Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: boshravie on June 08, 2007, 08:07:51 am
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Hi guys
Well, I had one of these All TEC marketing posted to me the other day, it sound good, but I am wondering how many of us cleaning guys in Great Britain have really tried these marketing’s and is it really working for some people?
I know that not every one has that drive to be so successful in these marketing, but I like to know if those of you which have tried and have the drive to be successful has really made thousands and thousands of pounds.
Your reply would be appreciated.
Bosh
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best money i've ever spent, if your really serious about growing your business then this is a gret start
others may disagree and have a better way in which case im sure they will share there secrets.
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about 8 or 9 c/cers in my area have done fast track, only one has been a success story, so the odds are not that great.
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It's all about the individuals Drive / Desire / Focus, etc..................there's an old saying............you can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink !
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what is your area chrisg?
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why isn't Robert Saunders living on his own personal island, drinking tequilas, and making love to a bevvy of beautiful woman?
surely if he practiced what he preached he would already be living the ideal lifestyle, does he clean carpets? has he got a successful carpet cleaning company which uses his ideas and is mega successful.
how can he advice us how to build a great carpet cleaning company which runs like clockwork and requires little attention from us the owner when he has'nt done the same thing with his business.
now if I'm wrong I apologize, but it looks like to me he has been selling a dream for as longs as I've been a carpet cleaner, he's had enough time to reach financial success but still is flogging his marketing stuff.
Mike
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Interesting that the coach has a coach.
Marketing is something that takes time and money to fine tune and also experiment with. Most cleaners havent got both.
So Alltec will tell you what to do and give you the hardcopy to use. If it works for others than why not you.
Ive the full fast track programme but it hasent worked for me, WHY, because ive never put it into practice. Thats my fault for not making the time.
Mark
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PS. I would like to know what their new referral system is as more referrals is never a bad thing.
Mark
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why isn't Robert Saunders living on his own personal island, drinking tequilas, and making love to a bevvy of beautiful woman?
surely if he practiced what he preached he would already be living the ideal lifestyle, does he clean carpets? has he got a successful carpet cleaning company which uses his ideas and is mega successful.
how can he advice us how to build a great carpet cleaning company which runs like clockwork and requires little attention from us the owner when he has'nt done the same thing with his business.
now if I'm wrong I apologize, but it looks like to me he has been selling a dream for as longs as I've been a carpet cleaner, he's had enough time to reach financial success but still is flogging his marketing stuff.
Mike
well he's got the girl from the cleaning show!!!
As for a personal island thats for the weak, someone told me the other day that i live in my own little world ( now there flash for you!)
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any one fancy posting that picture agian, as she was easy on the eye.
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cant believe people are still being sucked into this stuff, we are getting lots of reports from customers who receive their brochures, that they were put off by the advertising, ie bad mouthing other cleaning companies, and over inflated prices putting them off even phoning other companies, also once the customer has made contact for a quote, the fastracker will not leave them alone, constant phone calls sometimes daily to try and book the job, i think that is wrong, sure follow it up but dont pressurise, fastrack may work for the odd 1 or 2 here and there, but in the long run the way they push themselves to potential customers is becoming damaging for all of us.
concentrate on running a professional, honest bussiness and dont be greedy.
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Think some of the fast track stuff is good,ive used lots of it to my advantage over the past couple of years. :D
Would say know though that it is getting a bit old hat now and too many are doing it. ::)
Just look in your yellow pages. ;)
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Hi
For me the Dream changes every year so is never attainable.
Dave
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If anyone is interested in what the marketing side of Fast Track is about it COULD be a good buy.
Most of the Strategies
Chance to talk it over with the man himself.
Lot less than paying £3500
What I would like to see is follow up care when you get home you try the ideas but they do not according to plan or they do go according to plan.
I remember doing part of the Mini Coaching Programme Years ago.
Did not fully benefit as it concentrated on old Customers and I was a newbie but I thought the monthly phone in was very helpful
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PS. I would like to know what their new referral system is as more referrals is never a bad thing.
