Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: L plate on September 28, 2006, 12:34:58 pm
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Hi all
I was wonder if any of you can help me out, by answering this question
I’m looking to go down the water feed pole root
Most of my work is council or ex council houses
They have 10 openings including the doors
I am looking to do about 20 houses a day
I will be cleaning all the window w f p tops and bottoms
How many 25 litre drums will I use a day in total or per house
I’m not decided yet if I’ll be using a back pack or trolley
If I chose the back pack how many houses per refills
Thanks :)
L Plate
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hi mate
as a rough idea most tend to use between 250-400ltr per day. depends on how fast you set your flow really, and also how long a day you work ???
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600ltrs per day - go for a trailer system and 100m of 8mm minibore. Thats what I use when I'm on my own - can easily do 20 before lunch. (£6 each)
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Using the system you are talking about you will use approximately 15 litres of water per house.
First time cleans will be way above that.
I usually needed to pop home for refills now and then and I generally took 8 containers out with me.
For me it was no problem to nip home if I needed to.
You may well use less than 15 litres per house, some do, but it takes practice!
Ian
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I've found that I only use a maximum of 4 x 25 litre drums a day. I use a trolley system i made myself and i addapted the pole and brush so as not to waste water
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How do you adapt a pole and brush to save water?
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The odd day i hit 380ltrs but this is rare, my avarage is 200-250 ltrs a day.
first cleans use loads more but by the 3rd clean you will use half the water.
Macc
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Only in my first weeks of WFP and am using anywhere between 50 to 75 ltr per house on first cleans, don't know if you think thats excessive but really want to make sure I do a good job and hope the usage will fall in future.
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I too am a new user and find that the 250litre tank that I have is not normally enough to get me through the day...yesterday I used 160 litres on a 'average' detatched house and in the morning I used 45 litres on a 'normal' semi...
These were both 1st cleans and you can read into 'normal' what you will..
Cheers
Dave.
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I use a backpack, but wouldn't advise anyone to get one if they plan to do 100% WFP.
I've read here that one or two users had done this; but you'll be disapointed; I'm sure.
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Thanks for the replies
The reason I’m keen to go trolley or back pack is I’ve had use of a van system
And tried it on a good few of my customers and they have no problem with w f p
So time to invest!!
But because of the layout of houses
I spend most of my time reeling in the hose.
And the van system dose seems to use a lot of water. (And expensive to hire)
If I can get down to 15 litres a house I will be well happy.
L Plate
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Only in my first weeks of WFP and am using anywhere between 50 to 75 ltr per house on first cleans, don't know if you think thats excessive but really want to make sure I do a good job and hope the usage will fall in future.
Aiy caramba!! :o :o
I promise you that your usage will plummet once you get the hang of what you are doing.
If we say that a standard semi has 10 to 12 varying sized windows, and is all UPVC then on repeat cleans you should be able to clean those windows with no more than 18 litres at the most, and possibly less than 15 litres with practice.
Those with trolley and back pack systems are understandably more aware of how much water they are using, when you have a 650 litre or 1000 litre tank of water in your van you are very much less concerned.
Now I am a full van mount and operate with the pump flat out I'm probably using 20 plus litres per semi.....
I'll have to point my brush into a bucket and let the water run for ten minutes and see how much I use, as ten minutes is the maximum in actual work time I'd take on a 12 window semi.
I don't bother to turn off the flow between windows either, so I guess I'm wasting water by doing that, not much...but it adds up.
Ian
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Cheers Ian,
I'm really giving the top frames and rubbers a good going over for the 1st cleans just to be sure. My flow rate is about 2 ltr/min. To be honest as long as the customer doesn't phone up complaining then I'm happy ;D and like you say hopefully will reduce usage and time taken in the future.
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There is a trade off. you use more water and spend less time rinsing. Or use less and take longer. I get by on less than 200 ltrs a day if I'm on my own, but no way can I match Ian's 10 mins for a semi council house. I use 2mm jets and I think that cuts down on the amount I use cleaning. Dai
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Dai, try fan spray jets, you will probably use the same amount of water per day but you will find rinsing so much quicker and therefore use the water more efficiently - making more moulah.
John, yeah, thats a really good way to look at it. I would keep the flow rate the same and just work a little quicker once you have all your initial and recleans out of the way. You'll double your speed in no time whilst still doing a really good job.
