Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Mike #1 on October 23, 2015, 06:31:58 am
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Is their now to many window cleaners in certain areas just this week their has been 2 new vans in my area of work but firms have driven over 30 mins to do domestic houses one guy i spoke to nice fella but only cleaned one house in the street .
I wouldn't dream of doing a round trip for over an hour for a few dotted around domestic houses , I am not bothered by them as i have plenty of work just wondered if its the same in other areas .
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I would say there are a few more round my area. But you have to remember back when I first started every one used cars and ladder so would not stand out as much. I would say that I get less walkers now, but if I go knocking I still get good results.
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They're everywhere...I wouldn't like to build a round from scratch these days :-\
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Noticed lots more vans but a lot less guys on ladders in my areas. So guessing its the same. There is more competition now. With google,leaflets, websites etc etc. Luckily i got mine done 3/4 years ago so well ahead of the competition in my area. Website brings in jobs galore daily.
Work is still the same for me even with more window cleaners, if anything this year has been my busiest.
But then with guys on Facebook, saying they are earning £20 for fronts only. It's going to attract more people to the trade.
Had one prolific under cutter go round. Lost one house, however due to him going round. I picked up about 10 customers the same month. He jogged a lot of people memories to call me. So thanks matey !
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I have been seeing a lot more lately where I am.
I don't do much domestic but on one estate this week I saw 4 or 5 shiners.
We also have a lot of blokes who work for national window cleaning company's in Stevenage doing it on the side after work.
Some of the new starters have very little work so are going in cheap but seem to have money to burn on new vans.
There is a small window cleaning shop that sells water here and that has also made window cleaning a lot more accessible with people just starting out with a car and few barrels it's a cheap route in .
This shop also fits out systems and I have seen him fit 2 out in newish vans for new starters in the last month.
New window cleaners very rarely effect the established rounds or businesses.
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theres 3 lots of window cleaners that clean a few houses each on an estate i clean(i clean 90+)
1. a gang of trad lads in an old car(2 houses)
2.a trad guy in a audi estate(3 houses)
3.a company in a brand new ford custom WFP(2 houses)
it takes me nearly 4 days to clean this work ;D
its been the same for years.always at least 3 other guys cleaning scraps from my work(usually customers ive dumped/fell out with/they ve dumped me for a cheaper price or didnt like wfp) ;D
i seen 2 of them yesterday.i always say hello and smile.(big,big grin! ;D ;D ;D)
theres a hell of a lot of windows that need cleaning out there thus plenty of window cleaners.
you cant clean them all yourself!
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Other window cleaners starting up is only something you think about when new to the job yourself, once your at this
job a while and the reality of it sets in you never think about it again.
I would get a least 5 new starts in my area each year and that's only the ones I see or hear about there could be more, none last.
You need to be special to do this job day in and day out. ;D
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Other window cleaners starting up is only something you think about when new to the job yourself, once your at this
job a while and the reality of it sets in you never think about it again.
I would get a least 5 new starts in my area each year and that's only the ones I see or hear about there could be more, none last.
You need to be special to do this job day in and day out. ;D
Sean I've been running my business almost 16 yrs now . Most will never last let's hope we get a rough winter that will sort a few out .
After a year or 2 most will get fed up of chasing work and money and never getting paid for been off work .
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Getting a few new ones in this area but I don't care Got all the work I want but when weather gets rough the will be a few less newbies . All the new houses the government want to build we will need more window cleaners .
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You can only physically clean so many properties yourself and/or with a crew so why worry about what other do and just focus on your own business.
In this game cleaners come and go all the time so it should not bother you in the slightest surely?
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Is their now to many window cleaners in certain areas just this week their has been 2 new vans in my area of work but firms have driven over 30 mins to do domestic houses one guy i spoke to nice fella but only cleaned one house in the street .
I wouldn't dream of doing a round trip for over an hour for a few dotted around domestic houses , I am not bothered by them as i have plenty of work just wondered if its the same in other areas .
Mike whilst i do have streets where i appear to do the whole street more of my work is made up of ..only doing one house in a street.
You see a downside in that, and one i understand. Of course its a no brainer that the more compact your work is the more you earn? But there's an upside to this opposite scenario of only cleaning one house in a street too............
I don't know many streets, closes or whatever that do not have window cleaners. So when i get an enquiry i already know they have cleaners in their street/close whatever. But the fact they have asked me leads me to believe wrongly or rightly they do not want to use the cleaners that already service their road/street/close.
