Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Dave Willis on May 04, 2016, 07:49:33 pm
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Never thought I'd say it but even though I don't suit rigger boots a four wheel drive is getting more appealing for me as time goes by.
I got my van well and truly stuck in a grass field over the weekend - it's only got to look at grass and it bursts into tears! Met a 4x4 today on a customers drive, he simply took to the field and sped past. I've had several dodgy moments with the van and a full tank. Getting stuck in mud, snow and even a steep drive where I had to be towed up by a 4x4. Had a quick look at a Ford Ranger but not sure if I could fit everything in.
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That all depends on what you want to fit in it Dave.
I've a Ford Ranger super cab with a high hard top.
I carry a 500 tank, supermax 40, van mounted reel, backpack, trad stuff, tool box and a multi ladder all in the back of mine - no ro or di though, thats static.
I dont go off road for work ( but do for camping and festivals ) what I like is the nice clean comfortable cab that doubles as the family car. ;)
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We're four years into Ranger ownership and as work vehicle...it just sort of works. Only have a 400 litre tank and a 1,250 kg payload so it's hardly being taxed. Work is very rural with many farms and agricultural buildings in fairly remote locations. Enough space inside to get the kids to school too - highly recommended.
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How do you get on with the tailgate? Does it fold right down to a vertical position or have you bolted your reel to it so that it folds up with the tailgate? Do your poles fit into the loadspace?
What I mean is do you have your reel on the tailgate.
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Never thought I'd say it but even though I don't suit rigger boots a four wheel drive is getting more appealing for me as time goes by.
I got my van well and truly stuck in a grass field over the weekend - it's only got to look at grass and it bursts into tears! Met a 4x4 today on a customers drive, he simply took to the field and sped past. I've had several dodgy moments with the van and a full tank. Getting stuck in mud, snow and even a steep drive where I had to be towed up by a 4x4. Had a quick look at a Ford Ranger but not sure if I could fit everything in.
The solution - don't drive through a field unless the ground is as dry as a bone.
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How do you get on with the tailgate? Does it fold right down to a vertical position or have you bolted your reel to it so that it folds up with the tailgate? Do your poles fit into the loadspace?
What I mean is do you have your reel on the tailgate.
the tank was custom made by aquaeous pf, and the reel was mounted in front of it to the floor with room to allow the tailgate to close, the gate will open flat but I never have to do that whilst working. pole fits in diagonally on top of tank. The load bed of the supercab is just shy of 6 ft, less with the twin cab and longer still (obviously) with a single cab.
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I have a Supercab which has a 5.8 feet bed and four seats. A CLX-22 sits nicely inside the bed and the hose reel just sits behind the tank with enough feed hose to remove it. As for going anywhere I find that around 500 kg load and the LSD make for more usable traction than an empty truck and 4wd.
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There's no privacy sitting on a portable loo in the back of a Pick up, that rules them out for me and my fifty plus bladder.
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In the end you buy what you want, But I for one would not buy one as the costs of running a 4x is much higher than a van in every aspect. Many guys buy a 4x4 as a toy that the misses would never agree too under normal circumstances.
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For those that want to carry loads of gear about that don't need to go off roading as in my case they are defo not really pratical than a large works van that's for sure.
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Wait till you get stuck in a field 70 miles from home! I had to use an overflow car park at Lymington Ferry terminal totally knackered. Luckily for me it was a cycling event so managed to get about fifteen young girls to push and bounce the van the two feet required to get on gravel.
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In the end you buy what you want, But I for one would not buy one as the costs of running a 4x is much higher than a van in every aspect. Many guys buy a 4x4 as a toy that the misses would never agree too under normal circumstances.
