Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: M4RK on August 16, 2006, 04:44:19 pm
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What should I look for when choosing a wfp system?
Thanks for your help.
Mark
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buy all the bits in, and build it yourself :)
DIY is the future ;)
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Plug plug.....
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Matt,
Why don't you change your web link from free ipod to the diy link. ;)
Doug
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Matt,
Why don't you change your web link from free ipod to the diy link. ;)
Doug
the free ipod thing has died a death
i dont think Mike would like me to change it to the DIY site though ;) of course he could confirm this
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hhhmmm
build your own car ;)
rgds
stuart
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hhhmmm
build your own car ;)
rgds
stuart
;D ;D Yea or house, come to think of it I need a new ladder migth go down the garage and see what i can knock up with a bit of timber I have left over.
Mark get whatever you think is best for your company, think of what image you would like to have for your business, I know you can afford it ;D ;D,
also mate sorry for messing you about, after carefull consideration I decided It wasnt for me.
Kind Regards
Alex
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house , car , wfp! theres always those inclined to do so . and on the other hand others employ those whos trade it is.
depends what your image wants
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hhhmmm
build your own car ;)
rgds
stuart
hhhmmm
build your own car ;)
rgds
stuart
::)
;D ;D Yea or house, come to think of it I need a new ladder migth go down the garage and see what i can knock up with a bit of timber I have left over.
Mark get whatever you think is best for your company, think of what image you would like to have for your business, I know you can afford it ;D ;D,
also mate sorry for messing you about, after carefull consideration I decided It wasnt for me.
Kind Regards
Alex
::)
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Mark,
Don’t buy it just because it’s cheap.
If you are going down the DIY route which seems to be popular at the moment make sure you get a good strong frame for tank and anchor it well down into your van to strong secure points. Just take a look how strong your seat & seatbelt mountings and they are only designed to stop the equivalent of a body under 100kgs. 500 litres of water is 500 kilos and when your van hits something the water & the tank want to keep on going into the back of your head. Its all very well knocking so called professional suppliers and installer for being high priced but most of them do a good job of fitting the tank, and they should all carry product liability insurance. (ask to see it). All this DIY, DIY, DIY is all OK until you have a accident and your business or vehicle insurer won't pay up and you are liable for all the costs.
steve@freshwatersystems.co.uk
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Mark,
Don’t buy it just because it’s cheap.
If you are going down the DIY route which seems to be popular at the moment make sure you get a good strong frame for tank and anchor it well down into your van to strong secure points. Just take a look how strong your seat & seatbelt mountings and they are only designed to stop the equivalent of a body under 100kgs. 500 litres of water is 500 kilos and when your van hits something the water & the tank want to keep on going into the back of your head. Its all very well knocking so called professional suppliers and installer for being high priced but most of them do a good job of fitting the tank, and they should all carry product liability insurance. (ask to see it). All this DIY, DIY, DIY is all OK until you have a accident and your business or vehicle insurer won't pay up and you are liable for all the costs.
steve@freshwatersystems.co.uk
of course if your going for a trolley system, this doesnt aply :)
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Hang on a moment all you high and mighty suppliers, On the one hand you knock diy systems but you are quite happy to sell all the parts individually to window cleaners for them to build there own systems.
I could get on to ANY supplier tommorrow and order parts off them, and i guarantee no one will be bothered that i am building my own system, in fact they will all try to sell me most of the parts needed.
A wfp system is not a car or an house, If the prices for off the shelf wfp systems was more realistic you would see fewer and fewer diy systems.
Some wfp systems cost as much as a brand new small car.
Surely prices are due to fall, the wfp gold rush is over, Its time to get realistic with the prices.
My system diy cost about £1000, how can you wrap that product up and justify £3000 + if i bought it commercialy from a supplier.
I am due to buy an off the shelf system and i reckon i am going to pay £3500, I reckon £800 for the parts the othe £2700 will be for the design, fitting,safety (If thats any better) and profit to the supplier.
