Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Les on January 08, 2008, 06:00:37 pm
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Hi all.
I just wondered if anyone can offer advice on a situation I've got with some stair carpets.
I do alot of work for a family and one of the jobs was to clean the stair carpets which had some stains on them.
The outcome was pretty good and the customer was pleased too so I went on my way.
Several weeks later the lady rang to say the stains had re-appeared. She wasn't complaining and would pay me to do them again.
When I went back I couldn't believe my eyes. The picture below gives you some idea why :o
These weren't the same stains that I had removed previously. Fortunately I purchased a camera for work and take alot of before & after photo's, so I was able to compare them and confirm they were fresh stains.
The lady was fine with this and once again she was happy with the results.
Today, however, about 3 weeks on, she has sent me a text to say....they're back again :'(, not as obvious, but wondered if I had any suggestions ?
Apart from setting fire to the carpet, I thought I'd just ask you all first, Has anyone any idea what might be going on here ?
I did lift the carpet to see if the problem was underneath.... Not that I could see. Also I made certain to not overwet the carpet and even towelled it off by hand to leave it as dry as poss.
Any other suggestions welcome ;)
Les
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How did you clean and with what?
Had the carpets been cleaned before you?
Owned from new or inherited carpet?
Do they take food and drink upstairs?
Carpet fibre and construction?
As much information required as possible.
Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
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Hi Ken,
The carpets were a good quality Wool mix which they owned from new. I'm pretty sure no-one had cleaned them previously as I've been doing work for them over the past 7 years, (first clean of the carpets though late 2007).
I used Hot Water Extraction with a Stair Wand and a mix of prochem Double Clean having Pre-Sprayed with Prespray Gold.
They have what seems like an endless supply of teenage children in what is apreety large home. Oh, and a male dog which pees all over the place including their sofas which keeps me in business ;D but I don't think we can blame him for this.
They also have a lady who does for them, I'm not sure if she's cleaned them with anything.
The stains came out really quite easily which made me think they were quite fresh.
hope the info helps.
Les
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That's pretty dramatic " soiling "and someone must know what's causing it ! Some of the marks even look like water marks, but a tough one to call, on the screen.
If they came out easily, was there a lot of foam in the return tank, as it could have been caused by soap, vanish, 1001, type product, but this would have shown as soon as you hit the soiling with an extractor and there would certainly have been a lot of foam in the tank / coming out of the exhaust, if not, it's a bit odd, to say the least.
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It looks a bit like someone had a huge nose bleed, if it is blood, did you use cold water?
Also a protein pre spray or M power, or similar.
S
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Hi
If it was something in the carpet attracting the dirt the stains would look the same each time.
Does the dog have free raign when the house is empty ?
Is the dog coming in muddy & running up & down the stairs ?
Dave
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i think carpet guy could be right , you say they have a dog that pees everywhere are they using vanish are a similar product to clean areas where dog has peed and then this is being left in the carpet and attracting the dirt therfore causing the stains.
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Les are you just winding us up ?
If not then the customer is taking the pee out of you!! :(
These stains are not wick back as most look like drink spills and mucky feet.
Some body else is also having a go at cleaning them because I can see areas that have been poorly cleaned.
The fact is, if it was down to poor cleaning / wick back then this would have developed in the first 72 hours of the clean and not several weeks later.
Tell your customer to look nearer home for the problem.
If she cant find the answer then you keep on cleaning them every few weeks and charge the full rate. ;)
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I agree with your comments.
They aren't water Marks though or the wonderful Vanish/ 1001 which I like to show the customer as I produce a lovely 'Ball of Foam', just before I sell them some of my 'Non Resoiling, Biodegradable, Human Friendly Stain Remover :o
I do think the Children might have something to do with it, they're nice kids but I think the stairs get a right hammering with food and drink being taken up to their rooms.
The rest of the carpets are fine, but as I mentioned, the fact that I have cleaned the upholstery 3 times due to dog urine may indicate the family are quite a relaxed bunch.
Les
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Charge her full price all the time that is fresh soiling not marks re-appearing
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Les
If they have a cleaner you will find that she ( or the lady of the house) is cleaning the stairs to the best of her ability because they are getting trashed daily. She is not able to extract all the soil out so over a few weeks they get to a high level of soilage that she cant deal with/remove and they look a mess, so you get the call.
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Me again.
You're replies are coming in so fast I'm struggling to keep up. :D
It's not a wind up I can promise you and the lady knows I've put it on here to get your views.
I'm pretty sure that it's not urine as I don't have the same level of success in removing that if I'm honest.
I do think that this must be fresh soiling but it's the randomness of the stains that gets me. Some look like splashes, some like general soiling, but then they're not at the edge of the tread but here there & everywhere.
I would also add that I guess this carpet to be probably 20+ years old, generally in good nick but with some fading and general aging which may look like poor cleaning.
Thanks for all your comments so far
Les
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HI
Looks like either Fruit Juice (fruitshoot) coffee or wine pounded in with excess traffic.
Third stair down looks like a spillage of some sort, see the treads are very worn, so they are getting used a lot.
One possible way to see what is actually going on is to do a daily visit over the period of a week (depending on your time of course) Or get the lady to take pictures on a daily basis.
they look fairly fresh, and all seem to be spillages of one kind or another. Although there are no splashes on the surrounding areas??
OMFG was my response when I saw your pics!
She seems a good customer, and you want to keep her happy though.
Regards
Martin 8)
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Les
I would get a white towell, wet with water and see what colour the stains are.
I suspect there may be some dye instability,if the stains are all a reddy colour then this is unlikely to be just dirt.
It is possible the Double Clean has destabilised it, for cleaning I would use plain water with a little acid rinse which I suspect would clean it.
Cheers
Doug
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Just for the record, here's a shot of the stairs from the previous visit.
