Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: nathankaye on September 06, 2016, 04:37:17 pm
-
Dont you just love getting new work, where you agree a price and accept the terms of the arrangments. Only for a couple of months down line, they start to moan at price.........lol, they probably over spent on weekly shop or desperately wanting another pair of shoes ;D
Yet they argue over price. I simply state it was an agreed price and if they dont like it, they can go to whoever gave them a cheaper price. Whilst also highlighting that the only regular window cleaner in the area for 15 yrs is myself (esp if i know they have lived in area for some yrs), as these silly prices that they have been given doesnt support a descent living wage and not to expect longevity.
It does make me laugh ;D
(Please note its in relation to customers being tight, not quality of work or orofessionalism...)
-
If you're not professional and the quality of your work isn't up to scratch its to be expected.
-
I don't think I've ever had someone moan at the price after I've quoted...
I must be too cheap ;D
-
I had one recently. Quoted £201 to clean & clear gutters. Got this email:
Hi Sue
I have your Agleam Windows bill in front of me for £201.00 from Monday 15th August. I'm sorry I can't remember the name of the window cleaner, who I have to say is very pleasant.
The reason for writing is that the window cleaner gave me a quote for cleaning the conservatory roof, gutters and facias etc, which I agreed to, though at the time thought it rather steep, but then I also assumed it would be an excellent job with every nook and cranny covered.. However, for £201.00 it took 1.5 hours and as a professional cleaner myself not up to my standard! I feel like I want to cry - my husband and I work really hard and we don't get anywhere near that hourly rate, let alone daily rate. I've just had my kitchen refitted and the chap didn't charge that a day and neither did the electrician.
Needless to say I feel upset to be expected to pay £201 for approximately 1.5 hours work. I'd be happy to discuss this with you over the telephone, however, I'm not available until Monday morning as I'm making a wedding cake, which in itself is rather stressful. It's taken me a whole week to make and the cost to make is £100 and I've priced my time out at £100 a day, which is probably 8-hours roughly a day.
My telephone number is 07979 XXXXXX. I'll be leaving home at 9.30am on Monday so if you're not available before that time I'll be contactable after 6pm.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Kindest regards
Deborah
The job was nigh on perfect. She admitted later that she got the time wrong - it was 2 1/2 hours.
-
I'm the 'stroppy new window cleaner'.
You've got to get in there first; tell them how it is. ;D
-
and as a professional cleaner myself not up to my standard!
What does she clean?
There's a big difference between running a hoover around a carpet, or rubbing coffee rings off a desk when you compare it to cleaning gutters and conservatory roofs.
She sounds like a right whinge; you're only a ruddy window cleaner. Just how flippin' dare you charge that much (even if you have got all the equipment to make the job quick).
I'd just dump her.
-
and as a professional cleaner myself not up to my standard!
What does she clean?
There's a big difference between running a hoover around a carpet, or rubbing coffee rings off a desk when you compare it to cleaning gutters and conservatory roofs.
No idea. She was clearly off her rocker though. She paid up in full and hasn't cancelled her regular window clean. I replied with:
Hi Deborah,
Sue has forwarded your email to me.
Dan (who did the job) says that the job took at least 2 ½ hours which he checked as he had a phone that he could peg to a time soon after he’d finished. To be honest I would find it astonishing to complete that amount of work in 1.5 hours even if they were fairly clean before starting.
But leaving that aside, we price gutter clearance and cleaning by the metre. I estimate from Streetview you have around 25 metres of guttering. So we would have charged £3 per metre to clear then £3 per metre to clean. These prices are very competitive. The average cost for a gutter clear only is £125 - £175 for a 3 bed semi in the south. In addition we have cleaned the fascias and cleaned your conservatory roof. We price conservatory roofs by the panel. A price list is attached for transparency.
http://quotationcheck.com/average-cost-clear-roof-gutters/
However, if you are dissatisfied with the standard that is a different matter. I can pop back and have a look next week at anything you are unhappy about and try to rectify it.
Regards,
Steve Seddon
As I said, the job was spot on. Nothing wrong at all.
