Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Doug Holloway on January 22, 2008, 08:05:07 am
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Hi Guys
The dreaded word.
With so many peoples empires being built on sand with only massive debt holding them up, I believe we are heading for the corrective recession, which will ultimately leave housing more affordable and budgets better balanced.
We hear lots of rubbish, like 'Northern Rock was a well managed company' etc even though it was borrowed to the hilt.
What do you think ?
Cheers
Doug
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Good topic
The real maths start the problem and then lack of confidence gives it a snowball effect. If the govt can keep the publics perception in perspective (as you rightly put it "corrective recession") I think it will just be a bit tougher rather than a real nightmare.
Need to spk to you today Doug. Whats the best time to call?
Pete
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Doug
I should move this to other topics ;D ;D ;D
What I think
The only way to have a growing Economy is to have people or Government spend money. This then gives the Mutiplier Effect
Governments both Conservitive and Labour have encouraged people to borrow.
My Friends who use to live in Southend regularly remortgaged their House.
and enjoyed a prosprous lifestyle
They then went into buy to let and did the same.
They then borrowed against all assets and went to live in Spain on the Capital
When we saw them during the Summer they were having difficulty selling their big house.
Not sure what happened after that but with falling house prices they could be in big trouble. But I do not think they plan to leave their family anything when they leave this planet.
Buy to let has given a lot of people a feeling of wellbing and importance I am a Landlord you are a tennant
Some have made a million others owe a million
Those who have been in market a long time will eat the dablers that is the way of a Capatialist Society.
But if you do not understand that you should not play.
It could be good for Carpet Cleaners but customers will be seeking resonable prices aswell as quality work.
It might be harder to buy equioment on Lease etc
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Hi Pete,
About 4 .
How will a downturn affect our CC businesses , the last one caned mine although I had only been going 2 years in this area.
Cheers
Doug
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I don't watch the news so much now. They even had a piece about Blue Monday saying it was the most depressing day of the year. No poo.
Thanks to the media there is a Pedo on every street corner and there's a new health scare every week that's going to kill us.
The key is not letting the crap in, that's what does most people in.
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Could be a good thing for business.
Businesses that have grown responsibly, not over-geared and have a bit of wool on their backs should be OK. Now is the time to consider looking at overheads and start cutting them back before it becomes desperate measures.
It may also be a test of the quality of your business where you retain customers because of quality, not because you are the cheapest. You may not need to trim prices.
If customers are not moving house or changing carpets (or removing them for hard floors) there may even be more work around.
A recession may drive some cleaners out of business leaving more for those who survive.
We may get better deals on chemicals/machinery/advertising.
I'm not saying any fellow cc's on this forum fall into any of these catagories but they are matters to consider.
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Good food for thought there, Doctor.
Take into account if money is tight, public will be hanging on to what they have rather then splashing out on new carpets or hard floors.
Opportunity to get new clients who would not normally have a carpet cleaner - show em what can be done!
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When 8 people out of ten buy your services thats good business!
Ina reccession perhaps only 5 or 6 people out of ten buy your service if only 1 or 2 people buy that's a depression bearing this in mind makes it fairly easy to control your business during hard times.
One thing i can guaranee is that during a resession there are always people making loads of money and also people making a loss in the same business so there you have it!
also during hard times there are plenty of people wanting a new carpet all you have to do is persuade them to hold onto their money and have them cleaned until times get better and the've got more cash in their pockets ie there should be an abundance of people looking to have professional cleaning undertaken rather than spending thousands of pounds on replacement.
all you have to do is get this message accross to as many as you can.
These are my personal thoughts and they work for me!
Kind regards
Dave :)
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We went through the last recession, seeing friends handing back their house keys to lenders was a sorry sight, I had skilled tradesmen, carpenters, builders, electricians calling to see if I had any extra work, they would say,'give me £4 per hour and I will do anything', many problems in those days were due interest rates of 16%, things are different today.
