Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Harry Roberts on November 13, 2016, 08:41:03 am
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Hi ,
I've seen on flea bay you can buy new IBC tank with heating pad and tank thermal jacket to prevent heat loss. Is anyone using this or something similar. I wonder what the cost of heating would be.
Might be with getting two in of these in garage to alternate.
H
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Do you mean these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IBC-Tank-Heating-Pad-Insulating-Jacket-New-IBC-Cover-Heating-Mat-IBC-Container-/281632532624?var=&hash=item41929b6890:m:mbSiklkmyg2cTdtbQpWPtTQ
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Looks good. You could use it for frost protection or just enough to make hoses supple in winter (say 25 degrees). Once full and warm it would retain much of it's heat for days.
Maybe look at economy 7 heating especially as it uses 1400W.
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Not sure why tank suppliers havnt jumped on the bandwagon yet and started selling tanks prefitted with heating elements.
Seems alot of guys are going down this road as probably the cheapest and safest way to heat water.
I would certainly buy one, I'm not diy confident enough to fit an element myself.
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Not sure why tank suppliers havnt jumped on the bandwagon yet and started selling tanks prefitted with heating elements.
Seems alot of guys are going down this road as probably the cheapest and safest way to heat water.
I would certainly buy one, I'm not diy confident enough to fit an element myself.
+1 , I'd buy a jacket for my tank
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Do you mean these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/IBC-Tank-Heating-Pad-Insulating-Jacket-New-IBC-Cover-Heating-Mat-IBC-Container-/281632532624?var=&hash=item41929b6890:m:mbSiklkmyg2cTdtbQpWPtTQ
281634380112 Was the item no I saw. I think much the same.
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Heated jacket is £800 and after seeing the results there's no way I'd use one.
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Heated jacket is £800 and after seeing the results there's no way I'd use one.
Where did you see the results?
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"If full power is available to heat up water without any heat losses to the environment it would take 50 hours to heat the water from 10°C to 70°C."
70 would be bloomin hot but 50 hours?
Fitting an element to your van tank is dead easy and far cheaper, cost me about seventy quid including an insulating jacket. Heating to 30 degrees is about 12kw hours of electric every night. 650L
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The ibc insulation jacket doesn’t look like it goes underneath the ibc tank itself where most of the heat would be lost surely?
Likewise the heat pad or heated insulated jacket depending what you buy?
That's got to be the most inefficient and expensive way to heat pure water for wfp work if you ask me.
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A mate uses these for brewing. Or fermentation rather.
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The ibc insulation jacket doesn’t look like it goes underneath the ibc tank itself where most of the heat would be lost surely?
Likewise the heat pad or heated insulated jacket depending what you buy?
That's got to be the most inefficient and expensive way to heat pure water for wfp work if you ask me.
last time i was at school i got told heat rises ;D
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A local tank fabricator is manufacturing tanks with virtually zero heat loss, fitted with elements. They work really well, as i know a couple of lads that have them
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A local tank fabricator is manufacturing tanks with virtually zero heat loss, fitted with elements. They work really well, as i know a couple of lads that have them
Who making these tanks? Stephen Scargill?
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Yes Harry
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The ibc insulation jacket doesn’t look like it goes underneath the ibc tank itself where most of the heat would be lost surely?
Likewise the heat pad or heated insulated jacket depending what you buy?
That's got to be the most inefficient and expensive way to heat pure water for wfp work if you ask me.
last time i was at school i got told heat rises ;D
Yes but what happens when the bottom of the ibc pallet is left uninsulated/open to the elements and there is an air gap between the insulation jacket, metal frame and tank? It's not going to work very efficently is it now ;D
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Well unless you have a flow of cold air passing underneath there will be minimal heat loss.
Light a match indoors, feel the difference in heat above and below the flame. Any heat you feel below is a result of radiant heat from the light of the flame. You don't have this source of energy loss with hot water.
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Well unless you have a flow of cold air passing underneath there will be minimal heat loss.
Light a match indoors, feel the difference in heat above and below the flame. Any heat you feel below is a result of radiant heat from the light of the flame. You don't have this source of energy loss with hot water.
For example which one would you say has better insulation qualities A or B?