I'm just waffling on now, so i'll carry on waffling on..............as a new cleaner or some one starting out, or just me looking for new more lucrative business what do you do to attract customers where they already have a reliable cleaner ?
Well as i know, in my own circumstances, many cleaners engage on fortnightly terms and they door knock for the money on a Friday. They go around in gangs, and just jump fences, flat roofs etc willy nilly. Spliffs hanging out their mouths etc............. You know the type, entrapranuer......employs a few lads, £30 a day................
So armed with this knowledge i offer a little bit more, pre notification (for security), a contact address/phone/email, alternative payment means.............cheuque/BACS/plantpot/cash !! Blah blah blah !!!
Not everyones cup of tea i know. But its a cup of tea that keeps me in a comfortable living, gives my customers the window cleaning service they want and all the guys where i clean who generally do the whole street hate me. Can't please everyone.
But i've a question i'd like to ask you MIke? How come you're worried about other people ? I'd drive an hour for a days work no problem if the alternative was no work.
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CleanClear I am not worried about other people as such as i am well established in my area with a very good customer base i also clean 1 or 2 houses in some streets and i offer all the good alternatives you offer as any real pro would .
But i would'nt drive 30 mins from my home to do 2-3 hrs of dotted about work or less or to drive 30 mins then work my way back home doing just a 1-4 dotted about houses in various locations which is the impression the guy i spoke to gave me , Although i do have some days across the month were i am doing my driving about jobs as i call them but all in the same town and only 5 mins driving max between jobs .
If you factor in time spent driving plus van running costs are they really making much money , I know a guy now him and his brother both trad for more than 30 years got undercut on Greggs the bakers which they had in 2 towns whilst cleaning another shop one day the new Greggs guy asked if they would consider doing them for him not knowing he used to clean the windows .
He said how much the bloke said £5.00 that is what i am getting paid and kenny laughed at him i used to charge a £9.00 until i was undercut the guy was subcontracted to clean 6 shops the total drive time between shops was 1 hour with good traffic add another 40-50 mins to set up and clean each shop around £10.00 an hour if that with deducting vehicle expenses .
Overall i just find it a little puzzling as why 1 or 2 guys would travel such distances maybe them only been in the game few years lets say they have a different overall perspective , I am now and have been for some time compacting my round as much as possible but i will still take on 1 -2 houses in a street i don't already clean if its less than 5 mins from other work .
WAFFLING OVER ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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I think we're at a point now where compact means doing next door as well ;D
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CleanClear I am not worried about other people as such as i am well established in my area with a very good customer base i also clean 1 or 2 houses in some streets and i offer all the good alternatives you offer as any real pro would .
But i would'nt drive 30 mins from my home to do 2-3 hrs of dotted about work or less or to drive 30 mins then work my way back home doing just a 1-4 dotted about houses in various locations which is the impression the guy i spoke to gave me , Although i do have some days across the month were i am doing my driving about jobs as i call them but all in the same town and only 5 mins driving max between jobs .
If you factor in time spent driving plus van running costs are they really making much money , I know a guy now him and his brother both trad for more than 30 years got undercut on Greggs the bakers which they had in 2 towns whilst cleaning another shop one day the new Greggs guy asked if they would consider doing them for him not knowing he used to clean the windows .
He said how much the bloke said £5.00 that is what i am getting paid and kenny laughed at him i used to charge a £9.00 until i was undercut the guy was subcontracted to clean 6 shops the total drive time between shops was 1 hour with good traffic add another 40-50 mins to set up and clean each shop around £10.00 an hour if that with deducting vehicle expenses .
Overall i just find it a little puzzling as why 1 or 2 guys would travel such distances maybe them only been in the game few years lets say they have a different overall perspective , I am now and have been for some time compacting my round as much as possible but i will still take on 1 -2 houses in a street i don't already clean if its less than 5 mins from other work .
WAFFLING OVER ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
My view is that if your prices are good, compact is less of an issue. I have plenty of streets where I do lots but in general my experience is that those with very compact work tend to have lower priced work.
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Nope to my knowledge I am the most expensive cleaner covering my work area . On some houses I know lads are charging £4 less than me .
