Clean It Up

UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Peter_Blackburn on September 24, 2004, 12:50:17 am

Title: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on September 24, 2004, 12:50:17 am

Hi all,

I hope someone can help me on this one......

My normal quarterly BT phone bill usually equates to around the £120 mark per quarter so you can imagine how I felt tonight after a hard days C/C to receiving a bill for £820!!!!!!!!! , I almost choked to death on beans on toast.

On studying the bill in more detail £734 has accured on the section of the bill named 'Premium Rate' and the calls have spanned from the 16th Aug through to the 22nd Aug (one week of solid calls) and all the numbers start 09099 followed by differing selection of last numbers.

What is confusing is all the calls were made when nobody was home and the duration of the calls is in a regular pattern of 13mins and 50 mins, which was clocking up costs of £75 per call :o!!!.

The thing that is of great concern to me is that around the August period whist browsing the Internet I was confronted with the usual annoying pop up for a Casino or something, on trying to close the pop up I must have pressed the wrong part of the box which in turn opened up there site, once on the site the pop ups were coming so quick and regular within a few seconds the task bar at the bottom of the screen was full and as I was closing them more and more were appearing to the point where the computer was swamped.

The only thing I could think to do at the time was switch off the computer. On rebooting the computer and attempting to hook up to the net I was baffled to find out the number in the dial-up connection box had changed from the regular freserve number to one I have never seen before and there was also no dial up tone that you normally get.

When I connect onto Internet I get a red flashing light on my phone which sits next to the computer and lets you know the line is connected, during the period in question I would often come home to find the red light flashing even when the computer was not switched on and would switch off after a period of time, scary!!.

Does anyone know what has happened to me and more importantly will I have to pay this absurd bill.

Regards
Peter

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: martin19842 on September 24, 2004, 01:05:32 am

there has been an issue in the south , where a new type of program has been downloaded onto people pcs through pop ups etc,

where the program will turn off the pc's speakers, and then dials out.

if your pc, has a soft power down, there is the possibility that the pc has hibernated then started up again and connected.

i would speak to bt and the ombudsman to see what can be done.

in another case a gang were hacking the systems and then running up the bills.

hope  that helps

regards

martin

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: John_Flynn on September 24, 2004, 01:11:06 am

Your calling my Consumer Information line!!!

Much better money spinner than Carpet Cleaning 8) 8) 8) ::) ::) 8) 8) 8)

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: jacko on September 24, 2004, 01:40:54 am

The same has happened to me to the tune of £35 all 09099 or 09066 numbers. I found a dialer in my registry - came from a pop up i believe.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: paulchambers on September 24, 2004, 02:07:17 am

I had my phone ring at 2 am a few times i phoned bt how told me its calls from abroad trying to get into peoples pc's where spyware and adware(popups) have got into pc and then it dails a preminium rate i was told to buy a program to stop spy and adware i havnt done this and i get popups all  the time which i shut done straight away.

thinking about it not sure if my pc  can ring out,  as i got a router and ethernet card not not a dail up modem

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on September 24, 2004, 02:33:02 am

Thanks for the feedback guys,

Its frightening to think that by accidentally opening a pop up it could potentially cost you thousands of pounds, Im quite lookey because I had windows 2000 installed about a week after the problems, so all applications were reinstalled along with the new Internet connection, I have predicted the bill would have been in the region of £6400 if I did nothing.


Jacko

Did you have to pay the £35?.

Pete

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on September 24, 2004, 03:32:05 am

Sound like Im not alone this was taken from the net....


The numbers racket costing you a fortune

It is popping up everywhere - a major scam that makes your PC dial into costly premium rate phone lines. With consumer losses estimated at up to £10m a year Rupert Jones reports after having to fallen prey to this latest rip-off himself

Saturday July 3, 2004
The Guardian

Thousands of internet users are being ripped off to the tune of millions of pounds after falling victim to the latest scam to hit the web. It involves "secret" software that worms its way into people's computers and makes your PC dial up expensive premium rate numbers without your knowledge.
This new hi-tech con trick has snowballed alarmingly in recent weeks. It's something people only become aware of when they receive their bills -and discover to their horror they have racked up huge costs they were not aware of and didn't agree to.

The scam involves a crafty piece of software which surreptitiously replaces your usual internet connection with one that dials a premium rate number typically charging £1.50 a minute. Some people have been hit with bills for more than £1,000.