Mark
I belive on there satisfaction questionaire at the bottom it ask's for three names address's tels number of friends the client belives would benifit from our service. in return, if there friends does use you, you reward them with a tenner.
opps have i just let the cat out the bag :o
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whos been to one, do you actually learn whats said?
as i have a seminar CD from the states, and you really learn nothing its more about convincing you to join platnam boot camp (US fast track)
it goes on about what you will learn in the boot camp, but does not give it away at the seminaire, like it advertises it would.
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Hi Guys
From what I have seen and heard of FT, the main benefit seems to in having a marketing strategy and sticking to it.
Other main benefit is pricing high enough to actually have a business rather than a job.
Cheers
Doug
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The only thing that surprises me about the Alltec set up, is their failure to become Internet marketers, particularly, when you consider, that others are already using the internet to rip them off,
It's one of todays " must have's " the idea that you simply must .............have a T/M, or Triple Vac portable, or access to a marketing Guru.
The reality is, most of, or at least, much of, the Ideas, Suggestions, etc, have been around for nearly a hundred years ( no I'm not that old ) and are within the public domain.
What Robert Saunders and others, in various industries do, is to get people, who are good at something, to learn how to market their product, or service.
There are dozens of extremely talented people in this industry, who are excellent carpet cleaners, who give superb service to their clients.................but simply can't get their head around the basic principals of marketing.
If someone can give such people, the Confidence, the Focus, the Motivation, to change what they're doing and adopt a proven formula, which will increase, possibly double their income, or even more, they are providing a valuable service and a service which will benefit the industry, generally.
However.............I have been aware of an 80 / 20 situation that exits in human behaviour, which dictates, that, out of 100 people who receive " information "that could benefit them, only 20 will do anything about it and the rest, will continue to do what they did before.
Not only that, because out of the 20, only 20% of them, that's just 4 will stick to the " game plan "and these are the ones who will " just do it!"rather than complain or moan.
Out of the 4% who become the " fully fledged " marketers, they won't all charge the same, some will aim for the top end prices and others will be happy to work in the middle price range, but, because they have the tools and the motivation, they will be as busy as the want to be.
So, you will be given the tools, the confidence, the motivation, but...................it's then up to you, to make it work !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I suppose it depends on what you put into it. My own personal opinion is that Robert teaches secondhand Joe Polish stuff, You can get all that and more from Piranha Marketing direct so I can not see much point in him in the first place.
Anyway he does'nt practice what he preaches as I emailed hom many years ago for a price on a professional plus and never got a reply. Needless to say he made no sale.
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As long as you can offer THE DEEPEST CLEAN YOU HAVE EVER SEEN OR YOUR ONEY BACK to liitle old ladies you'll be fine. However you must make them fully understand that it is not save for them to enter their house until you have cleaned the carpets or else they might get eaten by dustites! And of course if a stain re-appears you will come back and clean it for free, after they have paid you £950 for a 12x12 lounge.
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Many thanks guys.
In my business I am using lots of marketing system. I just thought they might be any new ideas that they do.
I appreciate your comments.
Bosh
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look outside carpet cleaning for ideas and convert them to fit and you'll be fresh all the time, one step ahead
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That's precicely what JP's been doing for years with RS'S collaboration, There's nothing NEW in marketing just ideas and strategies that have been around for a century!
I bought the original Piranha package about 12 years ago, but was disappointed to find I had already aquired the knowledge through many years of sales / marketing programs in retail.
However, if someone becomes motivated, or focussed as a result of reading / attending a marketing programme, then it's an investment
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You are so right IANHAPER
I always look at the big boys like (Coca cola, Mac Donald) and so on.
They spend billions of pounds every year on marketing and if we all pick up some of
Their ideas for FREE we can all be in to a winner.
Bosh
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My advice to you on All Tec is this: I received all the Marketing stuff from All tec some time ago. I work in the creative industry as well as the Cleaning industry and liase with Marketing companies daily as well as our own 12 strong in house team.
I met Mr Saunders at a course I attended he gave a demo of his "out of this world truck mounted cleaner. I will not bad mouth him and say some of the things he done. there was 30-40 people on the course so some of you out there no what I am talking about!