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i have van mount with a boostered r/o system (makes 300 litres an hour ) i never run out water, but i am still concerned about water ussage and allways impresssed by how little water you guys use i think every one should care and its nice to see so many on this site do.
i use about 300 a day with 1.5 mm jets and micro bore never set more than 1 litre a minute (except first cleans and in the high street where its dusty, these componets have meant that i half my ussage water and are a must when investing in wfp system
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sair I can understand why you would want to conserve water if you live in an area prone to drought, however here in N.Ireland - it rains nearly every day, our reservoir system is capable of coping with three times the population we have, also our water is not metered so for us it is a false economy trying to save water - yes I agree that water is precious, its just that we have an abundance so we might as well use it.
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How wasteful :o, I can get by on a couple of litres a day when cleaning trad, the water companies will do something about all this waste of water soon, mark my words! :o and thats just the water you all use to clean the windows, what about all the water that goes down the drain from the ro? :-\
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How wasteful :o, I can get by on a couple of litres a day when cleaning trad, the water companies will do something about all this waste of water soon, mark my words! :o and thats just the water you all use to clean the windows, what about all the water that goes down the drain from the ro? :-\
YOUR GETTING BORING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Groundhog how exactly does that help L plate ???
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Groundhog.
I dont class useing wfp water as wastefull. Sure I am useing a lot more then a few buckets of water a day if I was Trad. I dont bat an eye lid on how much I use. Why?
Water is produced by the water cycle, Its a natural occuring cycle. You know how it works so I wont bore you with it. The water that is produced as waste through my R0 goes back down the drains, which will feed back into the rivers which feeds into the sea to help the cycle start again.
What about when it rains, All that water running down the streets into the drains. Water running off roads into fields. Its all part of nature.
Now if the water companys are filling in reservoirs, Are letting trillions of gallons escape through leaks and not putting enough money in the infustructure. Dont try to give a wfp user a guilt complex for useing water. The blame firmly lies at these Idiots who are in charge of storing and supplying water to everyone who lives on our Green Isle.
Oil will run out. Have you stopped Taking holidays abroad to save this Fluid from running out. Are you useing a more Environmentally freindly power source to run your vehicle? Oil will run out. Water will not.
We are Surrounded By water living on an island. Not one company has invested in a Desalination plant. Why? Because the water companys will not make as much money if they spent the money building one. Even though you would have a permenant supply of water.
Drink Coca cola, They use a lot more water to make a litre of the stuff to drink.
No wfp is fine the water that runs down a persons wall will Evaporate into the atmosphere.
Nel
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Neil if thats the case then why do the water companies want us to use less water? The fact is that our weather pattern is changing and we are more prone to droughts, and sooner or later they are going to catch up with all of us window cleaners who are now using many thousands of gallons of water for a non essential service! :( They are either going to levy hefty charges for excessive use of water or ban it all together, and thats a fact :-\
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Sorry butterbean that my opinion is different from yours, but thats life ;)
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and sooner or later they are going to catch up with all of us window cleaners who are now using many thousands of gallons of water for a non essential service!
The water boards know how much window cleaners with a WFP system use.
And they know roughly how many people are using them.
The water we are using is nothing to them.
Each water board wastes more water per day than we would all use in a year with WFP.
Paul
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interesting fact - apparently it takes 23 ltrs of water to make one 500ml bottle of coca-cola!! (water used in cooling machines etc), water is the most plentiful natural resource we have and the natural cycles that take place every day are constantly regenerating it.
Again Groundhog has tried to turn this into a trad v wfp dispute.
Stop being a child and just get on with life.
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Groundhog, I never professed to being an expert on the climate - however my sister does (BSc Hons, PGCE with commendation and MSc with distinction - Geography) and she has agreed with what I said. Funnily enough her fiance (BSc Biological Science, MSc with distinction) also agrees wholeheartedly. Think they might know a thing too about earth.
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Sorry but big words and letters after peoples names does not impress me at all ;D Why are hosepipes banned at the moment in many areas? because we are in the middle of a drought, and if it carries on they will ban us too. And I don't think that anyone can deny that wfp is a waste of water. To be constructive I think we should all make an effort to use less water, for instance by doing tops only wfp and downstairs trad, this will at least show the public and the Water Authorities that we care about the enviroment and are making an effort to conserve water :)
PS say hi to Archie for me next time your in the village ;D ;D ;D
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PS say hi to Archie for me next time your in the village ;D ;D ;D
I worry about Archie in his pink clothes and pink house.....
On the topic though, if hosepipes are banned, then wfp is too.(or should be).
It is a hosepipe! With a broom attached. ::)
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Exactly Squeaky!
I also worry abut Archie, he must get very drafty in that kilt ;D
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do the tops with wfp and the downstairs trad?
