Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: supernova77 on June 26, 2013, 04:25:57 pm
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Hi All,
I rarely charge extra for first cleans... However I got caught out this week by a "perceived" new regular customer... Take a look at the email conversation below.
I'll be charging more for all first cleans from now on!
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Hi Julia,
I took a look at your windows a little earlier... Exterior window cleaning on an 8 weekly basis would be £25 - This includes all frames and sills... Internal window cleaning would be an additional £35, most customers who have their internal windows cleaned only have them cleaned inside once, maybe twice a year.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Many Thanks,
Andy
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Hi Andy
This sounds great. I would like to go with the eight week phase and twice yearly for the internal ones.
When could you start?
Many thanks
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Hi Julia,
I hope that you were satisfied with the window cleaning carried out yesterday?
Many Thanks,
Andy
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Hi Andy
Yes cleaning was great thanks.
However my partner thought it a bit expensive so we will no longer require you to continue
Many thanks
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Hi Julia
One off cleans are normally 50% more so you got a good deal!
Andy
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::)roll
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What size house are we talking here?? If a semi or terraced then £60 is sky high to charge for inside and out, thre is too much competition out there to be charging prices like that. I know my limits on what i can charge, when i go beyond thats where dropouts and cancalations start apearing which i dont like.
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What size house are we talking here?? If a semi or terraced then £60 is sky high to charge for inside and out, thre is too much competition out there to be charging prices like that. I know my limits on what i can charge, when i go beyond thats where dropouts and cancalations start apearing which i dont like.
This was a 3 bed semi with a small extension and a few skylights...
As you can see she was initially happy with the price - Her partner is from the North, so maybe he is used to lower prices - That might be where the problem lies.
Andy
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next customer please ............... :)
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All part of the game I've learned unfortunately. When I recently started out if tried to go with pricing extra and usually ended up getting looked at like I had two heads lol
Anyone find that it's usually younger age groups who pull these fly moves who claim to want a regular only to be one offs? Same with replacing you with summer ladder boys. I guess when it comes to a toss up between a packet of fAgs or a pint or two, the latter wins with the younger generation.
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Andy i think your price from what said was spot on if i was cheaper it would only be £2-3 pound.
Had similar recently.
woman stopped me in the street, said i'd quote later in the week said £15 front £30 allround even though i didn't get to see back as she was out.
Guessing 5-6 bed detached house with akward front bedroom with old fashioned style balcony.
She called to say go for it allround; then front only on a monthly basis.
Following day got a text from same lady saying her husbands friend is a window cleaner and he was now gonna do it.
P me of the Big house brigade.
Want special treatment most off them and hardest work going.
My favourite work is the £10-£20 range.
If someone has entry gates i run a mile ;D
Got 1 with Entrée vous Gates doing tomorrow, she makes tea ;)
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£25 for 3 bed semi with a small extension?i think it is very expensive!my price would be £15 2 monthly! ;D ;D ;D ;D
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£25 for 3 bed semi with a small extension?i think it is very expensive!my price would be £15 2 monthly! ;D ;D ;D ;D
There are 3 bed semis and 3 bed semis. A newbuild on an estate and it is expensive, but an older one with bay windows........ :-\
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So true.
I'm going on the 1930's 3 bed semi's with 3 bays at front.
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£25 for 3 bed semi with a small extension?i think it is very expensive!my price would be £15 2 monthly!
My minimum charge is £20... The house in question at £25 wasn't expensive based on all my other work - I'm not fussed that I lost it, just annoyed that after all these years as a window cleaner I was still caught out by a one-off merchant.
Andy ;)
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I think £60 to clean a 3bed house in and out is taking the mick unless your lucky like me to clean up eaton square/sw1 sw6 postcodes in london where 4 bed town houses are £200 in and out. Money is no object for these people.
Normal 3bed houses i normally charge £15 or £20 with a conservatory. For a 1 off i wouldnt complain about £60 in the pocket.
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Say to new potential customer would you like regular monthly clean or would you like a one off.
