Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: dannymack on March 23, 2014, 01:34:10 pm
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Just wanted to know how many peeps are still having to charge there batteries ?
Isn't that old fashioned now, id of thought most wfp users have a split relay fitted that the second battery for the system would be charging from the vehicle battery.
Mind you saying that I do alot of travelling so mines getting plenty of charge, Spose if you don't travel much and do alot of residentials then yeah I can see that you have the hassle of taking in your battery to charge, or running chargers to your vehicle 👍😏🇬🇧👳👀
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Yep, the Neanderthal I am, I charge mine every day. I have two batteries; when I finish work I fill up the tank and swap batteries. It's not a chore because my shed is like 15 feet from where I park up.
But I never have any battery problems.
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Tosh why don't you just have a split relay and charge from your vehicle, is it what's said above due to it not getting enough charge !!! At 15ft is still 15ft to keep walking ay pmsl !!!! It's would be one thing to not have to do keep charging lol !!! ☑👍🇬🇧
I find it hassle filling the van system up everyday pmsl !!! 👍🇬🇧🇬🇧🐊
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Whats with all the daft icons?
Something I expect from my 8yr old :-*
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I have a split relay but don't do enough miles to keep the battery charged.
About 10 miles a week.
It works o.k. when the battery is new but after about 6 months it needs to be put
on a charger.
I use a Halfords smart charger which will top it up in a few hours and
I can charge my battery in the van so its not a problem.
One good point about having a split relay is if the battery does run out and you are in the middle of a clean
you can run the van for a few minutes and this will give you enough power to finish.
Or you can let the van tick over and finish off a few more. Just make sure you have a steering lock and are in a
safe area.
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Jarvey the icons are my trademark post and if ya don't like erm don't look at me post 😏and erm what's that you put at the end of your sentence !!! Mmm looks like an icon Some sort of hypocrite ain't we !!!!! 🔫🔫🔫👍
Sean I thought that may be the reason
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Whats with all the daft icons?
Something I expect from my 8yr old :-*
Only have to view them if you are on iphone. One of the reasons i stopped viewing the site on iphone.
Little things eh! ;)
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Another moaning about icon but has got one at the end of his sentence !!!!
Can't stop yaselves 😬😕😏 lol !!!!same goes to you h20 don't read or post on my post
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Smileys are acceptable ;D
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Why they still an icon !!!! 😕👳👳👳
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And to keep on topic, all vans fitted with split charge and built in smart chargers.
If i wanna top my van up, i plug into an external waterproof socket.
I will be moving closer to one of our rounds, so may cause an issue as that village has hundreds of houses.
Will cross that bridge when i come to it.
:) ;) :D ;D >:( :( :o 8) ??? ::)roll :P :-[ :-X :-\ :-* :'(
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Why you ask?
This is why, coz they show as **** all on a pc! So how do i want icons you have used.
I just assumed you have a fetish for squares.
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1395586337_WHY.jpg)
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What's a smart charge ? Lee mentioned earlier Spose there the same as the split relay. Looks like you will be going towards the battery and relay H20 in the near future
Pmsl !!! Like the Icons
The real reason I put them in is , I can find my posts and stuff I right in with icons beside them but don't tell nobody lol !!!!
Cheers H20 💂💂💂💂
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Don'ty icons come
Up as pics I'm putting on ? Yes I love triangles as well as squares pmsl !!!!
🔲🔲🔳♦♦♦
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If i view your posts on an iphone or my ipad they i see the icons which are "emoji text icons"
So if i view on my pc all i see are squares and random gibberish ;)
I have this hard wired in, i can tell via my 12v Gauges if it needs charging ;)
http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_894769_langId_-1_categoryId_255205
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Oooooo I see pmsl !!!
That's cool if you can see when your battery needs charging 😐😐😐😏 :) :) :)
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1395587840_Untitled11.jpg)
Tadarrrrrrrr
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That's a good bit of kit h20, the only thing I'd be worried about if I didn't have my battery wires up to the van battery if I started doing a job and battery went flat as I have jobs 2 and half hour away. My first jobs are prob about an hour from home. But I do like that telling when the battery is low pretty cool m8
No icons for ya as I know you don't like lol !!!!
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I have that, a spilt charge relay and a built in battery charger ;)
HaHa.
I think CIU without your icons would be like fish without the chips :P
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My 110 amp leisure battery was at 75% to 100% charged a couple of weeks ago. I purposely let its charge drop as I was going on a long journey and wanted to see what was needed to charge the battery via the split charge relay.
