Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: windows_chepstow on March 14, 2006, 04:53:46 pm
-
When I say 'fussy'; how much of a perfectionist are you when cleaning windows?
When Wor Lass and I started window cleaning we were way over the top when it came to being fussy window cleaners.
We didn't have many customers, so we could afford to take the time to do a high-quality job.
Most customer's didn't even bat an eye-lid and I remember one customer sacking me 'cos she was decorating or something.
My point is, you can be too 'fussy' and you get the same amount of 'thanks' if you do a standard clean.
So how fussy are you?
-
I always make sure the window is cleaned well, wipe the edges and wipe down the cills. Some people want me to clean the frames included in the price for cleaning just the windows. But i feel this is being 'over the top'.
-
One of my mottos to customers has always been, "I don't just clean glass, I clean windows." I've stood by that, whatever.
-
What got me thinking about this, is a local window cleaner who I just met last week told me he 'was as fussy as the customer'.
I'm like that.
-
Tosh,
I always clean glass, frames and sills.
a lot of window cleaners dont but it makes all the difference and gets noticed ;)
-
When Wor Lass and I started window cleaning we were way over the top when it came to being fussy window cleaners.
We didn't have many customers, so we could afford to take the time to do a high-quality job.
Yep.... same as.
I think the difference between now and then is that i'm gradually getting a better awareness of where to focus that fuss nowadays. And where not to as well.
The best glass i clean is that 18th/ 19th century glass. The stuff with bubbles and impurities. Don't have to be fussy there at all. Wipe dry no smears. Perfect.
Newer homes (last 15 years) i have to spend longer on. I always have to do a quick once over when i'm done. I used to find this a pain in the arse. But i do charge 20p more per window on those type of jobs than i did 6 months ago.
I am fussy on 1st cleans still, but after that not so much. Though i do guarantee my work to be smear free for a couple of days afterwards.
-
Tosh,
I always clean glass, frames and sills.
a lot of window cleaners dont but it makes all the difference and gets noticed ;)
Pre-WFP, I was sacked by one customer for not cleaning the frames; but on the whole, I don't think it matters.
If you've got a fussy customer; you generally know; so you can make a bigger effort (if you want to) for him/her; but in general, a clean window and sill is enough; unless you routinely charge higher prices for frames too.
-
always clean glass, frames and sills.
a lot of window cleaners dont but it makes all the difference and gets noticed
too right, happy customers mean a lot when another WC comes touting for business
JohnL
-
I was taught by Ian to do windows and clean sills.
Anything else is extra charge.
Customers are fussy about sills.
Generally the older folks too.
-
hi chaps. before i switched to wfp i always tryed to keep heads clean & the cills were a must.
im fussy so the way i look at it if a window cleaner did mine & charged me would i be happy, ???, if yes thats good enough 4 me. ;D
-
always clean glass, frames and sills.
a lot of window cleaners dont but it makes all the difference and gets noticed
too right, happy customers mean a lot when another WC comes touting for business
JohnL
Do you not think there's more to keeping customers than purely producing a high-standard of work? I think that building up a good rapport with the customer is Number 1 priority.
A window cleaner I know was told by one of his cutomers that his neighbor no longer wanted his window cleaning services, but kept him on anyway; because he seemed such a 'nice guy'.
Now had this 'nice guy' cleaned all the frames etc, but didn't build up the rapport he had with the customer who didn't want a window cleaner; then he'd've been sacked.
I'm not knocking you 'fussy' guys; good on you; you're better window cleaners than me.
But you're not going to be knocking out four-houses an hour like young Leekson!
So is the maths worth it...
1. Time spent working longer on a window, on stuff that may not even be noticed; is that worth the loss of income?
Or
2. Clean the glass only; then move on; risking the loss of the odd customer here and there (remembering it's easier to find customers than for customers to find window cleaners)?
From a business point of view, once your established, I think Number two makes more sense.
-
i am a fussy window cleaner, i do clean the frames and doors and although the first clean is a pain and can take ages all you do to keep the frames looking clean is a quick wipe with a damp scrim. not a lot more effect and more money for me.
although i've been in this game for nearly 2years i've just started up on my own and have put out about 500 leaflets, you'll be surpised how many people will sack they window cleaner for not doing their frames.
-
Agreed Tosh, as long a standards don't tail off.
I've got to stop myself sometimes, as I'm too quick for my own good.
It's easy to get slack, but there's no point wasting time, better to chance it! :D
-
It`s a good one this.
I`m probably too fussy...... or then am I too cheap?
I would say both :'(.
But, there`s nothing wrong with being cheap or dear. It all depends on the job and time it takes.
Gerry.
-
you'll be surpised how many people will sack they window cleaner for not doing their frames.
I have to disagree here. I've only had one customer in three years 'sack me' for not doing their frames.
Thinking about all the frames I haven't cleaned (pre-WFP); this loss of one customer was certainly worth it.
