate amongst men than women, yet higher numbers of attempts by women than men.)
Does this identify me as someone short in the brains department?
You have changed your stance from one of discriminating about the council estates due to dog-toffee and thieving kids to one of discerning business accumen. A man of principle too I see.
Enjoy your simple minded discussion.
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What the hell are you lot arguing about? ;D
Looks like I missed all the fun.
For my bit...
I don't work in the crappy areas, it too much bother and too little money.
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salt off the earth people council estates most tip at christmas and the old dears will chase you three blocks to pay you dont get that in spam want to be valley morgage to the hilt ticked up bmw in drive i find the in between estates the worst both for trying to bump you and think that they own you as a personal cleaner ,but cant aford you any way ...........then you get the realy rich who are great as well dont forget where they come from and let you name the price and also offer you a cuppa funny the difrent lay out off things just my opinion our does anyone else feel the same
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Time please gentlemen ! please dont cross swords we all have our opinions and we can agre to dissagree .
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salt off the earth people council estates most tip at christmas and the old dears will chase you three blocks to pay you dont get that in spam want to be valley morgage to the hilt ticked up bmw in drive i find the in between estates the worst both for trying to bump you and think that they own you as a personal cleaner ,but cant aford you any way ...........then you get the realy rich who are great as well dont forget where they come from and let you name the price and also offer you a cuppa funny the difrent lay out off things just my opinion our does anyone else feel the same
yes yes and yes again ;D ;D ;D when this recession really starts to bite its all these credit monkeys who will drop you like hot dog turd
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salt off the earth people council estates most tip at christmas and the old dears will chase you three blocks to pay you dont get that in spam want to be valley morgage to the hilt ticked up bmw in drive i find the in between estates the worst both for trying to bump you and think that they own you as a personal cleaner ,but cant aford you any way ...........then you get the realy rich who are great as well dont forget where they come from and let you name the price and also offer you a cuppa funny the difrent lay out off things just my opinion our does anyone else feel the same
yes yes and yes again ;D ;D ;D when this recession really starts to bite its all these credit monkeys who will drop you like hot dog turd
I'm not worried about that either.
I don't do much of the credit-monkey new estates either.
85% of my work is cottages in villages, and they're not a worry.
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sanity mate, I ain't impressed with your degree, and the fact that you felt the need to raise that says more about your own insecurities than anything else IMO. And i don't care about what you think about me personally. This is just not a personal issue.
There are lots of reasons i don't work council areas, those are a few.
This was a relatively simple discussion, you decided to start banging on about racism and sexism and nazis etc. You are a man looking for an argument where one didn't exist, probably because you were offended by the fact that I refuse to work council estates. You don't need to be arguing on here with me, because I just don't care. Instead you need to get out more. (Perhaps join a debating society?)
You sound like you're in the window cleaning business to serve the people. Personally I find that pretty hilarious, but each to his own.
And for what its worth Squeeky clean has summed up the issue perfectly
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Why avoid them? plenty of reasons.
1. you may not want a tribe of kids following you round your round singing george formby and trying to steal things out of your van
2. Council estates are dog poo city
3. the people (in the main) are scruffy work-shy dole-claiming layabouts and it offends me to have to be near them
4. they wont pay high prices becuase they do not have much money (but somehow manage to chan smoke and play the lottery every week)
5. They try to get you to do either more work for no more money, or at least haggle on price
6. you may not want to come back to your van to find the window smashed and the radio missing
7. the areas are grim and depressing
8. the people are grim and depressing, and often stupid
9. council estates attract chavs like poo attracts flies (I hate chavs)
10. Most important of all: there are plenty of customers to be had in areas with none of the above negatives, so there is simply no need to bother with them
nuff said
idiot post of the year
for the record, i steer clear of council estate, but thats only because i have taken over rounds and dont need to do other area's
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tenet is from cov. I've got some mates up there and have been visiting a couple of times in the past. 1 time i had to be chaperoned ;D around 1 estate. Can't remember the name now though. Not my choice, my mates. From an outsiders perspective cov estates were an eye opener.
thats not just council estates in cov, thats the whole of cov
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Please can we call a truce ? Fare enough if we have pre concieved ideas ...brought up with em perhaps ! Isnt education the best way to get you idea across instead of insults ? If you knew my background most wouldnt speak to me on here ! But Ive made my own conclusions in life , please try to be civil and not name call guys ....and girls !
