Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: DB Cleaning Services on July 22, 2015, 04:27:59 pm
-
Looking to convert my cold system to hot, can any body recommend the best way to do it,without spending £8k on a new system thanks dale ;)
-
Hi
Look at freedom hot water system
Not cheap but top quality
Bryan
-
I use a chepo lpg water heater myself which is mounted on a purfreedom trolley in the van by the side loading door.
I don't do spending silly amounts of money on kit when I don't have too.
-
I would not bother its over rated and I have used a gas boiler for 3 years and three units later decided its not worth it and I don't think it cleans better. all the hassle of fitting and hoses bursting, not thanks.
-
That surprises me you say that as I find using hot is brilliant on first cleans etc.
Tree sap, bug & bird poo, salt deposits if living by the sea etc all melts away no bother to mention a few things hot can do.
I would not bother its over rated and I have used a gas boiler for 3 years and three units later decided its not worth it and I don't think it cleans better. all the hassle of fitting and hoses bursting, not thanks.
-
If you want my honest opinion I don't rate cold pure water very much at all ;D
-
ask dazmond ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Well do tell us more ;D
ask dazmond ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Looking to convert my cold system to hot, can any body recommend the best way to do it,without spending £8k on a new system thanks dale ;)
If you can get electric supply out to the van you can use an immersion heater.
-
I thought about doing that myself then though b******s I want hot water on demand instead.
I also have the option to use customers tap water or pure from the van to use hot depending what I'm cleaning.
Looking to convert my cold system to hot, can any body recommend the best way to do it,without spending £8k on a new system thanks dale ;)
If you can get electric supply out to the van you can use an immersion heater.
-
m using hot more or less all the time, i think its worth the investment, i too use a LPG L5 water heater, costs about £1.00 a day to run, that will vary of course.
-
Hi bob
Where do you get one from,how much ?,is it a big job to install ? Cheers dale
-
i wouldnt bother mate.i was spending £52 a month on gas using it every day.then the price of hot water hose,the actual heater.the messing about going to get bottles and changing em etc.blown hoses,connectors,faffing.i had it running great just before last xmas and then i forgot to drain the heater properly over xmas.yep.you guessed it!i knackered it!! ::)roll
i reckon it does clean a bit better and its nice to have warm supple hoses on a cold day but not needed IMO.
I dumped the heater and hot water hose at the tip a few months ago. ;D
-
I only use hot for about three weeks of the year. Pointless these temps.
-
I only use hot for about three weeks of the year. Pointless these temps.
The immersion is the route for me. Ran mine for 5 years self-installed at £55 for the bits. Still going strong. Supple hoses are great in winter. Just put it on a timer depending on the forecast the next day.
-
Hi to agree hot water a complete waste of time ive used mine about 3 times in the last 6 months. Having said that I only do 99% windows If your doing a lot of one off none windows then fine.
-
Hi
Look at freedom hot water system
Not cheap but top quality
Bryan
I have the PF Isothermal 1 diesel heater and certainly do not rate it. For me it was a waste of time and money.
-
I do alot of what I call exterior deep cleans so hot water & soap is better than cold by miles.
You would not wash baked on filthy dishes with just cold water now would you ;D
-
i wouldent pay £2000+ on a diesel heater but a £150 gas set up all in is defo wrth a punt i think, i had a nte mare to day scrubing bird crxxxap of a 3 story window even using the super scraper with bronzwool pad on it lol took ages >:(
-
Webasto type diesel water heaters are relatively cheap to buy as that is all is in a really expensive diesel water heater box whatever brand you look at. Apart from a hot water exchange unit added etc but they are really expensive to maintain.
That is why I went for a cheapo lpg gas water heater myself as are a simple throw away item unlike paying out over a grand a time to get a webasto heater serviced by the likes of ionics
i wouldent pay £2000+ on a diesel heater but a £150 gas set up all in is defo wrth a punt i think, i had a nte mare to day scrubing bird crxxxap of a 3 story window even using the super scraper with bronzwool pad on it lol took ages >:(
-
I do alot of what I call exterior deep cleans so hot water & soap is better than cold by miles.