Britain's premium rate watchdog, Icstis, is deeply concerned and admits it has been "overwhelmed" by the scale of the problem. This week MPs called for urgent action from the industry and government to stamp it out, while BT announced some positive steps to combat the problem.

Here, Jobs & Money reveals how the scam works, the steps you can take to avoid being had, and what the companies and authorities are doing to tackle so-called rogue diallers.

Unfortunately, much of this wisdom has been acquired as a result of having to spend the past few days trying to sort out my own mess. I'm one of those who has been hit, and from my inquiries it sounds like there are a lot of us about.

More info at - http://money.guardian.co.uk/scamsandfraud/story/0,13802,1252835,00.html

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: stevegunn on September 24, 2004, 09:48:26 am

Downloads available to stop this available from http://www.download.com/

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Fox on September 24, 2004, 10:33:15 am

Another way to stop this is to call BT and ban all 09 numbers from being dialed out on your line.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: John_McGavin on September 24, 2004, 11:28:05 am

Sorry Peter, but I think you will need to pay the bill mate :(

A friend of mine had a similar problem, not with his pc but his sky digibox. There was a software problem in his box which caused it to dial up to verify the time every hour. result - HUGE BILL!

He ended up having to pay the bill then take it up with Sky, but unfortunately as its your computer theres not really anything you can do about it. No-one to blame so to speak.

Hope Im wrong.. Good luck

John

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: jacko on September 24, 2004, 12:00:10 pm

Hi Peter

I have already paid it as i pay by Direct Debit. I have recently moved to wannado broadband and hope this will stop the issue. When not using pc i disconnect. When i am connected any "dialling" should be obvious.

I cannot see me getting my £35 back even if i tried!

I hope you can get yours back mate.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: paulchambers on September 24, 2004, 01:54:19 pm

Can anyone tell me if my ethernet card is able to dail out

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: gwrightson on September 24, 2004, 02:49:24 pm

peter , sorry about your unfortunate hacking into your computer, a big problem at the moment .
onlyyesterday i was talking to some body who recieved
a bill for £800 and odd   .
he got intouch with local phone comp, which is kingston communications in our area (a law unto themselves,they have us by the short and curlys in every aspect of communications) and apparently large number of consumers in his area same problem all large bills .
not a thing they can do they told him. Has to pay,although he is refusing, so no idea what outcome will be .
having said all this  a good precaution i find ,is to constantly monitor your dial up number when on computer, click on to dial up connection, click properties
. this will display the number you are currently connected too , hope it helps in future
geoff

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Jamie Wiles on September 24, 2004, 02:59:17 pm

Paul, an ethernet card is completely different from a modem card and does not contain hardware required to make a telephone call, unless it is some sort of combination modem/ethernet card in which case it will have two sockets on the back, one for the RJ45 category 5 network cable and one for a telephone line.

The absolute best piece of software that I have used for getting rid of adware and spyware is Lavasoft Ad-Aware. You can download the personal version free from http://www.lavasoft.de. In my opinion, everyone should have a copy....

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: eclipse on September 24, 2004, 03:00:12 pm

can this still happen with adsl broadband i ask this because there have been a few nights when i have been in bed and the upstairs phone peeps !!

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: John_Flynn on September 24, 2004, 03:30:15 pm

Very Serious with this reply :o :o :o

A few years ago I was told to ring a 09000 number regarding a loan, this was a scam as I was put on hold for long periods whilst checks were been done, I became suspisous and hung up, the following day I received a call from my telecom supplier NTL asking if I knew I had made a £26.00 call the previous day, I replied I suspected so. I had to pay.

I got the number from NTL that I had rung, then rang Oftel and reported the matter, this was followed up by Oftel, the persons concerned ended up  with a very hefty fine.

I now NEVER call a 09000 number (although some days I get the urge to speak with BUSTY MAGGIE!!)

These dialers cannot call out on Broadband.

The dialers only get onto your PC when you allow them to by been inquizitive about what they are offering!!

