Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: simon w on April 04, 2020, 10:37:04 pm
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If so can you recommend a site that sells surgical masks (keeps the covid out) packs of fifty for a decent price? prefer the ones with elastic loops for the ears rather than the fiddly tie in a bow types.
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586037848_3AFA7AAA-3455-45ED-B9C7-DE87C5D51D4B.jpeg)
I can knock a few up by tuesday?
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Is that Mrs Willis?? Was she expecting a nose bleed ;D
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If so can you recommend a site that sells surgical masks (keeps the covid out) packs of fifty for a decent price? prefer the ones with elastic loops for the ears rather than the fiddly tie in a bow types.
I don't think the public can currently purchase them.
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Really? there must have been two hundred people walking around Costco wearing them today. Quite funny when you see people stick them on there head so they can have a puff on their electric cigarettes
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Let us know if you have any luck. As far as I am aware, the Government has purchased all stock within the UK.
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Joking to one side, it aint hard to make one.
The filter can be a tight bonded material which you can fold into some cotton like material and secured to your face.
Or.alternatively wear a scary mask which that you might wear when chemical cleaning, plus glasses for eye protection. 😂😂
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586039225_Screenshot_20200404-232608_WhatsApp.jpg)
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Let us know if you have any luck. As far as I am aware, the Government has purchased all stock within the UK.
Maybe they were all keyworkers doing their shopping :D
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Joking to one side, it aint hard to make one.
The filter can be a tight bonded material which you can fold into some cotton like material and secured to your face.
Or.alternatively wear a scary mask which that you might wear when chemical cleaning, plus glasses for eye protection. 😂😂
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586039225_Screenshot_20200404-232608_WhatsApp.jpg)
Yes have you seen Dave's Mrs demonstrating a DIY mask as pictured above :o
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586046554_MASK PROTECTION..jpg)
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Okay, here's my understanding; if you want a mask to protect yourself, go for a full face visor. It'll even stop spittle and stuff getting into your eyes. NHS front line staff use these because they work close up to covid-19 patients.
But otherwise even a scarf would do to stop you sneezing/coughing the Chinese plague around the shop if/when you're asymptomatic, which means you're infected but show no symptoms. You can be asymptomatic for around three days and not know it. The scarf would be more effective than using your elbow, and defo better than using your hands which you'd then touch other stuff with.
Yes, the virus is extremely small and can pass though a scarf, but most of it is attached to your snot/cough droplets, which would be caught by the weave of the scarf.
The scarf/mask isn't there to protect the wearer, but to protect everyone else.
That's my understanding; happy to be wrong.
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Front door for us.
Gloves next week, maybe.
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Front door for us.
Gloves next week, maybe.
You stupid idiot. ;D
It's hard to go shopping for my high risk neighbour with a front door strapped to my face.
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COVID-19: WHY WE SHOULD ALL WEAR MASKS — THERE IS NEW SCIENTIFIC RATIONALE
https://medium.com/@Cancerwarrior/covid-19-why-we-should-all-wear-masks-there-is-new-scientific-rationale-280e08ceee71?
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586050461_MASK.jpg)
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586050376_MASK PROTECTION..jpg)
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Front door for us.
Gloves next week, maybe.
You stupid idiot. ;D
It's hard to go shopping for my high risk neighbour with a front door strapped to my face.
For us it's worked.
I'll send the Missus out shopping next week. She'll be in the clear then. I'm indispensable and I'll be faced with drinking sherry and Crème de Menthe if she doesn't go.
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Why does everyone assume that everyone else has the virus..... Keep away, ye are a covid witch.....
You might be the one whose infected?
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COVID-19: WHY WE SHOULD ALL WEAR MASKS — THERE IS NEW SCIENTIFIC RATIONALE
https://medium.com/@Cancerwarrior/covid-19-why-we-should-all-wear-masks-there-is-new-scientific-rationale-280e08ceee71?
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586050461_MASK.jpg)
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586050376_MASK PROTECTION..jpg)
Oh Lord, Einstein’s on the case.
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Screwfix is currently ringfencing stock of personal protective equipment (PPE) to donate to those fantastic frontline NHS staff. We have currently withdrawn from sale selected PPE products until further notice to ensure we can distribute this to where it is most in need. Thank you for your patience.
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
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I've got a few in the garage but no I'm not wearing them for window cleaning.
I can see why you might want one in a crowded supermarket though.