Think it depends on what you're running. I do my own maintenance and have a tame mechanic for anything I can't manage. I haven't found it any dearer to run than any of my other work vehicles over the past 30 years. It's over engineered for WFP Cleaning so as a result is never running flat out - as a result it tends to be very reliable. Any 4 wheel drive has the potential to be expensive but the Ranger system is more 'Victorian Signal Box' than 'Star Trek' and so far has been well behaved (16 years old with 150,000 miles)
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Seriously how many times are you going to stuck in a field 70 miles from home in our business ? you cant beat a van for the job we
do and theres no excuse for a Pick up other than wanting a big boys toy.
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i suppose if you work in a lot of remote/rural areas with plenty of hills then a 4x4 would be a sensible option with the water we carry.
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you can buy vans with off road capabilities you know
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There's no privacy sitting on a portable loo in the back of a Pick up, that rules them out for me and my fifty plus bladder.
I know what you mean ;D
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There's no privacy sitting on a portable loo in the back of a Pick up, that rules them out for me and my fifty plus bladder.
I know what you mean ;D
;D ;D pop up loo tent springs to mind for a wee bit more privacy. You obviously have not thought that one through Barry :P
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There's no privacy sitting on a portable loo in the back of a Pick up, that rules them out for me and my fifty plus bladder.
;D ;D ;D
That's my first priority as well.
The second is; can I get into the back in time?
Way down the list is what size tank can I put in it?
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Man pants work well for me Spruce. You should try them ;D ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGNMeR-BOis
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Man pants work well for me Spruce. You should try them ;D ;D
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGNMeR-BOis
;D
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There's no privacy sitting on a portable loo in the back of a Pick up, that rules them out for me and my fifty plus bladder.
I know what you mean ;D
;D ;D pop up loo tent springs to mind for a wee bit more privacy. You obviously have not thought that one through Barry :P
She wee more like. ;D
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Seriously how many times are you going to stuck in a field 70 miles from home in our business ? you cant beat a van for the job we
do and theres no excuse for a Pick up other than wanting a big boys toy.
We drove a Transit into our field that supplies my water last week - it promptly sank and we had to tow it with the Ranger. There's plenty of reason for running a 4x4 Pickup when you live and work where I do.
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if its not a short bed round window and running a 427 hemi then its not a real pick up
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Seriously how many times are you going to stuck in a field 70 miles from home in our business ? you cant beat a van for the job we
do and theres no excuse for a Pick up other than wanting a big boys toy.
We drove a Transit into our field that supplies my water last week - it promptly sank and we had to tow it with the Ranger. There's plenty of reason for running a 4x4 Pickup when you live and work where I do.
Not many I know have to drive into a field to get their water :o
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Seriously how many times are you going to stuck in a field 70 miles from home in our business ? you cant beat a van for the job we
do and theres no excuse for a Pick up other than wanting a big boys toy.
We drove a Transit into our field that supplies my water last week - it promptly sank and we had to tow it with the Ranger. There's plenty of reason for running a 4x4 Pickup when you live and work where I do.
Not many I know have to drive into a field to get their water :o
Or go off road twice a day to get to it.
I was disappointed with the Transit though as the field entrance was dry. If you're living in town a van is probably fine but out here a pick up is far more useful.
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Might sound a silly question but why do you have to drive into a field twice a day to get your water?
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Might sound a silly question but why do you have to drive into a field twice a day to get your water?
We have a Well in our field and this supplies low TDS water (for the area) to the tap about half way up. Two gates to access the field and I'm usually there either to fill up in the morning or evening. Today it was twice as I was low on water last night and didn't have time to fill up. House is in the middle of nowhere and doesn't have a proper road at either end - concrete lower section and scalping / forest track at the top - Hilarious when it snows. My mate popped up for some water in his mid size Peugeot van - getting that out of the field was fun too.
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Thanks as I thought that might be the case.
It's a shame you can't rig up some sort of pumping station and underground pipe so you don't need to drive into the fields at all.
Still like you say 4x4 in your case is really the only option but they can still get stuck too.
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Thanks as I thought that might be the case.
