Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: r4g1t on November 08, 2007, 09:19:59 pm
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confronted a lad today who works for us, about going so slow whilst working.
he's a good w/c who usually works at a descent pace, his response was "we done a job this morning, it took an hour and you charge £80 for it, so why should we work at speed and make you even more money". needless to say i was livid.
so, now for the nitty gritty, on one hand he is usually an excellent worker loyal trustworthy and honest, but on the other i am not prepared to have anyone (apart from my wife) talk to me like that keep him or sack him, is there any other alternative, i have not thought about anything else since this incident....... any suggestions would be greatly appreciated
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make it an official verbal warning tell him if it happens again you wont be happy bunny
then sack the "cheeky little;D
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confronted a lad today who works for us, about going so slow whilst working.
he's a good w/c who usually works at a descent pace, his response was "we done a job this morning, it took an hour and you charge £80 for it, so why should we work at speed and make you even more money". needless to say i was f***ing livid.
so, now for the nitty gritty, on one hand he is usually an excellent worker loyal trustworthy and honest, but on the other i am not prepared to have anyone (apart from my wife) talk to me like that keep him or sack him, is there any other alternative, i have not thought about anything else since this incident....... any suggestions would be greatly appreciated
I am guessing you dont pay commision, if you dont why would he want to work to earn you more, add that as a bonus he will work his little socks off as it will be then worth it to him ;)
also say to him ever talk to me again that way and you will not be working for us again, I pay you to work
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Wait untill you can say it , but sometime when your paying him for work he hasn,t earn,t holidays/sick/ wet weather let him know its those times he,s earning more that you have to budget for him to have this holiday/sick wet weather money
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I don't employ, but at least he said it to you. Don't sack him good lads are hard to get. Give him a pep talk.
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Take time out and calm down ;) if you feel the same tomorrow, then give him a warning, verbal if no previous warnings.
Then if he does it a gain put your arm around his shoulder, walk him around the back of the property then kick the out of him ;D ;D Joking aside, I give respect to everyone but I demand it back, if someone shows me a lack of respect, I let them know my feelings, I try to do it so politly it tends to embarrass them. ;D
Good idea about the bonus scheme though.
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Put him on piece work, the more he speeds up the more he earns. If he is slow the less he earns.
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lol the lad is right though, he obviously hasnt realised he is better off without you yet i hope it starts his own round and tells you to stuff your job
you do realise slave labour was abolished??
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bonuses are the way forward, they work, they get paid well! they don't then no money!!!
i notice that these comments come out sometimes, as i've said before give a bit take a bit back, i put up with some sly comments but if they become to often then i become the boss and knock them down a peg or two, i still treat them with respect at all times though.
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lol the lad is right though, he obviously hasnt realised he is better off without you yet i hope it starts his own round and tells you to stuff your job
you do realise slave labour was abolished??
shhhh dont say that to loud my guys may here lol
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shhhh dont say that to loud my guys may here lol
lol
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lol the lad is right though, he obviously hasnt realised he is better off without you yet i hope it starts his own round and tells you to stuff your job
you do realise slave labour was abolished??
What a stupid comment!
many hours and many monnies go into working these rounds, my lot get paid very well, more than what a lot of people state they earn on this site, (i'm not knocking anyone on here just pointing out a fact)
if i employed someone with an attitude like yours i'd sack you.
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confronted a lad today who works for us, about going so slow whilst working.
he's a good w/c who usually works at a descent pace, his response was "we done a job this morning, it took an hour and you charge £80 for it, so why should we work at speed and make you even more money". needless to say i was livid.
so, now for the nitty gritty, on one hand he is usually an excellent worker loyal trustworthy and honest, but on the other i am not prepared to have anyone (apart from my wife) talk to me like that keep him or sack him, is there any other alternative, i have not thought about anything else since this incident....... any suggestions would be greatly appreciated
For this reason this is why i will for 1 or 2 months taking someone on supervise over them that way you know exactly how much work they sould do on a specific area in a day and if there not meeting your expectation then i would want to know why. But maybe they need that bonus incentive or maybe they still wont work hard enough for you. Its trial and error. But i would not tolerate any lip like that and would give him a verbal warning. In the meantime i would be looking for another worker cos the chances are it will happen again so you need to be prepared, they all think that there doing you a favour by working for you and you have to make them think differently. But it is a tough one i dont envy you. Good luck
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lol the lad is right though, he obviously hasnt realised he is better off without you yet i hope it starts his own round and tells you to stuff your job
you do realise slave labour was abolished??
