Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Mike Halliday on May 17, 2014, 02:20:51 pm
-
just got to the end of 5lts 'zip it' from Amtech, i'm a big fan of Amtech and think over all their chemicals are excellent....... but.......
I've got to say I wasn't impressed with Zip it, I don't think I used it once and was happy.
what chemical failed to impress you?
try not to slag off the company its not about the company its the chemical you didn't get on with
-
got it wrong.... it was 10lts not 5 so you can't say I didn't give it a good trial ;)
-
I don't experiment with chemicals so much these days, I just stay with those that I know work well. Not naming any chems but I have been disappointed with many chems that others really like, and I know that some don't get on with what I use.
Dave.
-
Hi Guys
First time I tried 'microspiltters' expecting good things after all the hype and was very disappointed.
I do now use Pureclean as my default upholstery chemical but rarely on carpets.
Cheers
Doug
-
Tried zip when it first came out, yep poop e. Was there another too, think it was zap, that was poo too.
-
well i'll be the first to say it then, Mpower = poop. think there was another called fusion clean or something? I bought at the same time, that was poop too.
microsplitters in general are poop.
-
What chems do you use carpet dawg. I struggled with m power in the beginning but finally cracked it. Don't you use microsplitters at all.
-
All the manufactures sell some rubbish chemical that don't work take coffee stain remover I have yet to find one that works you spray it on wait a few minutes do a dance round the stain you extract it and guess what it still there.
-
Prochems browning prescription is the best coffee stain remover I've tried before using sod' met
Microsplitters are my first choice for general prespray use them 90% of the time
-
It just goes to show how we can agree to disagree with different chemicals and machinery. I have been using Zip It for about 2 years as a general spotter and have found it to be good. Certain spots will require a specialist product to be effective.
David
-
extracta super chem not good at all ,it fills the air in the van with a light powder kills you
-
I never could get a good result with M Power, but I use the M Power spotter all the time!
-
Prochems browning prescription is the best coffee stain remover I've tried before using sod' met
Microsplitters are my first choice for general prespray use them 90% of the time
Same here. We use "One Step" a lot of the time on carpet and upholstery.
-
A nice tea and coffee spotter ready to use is alltecs red wine remover, as for rubbish products I have used the ones I use now for so long I can't remember the ones that I've not got on with.
Shaun
-
used zip it today, not a miracle. some will, some wont
-
MPower. I believed all the hype users were giving and it never got within 1% of what people were saying
-
I found that that colloidal cleaners work well on natural fibres but forget it on synthetics I do have some in the van but I use it for remedial treatments.
Shaun
-
High alkaline based cleaning chemicals, most chemical MFGs produce them, but they cause so much detrimental damage to surfaces from continuous use, and not just on carpet and upholstery but on all surfaces, just my opinion after being in the industry for over 30 years.
-
High ph chemicals are used as it's the quick & easy option, most carpets can be cleaned with lower ph but it might need extra time or agitation or a bit more knowledge, but hitting everything with champion is easier.
The thing is some people have one Hydraforce which they use on every job so rather than keep emptying & re-filling for each job they stick a high ph powder in it, who carries 2 or 3 Hydraforce on the van?
I asked a while ago if anyone had found a 1lt container you could fit to a Hydraforce so you could carry 3or4 different 1 lt containers of different presprays then change it to suit the specific carpet on the job.
-
High alkaline based cleaning chemicals, most chemical MFGs produce them, but they cause so much detrimental damage to surfaces from continuous use, and not just on carpet and upholstery but on all surfaces, just my opinion after being in the industry for over 30 years.
Good post Tadgh. This begs the question, are we using anything just to clean with no thought to the long term (potential) damage the product can cause, or do we use products which will clean in the safest manner according to the soiling & fibre type? Ok, I go nuclear from time to time, normally on trashed PP, but generally I'll use an eco product.
Worst product? Well Ultimate Master didn't do my pump much good a few years ago, which is the main reason I switched to only putting nothing put water through pumps from then on. Also have a tub full of Shockwave in the garage if anyones interested.
-
Pretty big tubs those Shockwave come in Adrian :), had mine two years, think it will last me a few more years yet. Actually i used it last week on a house, yes i know it is really for commercial, but this was the worst carpet i had come across in four years and owners admitted that they never vacuumed carpets and they were very stained with food and drink and greasy, must admit shockwave did a very good job and customer was pleased.
