Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Jim Waugh(Albright & Shiny) on March 30, 2014, 10:01:38 pm
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Peeps.
Im after a zero hours contract template if anyone has one or a real one I could numptyise Id be grateful if you could email me it at windows@albrightandshiny.co.uk
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I never understand why a windowcleaner would offer employment on those terms. Not what you asked, but in my opinion they are exploitative.
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I never understand why a windowcleaner would offer employment on those terms. Not what you asked, but in my opinion they are exploitative.
my sister had one at Thomas Cook. She loved it.
For some it works, for some it doesn't.
Being offered work is never exploitative.
It's down to the individual to take it or leave it.
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I never understand why a windowcleaner would offer employment on those terms. Not what you asked, but in my opinion they are exploitative.
Never said I was going to employ on those terms...... I do need to look at All the options before I sit down with my prospective employee and see what works for BOTH of us...
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I never understand why a windowcleaner would offer employment on those terms. Not what you asked, but in my opinion they are exploitative.
my sister had one at Thomas Cook. She loved it.
For some it works, for some it doesn't.
Being offered work is never exploitative.
It's down to the individual to take it or leave it.
If it is the only job on offer it would be more difficult to turn it down. And do you use the same defence with bad landlords? It's down to the individual to take it or leave it? Employers are simply taking advantage of poor employment opportunities.
Your sister loved the fact that from one week to the next she didn't know if she would be working?
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guys Im after a look at one. not a discussion on the morality of them or not.. Anyone got one I can have a look at?
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I never understand why a windowcleaner would offer employment on those terms. Not what you asked, but in my opinion they are exploitative.
my sister had one at Thomas Cook. She loved it.
For some it works, for some it doesn't.
Being offered work is never exploitative.
It's down to the individual to take it or leave it.
If it is the only job on offer it would be more difficult to turn it down. And do you use the same defence with bad landlords? It's down to the individual to take it or leave it? Employers are simply taking advantage of poor employment opportunities.
Your sister loved the fact that from one week to the next she didn't know if she would be working?
There's never only one option IME.
Bad landlords? Yeah. If you don't like it-move out.
Bad customers-dump.
Bad window cleaners-chuck 'em.
There are loads if jobs out there.
Not Swedish volley ball masseurs but work nonetheless. All depends how much you want to work.
You've looked at it 'glass half empty' with my sister.
She had the contract, they rang her up if they needed her.
If she wanted some extra $ she went in, if she didn't-she didn't.
Everyone was happy.
Problem is-it's not a blanket, one size fits all.
I see what you mean, that some people could be taken advantage of.
But it's not the case that everyone on a 0 contract doesn't like it.
OP asked for one, he may stick one in the job centre, someone may just like the sound of it. And go for it.
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guys Im after a look at one. not a discussion on the morality of them or not.. Anyone got one I can have a look at?
Fair enough mate. I've just had a new design put on my van. Looks just like yours. I'm going to post some pictures of it. I'm not looking for a debate on the morality/legality. I just want people's opinions on the look. ;)
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guys Im after a look at one. not a discussion on the morality of them or not.. Anyone got one I can have a look at?
Sorry Jim
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
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Jim, if you're in the FSB there'll almost certainly be one on their document site.
Vin
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
How does a zero hour contract protect the employer from being taken to an employment tribunal?
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
So what your saying is its wrong to have anything that's protects the employee but its alright to have something
that protects the employer.
I have a few mates who work for a major supermarket on nights all with one hour contracts.
They go in on the first night knowing that the next night only two thirds of them will be needed.
So they don't take any of the allocated breaks work flat out and kiss the managers backside with the hope of
getting another night and so on. Cap in hand comes to mind.
One guy was let go, he couldn't come in because his kid had went into hospital.
There's not one of them who wouldn't spit in the managers face and walk out if they had the choice.
That's the reality of most zero hour contracts.
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
How does a zero hour contract protect the employer from being taken to an employment tribunal?
Will give you an example. Lets say your employer is treating you unfairly and you make a complaint.
What your employer will then do is back off for a few months, just enough time to not make it obvious and tell you
your services are no longer needed.
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I've got two I can send you if needed.
Let me know your email.
Personally don't see the problem with them. Why shouldn't we be able to protect ourselves, I've been screwed one to many times now and as someone said if you're are a good employee of which I have a few then you will always have work and be treated correctly.
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
So what your saying is its wrong to have anything that's protects the employee but its alright to have something
that protects the employer.
