Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: chrismroberts on December 18, 2007, 02:17:22 pm
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Started a house today, did the backs... went round the front and plugged the pole back into the reel and had no pressure what so ever!
Went back to the van, gave the pump outlet a good suck (which usually works).... no joy.... ran the pump with the Varistream on full power for a couple of minutes.... no joy. Checked the tank to pump hose for air bubbles, that was fine. Checked the pump filter.... that was fine! The pump is just chugging away, really slow, isnt bringing any water through at all! I have had to de-ice the pump a couple of times, has that damaged it? Does anyone know how to get these things going again?
Its a Shurflo.... this is not good, tis the busiest week of the year!! :-[
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I reckon that the diaphramme insede the pump has dislodged itself.
Quite simple to rectify, unscrew head, carefully remove the head itseld and check the
seating of the said diaphramme, sometimes when the pump freezes the diaphramme
(traingular rubber part usually with 3 nipples), needs taking out and placing it very hot water for
a few minutes, this will cause the rubber to take back its natural form again. Refit and everything should work again.
Had this problem a lot myself untill I put in a heater over night (next to pump and hoses) to stop this.
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
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Im just about to do the same with my pump. Good pic! Always helps
I would guess that is the right part
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I reckon that the diaphramme insede the pump has dislodged itself.
Quite simple to rectify, unscrew head, carefully remove the head itseld and check the
seating of the said diaphramme, sometimes when the pump freezes the diaphramme
(traingular rubber part usually with 3 nipples), needs taking out and placing it very hot water for
a few minutes, this will cause the rubber to take back its natural form again. Refit and everything should work again.
Had this problem a lot myself untill I put in a heater over night (next to pump and hoses) to stop this.
what heater do you use woodley ?
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Hmm, still no luck :( The motor suddenly started whizzing round so I put that diaphragm back on.. still going fine, then the case and screwed it together, stopped working again! It couldnt be the varistream could it?
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My system has got really sluggish the last couple of days i've had to turn the blue dial up almost as far as it will go.
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Don't do like I did last week by hitting the pump violently with a stick, or tapping it with a hammer. I killed mine off by booting it to death with my steel toe cap boots whilst cursing and swearing at it. ;D
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Don't do like I did last week by hitting the pump violently with a stick, or tapping it with a hammer. I killed mine off by booting it to death with my steel toe cap boots whilst cursing and swearing at it. ;D
LOL!! Well its worth a try I guess? Things normally work if ya hit 'em :P:P ;D ;D ;D
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
Yes, thats what I meant, the bit in the middle sometimes is not a perfect fit and the pump sucks in air. The 3 Nipples need to be sitting correctly, might not be your problem, but a spare will only cost a few quid as is always worth keeping in reserve.
If you think the variotech is the problem them disconnect the it from the pump and hot wire the pump from the battery, if it then works at full speed you will know where the problem lies.
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
Yes, thats what I meant, the bit in the middle sometimes is not a perfect fit and the pump sucks in air. The 3 Nipples need to be sitting correctly, might not be your problem, but a spare will only cost a few quid as is always worth keeping in reserve.
If you think the variotech is the problem them disconnect the it from the pump and hot wire the pump from the battery, if it then works at full speed you will know where the problem lies.
Cheers mate! Thats the plan of action for the morning! Cant see a thing now so will have to lose another loada work :( Thing is I hope this doesnt keep me out of action til the end of the week, gotta few bigguns that I've booked in that are gonna keep me goin for cash over the break!
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Does anyone know if you can buy spares for the pumps or is it just a new pump every time?
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
Yes, thats what I meant, the bit in the middle sometimes is not a perfect fit and the pump sucks in air. The 3 Nipples need to be sitting correctly, might not be your problem, but a spare will only cost a few quid as is always worth keeping in reserve.
If you think the variotech is the problem them disconnect the it from the pump and hot wire the pump from the battery, if it then works at full speed you will know where the problem lies.
Cheers mate! Thats the plan of action for the morning! Cant see a thing now so will have to lose another loada work :( Thing is I hope this doesnt keep me out of action til the end of the week, gotta few bigguns that I've booked in that are gonna keep me goin for cash over the break!
if you are off today, go and drive and buy a new one, problem solved
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
Yes, thats what I meant, the bit in the middle sometimes is not a perfect fit and the pump sucks in air. The 3 Nipples need to be sitting correctly, might not be your problem, but a spare will only cost a few quid as is always worth keeping in reserve.
If you think the variotech is the problem them disconnect the it from the pump and hot wire the pump from the battery, if it then works at full speed you will know where the problem lies.
Cheers mate! Thats the plan of action for the morning! Cant see a thing now so will have to lose another loada work :( Thing is I hope this doesnt keep me out of action til the end of the week, gotta few bigguns that I've booked in that are gonna keep me goin for cash over the break!
if you are off today, go and drive and buy a new one, problem solved
I dont have £100.