It all hurts a bit, but needs must
Dave
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I am due to buy an off the shelf system and i reckon i am going to pay £3500, I reckon £800 for the parts the othe £2700 will be for the design, fitting,safety (If thats any better) and profit to the supplier.
So why spend so much on the same tool for the job Dave?
What's it going to do differently?
That's like me spending £3500 on a new squeegee because it's got a nicer handle. :o
I'm not being funny, just wonder what the point is, if you've already got wfp?
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does wfp stand for "want filthy panes?"
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Squeeky
Its not going to do anything different apart from allow me to keep my back doors wide open and show off
Also Its time for me to up my image and stand out from the rest
I think it will pay off, in real terms it will cost half that amount after tax allowances.
Its a case of spend it or pay tax on it.
Dave
Theres some logic in there somewhere.
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What should I look for when choosing a wfp system?
Thanks for your help.
Mark
It all depends what you are going to use as a vehicle. If you already have a van then that is by far the best way, if not, it's an added expense.
Like Dave I paid just over a grand for my system & I've just finished the dreaded 1st cleans with 2 complaints but no lost customers. Wish I'd done it years ago but then I think the price would of put me off.
Give Kirsty @Gardiners a ring, she will advise you what is best for you & will not give you the hard sell, she also won't try & sell you stuff you don't need.
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does wfp stand for "want filthy panes?"
Or "Washes fairly poorly" ;D
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You didnt go to work then m8?
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I dont knock self builds thats why i set up Skypole because i have the personel at my disposal to build the systems
Although the first one was for my own window cleaners to use a few good years ago
but making them work constantly, improving and offering after care warrantees etc cost a lot of money so when selling systems around the world these costs need to be covered for a one off self use system then it dosent cost any thing to reproduce other systems,
And im afraid there is no difference between wfp system manufacturers or pressure wash manufacturers or building your own home
DO you pay some one to build a decked area in your garden or go to a shop buy it yourself and build it yourself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Competant people will do the latter BUT THE SAME ANSWER COMES
ITS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So self build or pay off the shelf
its up to each person.
we are here to offer advice / systems options / training sales / aftercare / warranty / we even help people that buy from others or have self built ask grafters who is a long time regular on here.
::)
rgds,
stuart
www.skypolesystems.com (http://www.skypolesystems.com)
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I dont knock self builds thats why i set up Skypole because i have the personel at my disposal to build the systems
Although the first one was for my own window cleaners to use a few good years ago
but making them work constantly, improving and offering after care warrantees etc cost a lot of money so when selling systems around the world these costs need to be covered for a one off self use system then it dosent cost any thing to reproduce other systems,
And im afraid there is no difference between wfp system manufacturers or pressure wash manufacturers or building your own home
DO you pay some one to build a decked area in your garden or go to a shop buy it yourself and build it yourself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Competant people will do the latter BUT THE SAME ANSWER COMES
ITS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So self build or pay off the shelf
its up to each person.
we are here to offer advice / systems options / training sales / aftercare / warranty / we even help people that buy from others or have self built ask grafters who is a long time regular on here.
::)
rgds,
stuart
www.skypolesystems.com (http://www.skypolesystems.com)
hi stuart
agree totally m8
from the man who built his own
jay
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AND I SAY
YES YES YES
;D
whats the merlin producing now then?
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Thanks for the replies guys.
I think what I was trying to ask is more along the lines of:
In your experience, what are the most important factors to consider before buying a system?
eg. pole weight? capacity of the water tank? access? water usage etc. etc.
Does hot water make any difference? How much water do you go through in a solid day's work? :-\
Maybe these are individual topics in their own right..
Maybe I'm just lazy and should plough through all the archives, I'm sure its covered ground. :P
Cheers
Mark
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My van system was installed by facelift, It looks impresive and I get a lot of new work by leaving the van doors open, If someone looks at my system they become a customer. I have picked up £1,350.00 of new work since I went wfp all domestic.