If the answers one off "oh sorry; only do monthlies"; BYE! ;D
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I never worry about charging extra for one offs unless they are out of my cleaning
area.
Gave all the frames a quick wash and rinse including above vents then move on and do
a couple of regulars a few doors up.
Then come back when they have dried and finish the glass, wfp is just as quick on first cleans as it
is on repeat.
This way you never get stung or end up feeling angry all day
to me its all about having a stress free and happy work life.
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£25 for 3 bed semi with a small extension?i think it is very expensive!my price would be £15 2 monthly!
My minimum charge is £20... The house in question at £25 wasn't expensive based on all my other work - I'm not fussed that I lost it, just annoyed that after all these years as a window cleaner I was still caught out by a one-off merchant.
Andy ;)
[/quote
I think the prices quoted are spot on.
There will always be customers who do that, the same as window cleaners who would charge half the price.
There is no right or wrong.
Tony
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I don't think critising the price of the clean is helpful here - the customer accepted the price and the OP is getting work at these rates 8)
With regards to first cleans we charge extra for first cleans - not all the time but the majority of the work. There is also a higher price for 12 and 8 weekly cleans than 4 weekly cleans.
Charging extra for a first clean which, in effect is a bespoke clean covers the extra time taken to bring the property up to scratch and deters the chancers
Sometimes I offer the customer a half price or free clean down the line - say the sixth clean to offset the extra charged on the first clean - this sorts out the wheat from the chaff
Darran
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I never worry about charging extra for one offs unless they are out of my cleaning
area.
Gave all the frames a quick wash and rinse including above vents then move on and do
a couple of regulars a few doors up.
Then come back when they have dried and finish the glass, wfp is just as quick on first cleans as it
is on repeat.
This way you never get stung or end up feeling angry all day
to me its all about having a stress free and happy work life.
This erroneous statement is untrue; especially proven by the bit highlighted in red.
Always charge extra for a first clean is my motto.
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£25 for 3 bed semi with a small extension?i think it is very expensive!my price would be £15 2 monthly!
My minimum charge is £20... The house in question at £25 wasn't expensive based on all my other work - I'm not fussed that I lost it, just annoyed that after all these years as a window cleaner I was still caught out by a one-off merchant.
Andy ;)
I think its impossible to not get caught out now and then andy!? Don't sweat it mate!
George
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I never worry about charging extra for one offs unless they are out of my cleaning
area.
Gave all the frames a quick wash and rinse including above vents then move on and do
a couple of regulars a few doors up.
Then come back when they have dried and finish the glass, wfp is just as quick on first cleans as it
is on repeat.
This way you never get stung or end up feeling angry all day
to me its all about having a stress free and happy work life.
This erroneous statement is untrue; especially proven by the bit highlighted in red.
Always charge extra for a first clean is my motto.
O.k. so you lose a few minutes going back twice I personally don't need to worry about
a few minutes here or there.
Never had a first clean take me more than 5 mins in extra time but then I suppose that's would be equal
to two three bed semis to you.
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Well John - you obviously aren't doing all your first cleans to a very high standard if they only take five minutes extra. And I hope this post helps the unbiased reader.
However let's assume that your generalisation is true and you are taking five minutes extra.
Let's also take just one of those "3 bed semi's" you mockingly use to illustrate your post at my expense.
A repeat clean 3 bed semi (with two 3 facet bay windows and a bedroom window and a door at the front, a side window and a door plus four windows at the back including a patio door set. Let's say that takes 15 minutes on 4 weekly and 18 minutes on 8 weekly. (typically extra spiders' nests or baked on bird muck and going above the vents from time to time raises the average time on the latter.)
If your extra 5 minutes to clean it is correct then you spend 33% extra time cleaning it. Therefore you can justify charging say £20 instead of £15.
Personally a first clean done thoroughly on my above example would probably take me 25 or 30 minutes because I would want all the spiders nests and filth above the vents got rid of and so I would scrub the whole property top to bottom quickly and thoroughly including the cills and then I would go back to the first top window I did and then go back over the glass.