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Thanks :)
Ive taken the pump apart.... is this the piece you mean....?
Yes, thats what I meant, the bit in the middle sometimes is not a perfect fit and the pump sucks in air. The 3 Nipples need to be sitting correctly, might not be your problem, but a spare will only cost a few quid as is always worth keeping in reserve.
If you think the variotech is the problem them disconnect the it from the pump and hot wire the pump from the battery, if it then works at full speed you will know where the problem lies.
Cheers mate! Thats the plan of action for the morning! Cant see a thing now so will have to lose another loada work :( Thing is I hope this doesnt keep me out of action til the end of the week, gotta few bigguns that I've booked in that are gonna keep me goin for cash over the break!
if you are off today, go and drive and buy a new one, problem solved
I dont have £100.
can you not trad for the first half of today then use the money to buy a new pump?
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What would be the point? Id have to redo first cleans next time round on the houses I did this morning. And I'm not even sure its the pump thats playing up. Thanks for your advice though mate, got a coupla ideas I'm gonna try... will keep you all posted :)
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OK, a quick update for anyone whos interested or having the same problem...
Light on the varistream was flashing, couple of guys suggested this could be it telling me there wasnt enough power in the van battery so I swapped the it with the car one and gave it a whirl.... still nothing. So to rule out the varistream I connected the pump directly to the van power supply and ran the engine.... nothing. Took the pump apart, no loose connections.... I took it into a pump specialist in Chester who tell me that in the process of taking it apart I appear to have damaged the spring loaded mechanism in the top of the pump. (Note to anyone fiddling with a Shurflo.... dont take the top off! :-\)
Have found some space on a credit card and ordered a new one from Wintecs. Should arrive tomorrow. Fingers crossed.
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I see pure freedom are doing the pump and a varistreem (digital) for £149 inc vat and delivery on ebay. Looks to be a reasonable price.
................... and hate to tell you but they do the pump on it's own for £79. Unless it's lower output of course.
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I had trouble with my pump, well actually both of them last week. It's sod's law it's always at the most inconvenient time (Xmas). So, now I have 2 new pumps and I have it set up so that I can change over pumps literally in about 5 secs whilst still using the same varistream, so now I have learnt my lesson the hard way but I am now prepared for the next time it happens. If you have the spare cash and the time to set it up then it will save you the work time lost and the frustration when your pump packs up on you sometime in the future. :)
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I see pure freedom are doing the pump and a varistreem (digital) for £149 inc vat and delivery on ebay. Looks to be a reasonable price.
................... and hate to tell you but they do the pump on it's own for £79. Unless it's lower output of course.
Yeh I saw that one, good price! I just REALLY need it this week..... and wintecs were the only one i could find doing overnight delivery! Ah well. Such is life. :P
I had trouble with my pump, well actually both of them last week. It's sod's law it's always at the most inconvenient time (Xmas). So, now I have 2 new pumps and I have it set up so that I can change over pumps literally in about 5 secs whilst still using the same varistream, so now I have learnt my lesson the hard way but I am now prepared for the next time it happens. If you have the spare cash and the time to set it up then it will save you the work time lost and the frustration when your pump packs up on you sometime in the future. :)
Thats pretty cool, how do you change over? Just transfer the hose or keep a Y connector with hoses attached to both of them?
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2 pumps wired up to 1 varistream and both connected from van tank with a twin outlet socket and 2 taps (on/off) and only 1 connected to a small DI container via a hoselock connection with the spare one with a hoselock connection also. Then if my pump packs up all I have to do is take one hoselock off and put the other one on and turn 1 tap off and turn the other on.
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I had trouble with my pump, well actually both of them last week. It's sod's law it's always at the most inconvenient time (Xmas). So, now I have 2 new pumps and I have it set up so that I can change over pumps literally in about 5 secs whilst still using the same varistream, so now I have learnt my lesson the hard way but I am now prepared for the next time it happens. If you have the spare cash and the time to set it up then it will save you the work time lost and the frustration when your pump packs up on you sometime in the future. :)
Thats's really good advice.
I have a spare pump. It cost me £79.99 delivered from Pure Freedom (Next day Sheepmeister) :( O.K. It is sitting in a van doing nothing for now but if I get a problem like you say 5 mins to swap it then back earning.
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I`m lucky i have 2 spare pumps and a spare varistream,another important thing to have is a box of O rings assorted sizes ie hosereel-pole hose etc,and a cordless drill for being able to change over pumps if needed quickly,havn`t had to yet but it`s peice of mind knowing you have the kit in the vehicle so no or little down time.