It's a shame you can't rig up some sort of pumping station and underground pipe so you don't need to drive into the fields at all.
Still like you say 4x4 in your case is really the only option but they can still get stuck too.
Yes you're right. The only situation it's been defeated by is mud. Without proper mud tyres it's hopeless. It'll just spin all it's wheels. Apart from that it's great and when it comes to replacement time I'd happily have another.
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Popped into the local Mitsubishi dealers yesterday - they only had twin cabs and to me the loadspace looked very small. Drop the tailgate and it smacks the towbar. I'd have to think really hard before parting with my van I reckon. Some models had a handy feature of an opening rear cab window so a pole could be poked through but generally it's very tight for a thirty footer. Also the only access is the back door, no side access like a van. Still mulling if over.
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Popped into the local Mitsubishi dealers yesterday - they only had twin cabs and to me the loadspace looked very small. Drop the tailgate and it smacks the towbar. I'd have to think really hard before parting with my van I reckon. Some models had a handy feature of an opening rear cab window so a pole could be poked through but generally it's very tight for a thirty footer. Also the only access is the back door, no side access like a van. Still mulling if over.
If there's only two of you a single cab will give you a 7.5 foot load bay which is plenty. A Ranger super cab shrinks the load bay to 5'10" and will take anything up tp a CLX-22 whilst giving you four seats. A double cab gives around 5 feet of load bay length and five seats. A truckman top would probably allow you a 30 foot pole if fitted diagonally but it's a bit like driving with a conservatory on the back.
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Unless you REALLY NEED 4x4 capability I personally can't think of anything worse than a pickup for wfp work- particularly over a good sized van.
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I would love to have a Ranger. I like my space though. LWB transit. dogs cage, back seats for kids. After each house I just thrown my pole on the floor. Super fast, that's with electric reel. L:ooked at a few setups and mine is way faster.
On the down side. Vans are stolen a lot more
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Unless you REALLY NEED 4x4 capability I personally can't think of anything worse than a pickup for wfp work- particularly over a good sized van.
Couldn't agree more.
Bring back 4x4 transits :)
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There's plenty of 4 wheel drive vans out there.
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Unless you REALLY NEED 4x4 capability I personally can't think of anything worse than a pickup for wfp work- particularly over a good sized van.
Seriously ?
Well I much prefer it to the vans I've previously owned because it carries four or five, goes anywhere - especially remote solar panel installations and off road buildings, has so far not got stuck on any of the new sites I've worked on, works in the snow, is brilliant at towing with 10 available gears, has a payload of rather more than you need, is very lightly stressed, has excellent all round, visibility, reliable and the selling point for me: it's designed to get wet so is absolutely ideal for transporting water and WFP.
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Unless you REALLY NEED 4x4 capability I personally can't think of anything worse than a pickup for wfp work- particularly over a good sized van.
Seriously ?
Well I much prefer it to the vans I've previously owned because it carries four or five, goes anywhere - especially remote solar panel installations and off road buildings, has so far not got stuck on any of the new sites I've worked on, works in the snow, is brilliant at towing with 10 available gears, has a payload of rather more than you need, is very lightly stressed, has excellent all round, visibility, reliable and the selling point for me: it's designed to get wet so is absolutely ideal for transporting water and WFP.
Yep, really. When 99% of people run vans over pickups then I reckon I assessment is pretty much on the money. ;)
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Unless you REALLY NEED 4x4 capability I personally can't think of anything worse than a pickup for wfp work- particularly over a good sized van.
Seriously ?
Well I much prefer it to the vans I've previously owned because it carries four or five, goes anywhere - especially remote solar panel installations and off road buildings, has so far not got stuck on any of the new sites I've worked on, works in the snow, is brilliant at towing with 10 available gears, has a payload of rather more than you need, is very lightly stressed, has excellent all round, visibility, reliable and the selling point for me: it's designed to get wet so is absolutely ideal for transporting water and WFP.