I think we can all see that the stains might not be 'Bleed Back' ::) ;D
I think the best thing I can do is tell her I've consulted the 'Experts'.... :o , book in for another clean, take more photo's and see what happens.
If the same thing occurs afterwards I will recomend a change of carpet.
Last question.
What chemical reccomendations for the next clean, remembering they apparently don't look 'Quite' so bad now ?
Les
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With out doubt no dye bleed ::)
As said earlier rebook re clean, get paid, smile and wait for another call in 8 weeks, then
rebook re clean, get paid, smile and wait for another call in 8 weeks, then
rebook re clean, get paid, smile and wait for another call in 8 weeks, then
rebook re clean, get paid, smile and wait for another call in 8 weeks, then
rebook re clean, get paid, smile and wait for another call in 8 weeks, then ;D ;D ;D ;)
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I think the second lot of photos confirms
a pretty lax attitude to cleanlieness
the likeliehood of " interim cleaning " by an amateur, with god only knows what
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I think my customer must take her kids round to this other house where I found someone else who has a problem on their stairs. ;D
Oh, and what a practical colour too ! :P
It must be I just pick the wrong customers as I got a call to go back to this house about 2 weeks later as they'd had a slight problem on the White landing carpet.
The gentlemans new wife had fed his Siamese cats with.........Spaghetti Bolognese, ( As you all do I'm sure) :o ::) :-\
The result......Recycled Spaghetti Bolognese with a little body fluid thrown in, (or should that be 'Up') for good measure.
Oh well at least we'll never be short of work eh ?
P.S. One of the 3 Siamese Cats is about 19 years old so I'll just sit back and wait for the incontinence to start, (that's the Cats by the way )
Les ;)
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Les with all these photo's I think you have a stair fettish. :o
Anything you want to tell us. ;D
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How very dare you ?
'Tread' very carefully Paul
You may take a 'Step' too far
And end up having a heavy 'Landing'.
Any more suggestions like that and I may have to consult my 'Bannister'....I mean 'Barrister' !!
:o ;D :D ;) Les
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Les
The appearance of the stains in the photograph are consistent with the resoiling of an "invisible" residue. This could, for example, be something like a detergent, sugar, fat or oil. I gather that you have wet a sample and failed to produce a "foaming ball". This would eliminate a conventional high foaming shampoo residue, but not necessarily other types of detergent.
First
Do a pH test on a few spots, but be careful not to remove all of the spot. If the reading is heavily acidic or alkaline, treat accordingly.
If you have a pH reading in the neutral range, you will have little indication as to the nature of the soiling, so first pre-treat stains with a volatile solvent and towel/pad dry. Don't rub. This will help with any potential oily residue from non-volatile spotters, or white spirit or walked in fats, grease or oil. Then wet spot clean.
Clean carpets again with a detergent free formula, eg One Step Fineline to be Woolsafe, otherwise something like Pure Clean, Eco Gent, DFC, Solution 4(?), M Power Craftex M/S etc. etc. Then freshwater rinse. Agitate pre-spray carefully with a hand brush so that you can more easily detect if any spots are "foamy" or otherwise different to the others.
Other than this, I could not advise without an inspection.
Good luck.
Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
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Thanks Ken.
I take your advice seriously and will probably use some 'Solutions' microsplitter that I have on board.
The point about the invisible residue only concerns me because the original stains that I removed have never returned.
Thanks again for the very useful advice which I appreciate.
Les
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I think we're all agreed that the dog isn't the main problem, but I assume you have had a sniff at the carpet at some time to see if that gives any clues.
I notice that the hall seems to be a hard floor and with the carpet not going the full width of the stair I guess these factors are likely to concentrate the attraction or airborne dirt into the smaller than average soft fabric area.
Having said that I would presume it was drink spills coupled with dirt landing on the sticky residue.
As Paul said a regular "nice little earner". I've got a few like that, but to start with you do question your own competence a little bit on the first few occasions you go back to discuss with the client.
Hope that helps.
Roger
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Those photos look like a crime scene- are people mysteriously dissappearing from these homes, are there strange goings on and things going bump in the night .You maybe are cleaning up the evidence and so implicated in the crime.Be very careful or you may find a horses head next to you in bed.
If I am totally off course on this one then I agree with everyone else - their just messy so & so's.
Mike
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Mike you must have some really strange customers. Hope none are Italian :o
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Flash spray with bleach as a pre spray with some zflora in the xtraction tank.
Works a treat. Honest guv....
will
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Les,
After looking at this post several times with interest I've come to 2 conclusions:
1). She's got really messy kids and pets = Keep going back for repeat business.
2). She's making the mess on purpose wanting you back = ??? = :o = :) = :-* = ;D = :-X!
All the best,
Jason.
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Jesus ! have only seen stairs that bad on a commercial job .Did have one customer where i cleaned her lounge that had a 6 foot by 2 foot oil stain where her son had decided to strip down his motorbike in the lounge !
So bad i put the pics on my website...
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Well,
thank you all for your helpful and.......varied ::) :o ;D responses to my post.
I'm contacting the lady today to.......go back again :o
I will of course take more photo's of what I find, ( I'll pass them onto the Forensics team Mike ),
and let you see for yourselves.
Very busy thankfully so it's likely to be at the end of the month.
Keep well all
Les :D
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Hi Les,
Have studied the photos and they do look like fresh stains/marks. As for cleaning chemicals try using Prochem Pure Clean as a pre-spray then rinse with just plain hot water. This im sure will clean the carpets plus it will NOT leave any trace of residue.
Richie.
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Thanks Richie, that sounds like good advice.
I think the number and quality of replies go to show what a helpful site this is.
It's nice to get a second opinion....and a third.....and a fourth...... ;)
Les