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With ya on that thinkin NWH :)
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Think I might do that when I have a bit of spare cash... ie, in the new year. Keep a spare pump, cant be doing with this!! :P Just gotta think of a way to stop the new one from freezing up!! :(
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I've made a polystyrene box that goes over mine. Hope it works. Everything was frozen up this morning.
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New pump came but that didnt solve the problem. Only thing left is the varistream? I've tried wiring the pump in directly to the van supply..... but just spoken to a mate and he thinks that wont work unless I bypass the pump pressure switch? Does anyone know how to do this?
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To by pass the preasure switch you dissconnect the wire at the head of the pump, and just use the red and black wires from the base of the pump.
See attached document in pdf format.
Roy
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Cheers for that mate.
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Hmmm..... does anyone have a varistream near me who wouldnt mind disconnecting it from their van mount/trolley for 5 minutes so I can test it? Long shot? :P
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Just my two penneth, if the pumps running then it's unlikely to be the varistream. Sounds more like a water problem to me - maybe your tank vent is blocked, your pipe from tank to pump is kinked or a connector is off before the pump? Can't be anything serious 'cos there is nothing in the system that can go wrong.
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Where is your di? before the pump or after?
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Don't suppose there is a frozen bit of pipe anywhere?
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After the filters and just before the tank.
Hmmmm, I'll double check :) Hope thats all it is!! :-[
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Does the pump speed up ok when you put the varistream on boost?
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1. Get volt meter test battery should be 13.6 if fully charged. If charged step 2.
2. Get pump disconnect wire from top of pump, and use red and black wires from base of pump and connect the red to the + black to –, you can run the pump dry for a few seconds. If it spins go on to stage 3
3. Put pump back into system and connect the varistream with only the red and black wires from the base of the pump. Try again, if not working step 4.
4. Check in line fuse on the varistream wire, remove fuse and put back in. still no joy.
5. Check all wiring connectors from varistream and battery conections.
If the pump ran direct from battery but not after connecting varistream you have a faulty varistream. You can put a buy pass in to get you out of trouble. Put a Tee in each side on the pump from one side to the other, in this pipe put a flow control valve, to reduce the flow to what you require. Then wire your pump direct to the battery with an inline fuse and a simple on off switch.
If you need any help email me and I will email my number.
Roy
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Thanks Roy :) :) :) I've swapped the car battery into the van but I'll buy a voltmeter tonight and test it so I can rule it out for definite.
Getting a bit confused about the wiring direct from the pump to the van. Have tried to connect it to the van but cant get it running. I'm probably doing the wrong thing!! ACH!! If youre running direct from the van do you have to bypass the pressure switch? Because if so I'll have to strip the pressure switch plug right?
It does SOMETHING when connected to the varistream... just not enough. The light on the varistream flickers and the pump just click-click-clicks..... which I dont think is the pump cuz the old one did it.
Thanks for all your help everyone. I'm probably missing something so obvious I just cant think what!! :(
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Sheepmeister we are getting there. If the light flickers fairly fast say every two seconds it's telling you your battery is flat. Have a look at the instructions by the dial on the front. I've got a print out somewhere i'll have a read.
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Cheers dave. It flickers faster than that, is the flicker speed significant? Hmmm... can it be the battery? Thatd mean the van and car batterys are flat, and the car one should be fine. Went to Stoke and back last night, 115 mile round trip so it must be charged?
Thanks again :)
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Could be a poor connection? Found it - constant flashing means pump running but battery voltage low. So as Roy said really check the battery and connections. Sorry you haven't got going you probably know more than me anyway. Gets a bit confusing reading posts sometimes. Let us know how you get on then we can log it in our memory.
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It does get confusing yeh! Doesnt help that I'm confused myself! I think you probably know a lot more than me! My knowledge of auto electrics is....... non existent :-\ thanks mate, will keep you all posted! :)
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Roy,
I'm going to get a volt meter from Screwfix tomorrow. So, it should read 13.6 volts across the van battery?
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Sounds like your battery isn't holding it's charge properly. Don't forget in the winter vehicle battery has to work harder supplying the lights, heater if constantly on (demisting and heating the cab), wipers, etc so less amps going to the split charge relay for spare battery to charge up because vehicle battery takes longer to recharge to it's running state first.
I have an Omnipole hot water heater installed in my van. I have a 110amp leisure battery I run from a split charge relay for 2 pumps & a varistream. The heater is being run from a 30 amp gel battery which is connected up to the 110amp leisure battery and split charge relay. I find on these cold days that I can't get enough amps out of my 30amp gel battery for the heater (because it cuts out when the voltage is too low), so my next job is to replace it with a 110amp leisure battery so I have more running time for the heater during the day and will have to recharge the main battery overnight with an intelligent battery charger so I don't cook the battery. Does anyone know of a good website for large amperaged GEL batteries?
