Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: AJCleaningServices on February 28, 2006, 10:56:31 pm
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Rotovac - your opinions for a newbie,
Many thanks,
Arthur
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Where is the box to tick if you dont think it is a good piece of equipment? Best, Dave.
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Where is the box to tick if you dont think it is a good piece of equipment? Best, Dave.
Oops, ::) realised about that mistake just after posting the poll, cannot edit it.
However, you can post here any of your comments. Do you think it is not a good machine, or the are better?
Kind regards,
Arthur
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A lot of people use a Sebbo Duo or Host type machine to aggitate do you think this does a better job than a Rotovac or Power Brush,
or is it just an option that gives you the option to Clean Dry if required.
Ill be honest I was and still may buy The extracta Scrubba that was for sale and then I started reading that people had them, hardly used them etc.
So back to Sebbo Duo
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Arthur consider the extracta scrubba if you must as extracta on your doorstep if things go wrong but I find a wand is all you need most of the time
Your red & white friend ;)
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Arthur consider the extracta scrubba if you must as extracta on your doorstep if things go wrong but I find a wand is all you need most of the time
Your red & white friend ;)
Thanks for your advice Steve :)
I would not buy anything before visiting Carpex exhibition and Extracta, which is just across the rive Tyne ;). I like posting polls, as this forum is the best place to ask people opinions regarding virtually anything to do with cleaning.
Kind regards,
Arthur
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ian,
because i recently raised my prices (not by much) i have got my dads scrubber out of the shed, like you say its not been used much because a wands so much quicker, and thats all ive ever really known, but if you have a good price on a job so dont mind taking your time, they really will do a good job, and its great having one on the van, if you come across a real trashed carpet, you first think to yourself, il get the scrubber on that! and are glad you have it.
It raises the capabilities of a portable machine!! ;D
my opinion, get one.
craig
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Hi Arthur,
We got the Rotovac last year as part of the package with advantage but at that time I was cleaning by myself and found it heavy to get into kangoo van.However now that Adam is working with me we use it all the time, and it gives very good results.Previously I was happy using the wand but now it rarely leaves the van ;D
Also Adam spoke to John Flynn last week and got some good advice regarding the Rotovac and carpet cleaning in general, thanks John ;) ;D
This is a picture of the college we cleaned during christmas.
Thanks Barbara
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is a rotavac better than a power scrubb!!??
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The ROTOVAC is the DOG TESTICLES !!!
I used it ALL the time ;D ;D ;D
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The ROTOVAC is the DOG TESTICLES !!!
I used it ALL the time ;D ;D ;D
John ;D what did you use ::) ROTOVAC or DOG's TESTICLES, or both? ??? I am confused ;D
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I'll just go and check with dog before Mrs takes him to show in Cardiff!!
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;D ;D
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Dave,
Where is the box to tick if you dont think it is a good piece of equipment? Best, Dave.
and another post (http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=18086.0#msg131638)
…I dont use a roary machine, well having said that I do clean area rugs with them because I clean by total immersion and then use a floor machine....But on carpeting I would never use a rotary machine for many reasons but not on this thread...... Best, Dave.
Could you post your comments here about rotary machines, like Rotovac and/or HydroMaster etc…?
Arthur, I use a Steamway wand which has an internal single fan jet. It is a very good wand arguably the best scrub wand you can get....
Have you heard / seen / tried CFR’s “Wonder Wand”? Any comments?
