Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Clear Vision on July 13, 2006, 06:02:33 pm
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Today was a total disaster. Most of the houses I did today have never been wfp'd
before.
I did one house and packed my stuff away in the van and the lady of the house came out & said "you can't leave it like that" pointing to her kitchen window.
I went to have a look and righ enough it was horific :o
Water had lurched up in the frame at the top and had ran down and spread. What a mess.
I am really confused? Some people say on a first clean you must wash the frame at the top and rinse well, then wash the window and rinse?
My theory is and I have proved it, is when water touches the top frame no matter how many cleans it had you are in trouble.
All the houses I did after that I managed to let water touch the top frame and when dry it was spotty.
What do I do?
Clear Vision
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Hi Clear Vision,
I am not sure why you are having this problem?
The points I can offer you are this
1) 1st cleans you need to do in 2 hits, frames and glass, then back after the whole house is done and then just clean the glass only.
2) NEVER get water into the air vents above as they are a nightmare and will always cause you problems.
3) Rinse, Rinse and Rinse again, if you have managed to get water up into the frame unless you give it a thorough rinse it will always drag out the dirt from underneath, you will really need to give it a good rinse and then when dry do the glass again without the top frame.
4) Remember, WFP is not the definitive awnswer to window cleaning, it is purely a safer and alternative method, you will come across some glass that just won't accept this method so you will have to clean it traditionally. Thankfully these are only few and far between, but it happens
I know you have had a hard day and no doubt are questioning yourself and WFP, all I can say is stick at it and it will come good.
Keep smiling
Best wishes,
Trev
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Thanks trev,
Will do exactly as you said!
What do you do on the second clean? Do you just do the glass and try to avoid touching the top of the frame?
I find it hard as I'm on my own. I take it personaly. I am the ONLY person responsible for making a mess. If I could afford to have someone with me that would give me that little extra confidence. Also I find it hard to walk away when the windows are still wet. Worried that will they dry spot free.
Does that make sense?
Clear Vision
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clear vision how have your customers taken to the wfp cleaning? im due to get it in the next month and not sure how they will take to it up these parts.
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Some very good and others just not sure about it all. Probably about 80% are not convinced.
What system are you planning?
There are no showrooms up here so it's quite hard to see different set ups.
If you want we could meet up one day and you could have a look at mine!
Matthew
Clear Vision
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clear vision.
i have a hospital appointment tomorrow (10.20) could meet you about lunchtime.
if not give me a day and i will come down.
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What hospital?
Dingwall or raigmore?
I will be working in muir-of-ord about that time tomorrow.
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raigmore. what time do you get finished in muir?
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Will be there most of the day. Prob finish about 3-4?
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thats ok for me then.i will drive through after ive finished at hosp.what van have you got?
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The first clean is obviously the most important one as this is getting all the dirt and grime off the frames etc....
On the second clean I just clean the glass and frames to the left/right and make sure I give a good rinse.
Rinsing is so so important, I can't stress it enough.
Wish I was nearer I could have helped you for a day.
Best wishes,
Trev
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Thats very kind of you to sugest that.
You could allways come up if you like. Not much room in the house. Would pitch a tent in the garden. Very quite. Live way out in the countryside.
Would really like someone with experiance to come out with me for a day and show me the ropes.
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Clear Vison,
No doubt after reading many posts on this forum, it would be understandable to think that using a WFP is far quicker than using ladders to gain access to your windows.
Actually, it is, but it takes a while and a fair bit of effort, sweat and toil to get to that point.
When you first start using a WFP, you've got to convince yourself and your customers that it does the job. That's bad enough to begin with.
Then you've got to do the work. Scrubbing all those frames that you (maybe/probably) avoided when cleaning trad.
My advice is to accept you're going to have a ROUGH month or two, and go overboard on every customer's windows.
Scrub the frames first, get them really clean, then return to clean the glass only; as Trev pointed out; and rinse at least twice on each window.
As your customers gain confidence in your system, and as your confidence grows too, you'll reach a point where you just give each window a quick rub over and a quick rinse and then move onto the next.
This doesn't happen overnight though.
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clear vision.
have you any writing on your van?? if not what kind of van have you got.
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Cheers tosh,
Will stick it out. One of the main things is when you go back to collect payment. Sometimes they will comment on spotting and I feel bad taking the normal price from them. Do you maybe knock off a quid the first time or do you still charge them the same??
Matthew
Clear Vision
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This is my van. Let me know what time you are likely to be in the muir and I will wait for you.
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matt i reckon i will be there about 1 o clock maybe before.will see you in muir. 8)
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Cheers tosh,
Will stick it out. One of the main things is when you go back to collect payment. Sometimes they will comment on spotting and I feel bad taking the normal price from them. Do you maybe knock off a quid the first time or do you still charge them the same??
Matthew
Clear Vision
Matthew,
I didn't get much resistance when I first started using a WFP, but that was probably because I/we haven't went the whole hog. We only do 1st floor and above usually, apart from Geogian or Leaded windows.
Have a look in the 'Documents to Upload' Section and download David@StIves WFP letter of explanation and numptyize it to your requirements.
Also, be thick skinned. It's not much fun when you turn upto someone's house, with your pole and they're looking at you like you're daft; water going everywhere!
Just go overboard, with lots of scrubbing and rinsing; work hard and you'll enjoy the benifits in future repeat cleans.
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matt i reckon i will be there about 1 o clock maybe before.will see you in muir. 8)
See you in the square!
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ok matt thats fine.
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I treat the frames and glass as one and clean the whole lot everytime.
I never get a problem with any windows this way.
The only time i dont clean the top frame is if there is an air vent then i just clean up to the airvent.