You would not wash baked on filthy dishes with just cold water now would you ;D
You have convinced me, once I start getting the same crap that's on dirty dishes on my windows I'm investing in hot. ;D
-
have u got a link to these heaters im very intrested on geting one
-
I don't just clean windows I CLEAN them ;D
I do alot of what I call exterior deep cleans so hot water & soap is better than cold by miles.
You would not wash baked on filthy dishes with just cold water now would you ;D
You have convinced me, once I start getting the same crap that's on dirty dishes on my windows I'm investing in hot. ;D
-
This is the same one I'm using at the mo http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Stainless-New-8L-Gas-LPG-Propane-Tankless-Instant-Hot-Water-Heater-Boiler-/291137754549
It's a great little heater for my needs ;)
Just remember in winter below 0 to drain it down or it will freeze up and be fit for the bin like the one I use to have ;D
have u got a link to these heaters im very intrested on geting one
-
looks like a very good heater cheep to i take it u can mount it on the back door no flue needed
-
I've got mine mounted on a purefreedom trolley by the side loading door no probs. The gas bottle is strapped in where the water container would go. No vent required as I leave the door slightly open so it vents just fine.
If you a worried about co2 then you can also fit an alarm in the cab as my van is fitted with a full steel bulkhead
looks like a very good heater cheep to i take it u can mount it on the back door no flue needed
-
Yes, I have to admit my hot system has been brilliant for removing Weetabix, bacon rind, fried egg and dried on Tomato sauce from windows - I'd be lost without it.
-
;D
it's good at also removing dried on bird a bug poo, tree sap. lichen, backed on dirt/algae just to name a few not just the glass but the frames and other plastics like cladding, f/s/g too. All I can say it makes my job easier so I will stick to using hot ;)
Yes, I have to admit my hot system has been brilliant for removing Weetabix, bacon rind, fried egg and dried on Tomato sauce from windows - I'd be lost without it.
-
smurf did u use a gas man to rig it up or did u just do it ur self im asuming its easy to rig up, also what gas do u use lpg ?were do u get urs?, i can c the benifits to hot i work buy the sea lots of gulls craping on the glass even using ubik on the brush and leting it soak can b hard wrk at times
-
;D
it's good at also removing dried on bird a bug poo, tree sap. lichen, backed on dirt/algae just to name a few not just the glass but the frames and other plastics like cladding, f/s/g too. All I can say it makes my job easier so I will stick to using hot ;)
Yes, I have to admit my hot system has been brilliant for removing Weetabix, bacon rind, fried egg and dried on Tomato sauce from windows - I'd be lost without it.
When you say 'hot', how hot do you mean? After shattering a window I never used water other than luke warm which made it pretty pointless for me.
-
smurf did u use a gas man to rig it up or did u just do it ur self im asuming its easy to rig up, also what gas do u use lpg ?were do u get urs?, i can c the benifits to hot i work buy the sea lots of gulls craping on the glass even using ubik on the brush and leting it soak can b hard wrk at times
TBH mate if i worked by the sea i would use hot water all the time as it will help you with seasalt,seagull poo for sure.its easy to set it up yourself.you will have to use it pretty hot for it to have any cleaning power though.
and theres the rub.you need the water to be at 40degrees at least to see the benefit.
for most of us with regular maintenance window cleaning on 4/6/8 weekly frequencies away from the coast its an added expense thats really not needed IMO.cold water cleans just fine.
-
youll need
L5 heater(or something similar)
gas bottle(i used 13kg bottles)
gas regulator
13mm car radiator hose(for hot outlet to reel)
heavy duty brass or metal hoselock(QR from gardiners)
3/4 BSP screw thread brass male hoselock for screwing on hot outlet
2 D cell batteries for auto ignition
hot water hose and a heavy duty reel if you havent already got one
you will also have to upgrade your brushes to stiff versions
hot water pole hose(red or orange from AD is what i used)
make sure the gas inlet connector is screwed in nice and tight with PTFE tape on thread.double clip all your hose connectors and use a power tool to get them extra tight.
you ll have to fanny about with the calibration so the pump shuts off shortly after turning your tap off at brush end or else you run the risk of blown hoses(trust me i know!).
any weakness in your system will be found out with hot water!
