Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Art on November 17, 2006, 07:33:17 pm
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You can join the NCCA if you pass the appropriate IICRC courses.
Does this work the other way around?
If not, then why shouldn't it work both ways?
Arthur
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Art
You are correct in that you can pass the carpet and the upholstery exams for IICRC giving you qualifications acceptable to the NCCA.
IICRC is not a trade association, it is a body that sets standards and trains technicians to those standards. You cannot join IICRC. But you can be a certified technician as having passed their exams, or become a Registrant as a company. Given this scenario, outside qualifications are not appropriate to them.
Safe and happy cleaning :)
Ken
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Hi Ken,
Thanks for the reply. Still can't see why NCCA members can't join as affiliate members or something similar.
Arthur
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In my 28 year opinion, neither are worth belonging to.
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why not?
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Glynn
We have been down this particular road so many times now...
It again it is your choice whether you belong to a Trade organisation or not...that's as it should be.
Personally I have belonged to the NCCA for many years as a member and until recently a Director...as a member it has worked well for me as I do use my membership of the NCCA when talking to prospective clients.
Its like the chemicals we use....we make them work for us just letting a chemical sit in its bottle in the van isn't going to get it to clean a carpet...you have to in the very first instance... open the bottle.
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glynn , i have made a lot of money that i otherwise wouldnt have by being a member of the NCCA, if you were a member you would realise how many potential clients see it as important even if you dont.
regards
ollie
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Sorry Ollie but thats not true as regards clients. I would say not even 5% of all CC customers no who the NCCA are, and thats the problem.
They need to be seen by the Customers more and I dont think they are. Most dont even no who they are.
What I find amazing is that someone can never have cleaned a carpet go on the course and pass the exam and then become a member. Then they can sell themselves to the customers as being NCCA trained and have pretend to have the experience that should go with the qualification.
By not being a member I use the fact that it is so easy to join as no experience is nesccesary so no life skills as a carpet cleaner are needed. Testamonails from happy customers work a lot better than membership at the moment in my sales pitch.
What I think the NCCA should do is make all people wishing to join register their intent and then after a year of cleaning then take the exam and become a full member. Would add a lot more creditbility to the qualification in my eyes.
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Neil, you are correct a lot of customers dont know who the NCCA are, guess whose job it is to educate the public? and explain what benefits the CUSTOMER receives becuase their CC is a Member such as the fact you need to pass a training course and be fully insured covering both Public Liability & treatments risk, peice of mind. How many non NCCA members have the additionial treatments risk cover? in fact i bet there are a few that dont have insurance at all. How many CC can offer someone to whom they are accountable should things go wrong?, instead of being fobbed off and ignored should a CC cause a problem the customer can call the NCCA instead to register a compaint, more peace of mind. I personally have the badge on all my literature, all my uniform and i mention my membership on all surveys that i do, not only does this without a shadow of a doubt help my booking percentages but this also educates the customer to whom the NCCA are which can only benefit all CC's including non members by bringing the NCCA to the public eye we can only benefit.
Dene
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Dene
But my point about not having any experience is so important. Pass the exam and you are a NCCA member. Until the NCCA address this fact and any Tom Dick or Harry who has a good memory and can get through an exam can become a member and use all that goes with it, it's not all its cracked up to be. No real standard for joining.
To a customer this would mean that they are experienced which is misleading to all customers. Do you think a new CC who is a member will tell the customer that I took the exam last month and passed but have only been cleaning carpets for a month, I think not.
Like any business you have good and bad, I have all the insurance needed including treatment risk. I use this as part of the portfolio that I show customers.
I do see the need for a Trade association that we all have to be members but untill this is addressed it just not worth the certificate. To easy to join. If the NCCA are serious about having qualified members they should make it a pre req that all members should have passed the IICRC course before they can join. That would also set the standard for all carpets cleaners.
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Neil i agree with regards the ease of obtaining membership, but i would still argue thats is better to have new cc's going on a two day course and having to prove insurance than the alternative which some bloke buying a rug doctor second hand and being let loose on a carpet. In thoose two days i learnt a lot more than i had in the previous few months reading on theese forums.
regards
Dene
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Hi Neil,
I like to think that I am intelligent and after working for a corporation for some 23 years, all over the world (Scientific research, not carpets!) I decided to start up on my own and offer a service to my customers that I can do well, and enjoy at the same time. I could have went out and bought a puzzi, brassed my way in to folks homes wet their carpets and walked off with £23 quid.....for how long?
I had cleaned my own carpets using a hire machine several times and was pretty happy with the results, so my brain told me that if that's what a DIY machine can do? What can a PRO do with the available equipment? Loads more and loads better.