What a stupid comment!
many hours and many monnies go into working these rounds, my lot get paid very well, more than what a lot of people state they earn on this site, (i'm not knocking anyone on here just pointing out a fact)
if i employed someone with an attitude like yours i'd sack you.
Here Here! apart from the slave labour bit i think i might be guilty of that at times!
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One other thing Everclean
I don't employ staff, but I would try my hardest, not to let them know what I charge for an account, at least there always in the dark as to what each job is worth, also makes it difficult for them to learn a pricing statergy.
Just a thought ;)
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Can't say I blame him.
I'd put sod-all effort in either.
What's in it for him if he works faster?
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would think you would be on "slippery" ground sacking him over this. Yous ay he normally is a good lad, perhaps he was having a bad day? Not defending him at all but we all get bad days. When you have calmed down, take him to one side and have a chat...explain that a certain % goes on wages and % on paid hols and just remind him that with xmas coming up, work rate throughout the year does have an affect on xmas bonuses etc. Would word it to the fact that you are prepared to overlook the atitude this time, but should this re-appear you will take normal disciplinary action. Hopefully he will be back to normal for you 2morrow. ;D
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sit him down and explain the economics of it to him
That 80 quid was one of our better paying jobs and of that eighty quid at least 30 is gone on insurance, petrol, equipment, that leaves 50
of that 50 I have to pay 10 in tax, that leaves 40
i had to spend an hour between getting the job scheduling it and dealing with any problems associated with the comopleted job so you only worked one hour and I worked 2
I paid you 15 quid which leaves me with 25 quid for 2 hours work so you actually made more than me
feel free to inflate the numbers even more if you pay him less ;D
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It's only a matter of time until he realises he could work for himself earning more, (I did, after working for someone else for 3months). The good ones normally leave and start up on their own and the crap ones either get the sack or remain with you until the end of time :)
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We have got used to all antics of staff, although at times we would like to sack the lot, (we now try to laugh about it at the end of the day :)
We know we have always paid well and treated well anyone that has worked for us....we have shown patience to the not so quick to pick it up people, we have shown support to the people that have experienced out of work problems, we have bitten lips and gritted teeth at some comments and abuse thrown at us and we have more than nurtured some that seemingly would have benefited our business in some way.
Present staff excepted (we'll wait and see!) all that have gone before have in some way dented our belief that if you treat someone right then they treat you the same way back!The one thing that gets to us most....lies..... why bother lying, just be honest, you always get found out anyway.
We use a timesscale with staff and not one has differed from it!(If they have stayed that long!)
1-2 months - full of enthusiasm and working well
3-4 months - enthusiasm waning a little, think they know it all, will do things their own way and get it wrong!"
5-6 months - think they own the business and start "telling" us
7-8 months (if not sacked at 6months!) - realise that we do know best and yes they are being paid and treated well and yes hmmm this is quite a good job afterall! :)
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i have someone working with me. The better we do the more money he gets.
If i see he has worked hard and by 2:00 we earn more money then usual i pay him more money than usual for less time, but it also it works the other way around. Sometimes he has to work longer for less money. ...... as my dad always its swings and roundabouts!
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It's only a matter of time until he realises he could work for himself earning more, (I did, after working for someone else for 3months). The good ones normally leave and start up on their own and the crap ones either get the sack or remain with you until the end of time :)
or the crap ones leave because they think they know how to do the job better and run a business, then go and work in a cafe 6 months after starting up as they thought it would be easy and they now dont get that wage everyweek that used to get and have to pay all the bills including tax insurance ect ect ;).
p.s wayne that was in no way aimed at you, just was making a point that some people just cant work for themself and it is not as easy as people make out ;)
but good on you aswell ;)
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I would expect that an employee should give his/her best efforts each and every hour they work in exchange for the hourly rate they recieve, anything less is stealing and I would dock his pay. I would never explain the costs of running a business in all its details to an employee if they can't figure it out (insurance, vehicles, equipment, uniform, marketing, websites, phone costs, accountants etc) then they are far to thick, and will only wreck my head over other issues. Get rid of him because if he is brave enough or stupid enough to say this to you up front imagine what he is saying behind your back to the clients and anyone else who is listening. Good ridence.
