Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: dannymack on February 07, 2014, 06:29:55 pm
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As most know I mainly do commercial and have a few residential.. I did a pub for many many years and the detached house next door asked to do there's. I've been cleaning there windows for about 18 years, the pub closed about 7 years ago but as the family in the house are really nice and even give us a Christmas drink every year I carried on cleaning there windows. Well had a txt today to say not to clean them today as its raining, I do them the first Friday of each month so she knows when I'm coming and leaves money out round the back. I was really annoyed as it rains alot and if alot of custys said that we wouldn't have a business. I left it and thought no I'm gonna txt her so just did it. I explained that her windows get dirty due to a layer of dust that kicks up with the wind and settles on her glass, it will then rain at some time and the water on the dust makes them get dirty. I them said we come along when its raining or if its gonna rain and clean the glass. The rain is pure water which goes onto the clean glass, it's not the rain that makes the glass dirty as the window has been cleaned it will stay clean for a week or 2 when the dust kicks up again that's when they will start getting dirty. I said as I've been cleaning your windows for many years and yous are a nice family ill carry on. She txt back and said she was really sorry this will never happen again and she feels really bad
Do yous think I was right in explaining this as I get fed up when people say awww your wasting your time cleaning them its gonna rain !!!! 👳👳👳👍
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Depends bud.
Are you happy to carry on cleaning after your explanation?
Is she happy for you to keep coming?
If yes to both, then yes, you made the right call.
If you've been cleaning her windows for 18 years and (I assume) she's not cancelled because of rain before, I'd say something else was up though...
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I think u wer nice, ide av just dropped them n wen they ring bk nxt month say price is goin up
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I think u wer nice, ide av just dropped them n wen they ring bk nxt month say price is goin up
Did a chap called dodger design your site?
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as you say you have to pay bills and all so a bit of rain aint gunna make any difference. if its the only one there then drop and canvass more.
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One day Danny you will have enough work that it doesn't upset you.
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Had this a lot lately because of how much it's been raining, It starting to wind me up, had people say why would you work in this weather? I just say I've not got a choice , I got bills to pay too
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For what it's worth, my opinion on things like this is do keep smiling.
Normally, certainly for my customers, it's more about how i say it than what i say.
If I'm ploughing through the rain and a customer moans, chirping back something like:
'don't worry, it's the same price' or
'it always makes it feel a bit easier when a customer makes me a cup of tea...white with one, thanks'
All but the most miserable of customers will realise that you're cleaning as a business, and as such, need to make money, whatever the weather.
If people still continue to moan, suck it up until you can afford to lose them. Once you can afford to pick & choose (to a degree) who you clean for, chuck 'em
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If I dropped every customer who asked me to 'leave them today', I wouldn't have any!
I am in Ireland, where the culture towards window cleaning is different to Britain. The trick is to have enough customers to call on, so if hit with a 'not today', there is always another who wants me. This scenario works in cycles, so there is always work, just not always where you would like it on the day!
No one here really cares that we have families to support. They are too concerned with their own lives to bother about our needs. we are 'just the window cleaner' after all!
John
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if i hit on a not today move on and forget it, be flexible to a point if they continue dump.
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Thanks for info chaps, I won't dump as they are nice family and she promised not to do it again she just didn't think. It's not about the money as its only a £10 house it just annoys me when peeps say not to worry its gonna rain.
8 weekly I've got plenty of work thanks mate we turn overall 6 figure sum and am vat reg and a ltd company.it wasn't about the money with this as most of our work is Commercial these few houses we do are just abit of extra pocket money !!!! It's about people don't understand that the rain won't dirty there windows for a while 👳👳👳
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
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That's a shame Marc but you prob better off without twats like that mate 👳👳👳👍
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i always explain to customers i work in the rain and to let me know if their not happy after cleaning them in wet weather.
its the ruddy wind thats the problem!! ::)roll
wednesday was just too bad with strong wind and heavy rain so day off.i was gonna catch up and work today but again very strong winds and heavy showers.
better luck next week eh lads? ;D
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
It's the customer who is paying our wages, and let's not forget that they don't owe us a living. If I had a customer who was worth 4 grand a year, I would go with the flow, as I do with even my lowest paid work.
Even though customers don't sympathise with our need to earn a living (why should they, we are only hired help after all?) I still like my customers to have the benefit of clean windows for as long as possible, and I tell them so.
Golden rule guys, golden rule. ;)
John.
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
It's the customer who is paying our wages, and let's not forget that they don't owe us a living. If I had a customer who was worth 4 grand a year, I would go with the flow, as I do with even my lowest paid work.