I would then do the downstairs glass starting with any window not being dripped on from above and then the rest in reverse order.
I happily invest a bit extra in a first clean and charge accordingly. Because unlike you I'm not rushing it in "5 minutes extra" I have time to let it drip without driving back to finish off the glass.
I would charge £25 for a first clean (more or less depending on how filthy it was) and offer 8 weekly at £15/16 or 4 weekly at £13/14.
Then I know I have protected myself against one hit wonders masquerading as regulars.
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5 minutes extra on a first clean? Well on a 2 bed flat maybe if the windows aren't too bad. Generally though a first clean takes me about 50% longer or more. It depends on the state of the frames. If the windows are bad I charge more, but I now have a little more protection as I now state I don't do one offs. I will make an exception for end of tenancy cleans though, but quoted over the phone at at least double or more.
But, that said I got caught out this week. No one is perfect.
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Well John - you obviously aren't doing all your first cleans to a very high standard if they only take five minutes extra. And I hope this post helps the unbiased reader.
However let's assume that your generalisation is true and you are taking five minutes extra.
Let's also take just one of those "3 bed semi's" you mockingly use to illustrate your post at my expense.
A repeat clean 3 bed semi (with two 3 facet bay windows and a bedroom window and a door at the front, a side window and a door plus four windows at the back including a patio door set. Let's say that takes 15 minutes on 4 weekly and 18 minutes on 8 weekly. (typically extra spiders' nests or baked on bird muck and going above the vents from time to time raises the average time on the latter.)
If your extra 5 minutes to clean it is correct then you spend 33% extra time cleaning it. Therefore you can justify charging say £20 instead of £15.
Personally a first clean done thoroughly on my above example would probably take me 25 or 30 minutes because I would want all the spiders nests and filth above the vents got rid of and so I would scrub the whole property top to bottom quickly and thoroughly including the cills and then I would go back to the first top window I did and then go back over the glass.
I would then do the downstairs glass starting with any window not being dripped on from above and then the rest in reverse order.
I happily invest a bit extra in a first clean and charge accordingly. Because unlike you I'm not rushing it in "5 minutes extra" I have time to let it drip without driving back to finish off the glass.
I would charge £25 for a first clean (more or less depending on how filthy it was) and offer 8 weekly at £15/16 or 4 weekly at £13/14.
Then I know I have protected myself against one hit wonders masquerading as regulars.
You see thats where we differ I would take 30 mins on first and repeat cleans.
Im always amazed by guys who rattle round a house in 15 mins who believe that they are protecting
themselves against the competition.
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tbh a first clean will normally take me twice as long as will thoroughly do all the frames / vents then go back to start and do just glass ... if its a big property will do the rears completely before moving onto side and front ... if its a small property will go around whole house doing just frames then again just glass.
The way I see it is you get 1 chance to make a good impression and impress the customer so maybe im ott on first clean however going foward I know the frames are mint so a quick skim every clean is all thats needed.
For about 30 first cleans I get caught by a one off'er so maybe twice a year ? however comes with job but hopefully i would have smelt em so charged extra for 1st clean.
I dont always charge extra for 1st clean unless really minging and suspect a possiblr 1 off'er
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Well John - you obviously aren't doing all your first cleans to a very high standard if they only take five minutes extra. And I hope this post helps the unbiased reader.
However let's assume that your generalisation is true and you are taking five minutes extra.
Let's also take just one of those "3 bed semi's" you mockingly use to illustrate your post at my expense.
A repeat clean 3 bed semi (with two 3 facet bay windows and a bedroom window and a door at the front, a side window and a door plus four windows at the back including a patio door set. Let's say that takes 15 minutes on 4 weekly and 18 minutes on 8 weekly. (typically extra spiders' nests or baked on bird muck and going above the vents from time to time raises the average time on the latter.)
If your extra 5 minutes to clean it is correct then you spend 33% extra time cleaning it. Therefore you can justify charging say £20 instead of £15.