-
I wish I'd thought to write this:
"There's a big difference between running a hoover around a carpet, or rubbing coffee rings off a desk when you compare it to cleaning gutters and conservatory roofs." ;D
-
People! Cuh.
-
Actually people. I picked up a nice one today. Its a three monthly out in the sticks job; £140.00. Once we're up and running it'll be 2 hours - tops.
First visit this Thursday will be £275.00. She took it like a ravenous rat. I should've said first one will be £350.00 People. Cuh!
-
I've an awkward one to quote for tomorrow. She's had at least three other local window cleaners before me and I've heard one of them (Ian Giles) moan about her, so I'm going to charge high, charge an initial cleaning fee, and be ultra ultra clear and direct with regards frequency. I'm guessing she's running out of local window cleaners to mess about, so hopefully will be more 'positive' with me.
It's a big place, they've tennis courts 'n' stuff, but the customer is absolutely drop dead gorgeous too; she's a fitness instructor, tall, curves in the right places, long blonde hair; really fit.
Wor Lass thinks we shouldn't quote for the job though. ;D
-
Bend her over the kitchen table and stick it up her modded whilst you do her modded with your rancid old modded when you give her the bad news.
She'll be gagging for you to visit twice monthly if you know how to handle her.
-
Bend her over the kitchen table and stick it up her modded whilst you do her modded with your rancid old modded when you give her the financial cost of servicing her requirements.
She'll be gagging for you to visit twice monthly if you know how to handle her.
The secrets of success. ;D
-
Bend her over the kitchen table and stick it up her modded whilst you do her modded with your rancid old modded when you give her the bad news.
She'll be gagging for you to visit twice monthly if you know how to handle her.
;D
-
Bend her over the kitchen table and stick it up her modded whilst you do her modded with your rancid old modded when you give her the bad news.
She'll be gagging for you to visit twice monthly if you know how to handle her.
The ending would be that I get ripped from her by police dogs and truncheons. :-\
-
I might just visit south once a month for a week at a time wow i could clean up with facia and gutter cleaning and clearing gutters out £100 quid cheaper and i would still make a fortune ;)
-
I might just visit south once a month for a week at a time wow i could clean up with facia and gutter cleaning and clearing gutters out £100 quid cheaper and i would still make a fortune ;)
100 squid less ??? Nah they would think you were a cowboy or something ;D ;D
-
I might just visit south once a month for a week at a time wow i could clean up with facia and gutter cleaning and clearing gutters out £100 quid cheaper and i would still make a fortune ;)
A good few years ago, a JW moved from here (South East Wales/Wye Vally area) oop Narth, and still kept a sizeable amount of work. He'd drive down, once a month, stay with friends for about 7 days and just smash a load of work out, and head back oop narth.
He did this for quite a long time.
-
Lol
-
I might just visit south once a month for a week at a time wow i could clean up with facia and gutter cleaning and clearing gutters out £100 quid cheaper and i would still make a fortune ;)
A good few years ago, a JW moved from here (South East Wales/Wye Vally area) oop Narth, and still kept a sizeable amount of work. He'd drive down, once a month, stay with friends for about 7 days and just smash a load of work out, and head back oop narth.
He did this for quite a long time.
Seems to be JW theme.
I know one (Taffy lad who came over and nicked one of the young ladies wot are much prettier "round our way" than those in the valleys ;D) and who lives the wrong side of Swansea (is there a right side?) who has two stonking days work in Bristol and he drives over with some laddie and knocks out a reputed £400/500 day and goes back to his log cabin he's built on the edge of the Brecon Beacons.
-
We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area. Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.
-
We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area. Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.
Talking to a Romanian taxi driver in Bath last week
Earned £300 a year back home
Been over here 6 years earns £4000 a year and thinks it's a Kings ransom
-
I've an awkward one to quote for tomorrow. She's had at least three other local window cleaners before me and I've heard one of them (Ian Giles) moan about her, so I'm going to charge high, charge an initial cleaning fee, and be ultra ultra clear and direct with regards frequency. I'm guessing she's running out of local window cleaners to mess about, so hopefully will be more 'positive' with me.
It's a big place, they've tennis courts 'n' stuff, but the customer is absolutely drop dead gorgeous too; she's a fitness instructor, tall, curves in the right places, long blonde hair; really fit.