But if you go with the flow he isn't worth £4k a year. ::)roll
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
It's the customer who is paying our wages, and let's not forget that they don't owe us a living. If I had a customer who was worth 4 grand a year, I would go with the flow, as I do with even my lowest paid work.
But if you go with the flow he isn't worth £4k a year. ::)roll
Maybe not, but then if you value his custom so little that you are prepared to dump him, you've then got to find 4 grand's worth of new custom to make up the shortfall. How long would that take you? :)
John
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
It's the customer who is paying our wages, and let's not forget that they don't owe us a living. If I had a customer who was worth 4 grand a year, I would go with the flow, as I do with even my lowest paid work.
But if you go with the flow he isn't worth £4k a year. ::)roll
Maybe not, but then if you value his custom so little that you are prepared to dump him, you've then got to find 4 grand's worth of new custom to make up the shortfall. How long would that take you? :)
John
No you haven't as he was never worth that. He has only been a customer for 6 months and is already cancelling. It is much better to find customers that want the service you offer. The guy above wants a different service to the one agreed and on offer.
Besides, I wouldn't value his custom at all if he was shouting down the phone.
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It is annoying. I picked up a large-ish customer during the summer of 2013. Shop inside and out, large block of flats and his mansion. Just this one customer worth about 4k a year, lost it this morning as he kept messing me about, using the weather as an excuse. I reminded him that id like to stick to the agreed sched and i dont mind one or two jobs being cancelled but i dont want a habit made of it. He didnt like that and ended up barking down the phone at me at 8am this morning.
Wasnt very pleasent, but hey ho.
It's the customer who is paying our wages, and let's not forget that they don't owe us a living. If I had a customer who was worth 4 grand a year, I would go with the flow, as I do with even my lowest paid work.
But if you go with the flow he isn't worth £4k a year. ::)roll
Maybe not, but then if you value his custom so little that you are prepared to dump him, you've then got to find 4 grand's worth of new custom to make up the shortfall. How long would that take you? :)
John
No you haven't as he was never worth that. He has only been a customer for 6 months and is already cancelling. It is much better to find customers that want the service you offer. The guy above wants a different service to the one agreed and on offer.
Besides, I wouldn't value his custom at all if he was shouting down the phone.
1. Then why was the figure of 4k mentioned if it was never a true figure? 2. I agree, but these customers can still provide some income if you do go with the flow until better ones are found/come along. Lastly, I too wouldn't want customers who shout at or verbally abuse me. In my experience this has ever only happened when I have hacked them off. Nowadays I am much more diplomatic when dealing with difficult people.
John
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With Johnny B on this one.
There's a flip side to "good" customers. When they are worth 4K a year, if they cancel half the time, it's still worth 2K. So for some, that's worth the hassle of cancelation. The real down side for me would be, that's a good chunk of work to lose over night if he changes firms.
When I was new to this game, I chased the big jobs like hopitals and schools. You only get the jobs on price, and if they drop you, you've got problems finding like jobs in a short time.
When you have domestics as 90% of your work, this can't happen. Easy to replace a 10 quid job in under a hour.
Dannymack will already know this. He can obviously handle the hassle. Rather you guys than me. I'll stick to cleaning Mrs Smith's windows. I'm nearly ready to go semi retired now anyway. 8)
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With Johnny B on this one.
There's a flip side to "good" customers. When they are worth 4K a year, if they cancel half the time, it's still worth 2K. So for some, that's worth the hassle of cancelation. The real down side for me would be, that's a good chunk of work to lose over night if he changes firms.
When I was new to this game, I chased the big jobs like hopitals and schools. You only get the jobs on price, and if they drop you, you've got problems finding like jobs in a short time.
When you have domestics as 90% of your work, this can't happen. Easy to replace a 10 quid job in under a hour.
Dannymack will already know this. He can obviously handle the hassle. Rather you guys than me. I'll stick to cleaning Mrs Smith's windows. I'm nearly ready to go semi retired now anyway. 8)
Thanks Cozy, you've explained what I meant better than I ever could! :)
John
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haha
It WOULD have been worth 4k a year, if he stuck with it. To be honest its not going to take long to replace, and like others have said its not worth working for someone who shouts their face off at me down the phone, dont need that hassle, jobs tough enough anyway this time of year.
I did apologise to him, and said sorry if he didnt like what i said, but after all i am running a business here; im not doing it for pocket change. He should know that being a business nowner himself with a ruddy great big 8 bedroom mansion in surrey.