Beware Big Brother is watching.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dennis on September 24, 2004, 03:58:03 pm

Now some BT customers are saying that unless the company gets tough with the rogue premium-rate operators they may take it to court for failing to protect them from the scams. Barry Borman, a solicitor from North London, says: ";I think that, by doing nothing about a phone scam of which it is aware, BT is failing to exercise a proper duty of care towards its customers. If there are enough of us we could mount a court action against the company.";

Martin Cross, a partner with Thomas Eggar, a firm of South East solicitors, says: ";It may well be time for the law to consider a duty of care to the users of telephone highways.";

A spokesman for BT says: ";We receive 6p per minute for each premium-rate call carried over our network. There is now an element of arguably criminal activity relating to rogue diallers taking place, but this is not within BT's power to cure without formal orders from Icstis or another regulatory body. With most overseas premium-rate numbers we do not even know who the operators are.

From:
http://www.business.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,9076-1133244,00.html

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dusty on September 24, 2004, 04:14:25 pm

You’re not alone this is a common problem being discussed here…

http://forums.techguy.org/showthread.php?t=224491&page=1&pp=15

Cut and paste your original post from the top of page here…

http://forums.techguy.org/f54-s.html

…and they will check your system for any dodgy programmes you may have running in the background.

Also you will be able to download FREE spyware removal tools (ad-aware, Spybot search & destroy) with confidence as the experts there will tell you exactly how to configure the said software correctly and then check that your system is clean with a little programme called “highjackthis”.

You can also ring your telephone company and have a premium rate number ban placed on your line.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: paulchambers on September 24, 2004, 04:20:09 pm

Another scam to watch out for is the phone rings and you get a recorded messege saying you have won a prize and to press 9 when you press 9 your phone automatically rings the 0900 number. The cost is yours.   paul

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Martin Sambrook on September 24, 2004, 06:40:18 pm

A tip for people with broadband connections. Remove your dial up modem from your pc (not needed if you have an ADSL modem) then goto your internet settings and under 'connections' enable 'Never dial a connection'.

Also in the connections box you will see the connection that you use, any others could have been put there by hackers or other downloaded programs so just remove them as you dont want them there.

And make sure you have a firewall, antivirus and pop up controls. Then do as i do and regularly check your internet connection for any abnormalities.

Hope this helps

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: eclipse on September 24, 2004, 09:05:37 pm

where popups are concerned i would reccomend pop up manager which is downloadable form the link below also i have installed adaware and spybot search and destroy which are available form http://www.download.com
the link for pop up blocker is  http://www.endpopups.com i alway run both spybot and adaware after every web session

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on September 25, 2004, 12:55:21 am

Hello Again,

Spent all day tracking the people responsible for my huge bill, I also had a bit of help from a regular customer who owns a telecommunications business.

After many phone calls and a lot of perseverance I have managed to track the criminals or should I say criminal from the apparently unused two buildings in Mallorca in Spain through to the UK.

All my efforts have proved fruitful -  I now have a name, a name of a small business, the address, a post code, a telephone number, a e-mail address and ironically a web site explaining how to avoid been hacked.

Should I be contacting the Police at this point?. Im a little unsure where to take it from this point.

PS... Has anyone done any C/C in City Road in London :o :o

Thanks
Pete  

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: John_Flynn on September 25, 2004, 01:06:41 am

Ofcom (they have inherited Oftel) are the people you should contact, it worked for me!! ;D ;D ;D

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/contact_ofcom/?a=87101

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Len Gribble on September 25, 2004, 01:09:23 am

Give info to the police and let them decide! Sadly they probably cant help as hands are tried!


Not in city road red route but just round the corner.

Len

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dusty on September 25, 2004, 02:18:42 pm

Peter,

Name and shame um then!

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on September 25, 2004, 06:24:40 pm

Dusty,

   The business is now under investigation, so not at liberty to divulge.

It looks as though I definitely wont see my money again :'(. Things are so immensely complicated in regards to the systems they apparently use that any governing body such as oftel are unable to trace without any solid evidence.

Even the kind chap who owns the communications business who helped me with my enquires was unable to understand the web site and the terminology used.

I really wish I could take these parasites out Carpet Cleaning and show them how much work is involved in generating £700.00 legitimately, I hope and pray they live a life of misery forever.


Peter

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dynafoam on September 25, 2004, 07:42:54 pm

Quote

I hope and pray they live a life of misery forever.

I'll second that, for all thieving, parasitic, low-life scum-bags - may thier genitals turn to lead and melt, slowly.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dusty on September 25, 2004, 08:04:28 pm

Peter,

Haven't you heard we have a thing called freedom of speech in this country, if you are ripped off by criminals you have the right to say what you like about them.

