Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: duncan h on December 06, 2014, 11:44:47 am
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Just did a quote as van insurance due at end of year. Confuced.com asked if any mods etc. Even listed water tank. I click yeas and "SORRY WE CANT INSURE YOU" My point is, Its not actually a mod. Its still standard. Wont mention the extra seats in back for dogs lol.
DO any of you list tank and don't get stunned.
I am 49 15 years NCB. No points etc. £291. Add wife with 3 points for using mobile and 1 no fault claim £389. This is stating van as standard ::)roll
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I've found the comparison sites useless when you want to declare the fitted tank. What you need to do is speak to a broker. I've recently used A-plan and was more than happy with the price and service so far.
It's hardly worth not declaring the tank as you are giving them perfect excuse not to cover you in the event of an accident.
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APlan ring Dan 01993 841841 i have dealt with Dan for over 3 years now and have always got the best deal i now get my PL ins and home insurance through APlan
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Search for this topic - it's a constant problem.
According to some Insurance Companies 'Mods' are ANYTHING it didn't have when it left the factory.
Adrian Flux / A-Plan etc have brains not scripts - try them.
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I've been with A-Plan for last 3 years as they specialise in our kind of work. Before I went with these I was with Direct Line who were cheaper by about £100! But as soon as they started asking questions about tank/water etc I knew my premium would rise. The way they were asking the questions it was like I had got weapons of mass destruction inside my van!
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Just got sorted with A Plan - Richard Allen.
Ageas seem to be one of the few that will consistently insure vans with built in water tanks. Don't waste your time on price comparison websites is MHO.
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Ageas has a terrible reputation of not paying out. Just search the net. My gf never got paid out in a non fault accident.
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http://www.reviewcentre.com/Car-Insurance/Ageas-www-ageas-co-uk-reviews_1407238
Gives you a taste of what to expect if you have to claim.
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Hastings Direct were the cheapest, and most comprehensive cover for me with the tank in the van.
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They are all a rip off and avoid paying at all costs. This is why I normally tell them nothing and pay peanut's lol
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try aviva they insure my van with a 650 tank in and another with 300 ltrs in ;)
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i went with Gladiator insurance, on compare the market. i also got a free meerkat. 0 no claims bonus on van, 12 on car, £20 less than A plan, A plan are easy to contact, Gladiator is hit and miss trying to get through to them,
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They are all a rip off and avoid paying at all costs. This is why I normally tell them nothing and pay peanut's lol
Yea pay peanuts ..but you wont be insured because you haven't told them ???
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i went with Gladiator insurance, on compare the market. i also got a free meerkat. 0 no claims bonus on van, 12 on car, £20 less than A plan, A plan are easy to contact, Gladiator is hit and miss trying to get through to them,
Did you declare your tank with Gladiator?
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APlan ring Dan 01993 841841 i have dealt with Dan for over 3 years now and have always got the best deal i now get my PL ins and home insurance through APlan
+1 dan is the man!
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you HAVE to phone them up to comfirm they will insure you. as with most insurance companys strapped or bolted down, no difference, as long as they acknowledge your request, you must state what size tank. most only go upto 650 litres
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I'm with lv. They said business insurance with them covers anything you have in your van for work. Cheapest I could find
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I told them my load varies from week to week or even day to day. One day tank, next no tank but containers backpack and machine and so on. I also said I may stick a towbar on soon and they said a towbar doesn't count as a modification on commercial neither dose your equipment and goods for work.
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Ok so a 250 ltr tank strapped down. What is the difference to carrying one as goods and as a wfp tank? the wiring. Its all a rip off. As long as you are under the vans gross weight and its not a chemical or gas.....grrrrrrrr
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Ok so a 250 ltr tank strapped down. What is the difference to carrying one as goods and as a wfp tank? the wiring. Its all a rip off. As long as you are under the vans gross weight and its not a chemical or gas.....grrrrrrrr
Because you haven't told your insurance company that you have a tank in the back! so if you crash there going to turn around and say your not insured because you didn't tell us about the tank.
When insuring mine and speaking to aviva telling them i had a tank in the back i was saying... i dont want the tank insured i am just letting you know whats in the back of the van... there answer was... yes that's fine you wouldn't be insured if you didn't tell us so we can put it down on your policy.
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You do not have to tell the insurance company about the tank if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle. Unless they ask & unless you have modified your vehicle then you have nothing to declare- end of!!