Personally a first clean done thoroughly on my above example would probably take me 25 or 30 minutes because I would want all the spiders nests and filth above the vents got rid of and so I would scrub the whole property top to bottom quickly and thoroughly including the cills and then I would go back to the first top window I did and then go back over the glass.
I would then do the downstairs glass starting with any window not being dripped on from above and then the rest in reverse order.
I happily invest a bit extra in a first clean and charge accordingly. Because unlike you I'm not rushing it in "5 minutes extra" I have time to let it drip without driving back to finish off the glass.
I would charge £25 for a first clean (more or less depending on how filthy it was) and offer 8 weekly at £15/16 or 4 weekly at £13/14.
Then I know I have protected myself against one hit wonders masquerading as regulars.
You see thats where we differ I would take 30 mins on first and repeat cleans.
Im always amazed by guys who rattle round a house in 15 mins who believe that they are protecting
themselves against the competition.
By the way I think if your going to accuse someone of lying then I don't think you can complain
when they retaliate a little by mocking the length of time it takes you to clean a 3 bed semi.
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Who cares. Some people are naturally slow, some are rocket fast. Myself i like to be rocket fast.. Time is money, wfp there is no reason why a 3 bed house should take 30 mins. Even trad it would only be 15 mins. First cleans only take longer if they are realy dirty otherwise its only a few mins more. I have never had problems the way i do it so im guessing i have the right idea.
Id rather clean my 25/30 jobs in a day working fast than only do 15 of them taking my timeto achiev the exact same result.
As for the question charging extra, i tried it ages ago charging more but now the way i see it is that the first clean is the investment, do it good and your onto a winner with a good regular customer, do it bad and its game over.
Proof is in the pudding.
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I think the price is not up for discussion here. I work in the same area as Andy and you can get high prices here. The way to get some commitment in this case is to charge all new first cleans at a higher price, then give a discounted price on the 3 /4 clean.E.G We would charge 30 quid for the first and 25 for every clean there after, on the 4th clean you will get a 5 quid discount as a bonus due to the higher first clean. ;) ;)
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I used to charge a little extra for first cleans but now don't bother. If you charge extra for the first and they don't come up perfect due to the unkept state then you can leave yourself open to the customer saying "I paid the extra". Would rather just blast over them and say there could be the odd run afterwards but this will stop on regular cleans.
I have learnt a lot from other people on here and their experience in trying to see who the time wasters are.
One at the minute is "I need, really neeeeed them done done this week"
Oh is that because its sunny and you've not had them done in a year?
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I charge extra and warn of runs.
Doesn't usually run-just protecting myself.
The thing of saying i'll be a week or two seems to work well to weed out the 1 offer's.
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> John
Where have I accused you of lying?
Your posts contradict themselves; you may give one example and use that to highlight the correctness of your method; you might type in haste and get confused and have a different view to some. You might look at how long a 3 bed semi I described might take to clean and take longer than most experienced wfp users in this thread, you might have a little pithy comment to make at my expense but I would never call you a liar.
...
Edmund Blackadder: Look there's no need to panic. Someone on the forum will know how to do a repeat clean on a semi in about 15 minutes ...
Captain Rum: The forum, milord?
Edmund: Yes, the forum.
Captain Rum: What forum?
Edmund: I understood it was normal window cleaning forum practice to have on board wfp'ers who know how to clean a semi?
Captain Rum: Opinion is divided on the subject.
Edmund: Oh really? (Beginning to realise what he is dealing with...)
Captain Rum: Yaahs! All the other Captains say it is. I say it isn't.
Edmund: Oh no! Mad as a Brush!
(Wibble)
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why not do it a diffent way like us , we charge double for first cleans , tell the customer about the extra time and water and how much hassle it is , keeping them up to date , then tell them after 6 months you will do one clean free giving them there first clean costs back ?
