Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Amazin on August 11, 2015, 12:07:06 am
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(http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p222/Diamond888/Mobile%20Uploads/20150731_163307_zpsnprkd675.jpg) (http://s129.photobucket.com/user/Diamond888/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20150731_163307_zpsnprkd675.jpg.html)
The top 2 windows:S I don't think I can lean the ladder against it, I won't be able to reach it with my hands. What is the best thing to do?
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Invest in a WFP setup, and join the 21st century ;D
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With wfp its no longer hard to reach :-)
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Put the ladders above the windows, u will easy reach then top ones and then drop it back down to under windows for bottom ones if ya can't reach in first climb.
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It was windows like those that helped "encourage" me into WFP.
The one above the bay needs the ladder extended to rest on the brickwork above the window - to reduce the angle. For pity's sake, have ladder mitts on the end of the ladder to reduce the risk of sideways slip. The lower half of that wndow might be tricky as it's a longer distance to reach in. I have even been known to do windows like that with a foot on the sill and the other on the ladder. DON'T DO THAT!
Even if full WFP is currently unaffordable, at least treat yourself to a backpack, a cheap poleand find a local window cleaner who will supply you with enough water just to do the difficult windows.
Backpack maybe £100 with the VAT. You should be able to pick up a 20 foot fibreglass pole with brush for another £100 or so. The pole will not be great for that kind of price but if you only want it for the odd window, that won't matter. A couple hundred quid or so to spare you from the possibility of serious injury or untimely death.
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Got me thinking about our own work, and if we had to do it with ladders. . . . . . would rather stick needles in my eyes, while swimming across a river full of crocodiles ;D
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If money is real tight harris pole and hand pump garden sprayer
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i used to use a trad pole(unger teleplus with a vice versa and a fixiclamp for detailing) for awkward windows when 100% trad.more time consuming than wfp but got the job done.sometimes i had to use an angle adaptor to close out at the bottom of the windows with deep ledges so used a normal squeegee and mop rather than the vice versa.thing is i had to bring the pole down 3 times to clean it(mop/squeegee/detail).plus you couldnt really clean the frames effectively.
backpack/pole/little foldaway trolley,bungee,a couple of 25l barrels is what you need mate to start you off wfp and means to purify your water.(di/ro)
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It was windows like those that helped "encourage" me into WFP.
The one above the bay needs the ladder extended to rest on the brickwork above the window - to reduce the angle. For pity's sake, have ladder mitts on the end of the ladder to reduce the risk of sideways slip. The lower half of that wndow might be tricky as it's a longer distance to reach in. I have even been known to do windows like that with a foot on the sill and the other on the ladder. DON'T DO THAT!
Even if full WFP is currently unaffordable, at least treat yourself to a backpack, a cheap poleand find a local window cleaner who will supply you with enough water just to do the difficult windows.
Backpack maybe £100 with the VAT. You should be able to pick up a 20 foot fibreglass pole with brush for another £100 or so. The pole will not be great for that kind of price but if you only want it for the odd window, that won't matter. A couple hundred quid or so to spare you from the possibility of serious injury or untimely death.
I second this.
I used to do 'interesting' and probably unsafe things with ladders to reach windows like those that I would never recommend.
I recommend going wfp if you possibly can. I dismissed it for years till I had no choice. Once I started I didn't look back. Even if I could now, I'd never go back. With wfp you'll look at jobs like those, smile and carry on without a care other than to do a good job.
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To add to my earlier post, an additional benefitr with backpack and cheap pole is that you will be able to clean windows above conservatories. I've gained a number of jobs from trad cleaners due to this.
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dead easy mate , on left hand window just put your ladder on the top left corner 1 rail on brickwork other rail in the window return, go to the right hand corner of the other window & do the same, your ladder cant slip at all, i do a window like this every month i have to say though i do the rest of the house wfp
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piece of pish .... my first round in Hoole Chester had all houses like this ....
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.merlin-industrial.co.uk%2Faccess-equipment%2Fladders%2F921-ladder-and-steps-accessories&ei=J7PJVYzJF8HeUcONtKgE&bvm=bv.99804247,d.d24&psig=AFQjCNGLJxGnqDgo28Jbma6fEPjly9la-w&ust=1439368374052161
ladder stand off
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Really can't understand why people are still using ladders when there is a safer, and better cleaning method ::)roll
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Really can't understand why people are still using ladders when there is a safer, and better cleaning method ::)roll
take the falling off angle away, the earnings part, the harder work, the wfp complications / expense ...... I much preferred trad (in the nice weather) ;D
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It was windows like those that helped "encourage" me into WFP.