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I've got a few in the garage but no I'm not wearing them for window cleaning.
I can see why you might want one in a crowded supermarket though.
yeah that's the only reason I'd wear one. I've one left over from floor sanding last year. Only the cheap 59p one from screw fix. In the local chemist yesterday shocked to see same mask in a pack of five being sold for a tenner. The proper filtered medical grades were £35 each :o
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Screwfix is currently ringfencing stock of personal protective equipment (PPE) to donate to those fantastic frontline NHS staff. We have currently withdrawn from sale selected PPE products until further notice to ensure we can distribute this to where it is most in need. Thank you for your patience.
Arco stopped customers coming into their store last week but allowed me to come in and choose items for new work uniforms (high viz for safety) I couldn't do my order in the store but he wrote all the serial numbers down so I could do it on-line later. I dis notice they had a massive box full of Teal Skytec Nitrile gloves so jokingly I said " you couldn't sell me a few boxes of those could you?" he sold me five boxes for cash.
Just after the surgical masks now Joe public can be seen wearing them so surely they can be sourced somewhere.
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I've got a few in the garage but no I'm not wearing them for window cleaning.
I can see why you might want one in a crowded supermarket though.
Because the idea of you catching it frightens you more than the idea you may be spreading it ?
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
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Just to be clear I'm not planning on me or staff wearing face masks for work. More for myself and family when leaving the house for shopping etc.
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A customer of mine made her own out of a pillow case and it looked just as good as the one s being sold in shops
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Not sure if I should wear mine in the Bank on Monday. Don’t want to breathe in all those germs off my £50 notes.
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What sort of message would wearing a mask give to the public?
I don't understand.
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A customer of mine made her own out of a pillow case and it looked just as good as the one s being sold in shops
With some fine bonded material in between the folds then why not. If its just the pillow case material its a bit pointless
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Not sure if I should wear mine in the Bank on Monday. Don’t want to breathe in all those germs off my £50 notes.
Yep and the pistol in the back pocket for crowd control may not help either 😂😂
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I'm guessing the objections to the full burqa/niqab will have to die down a bit now.
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Ive got mine, home-made albeit, but it should help.
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586088140_main-qimg-8a7dc7f8d2bd8f6b302a866cb564e7f2.png)
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What sort of message would wearing a mask give to the public?
I don't understand.
I don't want to be catching your germs ;)
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What sort of message would wearing a mask give to the public?
I don't understand.
I don't want to be catching your germs ;)
And is that a bad thing?
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What sort of message would wearing a mask give to the public?
I don't understand.
I don't want to be catching your germs ;)
And is that a bad thing?
Do you consider catching germs/virus a good thing or bad thing?
When your out in public do you think "Oh good I might catch someones germs"?? No I didn't think so ;D
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Do you consider catching germs/virus a good thing or bad thing?
I think for most of us it'll be a good thing. As long as the medical services aren't over-stretched at the time (just in case we're in the minority that react badly to it).
This isn't as weird as it sounds; before the 1960s when vaccinations became the norm, mum's would hold measles parties where all the kids would go around a play in the house of a child who has the measles.
It gave them immunity. Measles when your young isn't a problem. Measles when you're older is serious.
Without a vaccine, the herd immunity that so many scoffed at, is probably the only viable exit strategy.
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One thing I've never really considered before is that we are all walking around spitting In each others mouths without knowing.
Droplets, dirty pigs. :-\
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What sort of message would wearing a mask give to the public?
I don't understand.
I don't want to be catching your germs ;)
And is that a bad thing?
Do you consider catching germs/virus a good thing or bad thing?
When your out in public do you think "Oh good I might catch someones germs"?? No I didn't think so ;D
I'm talking about the message not the germs.
Is it sending out a bad message to the public by wearing a mask? A couple of people have posted- that's why I didn't just use the quote function- that 'what message would it send to the public'.
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Do you consider catching germs/virus a good thing or bad thing?
I think for most of us it'll be a good thing. As long as the medical services aren't over-stretched at the time (just in case we're in the minority that react badly to it).
This isn't as weird as it sounds; before the 1960s when vaccinations became the norm, mum's would hold measles parties where all the kids would go around a play in the house of a child who has the measles.
It gave them immunity. Measles when your young isn't a problem. Measles when you're older is serious.
Without a vaccine, the herd immunity that so many scoffed at, is probably the only viable exit strategy.
This is what I think the gov are doing.
