Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Hard Floor Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Rob Hall on July 06, 2013, 09:26:35 pm
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I have 400sqm of sandstone on a driveway that needs a seal to keep the dust to a minimum. Obviously sandstone is sedimentary and will wear when driven or walked on. Can anyone tell me if they have anything similar to deal with?
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What type of sandstone is it?
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It is a Yorkstone. I will try and get some pictures on later
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New or reclaimed york stone ?Sawn or rough ? If reclaimed were did it come from ..above or below ground?
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Wow...interesting questions.
ok
The surface is rough, not smooth, the surface was made rough by a type of water jet treatment.
I will try and find out if the stone is from under ground, but in the meantime, I am very interested to know what difference it would make to the sealer used?
Thanks so far for your contributions
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If its just rough reclaimed sandstone from say a cellar (underground) or reclamation yard it will require time to dry out once laid before sealing (if you would bother sealing this type of stone). Stone that is "smooth saw" slabs "brand new" will be ok (nearly)straight away although staining can result from pointing.
I ask as i was not really aware of dust or wear issues. Rough stone is usually sort after for it's weathered look..sometimes it's a little "flaky" but thats part of it's appeal.I dont know of any "sealer" that would prevent this happening.
Sealing smooth machined stone is a different job .There are plenty on the market.
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Rob,
Just book it in for a year on year clean and forget the sealing.
Decent York really doesn't need sealing in an outdoor situation IMO
Shouldn't really be getting much dust off of York, you sure it is not Indian?
I clean loads of York year on year without sealers and clients are happy that.
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New or reclaimed york stone ?Sawn or rough ? If reclaimed were did it come from ..above or below ground?
I am not sure this is relevant it is highly unlikely that you would be able to reclaim 400M2 of Yorkstone and even if you did you would not use it on a drive having gone to that expense
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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If its just rough reclaimed sandstone from say a cellar (underground) or reclamation yard it will require time to dry out once laid before sealing (if you would bother sealing this type of stone). Stone that is "smooth saw" slabs "brand new" will be ok (nearly)straight away although staining can result from pointing.
I ask as i was not really aware of dust or wear issues. Rough stone is usually sort after for it's weathered look..sometimes it's a little "flaky" but thats part of it's appeal.I dont know of any "sealer" that would prevent this happening.
Sealing smooth machined stone is a different job .There are plenty on the market.
You could seal it immediately with Aqua Mix Sealers Choice Gold provided the surface was dry
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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New or reclaimed york stone ?Sawn or rough ? If reclaimed were did it come from ..above or below ground?
I am not sure this is relevant it is highly unlikely that you would be able to reclaim 400M2 of Yorkstone and even if you did you would not use it on a drive having gone to that expense
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
Reclaimed york stone is about £ 80 sqm it would be ideal for a period project. Why would you not use it on a driveway?
The Romans used it and it's still fit for purpose years on...and they did not apply Aqua mix!
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BELIEVE ME, IN THIS CASE COST REALLY ISNT AN ISSUE. The stone cost £40,000 and is not worried about ripping it up if we cant find a solution. Your eyes would water if you could see the cars parked on the drive!!
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New or reclaimed york stone ?Sawn or rough ? If reclaimed were did it come from ..above or below ground?
I am not sure this is relevant it is highly unlikely that you would be able to reclaim 400M2 of Yorkstone and even if you did you would not use it on a drive having gone to that expense
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
Reclaimed york stone is about £ 80 sqm it would be ideal for a period project. Why would you not use it on a driveway?
The Romans used it and it's still fit for purpose years on...and they did not apply Aqua mix!
Probably Not Aqua Mix your right they where not that technically advanced so well done for pointing that out, not that it helped the question in hand at all, but they were technically advance to use some protection on tile such as oil.
To robs question a penetrating sealer would be needed depending on what finish they want on the stone will depend on which one is needed for the job. Then depending on conditions of use a suitable maintenance plan would need to be put in place to keep the protection of the stone or in this case dust levels down I would even perhaps look at altering the surface tension of the stone prior to sealing.
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How long ago was this drive laid ???
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It has been down a year now.
Antony, please will you educate me on surface tension?? ;)
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Essentially at what grit the stone is left 60 120 220 400 800 etc where you will have to be careful is not to make it so tight that it start to produce a sheen or shine as obviously by altering the surface tension you alter the grip (slip resistance) in certain conditions.
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New or reclaimed york stone ?Sawn or rough ? If reclaimed were did it come from ..above or below ground?
I am not sure this is relevant it is highly unlikely that you would be able to reclaim 400M2 of Yorkstone and even if you did you would not use it on a drive having gone to that expense
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
Reclaimed york stone is about £ 80 sqm it would be ideal for a period project. Why would you not use it on a driveway?
The Romans used it and it's still fit for purpose years on...and they did not apply Aqua mix!