-
Hi Tosh
yes I agree with most of what you say but would add a successful business is one that has all its attributes in the 'good' class ie workmanship, quality, customer awareness, service - etc etc etc
however I am not sure if its wise to let the standard of quality be lowered because of speed and where I come from customers are pretty hard to come by purely because I am in a very very rural area working on buildings that take a time just moving around but I have already found a good job done is a good customer won.
JohnL
-
I have always cleaned windows as if the customer is watching me! but that dose not mean slowly. If you put the time in on the intial clean the the customer will check the work and be happy, all subsequent cleans will be easy and faster! but just as good!
Customer then recomends you to all her friends you get rich!
happy days!
Steve
-
I think the key is "customer awareness".
If the customer wants the frames cleaned and is charged for them, then they should be cleaned.
If not,quicker job- cheaper price.
The make-up of your round is also relevant. It`s not practical to do a lot of cheaper,quicker jobs on a round like JohnL`s.
Gerry.
-
you'll be surpised how many people will sack they window cleaner for not doing their frames.
I have to disagree here. I've only had one customer in three years 'sack me' for not doing their frames.
Thinking about all the frames I haven't cleaned (pre-WFP); this loss of one customer was certainly worth it.
maybe you were lucky, from my 500 or so leaflets i've had about 8 phone calls asking for quotes saying they already have a w/c but they don't do the frames and they feel that it should be part of the job. i don't like taking business from other so i quoted pretty high thinking that i wouldn't get it but 3 said yes. don't know bout you but if i had spent all the money on nice shinny white upvc that costs 000's i'd want it cleaned. if you don't clean it it staines.
-
[
Do you not think there's more to keeping customers than purely producing a high-standard of work? I think that building up a good rapport with the customer is Number 1 priority.
A window cleaner I know was told by one of his cutomers that his neighbor no longer wanted his window cleaning services, but kept him on anyway; because he seemed such a 'nice guy'.
Sales training manuals usually say, "25% Product, 75% Personality" is what people buy.
-
[
Do you not think there's more to keeping customers than purely producing a high-standard of work? I think that building up a good rapport with the customer is Number 1 priority.
A window cleaner I know was told by one of his cutomers that his neighbor no longer wanted his window cleaning services, but kept him on anyway; because he seemed such a 'nice guy'.
Sales training manuals usually say, "25% Product, 75% Personality" is what people buy.
PJ,
Exactly what I was thinking!
An old adage is 'work smarter; not harder'.
You've hit the nail on the head!
-
I'm with pj
i clean windows not just glass and get good prices for this too, come on, it takes no time at all to wipe frame over and keeps them looking good. I i actually do this first so i have already wiped any edge water away making cleaning the glass quicker
cheers simb0
-
To be fair that's true about it being a small job doing the frames, but I'd still want something for it.
It only takes seconds to do it after the first clean.
I've got a bunch of houses I do at £7 in a village estate.
They take roughly 15 mins each.
One of them asked for frames and said an extra £1.50.
Now most people will ask a lot more, but there's no need to rip customers off...
Instead of 15 mins, this house takes about 17 (neither here nor there),
so it's the best earner in the bunch. :)
-
squeeky
i charge £10 for average semi have right from the start this time last year and only look at doing 2 per hour more if closer together but that takes time, i do other work also but windows grow on thier own slowly get less work but better price you won't end up resenting it
cheers simb0
-
Tosh,
I always clean glass, frames and sills.
a lot of window cleaners dont but it makes all the difference and gets noticed ;)
Are we all missing something here its called taking pride in your work !
-
I think the more we try to please customers the more they will expect, when I first started window cleaning as far as I was concerned nobody was doing any detailing it was glass and sill only, if anyone said anything about the lines down the side we would just say cant be helped with upvc which was excepted, I never lost any customers except my very first job. This time around everyone expects you to detail, and now theres talk of whether the frames should be cleaned as well :o seems like some are trying to do more than whats required ??? around here people expect the glass to be cleaned and some are fussy about the sill but I always do them anyway If I do get a customer who asks about the frames then its always made clear that its an extra at extra cost. brings me to the question shoud I offer to clean the frames at extra cost before I switch to WFP ;D ;D ;D
-
when I was trad, I cleaned pvc frames whenever they looked grotty. That was for my own satisfaction. If they were prepared to pay for it I would detail with a cotton bud dipped in meths. But most of them don't want to pay do they? If I take my car to a car wash I don't expect it to be valeted.
I knew a bloke who was too mean to buy scrim, he use bar towels. I used to think how the hell does he get away with his poor standard of work. He got away with it because he had customers that would accept it. I don't know how many he lost along the way, but he ended up with a round full of non fussy customers.