If you have modified your van vis a permanent fixture & drilled through the floor/chassis etc then you do have to declare a modified vehicle.
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You do not have to tell the insurance company about the tank if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle. Unless they ask & unless you have modified your vehicle then you have nothing to declare- end of!!
If you have modified your van vis a permanent fixture & drilled through the floor/chassis etc then you do have to declare a modified vehicle.
Depends entirely on the standpoint of your individual Insurance Company.
Gladiator's standpoint with me was that a mod was something the vehicle has now that it didn't have when it left the factory - if it was bolted down it was a mod if it wasn't it was an insecure load and they wouldn't cover that either and they also refused to cover me to drive across my own field to get to my water supply - Adrian Flux, who I then insured with, didn't have a problem at all.
Other companies who viewed a non-fixed tank as a the end of life as we know it wouldn't accept the argument that it was simply payload and in that sense no different from a cement mixer.
Don't assume anything with any insurance company as they will check the fine print to bail on any pay out and leave you uninsured.
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You do have to tell them about the tank, it is basically a dead weight waiting to crush you, especially if not properly fit.
Many companies won't touch you as they are risk averse but Adrian Flux and More Than Van have both insured our WC van previously.
I think how the tank is secured will have a bearing.
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if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle.
And what idiot is going to strap it to there lashing point!?? most of the vehicle's can only hold about 50kg! i can pull mine up and see the floor of the van bend as i pull my finger under the Huck!! there not going to stop anything!
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if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle.
And what idiot is going to strap it to there lashing point!?? most of the vehicle's can only hold about 50kg! i can pull mine up and see the floor of the van bend as i pull my finger under the Huck!! there not going to stop anything!
Me, an idiot of ten years wfp, never refused insurance, never had an issue! ;D
Roll on boys, if you want to mod your vans, then don't moan about the increased premium. Some of the arguments here are ludicrous, even an insurance company wouldn't have a leg to stand on to refuse a claim.
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if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle.
And what idiot is going to strap it to there lashing point!?? most of the vehicle's can only hold about 50kg! i can pull mine up and see the floor of the van bend as i pull my finger under the Huck!! there not going to stop anything!
Me, an idiot of ten years wfp, never refused insurance, never had an issue! ;D
Roll on boys, if you want to mod your vans, then don't moan about the increased premium. Some of the arguments here are ludicrous, even an insurance company wouldn't have a leg to stand on to refuse a claim.
What do you drive a mini? I use straps and lashing points.. That's what they are for. All this about being a time bomb etc. My point was, you can carry say...a settee or a fridge and don't have to declare it !! savy
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if it is secured by straps to the manufactures lashing points as this method is not a "modification" to the vehicle.
And what idiot is going to strap it to there lashing point!?? most of the vehicle's can only hold about 50kg! i can pull mine up and see the floor of the van bend as i pull my finger under the Huck!! there not going to stop anything!
Me, an idiot of ten years wfp, never refused insurance, never had an issue! ;D
Roll on boys, if you want to mod your vans, then don't moan about the increased premium. Some of the arguments here are ludicrous, even an insurance company wouldn't have a leg to stand on to refuse a claim.
What do you drive a mini? I use straps and lashing points.. That's what they are for. All this about being a time bomb etc. My point was, you can carry say...a settee or a fridge and don't have to declare it !! savy
You don't have to declare a tank if the vehicle has not been modified, that's the point. You are simply using the vehicle for the purpose it was designed & built for.
Some of you might be peeved at your high premiums- via modification but please don't make silly, unqualified points for those who have not. My 2010 1.6 hdi Dispatch 1000 is £165 per year fully comp!! ;D ;D yep, read it & weep!! 8)
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A sofa or a fridge does not weigh anywhere near 300kg and wont come crashing through the bulkhead and kill you
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It will be you who is weeping chum bucket if you cause an accident and you haven t notified them about carrying a permanent secured load. Cant understand how anybody would not disclose a fitting in their vehicle just to get a cheaper QUOTE! A friend of mine wrote off his vehicle but luckily no one else was involved, didn t get apenny for his van as he had failed to disclose the tank as a permanent fixture for his business. Cost him 6grand! I sleep easy knowing i am legally insured in the case of an accident.
