Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Perfect Windows on June 12, 2015, 07:58:03 pm
-
As I've now been on here for five years, I thought I'd pop an idea out for discussion.
The way I've used this forum has changed over the years.
At first, I read through dozens of pages of posts looking for people who made sense. Then I searched through all of their posts for their ideas of how to run a window cleaning business. I noted everything that appeared to make sense and that might make my business work. I still have the notes - about forty pages of them. Sometimes they contradicted one another and I had to make a choice. The initial success of my business relied on people on here (some since gone) and, for that, I thank them.
Then, I started my business and my use of the forum changed. I had a way that I did things that I felt was the right way, even though it was based on what other people had written on here. However, I decided to take the approach of questioning and debating then, if the answers made sense, changing what we did.
Some of them didn't work out. Someone (now gone) was very persuasive on the subject of Vikan brushes (aka bricks). I changed and thought things were better then, when I went back, I realised that I'd been fooling myself. I also made what I now consider to be a foolish (and very expensive) foray into gutter vacuuming (others will no doubt disagree).
Some did work out - rinsing on the glass made a big difference to the health of my shoulders and I thank the people who brought it to my attention.
Some of the discussions around these subjects were quite heated but they always ended with a decision, one way or another, often a decision that other people had better ideas than I could muster, so I changed how we worked. I tried to debate and even argue with an open mind.
Again (I can't do it enough), I thank everyone who has improved my business through suggestions and comments on here. Many of them I couldn't have come up with given a year of thought. Many of those who helped me out know who they are. Thanks to all the ones I haven't been able to thank personally.
Hopefully, some of the discussions about how I did things led to help flowing the other way; it'd be nice to know that other people benefited, however little.
So, that's one way to use this forum and it's one that's made me more successful than I would ever have dared to hope for.
My question: Is this a more effective way to use the forum than just to tell other people who do things differently from you that they are idiots, bullsh!tters or liars?
Vin
-
I would say that you use the forum in both of the ways that you describe. Your "know it all" approach to what you refer to as being "forensic debate" is irritating beyond belief! If the other debater disagrees then you tend to pull the old "look at my success card" . I can only hope for your sake that you are not as annoying in real life to the point where other human beings in your company lose the will to live!
Just being honest ;)
-
I suppose what you have done is good, and good luck as always.......
But
For me the forum is just something I enjoy reading and yes pick up some ideas on the way of course, share experiences and just pass on info to those that want it.
There is always goin to be someone sat at home earning £80 a week and claiming to be earning millions, and trying to knock anyone or thinks they know better,..... I mean ;D I can't remember which numpty wrote it the other day on He mans post " anyone who works through the night is desperate " haha
I do this all the time and I am not desperate, sometimes it's the only way we can keep up with the work load or jobs need doing out of hours,
Just another one to add to the list....... They know nothin
I been on here about 2 years, and think it is a sound little set up for those that want/ are happy to share bits.
I don't come on here to find or go up against other people who are in the same industry, I can't be bothered am to busy ;D
If I come across someone who I find repeatedly slates every idea or knows better I simply don't partake in any other there conversations or topics
-
A bit harsh chummy.
I see the main problem being we all forget that there is a human being at the other end, it's like road rage, your in a safe bubble and can rage away in safety.
It's terribly difficult to express feelings, nuances and general jist of what you would like to say, this leads to people taking stuff the wrong way.
Lastly, as small businesses it can be lonely and leads you to believe that what you do this the greatest thing sliced bread and no body in the world ( never mind down the road ) so being subjective and understanding if difficult.
Generally the forum is beneficial - just need to make your own mind up who's worth taking notice of..
Darran
-
It's simply a forum at the end of the day. But folk on here have helped me no end. Just sort the wheat from the chaff. Some ideas are very good indeed and work for most; some work for the particular set of circumstances of the poster's situation. Others are dumb.
No-one of us is the best poster or the worst. We all have different takes, different days, different moods.
Sometimes I'm playful and daft. But I try to take a balanced view. I don't like seeing people taken for a ride by money-grabbing "cure-alls" and try to look out for the inexperienced. I respect those who have built better, more productive and profitable rounds but am wary of those that put money and work at the top of their reason for living. I respect those who are happy to plod along on part time pay but less so those who could do better by being a bit more sensible and firmer with their customers.
But it's all subjective isn't it?
-
I think the forum has always been the same, I mean how much helpful advice can you give on the subject of
cleaning windows until each subject has been done to death.
I use the forum as a way of having a natter with guys who do the same thing as me for a living, but the wind ups, arguments
and the nonsense all help to make it what it is.