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, most of the people that I deal with to the enth degree search and search again for the best type of cleaning for carpeting and or any other textile. At this point please note I am not knocking any other system but, as we are all aware of there are a lot of manufacturing companies that only, recommend hwe and inparticular truck mounted units.......Also the suppliers and manufacturers of carpet tiles only recommend hwe to clean the tiles. Now I know there are a lot of people on here that clean tiles with a different system and I understand they do get good results, however it doesnt alter the fact that the tile company's again only recommend hwe. If you apply to maintain the tiles on the suppliers behalf you can not use anything else but what they recommend. With regards rotary machines on carpeting..... In California where I use to work and indeed still have the business there I use to clean for a certain carpet company and they said that if I used a rotary on their carpets it would void any warranty that they supplied with the carpet. I dont know for certain how many other company's suggest this but I know of a few and accordingly clean as to their stipulations. As you know I clean hideously expensive carpets and those suppliers also say not to use any type of rotary machine on them...... With regards CFR, I tried in the US and also over here to have a clean off with my machine against theirs and to this date they havent accepted the "challenge" so to speak. I am always open to discussion with any company and I would like to see a CFR machine and Hot/Dry Fusion machine under test conditions but again as I said before they arent interested in doing so.. ....I am always biased to my machine and the way I do things as we all should but it does make you wonder why they wont try to sell their machines to me. I am confident of what the out come would be in a clean off, maybe they feel the same way (about my machine) and so show no interest. Again does make you wonder. Best and always nice talking to you, Dave.
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Liahona
What machine do you use?
Fibresafe
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Fibresafe, I use a "Powermatic Legacy 2100" from Steamway and also use thier portables although it has been tweaked a little so it is not standard. I also have a machine from Alltec and I am not knocking it but it doesnt compare in anyway. It is very small though so perfect for upholstery or large amounts of spotting. I do have a heated spotting machine but as I said if it is a lot of spotting then the Altec machine is perfect. My portable weighs 185 pounds so I obviously dont lug it around for spotting. Best, Dave.
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Where is the box to tick if you dont think it is a good piece of equipment?
Dave,
You still have not said why you think it is not a good peace of equipment… C’mon make your case. ;) I should say however, that DriMaster looks much more better to me than Rotovac, however its still a rotary machine.
… please note I am not knocking any other system but, as we are all aware of there are a lot of manufacturing companies that only, recommend hwe and inparticular truck mounted units...
I have not cleaned a single carpet yet, but let me disagree. Although carpet manufacturing companies make carpets, they do not make products to look after their carpets and probably do not follow or do not bother to follow the progress in the cleaning sector...
… With regards rotary machines on carpeting..... In California where I use to work and indeed still have the business there I use to clean for a certain carpet company and they said that if I used a rotary on their carpets it would void any warranty that they supplied with the carpet. I dont know for certain how many other company's suggest this but I know of a few and accordingly clean as to their stipulations. As you know I clean hideously expensive carpets and those suppliers also say not to use any type of rotary machine on them…
Again I think that carpet manufacturing companies do not understand and propably do not care to learn about the new ways of cleaning carpets. HydroMaster representative told me at CARPEX show that DriMaster does not require more than 300psi.
…I am always biased to my machine and the way I do things as we all should but it does make you wonder why they wont try to sell their machines to me. I am confident of what the out come would be in a clean off, maybe they feel the same way (about my machine) and so show no interest. Again does make you wonder…
Dave, I have never cleaned a single carpet, but I think, that your trackmount and the wand you use does not stand a chance against an average trackmount (CFR may do as well) and DriMaster…
I may call you for a challenge when I buy my CFR and DriMaster ;)
Best regards,
Arthur
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Arthur. I feel my last post was self explainatory but anyway....... Its not so much that it is a bad machine just that it is of no use to me or the carpets that I clean for reasons that I have explained..... With regards carpet manufacturers.. whether they follow up or not with the cleaning of their carpets doesnt alter the fact that they only recommend hwe and not with any rotary machine, neither do carpet tile manufacturers, again if you ask them how to clean their tiles they will give you information on hwe and not rotary machines... your comment that they dont understand cleaning is rebuted in that they do and have looked into it and that is why they recommend hwe...... I am a little bit surprised of your comment on my machine when you arent aware of it and what it does but thats ok... as to a clean off with you and your machines, not a problem but...... as you havent cleaned carpet yet you might want to do so first and I will wait till you have a litle bit more experience... this is not to put you off doing it now as I will if you will so to speak just think you might be able to offer more if you have that little bit more experience. For the record CFR have always declined to put their machines against mine so I suggest you find out a little more of what your machine can do before you put it against mine. ...A lot of cleaners use many different ways to clean and I am sure all with good results however it still doesnt alter the fact that "carpet" suppliers and manufacturers and generally most people still suggest the best way to clean carpeting is with hwe.... If I used any other system I wouldnt get the work that I do, that alone will always have me clean the way I do. To change what I do and then charge maybe only 50p a foot is a huge step backwards for me and one I am not prepared to take. My last comment and it is as old as the hills.... how many people upgrade from truck mount to any other type of cleaning??? I am not saying there isnt a place for all types, just not for me, best, Dave.