I don't think you can really avoid getting the top frame wet so you may as well clean it.
Paul
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Hi Matthew,
Create a new post and ask for someone to help you with a day out WFP.
I am sure you will get a reply and hopefully this will put your mind at rest.
Best wishes,
Trev
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Today was a total disaster. Most of the houses I did today have never been wfp'd
before.
I did one house and packed my stuff away in the van and the lady of the house came out & said "you can't leave it like that" pointing to her kitchen window.
I went to have a look and righ enough it was horific :o
Water had lurched up in the frame at the top and had ran down and spread. What a mess.
I am really confused? Some people say on a first clean you must wash the frame at the top and rinse well, then wash the window and rinse?
My theory is and I have proved it, is when water touches the top frame no matter how many cleans it had you are in trouble.
All the houses I did after that I managed to let water touch the top frame and when dry it was spotty.
What do I do?
Clear Vision
I also had troubles at first with those first cleans. The customers who let me get it right at my own pace now get a decent quality job. Those few who put me on a "last chance" after the first clean didn't hear from me again - it's not my fault they couldn't be bothered to read my explanatory leaflet. I didn't go self-employed to have people going through a verbal warning scenario as if they were an employer.
What I now do with first cleans is to scrub all the frames and glass with the first pass. Second pass I do glass only. In recent times, if I sense the customer might be a bit more picky, I do a third pass rinsing only with the brush off the glass. This may well be overkill but I prefer to do it this way rather than lose a job. I realise that this is very time consuming. The problem is that with existing customers, you can't really charge more for a first WFP clean. However, with new customers, you can. All my first cleans with WFP are now new customers so I price the first clean a fair bit higher. It still doesn't fully compensate me for the extra time taken but at least it's partially covered.
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Hi Matthew,
Create a new post and ask for someone to help you with a day out WFP.
I am sure you will get a reply and hopefully this will put your mind at rest.
Best wishes,
Trev
Trev,
I really dont think anyone would come up to inverness? Do you?
Anyway I went out today and did exactly what you said with the top frames.
I cleaned the whole frame then the glass and move onto the next window. After I finished the house I went back to the start and did only the glass. Results were quite good! Thanks for advise trev & everyone else.
The only problem was it took ages. I'm going to be well behind with my work now :'( How will I ever catch up?
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When will it start to get quicker? After I have done the top frame the first time?
Clear Vision
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Hi Matthew,
Create a new post and ask for someone to help you with a day out WFP.
I am sure you will get a reply and hopefully this will put your mind at rest.
Best wishes,
Trev
Trev,
I really dont think anyone would come up to inverness? Do you?
Anyway I went out today and did exactly what you said with the top frames.
I cleaned the whole frame then the glass and move onto the next window. After I finished the house I went back to the start and did only the glass. Results were quite good! Thanks for advise trev & everyone else.
The only problem was it took ages. I'm going to be well behind with my work now :'( How will I ever catch up?
Although others have said differently, this was why I converted my customer base to WFP in sections. Once I got a fair bit behind, I would revert back to trad and play catch up. First time around I converted one third of the work. Second time around, I did two thirds of it by WFP. Third time around, I did the lot.
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Hi Matthew,
Glad the results are getting better.
I am glad you said it took you ages as first cleans always do!!
On average a first clean will take 2 sometimes 3 times as long as normal. If you are converting your round in one hit the only way to keep up is to work 6 days. Alternatively as others have said, convert customers over in blocks. Maybe do your biggest accounts first, or any leaded or awkward houses.
Glad its getting better for you, it reall is just a matter of time and practice.
Any more help please just ask.
Best wishes,
Trev
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On a first clean most of the work goes into cleaning the frame.
You cant stop the water touching the frame. particularly the top where the muck has accumulated.
Give the frame a good going over with the brush first and rinse it off. The brush will shift the dirt but you need to wash it down. Then do the window.
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Thanks trev & everyone else.
I came across a wee problem yesterday. There is a row of about 8 houses and I clean the one in the middle. When I did it with the ladders I gained access through next doors garden and round the back that way. How can I do it now?
P.S. Is there anyone out there who would come out with me for a day to help and show me the ropes. There are no window cleaners local who have a wfp and there are no shops. So I've had to do it on my own, but am unsure if I'm doing it the right way?
Clear Vision
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Thanks trev & everyone else.
I came across a wee problem yesterday. There is a row of about 8 houses and I clean the one in the middle. When I did it with the ladders I gained access through next doors garden and round the back that way. How can I do it now?
P.S. Is there anyone out there who would come out with me for a day to help and show me the ropes. There are no window cleaners local who have a wfp and there are no shops. So I've had to do it on my own, but am unsure if I'm doing it the right way?
Clear Vision
Not sure what equipment you have but a trolley or backpack are usually fine for this. If no backpack and the trolley won't fit, take the trolley as far as you can and connect a hosereel up to it for the rest of the way?
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I have a trolley system that I usually leave in the van and treat as a static system. I only have 30m of hose on a reel which is mounted in the van. I ordered 100m of hose which should be here by the end of the month!
I use a 250l lay flat baffled tank.
A back pack would be great. I have often thought of purchasing one but do you have to convert it to work with the window cleaners tools? ie: hose/fittings?
Clear Vision
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i started wfp ma houses and started losing custom coz old dear couldn't understand why i left wter on the windows ???,i also stopped getting tips at christmas aswell try stick to laddering houses if you can mate ;)
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Had a good day today :D It was slow as I was scrubbing and rinsing the frames but the results were quite good considering they were first wfp cleans!
Thanks for all your help and advise
Clear Vision
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dlink:theres your annswer ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D annother one nearly connverted ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
gaza