I hit the brakes hard last week doing 55mph and my 800ltr tank was full to the brim. No problem. the tank was fitted by an enginer and designed by an enginer and it gives me total confidence.
Below are two photos one is my van and the other is my mates diy system. I am not knocking his but I prefer mine for many reasons even though it cost more.
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Hi Mark,
Ive just finished building my own DIY system and I decided to build a system that I can grow into so I bought a Merlin RO set up at home feeding into a 1000L IBC which currently could produce around 2000L per 24 hours (more if I fitted a booster pump) although at the moment I need no more than 600L per day and thats with a lot of intial cleans so I'll see that drop below 400L when Im onto maintenance cleans, if you could tell me more about what your trying to achieve I might be of more help!
Although if I was building a system now:-
Id make sure the first IBC tank I bought had an 8" top opening rather than 5.5" because you cant get a sub pump into the 5.5" without cutting it open.
I bought an 18' pole from Gardiners (3 x 6' sections) because my work is generally 2 storey domestic but now I'd buy a 20' pole (but 5 x 4' sections) because that 18' pole is a pain on ground floor work and the extra 2' would be helpful for windows over large conservatories.
Although I have done this, I would recommend buying 100m hose instead of 60m - although ive got 40m of hose on the reel that will probably never get used I like to know its there.
If you are producing water at home and then transfering it to your van buy the largest delivery hose you can because I insisted on using 1/2" hose and it takes almost 1 hour to fill a 400L tank.
I wouldn't worry about DIY vs Bought because the pictures of the DIY above are shambolic and to be truthful my DIY system looks neater than the facelift system, its just down to time, a little skill and how much you care
Regards
Alistair
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Neil
I think your 2 pictures are very misleading. I have a DIY set up & mine doesn't look anything like the 1st picture.
Infact my set up looks just as neat as your's but probably cost half the price.
You say you have picked up loads of work, fair play to you, but do you think they are now your customers cos you have a posh van interior or because you are good at what you do?
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the neatness of the van comes down to the user
as some know, im a carpenter, and any1 i have worked with or for would tell you a top notch carpenter at that
i used to do some work for the council in the early 90's (the recession)
the council had a fair few carpenters, some who were "council trained", some who had just joined them for the "recession times" i was the latter
you could allways tell a council trained guy, his van would be neatly racked out, EVERYTHING had a place, i would sometimes team up with this guy called "sol" he was a nice enough guy, but had issues with tidyness, everything in his van had a home, fair enough i guess
BUT sol was a crap chippy, but if you looked in his van you would say "oh very professional, must do a great job", you would soon find different
where as my van would be a right mess, but i did a good job
so just because a van is tidy and clean, doesnt mean you do a better job
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at the end of the day it doesnt matter if you buy from a supplier or go down the self-build route. MAKE SURE YOU BUY WHAT YOU WANT AND NOT WHAT THEY WANT TO SELL YOU
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at the end of the day it doesnt matter if you buy from a supplier or go down the self-build route. MAKE SURE YOU BUY WHAT YOU WANT AND NOT WHAT THEY WANT TO SELL YOU
very good point
something that not every1 seems to follow
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the neatness of the van comes down to the user
as some know, im a carpenter, and any1 i have worked with or for would tell you a top notch carpenter at that
i used to do some work for the council in the early 90's (the recession)
the council had a fair few carpenters, some who were "council trained", some who had just joined them for the "recession times" i was the latter
you could allways tell a council trained guy, his van would be neatly racked out, EVERYTHING had a place, i would sometimes team up with this guy called "sol" he was a nice enough guy, but had issues with tidyness, everything in his van had a home, fair enough i guess
BUT sol was a crap chippy, but if you looked in his van you would say "oh very professional, must do a great job", you would soon find different
where as my van would be a right mess, but i did a good job
so just because a van is tidy and clean, doesnt mean you do a better job
I'm so relieved to hear that. You should see the mess in my van right now. I had some engine oil in there and the top came off.