He'd been through 4 window cleaners prev i learned from the staff; and due to his volitile nature im not suprised. I wanst even looking for extra business anyway, i only went into the store to buy a hat during the last summer and ended up with £4k's worth of business from him (if he had kept on for the year)
More will come, so what. Been doing this for too long to get all worried about these things. Im picking up work all the time so. As long as your polite (which i was to him) , and do a good job the numptys will come and go.
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I think you did exactly the right thing. Communication with customers is key. If you take the trouble to explain to them how it all works and your terms they respond well I have found. They appreciate the opinion and explanation of someone who cleans windows as a profession. I've had to explain many a time why leaving windows wet isn't going to do any harm.
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haha
It WOULD have been worth 4k a year, if he stuck with it. To be honest its not going to take long to replace, and like others have said its not worth working for someone who shouts their face off at me down the phone, dont need that hassle, jobs tough enough anyway this time of year.
I did apologise to him, and said sorry if he didnt like what i said, but after all i am running a business here; im not doing it for pocket change. He should know that being a business nowner himself with a ruddy great big 8 bedroom mansion in surrey.
He'd been through 4 window cleaners prev i learned from the staff; and due to his volitile nature im not suprised. I wanst even looking for extra business anyway, i only went into the store to buy a hat during the last summer and ended up with £4k's worth of business from him (if he had kept on for the year)
More will come, so what. Been doing this for too long to get all worried about these things. Im picking up work all the time so. As long as your polite (which i was to him) , and do a good job the numptys will come and go.
Hmmmm ... let me think; I can suck up for 4k's worth of work, so let's say £350 a month.
Now for me that is a good day's work and so if I was cancelled more than once and unless for a blisteringly good reason then I'm having a day potentially messed up. It really is more trouble than it is worth.
Yes, I might allow a one off cancellation with notice for good reason but that would be it. I mean, what's the point otherwise - it's just numbers on a spreadsheet, not money in the bank.
Johnny B seems to think Cozy was saying the same as him but better; Cozy has a way with words and he was saying no such thing - in fact in that post he advocates quite rightly in my view not having a big egg in your basket - too much of a liability and too much potential for dependence.
Anyone who goes into a shop to buy a hat and then gets awarded a 4K contract should be very careful - the person awarding it screams flakiness and unreliabilty like a 10/6d topper at a tea party.
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haha
It WOULD have been worth 4k a year, if he stuck with it. To be honest its not going to take long to replace, and like others have said its not worth working for someone who shouts their face off at me down the phone, dont need that hassle, jobs tough enough anyway this time of year.
I did apologise to him, and said sorry if he didnt like what i said, but after all i am running a business here; im not doing it for pocket change. He should know that being a business nowner himself with a ruddy great big 8 bedroom mansion in surrey.
He'd been through 4 window cleaners prev i learned from the staff; and due to his volitile nature im not suprised. I wanst even looking for extra business anyway, i only went into the store to buy a hat during the last summer and ended up with £4k's worth of business from him (if he had kept on for the year)
More will come, so what. Been doing this for too long to get all worried about these things. Im picking up work all the time so. As long as your polite (which i was to him) , and do a good job the numptys will come and go.
Hmmmm ... let me think; I can suck up for 4k's worth of work, so let's say £350 a month.
Now for me that is a good day's work and so if I was cancelled more than once and unless for a blisteringly good reason then I'm having a day potentially messed up. It really is more trouble than it is worth.
Yes, I might allow a one off cancellation with notice for good reason but that would be it. I mean, what's the point otherwise - it's just numbers on a spreadsheet, not money in the bank.
Johnny B seems to think Cozy was saying the same as him but better; Cozy has a way with words and he was saying no such thing - in fact in that post he advocates quite rightly in my view not having a big egg in your basket - too much of a liability and too much potential for dependence.
Anyone who goes into a shop to buy a hat and then gets awarded a 4K contract should be very careful - the person awarding it screams flakiness and unreliabilty like a 10/6d topper at a tea party.
Fair points. But I disagree. A few big eggs does the world of good. IMO.
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I've lost count how many times I think I've scored a really good job only to get the run around after a good few months or sometimes less.
The last one was a £12 000 000 place. Believe it or not, it only had 5 rooms but to give an idea of size, you could have built a 2 bedroom modern house in the hallway. It was a converted old barn with bits added in an acre of landscaped gardens that was nearly a mile down a windy pot holed single track road. These people were the other side of millionaires. The husband owned a well known company that makes toasters, kettles, coffee machines and the like.
It took two of us a knackering 7 or 8 hour day to do the insides and out and these were all easy to get to windows and no ornaments to work around when doing the insides.