They haven't locked us down to the extent of other countries because they still want some circulation and immunity build up.
They are just trying to flatten the curve so the NHS are not overwhelmed at any one time but as a consequence this thing will go on longer because the curve is pushed forward.
They will only tighten up measures if the NHS is overwhelmed as they need to balance the economy with infection rates whilst trying to build immunity as well.
China showed that a strict lockdown can stop this thing dead but we are not playing the same game.
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China showed that a strict lockdown can stop this thing dead but we are not playing the same game.
It didn't stop it dead; it's like 'whack-a-mole':
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-02/chinese-county-back-under-lockdown-after-infection-re-emerges
You lock down one place and it gets better only to pop up somewhere else.
Lots scoffed at herd immunity but they couldn't come up with something better.
I think you're right though; the government's strategy is still herd immunity, it's just they haven't - yet - got the balls to say it. ;D
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China showed that a strict lockdown can stop this thing dead but we are not playing the same game.
It didn't stop it dead; it's like 'whack-a-mole':
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-04-02/chinese-county-back-under-lockdown-after-infection-re-emerges
You lock down one place and it gets better only to pop up somewhere else.
Lots scoffed at herd immunity but they couldn't come up with something better.
I think you're right though; the government's strategy is still herd immunity, it's just they haven't - yet - got the balls to say it. ;D
Yeh, I get that, a strict lockdown does halt it but what happens when it's released is a different story and why the gov haven't gone that route.
Bottom line is they want us to get it, just not all at once, at a rate the NHS can cope with. Or try to cope with.
I personally think this thing will be dragged out slowly for a year, until we get a vaccine the best hope is just to slow it whilst trying to keep the economy alive.
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One of Britain's most flamboyant aristocrats has sadly died of covid this weekend Lord Bath Mr Longleat Safari Park died in Bath Royal on Saturday.
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I don't think the government are using herd immunity. I don't think they know enough about immunity to it to carry it out.
That's why we are in lockdown; though it could be stricter.
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
Ok whatever, so by wearing one in that case, you are almost admitting/sowing a seed of doubt to the customer that you have an infection or possibly have one without knowing for sure but not wanting to risk it. In either case you should stay home and away from people and off the streets.
I'd wear one in a busy supermarket where I was concerned of a 2 meter rule not being viable, but I've so far avoided that by using smaller local stores outside peak hours.
All week I've seen people walking along the seafront self distanced more than adequately from others with these stupid unnecessary masks on. As if fresh air is somehow detrimental to their well being. Its ridiculous and over the top. Even seen people wearing them whilst driving their own cars !
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
Ok whatever, so by wearing one in that case, you are almost admitting/sowing a seed of doubt to the customer that you have an infection or possibly have one without knowing for sure but not wanting to risk it. In either case you should stay home and away from people and off the streets.
I'd wear one in a busy supermarket where I was concerned of a 2 meter rule not being viable, but I've so far avoided that by using smaller local stores outside peak hours.
All week I've seen people walking along the seafront self distanced more than adequately from others with these stupid unnecessary masks on. As if fresh air is somehow detrimental to their well being. Its ridiculous and over the top. Even seen people wearing them whilst driving their own cars !
That's not how I would look at it. It just shows that you are taking the virus and the risks of you spreading it seriously.
Let's be clear I've never worn one and I don't have any, yet. If and when we go back to work we'll be wearing them.
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
Ok whatever, so by wearing one in that case, you are almost admitting/sowing a seed of doubt to the customer that you have an infection or possibly have one without knowing for sure but not wanting to risk it. In either case you should stay home and away from people and off the streets.
I'd wear one in a busy supermarket where I was concerned of a 2 meter rule not being viable, but I've so far avoided that by using smaller local stores outside peak hours.
All week I've seen people walking along the seafront self distanced more than adequately from others with these stupid unnecessary masks on. As if fresh air is somehow detrimental to their well being. Its ridiculous and over the top. Even seen people wearing them whilst driving their own cars !
That's not how I would look at it. It just shows that you are taking the virus and the risks of you spreading it seriously.
Let's be clear I've never worn one and I don't have any, yet. If and when we go back to work we'll be wearing them.
Its not how you would look at it , its how your customers would surely ?
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
Ok whatever, so by wearing one in that case, you are almost admitting/sowing a seed of doubt to the customer that you have an infection or possibly have one without knowing for sure but not wanting to risk it. In either case you should stay home and away from people and off the streets.