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There are council estates and there are council estates.
Some are chav-ridden and full of twockers.
Others have a community spirit and lots of owner occupiers.
They even vary street by street.
I find the latter, usually, red bricked semi's, at £10 a pop can be good earners at 3/4 per hour with wfp.
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Malc if that was the last post on here I would be a happy man .
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... If you knew my background most wouldnt speak to me on here ! But Ive made my own conclusions in life , please try to be civil and not name call guys ....and girls !
Unless you're a child molester or rapist Jonah then I'll talk to you what ever your background is! :)
And if by any chance you've run away to Spain like your namesake - then Ninevah still has a 120,000 people needing their windows cleaned! ;)
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Just to put the record straight i grew up with racist parents....very political .
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Moderators.....where the heck are you guys.
Do your job. :)
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Just to put the record straight i grew up with racist parents....very political .
No-one is responsible for their background. It's what you do with it that counts. I had the sort of life where many might negatively stereotype me too. It's moving on from it that's the important bit.
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As far as my degree goes, you questioned my intelegence, I retorted.
As I have repeatedly said, you are biggotted, of limited intelectual capacity and have little to do with your life other than to make inflamatory comments on a forum. Pal, do us a favour and crawl back under whatever rock you came from. Oh, and try READING the posts I make and responding to them, rather than having brain-farts and writing whatever comes into your head. You seem to have difficulty when I write words of over 2 sylybles in response to your rantings. Maybe get someopne to explain them to you?
Other than that, Im out of this discussion. It is no longer serving any purpous other than to get normally rational people to call each other names. (how old are we?)
Anyhow, enjoy your business, I hope you are successful and when the day comes that you look back and judge what you have done in your life, I trust you can say 'I did my best'.
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Other than that, I'm out of this discussion.
Didn't you say that before? I thought you were going to leave us to our "simple minded discussion". Seems to me like you just can't step away.
As for name calling, well, for a reason I still don't fully understand you went from council estates to racism, sexim, nazism, homophobia etc in a way that simply didn't make any sense. (Maybe it made sense to you, but you seem to be in your own world)
You like to think you are oh so tolerant and accepting of everyone, but here I am disagreeing with you and you just can't take it.
TennetClean, I assume you hold the same kind of idiotic views about ethnic minorities, people with shaven heads, women who wear trousers, men who love men etc etc etc etc.
Because I have a certain view of working in council estates that is borne out from my own business experience, you have assumed that I am also racist sexist homophobic and and a neo-nazi!! Is that balanced? Is that a rational assumption to make? Now who is making generalisations?
You, mate, have taken offense and lashed out about all the issues you hold dear, even though they have absolutely nothing to do with this discussion. And then as if I will somehow view that with a bit of credibility you start boasting about some degree you have right down to what your dissertation was about! I don't care mate! You seriously need to face your issues, because they are way beyond window cleaning.
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getting back the main post topic, tennat can you see where I was coming from? tarring everyone that comes from a council estate with the same brush is not right, can you admit that or do you honestly think you are right:-\
Personaly it makes no difference in my life what your veiws are, as I said before fair play to you for replying in the first place.
I am just really interested to know on reflection that the post you wrote first may have been a bit ott. :-\
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Window washers mate, I'm sure council estates are like most things in life, there are the nice ones and not-so-nice ones.
Sure there will be some in every area that might make ok customers, and even if they make bad customers, or just can't afford high prices that doesn't necessarily make them bad people, I never said it does.
But for window cleaning, why bother going into areas that are grim when there are plenty of better ones with people who can afford high prices and where chavs don't hang around everywhere? Its obvious! (Unless of course you dont care about high prices and dont mind chavs, great if thats you, but that aint me)
I was with a mate of mine parked his car on a council estate a few years back because he had to see somebody there about selling it. He came back to it like 8 minutes later to find window smashed and radio gone. A bloke was walking past and said "oh dont park your care here mate, they'll do that every time!" Fellas on here will say 'you cant judge all council estates based on your limited experience' - actually yes I can, because i can choose to work where I want. (that isnt my only experience of council estates)
People who live in council estates have a right to stuff just the same as everyone else, but window cleaning aint a "right" its a service. And because I provide that I can choose where to work.