My main point is this I received his CD of his phone converstion with Martin Riley a superstar from Devon! On the course there was a guy there who knew Mr Saunders, and as Mr Saunders asked this guy questions he replied with perfect answers and figures that would make you interested in his products! The catch is this- it was staged and rehersed the questions and answers were near enough exactly the same as on the "CD" and it was obvious that they had rehersed this to near perfection several times
One other observation this guy was supposed to be an independent cleaner just comming to give us his views and support on the industry and All Tec! While Mr Saunders was giving the demo his phone rang which he gave to this guy to answer as if he was his PA my point was proven they work closely together make what you want of it? "I know what I did" It is not worth the £s unless you have £ss that you can afford to loose. All the info and better is out there cheaper if not free it is all about you applying your self to what you want i will tell you this you will need a lot of motivation and focus
Maybe some people are successful from Mr Saunders scheme but every bit of information he gives is available for free on numerous sites and from individuals including Mr Harper on this site, Chris Cardel and 100's of others just Google it! with his blogs etc and Joe Polish who Mr Saunders bases his marketing on! Have a good look and investigate more. the time spent investigstigating and researching will save you thousands of pounds but if you want to try the get rich quick scheme feel free to. Don't want to bad mouth Mr Saunders business I am just telling you the truth of what I have seen and know of all Tec at first hand.
Kind regards
Letzclean
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Letzclean
If you are such an expert, aware , on the ball, sort of person, you should be capable of researching and discovering the origins of the marketing package you're writing about.
First of all plageurism, is, in true terms, THEFT
You should be well aware, but perhaps you're not, that the origins of the F/T marketing, is the Pirannha marketing package, which was put together by Joe Polish and sold in the UK by Alltec, in collaboration with J / P. They worked as business associates!!!!!!
The sources you quote, such as the internet and Ian Harper, are people who are simply stealing other peoples products and either selling them to make money, or putting them on boards, to make themselves appear to be what they're not !
I am NOT a supporter of any particular company, system, or individual, but I purchased the original Pirannha package, attended a number of Alltec seminars and others and never found anything underhand, or dishonest.
The scenario you describe, seems to me, to be just a little bit of showmanship and will be found in any seminar / stage demo / marketing.
As I mentioned before........................There is nothing new in marketing...................but, if people will benefit from attending a motivational course, they should attend.
Finally............................if you were a success in the " creative industry "you would not be on here criticising !
Would you?
rob
ps
just noticed you are still looking for creative ideas from cd sellers !
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Carpetguy,
It would not be theft, fast track do not own copy write on the majourity of the stuff, neither does JP, also JP merly took his ideas from other cleaners, "The most thorough, ect". was not thought up by JP!
I'm suprised you critised Letzclean, what he says is absolutly correct!
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What I find hard to understand is our new friend Letzclean is After a Joe Polish kit like Yesterday in another post.
And is asking for details of Marketing CD.
Robert Saunders and Joe Polish do more to show Carpet Cleaners how to market than any other company.
We may not agree or feel comfortable with all the ideas , and there is resisitance from family friends etc.
Agree there are Chris Cardell and Joe Gorman out there but they do not come cheap.
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still think its the best thing i've ever done
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If someone purports to be " an expert "or a knowledgable person, they leave themselves open to criticism and that is what Letz' has done and to make matters worse..................as highlighted, bt Ian Gourley, Letz is, in spite of his apparent knowledge / expertise seeking to obtain plageurised material.
I am NOT defending J P, or anyone else, but, what J P and R S have done ( working together ) has been, to raise the profile of this industry and encourage people to become, BETTER TRAINED / BETTER MARKETERS and BETTER BUSINESS people.
JP has worked with the best writers in the marketing world and passed on their expertise to the c/c industry,
What he did, was smart and has worked very well for him, but also for those who lacked the "knowhow, or confidence "
All these guys have done, is, construct a model, or guidelines which others could follow and become more successfull. Could you have done it ?