I'd wear one in a busy supermarket where I was concerned of a 2 meter rule not being viable, but I've so far avoided that by using smaller local stores outside peak hours.
All week I've seen people walking along the seafront self distanced more than adequately from others with these stupid unnecessary masks on. As if fresh air is somehow detrimental to their well being. Its ridiculous and over the top. Even seen people wearing them whilst driving their own cars !
That's not how I would look at it. It just shows that you are taking the virus and the risks of you spreading it seriously.
Let's be clear I've never worn one and I don't have any, yet. If and when we go back to work we'll be wearing them.
Its not how you would look at it , its how your customers would surely ?
So what do you think about your postie wearing gloves?
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I don't think the government are using herd immunity. I don't think they know enough about immunity to it to carry it out.
That's why we are in lockdown; though it could be stricter.
Of course they are because they can't keep us in lock down for 12 to 18 months till a vaccine is created. Trump puts it well 'The cure cannot be worse than the disease'. A 12 to 18 month lock down would kill hundreds of thousands of people through the loss of GDP.
So the plan looks like:
1. Create extra capacity in the NHS for the increased demand (think Nightingale hospitals).
2. Shield the high risk (over 70s and those with underlying health problems that puts them at specific risk).
3. Lock down to flatten the curve (so that No 1 can be implemented).
Unleash the Chinese plague on everyone else.
There might be variants of the above plan, but that's the principle of the plan. It's just that government hasn't the balls to tell us. ;D
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''1. Create extra capacity in the NHS for the increased demand (think Nightingale hospitals).
2. Shield the high risk (over 70s and those with underlying health problems that puts them at specific risk).
3. Lock down to flatten the curve (so that No 1 can be implemented).
Unleash the Chinese plague on everyone else.''
I have to say I totally agree with this.
That is the only way out as far as I can see. Otherwise this will either continue for months and months or else it'll just return and we have to go through this again and again.
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I have to say I totally agree with this.
It will increase the possibility that granddad may die a little before his time.
The other choice is to wreck the economy so badly that your kids will be poorer throughout the whole of their lives and have a shorter life expectancy.
People keep telling me that life isn't easy. ;D
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Wearing mask to work.?.... seriously ? ..... What sort of message do you think that would send to a customer or anyone who saw you out.?
Absolutely agree! I know myself that I have explained why I am still working in a text to my clients and on my facebook business page. Also my instagram business page!
Explaining how low risk my job is in actually speaking/touching people. So if we start wearing masks to work, we might as well close down and stay in!
They're saying that masks help stop you spreading it, not catching it.
Ok whatever, so by wearing one in that case, you are almost admitting/sowing a seed of doubt to the customer that you have an infection or possibly have one without knowing for sure but not wanting to risk it. In either case you should stay home and away from people and off the streets.
I'd wear one in a busy supermarket where I was concerned of a 2 meter rule not being viable, but I've so far avoided that by using smaller local stores outside peak hours.
All week I've seen people walking along the seafront self distanced more than adequately from others with these stupid unnecessary masks on. As if fresh air is somehow detrimental to their well being. Its ridiculous and over the top. Even seen people wearing them whilst driving their own cars !
That's not how I would look at it. It just shows that you are taking the virus and the risks of you spreading it seriously.
Let's be clear I've never worn one and I don't have any, yet. If and when we go back to work we'll be wearing them.
Its not how you would look at it , its how your customers would surely ?
So what do you think about your postie wearing gloves?
I've no problem with them wearing gloves ( I have too ). I wouldn't have a problem with them wearing a mask either if it came to it but they are key workers doing an essential job. People can argue this until the cows come home but the window cleaning of domestic houses is non essential. IF it came to it and anybody outside in public was required to wear a mask, I wouldn't be working and I think the majority of customers would feel the same.
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I don't think the government are using herd immunity. I don't think they know enough about immunity to it to carry it out.
That's why we are in lockdown; though it could be stricter.
Of course they are because they can't keep us in lock down for 12 to 18 months till a vaccine is created. Trump puts it well 'The cure cannot be worse than the disease'. A 12 to 18 month lock down would kill hundreds of thousands of people through the loss of GDP.
So the plan looks like:
1. Create extra capacity in the NHS for the increased demand (think Nightingale hospitals).
2. Shield the high risk (over 70s and those with underlying health problems that puts them at specific risk).
3. Lock down to flatten the curve (so that No 1 can be implemented).
Unleash the Chinese plague on everyone else.