Yep, really. When 99% of people run vans over pickups then I reckon I assessment is pretty much on the money. ;)
I must be in the one percent then :)
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Here is my ranger super cab.
Tbh I didn't really need a 4x4 but I chose it for its versatility, owning only one vehicle and carrying up to 3 passengers sometimes at weekends, I was struggling to find a van that fitted the bill in my budget and would meet all my needs.
Posting these pics just to illustrate the point that with a bit of thought you can fit everything you need in the back ( albeit not an ro system but then I didn't need to ).
I added the lockable hatch door on the side of the fiberglass hard top to make filling the 500 L tank easy and also gives good access to cleaning products placed in a bucket just inside the door. That's a S max 40 ( with 3 sections removed but would still fit ) resting diagonally on top of tank. Everything is accessible without having to drop the tailgate or climb in to the back and if the tank were empty I could have everything removed in 10 mins - very handy for me when I go away on camping trips ;)
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Here is my ranger super cab.
Tbh I didn't really need a 4x4 but I chose it for its versatility, owning only one vehicle and carrying up to 3 passengers sometimes at weekends, I was struggling to find a van that fitted the bill in my budget and would meet all my needs.
Posting these pics just to illustrate the point that with a bit of thought you can fit everything you need in the back ( albeit not an ro system but then I didn't need to ).
I added the lockable hatch door on the side of the fiberglass hard top to make filling the 500 L tank easy and also gives good access to cleaning products placed in a bucket just inside the door. That's a S max 40 ( with 3 sections removed but would still fit ) resting diagonally on top of tank. Everything is accessible without having to drop the tailgate or climb in to the back and if the tank were empty I could have everything removed in 10 mins - very handy for me when I go away on camping trips ;)
That's really nicely done !
Same shape truck as mine though I run mine without a top on it.
I can clear mine in about 10 minutes too and it's then big enough for my bike...or a tonne of sand...or logs from the other end of the field,
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1462823908_hilux.jpg)Some Hilux models on Autotrader have hinged side panels in the top. Quite difficult to find basic models too, most are double cabs rather than the king cabs and everyone wants leather and toys. They seem to withstand huge mileages.
Is that a custom tank in the Ranger?
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1462823908_hilux.jpg)Some Hilux models on Autotrader have hinged side panels in the top. Quite difficult to find basic models too, most are double cabs rather than the king cabs and everyone wants leather and toys. They seem to withstand huge mileages.
Is that a custom tank in the Ranger?
Nice !
but yeah that's what I liked about the ranger, no frills - I wanted a work horse without the bling.
You quite often find them with utility hard tops , ex electric or water companies - in fact I just missed out on one prior to buying mine but in a way the empty shell in the back allowed me to set up the way I wanted.
Yes the tanks a 500 L custom made by Aquaeous Plastic Fabrications.
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Two lecky board double cab pickups where parked side by side in car park this morning that both had roller shutter doors on the sides. Still I would much rather have a decent size van than a pickup myself as is much more practical space wise in the back to cart all my gear about.
A friend of mine has just changed his van and picked up an old but very tidy and mechanically sound 08 traffic lwb sport with a double cab that seats 6 adults inc driver and still has loads of room in the back for all his kit. It's also loaded with boy's toys if that is the kind of thing that floats yer boat. Mind you him being a plasterer and never cleaned the last van he had in 10 years inside or out since he owned it I don't think it will be tidy for very long somehow. ;D ;D
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Off to Bristol this weekend to a wedding. Booked into a 5 star hotel first night and then once once suitably inebriated going to slum it by sleeping in the cab of the ranger. Seats recline virtually flat, really comfy with a pillow and a duvet. wouldn't be able to do that with a van ;D ;D
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;D ;D
I had a radford mini once back in the early 70's that had all the bells and whisltles including reclining lether seats. I never use to sleep in it though but the reclining seats sure did come in handy with the ladies. ;D
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I've been looking at pickups for well over a year now. The convenience of having more seats as a family man, and the extra bulk head for safety reasons are the reasons I'd like to move on from my vivaro.