-
Hi Guys
To a certain extent it is personal choice but I am always very wary of a hyped product because a good one will be naturally recommended.
In the earlier days of the forums there was a lot of attempted manipulation with stooges, but things have matured over the years and we have a wonderful range of products to select from and if we can make some of our own we have even more.
Cheers
Doug
-
High alkaline based cleaning chemicals, most chemical MFGs produce them, but they cause so much detrimental damage to surfaces from continuous use, and not just on carpet and upholstery but on all surfaces, just my opinion after being in the industry for over 30 years.
Good post Tadgh. This begs the question, are we using anything just to clean with no thought to the long term (potential) damage the product can cause, or do we use products which will clean in the safest manner according to the soiling & fibre type? Ok, I go nuclear from time to time, normally on trashed PP, but generally I'll use an eco product.
Worst product? Well Ultimate Master didn't do my pump much good a few years ago, which is the main reason I switched to only putting nothing put water through pumps from then on. Also have a tub full of Shockwave in the garage if anyones interested.
Hi Adrian,
One of the reasons the cleaning industry is such a dirty industry is because most of the large chemical MFGs have been producing harsh cleaning chemicals for so many years and getting away with it, its just like the big companies producing soft drinks we all know the damage these products cause to peoples health but they keep on getting away with all this damage that is caused by their products,
Its a known fact that using any high alkaline based cleaning chemical to any surface on a continuous basis will cause detrimental damage to that surface. but i think finally many of these companies are starting to change to producing safer cleaning solutions as green will become the future which can only be good for our industry, for anyone at the cleaning show in Amsterdam it was very noticeable to see many of these companies introducing their new green ranges of cleaning solutions.
-
Im sure there is a market for the green nonsense , thats why the industry takes it serious . But you need to be specific about what you call harmful , dividing chemical products into ' green ' and non green is so simplistic ..
Most of the conventional chemical products are harmless and extensively tested .
Remember nearly all of the green products contain chemical constituents used in conventional chemical products ... just less of them , mainly for marketing purposes and increased profit i'd say ...
-
Im sure there is a market for the green nonsense , thats why the industry takes it serious . But you need to be specific about what you call harmful , dividing chemical products into ' green ' and non green is so simplistic ..
Most of the conventional chemical products are harmless and extensively tested .
Remember nearly all of the green products contain chemical constituents used in conventional chemical products ... just less of them , mainly for marketing purposes and increased profit i'd say ...
to be more specific on what i call harmful, any high alkaline based cleaning chemical it dose not matter which company produces them, its the ingredients that they are derived from causes the detrimental damage to surfaces from their continuous use, this is my experience anyway from someone who used them for many years until i realized how damaging they were.
-
Tadgh, I don't suppose you sell microsplitters?
-
Which products are detrimental to carpets?
Micro splitters heavy duty versions can cause degeneration of wool but so does soiling and wear.
Very big cleaning solution manufacturers like chemspec and prochem make a varied catalogue of products if they were causing damage or premature wear or hazards then I'm sure we would know about it as there are 10's of thousands of cleaners out there using their products someone somewhere would have seen something odd!
Shaun
-
Im sure there is a market for the green nonsense , thats why the industry takes it serious . But you need to be specific about what you call harmful , dividing chemical products into ' green ' and non green is so simplistic ..
Most of the conventional chemical products are harmless and extensively tested .
Remember nearly all of the green products contain chemical constituents used in conventional chemical products ... just less of them , mainly for marketing purposes and increased profit i'd say ...
to be more specific on what i call harmful, any high alkaline based cleaning chemical it dose not matter which company produces them, its the ingredients that they are derived from causes the detrimental damage to surfaces from their continuous use, this is my experience anyway from someone who used them for many years until i realized how damaging they were.
The high alkaline products are not used on every job , but kept for specific uses where the user determines that it suitable for the situation .
You dont have buy ' green ' marketed products to keep to a fairly neutral PH if thats what believe causes damage .
In situations that might justify a high alkalinity product ... say for example a landlord want you to clean a four year old cheap carpet for the first time after the tenants move out ...
He will want the ' wow' factor result to help rent his property ...
So if you use you ' micelles ' magic green juice or whatever in that situation and the carpet is cleaner but just a bit dull.. and few stains remain , do think the owner will appreciate that used a ' green ' product . He wont give a $hit about anything other that the result you got for him ... and its unlikely he will put a carpet fiber under a microscope to see if the surface still ok ...