There might be variants of the above plan, but that's the principle of the plan. It's just that government hasn't the balls to tell us. ;D
I disagree with you.
For herd immunity to work you need to know about the immunity or have a vaccine and they don't.
I might be a few weeks behind on this and I might be wrong but I don't think either of the above apply.
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People can argue this until the cows come home but the window cleaning of domestic houses is non essential.
My neighbour wanted some bread and milk to go with his morning paper the other day. He's in his 70s and he has this for three months.
I didn't say, is that newspaper really essential? Bread? Milk? Haven't you any of that pasta left I bought you? What about those four tins of beans I got you on Tuesday? Have you really eaten all that? Is this really essential shopping?
Why not have some pasta and beans?
Instead, I just went to the shop and bought him what he wanted.
What the government really want is to stop the bell-thronks who were out in their droves this weekend, in parks and at the beach, not doing social distancing and sunbathing.
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I disagree with you.
For herd immunity to work you need to know about the immunity or have a vaccine and they don't.
I might be a few weeks behind on this and I might be wrong but I don't think either of the above apply.
They know how herd immunity works.
And you don't need a vaccine to create it either. Before my time, but in the 50s and into the 60s mummies would have Measles parties where one kid got the measles and they'd get all the other kids to play with them.
Measels when you're a kid is not a problem. Measles when you're older is.
And this created a herd immunity too. No vaccine required, but obviously a vaccine is a better answer.
Your granny knew about this stuff back in the 1950s.
And since we don't have a vaccine, what other options are there, other than herd immunity?
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I disagree with you.
For herd immunity to work you need to know about the immunity or have a vaccine and they don't.
I might be a few weeks behind on this and I might be wrong but I don't think either of the above apply.
They know how herd immunity works.
And you don't need a vaccine to create it either. Before my time, but in the 50s and into the 60s mummies would have Measles parties where one kid got the measles and they'd get all the other kids to play with them.
Measels when you're a kid is not a problem. Measles when you're older is.
And this created a herd immunity too. No vaccine required, but obviously a vaccine is a better answer.
Your granny knew about this stuff back in the 1950s.
And since we don't have a vaccine, what other options are there, other than herd immunity?
They knew more about measles than they do coronavirus. They don't know much about immunity to it.
It's a new virus.
Are you saying that this lockdown is in preparation for herd immunity?
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They knew more about measles than they do coronavirus. They don't know much about immunity to it.
It's a new virus.
Are you saying that this lockdown is in preparation for herd immunity?
I've explained exactly what I think the lockdown is for. See my above post.
And they'll know enough about herd immunity and the coronavirus.
But again, I'm interested to hear what you think is an alternative exit strategy?
Lock everyone down for 12 to 18 months? Or repeated lockdowns? I believe Trump to be speaking the truth when he says the cure cannot be worse than the illness.
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''1. Create extra capacity in the NHS for the increased demand (think Nightingale hospitals).
2. Shield the high risk (over 70s and those with underlying health problems that puts them at specific risk).
3. Lock down to flatten the curve (so that No 1 can be implemented).
Unleash the Chinese plague on everyone else.''
I have to say I totally agree with this.
That is the only way out as far as I can see. Otherwise this will either continue for months and months or else it'll just return and we have to go through this again and again.
Just have to hope every other Country in the World follows suit then, or it won't work unless everyone does it.
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They knew more about measles than they do coronavirus. They don't know much about immunity to it.
It's a new virus.
Are you saying that this lockdown is in preparation for herd immunity?
I've explained exactly what I think the lockdown is for. See my above post.
And they'll know enough about herd immunity and the coronavirus.
But again, I'm interested to hear what you think is an alternative exit strategy?
Lock everyone down for 12 to 18 months? Or repeated lockdowns? I believe Trump to be speaking the truth when he says the cure cannot be worse than the illness.
Are you saying that they know enough about coronavirus immunity to use herd immunity? I didn't think they did but if you know better, I'm eager to learn.
I don't have an alternative exit strategy. Why would I have?
As for the cure being worse than the illness, it depends on how you measure that. And even Trump has had a rethink, so I don't think that it his truth anymore.
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Just have to hope every other Country in the World follows suit then, or it won't work unless everyone does it.
Maybe the world won't get a choice in the matter?