-
It's easy to rig up on your own
smurf did u use a gas man to rig it up or did u just do it ur self im asuming its easy to rig up, also what gas do u use lpg ?were do u get urs?, i can c the benifits to hot i work buy the sea lots of gulls craping on the glass even using ubik on the brush and leting it soak can b hard wrk at times
-
i spent around £700 on everything then another £500 on gas in a 2 year period(used just for a few months over 2 winters)so £1200 altogether.
i can honestly say it was a waste of money for me plus the faffing around changing bottles etc.
you live and learn eh? ;D
i could of had a mini break in a 5 star hotel with the missus with the money instead! ;D
-
I tend to use hot all the time but I do mostly salavge type cleans all year round. Even on regular frequency cleans it's nice to have the option as some properties are minging after a short space of time.
i spent around £700 on everything then another £500 on gas in a 2 year period(used just for a few months over 2 winters)so £1200 altogether.
i can honestly say it was a waste of money for me plus the faffing around changing bottles etc.
you live and learn eh? ;D
i could of had a mini break in a 5 star hotel with the missus with the money instead! ;D
-
smurf did u use a gas man to rig it up or did u just do it ur self im asuming its easy to rig up, also what gas do u use lpg ?were do u get urs?, i can c the benifits to hot i work buy the sea lots of gulls craping on the glass even using ubik on the brush and leting it soak can b hard wrk at times
TBH mate if i worked by the sea i would use hot water all the time as it will help you with seasalt,seagull poo for sure.its easy to set it up yourself.you will have to use it pretty hot for it to have any cleaning power though.
and theres the rub.you need the water to be at 40degrees at least to see the benefit.
for most of us with regular maintenance window cleaning on 4/6/8 weekly frequencies away from the coast its an added expense thats really not needed IMO.cold water cleans just fine.
Dazmond has hit the nail on the head once again, other than the odd bit of stubborn bird poo you don't really get anything
on glass that cold pure wont shift easily.
Maybe its different by the coast I don't know as Iv never cleaned in those conditions but for most off us there's no real benefit
to using hot.
-
SeanK have you tried hot then?
I know using hot shifts stubbon stuff darn easier than cold dose.
There is an ionics vid on the net somewhere showing using hot on a salvage clean etc to give ppl a better idea.
Found it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3Qanob6u_M
What do you think chaps?
-
If ionic say it's twice as fast on first cleans than cold I'm thinking with hot & say vision will it be 4 times as fast then? ;D
-
+1 with Daz on hot water.
-
SeanK have you tried hot then?
I know using hot shifts stubbon stuff darn easier than cold dose.
There is an ionics vid on the net somewhere showing using hot on a salvage clean etc to give ppl a better idea.
Found it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3Qanob6u_M
What do you think chaps?
I haven't tried it for the simple reason I have never found the need, I don't get a lot of stuff on the glass and frames that
requires a lot of effort to remove.
Like I have said the only thing would be the odd bit of stubborn bird poo but that wouldn't be enough to convert me to hot.
Even some of the horrendous first cleans I have done just required a spray of Virosol on the brush and the dirt came away
with ease.
-
I would not bother its over rated and I have used a gas boiler for 3 years and three units later decided its not worth it and I don't think it cleans better. all the hassle of fitting and hoses bursting, not thanks.
get a proper one not a shower heater and you might change your mind,hot water systems must be used with the correct pressure fittings or you will have endless problems with reels especially
-
What do you call a proper one?
How much do you think it costs to knock one of these up in the shed?
http://www.purefreedom.co.uk/water-fed-poles/isothermal-diesel-water-heaters/pure-freedom-isothermal-diesel-water-heater-9kw-2-operator-unit.html
They must be making 100% markup on that surely ::)roll
I would not bother its over rated and I have used a gas boiler for 3 years and three units later decided its not worth it and I don't think it cleans better. all the hassle of fitting and hoses bursting, not thanks.
get a proper one not a shower heater and you might change your mind,hot water systems must be used with the correct pressure fittings or you will have endless problems with reels especially
-
Some parts you might be interest in to knock one up yourself
Webasto Thermo Pro 90 12v Heater | 9023075A
http://sales.butlertechnik.com/webasto/webasto-installation-complete-heater-install-kit/webasto-thermo-pro-90-12v-heater-9023075a?___SID=U
Heat exchanger
http://sales.butlertechnik.com/webasto-motor-home-plate-heat-exchanger-with-mixer-valve-4111209a
I'm sure if you enquired for all the bit you need they would offer a full package and maybe a bit of discount too
After all the likes of purefreedom just buy in the bits they want and stick them together in a box then charge silly money for them ;D
-
I only have a hot water system is so I can carry on cleaning when cold water is freezing and hot enables me to carry on
was 2010 when the country was frozen
-
Hot water is only good for one thing - keeping the hoses supple in the cols weather allowing you to work quickly and easily, just like in the summer.