And every so often you get to read a post like the one above, excellent.
-
The forum has been a great help to me I was a 'lurker' to start of with whilst I was thinking about going into window cleaning but I have based all my equipment purchases and some of my business strategy (ie; canvassing rather than leafleting etc... etc...) on what I've found on here.
-
I think we should share our ideas, good and bad. After all we are all in the same boat. Some people employing several, other's operating as one man bands for a easy lifestyle. There are millions of windows out there in need of cleaning. There is enough work for everybody and we need to educate each other and raise standards across the industry. This forum is a fantastic tool, especially when you are losing your mojo and need a lift. Keep the faith :D
-
But Vin!! Whats better leaflets or canvassing?? :-*
-
I would say that you use the forum in both of the ways that you describe. Your "know it all" approach to what you refer to as being "forensic debate" is irritating beyond belief! If the other debater disagrees then you tend to pull the old "look at my success card" . I can only hope for your sake that you are not as annoying in real life to the point where other human beings in your company lose the will to live!
Just being honest ;)
8)
-
For a lot of guys on here they use the forum to vent their frustrations, you seem frustrated all the time, perhaps you're not using the forum in the manner that is most beneficial for you.
-
It's simple. Just read what is posted and if it seems a good idea give it a go or at least keep it in mind for when that situations crops up.
As for the wally's, braggers, £500 pound a day merchants, 3 minutes a house including driving time, etc, they add spice and entertainment value.
As for those heated debates, more please. People watch clap trap on tv like East Enders etc and the rest of the trash for entertainment then complain when it happens for real on here.
-
Can't believe anyone would read what I post or take advice lol
-
I'm pinching this from Darran
Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great
Vin, I have always respected your take on business and you have been an inspiration to me to keep going. As they say, the proof of the pudding is in the eating and the results of your business speak for themselves. So I can say personally that I have much to thank you for.
On of the things that I will never forget is your take on the 'credit crunch' of 2008. It wasn't you who caused it, so get on and work around it. There is always a group of people who profit from a downturn in the economy - go find them as customers. At the tail end of the day history showed that the 'credit crunch' was more media hype than anything. We lost a few customers as a direct result of it, but we gained far more at the same time.
There was another time when you offered to help someone from south London with a day out to show him the window cleaning ropes. Despite encouragement from a few of us he felt it was too far to travel and so, as I understand it, he past up the offer. I often wonder if that moment was a lost opportunity, an open door, that that newbie lost out on forever. Was that the pivotal moment that meant the difference between success and failure?
Over the years there have been a lot of good people on here who are no longer posters. The forum isn't a better place without them. I learnt a lot from many of them as well in those early wfp days.
You've had the balls to franchise; one day I'm going to have to grow some balls and do the same thing.
-
A bit harsh chummy.
I see the main problem being we all forget that there is a human being at the other end, it's like road rage, your in a safe bubble and can rage away in safety.
It's terribly difficult to express feelings, nuances and general jist of what you would like to say, this leads to people taking stuff the wrong way.
Lastly, as small businesses it can be lonely and leads you to believe that what you do this the greatest thing sliced bread and no body in the world ( never mind down the road ) so being subjective and understanding if difficult.
Generally the forum is beneficial - just need to make your own mind up who's worth taking notice of..
Darran
What he said!
-
As I've now been on here for five years, I thought I'd pop an idea out for discussion.
The way I've used this forum has changed over the years.
At first, I read through dozens of pages of posts looking for people who made sense. Then I searched through all of their posts for their ideas of how to run a window cleaning business. I noted everything that appeared to make sense and that might make my business work. I still have the notes - about forty pages of them. Sometimes they contradicted one another and I had to make a choice. The initial success of my business relied on people on here (some since gone) and, for that, I thank them.
Then, I started my business and my use of the forum changed. I had a way that I did things that I felt was the right way, even though it was based on what other people had written on here. However, I decided to take the approach of questioning and debating then, if the answers made sense, changing what we did.
Some of them didn't work out. Someone (now gone) was very persuasive on the subject of Vikan brushes (aka bricks). I changed and thought things were better then, when I went back, I realised that I'd been fooling myself. I also made what I now consider to be a foolish (and very expensive) foray into gutter vacuuming (others will no doubt disagree).
Some did work out - rinsing on the glass made a big difference to the health of my shoulders and I thank the people who brought it to my attention.
Some of the discussions around these subjects were quite heated but they always ended with a decision, one way or another, often a decision that other people had better ideas than I could muster, so I changed how we worked. I tried to debate and even argue with an open mind.