To start with the lady was more than happy. She was so pleased to have her windows clean. After about 6 or 7 cleans, the lady started the 'not tomorrow' routine, then it changed to 'not this month'. I kept asking her if she actually wanted her windows cleaned and she kept saying she did, but 'not this month'. In the end, I just simply asked straight, did she want me to call again and she sort of said no, not really, so I didn't.
I've had exactly the same thing happen with other mega rich people. I don't know why though. They seem fine with everything but after a while, they seem to change their minds and become reticent about window cleaning.
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haha
It WOULD have been worth 4k a year, if he stuck with it. To be honest its not going to take long to replace, and like others have said its not worth working for someone who shouts their face off at me down the phone, dont need that hassle, jobs tough enough anyway this time of year.
I did apologise to him, and said sorry if he didnt like what i said, but after all i am running a business here; im not doing it for pocket change. He should know that being a business nowner himself with a ruddy great big 8 bedroom mansion in surrey.
He'd been through 4 window cleaners prev i learned from the staff; and due to his volitile nature im not suprised. I wanst even looking for extra business anyway, i only went into the store to buy a hat during the last summer and ended up with £4k's worth of business from him (if he had kept on for the year)
More will come, so what. Been doing this for too long to get all worried about these things. Im picking up work all the time so. As long as your polite (which i was to him) , and do a good job the numptys will come and go.
Hmmmm ... let me think; I can suck up for 4k's worth of work, so let's say £350 a month.
Now for me that is a good day's work and so if I was cancelled more than once and unless for a blisteringly good reason then I'm having a day potentially messed up. It really is more trouble than it is worth.
Yes, I might allow a one off cancellation with notice for good reason but that would be it. I mean, what's the point otherwise - it's just numbers on a spreadsheet, not money in the bank.
Absoultely agree there, this was in fact what he got annoyed about, i said that id like to keep to the schedual otherwise i might have to reconsider the whole pricing structure and he didnt like that.
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he advocates quite rightly in my view not having a big egg in your basket - too much of a liability and too much potential for dependence.
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Yep again, 100% agree. remember back in 2004-2006 when wfp bubble went mental in commercial applications? I had a contract with GEM and started of with a couple of sites, i think over the 3 years we worked for them we must of quoted for about 30 different sites, got a good third of those you know. Back then GEM were looking at getting rid of trad guys hanging off cradles due to the high costs involved with cradle signoff & inspections, they'd be looking at a grand or so before any labour started, and thats not including insurances. Then we'd go in and quote like £600 all in and get the job done in half a day by wfp, saving them thousands. that was the golden days bay then we were doin like insane money for window cleaners...then what happened? everyone jumped on the bandwagon to make easy money in pure water window cleaning and the rate you could charge dropped like a stone due to the saturation in the wfp market By 2008 i remember we had lost a lot of work; so sold the rest off to someone else, turns out he eventually lost it all to cheaper boys on wfp too...bubble...burst....egg in basket....you know the drill. been there.
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Anyone who goes into a shop to buy a hat and then gets awarded a 4K contract should be very careful - the person awarding it screams flakiness and unreliabilty like a 10/6d topper at a tea party.
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You know those cought up in the moment things? that was one of them..it happens...
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I've lost count how many times I think I've scored a really good job only to get the run around after a good few months or sometimes less.
The last one was a £12 000 000 place. Believe it or not, it only had 5 rooms but to give an idea of size, you could have built a 2 bedroom modern house in the hallway. It was a converted old barn with bits added in an acre of landscaped gardens that was nearly a mile down a windy pot holed single track road. These people were the other side of millionaires. The husband owned a well known company that makes toasters, kettles, coffee machines and the like.
It took two of us a knackering 7 or 8 hour day to do the insides and out and these were all easy to get to windows and no ornaments to work around when doing the insides.
To start with the lady was more than happy. She was so pleased to have her windows clean. After about 6 or 7 cleans, the lady started the 'not tomorrow' routine, then it changed to 'not this month'. I kept asking her if she actually wanted her windows cleaned and she kept saying she did, but 'not this month'. In the end, I just simply asked straight, did she want me to call again and she sort of said no, not really, so I didn't.
I've had exactly the same thing happen with other mega rich people. I don't know why though. They seem fine with everything but after a while, they seem to change their minds and become reticent about window cleaning.
I thinks its jealousy. They work out how much your making and; the origional, 'ahh give the scrubber a job' attidtude changes when they realise that your making money out of them and doing quite nicley thanks very much.
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I've lost count how many times I think I've scored a really good job only to get the run around after a good few months or sometimes less.