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Dave,
My call for a challenge was a jock ;), I hope that no offence was caused to you and your machine.
… With regards carpet manufacturers.. whether they follow up or not with the cleaning of their carpets doesnt alter the fact that they only recommend hwe and not with any rotary machine, neither do carpet tile manufacturers, again if you ask them how to clean their tiles they will give you information on hwe and not rotary machines...
Speaking seriously, I found it hard to believe that carpet manufacturers would not recommend DriMaster.
…your comment that they dont understand cleaning is rebuted in that they do and have looked into it and that is why they recommend hwe...
May I ask you Dave if you can refer to any web-link or document, as I would love to study their reasons.
... I am a little bit surprised of your comment on my machine when you arent aware of it and what it does but thats ok... as to a clean off with you and your machines, not a problem but...... as you havent cleaned carpet yet you might want to do so first and I will wait till you have a litle bit more experience... this is not to put you off doing it now as I will if you will so to speak just think you might be able to offer more if you have that little bit more experience...
As I have already said that my call for a chalege was a jock, however, could you set criteria upon which you would like your machine to be chalenged.
… My last comment and it is as old as the hills.... how many people upgrade from truck mount to any other type of cleaning???
Good point!
Kind regards,
Arthur
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Although the drimaster is working on a rotary principle it is still HWE so it does come under recomended use.
Goron
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I think the same, Gordon.
I have red comments here that Drimaster can deliver superb result under 300 psi, so to my understanding it is a kind of gentle gigant…
Regards,
Arthur
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Goron, you are right in that the Drimaster is a form of hwe but as far as I know that it is rotary it is still not recomended but that is what I think again I dont know. With regards using it I wouldnt for reasons I have explained before, I get paid to well to use a Drimaster and have to do "normal" work again................................... Arthur I dont take offence at anyone particularly yourself as you are generally asking on things you need an answer too not to cause an argument....... with regards your comment on Drimaster, see above................ I will send you an e-mail as to clean off stipulations to save maybe causing a riot on here................... I am not into computers too much and wouldnt know how to send you to where but I am sure someone else on here knows how too. Other than that just look on Shaw's web site where they recommend hwe.....Interface Tiles also recommend hwe, as do Collins and Aikman, as do Tandus.............. The fact that between these companies they provide, I think so dont quote me on it, over 60% of carpeting through out the world then that would suggest that most cleaning should be hwe. There are company's that dont recommend any type over another and that used to be about 20%...... at this point we are at 80%.......With only 20% left, there to my knowledge is still no company that suggests any other type of cleaning other than hwe........ Just as a talking point lets say these 20% of company's suggested any form of cleaning other than hwe extraction and to say the obvious that would leave 2 in 10 customers...... The fact that most people dont even clean their carpets then it will always be easier to find a customer with hwe as your arsenal....... When comapany's over here start to do as they do in the U.S....... suggest to the public to have their carpets cleaned at least once a year and by hwe then life will be so much easier for us as cleaners, as the public will know they should clean their carpets and also how they should be cleaned..... It is always open to debate which is a good thing but again, let me know of any supplier or manufacturer that recommends any other form of cleaning other than hwe and I will by all means listen to their argument, till then I shall clean as requested to with hwe...... If all machines cost the same amount of money, what do you think would sell the most and be honest. I know we all need different machines for spotting and upholstery but I think you know the idea of my question..... Best, Dave....
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Dave I have just looked at Show's website (http://www.shawfloors.com/FloorCare/CarpetCare/CarpetOverallCleaning.asp). They do recommend HWE, but they do not object to rotary machines, what the do say is that it is important not to over wet the carpet. DriMaster (HWE system) user will leave carpet dryer than any wand user. Now I bet you will buy one soon. ;)
Best regards,
Arthur
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I am glad you looked up the info so you now know why most cleaners use hwe. I have nothing against the Drimaster but for reasons I have explained before I wouldnt buy one. Best, Dave. P.S. Would you really want to put the Drimaster on a £500 a yard carpet and run the risk of ruining it. Bearing in mind that insurance would not cover it, I wouldnt either.......