Chris
The Egyptians built the Sphinx and the Pyramids and didn't seal them either but they have sealed them now. Regarding price I suppose £16k is OK for a driveway. Regarding Aqua Mix I will re-iterate my position for you. Yes we use Aqua Mix all the time because it is the best product bar none we have ever used we used it long before we ever started selling it incidentally. In fact we liked it so much I spent a great deal of time and money persuading the manufacturers to let us import it back into the UK and Europe but the real reasons were selfish because we wanted to continue using the best products in our restoration business. Selling it to others is just an add on to our warehouse inventory. Perhaps you should try it?
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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BELIEVE ME, IN THIS CASE COST REALLY ISNT AN ISSUE. The stone cost £40,000 and is not worried about ripping it up if we cant find a solution. Your eyes would water if you could see the cars parked on the drive!!
Not really Rob, these are the sort of properties we work at day in day out down here in dirty Surrey & London, but all that aside a yearly clean and if they really want it sealing then yes Aqua-Mix would be a good choice, it's all I use on Limestone, and Sandstone if the client wants colour enhanced finish, haven't used it on York, only Lithofin, as that is what my clients have wanted but that's not to say it wouldn't work.
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Here are a couple of photos. You can see the type of surface...(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1373323462_photo-20.JPG)(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1373323468_photo-21.JPG)
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Sandblasted Indian?
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As far away from Indian as you can get. It is from a quarry somewhere near Whitby/Scarborough.
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As far away from Indian as you can get. It is from a quarry somewhere near Whitby/Scarborough.
Rob
That looks like Aislaby stone to me
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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Can't really see it..workingaway at the moment. Looing at it on a scratched sreen on a very old mobile!
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As far away from Indian as you can get. It is from a quarry somewhere near Whitby/Scarborough.
Rob
That looks like Aislaby stone to me
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
Could well be Kevin.
What are your suggestions for keeping the dust down on it?
The client doesnt want a "Slate Seal" type finish.
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Rob
Personally if the client was asking me for advice I would probably:
1. Thoroughly pre wet the stone.
2. Hone the whole surface using a Mono Rotary fitted with a SIC Brush and some 100 grit honing powder.
3. Thoroughly rinse and vacuum.
4. Allow to dry thoroughly
5. Seal the lot with Aqua Mix Enrich n Seal.
This process won't stop the dust because of the vehicle traffic but it will reduce it by about 80% because you will have already got rid of most of the loose bits and pieces with the pre wet and honing process. The surface should have a nice overall appearance aesthetically and the polymers in the penetrating sealer and enhancer will also help a great deal sub surface.
There are sealers out there that bond the surface as well. We have tried them and they are very good in fact they are superb but they are also extremely expensive!
Kev Martin
Marblelife ltd
Tiling logistics Ltd
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Rob
Personally if the client was asking me for advice I would probably:
1. Thoroughly pre wet the stone.
2. Hone the whole surface using a Mono Rotary fitted with a SIC Brush and some 100 grit honing powder.
3. Thoroughly rinse and vacuum.
4. Allow to dry thoroughly
5. Seal the lot with Aqua Mix Enrich n Seal.
This process won't stop the dust because of the vehicle traffic but it will reduce it by about 80% because you will have already got rid of most of the loose bits and pieces with the pre wet and honing process. The surface should have a nice overall appearance aesthetically and the polymers in the penetrating sealer and enhancer will also help a great deal sub surface.
There are sealers out there that bond the surface as well. We have tried them and they are very good in fact they are superb but they are also extremely expensive!
Kev Martin
Marblelife ltd
Tiling logistics Ltd
Thanks Kevin
The expense really isnt an issue. He is willing to replace it (It cost him £40K!!)
Can you advise on other products? What is the smallest enrich & seal that you do, I will try a sample area for him.
Thanks again.
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smallest Enrich N Seal is 473mls but why mess around with a client like that??? Buy a gallon and tell him you are gouing to do a large test area for his assessment that he needs to pay for!
With regards the other product it was used to seal some of the Pyramids and Sphinx in Egypt to stop them crumbling. It is a two part system where you apply an impregnatiing pre sealer and allow it to cure then you add a further sealer that is both topical and impregnating which bonds in three ways, it bonds subsurface, it attachs to any molecules sticking up from the pre sealer and it bonds to the surface. Now whilst it worked very well in both those situations what was not checked was Traffic wear because at the end of the day the most it is going to have is the odd idiot scrambling on it but it certainly isn't going to have cars driving on it. I must also re-iterate I am not using the word EXPENSIVE lightly!
Kev Martin
Marblelife ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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Thanks Kevin. Can you enlighten me on the sealer used for the Sphinx?
Do ou sell it?
If not, who does?
Thanks
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Rob
Now you have prices let me know if the other test doesn't work
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
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Rob
Now you have prices let me know if the other test doesn't work
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd
Samples arrived today Kevin, Thanks. I will let you know how I get on.
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No problem
Kev Martin
Marblelife Ltd
Tiling Logistics Ltd