And remember, foreign travel is a fairly recent thing. Before vaccinations if you went to emigrate to a foreign country you'd be put in some kind of holding facility (Statten Island in the USA for example) for a period of time and these holding facilities have grave yards full of those who ended up with some kind of plague.
We're also very lucky living in a first world country. The continent of Africa, India, much of SE Asia; these countries are going to be hit hardest. In India they've something daft like four ventilators per million people. Four, ffs.
They'll get herd immunity before us, and not in a good way.
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Are you saying that they know enough about coronavirus immunity to use herd immunity?
Yes, they know about herd immunity, they know you have some level of immunity if you recover from the Chinese Plague. What they don't know is the fine detail.
I don't have an alternative exit strategy. Why would I have?
Because you seem to think the only viable solution won't work. In the absence of the impossible, that only leaves the possible.
As for the cure being worse than the illness, it depends on how you measure that.
In poverty by the loss of GDP, shortened life expectancy and deaths. How else would you measure it? A tape measure? ;D
And even Trump has had a rethink, so I don't think that it his truth anymore.
He just said the cure can't be worse than the illness yesterday. Follow him on Twitter and listen to the daily briefings. ;D
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People can argue this until the cows come home but the window cleaning of domestic houses is non essential.
My neighbour wanted some bread and milk to go with his morning paper the other day. He's in his 70s and he has this for three months.
I didn't say, is that newspaper really essential? Bread? Milk? Haven't you any of that pasta left I bought you? What about those four tins of beans I got you on Tuesday? Have you really eaten all that? Is this really essential shopping?
Why not have some pasta and beans?
Instead, I just went to the shop and bought him what he wanted.
What the government really want is to stop the bell-thronks who were out in their droves this weekend, in parks and at the beach, not doing social distancing and sunbathing.
I agree but a shop is an essential service even if what you are going in there for isn't essential. I'm not sure what any of that has to do with masks though. If a stricter enforced lockdown were to happen and the wearing of masks became mandatory I don't think window cleaning would be seen as essential or even permitted.
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If a stricter enforced lockdown were to happen and the wearing of masks became mandatory I don't think window cleaning would be seen as essential or even permitted.
Other countries have implemented compulsory masks only at certain places. Such as when going into a supermarket you must wear one.
Not for being outside where the risk of anything airborne is greatly reduced.
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Are you saying that they know enough about coronavirus immunity to use herd immunity?
Yes, they know about herd immunity, they know you have some level of immunity if you recover from the Chinese Plague. What they don't know is the fine detail.
I don't have an alternative exit strategy. Why would I have?
Because you seem to think the only viable solution won't work. In the absence of the impossible, that only leaves the possible.
As for the cure being worse than the illness, it depends on how you measure that.
In poverty by the loss of GDP, shortened life expectancy and deaths. How else would you measure it? A tape measure? ;D
And even Trump has had a rethink, so I don't think that it his truth anymore.
He just said the cure can't be worse than the illness yesterday. Follow him on Twitter and listen to the daily briefings. ;D
Some level of immunity?
Do you think that that is enough to use herd immunity?
I never said that the only viable solution won't work. I said that I don't believe that the government are using herd immunity.
Can we predict the loss of GDP, shortened life expectancy and deaths by not using herd immunity? And Trump keeps changing his mind anyway. He actually said that the cure cannot be worse than the problem itself.
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Some level of immunity?
Do you think that that is enough to use herd immunity?
Yes, Prof Chris Whitty said so on one of his first ever briefings. Before the Guardian got angry at him. ;D
He said even if it's only a short-lived immunity, that would be enough to create herd immunity and defeat the corona.
I never said that the only viable solution won't work. I said that I don't believe that the government are using herd immunity.
Why don't you believe it? They said they would. The Guardian got angry. They Gov then went quiet about it. Still doing it though, like lots of other countries; govs just not got the balls to be open about it. ;D
Can we predict the loss of GDP, shortened life expectancy and deaths by not using herd immunity? And Trump keeps changing his mind anyway. He actually said that the cure cannot be worse than the problem itself.
Yes, in that I think it's fair to say that GDP will plummet if the world doesn't get back working. And we know what happens when GDP drops (poverty, shorter life expectancy, and lots of preventable deaths but over a much longer term).
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Oh, and standby for the UK's Covid-19 exit strategy to become a political football. Sir Starmer is already talking about it.
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Some level of immunity?
Do you think that that is enough to use herd immunity?