A: http://www.diy.com/departments/mangers-4-piece-cylinder-tank-jacket-l1067m-w450mm-t80mm/26876_BQ.prd?ecamp=Seapla&ppc_type=shopping&ds_kids=92700014010422148&gclid=CjwKEAiAu6DBBRDDr6-e_6698E0SJACvuxnymb5dKi0tRzqtSt0ThOrf9Mz7nlDYiIbTRfOJi2kFKhoCfiTw_wcB&dclid=CIGFlLScptACFYmo7QodVsINHA
B: http://www.screwfix.com/p/rm-direct-cylinder-1050-x-450mm/69843
Anyway the best and most efficent way I've found to heat water for wfp work is on demand and not trying to heat a tank up over night.
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You're correct that direct heating is more efficient - heat loss is dependent amongst other things, time - no insulating jacket is 100% thermally non conductive (none that I know off anyway)
As for the 2 you posted I don't know which is more thermally efficient as there are no specs attached. With saying that, all our vans have 2inch insulation board around each tank and over the top but not underneath and at most, the water temp only drops 2 degrees over the working day. Each tank (650ltr)has an immersion heater (3kw) and we preheat each tank to 30celsius each night in winter if it's forecast to freeze overnight. We also recirculate the water through the pumps and hoses back into the tank through the night running the varistreams at 1 so as the hoses etc don't freeze.
Works for us and ensures our guys get to work in the morning.
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We have gone a bit of topic from the op but if that works for you then fair play.
I still don't understand fully why the chap wants to heat the water up in his garage ibc storage tanks though. I assume it was to help stop the water freezing as would be a costly and inefficient way if he wanted to heat the water up to use warm water for wfp work surely?
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We have gone a bit of topic from the op but if that works for you then fair play.
I still don't understand fully why the chap wants to heat the water up in his garage ibc storage tanks though. I assume it was to help stop the water freezing as would be a costly and inefficient way if he wanted to heat the water up to use warm water for wfp work surely?
I could use one of these instead of a heater element in my vehicle.
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You could also use one of these if you wanted too ::)roll http://direct.asda.com/slumberdown-electric-blanket-single/002257085,default,pd.html?cmpid=ppc-_-george-_-ggle-pla-_-OD20BATH_KIDS_FURNISHINGS-_--_-dskwid-s92700014242725428_dc&gclid=CjwKEAiA3qXBBRD4_b_V7ZLFsX4SJAB0AtEVQq8nSqFbnVAVtqYM-F3yJc6ur_eNXQRO9XetGtNCKhoCzSHw_wcB
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You could also use one of these if you wanted too ::)roll http://direct.asda.com/slumberdown-electric-blanket-single/002257085,default,pd.html?cmpid=ppc-_-george-_-ggle-pla-_-OD20BATH_KIDS_FURNISHINGS-_--_-dskwid-s92700014242725428_dc&gclid=CjwKEAiA3qXBBRD4_b_V7ZLFsX4SJAB0AtEVQq8nSqFbnVAVtqYM-F3yJc6ur_eNXQRO9XetGtNCKhoCzSHw_wcB
Yebbut that thing is about 60w. The other thing is 1400w. ::)roll
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OK how about this then? http://www.hottubdiy.co.uk/auto-heater-2kw.html?gclid=CjwKEAiA3qXBBRD4_b_V7ZLFsX4SJAB0AtEV90CHnxUJ9z09gD0T7BJGbvBldNMFyXMnZ7XOzBqhehoCOl7w_wcB
They also do a 3kw version http://www.hottubdiy.co.uk/auto-heater-3kw.html
Simple bit of plumbing and away you go. No more drilling holes in your tank to fit an emersion element. No more cold spots in your baffled tank either as the water will be recalculated back to the tank constantly while it’s on. Could be also used as hose reel frost protection too by hooking it up to the hose reel that runs back into the tank.
If you have ever owned a hot tub you will know how hot the water can get using this type of heater pump.