Did you read any of that link I posted in an earlier post where the public are openly talking about being riped off by scam merchants called National One Telecom...it may be an american site but thieves like this operate on an international scale and it's only the power of the people that can bring them to justice.

Have you installed a firewall? Zone Alarm do a FREE one and anti-spyware programmes ad-aware SE and spybot Search and destroy are also free

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dusty on September 25, 2004, 08:21:44 pm

Found this

http://www.bt.com/premiumrates/

Text from the above link

If you have received a BT telephone bill with premium rate calls that you do not recognise, the Independent Committee for the Supervision of Standards of Telephone Information Services, (ICSTIS), have a web site that can be accessed on www.icstis.org.uk . This will also help you to check the most commonly queried premium rate (090) numbers. ICSTIS is the premium rate services 'watchdog' and regulates the content and promotion of services. . This web site provides details of those Internet Dialler services under investigation, usually with the contact details of the company that operates the service. Not all 090 numbers are internet dialler related. The vast majority provide access to information, entertainment or TV games services.

If you wish to dispute a particular premium rate call charge, please contact BT on 150 or 0800 800 150, (a free call from BT fixed lines), where your call will be handled by our specialist team. In the event that we believe that the charge is a result of an errant dialler, we will still ask you to pay the BT bill in full, however, BT will allow some extra time for payment to be made. We recommend that you check the ICSTIS web site to see whether the Internet Dialler service is under investigation. Where no such investigation is underway, we recommend that you register your enquiry with ICSTIS using the online facility on www.icstis.org.uk. ICSTIS do operate a free helpline for customers who have complaints about the content and promotion of premium rate services. The freefone number for ICSTIS is 0800 500 212 and operates 09:00 to 16:00 Monday to Friday. This number gets very busy so using the online service is possibly the best option.

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Dusty on September 26, 2004, 03:02:45 pm

Peter, yours is one of the biggest bills i've seen mentioned on various forums. I think that ICSTIS will be very proactive in your case.

Have you checked your numbers against their lists of numbers under investigation?

Telecom one ltd appears on the ICSTIS website but it looks like they are just one of the network cogs, not the actual thieving webcrooks that put the dialer on your computer.

Good luck

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on October 26, 2004, 12:09:17 pm

Hi,

    Sent a very professional headed letter back in September to the cyber crooks who ripped me off. I enclosed a copy of my phone bill and in the letter I demanded a cheque for said amount and made it clear that if payment was not received within 15 days the matter would be reported to the ICSTIS and Oftel, I also made it clear that the matter would also be put into the hands of our legal department ;) ;).

So what's the verdict to this letter received from them this morning....


(http://www.cleantalk.co.uk/pics/1098787739.JPG)

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: John_Flynn on October 26, 2004, 12:17:31 pm

They forgot to tell you that when they get your Bank Details

They will clear out your account

![/b]![/color]

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on October 26, 2004, 12:18:09 pm

Ps... They now have all my account details, AC number, Sort code, Issue number. So im sure the matter will be rectified fairly shortly. ;D ;D ;D


Daft but not stupid
Peter ;D

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: Peter_Blackburn on November 20, 2004, 12:45:32 pm

Hi,

     Just thought some of you would be interested in the outcome.

Was informed by the Halifax bank that 'no money could be drawn from my account' if the details shown on the above letter were given to the said company and was also informed that it was a standard procedure for a international bank transfer.

The result - fully reimbursed Wednesday morning :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) and a letter of apology from the perpetrators this morning begging me to contact BT and explain them that I was reimbursed without hindrance.

Last month I heard on the Working Lunch TV program that BT revoked 50 communication companies world wide of there premium rate service licences, I wonder if this could have had something to do with it. Its reassuring to know that BT have taken the matter of illegal diallers very serious and have taken a very positive step in cracking down on these criminals.

Anyway can go out tonight wearing a very large grin on my face, it just goes to show that crime never pays.  ;) 

***************The End*********************

IVE GOT MY MONEY BACK!! ;D ;D ;D
Pete ;)

Title: Re: Phone Bill!!!!!
Post by: rob_s on November 20, 2004, 06:27:54 pm

Dear pete,
       The same thing happened to me on a smaller scale two months ago.
BT, at no extra cost,  have put a block on all premium rate calls going out.
     You can check your bill any time on automation, ring 0800 103301.


    Regards  rob-s.