I would not have let myself loose even on my mothers carpet without first knowing what I was doing! The NCCA course showed me the ropes, how to do things correctly and above all when to walk away. Personally the price of the course was S***e pence for the knowledge that I gained and also as a % of my business investment. Both the teachers on my course are stored in my phone under C and U legends as well as a few delegates that impressed me with their experience/knowledge. I have not had to phone them yet but I am sure I will have to sometime, and that's great peace of mind for me, as what is known on this forum a Neewbie or (Numpty) ..................dont think so.
Where I am in the Scottish borders the NCCA is virtually unknown, but it will be as I educate my clients and show them what a proffesional can do . All thanks to the NCCA. I only have been doing this since September, I have no problem telling my clients that I have only been doing this for a few months, but have been trained by pro's and I am a pro! What are you?
TECHNICLEAN NCCA MEMBER 1630.
P.S if you need your carpet or suite cleaned properly, phone an expert, there are several I would recommend in your region. Thanls to the NCCA
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Dene,
you could have saved me a lot of typing ;)
Straight to the point!
Cheers,
Adam.
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Hi Adam
So are you telling me that if you are not a member then you are not worthy of being a carpet cleaner. Their are lots of top carpet cleaners with as much Knowledge who have not joined for reasons that they feel they dont need to.
Why is it assumed that if your are not a member then you are not Proffessional, I know I am and I do as good a job as any member does. My repeats and referals tell me that. You are not Proffesional just because you belong to an association. I did the course when i first started and have built a good business in the last 2 1/2 years. Paul Pearce was great and helped me with some great advice.
I bet a lot of cleaners dont follow all the guide lines set down by the NCCA and just want the name because it gives them that little bit extra in the Sales pitch.
I have never said that they are not a good organisation but its just that they have no Profile in the Public eye and it is to easy to Join. Good for Carpet Cleaners to talk and pass idea's on but I want a NCCA that the Public know they should look too to get Carpets cleaned.
I will join once the rule changes go through about compaines being able to say they are NCCA certified when only the Owner passed the exam and never cleaned in his life, then get untrained Techy's to clean while saying that they are NCCA certified. Ken said that this is changing next Year. It's just little things like that that need sorting out.
Not against the NCCA and love the idea of a Trade Association I just feel they need to be more Professional in dealing with membership and there image in the public eye.
Cheers
Neil
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The fact that someone makes the effort to travel, often long distances, at considerable expense, speaks volumes and tells me they are serious about their chosen profession.
Ok, so clients may not know of the NCCA, but the fact that you belong to an official trade body impresses the type of customers I want to attract.
When it`s explained to them, they are impressed and you will secure a good price for your work. (I make no apologies for that)
I cant understand why anyone would not want to join. The more of us that join the stronger it becomes. I think the rest is obvious.
Regards
Rab
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Rab
I do understand what you are saying but am building a proffesional business whilst not being a member. Is this wrong and am I not a proffessional just because i did not take up the membership.
I still get training now and will always do so, as knowledge is power.
Cheers
Neil
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I agree Neil that the new One to One training rule should be implemented, maybee the NCCA should have different levels becuase if the test was too hard it would scare newbie off but if the NCCA had a Bronze, Silver, Gold & PLatinum members each level representing the ammount of training the member had completed this would help show the different levels of expertise? just a thought. One other point, how many adverts have you seen on TV heard or heard on the radio about Using Corgi Registered plumbers however the public seem to know about Corgi, im willing to bet its becuase of the Plumber educating the public, which is what we also need to do. And Neil you are correct just becuase you arent an NCCA member it doesnt mean you cannot do a good job but the training you recieve and the ongoing training events, newsletter etc can only help.
regards
Dene
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Dene
That's a great idea, would join if they did that.
Cheers
Neil
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Well i wish i'd never started this thread, as it was in no way meant to end up as a slagging match of the NCCA.
The point of it was that the NCCA were every bit as good as the IICRC.
Someone mentioned having IICRC trainning as a pre req for NCCA membership.
When i went on a 2 day IICRC C/C course if i'd sat the exam and passed i would have been able to call myself a IICRC technician, but to join the NCCA via the IICRC route i would have to pass a further upholstery course, so this to me says the NCCA are abit more selective.
Again i'm not slagging off the IICRC either, i'm just stating the facts.
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Neil.
Tenner says your more professional than me. ;)
What I`m saying is, the more people that join, the stronger it will become.
They can only promote the organization with the cash they have, just like us.
We`re only talking about 6 quid a week.
So the more that join, the better for all.
Regards
Raberto.
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My comments were not ment as a slag of for the NCCA as I think they have good points as well but they just didn't suite me at the time.
Rab, I never think that I am better than anyone else just try to set my own standards that i would want from anyone doing work for me. I hate the feeling of being ripped off so would not do it to someone else.
Cheers
Neil
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I never said, you did think you were better. Did I come across wrong ???
I`ll read it again tomorrow.
Another Tequila calls.