Ive been WFP since last August. If the frames look clean I leave them and just do the glass. I am not getting any complaints about WFP cleans, I'm not going up the ladder to check on them either. I'm waiting for the day when someone starts complaining, when they do I'll slow down a bit and review my technique. Till then, Tallyho. Dai
-
I did some tinted windows on a factory on saturday, unlike normal windows these show up all the dirt and bits of dust that is still left on and believe it or not I have realised that I have not been spending enough time on the windows, so now I have since purchased a more powerful pump and do rinse of a lot more
-
I spent years being too fussy having said that it got me a good reputation and a lot of work 8)
The last year and a half i have cut down on detailing but i always make sure i do the sills i find its that, that keeps the customer happy. ;)
Its also down to how fussy your customer is i have had them come out to complain about a little speck on the glass some will just try it on ::)
I know of some window cleaners that dont wipe sills and miss toilet windows they are the ones that get us a bad name >:(
Brett
-
:)i only do glass and cills frames are extra never lost customer through not cleaning frames tell them if they want done will be extra one lady not my customer told me her w c charged her £50 for frames i charge double the clean also if they have had painting done charge for cleaning of paint spots ;)
-
Dai
. . . If I take my car to a car wash I don't expect it to be valeted. . .
but would you feel you had value if the car washer didnt clean your windscreen or rear window as a lot of old sloppy car washers dont?
JohnL
-
Yes, I must say, over the years, how many customers have said, as they come to the door to pay, "Oh It looks like rain! O well at least the window sills will stay clean."
But I have discovered something new with wfp.
The glass stays clean after the rain. I wouldn't know, I don't waste my time going back to check. But they have started telling me this next time I'm round.
-
Always do the cills - it's more important than the glass!
-
you'll be surpised how many people will sack they window cleaner for not doing their frames.
I have to disagree here. I've only had one customer in three years 'sack me' for not doing their frames.
Thinking about all the frames I haven't cleaned (pre-WFP); this loss of one customer was certainly worth it.
With trad methods, I always made it clear that a full frame clean was an extra charge. However, I often wiped bad bits that were bugging me if it came off easily. Anything I put there (such as liquid on the sills etc) I would wipe off. Obviously things are a bit different now I'm on WFP.
-
On all trad jobs i only ever clean the glass, anything else is an extra.
Only ever been sacked by 2 customers in 16 years for not doing cills and this was on a housing assosiaition estate where they had just replaced all the wooden frames with u.p.v.c frames.
Both customers asked that i start wiping there cills, i told them that i dident wipe them when they were wooden, so if they wanted them wiping they would have to pay for it, they dident want to pay. they wanted extra work for the same price, so we parted company.
Cheers Jeff
-
With trad methods, I always made it clear that a full frame clean was an extra charge. However, I often wiped bad bits that were bugging me if it came off easily. Anything I put there (such as liquid on the sills etc) I would wipe off. Obviously things are a bit different now I'm on WFP.
That pretty much sums up what I was trying to say Shiner. :)
I will wipe a bit of muck off a frame if it detracts from the job I've done.
-
So what's the verdict?
The general feeling I get from this thread is that you don't have to be overly fussy to keep your customers happy with your services.
I also hear what Marcus said about taking pride in your work; but I think I'd rather take more money home. I can't 'afford' too much pride at the moment; maybe later when I've paid a few things off.
Anyway, the feed-back I'm getting is that personality and service are major contributing factors to keeping your customers happy. Just little things, but they count for a lot. I'm not saying all my customers 'love' or even like me; some are neutral and stand-offish. I turn up, clean their windows, pass pleasantries, get paid, and depart.
Others think I'm the best thing since sliced-bread.
So to conclude, before I start another 'WFP versus ladders thread' (not ladders versus squeegie; I use a squeegie every day on the majority of my accounts , would you generally agree that personality and service are major factors in keeping your customer's happy, and pristine windows and frames are important; but of secondary importance; as long as the standard of cleanliness is good; albiet not perfect?
-
Yes I would agree with that Tosh.
You tend to get a lot of "They're fine, that's a lot better".
Even if you're not entirely happy with it yourself. :-\
I wonder, if I wasn't so cheery-chatty, would I have had more complaints over the years?
I think my customers don't want to disappoint me! :D
-
I agree with Tosh`s summary but I also think some people will tolerate any window cleaner rather than have none at all. Especially in areas where they can`t get another one.
Some are just not bothered at all and I can imagine their reaction to this site ;D.
Gerry.
-
Ive only been window cleaning for a year but decided when i started that i would always quote a price including frames, sills and doors. It costs people a bit more but they are really grateful when youve done the first clean and they see the difference with their frames, sills and doors. Not had any problems so far...only lost one customer... she was rubbish at paying anyway!!!!!!
BRING ON THE SUMMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
-
But you're not going to be knocking out four-houses an hour like young Leekson!
So is the maths worth it...
1. Time spent working longer on a window, on stuff that may not even be noticed; is that worth the loss of income?
Or
2. Clean the glass only; then move on; risking the loss of the odd customer here and there (remembering it's easier to find customers than for customers to find window cleaners)?
From a business point of view, once your established, I think Number two makes more sense.
Alright Tosh, am sure your right. You know your round. But there is a 3rd way.
By maximising your potential earnings from each customer.
If you could only get half of your 300 customers to pay an extra £1 for frames cleaned then that is an extra £1800 per year, for not moving or travelling. As you are cleaning WFP you are doing it anyway. Get a mini pole for your mrs and all windows will have their frames cleaned anyway. It seems a very profitable add on for what is very little extra work after the 1st clean.
mark