It might be 500 quid, but its legally on the road
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It will be you who is weeping chum bucket if you cause an accident and you haven t notified them about carrying a permanent secured load. Cant understand how anybody would not disclose a fitting in their vehicle just to get a cheaper QUOTE! A friend of mine wrote off his vehicle but luckily no one else was involved, didn t get apenny for his van as he had failed to disclose the tank as a permanent fixture for his business. Cost him 6grand! I sleep easy knowing i am legally insured in the case of an accident.
It might be 500 quid, but its legally on the road
My tank is NOT a permanent fixture so there is nothing to be declared. Do you declare your shopping if you go in the van? surly even you can appreciate this as fact? I am fully covered, my insurer knows what my profession is, I have provided them correctly & truthfully with ALL the information which they request. Me AND my wife are on the policy for both private AND business use. I sleep very good also. ;)
My mate wrote his berlingo off, with a strapped in tank. Tank didn't budge & he got paid out, in full without question.
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That suprises me, if it is used every day it is a permanent fixture, guess every insurance company is different. I personnaly feel happier knowing it is disclosed. I should imagine the fact it is strapped/bolted down makes it a permanent fixture?
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That suprises me, if it is used every day it is a permanent fixture, guess every insurance company is different. I personnaly feel happier knowing it is disclosed. I should imagine the fact it is strapped/bolted down makes it a permanent fixture?
If you bolt the tank down, in a metal frame then this would be viewed as permanent- You have made it a "permanent" fixture & it would be very difficult to argue otherwise.
However, I can whip my tank out in approx 10 minutes & do just this now & then if I need to carry large items (IKEA etc.) So this isn't a "permanent" fixture. Any rational, normal human being would agree with this.
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Never mind the insurance, do it wrong and have anything slightly more than a minor shunt and you and anyone else up front is in a spot of bother.
Your passenger will be able to sue your ass, or his/her family will sue your estate.
Ignorance is bliss, until............
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That suprises me, if it is used every day it is a permanent fixture, guess every insurance company is different. I personnaly feel happier knowing it is disclosed. I should imagine the fact it is strapped/bolted down makes it a permanent fixture?
If you bolt the tank down, in a metal frame then this would be viewed as permanent- You have made it a "permanent" fixture & it would be very difficult to argue otherwise.
However, I can whip my tank out in approx 10 minutes & do just this now & then if I need to carry large items (IKEA etc.) So this isn't a "permanent" fixture. Any rational, normal human being would agree with this.
So your tank is in your van almost 365 days of the year regardless if it can taken out at anytime so can a bolted in tank and it's connected to a delivery pump and battery etc but it's not a permanent fixture or mod
It's almost like saying your home is not a permanent residence because you go away on holiday 2 weeks a year
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It will be you who is weeping chum bucket if you cause an accident and you haven t notified them about carrying a permanent secured load. Cant understand how anybody would not disclose a fitting in their vehicle just to get a cheaper QUOTE! A friend of mine wrote off his vehicle but luckily no one else was involved, didn t get apenny for his van as he had failed to disclose the tank as a permanent fixture for his business. Cost him 6grand! I sleep easy knowing i am legally insured in the case of an accident.
It might be 500 quid, but its legally on the road
This is interesting. You're the only person I've heard of where this is the case and I've been asking for a very long.
Exactly the same thing happened to Soupy, he crashed (I think-or his employee...) he hadn't declared any mods as he didn't need to as the tank was lashed down rather than modded and his company paid out.
Do you have any more details of the insurance not paying out on your mate.
It would seem strange that one paid out and one didn't when the situation was the same or at least similar.
Perhaps Soupy will fill in the gaps. It just seems your mates experience was completely different.
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I really find it difficult to understand why anyone would fail to disclose a water tank in their van to save a few hundred quid when the repercussions could be a prison sentence or refusal of insurance in future!
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That suprises me, if it is used every day it is a permanent fixture, guess every insurance company is different. I personnaly feel happier knowing it is disclosed. I should imagine the fact it is strapped/bolted down makes it a permanent fixture?
If you bolt the tank down, in a metal frame then this would be viewed as permanent- You have made it a "permanent" fixture & it would be very difficult to argue otherwise.
However, I can whip my tank out in approx 10 minutes & do just this now & then if I need to carry large items (IKEA etc.) So this isn't a "permanent" fixture. Any rational, normal human being would agree with this.