The last one was a £12 000 000 place. Believe it or not, it only had 5 rooms but to give an idea of size, you could have built a 2 bedroom modern house in the hallway. It was a converted old barn with bits added in an acre of landscaped gardens that was nearly a mile down a windy pot holed single track road. These people were the other side of millionaires. The husband owned a well known company that makes toasters, kettles, coffee machines and the like.
It took two of us a knackering 7 or 8 hour day to do the insides and out and these were all easy to get to windows and no ornaments to work around when doing the insides.
To start with the lady was more than happy. She was so pleased to have her windows clean. After about 6 or 7 cleans, the lady started the 'not tomorrow' routine, then it changed to 'not this month'. I kept asking her if she actually wanted her windows cleaned and she kept saying she did, but 'not this month'. In the end, I just simply asked straight, did she want me to call again and she sort of said no, not really, so I didn't.
I've had exactly the same thing happen with other mega rich people. I don't know why though. They seem fine with everything but after a while, they seem to change their minds and become reticent about window cleaning.
I thinks its jealousy. They work out how much your making and; the origional, 'ahh give the scrubber a job' attidtude changes when they realise that your making money out of them and doing quite nicley thanks very much.
Yep complete jealousy. They live in a 12 million house, but jealous of the window cleaner. I see where your coming from ::)roll
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With Johnny B on this one.
There's a flip side to "good" customers. When they are worth 4K a year, if they cancel half the time, it's still worth 2K. So for some, that's worth the hassle of cancelation. The real down side for me would be, that's a good chunk of work to lose over night if he changes firms.
When I was new to this game, I chased the big jobs like hopitals and schools. You only get the jobs on price, and if they drop you, you've got problems finding like jobs in a short time.
When you have domestics as 90% of your work, this can't happen. Easy to replace a 10 quid job in under a hour.
Dannymack will already know this. He can obviously handle the hassle. Rather you guys than me. I'll stick to cleaning Mrs Smith's windows. I'm nearly ready to go semi retired now anyway. 8)
Of course, they can actually cost you money too. Because the job is due, you may not have other work lined up to fill that slot if they cancel at short notice. OK, so usually you can move on to the next due jobs. But what if some of them require pre-notification that you haven't given because you thought you were going to be working for the short notice canceller?
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>Pole King
I said one big egg in your basket. If you have several then you aren't likely to lose them all in one go.
It's known as Marks and Spencer syndrome.
Let's say my Mrs. makes/sources a nice little item and buys/makes a hundred and sell them to shops and it goes well and she makes a pin money job out of it.
Then it picks up and she shows it to some big boys and M&S say yes please but we want ten thousand a month.
So Mrs. tools up, I give up work, we borrow against the house, employ, work long hours - we buy a little unit and off we go. A year later, two years later M&S either want to pay half or drop you all together.
Bye bye unit, job, car and the house which secured the borrowing ...
A few good eggs is fine; one biggun - a liability.
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>Pole King
I said one big egg in your basket. If you have several then you aren't likely to lose them all in one go.
It's known as Marks and Spencer syndrome.
Let's say my Mrs. makes/sources a nice little item and buys/makes a hundred and sell them to shops and it goes well and she makes a pin money job out of it.
Then it picks up and she shows it to some big boys and M&S say yes please but we want ten thousand a month.
So Mrs. tools up, I give up work, we borrow against the house, employ, work long hours - we buy a little unit and off we go. A year later, two years later M&S either want to pay half or drop you all together.
Bye bye unit, job, car and the house which secured the borrowing ...
A few good eggs is fine; one biggun - a liability.
I get what you mean but I still stand by one big egg can be good too.
Depends on how work is erm...worked.
I pay myself a set ammount each month. Regardless of how much I've earned that month.
If a bigun comes in, great! The money builds up in the business acct.
if they dump/get dumped, it's irritating but has no immediate effect on my life.
Pretty soon, the work lost will be made up.
I appreciate this isn't a blanket way of working but it works for me.
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I'm normally totally with the regular people but with 4 grand/year potential I would just do the one off so charge more then try and choose a more realistic frequency , maybe 4 monthly or at best 2 monthly if he went on about the weather I would just keep the price higher then it would have been on the regular I find these sort of people need a reason to have it more often the they feel, so charge £8k first clean then £4 second clean ;) don't want it in 4 months not a problem that will be £8k next time lol
A bit different to my £20 houses to £40 next time but still same principles!
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>Pole King
Yep! That last post makes a lot of sense.
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Some customers are like clouds.
Once they are gone it's a beautiful day. ;)