This has nothing to do with tarring everyone with the same brush, its just what I have personally found to be the case. I dont care if anyone disagrees, as far as I'm concerned, my own experiences cant be wrong can they?
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Window washers mate, I'm sure council estates are like most things in life, there are the nice ones and not-so-nice ones.
I will leave it at that m8, because that part is right.
I could tell you had a bad experience somewhere along the line.
I love a good debate lol
Have a good day ;)
Ian
p.s I also get good prices for work and yes I am choosey what work I now take on, we are all in it for the same reason and that is to make money.
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The only person 'ripping me off' and 'peeing me off' is a lady in a large house; not ex-council; and she owes me £24.00, and I know I won't get it.
I clean quite a few ex 'social accommodation' houses, and have no problems; though I did clean a good many houses in a new housing association area, and found I had many bad apples, but once I wheedled these out, the rest of the customers were fine.
I actually sold these houses on last Summer.
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The only person 'ripping me off' and 'peeing me off' is a lady in a large house; not ex-council; and she owes me £24.00, and I know I won't get it.
I clean quite a few ex 'social accommodation' houses, and have no problems; though I did clean a good many houses in a new housing association area, and found I had many bad apples, but once I wheedled these out, the rest of the customers were fine.
I actually sold these houses on last Summer.
I've found that getting ripped off for payment can happen at any level. It hurts more when it's a larger place because the amount owing is more. I have had good compact bits of council estates in the past. They were full of upper middle-aged to elderly people many of whom had lived there since the 1950s. They were reliable payers and decent people. The trouble was they were TOO nice. I would walk away from there with a bladder full of tea and everyone wanted a few minutes chatting time on top of the window cleaning. Lovely people but an atrocious area to make reasonable money :) . However, as has been said on here, it was sometimes let down by the odd younger people in the area. Many of them didn't seem to have the "old school" values of their seniors. Although they wouldn't have stolen property from me, many of them certainly were hard to get money out of. Anyway, when I was long term sick some years ago, a lot of customers deserted me eventually. Fair enough as they wanted their windows cleaned. On the council estates, as soon as one went, the rest followed because they all knew each other. Lovely people but I wasn'tsorry to lose that part of my work. My fault too as it was badly underpriced.
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i find coucil estate customers are generally better payers than most on private estates.actually dropped one private estate.most with the big houses flash cars
these days tend to have no spare cash.up to thier eyeballs in debt.never judge a book by its cover.
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I make good money from a council estate, only because the houses are owned by a housing assosiation and they pay me .
I agree whith some of the things Tennant has said, when I first started window cleaning I used to clean a estate most were good prompt payers , but you did get the odd one who messed me around.
I have had more problems getting paid from my better off customers.
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i worked as a carpenter and a foreman on council properites
you get good and bad, lets face it, its just a mirror of the world we live in
ive also done work on "private houses", you get good and bad, though i have to say, you get more cuppa's of some of the council houses people
its a sad world that we live in that people have to make such wide spread genralisation :(
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My father in law says this country is finnished due to letting in anyone and everyone,i`m starting to think he could be right.
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i worked as a carpenter and a foreman on council properites
you get good and bad, lets face it, its just a mirror of the world we live in
ive also done work on "private houses", you get good and bad, though i have to say, you get more cuppa's of some of the council houses people
its a sad world that we live in that people have to make such wide spread genralisation :(
You are so right Matt, in tennant's defence even though he is way wrong at the moment IMO, in 10 years time he will be spot on if are gov keep letting it happen and at it will not be the so called chavs that are talked about it will be poeple that do not even speak english the ones that are coming here in droves for no reason apart from sucking money from us people that pay taxes "this does not include the people from far away that have a valid reason I am talking about the 50 fold for every one that has that vaild reason.
Slate me mock me if you like this is the truth of england to come, it is already way out of habd pick up a paper and read it, then triple the amount because they aint got a clue.
Ranmt over
Ian
if i offended sry just saying what i think, right or wrong
Ian, isnt that another genralisation
when i was growing up, the older generations would say " all these darkies ** will be coming over and stealing our work "
now the same aged generation are saying about the " eastern europeans "
we as a country and never happier than when we are moaning and worring, now thats a fact
please note ** the term "darkie" was used as a genralisation of people who are non-white, i personally have nothing against the said people, infact my best mate for years was a indian who was born in cardiff, his parents were born in cardiff aswell, but still non-white
that should stop the PC lot jumping up and down about this post :) :)
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you say " was an indian " what is he now ?