You can't get much closer to the coast than some of our cleans, and cold pure works perfectly well summer or winter.
Diesel systems are well over priced and for the benefits will take around 10 years to re coup just the initial outlay ( never mind the running costs )
Gas heaters - viable alternative, until you ask serious questions regarding insurance, I couldn't get any insurance company to give me written confirmation I was insured to use one of these things and carry the gas.
Immersion heaters have proved great! - they double as an anti frost device as well as heating the water when the vans were parked outside overnight, cheap and easy to install, hot water lasts all day and drops maybe 3 or 4 degrees over 5 hours.
Darran
-
I too have serious issues about man made water heaters due to the insurance.
-
Not sure about work vans but if you leave a gas appliance running in a motorhome and your not in it then you
wont be insured if the worst should happen.
I used to convert vans into campers and wasn't allowed to install the gas water heaters as the van wouldn't be insurable,
had to get a qualified guy to come and fit it and get the paperwork to prove it.
The thing is qualified guys wont touch those cheap imported gas heaters as they don't consider them safe, so you don't
really have a choice but to fit them yourself and hope the worst never happens.
-
Not done a winter yet so I don't know what it's like , do the majority of you guys just use cold pure all year round?
-
I'm aware of one likes of suerclean systems that install gas water heaters that are calor gas approved installs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSsRn6PwZ-w
Also you will find a very expensive brand that also uses gas water heaters in there van mount systems which their name is concept 2O http://www.clearviewplus.com/
Like with any gas appliance there are regs/guidelines to how they should be correctly installed
-
Im sure they dont recommend fitting it to a trolley with the side door open! ::)roll
-
Nope but it's a portable system not fixed in the van ;D
Im sure they dont recommend fitting it to a trolley with the side door open! ::)roll
-
Obviously the safest option would be to get a diesel fired wabasto type water heater fitted correctly in the van instead of carry gas about. But you still see motor homes etc with gas systems so it’s down to the individual what they want to use at the end of the day.
-
Not done a winter yet so I don't know what it's like , do the majority of you guys just use cold pure all year round?
To be honest Shane over this last four years Iv never lost more than a week over the winter because of minus temps
I think it was about 5 or 6 years ago when we got a very cold winter I lost about a month all in, it didn't go above minus 10
for about three weeks in a row so hot wouldn't have been any use anyway.
If you are planning to work in minus temps just be very careful where you leave water as you could be liable
for any slip hazards caused by this and don't get caught out like I did in my first year when my pole froze up in the extended
position, it was a real challenge to get it down again. ;D
I forgot to mention I work with cold year round.
-
Not done a winter yet so I don't know what it's like , do the majority of you guys just use cold pure all year round?
To be honest Shane over this last four years Iv never lost more than a week over the winter because of minus temps
I think it was about 5 or 6 years ago when we got a very cold winter I lost about a month all in, it didn't go above minus 10
for about three weeks in a row so hot wouldn't have been any use anyway.
If you are planning to work in minus temps just be very careful where you leave water as you could be liable
for any slip hazards caused by this and don't get caught out like I did in my first year when my pole froze up in the extended
position, it was a real challenge to get it down again. ;D
I forgot to mention I work with cold year round.
That's not too bad, cheers for that advice Sean, never even thought of my pole freezing up! Hopefully won't be too bad this winter lol
-
I feel into that trap thinking a hot system is a help in the winter. Believe me its the opposite you have to drain your water heater every night to stop it freezing .
-
Papa smurf - what's acceptable for personal use to that of business and then again businesses with employee's differs vastly.
It should also be remembered that just because a company fits a gas system does not mean your insured.
Let's face it if the outside temp is below freezing then you also have to consider if it's safe to carry out window cleaning work due to ice, snow and road conditions
Darran
-
I suppose I need to get my barbie set up by a gas safe engineer - god knows how I'll get the gas home when my cylinder needs replacing.