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I think what a lot of people fail to realise is that "Fast Track" is a lot more than just a few books and leaflets
You do get a whole load of books and cd's at the begining, but its not a case of here you go thats 3 grand see you later
What Robert sells is not available on any internet store, and allthough you can get a lot of the help and advice on these forums it is not available on here either
Fast Track, is a buisness building system that relys heavily on its marketing (that marketing in its raw form is available everywere) but as i say its a lot more interactive than just a book or manual
As well as the marketing you get full IICRC training on a variety of subjects for yourself and any staff you decide to employ
You will be given information on planning, budgeting, and how to set your prices
You will be given advice on where to go to get the best deals on printing and delivering leaflets and the best telephone suppliers for 0800 no's etc
You will be introduced to there accountant who specialises in our industry
If you are struggling with any elements of the course you can go in and have a meeting with Robert or Scott to discuss your problems and hopefully get advice
If you dont seem to be doing as well as others at any part of it Robert will put you in contact with another member who is so you can spend the day with them to pick there brains
they do something called a conference call twice a month where all the Fast Track members are on a call at the same time discussing new ideas and going over what is and isnt working
And they have something called brainstorming sessions where all members get together at a hotel and spend a day going over things
Wether its any good and wether its worth the money or not is not for me to say but...
THAT IS NOT AVAILABLE ANYWHERE ELSE
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here here old chap!
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Anybody interested in my all new "Goldfish Marketing"?
It works like this, I get 100 carpet cleaners to give me 5 grand each and then I'll give you an 0898 number to ring to have a 2 hour conference call at £1.50 a minute every week, I might even throw in a couple of cd's if your lucky.
I'll give you a bell in around 6 months from somewhere in the Med to see how your getting along with it as well, just to make sure your happy with your investment.
As a bonus the first 20 people to enrol will get 25 litres of my new miracle cleaning product that not only keeps cleaning for up to 3 months after you have splashed it around the house (not too much mind, 10ml is enough to do a 3 bed semi) completely free of charge, on the condition that when they have seen the results for themselves they take dubious before and after pics (you don't need to use the same carpet for both pics although a similar colour/pattern would be nice) and go forth and tell the peasants the good news, Andy
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i was in the market for a new truck-mount not long ago and personally i found alltec to be the most unprofessional people to deal with, i was treated in a very off-hand manner, frankly robert was quite rude to me and i like to think that i am easy going and not at all difficult, i left there asking for a written quote to be sent to me, after waiting for a month i bought elsewhere. i think they should practice what they preach.
colin
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Red,
so you recommend going on fast track ?
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Only a month Colin, sure i'm waiting for over four years, however next year perhaps, I never give up hope.
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Just making people aware of what it is.
Im forever reading posts on the subject, where people are saying how can others spend 3k on a bunch of old leaflets that if you were to look around you could find for free if you really tried.
And there right.
Iv never once seen anybody apart from myself even mention that the joining fee includes includes around 2 weeks of hands on training.
Which obviously in itself makes it better value, not that im saying its good value, just that its more than just leaflets and people should be aware of that.
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ive never had a problem with Alltec
my truckmount is brilliant from them
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Daniel,
What we want to see is you getting a return on your investment.
We know you had it tough to start with.but hopefully you have now found your way.
But is it the Fast track way or the way you were going anyway.
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Well guys I see a lots of interesting comments here.
And its always good to see a good debate.
I personally think that most of us should attend these kind of marketing seminars, because for start nearly 8 out of 10 general public don’t know much about carpet cleaning and how it should be done, that’s why you see more or less in every house they have vanish or other kind of stain remover which have been advertised on T.V. which are some time harmful for carpets. Or if you have noticed Rug Doctor has been hired out more or less in most large stores and dry cleaners, and they don’t do half good job as our carpet cleaning machine. Why?
All because of Marketing.
As you know Americans maybe not good as politicians, but they are second to none in marketing.
Bosh
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I wanted to go but have to go to Bradford on that day.
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why isn't Robert Saunders living on his own personal island, drinking tequilas, and making love to a bevvy of beautiful woman?
Mike
I remember reading that his company had achieved a "one million pound" turnover a couple of years ago ?