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I think that being a w/c is a great job...here I am at 13.35 on a Friday and all finished...happy days ;D
I work as a sole trader and frankly didn't find it at all hard to build up a worthwhile business.
Not being funny but anybody who has, in Hercule Poirot's immortal words got a bit of "grey matter" would never consider being employed as a window cleaners "lad".
I find it sad that there's people out there who despite years of education still haven't enough savvy to cobble together their own round.
But these people do exist...and scarily...they breed!!!
Everclean: Use him whilst he's making a profit for you and when he doesn't tell the no-hoper to sling his hook...and don't have any conscience as he'll soon find other work such as a brickies mate or sweeper-upper in Micky D's.
Simon
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I find it sad that there's people out there who despite years of education still haven't enough savvy to cobble together their own round.
Agree it is sad, but there are people out there who can build a round, it's whether they can run and sustain a viable business or not that makes the difference!
:) :)
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
you forgot the first and most important thing
0) build a website, if not contact WW :P :P
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i had a guy ( 19yr old boy ) like this the other year , very good worker , if a bit immature !
he left to work for someone who paid MUCH more , percentage / commission etc ,
however although he was worked very hard , taken to far away areas , the boss didnt have enough regular work , so he had many extra unpaid days off , sometimes had trouble getting all his wages and was soon fired for no real fault of his own . so over the same period he would have earnt more from me , without having to break his neck and worry about getting paid.
he was then out of work for over a year , and kept phoning asking for work !!
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
Not everyone can run a business or even want to so they go into employment do the work go home and at the end of the week get paid some people prefer this
Also this job is or can be boring and monotonous so motivation is the main problem for all of us employed or self employed
Dean
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
Not everyone can run a business or even want to so they go into employment do the work go home and at the end of the week get paid some people prefer this
No it isn't rocket science and that is exactly my point, yes your list Simon to a certain extent is right, but there is so much more to running a business, like record keeping, accounts etc etc. Most of the people we have employed wouldn't have had a clue about the admin side yet none of them have been particularly unintelligent :)
Dean you are spot on, not everyone wants their own businessm, It really can be hard work!
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Problem is sacking could result in him starting up himself and nicking work of you
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EVERCLEAN WHERE ARE YOU?
We are all waiting to hear what happened with him today? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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If i was this lad, i'd be prepareing to set up my own round & take some of your customers. thinking that with those margins i can easily under-cut you & still make a cracking wage. screw working for you anymore for just ?? per hour. ;)
tony
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
Not everyone can run a business or even want to so they go into employment do the work go home and at the end of the week get paid some people prefer this
No it isn't rocket science and that is exactly my point, yes your list Simon to a certain extent is right, but there is so much more to running a business, like record keeping, accounts etc etc. Most of the people we have employed wouldn't have had a clue about the admin side yet none of them have been particularly unintelligent :)
Dean you are spot on, not everyone wants their own businessm, It really can be hard work!
Yes OK the admin side is tedious and needs to be kept on top of...but again it isn't massively difficult if you're prepared to apply yourself.
I'm just of the opinion that I'd sooner go the extra mile and earn £25ph (yeah I know I'm cheap cheap cheap...but that's down to me) rather than be employed in what ,let's face it, is a pretty unskilled job and earn £10-£15ph.
Anyway, who am I to judge?...each unto their own as long as they're content with life is my motto ;D
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To be honest makes me think twice on expanding as means taking people on.
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I would expect that an employee should give his/her best efforts each and every hour they work in exchange for the hourly rate they recieve, anything less is stealing and I would dock his pay. I would never explain the costs of running a business in all its details to an employee if they can't figure it out (insurance, vehicles, equipment, uniform, marketing, websites, phone costs, accountants etc) then they are far to thick, and will only wreck my head over other issues. Get rid of him because if he is brave enough or stupid enough to say this to you up front imagine what he is saying behind your back to the clients and anyone else who is listening. Good ridence.
Good God !!
I'm a self-employed sole trader and I don't always work my hardest 100% of the time so I wouldn't expect an employee to do that for me. I would expect a reasonable degree of effort though and to be able to make a reasonable profit over and above what he/she costs me.
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
Honestly Helen this isn't rocket science...is it?
you forgot the first and most important thing
0) build a website, if not contact WW :P :P
good point Matt ;)
for anyone that does not know the ww stands for windowwashers.co.uk ;D
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I see where you're coming from but surely the the two go hand-in-hand?