On starting the journey the battery was accepting a charge of 4.8/4.9 amps at 13.9 volts. (I put the battery on charge for a few moments and my intelligent battery charger was also charging the battery at the same volt and amperage rate the van's alternator did.)
After 250 miles and 4 & 1/2 hours travelling time the battery was accepting 1.2 amps at 14.2 volts and 0.8 amps at 14.4 volts 50 miles and 1 hour later.
In all I did 660 miles and the battery was still accepting a trickle charge of 0.3 amps at 14.4 volt.
When was my battery fully charged and when was it just receiving a trickle charge? I would think that it was at the 300 mile point. Had I thought about it I should have removed the fuse to the SCR at that point. This would have enabled the battery to rest for 4 hours before checking the voltage. A pity I didn't as it was an opportunity missed.
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Soz Spruce all what your saying as gone straight over me head lol !!! That's to much involves for me m8, this is my second 110AH Leisure battery I've had in 10 years I don't do nothing with them as it runs off van batter via split charger. I do lots of mileage so that's why it's kept fully charged. I know it has X2 fuses one in van battery and one on Leisure battery. As long as it works ok that'll do me lol !!!!
Thanks for all info 😇😮😏👍
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Just seen your post H20 pmsl yeah like bread without butter pmsl !!!! 👍🇬🇧🇬🇧👳
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Soz Spruce all what your saying as gone straight over me head lol !!! That's to much involves for me m8, this is my second 110AH Leisure battery I've had in 10 years I don't do nothing with them as it runs off van batter via split charger. I do lots of mileage so that's why it's kept fully charged. I know it has X2 fuses one in van battery and one on Leisure battery. As long as it works ok that'll do me lol !!!!
Thanks for all info
If you do the mileage like you do then your alternator will keep your leisure battery pretty well charged up.
If you are like me and do 20 to 30 minutes driving a day maximum then you have to supplementary charge your battery.
The Numax battery boys said that batteries used by window cleaners don't last very long at all and they won't guarantee them in our environment. Having 2 only 110 amp batteries in this length of time means you are doing something right - your van is keeping them in good condition due to the mileage you drive.
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That sounds about spot on Spruce, I'm lucky in that way but not so lucky in the ammount of fuel costs pmsl !!!! 👍👳👳👳
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I use a charger on my battery every night and also have a SCR, I don't really do enough milage to fully charge the better with a SCR. Also letting the battery get down to low levels of charge will damage it. I've put a switch on the SCR so I can just let the alternator charge the van battery on it's own and leave the system battery out of it if need be, this is good for the van battery and alternator.
Simon.
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That's a good idea Simon putting a switch on the SCR to save the life of the battery 👍
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I got fed up with charging the battery every night so I thought I would install a split charger..I also put in a voltmeter to see what the system battery is holding. After driving 5 miles or so, the meter is showing 13.2 volts.
After working for, say an hour the voltage is dropping to 12.5v. A short drive to next job and the voltage is back up to 13!
Is this right? I could do a really short drive (less than a mile) and it makes .5v difference? I don't travel a lot of miles to and from work (not like Mr Mack!).
Just as a test, I put the battery on charge last night and the voltmeter is reading 13.2. Does this mean the battery has had it or is on its way out?
Oh, another test I did was put the voltmeter in the cigarette lighter socket while the engine was running and it showed 14.4v....
At what voltage would the pump stop working?
Sorry for the hijack Danny!
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No probs Dave, I don't no no difference as I've always had my leisure battery fitted to the van battery. I would hate to keep taking it out to charge would be a chore for
Me that is 👳
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I got fed up with charging the battery every night so I thought I would install a split charger..I also put in a voltmeter to see what the system battery is holding. After driving 5 miles or so, the meter is showing 13.2 volts.
After working for, say an hour the voltage is dropping to 12.5v. A short drive to next job and the voltage is back up to 13!
Is this right? I could do a really short drive (less than a mile) and it makes .5v difference? I don't travel a lot of miles to and from work (not like Mr Mack!).
Just as a test, I put the battery on charge last night and the voltmeter is reading 13.2. Does this mean the battery has had it or is on its way out?
Oh, another test I did was put the voltmeter in the cigarette lighter socket while the engine was running and it showed 14.4v....
At what voltage would the pump stop working?
Sorry for the hijack Danny!
After charging you need to leave a battery to rest for about 20 mins to get an accurate reading of the charge it holds. A short drive won't recharge the battery fully it's just displaying a higher voltage due to having 14volts at high ampage being dropped across the terminals minutes before. If you parked up had lunch and then checked it would probably be something like 12.6.
Simon.
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Let you all into a secret!