Yes, Prof Chris Whitty said so on one of his first ever briefings. Before the Guardian got angry at him. ;D
He said even if it's only a short-lived immunity, that would be enough to create herd immunity and defeat the corona.
I never said that the only viable solution won't work. I said that I don't believe that the government are using herd immunity.
Why don't you believe it? They said they would. The Guardian got angry. They Gov then went quiet about it. Still doing it though, like lots of other countries; govs just not got the balls to be open about it. ;D
Can we predict the loss of GDP, shortened life expectancy and deaths by not using herd immunity? And Trump keeps changing his mind anyway. He actually said that the cure cannot be worse than the problem itself.
Yes, in that I think it's fair to say that GDP will plummet if the world doesn't get back working. And we know what happens when GDP drops (poverty, shorter life expectancy, and lots of preventable deaths but over a much longer term).
I disagree with you.
It doesn't matter what you say because I don't think it is happening. When it happens, it might matter to me.
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I disagree with you.
It doesn't matter what you say because I don't think it is happening. When it happens, it might matter to me.
It's cool with me if you disagree.
It's just disappointing you can't say why.
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I disagree with you.
It doesn't matter what you say because I don't think it is happening. When it happens, it might matter to me.
It's cool with me if you disagree.
It's just disappointing you can't say why.
Don't let me control your emotions.
But I've told you: I don't think that herd immunity is happening and you think that it is.
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Oh, and standby for the UK's Covid-19 exit strategy to become a political football. Sir Starmer is already talking about it.
Sir Keir. ;)
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AND SIMON SAYS DO YOU KNOW ANYWHERE THAT SELLS F###*** MASKS FFS
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But I've told you: I don't think that herd immunity is happening and you think that it is.
Yes, Griff, but I've explained why I think it is the UK's exit strategy, in some detail. Basically because there isn't another one.
But all you say is "No, I don't like it, it's not happening". ;D
Without explaining why. ;)
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Yes, in that I think it's fair to say that GDP will plummet if the world doesn't get back working.
Right now i'd doubt the majority are concerned about GDP. I find it amazing the amount of workers we actually need to keep us fed, warm, watered etc.. the basics. Walk in some beauty spot or a weekend away now seems like an absolute luxury.
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Right now i'd doubt the majority are concerned about GDP.
I agree, but that doesn't change the fact that a drop in GDP will affect the long term health of the nation.
That to one side, here's a decent BBC newsnight article about the UK's exit strategy and compares our approach with Sweden's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypdVMIZrMVU
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Walk in some beauty spot or a weekend away now seems like an absolute luxury.
**Swings Lantern and pulls up sandbag** I once spent six months living in a tent in the desert. No electric lights, no hot and cold running water, we shit in holes in the ground with no bushes to hide behind. I did my No 2s in the dark otherwise while squatting, helicopters would fly low and buzz you, or your mates would throw stones at you. Dark was much safer.
We had to wash our own clothes in metal basins. My sleeping bag wasn't washed or replaced once in six months. The food the cooks made us was the only slop we ate, with the exception of the odd 'red cross parcel' sent from home. Flippin' tortured by flies during the day and especially at meal times.
For sex I'd wait till Andy Palmer went on stag and I'd borrow a clean spare army sock from his bergen and have sex with that; carefully putting it back into his rucksack after I'd finished abusing it (he wasn't happy with me when I told him back in Germany).
But I remember getting back to my barracks in Germany; a real bed, electric lights, TVs, microwaves, flushing bogs, hot showers, washing machines, beer and women. It really was like heaven.
You don't know what you've got until you lose it.
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Walk in some beauty spot or a weekend away now seems like an absolute luxury.
**Swings Lantern and pulls up sandbag** I once spent six months living in a tent in the desert. No electric lights, no hot and cold running water, we shit in holes in the ground with no bushes to hide behind. I did my No 2s in the dark otherwise while squatting, helicopters would fly low and buzz you, or your mates would throw stones at you. Dark was much safer.
We had to wash our own clothes in metal basins. My sleeping bag wasn't washed or replaced once in six months. The food the cooks made us was the only slop we ate, with the exception of the odd 'red cross parcel' sent from home. Flippin' tortured by flies during the day and especially at meal times.
For sex I'd wait till Andy Palmer went on stag and I'd borrow a clean spare army sock from his bergen and have sex with that; carefully putting it back into his rucksack after I'd finished abusing it (he wasn't happy with me when I told him back in Germany).