So your tank is in your van almost 365 days of the year regardless if it can taken out at anytime so can a bolted in tank and it's connected to a delivery pump and battery etc but it's not a permanent fixture or mod
It's almost like saying your home is not a permanent residence because you go away on holiday 2 weeks a year
Are you REALLY so stupid, or are you drunk? ::)roll
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I really find it difficult to understand why anyone would fail to disclose a water tank in their van to save a few hundred quid when the repercussions could be a prison sentence or refusal of insurance in future!
And I completely agree if your tank is a "permanent" fixture & you have modified your vehicle to make it so- which you must declare. ;)
So, what some are saying then is that virtually all HGV drivers are jail bait in the waiting? I just had a one tonne pallet of bio fuel delivered & guess how it was secured on this "National Companies" flatbed Vehicle? ::)roll
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Further to that- in summer our local council drive round in a flat bed transit with a 1000ltr IBC tank on the back, full of (you guessed it) water. They go round watering the council's hanging baskets & planters in the towns & villages. Guess how the IBC tank is secured on the back.... go on.... you know you want to........yep, straps!! :o :o GEEEZE wonder if these guys are banged up now, eating porridge over xmas!! ;D ;D ;D
Honestly, only on CIU!! ::)roll
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton. When the insurance company(Swinton) did an investigation they found he was carrying a 500 ltr non baffled tank which had been set up by himself. Because he had failed to notify them of modifications to his vehicle ie water tank, electrics in the rear on a split charge relay and the carrying of a gas cannister which they viewed as for daily work use they refused to pay out.
He seeked proffesional advise but was un succesfull in his appeal.
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Yeah but chum bucket, they work for the council and you bet it is notified on there insurance
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton. When the insurance company(Swinton) did an investigation they found he was carrying a 500 ltr non baffled tank which had been set up by himself. Because he had failed to notify them of modifications to his vehicle ie water tank, electrics in the rear on a split charge relay and the carrying of a gas cannister which they viewed as for daily work use they refused to pay out.
He seeked proffesional advise but was un succesfull in his appeal.
I wonder if it was the gas as opposed to the tank...
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton. When the insurance company(Swinton) did an investigation they found he was carrying a 500 ltr non baffled tank which had been set up by himself. Because he had failed to notify them of modifications to his vehicle ie water tank, electrics in the rear on a split charge relay and the carrying of a gas cannister which they viewed as for daily work use they refused to pay out.
He seeked proffesional advise but was un succesfull in his appeal.
1. he's a muppet for using a none baffled tank
2. he's obviously modified his van (I haven't)
3. he's a bigger muppet for not declaring the modifications
;)
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My two cents:
I have had a vehicle written off. It had tanks in the back, a split charge system, fixed hose reels, and other non standard "modifications", none of which were ever mentioned. Not when I was getting a quote nor when the loss adjuster was inspecting the wreckage. They paid out without issue. The word modification was never uttered.
Personally I believe that tanks are tools of our trade. Fixing them in is only sensible.
I would never lie to an insurance company, but vans are designed to carry stuff. Carrying a tank is not a modification, whether you've fixed it in or not.
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton.
No way !!!
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton. When the insurance company(Swinton) did an investigation they found he was carrying a 500 ltr non baffled tank which had been set up by himself. Because he had failed to notify them of modifications to his vehicle ie water tank, electrics in the rear on a split charge relay and the carrying of a gas cannister which they viewed as for daily work use they refused to pay out.
He seeked proffesional advise but was un succesfull in his appeal.
I wonder if it was the gas as opposed to the tank...
Why would that be? I can't see an issue with the gas either, roofers carry gas, do they need to tell their insurance company?
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I didn t say it was an issue solely with gas, i just said it was a number of issues. But generally builders dont have gas bottles fitted up to heaters. I Think the main thing was that he had a non baffled tank from a diy set up that he hadn t declared. He doesn t window clean anymore but i will get in touch with him and find out for definate his insurance refusal.
Whilst we are on the subject insurance company s will try and get out of any pay outs, if you had an accident with say for instance insufficient on your tyres they would not pay out! I just think its best to declare everything to know you are covered.
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I didn t say it was an issue solely with gas, i just said it was a number of issues. But generally builders dont have gas bottles fitted up to heaters. I Think the main thing was that he had a non baffled tank from a diy set up that he hadn t declared. He doesn t window clean anymore but i will get in touch with him and find out for definate his insurance refusal.