1) Find customer.
2) Clean windows
3) Go back at agreed intervals
4)Clean windows again....
....and so on and on and on and on...
buy some PL insurance
keep a list of jobs you do each week
keep receipts
phone an accountant once a year
pay bills
still not really rocket science i don't think??
But it's true that there are many who can't be bothered with motivating themselves and would rather work for someone else.
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MOST MECHANICS ARE AWARE OF THE AMMOUNT PER HOUR THAT THE CUSTOMER GETS CHARGED. YET VERY FEW LEAVE TO START ON THIER OWN.
IF THIS LAD IS AS GOOD AS YOU SAY I WOULD REVIEW HIS WAGES. LEFT, HIS UNHAPPINESS WILL SPREAD TO THE OTHERS. GOOD STAFF ARE HARD TO FIND. MONKEYS WORK FOR PEANUTS.
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Ya The Shiner, I was a bit literal there, what I mean is that a reduction from his normal work effort within the time frame rather than he must work every minute. It would be nice if it was possible though :)
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2 years ago I could have been that lad that you mention.
I was in his position, worked flat out somedays for an hourly wage, really started getting me down and was getting home exhausted. I had enough of that grey matter to realise I could do better on my own, now if there had been bonuses, incentives for working harder, I may not have quit and gone self employed as it was hard starting from scratch but 2 years on I'm smiling, well most of the time :D
Is he that cheeky? well only you can really decide that or know if your paying him a decent wage for what he does. In my case I got no sick pay other than statutory after 3 days, bank holidays came out of my 20 days annual leave and if I could'nt work due to the weather or a lack of work recieved no pay. On top of all that I did quotes and debt collected and fixed equipment/vehicle so in the end it was a no brainer!
I'm not wishing to sound critical of others here just pointing out that the minds of an employer and an employee will always have different perspectives and I can see where the lads coming from and having been there can sympathise with him to an extent.
Simon
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It makes me laugh how these lads think,your getting all the money and your only paying me X,go out on your own then.I`ve got absolutly no time for this way of thinking,if it`s that bad leave making comments to me like that would only get him sacked,they only seem to think like this in our job you hear of people thinking these things but to come out and say it i would have been boiling,that`s it now he`s shown his colours and what type of a person he is start looking.At the end of the day he working for your business under your name as an employee,he knows the score what he gets at the end of the week and i would say if he`s not happy give him a swift kick up th A*** down the road,sack him and he`ll be delivering your post next month or dropping your spares off for DHL LOL.
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Got to say, good for him and he will go far ;D ;D. he realises his worth to you and you know he is honest and does a good job. If he was crap then he should be gone.
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It dosen`t mean he will go far,he`s just a jealous resentfull idiot.
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Ive read all these posts but no ones asked....Everclean how much do you pay the lad a day and for how many hours? and on an average day how much does this cheeky tw@t earn for you?
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What right does that give him to come out with that kind of comment to his employer.
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faster you clean faster you ern ;D plus faster you clean cheaper then the next wc ;D ::) confushur snatch the squeegee from my hand ;D master
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like john lenon said let it be let it be
i say let it be but mark his card.......................
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;D be one step ahead ::) ;) ;D move forward
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I would never see that lad in the same eyes again.
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Obviously the mans not happy, he may well be greedy or a man with a hard luck story that thinks hes owed a living. Only you know what type of man he is.
However a fact of life is that your business and its continued success is dependent on the quality of the work you produce for the money you charge. A man has to feel valued at his job for you to get the best from him.
You cannot expect a man to work that bit harder or do those extra jobs to earn you more if he is no better off financially. And if hes on a basic wage with no incentive I THINK THE FAULT WITH THIS SITUATION LIES WITH THE EMPLOYER.
Provided hes good at his job and looks after your customers well then he should be rewarded for his commitment to your business and the value HE adds to it. HIs value is directly related to the ammount of revenue he generates for you from HAPPY customers.
If he is a man who cares about nothing then he shouldnt be working for you in the first place.
Mark
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i think minimum wage equals minimum effort, certain big companies agree with this and provide decent wages and better conditions for their staff. it has been proved that this increases productivity, less sick days and more empoyee pride in the company.
many people have had enough of making thier boss richer and gone alone, some have failed some do very well. look after staff good ones are hard to get keeping them may be harder