Sorry mate, ok maybe if I was in a drought area I would maybe consider it - but I'm not, I'm in an area thats plagued by rain.
As for water shortages, we all know who's fault that is. When all the large firms stop using water then I'll stop too, until then not a chance.
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this has gone off topic somewhat, but the debate about water is a good one.
interesting fact - apparently it takes 23 ltrs of water to make one 500ml bottle of coca-cola!! (water used in cooling machines etc), water is the most plentiful natural resource we have and the natural cycles that take place every day are constantly regenerating it.
Any factory making drinks coca cola or otherwise use an absolutely prodigious volume of water every day.
HUGE :o
They would only have to turn off the taps for an hour and they would save more water in that time than all the WFP windows cleaners in the same county would use in 12 months.
A local brewery uses many millions of litres of water per year.
How many WFP window cleaners are there in your town? Half a dozen??
The average WFPer uses about 250l per day.
I'm from Chepstow, and I only know of 4 window cleaners who live in our town that have WFP.
Of the 4 of us I reckon I use the most water, and I rarely use much more than 300 litres a day.
How much water do you reckon the man on the street will use when he washes the car and uses his garden hose connwected to the mains?
With the tap full on and if he (or she) takes ten minutes to clean the car they will use more water than I will use in a day of window cleaning.
Though the summer in an average town of 10,000 people I wonder how many of them get the hose out to wash their car on any given day?
Even worse of course is the householder who has the garden sprinkler going for a few hours watering the lawn.
Just one individual in a town of 10,000 people will will use more water in that single day than I would use in a month, and of course it will never be just the one householder washing his car (or hers) or watering the lawn.
WFP use is barely a drop in the ocean.
And nobody compares even closely to the water companies themselves :o :o :o
Over the last 25 years water lost through leaks has actually gone up and not down :o
How the hell can that happen? ;)?
Since the big drought of 76 you would have thought the alarm bells would have rang loud and clear, but no...the shareholders and not the customer come first, profit, profit, profit!
It incenses me when these morons advertise on telly and tell me to conserve water when they waste it like it is going out of fashion.
A month or 2 ago I was working in a street (Kingsmark Avenue for any Chepstow guys reading this) that had a big leak.
Not slaging off the water company here by the way, they had someone there to check it out within an hour or so.
But at one point he opened up some mains valve in the street while he checked out the leak further down the street.
This was gushing out water for perhaps 10 or 15 minutes, I've no doubt it was sone for a specific reason, so once again this isn't a dig a the guy who did it.
But my god! it was like a river!!
In just those ten or fifteen minutes many thousands of litres of water went spewing out into the roads and down the gutters.
The leak itself, which was lower down the road was repaired in a day or two, which was a pretty quick response time I thought, but for every minute of the time that main was leaking it was pushing out way more water than you could do if you had all the taps turned on in your house!
And there are tens of thousands of these leaks happening all the time.
WFP wasteful ?? No way.
Ian
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I'm from Chepstow, and I only know of 4 window cleaners who live in our town that have WFP.
Funny how figures get manipulated to suit the arguement.....
A while back when you and Tosh were slating me for being "the odd one out" there was "At least 8 or 10 wfp users around Chepstow"......
Now it's about water wasting there's only 4! ;D
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Any factory making drinks coca cola or otherwise use an absolutely prodigious volume of water every day.
HUGE :o
The point is that there's no other way of making drinks.
There's a far more ecologically sound way of cleaning windows.
Besides, a lot of people would be gutted if soft drinks disappeared for a while.
Don't think they really give much of a toss how their windows are cleaned.
Or if they're not even cleaned at all.....
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I'm not suggesting they should stop making soft drinks, but if for one hour a day they ceased production, in a single week they would save more water than all the WFP users in the country combined.
Or if they cut production in the drought areas by 1% the savings in water would make what that county's WFP users use pail into insignificance.
And the same could apply to all the other major water users.
WFP is such piddling small fry, to be quite honest, saying they should be banned to save water is ludicrous in the extreme.
Ian
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couldn't agree with you more Ian.
Why the debate about using water anyway? Squeeky etc if you want to be extreme then what about the environmental damage your gg3/4/fairy solution does to the environment? No-one makes a fuss because it is minimal - and so is water wastage from wfp, minimal.
But again its funny how the trad only guys have started another anti-wfp thread and before you go off on your high horse I use trad too, not a big lot anymore but for some of my best payers (shops) I still use trad, makes a break from the pole and I enjoy it still.