Wor Lass thinks we shouldn't quote for the job though. ;D
I reckon she's used to "dazzling 'em" to get her way. Your lass is right. I'd let her do the negotiations! (Tho' you might sneak a quick pic to see whether forum members agree with your assessment of the owner - all in the interest of objectivity, of course!)
-
We often get debates on here about pricing and a days wage, one area compared to next.
Seems some people put some extra effort into travelling to go make some money if desired amount cant be found in ones own area. Sounds like a good plan to me, if your able to do so. Lets face it tho, its not like how some move countries and leave families inorder to find money to send back home tho is it.
Yep 20/25 miles from me I could demand two maybe three times the money I get now, its not much different to my own area
wealth wise there just seems to be a shortage of shiners and customers who are used to paying more.
Thing is I'm happy with having my work on my doorstep and with what I earn but I would be lying if I said I haven't been tempted
at times.
Certainly if I was starting out in life it would be a no brainer.
-
I've just encountered one.
New customer, house needs cleaning by the weekend, arranged to clean it this morning. Arrived and no sign of customer, Cleaned windows, left invoice and then received 3 missed calls and finally a text :
Apparently the windows are still dirty (despite the use of Virosol and two soaks before rinsing) and I'd quoted a maximum of 2 hours but cleaned it in just over 1...as customer was in but obviously hiding! I have offered to rectify any issues but as I'm old and tired something tells me it's better just to write it off.
Followed that up with another new customer who was delighted and has booked in for six weeks time.
-
I would have not cleaned it myself if the customer did not answer the door. I treat first cleans as one off's so they have to be present and make full payment before I leave.
Looks like you have been stiched up like a kipper there bud.
-
Getting back on topic I think the main problem with pricing is matching the customer’s expectations with the job in hand.
Some customer expectations are way too high so needs addressing on the site survey and quote.
Regards to time the job takes I've found it's irrelevant really if the customer is happy with the end results.
-
I would have not cleaned it myself if the customer did not answer the door. I treat first cleans as one off's so they have to be present and make full payment before I leave.
Looks like you have been stiched up like a kipper there bud.
I think you're probably right. I've asked what the problem is and have received no less than 14 photo's that show...well very little actually except that there is still some render in some of the corners.
Brown, grained upvc - will spray on Sandtex upvc cleaner get that out or does only work on smooth plastic ?
-
So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. ::)roll
-
The penny dropped on me a few years back after reading, posting and experiencing bad customers and it goes like this
The world is full of great window cleaners and bad window cleaners along with great customers and bad customers - it only goes wrong when a great window cleaner takes on a bad customer and a bad window cleaner takes on a great customer the trick is putting great with great otherwise that's when the problems start.
I along with everyone else on here consider myself to be a great window cleaner so its why Ive been zero tolerance to messers for last 4 years and never been as happy and earned as much since then.
:)
-
however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only ;D
-
So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. ::)roll
No and it was a her.
I was asked to remove the render that seems to be all over the windows and the frames but told not to worry about the paint spots ...? 90% of the render was successfully removed with Virosol, an extra soak and a good scrub & rinse. The render that's left is either embedded or etched into the frames. To clean with upvc cleaner, if that will even work on grained plastic, will make the original price look like a downpayment - which I'm sure they won't pay either. I'm happy to write the job off as I don't possess the patience or time to deal with anyone like that. In 25 years of working I've only encountered 3 people with this mentality so i suppose I should be grateful. Last message complained that I hadn't dried the windows - counts to 10.... I encountered the father in law, who lives in the annex, who was a posturing sort and the conversation, although polite, led to me expect trouble. He has a different window cleaner, who she doesn't like, who is also cheaper - I invite you to draw your own conclusion on the topic of conversation after I left this morning...
-
The penny dropped on me a few years back after reading, posting and experiencing bad customers and it goes like this
The world is full of great window cleaners and bad window cleaners along with great customers and bad customers - it only goes wrong when a great window cleaner takes on a bad customer and a bad window cleaner takes on a great customer the trick is putting great with great otherwise that's when the problems start.
I along with everyone else on here consider myself to be a great window cleaner so its why Ive been zero tolerance to messers for last 4 years and never been as happy and earned as much since then.