I think that Doug's 'corrective' comment may be right, house prices are sky high, with first time buyers struggling to get on the property ladder, people heaping amount's on credit cards, we have evolved into a 'want it now, pay for it later' nation, which will eventually come and bite us. :'(
We try to make sure our overheads are kept down along with our borrowing.
Regards
S
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Im a tiler by trade, in my area there are about ten good tilers, we all know each other and work together, we speak about jobs, we meet once a month for breakfast and chat about bad customers, give each other work if needed and we all price the same. we dont over charge we charge the going rate we are like one big happy family and it works quite well. perhaps you guys could try this, really helps in quite periods.
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The buy it now and pay later people have kept the country running though, money makes the world go round so with money passing hands knowone thinks of a recession because as you are earning it you are spending it and you keep ahead because of cash flow NOT saving.
Years ago there used to be a company that advertised in Exchange and Mart and said that our industry was 'recession proof' well in some ways I'd agree although we may get less jobs because of a potential recession we will still get jobs.
The 'Bank manager' addage is that if your business is doing poorly then put your prices up, yes you become less competitive but they know that the numbers calling you may drop and you'll get less conversions but at least what you will get will be worth it and they know their numbers just look at what British Gas are doing!
Shaun
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Wasn't it Ronald Regan who said, "A recession is when your neighbour loses their job, but a depression when you lose your own job"?
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Sherco I think with the amount of jobs we do per day/week or year that it's not the same, 1 domestic tiling job may take you a week there aren't many carpet cleaning jobs that take that long so therefore you need less jobs.
Shaun
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I think the media are talking us into a recession, I don't think the general public are as prudent as they were in the 80's and 90's but also they are more resourceful ie look at the amount of different jobs there are nowadays? before people wanted a secure job in a large national, now they get short term contracts in those jobs and smaller businesses have florished, I bet there are more number of business than there were back then so it spreads the risk.
Shaun
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I agree with Shaun. One of the reasons for the length of the depression in the late 1920's/30's was caused by people trying to save money instead of spending it. Saving money takes it out of the economy where it can't then be used.
Obviously, if money is continually spent then this can lead to inflation unless there is some increase in manufacturing along the way.
IN the late 1970's/early 1980's it is known that "After Eight" Dinner Mints idea of a sales drive was to put their prices up. The reason being that the product was seen as exclusive and aspirational, so the more expensive it was the more people wanted it. Similarly, I guess we want people to aspire to having perfectly clean carpets all the time.
Roger
PS I apologise if that got a bit heavy with economic theory.
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Sherco I think with the amount of jobs we do per day/week or year that it's not the same, 1 domestic tiling job may take you a week there aren't many carpet cleaning jobs that take that long so therefore you need less jobs.
Shaun
I wish every job took a week, kitchen walls, one day, conservatory floor, one day, bathrooms three days, we still get through the work quick and need a lot to keep us busy.
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Doctor
You need to lie down in a quiet room for a while
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Shaun's comment about it being recession proof business is interesting, while it has the same supply and demand factors, there is the fact that people make do and mend rather than buy new stuff during times of lower confidence.
As has been said in a few posts in the end it has much more to do with the person running the business that makes the most difference.
Since Friday I have had no work and have delivered 2500 leaflets, about 5 hours a day. I've had one quote so far. Now off to post some letters and finally sort out my website copy. :)
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It's generally agreed that a recession over here will come in from the direction of the US. Does anyone really think that they will enter a serious recession with a Presidential election looming in November ? Prepare though; next year perhaps ?
Regards
Pete (JS2)
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Whats the going rate for tilers as a matter of interest.
I know a fella whos a tiler with an old van and as i see it a few quid worth of tools yet hes making plenty. We have up to £20k of gear just to clean a carpet!!
Mark
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Carpet Guy
Will the pub do instead?
Roger
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Hi Guys
Interesting posts.
There used to be two economic theories
Keynesism and Moneyterism, the former ruled until inflation surged and the latter was adopted by Mrs Thatcher.
Keynesism was based on spending to stimulate growth and Moneyterism on resticting money, probably what led to the last recession with sky high interest rates.