Cheers
Rab
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i thought Rab was for 'Rab c nesbit', not 'Raberto' ;)
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Secound bottle of red after getting back from football. Having to watch X factor with the kids, why oh why oh why
Didn't think you did.
Cheers
Neil
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Craig,
I`m going to kick your arse. So ah will ;D
Good night ya shower ye
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Art, when I joined the N.C.C.A. I was allowed to do so because I was an I.I.C.R.C. tech. Coming from the U.S. I didnt even know of it..... I didnt have to do any other courses of any type, I was just ok'd to join with respect of the I.I.C.R.C. With that in mind as you can not be with the I.I.C.R.C. by being a member of the N.C.C.A. I would suggest the selectiveness favours the I.I.C.R.C. For my own reasons I have nothing to do with the N.C.C.A. but remain with the I.I.C.R.C. In parting it is too easy and I mean tooooo easy to become a member of the N.C.C.A. and for this I will always advocate it being way more difficult. I do like the idea with the I.I.C.R.C. that you have to stay up with "education" with continual credits, maybe something the N.C.C.A. might want to look into. I also like the various different catagories to be qualified in. I feel the N.C.C.A. is just a little too generic. Anyway, best, Dave.
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Dave, when you joined the NCCA did you have both IICRC carpet and upholstery credits?
Arthur
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Art, yes amongst quite a few others. Best, Dave.
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CORGI Registered...you are holding this name up to be the epitomy of acreditation...what you may not know is that there are varying degrees of Corgi registration.
Although a logo on their van or stationary may say Corgi Registered giving the implication that they are totaly trained...they may be only trained in one particular discipline...my daughter found this out the hard way when she employed a Corgi registered technician.
We had to contact their Trade body to sort out the mess...it was only then we discovered the technician employed wasn't qualified to do that particular work.
When selling my membership of the NCCA I always say, "there may be excellent carpet cleaners listed in the various directories who are not members ..but how can you tell"?
An NCCA member has at least had basic training and has the support of the Association...
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Derek
Would you say the 2 day course to join is giving you knowlege of carpet cleaning or just the basics without any practical experience.
How can an organisation send out members not knowing if they can use the Chemicals or equipment in their armery properley without any practical exams to say they are acredited.
I think the NCCA should have different degree's of membership from Junior to Senior depending on experience and explain the level of differences on their website. The more qualifications you have the higher the level they get.
This would make sure all your members are joining for the right reasons and not just to use the NCCA name in their marketing.
Cheers
Neil
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If you think the main benfit of The NCCA is to give you crediability, you can also achieve this with IICRC.
If you become a Certified firm you can promoted on the IICRC Web Site
I would think NCCA however gets more Public enquiries.
Can you link your site to NCCA or IICRC to help improve search engine ratings.
However if you have lots of NCCA members in your Area that might not work very well.
NCCA gives you a voice. It is the Voice of the UK industry.
What are the chances of them Acting on any motion I care to put forward if they are member.
I did enqiuire what happens at a NCCA meeting but was told this information is for those who attended and the membership.
Will the Minutes be published in the EXCELLENT NCCA Magazine, or are they available to members through the Web Site.
NCCA acts as an arbitration service in case of dispute.
Does IICRC do this.
Would my Insurance company do this.
Is there a charge for this service.
Do I want an outside person involved. After all I offer a Satisfaction Guarantee,
Some people belong to both apart from being a Good industry person is there any advantage.
Both have Conferences but must say NCCA conference price would not have broken bank.
Ken has done a Fantastic job with NCCA roadshows making it more of a Networking Organization.
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Neil
Of course not....delegates are expected and encouraged to further their education.. I ask you in return...what is the alternative?
Many cleaners buy a machine plus a few chemicals and launch themselves at the public and 'then' seek out these forums for advice on how to clean...surely that is putting the cart before the horse. Some of the advice given out is often contradictory and, dare I say, incorrect. ::)
Ken has put a lot of time and effort into the NCCA Roadshows and yet we still only get the dedicated ones who bother to turn up...you can almost name them all in advance.... the cost is kept minimal
They were originally going to be free but some folk booked and never turned up, not even a telephone call to say they weren't coming... catering for them had been organised and still had to be paid for.
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Art, yes amongst quite a few others. Best, Dave.
Dave,
Well in that case you misunderstood my post .
What i was saying was that you can pass as a carpet cleaner with the IICRC then become a technician.
The NCCA will not let you join using this route unless you've done both c/c and upholstery with the IICRC.
So you can be an IICRC tecnician without having ever touched upholstery.
Arthur
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Is there a link between ncca and bics do like the word British. 8)
Len
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Art, maybe I did misunderstand your post. And you are correct you can be an I.I.C.R.C. tech with out having touched upholstery but you cant be an upholstery tech. Hope this makes sense. Best, Dave.