I already have a custom tank that came out of a Navara. It's the expense that's holding me back at the moment
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I've been looking at pickups for well over a year now. The convenience of having more seats as a family man, and the extra bulk head for safety reasons are the reasons I'd like to move on from my vivaro.
I already have a custom tank that came out of a Navara. It's the expense that's holding me back at the moment
Don't buy a Navara - they're lovely trucks but they do have a number of serious issues.
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Only just got off a customers gravel drive today. The gravel was too deep, really struggled >:(
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Don't buy a Navara - they're lovely trucks but they do have a number of serious issues.
Yeah I saw that video by the Yorkshire mechanic! Don't buy a Navara if you're taking it beyond 80k.
Been thinking of a lease. That way they'll be under warranty, but I'm looking at £250 +vat per month with a canopy. Hmmmm!
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If I did go down that route then it would be a Hilux for me. I like Toyotas. ;)
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Perhaps he needs a driving course. Can't clean windows and can't drive.
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Don't buy a Navara - they're lovely trucks but they do have a number of serious issues.
Yeah I saw that video by the Yorkshire mechanic! Don't buy a Navara if you're taking it beyond 80k.
Been thinking of a lease. That way they'll be under warranty, but I'm looking at £250 +vat per month with a canopy. Hmmmm!
If you can afford to go down the new / lease route then I can't see you'd go far wrong as long as someone else is picking up the bill.
A few years back there was website called knackerednavara.com where a large number of disgruntled owners collaborated to seek class action against Nissan. Engines on the D40 were routinely blowing up at around the 40,000 mile mark and what infuriated owners more than anything was the general disdain from Nissan. Some dealers, to their credit, replaced the engine under warranty with little fuss. Others claimed never to have heard of the problem and tried to blame the owners for lack of maintenance or not adhering firmly to the service schedules. It was only when featured on 'Watchdog' that Nissan has to accept some responsibility - though this seems to be limited.
Now we have a new problem with the Nissan Navara snapped chassis group - A number of D40 shape Navara's seem to be breaking in two when you tow something, you know the sort of thing you'd probably do with a pick up truck !
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I don't want to get completely off topic here but in a nutshell this is the problem that Nissan experienced and the reason why we're having so many issues today:
A brief history of NISSAN and the Navara problems... from about the mid 1980's nissan made great cars, they were now rust free and uber reliable with proper japanese tech, prob every person learning to drive up to the early 90's learnt in an old trusty micra... sadly though by the late 90's early 2000 they were losing money hand over fist so a collaboration with RENAULT, 'you know' the company who make brilliant cars out of paper, cardboard, the occasional bit of metal and wiring with virtually no insulation whatsoever, to share engines/chassis and french tech?... this brought us the last of the Primera's (the futuristic one which... err... didn't progress well into the future) so nissan was then even more in debt, RENAULT bailed them out and bought a 51% controlling stake in the company and cost cutting began.... NOW HERE COMES THE NAVARA BIT, and it is just my opinion!, the Navara D22 program/line was already in full swing so any cost cutting would have been minimal, Sadly though the D40 was a different matter, by the time the D40 was introduced the cost cutting was in full swing with the Primara and Note sharing engines and platforms with the 'super' Renaults, NOW HERE'S THE PROBLEM, how do you build the Navara D40 cheaply, the engine isn't really fitted to many vehicles, so thats out, the chassis only really can be adapted to the pathfinder and that's not a big marketable vehicle so what can you do..... Well you cut back.. seriously cut back, a lot of electronics, switchgear are shared and can't take the harsh environment a 4x4 pickup goes through, smaller cheaper bearings..... less protection against the elements..... The D40 has suffered many faults since introduction, in the early years it was half shafts, turbo boost solenoids and numerous 4 wheel drive sensors..... Sadly now we're at this point whereby the chassis are either rotting from the inside out and can even fool the best of MOT examiners for many years, by the time it does shows its ugly head it's too late....... OR you place a bag of sugar on the wrong point of the truck bed then all of a sudden the chassis joins the decepticons and decides to transform into what can be best described as a children's See-Saw on a playground....... either way it makes the vehicles so attractive to new buyers with the great looks, practicality and presence...... YET underneath there hiding a frightening prospect of possibly killing one of your kids!!!!!....