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OK how about this then? http://www.hottubdiy.co.uk/auto-heater-2kw.html?gclid=CjwKEAiA3qXBBRD4_b_V7ZLFsX4SJAB0AtEV90CHnxUJ9z09gD0T7BJGbvBldNMFyXMnZ7XOzBqhehoCOl7w_wcB
They also do a 3kw version http://www.hottubdiy.co.uk/auto-heater-3kw.html
Simple bit of plumbing and away you go. No more drilling holes in your tank to fit an emersion element. No more cold spots in your baffled tank either as the water will be recalculated back to the tank constantly while it’s on. Could be also used as hose reel frost protection too by hooking it up to the hose reel that runs back into the tank.
If you have ever owned a hot tub you will know how hot the water can get using this type of heater pump.
Got to be worth investigating further surely folks ? ::)roll
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Good one Smurf. The hot tub pump heater thing. ::)roll
;D
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I even surprise myself at times ;D
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Cut the top off your IBC tank, chuck in a bottle of vision and climb in. Hot tub for £100.
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Anyone got ideas on how to fit one and how to wire it up. Would it work off of an ordinary socket
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Cut the top off your IBC tank, chuck in a bottle of vision and climb in. Hot tub for £100.
I can make my own bubbles in the bath so don't need vision for that ;D
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Anyone got ideas on how to fit one and how to wire it up. Would it work off of an ordinary socket
I've sent them an email to find out if the 3kw version would be suitable for a van tank etc and await their reply.
As for mains hook-up being 3kw as I'm no sparky so would be best to seek professional advice. However I'm aware some using emersion heater elements in the van tank like to use heavy duty arctic cable as the extension cable and run it off a separate house spur/breaker which is then cabled up to a separate outside waterproof socket to plug into. I'm sure there are electrical regs that must be followed regards to this so like I said before best speak to a sparky to do the electrical side for you so it's done properly and safely.
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y dont u just go and speak to stephen scargill off face book he does insalated tanks with bilt in heaters ::)roll
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"If full power is available to heat up water without any heat losses to the environment it would take 50 hours to heat the water from 10°C to 70°C."
70 would be bloomin hot but 50 hours?
Fitting an element to your van tank is dead easy and far cheaper, cost me about seventy quid including an insulating jacket. Heating to 30 degrees is about 12kw hours of electric every night. 650L
Is there a thread on here of how to fit an immersion?
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My only observation regarding putting a heated pad under the tank is the friction generated by the vehicle movement. In the advert it shows the ibc tank in a static position but even the most solid fixings in a van aren't going to prevent the tank form vibrating and moving slightly. Surely with a short period of time it would mangle the wiring in the pad? ???
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A local tank fabricator is manufacturing tanks with virtually zero heat loss, fitted with elements. They work really well, as i know a couple of lads that have them
Who making these tanks? Stephen Scargill?
best of luck ::)roll ::)roll ::)roll
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Well you can scrap that hot tub heater pump idea as was told it would not be anygood ;D
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Why would it not be any good Smurf?
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Why would it not be any good Smurf?
Thats a pain as was really keen on that idea.
Would i be right in thinking its the volume of water. Lol would i be right in thinking ::)roll ive no idea
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
Could he have misunderstood. Thinking that it would be used at the pump end heating water coming out the tank. Rather than it being submerged in a static tank on a timer, using its inbuilt thermostat over night. (Shows my fast unlimted knowledge, as thats how i was gonna use it. May be utterly wrong)
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No he understood ok as I was clear in the email I sent him how it was intended to be used.
Also it's an external heater pump not a sumbmersable heater pump you silly billy ;D
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No he understood ok as I was clear in the email I sent him how it was intended to be used.
Also it's an external heater pump not a sumbmersable heater pump you silly billy ;D
So could you rig it to sit on a van tank, again on timer, same principle, overnight? If its self priming, on a loop back into tank. Guessing then, same as the hottub? (Apart from the pump is elevated)
Lol, i dont want struggle of fitting element heater. This sounds easier, lol really want to make this work
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No he understood ok as I was clear in the email I sent him how it was intended to be used.
Also it's an external heater pump not a sumbmersable heater pump you silly billy ;D
So could you rig it to sit on a van tank, again on timer, same principle, overnight? If its self priming, on a loop back into tank. Guessing then, same as the hottub? (Apart from the pump is elevated)
Lol, i dont want struggle of fitting element heater. This sounds easier, lol really want to make this work
I agree Nathan I was wondering if it heated enough overnight. If it was attached to the tap out of the van tank and re circulated into the top of the tank surely no airlock?