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hi barbara of cleanest carpets looked at the photo of the carpet and i do not want to sound as though i am critical as i am not. is this the normal finish of a rotovac as i use a rdm and find i do not get the pattern that your machine has created. regards pete
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...Would you really want to put the Drimaster on a £500 a yard carpet and run the risk of ruining it...
Dave, I have to admit I have never seen a £500 a yard carpet…
I do not know why it would be so expensive. Could you say is it an exclusive design or do they use very expensive materials to make it?
And how do you supposed to look after a £500 a yard carpet, can you hoover it or Sebo would tear it to pieces?
Do you aggitate a £500 a yard carpet, if yes how, what do you use?
Regards,
Arthur
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toothbrush ;D
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Arthur, I dont vacuum the carpets before I clean as this is done in house and these vacuums are either center vacuums or at least suction only.... therefore you are correct, I wouldnt use a sebo or a hoover.... .... A lot of what I clean is just wool but some are blends of silks and wool and some are just all silk which are a little bit more expensive...... On the whole the carpets probably arent worth the 4 or 500 that is spent on them however the market dictates that amount of monies and accordingly the people pay the amount asked for...... No I dont aggitate in anyway on this type of carpeting but having said that I dont agitate any carpet........ To the design question, yes some of the designs are exclusive which of course creates a very high price........ some of what I clean is hundred of years old and would be difficult to replace and consequently can be priced at thousands for only a few yards of carpeting......... Maybe now you can understand why I wouldnt put any rotary type of machine on these textiles. Hope this helps in answer to your questions but feel free to keep them coming....... Also maybe you can now understand why I clean how I do so as to keep these type of customers......... Although meant tounge in cheek I am sure but as far as the tooth brush goes....... they are usually nylon and very hard and would damage the pile/face fiber so no I wouldnt use one. Having said that they are and can be used around the edges with care. As always, best, Dave.
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Dave,
Thank you for your post, interesting, in particular about using toothbrush around the edges… ;) I bet you have given it a try.
... A lot of what I clean is just wool but some are blends of silks and wool and some are just all silk which are a little bit more expensive...
... No I dont aggitate in anyway on this type of carpeting but having said that I dont agitate any carpet...
Could you tell what your techniques are for the above ::) if it is not a secrete?
...some of what I clean is hundred of years old and would be difficult to replace and consequently can be priced at thousands for only a few yards of carpeting...
Maybe now you can understand why I wouldnt put any rotary type of machine on these textiles...
Do you clean antique carpets using HWE method?
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, I pretty much use hwe on most cleanings but you have to bear in mind appying a solution with a pipette and using an airline vacuum is still hwe. Sometimes I will use various forms of alcohol as the "water" but this is at room temperature so of course not hot....... Some antiques I will just use an airline to extract what I can in the dry state and may not use any moisture to clean with at all. ........Some textiles I put in a tumbler machine with solvent impregnated sawdust to do the cleaning for me. Then as I remove the sawdust I remove the soils too......... I dont have any secrets about what I do. The main difference in what I do is that it takes sometimes forever to complete certain jobs. Accordingly I charge a lot more for what I do........you also need a lot of patience which fortunately I have........ Linen carpets can take forever to do as you have to or should, hand brush each wand stroke with cotton rags or synthetic shammies...... I have tried to cover the wand head with the same but never works as well...... Lastly, yes I have used a tooth brush many a time.... Best, Dave.
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if everyone would please download the free google toolbar, it has a spell-check in it that really works!! i like to read the forum replies not decipher them.
colin
ps it does make me laff!
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thanks for information it works.
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surly deciferin is part of the funn
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I always use spell check otherwise no one here would understand me :-[
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Dave,
RE: your wand, the best wand in the world you said, did you not...
At what PSI do you normally work?
How much water do you recover from the carpet?
What average drying time can you deliver?