The quality of my workmanship is reflected in my prices , A guy I heard cleaning windows the other day might have to start making repairs to his custys houses I could hear his Vikan sill brush pounding the window reveals 4 doors away
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Generally, each area I visit has at least two days work - though some have maybe four or five. By "area", I mean jobs within a five minute drive of each other. However, I do have a few days where it might be 10 - 15 miles to the first job, then four or five miles to the next one etc. These are mostly larger jobs and have decent price tags. It is viable for me. Also, I ike to get away from the more urbanised areas sometimes and get a nice view.
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I think most new start-ups travel and do odd houses in a street on the premise that they could pickup extra work by canvassing etc and hopefully build a compact round from their efforts. However many seems to dare I say it be lazy and not bother too much on the marketing side so end up running all over the place.
Many established windys I have spoken to say I would not like to try building a round from scratch now as it's defo a lot harder out there than it used to be to gain compact work. These are mostly trad guy's been doing it for years that some use wfp too. The norm when they started was bi - weekly cleans that most customers went over to monthly. Now a lot of people the frequecy seems to be getting longer and longer so gaining new good frequent clean customers can be an upward strugle even for them.
I blame wfp method as windows stay cleaner for longer don't you know ;D
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I think most new start-ups travel and do odd houses in a street on the premise that they could pickup extra work by canvassing etc and hopefully build a compact round from their efforts. However many seems to dare I say it be lazy and not bother too much on the marketing side so end up running all over the place.
Many established windys I have spoken to say I would not like to try building a round from scratch now as it's defo a lot harder out there than it used to be to gain compact work. These are mostly trad guy's been doing it for years that some use wfp too. The norm when they started was bi - weekly cleans that most customers went over to monthly. Now a lot of people the frequecy seems to be getting longer and longer so gaining new good frequent clean customers can be an upward strugle even for them.
I blame wfp method as windows stay cleaner for longer don't you know ;D
I think WFP cleaning may be partly responsible, but for another reason. It an be a fair sized investment setting up WFP, so shiners want a return on that by pricing at a realistically higher rate. In turn, that can start causing issues with frequency.
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I think most new start-ups travel and do odd houses in a street on the premise that they could pickup extra work by canvassing etc and hopefully build a compact round from their efforts. However many seems to dare I say it be lazy and not bother too much on the marketing side so end up running all over the place.
Many established windys I have spoken to say I would not like to try building a round from scratch now as it's defo a lot harder out there than it used to be to gain compact work. These are mostly trad guy's been doing it for years that some use wfp too. The norm when they started was bi - weekly cleans that most customers went over to monthly. Now a lot of people the frequecy seems to be getting longer and longer so gaining new good frequent clean customers can be an upward strugle even for them.
I blame wfp method as windows stay cleaner for longer don't you know ;D
I think WFP cleaning may be partly responsible, but for another reason. It an be a fair sized investment setting up WFP, so shiners want a return on that by pricing at a realistically higher rate. In turn, that can start causing issues with frequency.
Indeed frequency & pricing plays a bit part too as the days of really cheap bi weekly rag glass cleaners have long gone...well most have snuffed it anyway ;D
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Anyone look at it the other way around, there are to many windows and not enough shiners to take care of them all, some people see the glass half full others see it half empty.
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Anyone look at it the other way around, there are to many windows and not enough shiners to take care of them all, some people see the glass half full others see it half empty.
Indeed ;D
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My niece and nephew (in their thirties) were in fulltime jw voluntary work in the London branch office. They decided they'd done enough up there and moved out and had to start with no accommodation, no job, no trade skills.
They bunked up with my brother in Somerset in May 2014 and he and I gave them some guidance (good with tekkie practical skills) and helped them build a home installed system in an old Peugeot partner van.
My nephew rented some crappy work paying him about £400 a month after the rental and he and my niece went canvassing. (jw's are usually good at canvassing ;D)
By January 2015 they were earning enough to move out and rent a small house and are now independent. They have no kids and are very frugal with their expenses but it shows what can be done.
My brother says they didn't even break a sweat (as in push themselves) - they work part time and jog along quite happily and I guess but don't know for sure that their round is probably turning over about £2K a month and the original rental stuff has been returned.
If they were "go-getters" I reckon they'd be doubling that turnover, but they seem very happy jogging along being away from a very regimented life.
Sounds like they they are doing well and have the right work and home life balance which is an important thing in life , As my physio guy said the other day would rather work flat out till retirement sacrificing time at home to be at work and suffer ill health and not really enjoy life .
Or would rather have the right balance and make the most of your life spend time with your wife/family and maintain good health throughout your life and look back and say to yourself i have done what i wanted and had a great life .