So he aint doin bad :)
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Turnover is not what makes a business profitable, it's the bottom line that matters.
Brings to mind a builder in my locality who was turning over millions about five years ago, he is now a bankrupt. He had a huge turnover but was loosing money hand over fist at the same time.
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Ian, im still having it tough im afraid, had a good week this week £1500+ but as my personel commitments are so big it is such a strain on the buisness that no matter what i take i still seem to allways be behind :(
Since starting "ft" i have done very little of there stuff as most requires some kind of investment and my cashflow is so bad of late its a struggle to start anything.
Can say though that my average job ticket has risen from £100 to £160 so thats a good thing, more down to just having the confidence to ask for more rather than any particualer strategy. But i doubt i would have done that without seeing what others were charging.
When i started i felt i was dear and would constantly knock my own prices down and give people a extra room free etc. Now i feel im to cheap and am constantly trying to upsell extra rooms and protector just to get a decent ticket price.
Must admitt it has changed my mindset.
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red
guerrilla marketing is the way forwards
respect
ian harper
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ian
How does that work then?
Regards
Bosh
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You spend a monkey on advertising.
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check amazon
http://www.amazon.com/Guerrilla-Marketing-4th-Inexpensive-SmallBusiness/dp/0618785914/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/104-7460797-5195159?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1182428801&sr=8-1
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where is the picture of the sexy lady from alltec! somebody post it please.
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Thanks for that ian.
so has it worked for you?
is it any good?
Regards
Bosh
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Boshravie
I am feed up with spend thousands on contact based media that does not work and locks you in. these organizations know that they don't that's why they make you sign a contact.
Anything that keeps my overheads down has to be good. as marketing is the largest spend in carpet cleaning its a place that you need to review all the time.
We gave away a year free house cleaning and it cost us to do it but as far as putting numbers on our turn over it was well worth it.
its ideas like this that are the basics of this type of marketing. just read the books and you will come up with ideas of your own. plus it puts you in a creative place with your marketing that is positive for your income.
Keeping the creative juices flowing can be hard when your self employed, but to keep taking steps up that ladder you must.
if anyone is interested i have just posted a 40 page sales letter manual for all to use on my blog. as you all know i built my maid service with JP ideas here you can see how these basic "direct response" ideas can be used in any service.
guerrilla marketing is just the same.
many of the sales letters as you will see are very close to JP stuff this just shows you how easy it is to take something from outside your circle (carpet Cleaning) and use it.
Taking JP's stuff gave me a USP in cleaning homes that had never been used before. you can also do this if you take ideas from outside carpet cleaning. you would not believe the comments that i have had over the years regarding it.
lets not forget where "direct response came from
http://dc19.4shared.com/download/11777003/90dc0cf4/scientificadv.exe
its the rules in this book wrote many years ago that it all started.
just because something is free or cheap does not mean that it does not have great value.
the price of a guerrilla marketing book can put many thousands of pounds on your business over many years. don't under value it.
Like most things it requires effort. nothing is easy, but the marketing money saved will be worth it.
We all know that FT takes a commitment of many thousands to make it work Evan after the upfront investment. i think that its this money that people get negative about what FT has to offer. well you cant have it both ways. you pay your money and make the commitment or you see the value in the price of a book, the choice is yours.
as always I would like to point out my thanks to JP and direct response for what its done for me. but given how demand is at the moment its time for a new outlook.
I know many of you say you are doing really well and it is probably the ones that have been in business for many years, good luck to you, but many have had to give up or are finding it hard. i am lucky i have other income.
for those who wish to cut the BS lets bet this downturn.
respect
Ian Harper
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Well ian
Many thanks for your detailed explanation, its always good to have knowledgeable people like you on this forum, specially on marketing side.
Like you said on service industry like our trade we need as much marketing as we can to be able to expand.
I have started my business in 1999 and from start I was always looking outward and I had a target of within 5-10 years which I would be managing my business and not just be a soul trader and I have achieved that.
I have maid service as well as window cleaning combined with carpet cleaning and its doing well, but not as well as I wanted to be.
I am always striving for more clients.
so you could say I am lucky too.