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, I think I said arguably the best wand, but to date I havent found a better one........ PSI depends on what I am cleaning, normally I will use between 4 and 500...... Linens much lower as for silks and needle point carpets too...... Not sure how to answer how much water that I recover, more than most maybe, not as much as others???? again dont know how to answer the question.... Same with your question on drying times. If I left an inch thick wool carpet to dry on its own then it would take forever and that goes for any wet system, that is why I use air movers and sometimes de-hu's as well. An 1800 knot per square inch silk carpet needs to be forced dried too as does a 3200 knot rug and 6400, get the idea???? When I clean larger properties of maybe 30 or 40,000 square feet of carpet then at the end of each day most all that I had cleaned in the morning would be dry. What I leave behind wet would soon be dry as I would leave air movers as mentioned before. I suppose in some sort of answer, I force dry almost everything that I clean....... I know this doesnt really answer your questions but they cant really be answered can they? Best, Dave...... For what its worth most techs have their own reasons for liking or disliking what they may or may not use accordingly. Having said that the wand that I use still has the highest spec on it for performance and heat retention. To my limited knowledge it is still unique in its design and I am sure it has a patent on it so it cant be copied but of that I dont know for certain....
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...Not sure how to answer how much water that I recover...
Dave, let me put it differently:
You have a water and the waist tanks, do not you.
Your water tank had 200 liters (it was not full ;D) You started cleaning an average carpet. After the water finished how many liters of waist would you have? Do not try to by precise, approximately.
Thank you for talking to me!
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, I think I get your question now.. Is it that you want to know the percentage I pick up of what I put down? Havent the foggiest idea. Nor do I care. I would pick up an awful lot more than any portable but also put down more than "most" portables. Again I haven't got a clue and not only that, that I force dry the carpet anyway it doesnt really make the slightest difference. For some reason and I am not sure why I know that you are set on a CFR machine and that you are also interested in the Rotovac. Please please please go on courses and learn about the industry that you talk a lot about of but by self admitance know so little of actually cleaning, then see each machine for their good and bad points and then go and buy a truck mount, as your first arsenal. What else after you may or may not buy is up to you but for first "attack against the soil" get your self a truck mount, or Steve Gunns portable, way better than what it is you seem to desire, best, Dave.
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Dave,
I have already arranged CC curses and would not buy a CC machine before that...
... I would love to challenge you ;D ;D ;D
Kind regards,
Arthur
;)
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But thats my point, if you dont have a machine what are you going to challenge me with?? and for what its worth the machine you so highly talk about..... the manufacturers wont even accept the challenge but anyway, back to the origin of the post, no I dont like Rotovacs.
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...back to the origin of the post, no I dont like Rotovacs...
Neither do I, Dave
I like CFR working with DriMaster.
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, 2 weeks ago you said Rotovav's were the best thing around and you made an offer to someone for £1,000 to buy one ???
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It was sold so I do not think it a good tool, anymore ;D
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I had a look at the rotovac down at alltec a couple of weeks ago,looks like a well built bit of kit,next time im down that way i might even ask for a demo, ive got some special carpet samples in the garage that should give it a trial ;D
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...back to the origin of the post, no I dont like Rotovacs...
Neither do I, Dave
I like CFR working with DriMaster.
Regards,
Arthur
Can you explain what drimaster is please and how it works with a CRF?
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DriMaster is a rotary machine, which uses a lot of water.
If you are a TM user the water supply is not a problem as you have a tank of hundreds of liters in the van. If you are a porty user then I guess you will spend more time refiling your machine instead of cleaning the carpet, unless you have CFR - the only porty I know which uses recycled water.
Hope this explains
Regards,
Arthur
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Using drimaster with CFR is this better than using the wand and if so why?
Arthur
Ps Is drimaster similar to rotovac?
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I visited CFR's stand during the carpex. They said to me that their (patented) wands can recover more water than any other, about 85%. So it is supposed to be a good wand, more info is on the bottom of this page (http://www.amtechuk.biz/cfr_pro500.php)
DriMaster (http://www.hydramaster.co.uk/drimaster.htm) is similar to the Rotovac, but cost more (about £1000 more).