Again (I can't do it enough), I thank everyone who has improved my business through suggestions and comments on here. Many of them I couldn't have come up with given a year of thought. Many of those who helped me out know who they are. Thanks to all the ones I haven't been able to thank personally.
Hopefully, some of the discussions about how I did things led to help flowing the other way; it'd be nice to know that other people benefited, however little.
So, that's one way to use this forum and it's one that's made me more successful than I would ever have dared to hope for.
My question: Is this a more effective way to use the forum than just to tell other people who do things differently from you that they are idiots, bullsh!tters or liars?
Vin
I only use the forum to insult people - but I do it in alphabetical order. Anyone who uses the forum differently is an idiot.
I'm only up to "D" so your time is coming eventualy.
-
Actually, there's more than two ways to use the forum. Posting crummy videos of render cleaning is popular with some, whilst advertising your products without paying is a popular pastime too. ;D
Don't forget driving people to your website, recruitment to your training courses is another way too.
Personally I prefer to just take the pee.
-
Walter, I think you missed me :( When's my turn? Hate missing out. :D
-
It's simple. Just read what is posted and if it seems a good idea give it a go or at least keep it in mind for when that situations crops up.
As for the wally's, braggers, £500 pound a day merchants, 3 minutes a house including driving time, people so desperate for money they work through the night and claim it's because they are so busy, etc, they add spice and entertainment value.
As for those heated debates, more please. People watch clap trap on tv like East Enders etc and the rest of the trash for entertainment then complain when it happens for real on here.
FTFY ;D
-
5 years in with window cleaning and there is only so much you can learn from this board and probably after 3 months you have probably extracted as much as you can from the posts.
after that its all about getting out there and doing it consistently on a day to day basis.
Ive been taking advice via phone calls and emails over 2015 from 2 members on here who have much bigger businesses than mine - hugely grateful to these 2 guys who have taken the time to help me (they know who they are).
I try to help newbies these days as much as I can so kinda paying it forward.
-
I read a lot of things on this forum and have been torn apart many time by people would do not understand me due to my culture been different to most on here. I think having to communicate on a forum very difficult to convey your thoughts as we do not have the ability to read body language and emotion on a forum format.
There is a wealth of knowledge and experience on this forum. The shame is we loose out on so much knowledge due to a lack of respect for people. Every time someone leaves due to folk being rude the forum become poorer.
The thing I have learned on this forum is discernment to know what will suit my needs and to just walk away when I read what I would regard as useless information.
I find I do not offer much advice any more because of the response I have got in the past.
-
I find I do not offer much advice any more because of the response I have got in the past.
I find it a shame that you allow other people to control whether you post or not.
Me? I'm not so super-sensitive; if I want to post, I'll post; I don't let others control me. If someone wants to be rude to me, that's cool too.
-
It's just very tedious and boring .
Think this use to be a fantastic source for information and advice . It's recently just become less appealing . Same old persons dominating the posts and shooting persons down .
It's the same old folk .
Don't blame persons for just viewing .
-
Yes come on here with the intention of lining your own pockets, and when it doesn't work out throw a hissy fit.
Plenty of good honest information on here by guys who just want to help for the sake of helping, as long as we keep
this then this forum has nothing to worry about.
-
Blimey!, I joined this forum 10 years ago this November after starting out on my own in the October.
The advice back then was tremendous and I would never have made the switch from squeegee to wfp so soon without it.
It makes me laugh, all these very opinionated people who think their way of doing things is the only right way to run a business. I run my business to suit my lifestyle and have a great balance. If I wanted to become a millionaire in this business, I probably could but I don't have the desire or want for it, as it would mean sacrificing my family time.
It is a shame, when the knowledgable people are constantly being attacked and shot down, by small minded trolls, as this doesn't benefit anyone.
-
Blimey!, I joined this forum 10 years ago this November after starting out on my own in the October.
The advice back then was tremendous and I would never have made the switch from squeegee to wfp so soon without it.
It makes me laugh, all these very opinionated people who think their way of doing things is the only right way to run a business. I run my business to suit my lifestyle and have a great balance. If I wanted to become a millionaire in this business, I probably could but I don't have the desire or want for it, as it would mean sacrificing my family time.
It is a shame, when the knowledgable people are constantly being attacked and shot down, by small minded trolls, as this doesn't benefit anyone.
So was it not opinionated people who thought that doing it their way was right that got you to change from traditional to wfp ?
-
Walter, I think you missed me :( When's my turn? Hate missing out. :D
You were probably on one of your many bans when he was on the C's..