But ian , like you said everything in life is hard to get and if we stop being creative, our business will die.
I will defiantly buy the book thanks to you and also attending the ALL TECK marketing too.
After all you can not put a price on good advice.
Regards
Bosh
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Hello Carpetguy,
Let me set a few things straight, firstly as you can see I am “newbie” and I can not see where I claimed to be an “expert.” As you claimed in your statement. I have the 8 cd pack from Tim Paulson and Joe Polish where the spill comes from! My point was this” The same statements, facts and figures that were on the Martin Riley Superstar fast track CD, were being used again, as I said make of it what you want?
but me and the guys on the course know what we made of it. As for being a success in the creative industry I work 9-5 in Media Advertising it pays 35k pa basic 50K with bonuses and OTE Carpet cleaning is just one of many sidelines that I have invested in with two friends to make more easy money. I have never touched a carpet cleaner as of yet, done a few quotes for my partners and have negotiated and won got a couple of contracts with landlords, not really rocket science is it? We are already cleaning hotels, apartments and restaurants in London and surrounding areas. As I said easy money mate. Seems like you got a bit cheesed off with my comments, I am sorry if I offended you in anyway that was not my intention I wish you all the success and happiness you work for in this competitive and ever changing industry.
Kind regards
James
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Letz'
Reading my posts, you will find that I am simply " puting the record straight " as far as Alltecs history of involvement with JP is concerned!
What you are highlighting.......................is the fact, that it's very easy to steal ideas, breach agreements, plaguerise other work and make money from it.
This is not what Robert Saunders has been doing, although you give the impression that is what he's been doing.
Polish and Saunders collaborated in the sale of marketing materials.
I have said all along, that c/c is hardly " rocket science "and is extremely easy to get into, but the marketing of any business, is another matter.
Personally, I will be completely out of this industry, in the not too distant future, having been involved for over 20 years.
You could put together Monkey Marketing,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,," so easy a monkey could do it " and out of any group of 100 participants, only 20 would put it into practice and out of the twenty, only 4 would stick to the plan !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
That, is HUMAN NATURE !
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carpetguy
I am sorry to here that you are giving up carpet cleaning, its a great loss to those already in and those that have yet to start.
I hope and wish you luck in whatever field you are going into.
your 20 years show that you are a true success as a carpet cleaner.
respect
Ian harper
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Nothing to do with me but I often wondered what fee Alltec had to pay JP to use his ideas and material .
Also What fee JP payed Jim Wolverson
What is really clever is that itrying to think of anything original you end up using their phrases ideas etc Even if you dress it up differently.
However in 1990 when I did my first advert and leaflet I went on about Dust mites etc.
Another Manual I have which was published I think before JP came on to seen uses similar ideas.
But I nicked the idea from Stimvak
On Ebay there is a Gurilla Marketing CD set that is being promoted but its not the same person who wrote book Ian H has suggested.
In my opinion you will get more new ideas from the book.
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As a new member its good to listen to all the different points of view there is always something to learn about this industry within the replies given.
I always felt from the start that I would get good training based on others opinions from the training they have had and buy a machine etc from a well liked provider for professionals such as yourselves and not be led into get rich quick schemes which cost time and money and are normally just not realistic.
I have always felt that these schemes etc are just another add on to the business to make money and in the wrong hands it can give false hopes to individuals.
There is only one way to make a long lasting success of any situation know your business,customers do a good job and believe in yourself.
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PeterD, Joe Polish is not a get rich quick scheme, it is marketing knowledge, but you can get rich and quick too if you market your business well,. it doesn't matter where you gain your marketing knowledge from
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JP and Howard partridge programs etc all take time to impliment but the rewards are higher than average incomes, the quickest 'fast track' done by most cleaners is to offer the cheapest price, this will get you work from day 1 and keep you working hard till the day you die.
Shaun
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Hi
Including Saturdays & Sunday.
LOL
Dave
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Those of you attending the CCDO can ask Robert Saunders your self about FT etc as he will attending and demonstrating the new Bluewave Truck Mount ;)
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Here you go Paul.