I believe DriMaster is easier to use (comparing to Rotovac, never mind the wand). Using DriMaster you would need less time to finish the job and it delivers a better drying time.
Only you, Arthur, can answer for yourself what is best for you.
Regards,
Arthur
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Craig from Hydramaster told me that when used and set up correctly the rotary drimaster will use no more water than a standard wand running at 300psi. Apparently the reason that they can use more water is because you can see the colour of the water being extracted and thus go over the same area more until the water runs clean!
Never used one though so can't comment on experince!
Cheers Goron
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Gordon,
Peter (carpetclean) (http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=18126.0#msg132001) who has been using DriMaster says it does use more water than a wand.
Regards,
Arthur
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the drimaster can be fitted with a reducer to use less water but still get the same clean. in my humble opinion it is a good tool and well worth the money i now use it with the cfr and dont have to worry about the water flow. i did a pub on wednesday and in 2 hours of continuous use the drimaster and cfr used less than a third of a bucket of water as the recovery was so good and this was on a very thick woolen carpet that was trashed and i had to go over several times in places.
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Hi Carpetclean
I see from your post that you use a Drimaster with your CFR. I am thinking of getting a Rotovac or Drimaster to team up with my CFR400. Do you use an inline heater or, as I do, fill the machine with hot water and carry on until the end of the job, with the recycled water gradually cooling. Also, did you consider a Rotovac before you chose the Drimaster?
Regards Alan.
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tried the drimaster on the 400 and the water lift is not good enough it being one vac . i have the cfr 500 perfect heat upgraded to the 2 x 3 stage vacs which was a wise chioce. regarding the heat i have two heating systems so dont need an inline heater there is a heater built in as well as coils wrapped around the vacx which cool the vacs by capyuring the heat generated and keep the water hot. as i have said on previous posts the loss of water is minimal so can use the machines for hours providing i keep the main filter clean on really trashed carpets
i did consider a rotovac but decided the drimaster was for me and i am glad i made the choice. the drimaster does not require a lot of psi as it can clean just as well with 100 as it can with 500 because of the design and i can go over the same area several times if need be without overwetting as you can with the cfr hand tools which by the way are in my opinion a good tool also. if you want to talk to me i can be contacted on 020 8240 0750 and i will do my best to answer any questions on the subject
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Ive used carpetcleans dri master on a number of occasions and despite what craig at hydromaster says you use loads of water which is why it is a perfect tool for a CFM ( maybe they should team up) i have a drimaster hand tool and used 40ltrs (yes 40) on a 3seater and 2 seater but the fabric dried quicker than anything i cleaned before, also it way a rayon which without a good skill level and technical knowledge you can get in a lot of bother with, also used around 180ltrs on a pub carpet but it was dry in 1 hour!! if you havent tried it then dont comment on it,
NIck
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I have used all three of these type,s of machines rotovac -drimaster -rx20 and i have a rotovac and a rx20 .I think the drimaster is a good cleaning machine but its a bit big to move around rooms with furniture in as is the rx20 .But the rotovac is small enough to do this and it gives you a better clean than a wand also the new brushes are very good and quick at agitating your prespray .So its rotovac 1st and rx20 2nd because you can dry clean with it also and 3rd the drimaster but thats only my opinion des ;D
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des are you sure you are not getting confused as the drimaster is designed for the dpestic market in mind can even clean right up to the edge of sofas if need be and under tables. anyone who went to carpex coud see both machines and see that the drimaster is indedd the smallest of them all
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Mr carpetclean the rotovac is half the size of the hydramaster drimaster .i know because i have used both des p s my company was called carpetclean when i first started but people kept asking if we did 3ps so i changed
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Rotovac is just as heavy as DriMaster. I would never think of rx20 as of a tool for domestic carpet cleaning - too big and heavy.
Regards,
Arthur
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Arthur, perhaps your opinion might be worth something when you have actually used the equipment you talk about and you have cleaned a carpet.
Until then shut the hell up. >:(
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Gary, you should have done this long time ago (http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=18322.120#msg134900) 8) Do not you start it again ;)
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You are an idiot >:(
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lmfco ;D