I have a few mates who work for a major supermarket on nights all with one hour contracts.
They go in on the first night knowing that the next night only two thirds of them will be needed.
So they don't take any of the allocated breaks work flat out and kiss the managers backside with the hope of
getting another night and so on. Cap in hand comes to mind.
One guy was let go, he couldn't come in because his kid had went into hospital.
There's not one of them who wouldn't spit in the managers face and walk out if they had the choice.
That's the reality of most zero hour contracts.
I'm not saying that its wrong mate no,
What I'm saying is that in my experience its best to protect yourself, anybody who works for me I will treat fairly, there's no need for them to kiss my backside to keep their jobs, if they're good I want them to work for me, pay them hol pay, loads of overtime etc.
There is an uncurable illness that effects some people though, mainly window cleaner. Its called feetunderthetableitas. Its terminal, and usually shows after anything between 3 months and 18months of employment. The symptoms are that a guy who once once one of the best lads you've got almost overnight turns into somebody who is taking their job for granted and turns into a complete arse. Those who employ will know what I mean.
I zero hour contract would help to protect against this.
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
So what your saying is its wrong to have anything that's protects the employee but its alright to have something
that protects the employer.
I have a few mates who work for a major supermarket on nights all with one hour contracts.
They go in on the first night knowing that the next night only two thirds of them will be needed.
So they don't take any of the allocated breaks work flat out and kiss the managers backside with the hope of
getting another night and so on. Cap in hand comes to mind.
One guy was let go, he couldn't come in because his kid had went into hospital.
There's not one of them who wouldn't spit in the managers face and walk out if they had the choice.
That's the reality of most zero hour contracts.
I'm not saying that its wrong mate no,
What I'm saying is that in my experience its best to protect yourself, anybody who works for me I will treat fairly, there's no need for them to kiss my backside to keep their jobs, if they're good I want them to work for me, pay them hol pay, loads of overtime etc.
There is an uncurable illness that effects some people though, mainly window cleaner. Its called feetunderthetableitas. Its terminal, and usually shows after anything between 3 months and 18months of employment. The symptoms are that a guy who once once one of the best lads you've got almost overnight turns into somebody who is taking their job for granted and turns into a complete arse. Those who employ will know what I mean.
I zero hour contract would help to protect against this.
Stupidity too because those employees have no protection or right to an employment tribunal until they have worked for you two years. A zero hour contract won't change that.
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8weekly, I don't think that's the case anymore I think you have full rights after 26 weeks.
Dean, I understand where your coming from have seen that happen myself and it can be a nightmare
for the employer to get rid.
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8weekly, I don't think that's the case anymore I think you have full rights after 26 weeks.
Dean, I understand where your coming from have seen that happen myself and it can be a nightmare
for the employer to get rid.
No, unfair dismissal is two years. That is the key one. Plus the person taking someone to a tribunal has to pay fees of £1,200 or so. That stops the chancers.
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8weekly, I don't think that's the case anymore I think you have full rights after 26 weeks.
Dean, I understand where your coming from have seen that happen myself and it can be a nightmare
for the employer to get rid.
No, unfair dismissal is two years. That is the key one. Plus the person taking someone to a tribunal has to pay fees of £1,200 or so. That stops the chancers.
My mistake it used to be one year but I thought they had reduced it to 6months but its went the other way 2 years.
Should have known that the Torries wouldn't do anything that would improve conditions for the worker.
Its still one year in Northern Ireland.
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Peeps.
Im after a zero hours contract template if anyone has one or a real one I could numptyise Id be grateful if you could email me it at windows@albrightandshiny.co.uk
Hi jim,
nothing wrong with a zero hr contract in my mind. i would wonder if it would gain you the same loyalty as a contract with set hours, but at the right time and place they are an option. you could always start people on zero hrs with the view of giving them set hrs when the work is there and they have proved themselves relaible and good.
with the moral issues asisde, isn;t azero hr contract just a contract without set hours. so where i put on my contracts say 36hrs a week (for example) you would put 0 hrs. the terms and condtions of a contract are the same.
R
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What Im exploring is a 6 month zero hours contract on an hourly rate and a productivity based bonus.. Then once everyone is happy . put them on a 20 or 30 hours contract with productivity bonus.. Should work for everyone at all levels.
My prospect is on minimum wage currently and getting messed around. He knows that I would have to subsidise his wages per the first 6 months and that some days there could be no work.. While It would be a zero hours contract on paper I feel morally obliged to match at least what he is currently on with a view to getting as much work in as fast as possible..