Cheers
Doug
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Don't know the current rate for tilers, but it was £20 - £36 per sq yd 20 years ago, a neighbour paid £600 for a bathroom recently.
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Whats the going rate for tilers as a matter of interest.
I know a fella whos a tiler with an old van and as i see it a few quid worth of tools yet hes making plenty. We have up to £20k of gear just to clean a carpet!!
Mark
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Whats the going rate for tilers as a matter of interest.
I know a fella whos a tiler with an old van and as i see it a few quid worth of tools yet hes making plenty. We have up to £20k of gear just to clean a carpet!!
Mark
You get set up for £2,000 with tools etc, but its knowing the tricks of the trade and being very fast fixing, i made £32,000 last year but like any business its having the contacts with builders, plumbers, architects etc. The rate is between £25 to £35 sqm.
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recession I vividly remember the 80's recession, we were never busier people don't buy new they make and mend and clean
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hi there
ok, stay professional keep your business lean and keen, and dontbe afraid to market.
many businesses chop their sales teams when recession bites, but that reduces your market exposure, therefore you must keep your marketing level high, the more that you are out there the more chances you have of winning business, irrelevant of business type.
this is the time to revisit your existing clients, go through the quote file, re quote,
we are embarking on a mail marketing campaign a4 folders, letter, and four or five inserts, not cheap, but delivers a positive message, aimed precisely where we want to be, x number going out each week, over next 6 weeks.
be positive when you are with your clients, you can never sell when you put yourself under pressure.
yes people will disappear, gearing is essential, make sure that your cashflow remains positive.
yes it might get tight, but there will still be customers, its all about hunting them down and then closing the sale.
its just an opinion.
regards
martin
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Last year the Economy grew by 3% Acording to the news despite doom and gloom leading Economists not government connected are predicticting
2% growth this year
We have had Contionous Growth since the Housing collapse in 1992.
you only have a reccesion when you have minus growth not when things slow down a fraction.
I am amazed about 3% growth because the doom and gloom merchants were predicting a slow down this time last year.
With Computer proragrmes running the buying decisions on the stock exchange I wonder if Stock collapses areEngineered and the first sign of trouble so the Mega rich have a Chance of buying shares invested in my pennsion at at a discount
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recession I vividly remember the 80's recession, we were never busier people don't buy new they make and mend and clean
same for us our best years were when the rate went up too 15% put alot of cleaners out the game as well
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Great post everyone.Those that say the last recession was thier best years,what adjustments did you make,if any?
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???
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Turns out the Crash was because of a Rouge Trader in France ditching 3.5 billion of stock.
The Fed in America did not know this thought the world was in melt down and slashed interest rates.
We will now see if they put them back up
If they did not panick dodgy loans could have been handled better as houses would eventually start increasing in value, although like the rest of us they might have to wait a year.
Why throw people out on street Forclose and then rent house back to them or someone else no need for Fire sales and panic
But it helps to get rid of Bush
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Bush and now Brown are a bad combination, Blair when you saw through the smoke screen was a good actor but I'm afraid this is politics of the future!
My old school teacher once said to me that Americans elect presidents if they like the man not the policies and I'm afraid Tony Blair was partially in that albeit John Major (a proper politician) didn't help with his greyness.
One thing is for sure we need a general election to freshen things up as the nation needs a feel good factor and it could be around the corner May 2008.
Shaun
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I'll just keep my thoughts to myself then shall i? :-X
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Great post everyone.Those that say the last recession was thier best years,what adjustments did you make,if any?
I had spent my life in retail managment opened a shop went bankrupt lost house went begging door to door for various companies moved out of cardboard box, and rebuilt my life.
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Great post everyone.Those that say the last recession was thier best years,what adjustments did you make,if any?
I had spent my life in retail managment opened a shop went bankrupt lost house went begging door to door for various companies moved out of cardboard box, and rebuilt my life.
Thanks Ian,i meant those that were in CC at the time.I was in real estate then,interest rate was 17%,tough times indeed.