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
Why would airlocks be an issue?
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
Why would airlocks be an issue?
I guess having air locks could mean the heater element would not be in water so could burn out and/or the pump is not a run dry pump maybe? That's assuming there is an actual pump in it.
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
Why would airlocks be an issue?
I guess having air locks could mean the heater element would not be in water so could burn out and/or the pump is not a run dry pump maybe? That's assuming there is an actual pump in it.
Yeah, I get that but why would you get an airlock?
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No he understood ok as I was clear in the email I sent him how it was intended to be used.
Also it's an external heater pump not a sumbmersable heater pump you silly billy ;D
So could you rig it to sit on a van tank, again on timer, same principle, overnight? If its self priming, on a loop back into tank. Guessing then, same as the hottub? (Apart from the pump is elevated)
Lol, i dont want struggle of fitting element heater. This sounds easier, lol really want to make this work
Well I guess you could buy one and see if it works then let use all know.
Like I mentioned before I prefer to use hot water on demand and have no real reason to pre heat the tank water overnight myself. Weather wise if it's cold /hard frosts overnight an electric air heater works for me to keep my gear freezing up in the back of the van. Also I currently have 2 tanks in the van plus a small softwash tank so would be bit difficult to go down the emersion heater route for now.
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The chap mentioned something about air locks and the heater would burn out. To be honest I wasn't really listen after he said it would not be suitable.
Why would airlocks be an issue?
I guess having air locks could mean the heater element would not be in water so could burn out and/or the pump is not a run dry pump maybe? That's assuming there is an actual pump in it.
Yeah, I get that but why would you get an airlock?
You could always contact the chap yourself.
Jon Pennington
sales@hottubdiy.co.uk
Tel: 01209 808 343
www.HotTubDIY.co.uk
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Apologies smurf, we all think your the sales rep.
Think i might look into this further, as an overnight water heater is ideal for my circumstances.
Cheers for heads up about it tho.
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Jon did metion something about an inline heater that you could get from a plumbers merchant. But I have no idea what he was on about either. ;D
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Hi guys,
I got my hot tub heater today to see if it could be used to warm water overnight.
Firstly to notice it doesn't have a standard 3 pin plug so would require professional installation.
Secondly the inlet and outlet are very wide 2" in diameter so would need a good bit of plumbing to get it to work.
If anyone with a bit more knowledge has done it then I would be grateful of any tips or photos.
Cheers.
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Chuck it in the bin - send the bill to Smurf.
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Hi guys,
I got my hot tub heater today to see if it could be used to warm water overnight.
Firstly to notice it doesn't have a standard 3 pin plug so would require professional installation.
Secondly the inlet and outlet are very wide 2" in diameter so would need a good bit of plumbing to get it to work.
If anyone with a bit more knowledge has done it then I would be grateful of any tips or photos.
Cheers.
I was going to see about ordering one when had spare money. Is it self priming the pump, as in, could you stick 2" hose on either end and stick other ends in tank. My tank is 500ltr upright and so sas thinking keeping lid off and two different lengths of hose into tank.
What connection is for power?
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Hi guys,
I got my hot tub heater today to see if it could be used to warm water overnight.
Firstly to notice it doesn't have a standard 3 pin plug so would require professional installation.
Secondly the inlet and outlet are very wide 2" in diameter so would need a good bit of plumbing to get it to work.
If anyone with a bit more knowledge has done it then I would be grateful of any tips or photos.
Cheers.
I was going to see about ordering one when had spare money. Is it self priming the pump, as in, could you stick 2" hose on either end and stick other ends in tank. My tank is 500ltr upright and so sas thinking keeping lid off and two different lengths of hose into tank.
What connection is for power?
Hi Nathan,
I didn't realise that it was self priming, I will see about sorting some hose as that could work.
There is no plug fitted but there are normal live neutral and earth cables so i will get my father in law to take a look as he is an electrician.
Thanks
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Chuck it in the bin - send the bill to Smurf.
He he.
If I can't use it I will send it back.
Had to order one to take a look.
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Sorry it has 1.5" connections not 2" as I wrote before
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Let us know how you get on with it. Try not to fry the heater element though as any air locks would burn it out apparently so I've been told.