The one above the bay needs the ladder extended to rest on the brickwork above the window - to reduce the angle. For pity's sake, have ladder mitts on the end of the ladder to reduce the risk of sideways slip. The lower half of that wndow might be tricky as it's a longer distance to reach in. I have even been known to do windows like that with a foot on the sill and the other on the ladder. DON'T DO THAT!
Even if full WFP is currently unaffordable, at least treat yourself to a backpack, a cheap poleand find a local window cleaner who will supply you with enough water just to do the difficult windows.
Backpack maybe £100 with the VAT. You should be able to pick up a 20 foot fibreglass pole with brush for another £100 or so. The pole will not be great for that kind of price but if you only want it for the odd window, that won't matter. A couple hundred quid or so to spare you from the possibility of serious injury or untimely death.
I second this.
I used to do 'interesting' and probably unsafe things with ladders to reach windows like those that I would never recommend.
I recommend going wfp if you possibly can. I dismissed it for years till I had no choice. Once I started I didn't look back. Even if I could now, I'd never go back. With wfp you'll look at jobs like those, smile and carry on without a care other than to do a good job.
I can relate to everything you have said here, good post.
lal
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You will find most domestic jobs you get asked to quote will be awkward to do one way or another using trad methods be it from ladders or by trad pole.
Regarding using ladders some jobs are fine to do ladder sets when it's dry. However surfaces you set the ladder on can become slippery which becomes an issue so it's easy to start taking risks to get the job done. Old school trad cleaners will think nothing of setting ladders up a weird angles and tile walking too.
A lot of trad guy's that get into wfp work would have had a near miss or two or even a fall at some point including myself. Most new to wfp start off doing tops then soon realise it's easier to do the lot by wfp so end up with a van mount eventually.
Going wfp is a no brainer if you ask me as it also opens up new revenue streams too. ;D
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backpack/pole/little foldaway trolley,bungee,a couple of 25l barrels is what you need mate to start you off wfp and means to purify your water.(di/ro)
wait, are you saying they come with a mini purification system with them? wow, I need to look into it then!
You will find most domestic jobs you get asked to quote will be awkward to do one way or another using trad methods be it from ladders or by trad pole.
Regarding using ladders some jobs are fine to do ladder sets when it's dry. However surfaces you set the ladder on can become slippery which becomes an issue so it's easy to start taking risks to get the job done. Old school trad cleaners will think nothing of setting ladders up a weird angles and tile walking too.
A lot of trad guy's that get into wfp work would have had a near miss or two or even a fall at some point including myself. Most new to wfp start off doing tops then soon realise it's easier to do the lot by wfp so end up with a van mount eventually.
Going wfp is a no brainer if you ask me as it also opens up new revenue streams too. ;D
yeah I know, its only matter of time before I got WFP fully but now I need to make some money. I charging £40 to clean the whole house first time then £30 afterwards. hope I'm charging enough for all the hussle of climbing ladders!
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If you happen to live in a soft water are then depending on the tap water tds you may not even need to use an ro/di as a di system only would do.
Treat yourself to a none fake HM Digital TDS-3 Handheld Meter With Carrying Case first to test it as you will need to get one anyway. http://www.daqua.co.uk/testmeters.htm
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dead easy mate , on left hand window just put your ladder on the top left corner 1 rail on brickwork other rail in the window return, go to the right hand corner of the other window & do the same, your ladder cant slip at all, i do a window like this every month i have to say though i do the rest of the house wfp
thats the way to do them,lads around here take the rubbers out of the ladder and push pieces of wood in,which stick out 10 inch,this helps get the ladder in the corner better
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If you're happy staying trad for a while, then invest in a decent 'A' frame pointer ladder. You can position these practically anywhere on or around the window.
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The last look at H/S stated that you should not use ladders if a safer way was available. The problem if its not available due to a cash problem or if you should get the cash before you start.