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Hi all,
Bought a volt meter this morning, tested the battery, got between 12 and 13v going through there so thats not the problem. Tested the voltage coming out of the varistream and thats the same. The pump is still making that fast clicking noise and not drawing anything through, and the varistream light is flickering green really fast. So its not the battery, and its not the varistream? Cant be the pump, thats new??
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Would it be a good idea to contact these people?
http://www.williamson-shop.co.uk/varistream-auto-compensating-pump-controller-48-p.asp
Williamson Pumps Ltd
Aviation House
The Street
Poynings
West Sussex
BN45 7AQ
Tel: 0845-226-3638
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Hi all,
Bought a volt meter this morning, tested the battery, got between 12 and 13v going through there so thats not the problem. Tested the voltage coming out of the varistream and thats the same. The pump is still making that fast clicking noise and not drawing anything through, and the varistream light is flickering green really fast. So its not the battery, and its not the varistream? Cant be the pump, thats new??
I had to replace a 75psi pump for a 100psi pump and my varistream was also flickering like mad when I first run the pump although I was getting water out of the pump despite it being eratic (fast....stop....fast....stop).
I think the varistream frequent monitoring/automatic compensation settings had been messed up by changing the pump from a 75psi to 100psi.
I simply let the pump run for a couple hours continuously back into the tank and it settled down to a smooth flow without the erratic behaviour.
Then I readjusted the blue dial inside the varistream so that I have a greater flow of water and it shuts off quickly.
I think when a pump has been playing up the varistream tries to compensate any adjustments so when a new pump is fitted the varistream is still running at the old compensating settings. Let it run continuosly for a few hours and see if the varistream settles down like mine did.
One last suggestion: if you have a non-return valve or stop connector fitted before the pump take it off as it could be the cause of the problem.
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Hi Dave, thanks for that. Gave Williamsons a call earlier on, had one of their sales managers call me back... he was mystified so was gonna get a more techie person to call me back. Will see what they say!! :)
Hi all,
Bought a volt meter this morning, tested the battery, got between 12 and 13v going through there so thats not the problem. Tested the voltage coming out of the varistream and thats the same. The pump is still making that fast clicking noise and not drawing anything through, and the varistream light is flickering green really fast. So its not the battery, and its not the varistream? Cant be the pump, thats new??
I had to replace a 75psi pump for a 100psi pump and my varistream was also flickering like mad when I first run the pump although I was getting water out of the pump despite it being eratic (fast....stop....fast....stop).
I think the varistream frequent monitoring/automatic compensation settings had been messed up by changing the pump from a 75psi to 100psi.
I simply let the pump run for a couple hours continuously back into the tank and it settled down to a smooth flow without the erratic behaviour.
Then I readjusted the blue dial inside the varistream so that I have a greater flow of water and it shuts off quickly.
I think when a pump has been playing up the varistream tries to compensate any adjustments so when a new pump is fitted the varistream is still running at the old compensation settings. Let it run continuosly for a few hours and see if the varistream settles down like mine did.
One last suggestion: if you have a non-return valve or stop connector fitted before the pump take it off as it could be the cause of the problem.
Hmmm.... thanks mate, will give it a try. When the original pump first started playing up it was bringing a small amount of water through every now and again so it might be worth it running it for a while..... will go start it going now and keep you all posted.
Thanks! :)
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I love this thread! The varistream blurb says that when you first set it up you should connect your pole etc, push the numpty in and make sure the green light is constant then turn the dial to max and wait ten seconds for the pump to gradually start working. If the pump has not started working after ten seconds then push the button again and wait another ten seconds.
It goes on stating the obvious things then says to check that the four wires are connected properly and that the pressure switch is NOT connected.
Trouble is it seems like your still at the flashing light stage??
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LOL it seems to be going on for a while doesnt it?? :P
Yeh I'm still at that stage. Thing is, it was working for 5 months before this without a hitch, WITH the pressure switch connected....
....cant shake the feeling I'm missing something REALLY obvious.....
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You haven't reversed the polarity at any time? Like swopped the clips on the battery terminals by accident? :)
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What if your pressure switch failed whilst it was connected would that mess things up? Anybody know?
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Could be, but this is a new pump.
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OK, bit of an update for anyone who is interested....
Tested my pump and varistream with a mates van the other day, no problems at all, everything ran. So looks like its a wiring problem. Connected the pump to the stereo supply in my van and it worked... then didnt, again. It works fine if I connect it DIRECTLY to the van battery, so it must be a problem somewhere between the battery and the pump. Dodgy earth somewhere??
For now, will just run a feed directly from the battery, stick a fuse in there and use that until I can afford to have the problem tracked a bit more precisely. Tis a good thing I was taking a couple of weeks off anyway :P