The Zero hours contract is purely a get out of Jail clause if he does not perform as expected or for some reason the work I currently has dries up..
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
So what your saying is its wrong to have anything that's protects the employee but its alright to have something
that protects the employer.
I have a few mates who work for a major supermarket on nights all with one hour contracts.
They go in on the first night knowing that the next night only two thirds of them will be needed.
So they don't take any of the allocated breaks work flat out and kiss the managers backside with the hope of
getting another night and so on. Cap in hand comes to mind.
One guy was let go, he couldn't come in because his kid had went into hospital.
There's not one of them who wouldn't spit in the managers face and walk out if they had the choice.
That's the reality of most zero hour contracts.
I'm not saying that its wrong mate no,
What I'm saying is that in my experience its best to protect yourself, anybody who works for me I will treat fairly, there's no need for them to kiss my backside to keep their jobs, if they're good I want them to work for me, pay them hol pay, loads of overtime etc.
There is an uncurable illness that effects some people though, mainly window cleaner. Its called feetunderthetableitas. Its terminal, and usually shows after anything between 3 months and 18months of employment. The symptoms are that a guy who once once one of the best lads you've got almost overnight turns into somebody who is taking their job for granted and turns into a complete arse. Those who employ will know what I mean.
I zero hour contract would help to protect against this.
Stupidity too because those employees have no protection or right to an employment tribunal until they have worked for you two years. A zero hour contract won't change that.
Are you saying you should keep somebody on for just under 2 years and then get rid of them?
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The main problem with the zero contract in my opinion is that it's left wide open for abuse. The majority of employers that use it to do to save costs as much as possible at the detriment to their workers.
It's a very difficult situation, in principal I am against zero hour contracts because the large companies like whetherspoons use them to squeeze
Every penny they can out out of their staff avoiding all the supposed benefits of being employed rather than self employed
However, when it comes to small traders I think zero hour contracts can be better. Simply because they protect the employer from being messed around, long term sickness etc. If you only employ one person and they go off sick for 2 months then it could destroy your business. Whereas for someone like whetherspoons it wouldn't make a difference.
The only concern again is that the employer take the p_ss.
If like dene says they are happy to provide holiday and sick pay etc then everyone wins.
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Its not until you get taken to an employment tribunal that you realise the benefit of a zero hour contract. Decent staff have nothing to fear and their jobs will always be safe, they will always have holiday pay, they will always earn a decent wage. The zero hour contract is there to protect the employer, I personally don't have my staff on one but any new staff who I may take on in the future will be having one.
So what your saying is its wrong to have anything that's protects the employee but its alright to have something
that protects the employer.
I have a few mates who work for a major supermarket on nights all with one hour contracts.
They go in on the first night knowing that the next night only two thirds of them will be needed.
So they don't take any of the allocated breaks work flat out and kiss the managers backside with the hope of
getting another night and so on. Cap in hand comes to mind.
One guy was let go, he couldn't come in because his kid had went into hospital.
There's not one of them who wouldn't spit in the managers face and walk out if they had the choice.
That's the reality of most zero hour contracts.
I'm not saying that its wrong mate no,
What I'm saying is that in my experience its best to protect yourself, anybody who works for me I will treat fairly, there's no need for them to kiss my backside to keep their jobs, if they're good I want them to work for me, pay them hol pay, loads of overtime etc.
There is an uncurable illness that effects some people though, mainly window cleaner. Its called feetunderthetableitas. Its terminal, and usually shows after anything between 3 months and 18months of employment. The symptoms are that a guy who once once one of the best lads you've got almost overnight turns into somebody who is taking their job for granted and turns into a complete arse. Those who employ will know what I mean.
I zero hour contract would help to protect against this.
Stupidity too because those employees have no protection or right to an employment tribunal until they have worked for you two years. A zero hour contract won't change that.
Are you saying you should keep somebody on for just under 2 years and then get rid of them?
No. I was asking you how a zero hour contract protects you from being taken to a tribunal.
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
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If anyone has got that 0 hour contract, can i have a copy too please?
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
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Im just wondering how a zero hours contract affects an employee?
Difficulty when applying for a mortgage or loan or private rental contract?
Worry and stress due to not knowing what their given income will be weekly/monthly?
Not being able to plan for holidays etc. due to uncertainty?
Loss of morale and self worth due to not feeling valued by their employer?