Whilst we are on the subject insurance company s will try and get out of any pay outs, if you had an accident with say for instance insufficient on your tyres they would not pay out! I just think its best to declare everything to know you are covered.
Martin, you're making it up as you go along. In that case, the insurance company would have to establish that the tyres were a factor in the accident. I also think your mate only exists in your head!! ;D
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No mate, your insurance states that your vehicle must be in a road worthy condition. I pop onto here once in a while to seek advise and try to give advise, ive been a window cleaner for 20 years and am just trying to give honest advise. I aint a glory hunter.
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He crashed his van(v vivaro swb) trying to avoid a badger in bolton. When the insurance company(Swinton) did an investigation they found he was carrying a 500 ltr non baffled tank which had been set up by himself. Because he had failed to notify them of modifications to his vehicle ie water tank, electrics in the rear on a split charge relay and the carrying of a gas cannister which they viewed as for daily work use they refused to pay out.
He seeked proffesional advise but was un succesfull in his appeal.
I wonder if it was the gas as opposed to the tank...
Why would that be? I can't see an issue with the gas either, roofers carry gas, do they need to tell their insurance company?
I think so, though I don't know.
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Ps theres no need to be nasty calling me a liar, i havent said a bad word about you, i have just aired my views drawing on my experience. This is supposed to be a forum, lets keep it friendly. :)
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Ps theres no need to be nasty calling me a liar, i havent said a bad word about you, i have just aired my views drawing on my experience. This is supposed to be a forum, lets keep it friendly. :)
Yes but lets keep it sensible. If your car was parked up & damaged by a hit & run, the insurance company would not be able to justify not paying out on the policy just because the tyres might have illegal tread. The tyres would have had no influence on the claim.
People are stating that vans are modified when they are CLEARLY NOT.
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That suprises me, if it is used every day it is a permanent fixture, guess every insurance company is different. I personnaly feel happier knowing it is disclosed. I should imagine the fact it is strapped/bolted down makes it a permanent fixture?
If you bolt the tank down, in a metal frame then this would be viewed as permanent- You have made it a "permanent" fixture & it would be very difficult to argue otherwise.
However, I can whip my tank out in approx 10 minutes & do just this now & then if I need to carry large items (IKEA etc.) So this isn't a "permanent" fixture. Any rational, normal human being would agree with this.
So your tank is in your van almost 365 days of the year regardless if it can taken out at anytime so can a bolted in tank and it's connected to a delivery pump and battery etc but it's not a permanent fixture or mod
It's almost like saying your home is not a permanent residence because you go away on holiday 2 weeks a year
Are you REALLY so stupid, or are you drunk? ::)roll
I neither stupid or drunk neither do I chose to throw cheap insults in the playground , I like other people have made the insurance companies fully aware that I have a strapped in tank .
I would rather be safe than sorry I don't believe I am paying extra for having a tank in my pickup , but every insurance company can be different so I don't want to run the risk of losing out on more than £10,000 on a hope
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Thats a fair point, i meant if you were the cause of an accident. I was just stating that an insurance company will always try and find a reason not to pay out and a term of your insurance is that your vehicle must be maintained to a road worthy state to validate your insurance. the tyres was just an example.
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Over recent years things have changed but just over 3 years when I informed direct line I was considering strapping a 400ltr tank my pickup they said the day I did that they would not insure me .
I believe honesty is always the best policy rather than keeping my fingers crossed and hoping I am insured in the event of an accident
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Thats a fair point, i meant if you were the cause of an accident. I was just stating that an insurance company will always try and find a reason not to pay out and a term of your insurance is that your vehicle must be maintained to a road worthy state to validate your insurance. the tyres was just an example.
I know, it's a reasonable argument but people seem to think that insurance companies can just choose willy nilly what they will pay out or not and that isn't the case.
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Every time I have renewed my insurance they always ask if there is a tank in the back with some stating they would not insure me if there was.
But on the other side to this debate I had a friend help me out on a job who has a bolted in van mount system,he did not put the hand brake on properly and the van crashed in to two parked cars.
The tank and system was not declared and his insurance still paid out.
It's down to the individual if you want to declare your system or not every one is different there are thousands of trad window cleaners driving round in the wife/family car who have not declared it for business use.
I do thing we as window cleaners we get a harsh deal when it comes to insurance.
A builder can carry a ton of lose gravel or 1ton of concrete lintels with a mixer on the back of a flat bed truck and they don't get penalised.