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ALWAYS ALWAYS charge extra for the first clean, I've heard it all before "their not that dirty my husband only did them the other week" then you clean them and they cancel you've got to cover your backside, if they really want a regular cleaner they won't mind paying extra once after all look at the money they have not had to spend having them cleaned before, I price first timers the same as one offs you can't go wrong, a good benchmark of reading the situation is if they won't pay extra for the first time they will probably mess you about as a regular clean, just move on and do another job if that's the case.
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ALWAYS ALWAYS charge extra for the first clean, I've heard it all before "their not that dirty my husband only did them the other week" then you clean them and they cancel you've got to cover your backside, if they really want a regular cleaner they won't mind paying extra once after all look at the money they have not had to spend having them cleaned before, I price first timers the same as one offs you can't go wrong, a good benchmark of reading the situation is if they won't pay extra for the first time they will probably mess you about as a regular clean, just move on and do another job if that's the case.
This post should be put as a sticky at the top of page one of the forum.
Pro-Poler, you have said in one well thought out post what I - with all my waffle - have been trying to say! ;D
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i have also started to charge extra, normally double, for my new cleans. otherswise i resent spending twice as long on the first clean
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ALWAYS ALWAYS charge extra for the first clean, I've heard it all before "their not that dirty my husband only did them the other week" then you clean them and they cancel you've got to cover your backside, if they really want a regular cleaner they won't mind paying extra once after all look at the money they have not had to spend having them cleaned before, I price first timers the same as one offs you can't go wrong, a good benchmark of reading the situation is if they won't pay extra for the first time they will probably mess you about as a regular clean, just move on and do another job if that's the case.
This post should be put as a sticky at the top of page one of the forum.
Pro-Poler, you have said in one well thought out post what I - with all my waffle - have been trying to say! ;D
I didn't read most of the posts just posted how I deal with it 8)
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> John
Where have I accused you of lying?
Your posts contradict themselves; you may give one example and use that to highlight the correctness of your method; you might type in haste and get confused and have a different view to some. You might look at how long a 3 bed semi I described might take to clean and take longer than most experienced wfp users in this thread, you might have a little pithy comment to make at my expense but I would never call you a liar.
...
Edmund Blackadder: Look there's no need to panic. Someone on the forum will know how to do a repeat clean on a semi in about 15 minutes ...
Captain Rum: The forum, milord?
Edmund: Yes, the forum.
Captain Rum: What forum?
Edmund: I understood it was normal window cleaning forum practice to have on board wfp'ers who know how to clean a semi?
Captain Rum: Opinion is divided on the subject.
Edmund: Oh really? (Beginning to realise what he is dealing with...)
Captain Rum: Yaahs! All the other Captains say it is. I say it isn't.
Edmund: Oh no! Mad as a Brush!
(Wibble)
To be honest I cant disagree with any of the above.
But talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
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You make me smile John! ;D
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Well John - you obviously aren't doing all your first cleans to a very high standard if they only take five minutes extra. And I hope this post helps the unbiased reader.
However let's assume that your generalisation is true and you are taking five minutes extra.
Let's also take just one of those "3 bed semi's" you mockingly use to illustrate your post at my expense.
A repeat clean 3 bed semi (with two 3 facet bay windows and a bedroom window and a door at the front, a side window and a door plus four windows at the back including a patio door set. Let's say that takes 15 minutes on 4 weekly and 18 minutes on 8 weekly. (typically extra spiders' nests or baked on bird muck and going above the vents from time to time raises the average time on the latter.)
If your extra 5 minutes to clean it is correct then you spend 33% extra time cleaning it. Therefore you can justify charging say £20 instead of £15.
Personally a first clean done thoroughly on my above example would probably take me 25 or 30 minutes because I would want all the spiders nests and filth above the vents got rid of and so I would scrub the whole property top to bottom quickly and thoroughly including the cills and then I would go back to the first top window I did and then go back over the glass.
I would then do the downstairs glass starting with any window not being dripped on from above and then the rest in reverse order.