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you say " was an indian " what is he now ?
A cowboy lol. ;D ;D ;D ;D
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you say " was an indian " what is he now ?
:P i guess he is still a indian
he moved away to aberdeen on the oil-rigs as he got banned from driving ( drink driving ) so his company sent him to scotland for punishment, we sort of lost touch
thus infact my best mate for years was a indian, he is no longer my best mate
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just starting to think??? the problem is that whereas 30 years ago immigrants came to settle and make a new life here they now do it differently .Many immigrant workers come here to work and send a percentage of their income home to their family.If they are careful and play the system they can soon build up substantial wealth in their home country(iam talking eastern europe here) some of the blokes you see working in fields in this country own property or properties back home(poland is going through an economic boom now after the initial hard period after the mass migration of younger populace this is mainly caused by influx of money from uk) this is not hearsay or rumour but fact,I know of one girl in a supervisory position at a large farm where i clean she lives in hostel style accom on site and sends as much money home as she can she plans to stick it out for about three more years and then return home to live off her property portfolio in poland,also she says that she can reclaim almost all the tax she pays in this country if she returns home within 5 yrs but i dont know if thats true??? i sure hope not
My father in law says this country is finnished due to letting in anyone and everyone,i`m starting to think he could be right.
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ust starting to think??? the problem is that whereas 30 years ago immigrants came to settle and make a new life here they now do it differently .Many immigrant workers come here to work and send a percentage of their income home to their family.If they are careful and play the system they can soon build up substantial wealth in their home country(iam talking eastern europe here) some of the blokes you see working in fields in this country own property or properties back home(poland is going through an economic boom now after the initial hard period after the mass migration of younger populace this is mainly caused by influx of money from uk) this is not hearsay or rumour but fact,I know of one girl in a supervisory position at a large farm where i clean she lives in hostel style accom on site and sends as much money home as she can she plans to stick it out for about three more years and then return home to live off her property portfolio in poland,also she says that she can reclaim almost all the tax she pays in this country if she returns home within 5 yrs but i dont know if thats true??? i sure hope not
Quote from: NWH on Yest............
Hi, Wake up to the real world, here in Birmingham that is exactly what the Indians, Bangladeshis and Pakistanis have been doing for the last 30 years or so and still do. I am amazed you are surprised. No disrespect to you intended.
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PS ..not trying to be anti anyone..just stating the fact that all immigrants try to better themselves, rightly or wrongly
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dont know about that mate i live in lincs aand not that many indians here but lots of east europeans cant blame em for doing it when average weekly minimum wage in poland is 70 quid and in lithuania its about 50 i just resent the fact that the tossers in govt like to tell us what a huge contribution they are making to this countries economy.....pmsl ;D ;D
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paul scotney not surprised at all if you could earn the equivalent of up to £970 a week with no skills wouldnt you do it????
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With all the guessing and theories about asylum seekers economic or otherwise, I thought it would help if facts produced by the Economist magazine were used rather than summising . The % rates are those of actual accepted seekers. 10% of Sweden's population are now Immigrants, where 30 years ago their were none! And they still seem to be doing very well as they are rated No5 in the best countries in the World for quality of life.
The purpose of this posting is to show that the UK is not the only country Immigrant workers choose to come too.
Asylum Seeker Acceptance Rates
1. Denmark 74%
2. Canada 62%
3. Finland 51%
4. Sweden 50%
5. USA 44%
6. UK 43%
7. Norway 43%
8. Netherlands 39%
9. Switzerland 39%
10. Belgium 25%
11. France 20%
12. Ireland 18%
13. New Zealand 18%
14. Italy 16%
15. Australia 13%
16. Austria 13%
17. Germany 10%
18. Japan 9%
It might also be of interest to note that the UK was rated as only the 29th best place to live in 2005 for quality of life.
The Top 10 best countries for quality of life (2005)
1 Ireland
2 Switzerland
3 Norway
4 Luxembourg
5 Sweden
6 Australia
7 Iceland
8 Italy
9 Denmark
10 Spain
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How funny. :-\
Isnt life hard enough without arguing with our Colleagues over what is a matter of preference.