:)
I like your thinking :)
I just have zero tolerance.
-
So in a nutshell he was expecting a builders clean for the price of a normal window clean. Hmmmm..was he asian by any chance?. ::)roll
No and it was a her.
I was asked to remove the render that seems to be all over the windows and the frames but told not to worry about the paint spots ...? 90% of the render was successfully removed with Virosol, an extra soak and a good scrub & rinse. The render that's left is either embedded or etched into the frames. To clean with upvc cleaner, if that will even work on grained plastic, will make the original price look like a downpayment - which I'm sure they won't pay either. I'm happy to write the job off as I don't possess the patience or time to deal with anyone like that. In 25 years of working I've only encountered 3 people with this mentality so i suppose I should be grateful. Last message complained that I hadn't dried the windows - counts to 10.... I encountered the father in law, who lives in the annex, who was a posturing sort and the conversation, although polite, led to me expect trouble. He has a different window cleaner, who she doesn't like, who is also cheaper - I invite you to draw your own conclusion on the topic of conversation after I left this morning...
Had to be done by the weekend eh? Still plenty of time to go and put the dirt back on for them. ;D
-
however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only ;D
Why have you chosen to put all your eggs in one basket if I may ask Ian?
I have recently pondered this as I see that 2% of my customers are commercial but account for 25% of my turnover.
What I haven't estimated is the time to turnover ratio of commercial against residential.
We once lost a big commercial clean we used to do when the owners declared insolvency. Thankfully we got paid the full amount but loosing that hurt financially for a while. Annually, it was our biggest job we have had in the 14 years of window cleaning.
.
-
however as great as my residential customers are by November I will be commercial only ;D
Why have you chosen to put all your eggs in one basket if I may ask Ian?
I have recently pondered this as I see that 2% of my customers are commercial but account for 25% of my turnover.
What I haven't estimated is the time to turnover ratio of commercial against residential.
We once lost a big commercial clean we used to do when the owners declared insolvency. Thankfully we got paid the full amount but loosing that hurt financially for a while. Annually, it was our biggest job we have had in the 14 years of window cleaning.
.
Hi Spruce - no problem.
The simple answer is commercial pays more if done correctly as your 2% / 25% shows also wont just be cleaning windows but will be doing other exterior at height cleaning along with commercial pressure washing.
Longer answer is expansion and longevity - this is just my opinion but the effort and time required to grow a multi van residential operation is massive and expensive compared to the reward that you get back, vat issue on residential and I think eventually you will hit a limit on what can be earned with residential plus no barrier to entry or very low cost so competition can set up easily plus staff can and will jump ship to go on their own so lots of little fires to constantly fight.
Commercial not without problems obviously and you do need some cash in the bank to keep things rolling when you have people on 90 days but effort v reward is better in my opinion plus once you have done a few jobs worth a few grand chasing around doing windows for £10 a pop seems pointless (just my opinion)
I may be wrong but we will see but in need of a new challenge after 7 years.
-
if your planning to stay as a sole trader you cant beat having your eggs in hundreds of different baskets!you lose one or two and it isnt a problem.lose a commercial contract worth thousands of pounds and it could hurt a lot and almost put you out of business.
theres still good money to be made out of residential with minimal stress/hassle.i do have some commercial but their offices/childrens nurseries/childrens homes etc(no contract work).
i very rarely have problems with customers.if i do i drop them but its rare as hens teeth.
-
I've just encountered one.
New customer, house needs cleaning by the weekend, arranged to clean it this morning. Arrived and no sign of customer, Cleaned windows, left invoice and then received 3 missed calls and finally a text :
Apparently the windows are still dirty (despite the use of Virosol and two soaks before rinsing) and I'd quoted a maximum of 2 hours but cleaned it in just over 1...as customer was in but obviously hiding! I have offered to rectify any issues but as I'm old and tired something tells me it's better just to write it off.
Followed that up with another new customer who was delighted and has booked in for six weeks time.
There is no way on a first clean for a new customer that i would start cleaning the windows, if they didn't answer the
door or weren't there, i would try ringing their phone, if still no joy, i would just walk away, Zero tolerance for messers.