Standard fittment van and car alternators are not good battery chargers. In fact, they are bad battery chargers. To charge batteries quickly and fully requires a more sophisticated device than that of a standard alternator regulator.
Also if using a split charge relay, make sure it is a zero volt drop relay.
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I got fed up with charging the battery every night so I thought I would install a split charger..I also put in a voltmeter to see what the system battery is holding. After driving 5 miles or so, the meter is showing 13.2 volts.
After working for, say an hour the voltage is dropping to 12.5v. A short drive to next job and the voltage is back up to 13!
THE VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY TAKES A WHILE TO STABILISE (4 HOURS). YOU WILL FIND THAT OVER TIME THE GAUGE WILL DROP BACK. IF YOU HAVE BEEN WORKING FOR AN HOUR YOU WILL ALSO FIND THE THE BATTERY WILL RECOVER IF LEFT TO SETTLE. yOU CAN ONLY TEST THE VOLTAGE AND GET AN ACCURATE STATE OF CHARGE ONCE THE BATTERY HAS RESTED FOR 4 HOURS,
Is this right? I could do a really short drive (less than a mile) and it makes .5v difference? I don't travel a lot of miles to and from work (not like Mr Mack!).
Just as a test, I put the battery on charge last night and the voltmeter is reading 13.2. Does this mean the battery has had it or is on its way out?
IF YOU LEFT THE BATTERY ON CHARGE ALL NIGHT AND THEN LET IT STABILISE FOR THIS 4 HOUR PERIOD, THEN YOU WOULD PROBABLY SEE A VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY OF 12.8 OR 12.9 VOLTS WHICH IS FULLY CHARGED.
Oh, another test I did was put the voltmeter in the cigarette lighter socket while the engine was running and it showed 14.4v...
AS YOUR VOLTMETER SEES THE VEHICLE ELECTRICAL SYSTEM AT 14.4 VOLTS WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING, YOUR VOLT METER IS ACCURATE.
At what voltage would the pump stop working?
STOP WORKING OR BURN OUT? MOST EQUIPMENT HAS AN OVER VOLTAGE BUILT IN. ANY MANUFACTURER WILL BE AWARE THAT A VEHICLE'S ALTERNATOR WILL CHARGE AT 14.4 VOLTS AND SO WILL DESIGN THEIR 12V PRODUCT TO ACCOUNT FOR THIS. (AN ALTERNATOR PUTTING OUT 12V WON'T CHARGE A BATTERY).
Sorry for the hijack Danny!
Hi Dave,
Answers in block capitals as I can't get the letters of the answer to come up in a different colour like I could before.
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I run an extension lead out to my van via letter box from my flat after filling up.takes 2mins.then disconnect in the morning.
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I bench charge my leisure battery with intelligent charger once a week at weekends.
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http://www.seapost.co.uk/sterling-ab1280-special-price---digital-ab-1280-alternator-to-battery-charge-booster-416-p.asp
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I got fed up with charging the battery every night so I thought I would install a split charger..I also put in a voltmeter to see what the system battery is holding. After driving 5 miles or so, the meter is showing 13.2 volts.
After working for, say an hour the voltage is dropping to 12.5v. A short drive to next job and the voltage is back up to 13!
THE VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY TAKES A WHILE TO STABILISE (4 HOURS). YOU WILL FIND THAT OVER TIME THE GAUGE WILL DROP BACK. IF YOU HAVE BEEN WORKING FOR AN HOUR YOU WILL ALSO FIND THE THE BATTERY WILL RECOVER IF LEFT TO SETTLE. yOU CAN ONLY TEST THE VOLTAGE AND GET AN ACCURATE STATE OF CHARGE ONCE THE BATTERY HAS RESTED FOR 4 HOURS,
Is this right? I could do a really short drive (less than a mile) and it makes .5v difference? I don't travel a lot of miles to and from work (not like Mr Mack!).
Just as a test, I put the battery on charge last night and the voltmeter is reading 13.2. Does this mean the battery has had it or is on its way out?
IF YOU LEFT THE BATTERY ON CHARGE ALL NIGHT AND THEN LET IT STABILISE FOR THIS 4 HOUR PERIOD, THEN YOU WOULD PROBABLY SEE A VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY OF 12.8 OR 12.9 VOLTS WHICH IS FULLY CHARGED.
Oh, another test I did was put the voltmeter in the cigarette lighter socket while the engine was running and it showed 14.4v...
AS YOUR VOLTMETER SEES THE VEHICLE ELECTRICAL SYSTEM AT 14.4 VOLTS WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING, YOUR VOLT METER IS ACCURATE.
At what voltage would the pump stop working?