-
I think it depends on how you sell your wears and what your customer is after, green cleaning suits one customer as dry another or cheap another etc etc whether we believe it's all Eco friendly the customer doesn't want ' ordinary ' cleaning chemicals they want ' Eco friendly solutions ' believing that they have decided on a non toxic clean that won't pollute their home.
What I would like to know is how Eco friendly all cleaning solutions are?? If say power burst is 100% toxic and coloidal cleaners are 0% it would be far easier but that's like asking asda to put sugar content on all of their products.
Shaun
-
Prochems crystal green, double clean, chemspec formula 90, ashbys supreme powder for dramatically reducing pumps life. Non have de-scalers and non have lubricating properties. Not to be confused with ashbys blue powder. That was surprisingly good until they filled it out with a powdered version of fresh air or nothing.
Prochems rust remover does not work. Micro splitters are the same as agitating good old tap water. They play a very small part of the cleaning spectrum and have no emulsifying propertys whatsoever.
That'll do for now.
-
Tadgh, I don't suppose you sell microsplitters?
Hi Carpet Dawg you suppose right we do not sell microsplitters.
-
I answered the original question on what chemicals failed to impress me, i did not mention anything about microsplitters or micelles technology, i did mention that high alkaline based chemicals do not impress me because of the detrimental damage they cause to surfaces, again its not just carpets and upholstery i am talking about as they are promoted for all sections of the cleaning industry, and after using them for many years myself no one can tell me that they do not cause detrimental damage to surfaces from continuous use, again this is just my opinion as i am sure others will have their own opinions which they are entitled to have.
-
Prochems crystal green, double clean, chemspec formula 90, ashbys supreme powder for dramatically reducing pumps life. Non have de-scalers and non have lubricating properties. Not to be confused with ashbys blue powder. That was surprisingly good until they filled it out with a powdered version of fresh air or nothing.
Prochems rust remover does not work. Micro splitters are the same as agitating good old tap water. They play a very small part of the cleaning spectrum and have no emulsifying propertys whatsoever.
That'll do for now.
Not sure if you put your chemicals in with your extraction machine, but if you do, you might be better pre spraying the carpet (buy a pressure spray), agitate with an oreck or something your happy with then rinse with your extraction machine just using warm water. You should save on pumps this way.
-
Only ever use hot water to extract.
-
Tadgh, I don't suppose you sell microsplitters?
Hi Carpet Dawg you suppose right we do not sell microsplitters.
eh well I am close. You sell some other hippy cleaning product?
-
In terms of the 'damage' argument I am tempted to raise the thorny issue of rinsing - it depends on the amount of rinsing that is achieved and the system used - I am sure porty owners think they do a good job of rinsing out a cleaning product (and the contaminants/dirt etc that it has emulsified) and they may well do a good job but imo there is no substitute for multiple rinsing actions and the temptation when you have a limited water reservoir is to limit your rinsing actions whilst with an unlimited water supply you crack on regardless
There is no reason to suppose that in terms of the amounts of high-ph products used on an occasional basis on (say) carpet fibres (natural and synthetic) compared to weekly cleaning of hard surfaces with high ph products - that ALL of the cleaning agent - ms or high ph could not be rinsed COMPLETELY out of the carpet - especially if you concentrate on thoroughly misting the face fibre rather than soaking it - perfectly possible to rinse all of this out and the key to doing a 'proper job'
dave
The last product that really surprised me by its effectiveness was pc Fibresafe Gold on a trashed (so-called bleachable) synthetic carpet with multiple indeterminate 'stains' and soil - amazing - try it and you will not be disappointed
On the downside their Stain pro has never surprised me into thinking wow! I dont know why I keep on trying it! Well I do actually I suppose I always think its better to use a low impact water-based product before going on to something stronger!
-
Ive been rinsing carpets with formula 90 for 10 years and never had a problem with pumps sounds like another myth just like the sticky residue nonsense.
-
Ive been rinsing carpets with formula 90 for 10 years and never had a problem with pumps sounds like another myth just like the sticky residue nonsense.
Err no, not a myth Darren. As evidenced by the cavitation on my (1200psi) pump head. I have no experinence of F90 but, perhaps, it's a differnt mix to Ulti Master. Sticky residue myth? Can't speak for other's but I've lost count of the number of Groupon deals I've been called on to re-clean after a couple of months or less. You can almost clean the carpets with just the detergent left behind, but I suppose that's the point Buckland raised regarding rinsing.