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Really can't understand why people are still using ladders when there is a safer, and better cleaning method ::)roll
Alot more expensive as I hardly haven't outgoings and no expensive kit to keep in order, also gained alot of customers as they don't like wfp because the ways it's done not just because they had a crap window cleaner
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Really can't understand why people are still using ladders when there is a safer, and better cleaning method ::)roll
Alot more expensive as I hardly haven't outgoings and no expensive kit to keep in order, also gained alot of customers as they don't like wfp because the ways it's done not just because they had a crap window cleaner
What price do you put on your life ? Regarding customers prefering it , thats a load of bull, are your customers going to pay your bills when you fall off ? A cleaner in our area died falling off ladders, and one of his old customers asked us if we would do the work using ladders . . . . I won't say what I said ::)roll
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Really can't understand why people are still using ladders when there is a safer, and better cleaning method ::)roll
Alot more expensive as I hardly haven't outgoings and no expensive kit to keep in order, also gained alot of customers as they don't like wfp because the ways it's done not just because they had a crap window cleaner
What price do you put on your life ? Regarding customers prefering it , thats a load of bull, are your customers going to pay your bills when you fall off ? A cleaner in our area died falling off ladders, and one of his old customers asked us if we would do the work using ladders . . . . I won't say what I said ::)roll
Not really bull when i've gained alot of money from just doing trad, I am always safe as the ladder slipped years ago so will never risk anything and get workmate to hold it if it's a hard or wet etc. Also you could potentially use pole and wagtail as good and quicker than wfp if you've seen waggas videos on YouTube
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A few years ago I had a very harsh reality check. Barely half a mile from where I live the W/C came off his ladder while cleaning the top windows above a restaurant. I didn't see it myself the the shopkeeper in the next shop told me that the blood was running from his head and into the gutter. He was lucky to live. Six months off work. When I next saw him he was very much slower of mind, body and speech. He stopped cleaning within a year. I don't know what became of him. I used to see him around a lot in happier times.
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
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A few years ago I had a very harsh reality check. Barely half a mile from where I live the W/C came off his ladder while cleaning the top windows above a restaurant. I didn't see it myself the the shopkeeper in the next shop told me that the blood was running from his head and into the gutter. He was lucky to live. Six months off work. When I next saw him he was very much slower of mind, body and speech. He stopped cleaning within a year. I don't know what became of him. I used to see him around a lot in happier times.
I know as window cleaners die or sustain life changing injuries every year as a direct result of just trying to do their job.
The lucky ones get a big wakeup call for sure.
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
in the hands of a good cleaner ladders are perfectly safe,its the make as much money as quickly as possible cleaners that are unsafe
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
I'm not against wfp in some situations it's good but if I take precautions to be as safe as anyone else a ladder is fine, alot of the time quicker on normal residential houses as well and the main reason a hell of a lot cheaper, as I said learning the skill with a trad pole is also alot more satisfying I think
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Mark you really are behaving unwisely. You've been shown a way for less than £200 to get to difficult windows with a backpack and pole and you yammer on about how your customers won't have it.
Heard it all before ... they won't have it they say this they say that. What it boils down to is this. Either a window cleaner grows a pair and tells his customers he will not risk his neck and they can find someone else or he doesn't.
You carry on giving it large as to how your keeping the craft alive and making the money from your loyal customers . Don't bother asking folk who were on ladders for ten years and have been wfp for ten years, just go your own sweet way.
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
in the hands of a good cleaner ladders are perfectly safe,its the make as much money as quickly as possible cleaners that are unsafe
Exactly mate, there are people injured in every profession when not using their equipment properly.
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Wagga only took 28 years to realise wfp van mount was the way to go . ;D
My mate only took 26 years to realise he could make more money going wfp too. ::)roll
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Mark you really are behaving unwisely. You've been shown a way for less than £200 to get to difficult windows with a backpack and pole and you yammer on about how your customers won't have it.
Heard it all before ... they won't have it they say this they say that. What it boils down to is this. Either a window cleaner grows a pair and tells his customers he will not risk his neck and they can find someone else or he doesn't.
You carry on giving it large as to how your keeping the craft alive and making the money from your loyal customers . Don't bother asking folk who were on ladders for ten years and have been wfp for ten years, just go your own sweet way.