STOP WORKING OR BURN OUT? MOST EQUIPMENT HAS AN OVER VOLTAGE BUILT IN. ANY MANUFACTURER WILL BE AWARE THAT A VEHICLE'S ALTERNATOR WILL CHARGE AT 14.4 VOLTS AND SO WILL DESIGN THEIR 12V PRODUCT TO ACCOUNT FOR THIS. (AN ALTERNATOR PUTTING OUT 12V WON'T CHARGE A BATTERY).
Sorry for the hijack Danny!
Hi Dave,
Answers in block capitals as I can't get the letters of the answer to come up in a different colour like I could before.
Thanks very much Spruce, informative as ever!
What I meant by"at what voltage does the pump stop working" is for instance, if the voltmeter was reading say 11.5 volts would the pump still work? (If that makes any sense!!)
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Yes it would, it would work slower as your battery volts drop, like a torch when the batteries are going unless your using an electronic pump controller, most of these now cut your pump off when your battery voltage drops below a certain point.
Hope this helps
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Yes it would, it would work slower as your battery volts drop, like a torch when the batteries are going unless your using an electronic pump controller, most of these now cut your pump off when your battery voltage drops below a certain point.
Hope this helps
Hi Dave
excellent example of the torch - must remember than one as it is easy to relate to.
Lets talk about those sterling chargers for £270.00 plus. As an auto electrician, how does that speed up charging a leisure battery? A leisure battery will only accept a low charging rate. My leisure battery is sealed so can't be topped up with water. Too fast a charging will create gas which will escape but there is no way to replace the water, hence the reason for trickle charging it.
Charging a leisure battery doesn't seem to have anything to do with how big the charger is, but rather at what rate of charge the battery will accept.
The reason for asking is that we have had some communication with Grippa who did tell us that fitting their 100 amp relays solved all their customers flat battery problems - except for one who lived next door to his customers and did no mileage.
I got intouch with their suppliers and was told that their 100 amp relay will not work any faster than my 30 amp relay and that it has no sophisticated electronics on board to facilitate faster charging.
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i have a split relay but i charge my van every day at home because i have run out of juice before and don't wanna do it again so i charge it for a few hours every evening
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I got fed up with charging the battery every night so I thought I would install a split charger..I also put in a voltmeter to see what the system battery is holding. After driving 5 miles or so, the meter is showing 13.2 volts.
After working for, say an hour the voltage is dropping to 12.5v. A short drive to next job and the voltage is back up to 13!
THE VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY TAKES A WHILE TO STABILISE (4 HOURS). YOU WILL FIND THAT OVER TIME THE GAUGE WILL DROP BACK. IF YOU HAVE BEEN WORKING FOR AN HOUR YOU WILL ALSO FIND THE THE BATTERY WILL RECOVER IF LEFT TO SETTLE. yOU CAN ONLY TEST THE VOLTAGE AND GET AN ACCURATE STATE OF CHARGE ONCE THE BATTERY HAS RESTED FOR 4 HOURS,
Is this right? I could do a really short drive (less than a mile) and it makes .5v difference? I don't travel a lot of miles to and from work (not like Mr Mack!).
Just as a test, I put the battery on charge last night and the voltmeter is reading 13.2. Does this mean the battery has had it or is on its way out?
IF YOU LEFT THE BATTERY ON CHARGE ALL NIGHT AND THEN LET IT STABILISE FOR THIS 4 HOUR PERIOD, THEN YOU WOULD PROBABLY SEE A VOLTAGE ACROSS THE BATTERY OF 12.8 OR 12.9 VOLTS WHICH IS FULLY CHARGED.
Oh, another test I did was put the voltmeter in the cigarette lighter socket while the engine was running and it showed 14.4v...
AS YOUR VOLTMETER SEES THE VEHICLE ELECTRICAL SYSTEM AT 14.4 VOLTS WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING, YOUR VOLT METER IS ACCURATE.
At what voltage would the pump stop working?
STOP WORKING OR BURN OUT? MOST EQUIPMENT HAS AN OVER VOLTAGE BUILT IN. ANY MANUFACTURER WILL BE AWARE THAT A VEHICLE'S ALTERNATOR WILL CHARGE AT 14.4 VOLTS AND SO WILL DESIGN THEIR 12V PRODUCT TO ACCOUNT FOR THIS. (AN ALTERNATOR PUTTING OUT 12V WON'T CHARGE A BATTERY).
Sorry for the hijack Danny!
Hi Dave,
Answers in block capitals as I can't get the letters of the answer to come up in a different colour like I could before.
Thanks very much Spruce, informative as ever!