Thats pretty much how i live now, thats why i usually enjoy my weekends.
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BREAKING: British Prime Minister BorisJohnson admitted to hospital tonight for tests due to persistent #coronavirus symptoms 10 days after testing positive.
Worrying development - he's looked worse each time we've seen him, poor guy. Wish him well.
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I reckon the government will slowly introduce herd community whilst keeping crowds to the bare minimum.
Economic disaster will last much longer than covid19. Government waiting 'til scientists in general advise them the worst is over for the first wave and will monitor the situation with hospitals according to how A&E's are managing the pandemic.
Wish Boris a speedy recovery.
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I wear 1 when I go shopping with surgical gloves the ones with the built in filter.
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Walk in some beauty spot or a weekend away now seems like an absolute luxury.
**Swings Lantern and pulls up sandbag** I once spent six months living in a tent in the desert. No electric lights, no hot and cold running water, we shit in holes in the ground with no bushes to hide behind. I did my No 2s in the dark otherwise while squatting, helicopters would fly low and buzz you, or your mates would throw stones at you. Dark was much safer.
We had to wash our own clothes in metal basins. My sleeping bag wasn't washed or replaced once in six months. The food the cooks made us was the only slop we ate, with the exception of the odd 'red cross parcel' sent from home. Flippin' tortured by flies during the day and especially at meal times.
For sex I'd wait till Andy Palmer went on stag and I'd borrow a clean spare army sock from his bergen and have sex with that; carefully putting it back into his rucksack after I'd finished abusing it (he wasn't happy with me when I told him back in Germany).
But I remember getting back to my barracks in Germany; a real bed, electric lights, TVs, microwaves, flushing bogs, hot showers, washing machines, beer and women. It really was like heaven.
You don't know what you've got until you lose it.
Lol
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Walk in some beauty spot or a weekend away now seems like an absolute luxury.
**Swings Lantern and pulls up sandbag** I once spent six months living in a tent in the desert. No electric lights, no hot and cold running water, we shit in holes in the ground with no bushes to hide behind. I did my No 2s in the dark otherwise while squatting, helicopters would fly low and buzz you, or your mates would throw stones at you. Dark was much safer.
We had to wash our own clothes in metal basins. My sleeping bag wasn't washed or replaced once in six months. The food the cooks made us was the only slop we ate, with the exception of the odd 'red cross parcel' sent from home. Flippin' tortured by flies during the day and especially at meal times.
For sex I'd wait till Andy Palmer went on stag and I'd borrow a clean spare army sock from his bergen and have sex with that; carefully putting it back into his rucksack after I'd finished abusing it (he wasn't happy with me when I told him back in Germany).
But I remember getting back to my barracks in Germany; a real bed, electric lights, TVs, microwaves, flushing bogs, hot showers, washing machines, beer and women. It really was like heaven.
You don't know what you've got until you lose it.
"You don't know what you've got until it's gone". Joni Mitchell? (said in a West Bromwich accent, Barry Taylor, Auf Weidesehen, Pet).
Your version was more apt for you.
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Might want try this;
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586151277_MASKS.jpg)
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586151311_MASKS2.jpg)
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1586151334_MASKS 1.jpg)
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https://www.facebook.com/30382852317/posts/10158319633262318/
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Chinese plague
i think you're being sarcastic or ironic but could you stop referring to it as this. it's pretty racist to be honest and jars me every time i read it in your posts.
which is a pity as your posts on this subject are pretty much in line with what i think and understand
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it's pretty racist to be honest and jars me every time i read it in your posts.
It's not racist; and it is from Chy-na. Though technically it's not a plague.
My mum reckons she was born in China, though I'm a bit dubious about that. My granddad worked there during the war (when I say worked, he probably slaughtered quite a few of them, being an officer in the Kwangtung army who was accompanied by his wife, which is how my mum reckons she was born there, but the time-line doesn't fit).
And just for interest the word 'Oriental' has supposed racist connotations and shouldn't be used, even though I described myself as of Oriental heritage for years before finding out I was being racist against myself.
It's just so hard to keep up with all the woke nonsense these days.
You'll be telling me that the Spanish Flu or the Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome is racist next. ;D
Edited to add: the Spanish flu should really be called the American Flu because it started in Kansas and was brought over to Europe by US soldiers. But I don't think that's racist either, btw.