No not at all I haven't attacked anyone for using wfp, I'm just saying if you are safe and take precautions etc you can make that work as well, I wouldn't speak to customers that way, I was talking about getting new customers because they don't like wfp. Im open to the idea of a backpack and have asked about that previously, I don't know where you think k ivebeen giving it large as you put it? But last time I looked it was a post about trad? I have said a few times wfp can be good but not in every situation as a few here try to tell me otherwise, thanks for your concern about my safety though :)
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Wagga only took 28 years to realise wfp van mount was the way to go . ;D
My mate only took 26 years to realise he could make more money going wfp too. ::)roll
I'm doing pretty well then as it only took me 14 years of ladders (and two near misses) to decide on WFP.
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Mark you really are behaving unwisely. You've been shown a way for less than £200 to get to difficult windows with a backpack and pole and you yammer on about how your customers won't have it.
Heard it all before ... they won't have it they say this they say that. What it boils down to is this. Either a window cleaner grows a pair and tells his customers he will not risk his neck and they can find someone else or he doesn't.
You carry on giving it large as to how your keeping the craft alive and making the money from your loyal customers . Don't bother asking folk who were on ladders for ten years and have been wfp for ten years, just go your own sweet way.
No not at all I haven't attacked anyone for using wfp, I'm just saying if you are safe and take precautions etc you can make that work as well, I wouldn't speak to customers that way, I was talking about getting new customers because they don't like wfp. Im open to the idea of a backpack and have asked about that previously, I don't know where you think k ivebeen giving it large as you put it? But last time I looked it was a post about trad? I have said a few times wfp can be good but not in every situation as a few here try to tell me otherwise, thanks for your concern about my safety though :)
Mark, even customers who dislike WFP are unlikely to give you a hard time about just using it on the more unsafe climbs. If they do, they don't deserve a window cleaner.
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Wagga only took 28 years to realise wfp van mount was the way to go . ;D
My mate only took 26 years to realise he could make more money going wfp too. ::)roll
I'm doing pretty well then as it only took me 14 years of ladders (and two near misses) to decide on WFP.
Wakeup calls tend to do that for sure...Nice one ;)
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I won't do any unsafe climbs, I've had a near miss before and took the precautions against it happening again
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I bet that's what this chap said too ???
http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/13313360.UPDATED__Window_cleaner_seriously_injured_after_falling_18ft_from_ladder_on_building_site/
No one goes out to work thinking they will not come back in one piece but sadly it happens all the time.
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No matter how safely you use ladders and how good you are at judging situations, accidents are what they are. More often than not unforeseen. You cannot predict every situation, especially when other people are involved. I've had numerous customers over the years suddenly appear at windows trying to pay me out of upstairs windows. I've had animals suddenly leap up windows and on one occasion two stupid boys who thought it would be fun to try to tip me off the ladder by forcing the window open I was trying to clean.
As for customers not liking wfp, and insisting on trad, well they don't give a hoot about our safety. I was even told this by one of my customers when I made the switch. He was one of four that I lost straight off. They chose to go with a trad guy who two years ago fell off his ladder after a particularly wet night and broke his wrist. He never returned to work and three of the four came back to me and the fourth went with another wfper. She too had been very rude to me when I tried to explain the safety issues.
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I won't do any unsafe climbs, I've had a near miss before and took the precautions against it happening again
Mark don't try and defend your actions to this mob, there have been many thousands of window cleaners over the years
who have worked successfully and safely from ladders.
Remove the guys who where too stupid to be allowed on ladders in the first place or guys taking silly risks and there would only be a very small percentage of competent shiners who have been injured from falling.
This same mob preaching about health and safety will be telling you next week that you need to buy a cheap gas boiler from
China and fit it to your van if you want to make any money cleaning with pure. ::)roll
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ive had more accidents in 5 years wfp than 17 years on the ladders!ive fell off ladders twice from 1st floor height(ladders slipped and landed on my heels both times)luckily i was ok apart from a swollen ankle and a bit of back pain.
wfp ive fell over a wall/garden furniture(while looking up poling)5 TIMES!one of the falls resulted in painful bruised ribs! ::)roll ;D
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Head out with a round of under priced work which then means you having to work fast to make a living add a ladder and there's going to be an accident/fall.
I got asked to quote a property a while back the guy who was cleaning it had a bad fall and had quit, he was charging £5 for
a property that would take me 45mins to clean with the pole.
He ran about with the ladders walked across porches ledges or do anything that would make the job quicker it surprises me he
lasted so long.