;D ;D
-
I actually really like this forum, yes you've got the more experienced windys who have probably been asked the same questions over and over again so can get a bit annoying for them but still you get decent advice. I'm learning everyday on here, there's some big characters who are very opinionated, but without them, I think it would be quite boring. iv been going to the gym now for about 15 years, so I would say I know my stuff in the gym, so I know what works for me. When someone new comes in and tells me I should try something new or I'm doing something they don't agree with , I stick to my guns , as I know what I'm comfortable with and I know what works...for me . Anyways, just enjoy it! ;D
-
LOL
-
You have a point Sean, I have adapted my business based on people's opinions and ways of working. The problem lies when someone is so stuck in their way of working and they refuse to accept change. This will hold them back and they often become bitter when a 'new starter' supersedes their success.
I'm always happy to listen/read other people's ideas and methods. Some are worth trying, others laughable. It's the people who insist you should be doing this and that, but are turning over very little in terms of profitability that get on my nerves.
-
I don't think there is a person on this forum who has not learnt something from being on here, information shared is invaluable to those that haven't yet covered certain elements involved in the industry.
I been at it many years on commercial and before wfp I would use cherry pickers a lot.
2 years ago I started to wfp, my man gav camm showed me what it was all about and threw a set up in a van for me, from there to here and still today am learning all the time. I have upgraded all my bits and took advise off here on which and why to buy certain bits.
And in those 2 years things now operate different and more sufficient due to info shared.
We all have a bad day but this place is about helping each other out
FFS
-
Walter, I think you missed me :( When's my turn? Hate missing out. :D
You were probably on one of your many bans when he was on the C's..
;D ;D
He hasn't got to "H" yet then :(
-
Yes come on here with the intention of lining your own pockets, and when it doesn't work out throw a hissy fit.
Plenty of good honest information on here by guys who just want to help for the sake of helping, as long as we keep
this then this forum has nothing to worry about.
To be honest I think it's negativity like this that is dragging this forum down at the minute. There's no doubt that this place is massively quieter than a year or two ago.
I'm first and foremost a window cleaner, and have been on here for a few years. I've always posted and tried to help where I can, stating my experience. even if some one does something a different way to me, I look to try and learn from what they are doing rather than shoot them down in a " my way or the highway" attitude.
Just recently there was a thread about franchising and vin ( who has many franchisees and doing very well for himself ) was being shot down by guys who are sole traders, and just ticking over, and yet they were arguing and insisting that vin was wrong and they were right. ???
To many outsiders it's laughable, but it's things like this that are driving people away from this forum.
Me personally I have thick skin, and I've learned to let negativity bounce off me, so I will always be a member on here and check in to see what's happening, as I do with half a dozen forums. Unfortunately though I know of many who have finished with there Ciu login details for good, never to return.
Banter is good, but constant negativity drives people away, and this us what we are seeing too much of IMHO.
Just my thoughts.
-
I have JUST found another way to use the forum.
I didn't realise you could ignore users.
BONUS ;D
Oh wow! That is awesome. Members added to list, forum fixed! Result :D
-
I have JUST found another way to use the forum.
I didn't realise you could ignore users.
BONUS ;D
Oh wow! That is awesome. Members added to list, forum fixed! Result :D
ignore people??? iv been adding everyone to my buddy list!! ;D
-
I have JUST found another way to use the forum.
I didn't realise you could ignore users.
BONUS ;D
Oh wow! That is awesome. Members added to list, forum fixed! Result :D
ignore people??? iv been adding everyone to my buddy list!! ;D
Did you say something ? :D ;D ;D ;D
-
I have JUST found another way to use the forum.
I didn't realise you could ignore users.
BONUS ;D
Oh wow! That is awesome. Members added to list, forum fixed! Result :D
ignore people??? iv been adding everyone to my buddy list!! ;D
Did you say something ? :D ;D ;D ;D
....adding everyone to my buddy list....except you!! hahaha ;D ;D ;D
-
It's called "mong blocker" Got a few on mine. ;)
-
Well it mustn't work, I would say I'm top on the list for all the Visionites, yet they reply to my posts
almost instantly.
-
Walter, I think you missed me :( When's my turn? Hate missing out. :D
I skipped over you; I only insult real window cleaners.
-
I think the number of postings about members insulting other members and moaning about that is greater than the actual number of postings that insult other members.
Then that in turn leads to more moaning and insults and so it goes on. Then in the end there's no difference between the postings that are insulting and the postings that point out the postings that are insulting. It's quite comical.
-
I'm on dozy cozys Mong blocker. It's hilarious! Apparently he has a dicky ticker and I kept winding him up a bit too much ;D
Poor old man :'(
-
Walter
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1434478210_123321321321.jpg)
;D