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
Wasn't based in Hungerford was it? with a fellow director called Clive??
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
Wasn't based in Hungerford was it? with a fellow director called Clive??
No, Maidenhead... well Bray to be totally accurate.
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Im just wondering how a zero hours contract affects an employee?
Difficulty when applying for a mortgage or loan or private rental contract?
Worry and stress due to not knowing what their given income will be weekly/monthly?
Not being able to plan for holidays etc. due to uncertainty?
Loss of morale and self worth due to not feeling valued by their employer?
Exactly and how would it effect us as a service provider, if you don't know how much money you've got
coming in from one week to the next your not going to take the chance and spend it on having your
windows cleaned.
The same goes for other businesses that provide goods and services if they aren't getting custom then they
also have no spare cash for things like window cleaning.
The problem is that if one greedy company does it to cut costs then others have no choice they have to do the same
to compete.
That's why we have to be careful when supporting things like zero hour contracts it might look good for are business
in the short term but not so good long term.
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better off on benefits than zero hour contracts, that's how people on income support see it and as it is. Zero hour contracts are an exploitation by employers who pray on the very vulnerable.....should be banned imo.
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
So the answer is no. Thought so. Lol.
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
So the answer is no. Thought so. Lol.
Edited. Some people aren't worth arguing with.
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There is little justification for employing people on zero hours contracts in instances where they are, to all intents and purposes, regular full time employees
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
So the answer is no. Thought so. Lol.
Edited. Some people aren't worth arguing with.
Lol Pmsl rofl lmao!
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So I asked all my staff today whether it bothered them that they were on a zero hour contract.
Not one was bothered. Ill stick to my zero hour contract and you can all sit on your soap box, I'm quite happy down here.
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
So the answer is no. Thought so. Lol.
Edited. Some people aren't worth arguing with.
Lol Pmsl rofl lmao!
I bet I pay my leafleters more an hour than you pay your workers. I suspect that is why you have problems with them. Getting ped with them won't help either. ;)
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So I asked all my staff today whether it bothered them that they were on a zero hour contract.
Not one was bothered. Ill stick to my zero hour contract and you can all sit on your soap box, I'm quite happy down here.
Would you expect them to say anything else to you? ::)roll
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There is little justification for employing people on zero hours contracts in instances where they are, to all intents and purposes, regular full time employees
True.
They were allegedly brought in to cater for fluctuating requirements of staff numbers in sectors such as hospitality and tourism.
To manage seasonal demand for short duration periods.
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So I asked all my staff today whether it bothered them that they were on a zero hour contract.
Not one was bothered. Ill stick to my zero hour contract and you can all sit on your soap box, I'm quite happy down here.
You have previously posted that you struggle to hire and retain staff.
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8weekly? Do you employ?
Cheers,
Dean
Not currently, but I was a founding director of a software company and employed 5 staff.
Why do you ask? Would that excuse me being muddled over zero hour contracts and other employment rights?
So the answer is no. Thought so. Lol.
Edited. Some people aren't worth arguing with.
Lol Pmsl rofl lmao!
I bet I pay my leafleters more an hour than you pay your workers. I suspect that is why you have problems with them. Getting ped with them won't help either. ;)
And I bet you back twice as much that you don't. Pmsl Lol, Lmao, Rofl.
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So I asked all my staff today whether it bothered them that they were on a zero hour contract.
Not one was bothered. Ill stick to my zero hour contract and you can all sit on your soap box, I'm quite happy down here.
You have previously posted that you struggle to hire and retain staff.
Did you read the reasons why though? For one job in particular, a night shift for 3 hours per night, seven days a week.
I also had problems with finding staff because the job centre insist on getting every single person applying for a job, regardless of what you stipulate. I ask for someone who could drive, yet I received 340+ applications and of the first 80+ people I spoke to only 1 person can drive.
I have no need to lie, I asked the people who work for me and they said it doesn't bother them, I pay them a decent enough wage, or as much as I can. Plus lots of other benefits.
Go and do a few more searches if you want I'll answer what you want?
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Also Alfie if you want to click on my profile everything about me is there to see unlike some people who keep everything hidden!
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Also Alfie if you want to click on my profile everything about me is there to see unlike some people who keep everything hidden!
Lol Neil. It doesn't link anywhere. ;D
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Haha I think it's clean it up, it does it with other peoples I've been on.
My company name is there though and it links to a bad URL that displays my website for you to type in google so it's all good!