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ive had more accidents in 5 years wfp than 17 years on the ladders!ive fell off ladders twice from 1st floor height(ladders slipped and landed on my heels both times)luckily i was ok apart from a swollen ankle and a bit of back pain.
wfp ive fell over a wall/garden furniture(while looking up poling)5 TIMES!one of the falls resulted in painful bruised ribs! ::)roll ;D
Best to look down & around you before moving your feet you clumsy oaf ;D
Also best to pay attention to the base of the pole too so you don't smack any cars etc as is easy to do too... Oops! ::)roll
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
I'm not against wfp in some situations it's good but if I take precautions to be as safe as anyone else a ladder is fine, alot of the time quicker on normal residential houses as well and the main reason a hell of a lot cheaper, as I said learning the skill with a trad pole is also alot more satisfying I think
If you have all the answers don`t ask for advice on how to kill yourself.
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Do you know what, some people are just not going to change even when they are risking their own life, so I am going to tell you where I am . . . . .I am out ! You crack on fella :-X
I'm not against wfp in some situations it's good but if I take precautions to be as safe as anyone else a ladder is fine, alot of the time quicker on normal residential houses as well and the main reason a hell of a lot cheaper, as I said learning the skill with a trad pole is also alot more satisfying I think
If you have all the answers don`t ask for advice on how to kill yourself.
What does that mean? As the person above mentioned he's had more accidents with wfp than ladders, I'm not trying say ladders are safe but people will have accidents with anything whether it's ladders, wfp or more likely driving to the job, that was what I was saying when I first posted a reply
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It's logical to assume you are at higher risk of serious injury or even death using ladders doing hundreds of ladder sets a day than someone using a wfp surely?
You don't hear of many wfp guy's getting killed using a wfp compared to a trad guy's using ladders
RAMS springs to mind but just watch out for high voltage overhead cables or you could get fryed as a few yanks have already found out waving a long pole about. ::)roll
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Regarding the risk of electrocution I'm sure a few over here have had a close call too as I'm aware of 3 got a belt from overhead cables waving poles about. I sure it was one of Rhinoman workers doing solar panel cleaning and another 2 that Alex Gardiner has mentioned.
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O yh I know there's more danger in ladders, I never said that it was safer than wfp just a few people either didn't read it or just love to mention about ladders cause death lol
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I've found the falling bit is easy but the sudden stop at the end is a bummer as hurts like hell ;D
Now if I need to use ladders for whatever reason when it's safe to do so I use this setup. Looks like overkill I know but as I work on my own I know the ladder will not go anywhere if set properly even on slippery surfaces. I just have to make sure I don't fall off the dam thing ;D
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wfp ive fell over a wall/garden furniture(while looking up poling)5 TIMES!one of the falls resulted in painful bruised ribs! ::)roll ;D
Know what you mean. I wouldn't say I've had more accidents with wfp than using a ladder but I've learned to take a mental snapshot of the ground around me before I start as it is very easy to trip over or step on something or even go down a step you didn't notice was there whilst you are looking up. Even falling onto something hard or sharp from a standing position can cause a considerable injury.
I'd still rather trip over than fall off a set of ladders though. As Smurf says, 'the falling's easy, it's the landing that stings a bit.'
I love the way you put that Smurf. Made me laugh. ;D
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Thanks ;D
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Don't think it's overkill, that's the precautions I meant when using a ladder, I see others on a ladder and I almost can't watch it looks so dangerous, there's a good video on YouTube crazy world of window cleaning I think? Now those guys are scary!
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Ladders are safe enough if they are in good condition and used responsibly.
John
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Sorry, could get myself lol ;D
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Brilliant! ;D ;D ;D
John.
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Does make you feel a right chimp when you fall off one for sure ;D
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I probably looked like a chimp on one occasion as the ladders I was climbing flipped over when I was half way up and left me swinging by one hand for a second or so before I dropped to the floor. I only dropped about two or three feet but hit the floor with straight legs and boy did it send a shock through me.
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I probably looked like a chimp on one occasion as the ladders I was climbing flipped over when I was half way up and left me swinging by one hand for a second or so before I dropped to the floor. I only dropped about two or three feet but hit the floor with straight legs and boy did it send a shock through me.
Sounds rather painful but funny at the same time ;D
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This cctv footage always cracks me up.
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=13e_1191083013
Dumb & Dumber springs to mind ;D