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Only just got off a customers gravel drive today. The gravel was too deep, really struggled >:(
It would be much more economically beneficial to drop that One customer. ;D
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It would be more beneficial to drop every customer with any access issues and only work in the Summer ;D
Just got in from looking at Toyota Hilux and Nissan N300 or something. Man, these things are so vulgar ....... and bloddy expensive!
What you want is a switch-able 4x4 van, nothing too fancy, just some intelligent wizardry that can send power to the non spinning wheels when required. I had to reverse up a steep drive this morning, nightmare again, either stall or spin.
I wonder if winter tyres all year round would help?
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It would be more beneficial to drop every customer with any access issues and only work in the Summer ;D
Just got in from looking at Toyota Hilux and Nissan N300 or something. Man, these things are so vulgar ....... and bloddy expensive!
What you want is a switch-able 4x4 van, nothing too fancy, just some intelligent wizardry that can send power to the non spinning wheels when required. I had to reverse up a steep drive this morning, nightmare again, either stall or spin.
I wonder if winter tyres all year round would help?
4x4s really are daft money. Cars are the same. Wife wants a Disco and we looked at 11/13 plates and they're outrageous money.
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I
need, want a pick-up.
I drop my children to school once a week and its getting tight in my traffic with their car seats.
And on my round I do have to go down a few gravel tracks and they get a bit muddy in winter.
Thats how I've justified it to myself ;D
I like taking my time on vehicles-the wife looks at houses and I at cars.
So I'm due a new motor in March and like the Amarok (I've driven VAG cars for about 8 years now) but it's only a 2 litre and i can't help think that with weight it'll not be as good as the 3 litre of the new Ford Ranger.
And the Ranger has loads of lovely little touches.
But my heart just isn't in the blue oval :(
Step up:
http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/first-official-pictures/volkswagen/new-2016-vw-amarok-gets-a-v6-pick-me-up/
221BHP and 406lb torque
Decision made :D
Can be ordered in September.
12 week build time.
Plenty of time for my 1st March delivery :D :D :D
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It would be more beneficial to drop every customer with any access issues and only work in the Summer ;D
Just got in from looking at Toyota Hilux and Nissan N300 or something. Man, these things are so vulgar ....... and bloddy expensive!
What you want is a switch-able 4x4 van, nothing too fancy, just some intelligent wizardry that can send power to the non spinning wheels when required. I had to reverse up a steep drive this morning, nightmare again, either stall or spin.
I wonder if winter tyres all year round would help?
4x4s really are daft money. Cars are the same. Wife wants a Disco and we looked at 11/13 plates and they're outrageous money.
I have a customer that part Xd her disco for another one it was an 06 Reg they have her £6500 for it only to see it on the forecourt a month later for he 12 mark lol,complete rip off m8 if you get one lease it and get another one 2-3 years later no big bills then only 6-800 a month depending on what option you go for lol.
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I'm 52 now and have driven my fair share of vehicles. I used to own a Toyota Hilux Intimidator (japanese import) and I have to say it is the best vehicle I have ever owned, bar none. I wasn't window cleaning at the time so it was purely for pleasure but it was the nuts. Just thought I'd mention it ;D
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Seen a 16 plate ranger today, huge thing it was. Very nice but not practical for our use Imo.