What I meant by"at what voltage does the pump stop working" is for instance, if the voltmeter was reading say 11.5 volts would the pump still work? (If that makes any sense!!)
As per Dave's answer from Kentkleen.
Our Varistreams cut the power supply at 10.3vdc to help save the battery.
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i have a split relay but i charge my van every day at home because i have run out of juice before and don't wanna do it again so i charge it for a few hours every evening
I do mine every couple of days.
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Not really an expert on charging but, as far as I know most alternators have a fairly crude voltage regulator fitted to them (changing ac produced to dc delivered to your battery). Batteries do not like unstable current being used to charge them, they will accept it and charge up but not in the most economical way. These alternator 'boosters' dont increase power in any way, they simply 'smooth' out the power delivery to your battery alot more than a standard alternator regulator.
We have one that was fitted to one of our old berlingo's and we never had any problems with van starting or system running.
Sterling claim that using one of there boosters is like charging your battery with a smart battery charger.
We dont not use leisure batteries in any of our vans, IMO 'normal' van batteries used as a system power supply (good quality one) like the 'charge' from the everyday running of a van more than a leisure battery.
Most SCR are not zero volt drop, heat and resistance builds up across the contacts and break down occurs in time, using a 100 amp relay simply means bigger contacts less heat and a longer life.
Hope this is of some use.
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Not really an expert on charging but, as far as I know most alternators have a fairly crude voltage regulator fitted to them (changing ac produced to dc delivered to your battery). Batteries do not like unstable current being used to charge them, they will accept it and charge up but not in the most economical way. These alternator 'boosters' dont increase power in any way, they simply 'smooth' out the power delivery to your battery alot more than a standard alternator regulator.
We have one that was fitted to one of our old berlingo's and we never had any problems with van starting or system running.
Sterling claim that using one of there boosters is like charging your battery with a smart battery charger.
We dont not use leisure batteries in any of our vans, IMO 'normal' van batteries used as a system power supply (good quality one) like the 'charge' from the everyday running of a van more than a leisure battery.
Most SCR are not zero volt drop, heat and resistance builds up across the contacts and break down occurs in time, using a 100 amp relay simply means bigger contacts less heat and a longer life.
Hope this is of some use.
Cheers Dave
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Just to add Bruce, Geoff has a transit and travels from his house about a mile and cleans all day week in week out within a 0.5 mile area. He has ocd with his diesel use so never leaves the van running on a job (most roads/closes he cleans between 4 to 8 houses without moving and uses his car for collecting. No SCR just a van battery in the back, never charges and never gives his battery a second thought.
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Thanks for the answers guys
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That sounds about spot on Spruce, I'm lucky in that way but not so lucky in the ammount of fuel costs pmsl !!!! 👍👳👳👳
Wierd the way we are isn't it. You don't mind driving for hours but find walking 15 foot to a garage a chore ? 👍👳👳👳
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I cleaned three properties today from 8am until 3pm. Battery was reading 14.3volts at the start of day and finished reading 13.0 volts and it is connected to a smart split charge relay on my van but I only travelled a very short distance today. 1.3 volts used from a brand new battery today.
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Just to add Bruce, Geoff has a transit and travels from his house about a mile and cleans all day week in week out within a 0.5 mile area. He has ocd with his diesel use so never leaves the van running on a job (most roads/closes he cleans between 4 to 8 houses without moving and uses his car for collecting. No SCR just a van battery in the back, never charges and never gives his battery a second thought.
???
His battery never gets charged and never goes flat??
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It never gets taken out of the van, he averages 15 to 20 miles a week of driving, yes it gets charged (whenever the van is running) and you are correct it never causes him any problems.
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1395587840_Untitled11.jpg)
Tadarrrrrrrr
Pure H2O,
Where did you get those stickers/yellows labels from? Have been looking for exactly the same for my new machine panel.
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Yep, the Neanderthal I am, I charge mine every day. I have several ex scrap batteries; when I finish work I fill up the tank and swap batteries. It's not a chore because my shed is like only 5 feet from where I park up.
But I never have any battery problems.
+1
FTFM! ;D
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Don'ty icons come
Up as pics I'm putting on ? Yes I love triangles as well as squares pmsl !!!!
🔲🔲🔳♦♦♦
Those are not triangles.
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(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1395587840_Untitled11.jpg)
Tadarrrrrrrr
Pure H2O,
Where did you get those stickers/yellows labels from? Have been looking for exactly the same for my new machine panel.
Looks like he used a Dymo LetraTag with yellow tape. Tape comes in different colours. See YouTube under Dymo LetraTag
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Cheers mate.