Lal
-
There is no way on a first clean for a new customer that i would start cleaning the windows, if they didn't answer the
door or weren't there, i would try ringing their phone, if still no joy, i would just walk away, Zero tolerance for messers.
Lal
Seriously?
We never meet a substantial percentage of our customers because they are out at work when we visit, even on the first clean.
-
It`s not the labour charge that cost so much but all the equipment one need to do these jobs. Just filtering the water to clean a conservatory, costs a lot of money as well as the rest.
-
I've an awkward one to quote for tomorrow. She's had at least three other local window cleaners before me and I've heard one of them (Ian Giles) moan about her, so I'm going to charge high, charge an initial cleaning fee, and be ultra ultra clear and direct with regards frequency. I'm guessing she's running out of local window cleaners to mess about, so hopefully will be more 'positive' with me.
It's a big place, they've tennis courts 'n' stuff, but the customer is absolutely drop dead gorgeous too; she's a fitness instructor, tall, curves in the right places, long blonde hair; really fit.
Wor Lass thinks we shouldn't quote for the job though. ;D
I reckon she's used to "dazzling 'em" to get her way. Your lass is right. I'd let her do the negotiations! (Tho' you might sneak a quick pic to see whether forum members agree with your assessment of the owner - all in the interest of objectivity, of course!)
Well, I quoted a good price and she told me that it's far more than what she'd paid before, but accepted after asking if we'd do a couple of inside windows (hard to get at ones). I agreed.
We turned up to clean, she was dressed in her work clothes - tight fitting exercise kit - and she looked stunning. She's about six foot tall, slender, and just lovely (she's in her 40s).
We had a chat about fitness stuff (she knows Wor Lass from seeing her running everywhere) and we got to work.
She bank transferred the payment to me the same day and text me a nice 'thank you and it was nice meeting you both' to me as well.
All in all I think she's a lovely customer and I'm not sure why other window cleaners found her to be not a good customer.
Wor Lass has her reservations, though I suspect it could be a bit of 'cattery' going on here.
-
You know the forum rules Tosh...
no photo's..... it is not true...... :P
;D
-
You know the forum rules Tosh...
no photo's..... it is not true...... :P
;D
;D
And no Photoshop Lightroom!
-
I looked at a job the other day a fellow WC does it although at the quoting stage I wasn't aware of this,she said he wants 50 and it takes him half an hour though it is worth the 50. Then proceeds to go on and on about how much his hourly rate works out blah blah blah,I just walked away that is not the type of person I want to clean windows for these days. If you price for each job individually and not just because you clean 1 next door the extra over the course of the month in increased money earned is surprising.
-
@Tosh
Do you think Wor Lass is a bit concerned about your tongue lolling on the floor?
-
Ah yes now i've made the link between Tosh posting the Eric Prydz (Dance Instructor) vid and this new customer of his.
Yep clear as a bell. ;D
-
There is no way on a first clean for a new customer that i would start cleaning the windows, if they didn't answer the
door or weren't there, i would try ringing their phone, if still no joy, i would just walk away, Zero tolerance for messers.
Lal
Seriously?
We never meet a substantial percentage of our customers because they are out at work when we visit, even on the first clean.
Seriously? Yes definitely Seriously Soupy, 99% of my customers pay me on completion of job, a handful pay using online
banking, some send me a cheque, but these customers I've got to know over time and trust them. Now with a brand new
1st time customer they need to be in to pay me on completion of job or otherwise leave the money hidden somewhere.
Lal
-
1st time customer they need to be in to pay me on completion of job or otherwise leave the money hidden somewhere.
Lal
For me that's an absolute no no. One day you're gonna go where they said they left the money and it won't be there. You'll be accusing them of lying, they'll be accusing you of being a thief. No one wins.
-
1st time customer they need to be in to pay me on completion of job or otherwise leave the money hidden somewhere.
Lal
For me that's an absolute no no. One day you're gonna go where they said they left the money and it won't be there. You'll be accusing them of lying, they'll be accusing you of being a thief. No one wins.
No problems so far with people leaving money hidden, i have suggested online banking to them, but not everyone
is keen on this ::)roll