-
Formula 90 dosent damage pumps if it did it wouldnt be the biggest selling carpet cleaning chemical in the world as for the sticky residue bit if you follow the instuctions you wont have a problem thats just common sense.
-
I use a lot of Chemspec F70 and get cracking results with it ! I also use M power and still I get very good results, but ive noticed on more than one occaision that the waste water extracted when using F70 or any detergent seems to be much dirtier ! Is it because the detergents work better !
Stuart
-
Yes
Cavitation is caused by vapour in the liquid, these small bubbles
explode which causes the damage. This can occur in any liquid subjected to sudden
pressure changes.
That is the reason submarine screws are so well designed, to avoid cavitation, which
is the loudest part of the sub when running silent.
-
Formula 90 dosent damage pumps if it did it wouldnt be the biggest selling carpet cleaning chemical in the world as for the sticky residue bit if you follow the instuctions you wont have a problem thats just common sense.
I have no idea whether F90 is the biggest selling cc'ing chem in the world, and frankly Scarlet...............! Neither do I have any problems with sticky residue. Well not cc'ing sticky residues anyway ;D
Maybe I've been overdosing on common sense 8) Tricky job this cc'ing ain't it?
-
Alltec use to use coated pump heads as far as i know specifically to cope with their Ultimate master
Powders do cause problems - when i use to use SPM as a prespray it would soon cause problems with my electric sprayer and shafts in the pump up sprayers
Dont forget in between cleans any solution left it the pump will start to get cold and crystallize and create a corrosive build up in the head
No matter what the UK Pumptec distributor says (i wen to see them and heard it all) - pumps are much happier working with just plain water or just a liquid rinse added
-
Cavitation is small air bubbles trapped in the pump and normaly eats away at the valve seats on alloy pumptec pumps, I had quite a few problems in the early days with my first Scorpion!
But not anymore, pumptec suggested I fitted two intake pipes, never had a problem since, pumptec also said there isn't a cleaning chemical in the uk that would damage there pumps
Stuart
-
That's interesting to know, I've always thought that it's not the cleaning product that's corrosive it's more of the undisputed or it's not been mixed sufficiently, when I mix f90 I have to really mix it before it goes in the sprayer.
Shaun
-
If you use F90 as a pre spray what dilution do you use
-
water for me , why cant it remove everything with out adding stuff to it , life would be much easyer
-
Stuart - i thought you had loads of problems with pump heads in the past you put down to powders in the tank including when you bought non Alltec supplied heads before the Scorpion?
-
Flush your pumps with clean water after using a powdered detergent, even add a little acidic rinse in for good measure.
Talking about products which are over hyped... Fusion 8 by solutions, every time I used this product as a pre spray on upholstery I ended up having to use something else as it just didn't work at all... Waste of time regardless of what is said on CT
MPower... Found it to be hit and mostly miss, converted over to Bioclean and I love it :-)
-
Interesting, I thought MP and bio clean were the same thing. Is this not the case.
-
Fusion 8 - an in tank cleaner or prespray and its a polymer based cleaner. So I asked if it could be used as a bonnet/encap cleaner as its polymer and can be used in tank so hence not rinsed.
Never got an answer but I think its an encap compatible cleaner - am I wrong?
-
Why not just buy a product which is designed to encap such as Dynamal or DS2?
-
Yes I know that Russ, just I have a load of Fusion 8 which I can't find a use for and wondered about trying it as an encap
Your answer is just the same I got before
I like to explore chemicals, they are often not completely as the supplier may describe and understanding what they are may mean other use
-
I found I had realy good results when using fusion 8 on upholstery, took a video a couple of years ago cleaning a multi coloured chenile, you could hardly see the patten and I must admit it came up a treat, but saying all that I now use prochem upholstery prespray and get better , faster results every time
see I dont always use in tank detergents ! Lol
stuart
-
Cleanercarpets !
Its right I did have a lot of problems a few years ago with pump heads, and thats right I did put it down to the powder I used in tank,
but later found out from pumptec that cavitation was the real scoundrel! Microscopic air bubbles within the pump head causing eroding of the valve seats
they advised me to fit two intake pipes to there pump head and that would eradicate the problem, and to be honest I've never had any further problems since
stuart
-
Good to know thanks Stuart
I think my Airflex has a double water connection to the head which will be good whereas the Scorpion comes with a single side connection as standard, probably because of space or the lack of