I happily invest a bit extra in a first clean and charge accordingly. Because unlike you I'm not rushing it in "5 minutes extra" I have time to let it drip without driving back to finish off the glass.
I would charge £25 for a first clean (more or less depending on how filthy it was) and offer 8 weekly at £15/16 or 4 weekly at £13/14.
Then I know I have protected myself against one hit wonders masquerading as regulars.
You see thats where we differ I would take 30 mins on first and repeat cleans.
Im always amazed by guys who rattle round a house in 15 mins who believe that they are protecting
themselves against the competition.
So every clean is approached as though it hasn't been cleaned in years, even if cleaned 4 weeks ago? I must have that wrong because it makes little or no sense.
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Well John - you obviously aren't doing all your first cleans to a very high standard if they only take five minutes extra. And I hope this post helps the unbiased reader.
However let's assume that your generalisation is true and you are taking five minutes extra.
Let's also take just one of those "3 bed semi's" you mockingly use to illustrate your post at my expense.
A repeat clean 3 bed semi (with two 3 facet bay windows and a bedroom window and a door at the front, a side window and a door plus four windows at the back including a patio door set. Let's say that takes 15 minutes on 4 weekly and 18 minutes on 8 weekly. (typically extra spiders' nests or baked on bird muck and going above the vents from time to time raises the average time on the latter.)
If your extra 5 minutes to clean it is correct then you spend 33% extra time cleaning it. Therefore you can justify charging say £20 instead of £15.
Personally a first clean done thoroughly on my above example would probably take me 25 or 30 minutes because I would want all the spiders nests and filth above the vents got rid of and so I would scrub the whole property top to bottom quickly and thoroughly including the cills and then I would go back to the first top window I did and then go back over the glass.
I would then do the downstairs glass starting with any window not being dripped on from above and then the rest in reverse order.
I happily invest a bit extra in a first clean and charge accordingly. Because unlike you I'm not rushing it in "5 minutes extra" I have time to let it drip without driving back to finish off the glass.
I would charge £25 for a first clean (more or less depending on how filthy it was) and offer 8 weekly at £15/16 or 4 weekly at £13/14.
Then I know I have protected myself against one hit wonders masquerading as regulars.
You see thats where we differ I would take 30 mins on first and repeat cleans.
Im always amazed by guys who rattle round a house in 15 mins who believe that they are protecting
themselves against the competition.
So every clean is approached as though it hasn't been cleaned in years, even if cleaned 4 weeks ago? I must have that wrong because it makes little or no sense.
Its not what im saying.
I find that I can do first cleans every bit as quick as a repeat, maybe Im being too fussy with my
repeat cleans.
Another reason is that I only put water above vents when doing very dirty first cleans.
Which I then leave and come back later that day to finish the glass.
On repeat cleans I use a damp microfiber on a harris pole with a fixi clamp above the vents
this would be slower than using water.
At the end of the day I have priced to take 30 mins so I would rather over clean and work
at a calmer and less stressful pace.
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learnt my lesson and have been charging either 25% or 50% extra
on first cleans over the last year
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The best way is to do the second clean first. Charge for a second clean and do it as one. Then on the second clean, charge the same as the first. They will be cleaner, so the first- which is really the second-won't take as long.
You might think it's harder doing the second first but get someone to help you. Who's on first? Exactly. What's the name of the guy on second. Naturally.
Why? Left field ;).
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Grifter, you're heading in the same direction as Mr Acorn.
;D
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Grifter, you're heading in the same direction as Mr Acorn.
;D
;D
It's them aeroplanes, in the sky.
They'll get us all, in the end :o.
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Grifter, you're heading in the same direction as Mr Acorn.
;D
;D
It's them aeroplanes, in the sky.
They'll get us all, in the end :o.
No Gerry, no.
Do the bottom windows first with a bladder on a stick and when you've done the bottoms you can splash and dash the tops because the householder will be out in the garden, tinfoil hatted against the x-rays, plotting the chemtrails on a sheet of foolscap.
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We always charge double for first clean but charge half price for 5th & 6th clean,