-
Like it or not Dave this is the modern world, can't say I always care for it but if I don't follow it, it's my dangly bits for the chop.
Darran
-
I suppose I need to get my barbie set up by a gas safe engineer - god knows how I'll get the gas home when my cylinder needs replacing.
;D ;D ;D
-
Like it or not Dave this is the modern world, can't say I always care for it but if I don't follow it, it's my dangly bits for the chop.
Darran
That's it exactly, but then looking at it in another way there are some real numpties out there, would you want one of their
DIY gas systems in a van parked outside your property.
I know I wouldn't.
-
Anyone on here saying hot is not worth the money or there's no difference over cold is either an idiot or has never used hot for any length of time to do there work,there is NO comparison I use mine all yea round it knocks cold systems into a cocked hat
-
Why do they still sell cold systems,coz there are cheaper end of. I really cannot see this argument on here simply because there is no argument,use hot for 6 weeks and then give an opinion.
-
Anyone on here saying hot is not worth the money or there's no difference over cold is either an idiot or has never used hot for any length of time to do there work,there is NO comparison I use mine all yea round it knocks cold systems into a cocked hat
I would not have put it so blunty but I would have to agree ;D
-
Anyone on here saying hot is not worth the money or there's no difference over cold is either an idiot or has never used hot for any length of time to do there work,there is NO comparison I use mine all yea round it knocks cold systems into a cocked hat
i must be an idiot then! ;D
a complete waste of time,money and effort in my "idiot" eyes(2 winters using hot water).its just not needed to clean windows to a good standard on a regular basis.
less expense and less faffing with a simple cold water set up and the same money earnt and same happy customers. :)
-
I work with hot all year round . I have plenty of custys. Who smear lamb vindaloo . Full English breaky and jam rolly polly all over the windows . Try getting that off with cold water .
-
I work with hot all year round . I have plenty of custys. Who smear lamb vindaloo . Full English breaky and jam rolly polly all over the windows . Try getting that off with cold water .
You obviously do alot of shop front then ;D
-
I work with hot all year round . I have plenty of custys. Who smear lamb vindaloo . Full English breaky and jam rolly polly all over the windows . Try getting that off with cold water .
You obviously do alot of shop front then ;D
Or you work some rough estates. .
-
Anyone on here saying hot is not worth the money or there's no difference over cold is either an idiot or has never used hot for any length of time to do there work,there is NO comparison I use mine all yea round it knocks cold systems into a cocked hat
i must be an idiot then! ;D
a complete waste of time,money and effort in my "idiot" eyes(2 winters using hot water).its just not needed to clean windows to a good standard on a regular basis.
less expense and less faffing with a simple cold water set up and the same money earnt and same happy customers. :)
How did it take you 2 winters to workout it was a complete waste of time, money and effort? ;D
-
Anyone on here saying hot is not worth the money or there's no difference over cold is either an idiot or has never used hot for any length of time to do there work,there is NO comparison I use mine all yea round it knocks cold systems into a cocked hat
So are you saying that you are cleaning more properties over the year than all the guys using cold and that your cleaning
them to a better standard ?
If the answer is yes then my second question is what are you getting on the glass that needs hot water to remove it.
Does hot water clean better maybe it does, would it benefit me knowing what I have to deal with on the windows I clean absolutely not.
I have no problem paying for something that will benefit me and make my working day easier but Im not going to invest in
hot just to remove a few bits of dried on bird poo in a day slightly quicker, that would make me an idiot.
-
I only get smoked salmon and the odd ball of caviar stuck to my customers windows - cold water seems to clear it off no trouble.
-
I get the feeling that I must live under the dome, all I get on my windows is some dust the odd snail trail and bird poo
that in nine out of ten cases just melts away.
When you consider I only use an Xtreme brush that isn't supposed to have any scrubbing power I don't know how I get away
with it. ;D
-
You lot crack me up...
Next someone will be saying cold cleans better than hot ;D
I actualy ran out of gas on a job today and oh boy what a ball ache it was to just use cold. ::)roll
-
Very amateurish , run your business properly you should never run out of anything .
-
Very true ;D
Very amateurish , run your business properly you should never run out of anything .