Come on....lighten up a little. To air ones views is fine, to put down & insult someone for airing them is Stalinist behaviour.
About time this thread was locked.....as its doing nothing more than keeping bad feeling & negitivity going whilst petering on racism.
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The problem with the assylum seekers coming to this country is that other countries in Europe do not offer them the same benefits package. That means that they do not go there. Spain for example gives very minimal support and only for six months. France is the same. So they come here instead. Most are economic migrants looking for a better life rather than true assylum seekers so they follow the money.
I see from the previous post that America accept 44% of its assylum seeker. That makes me laugh.
Anyone who travels to America on holiday or business knows how difficult it is to get through immigration.
America may accept 44% of those who apply but most would not get into the country in the first place to apply. Everyone who goes to america has to have a return ticket already paid for as part of the entry requirement. How many genuine assylum seekers have the new "chip and pin " passports that are now required.
To get a visa you have to apply in person to the American Embassy in the country of departure and they run your name through their vast computers. If you don't tick all the right boxes you don't get a visa and if you haven't got a visa the airline won't take you.
Canada is the same, My friend Steve now lives in America and has a green card but was refused a visa to go to Canada on holiday because he didn't have a credit card for religeous reasons. When you apply for a visa to go to Canada on holiday they check your credit rating it appears. How many assylum seekers have credit cards?
Look at what happened a while back in Australia when a boat load of Vietnamese boat people tried to land.
Coming back to the original thread. Its not the council estates that are a problem. Slack Government and incompetent Civil Servants are allowing situations to develop that could be addressed but aren't.
Its the same with all these work shy chavs. Its easier to just keep throwing money to them than to do something about them. There are people out there today who fully intend to spend their whole lives on benefits. And the Govt seems prepared to let them.
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Racism is an ugly word and it seems that Government and MP's are terrified of being seen as such. This means that no-one has the guts to stand up and question the sense in flooding our country with some ten million immigrants. The only people who will question it are the hardliners with nothing to loose that we tend not to listen to anyway. So WHY are we allowing them to come in and drain OUR rescources good or bad?
As for council estates, i avoid them as i feel uncomfortable working on them. I was brought up in a council house so have nothing against any decent people living on them. It's my choice to work where I want to at the end of the day, simple as that. :)
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I am of to Japan, I should do well out there I think. ;D
Will post back as soon as I get there. 8)
Adam
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The problem with the assylum seekers coming to this country is that other countries in Europe do not offer them the same benefits package
Ireland Denmark, Sweden, Norway and Finland are in Europe and all have better benefits than us.
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I'll work for anyone who is prepared to pay to have their windows cleaned regardless of where they live inside my area. because thats what I do for a living, I clean windows in return for money. If I get a non paying customer I drop them. It doesn't matter where they live.
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Asylum seekers are not permitted to work in the UK, that's the law.
No matter how highly qualified they may be. If we won't let them work and we can't let them starve, they are paid basic benefits.
We are so lucky to be living in a country that encourages the freedom of speech. We can come on forums like this and voice our views. Speak out in Zimbabwe and you get bumped off, it's very easy to take our freedom for granted. If we are not happy here, it's comparatively easy to emigrate, most Brits seem to think they have a God given right to go wherever we please, and yet we would deny this right for others to come here.
To risk generalising again, many people living in social housing have big financial problems, many are the victims of poor parenting. Brought up with few boundaries and left to their own devices, they under achieve in school, and leave without acquiring the necessary skills to compete in the job market. Many end up on benefits, and without the skills to manage their meagre finances find themselves in debt.
I can sympathise with these people, especially at Christmas time when their own kids want the same as all their friends.
I have cleaned for such people and been asked if they can pay next time, being a bit of a softy, I say yes. When next time comes it's double the money, twice as much as they didn't have last time.
They know they owe me, and they know they can't pay again, some get angry at the situation they are in, and at times they have directed their anger in my direction.
Be honest guys, who needs this kind of hassle. I am just an ordinary working guy trying to earn a crust.
I know these people are in the minority, but this minority is more common in social housing.
If you play Russian roulette, there is only one chance in 6 of shooting yourself, but I would rather leave the gun well alone to begin with. Dai