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My niece and nephew (in their thirties) were in fulltime jw voluntary work in the London branch office. They decided they'd done enough up there and moved out and had to start with no accommodation, no job, no trade skills.
They bunked up with my brother in Somerset in May 2014 and he and I gave them some guidance (good with tekkie practical skills) and helped them build a home installed system in an old Peugeot partner van.
My nephew rented some crappy work paying him about £400 a month after the rental and he and my niece went canvassing. (jw's are usually good at canvassing ;D)
By January 2015 they were earning enough to move out and rent a small house and are now independent. They have no kids and are very frugal with their expenses but it shows what can be done.
My brother says they didn't even break a sweat (as in push themselves) - they work part time and jog along quite happily and I guess but don't know for sure that their round is probably turning over about £2K a month and the original rental stuff has been returned.
If they were "go-getters" I reckon they'd be doubling that turnover, but they seem very happy jogging along being away from a very regimented life.
Sounds like they they are doing well and have the right work and home life balance which is an important thing in life , As my physio guy said the other day would rather work flat out till retirement sacrificing time at home to be at work and suffer ill health and not really enjoy life .
Or would rather have the right balance and make the most of your life spend time with your wife/family and maintain good health throughout your life and look back and say to yourself i have done what i wanted and had a great life .
Could not agree more
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Personally, I hate it when we do around 40 houses in an estate and another window cleaner arrives and does 2 or 3. I'm not into saying this or that is my patch as that saying is well gone. I respect other window cleaners . If I'm offered a job in an estate where i don't do and I know the window cleaner there, I always hand it over. That way they do the same for you.
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Personally, I hate it when we do around 40 houses in an estate and another window cleaner arrives and does 2 or 3. I'm not into saying this or that is my patch as that saying is well gone. I respect other window cleaners . If I'm offered a job in an estate where i don't do and I know the window cleaner there, I always hand it over. That way they do the same for you.
I disagree. I cleaned around 8 houses on an estate where a competitor who supposedly cleans the whole estate recently tried not only to bully me off the estate, but even tried to intimidate his customers into staying with him by telling them that he was the local window cleaner and they had better stay with him! I kid you not. Since then he has lost 6 more to me in the same stretch of the estate!
I am more than happy to co-exist with other windys as we all need to earn a living, but his attitude makes me want to put him out of business. The thing is, I am failing. He is doing it to himself.
John
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Personally, I hate it when we do around 40 houses in an estate and another window cleaner arrives and does 2 or 3. I'm not into saying this or that is my patch as that saying is well gone. I respect other window cleaners . If I'm offered a job in an estate where i don't do and I know the window cleaner there, I always hand it over. That way they do the same for you.
Yeah your right - that saying went about 10 years ago. But you sound like inside your head your still telling yourself ' this is my patch' .
if someone has advertised on the web or whatever and a custy from an estate decides to ring them, then why the hell should that window cleaner just hand it over to you?
If you've got 40 houses in one estate then I'd say your doing a good job anyway , so why worry about a few houses being done by someone else?
Remember, you don't own the houses or customers, it's upto them who they want to clean their windows.
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Personally, I hate it when we do around 40 houses in an estate and another window cleaner arrives and does 2 or 3. I'm not into saying this or that is my patch as that saying is well gone. I respect other window cleaners . If I'm offered a job in an estate where i don't do and I know the window cleaner there, I always hand it over. That way they do the same for you.
I disagree. I cleaned around 8 houses on an estate where a competitor who supposedly cleans the whole estate recently tried not only to bully me off the estate, but even tried to intimidate his customers into staying with him by telling them that he was the local window cleaner and they had better stay with him! I kid you not. Since then he has lost 6 more to me in the same stretch of the estate!
I am more than happy to co-exist with other windys as we all need to earn a living, but his attitude makes me want to put him out of business. The thing is, I am failing. He is doing it to himself.
John
I agree with you Jonny. If my window cleaner said that to me, I would immediately sack him and get somebody else...and he would have a sore nose too >:(
I hate attitudes like that.
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The most windys I've seen in one street at any one time is 6. There was a few daggered looks going on I can tell you ;D
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There are plenty of newbies starting up charging ridiculous prices undercutting who disappear come winter as they've priced way too low. There's a cleaning company earning £8 an hour as employers who want to sell their business, joke!! no chance, might as well stay PAYE with holidays, sick pay, etc.