Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: David Salkeld on May 23, 2013, 07:05:16 pm
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Not being clever but...
I use a standard Asda Indoor broom head. Fit my own jets and costs about a fiver.
OK, maybe they don't last quite as long as the £30 brushes do. I get about 4 months out of one and I have been told a, for example, Gardiner brush lasts about a year.
My brushes are much lighter than even a "Super Light".
My brushes do a good job too.
Please don't think I am saying you're all idiots, just wondering if there is anyone who has done as I do and changed to "Proper" brushes and what their reasons are?
I, personally haven't found a reason to change
Thanks
David
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The only reason i use gardiner and other supplier brushes is because im lazy to make my own plus i like to have the best equipment i can afford for the job
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Care to show us some pics of your DIY brushes?
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I've been using my current £25.00 Boardex brush for 3 years ;)
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I started with diy bentley brushes then progressed to Gardiners Bentley brushes 'cos I couldn't be bothered to fit the jets.
They worked ok but didn't last long and didn't look very professional but they did the job.
As i earned more and more money it just seemed the sensible thing to do - buy specific brushes designed for the job ie. Gardiners again. Same with poles too.
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The only reason i use gardiner and other supplier brushes is because im lazy to make my own plus i like to have the best equipment i can afford for the job
Thought that most people don't want to bother messing around making brushes. Must admit mine sometimes last longer than they should due to "Can't be arsed ::)roll"
As for best equipment....Totally agree....that's why I, eventually bought a Gardiner SLX and through out the fishing pole ;)
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I buy my brushes because when I finish my working day and at weekends I like to shut-off from window cleaning (and sit at the computer on a window cleaning forum!). :P
Nowadays good quality equipment is easily available to buy, and £30 for a brush is peanuts considering the amount of work it will do.
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Care to show us some pics of your DIY brushes?
Yer I tried, but how do you post a pic?
I think the Jpeg files I have are too big?
Ta
David
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When I started I was using £30 poles. I'll happily part with £700 for a pole these days and not worry too much. The bigger your business grows, the less you can be arsed to diy.
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When I started I was using £30 poles. I'll happily part with £700 for a pole these days and not worry too much. The bigger your business grows, the less you can be arsed to diy.
Very true.
I've diy'd Harris poles, Gangster modular pole etc etc. over the years.
With the quality of equipment that's available today there is no need to diy.
Plus I can't be bothered, even re-filling the resin vessel is a chore these days to me.
Even if I bought a new £300+ carbon pole every 12 months it would be worth the money because of the amount of work that can be done with it.
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I've been using my current £25.00 Boardex brush for 3 years ;)
Just checked out the Brodex Brushes, not bad price.
Are they light?
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I've been using my current £25.00 Boardex brush for 3 years ;)
Just checked out the Brodex Brushes, not bad price.
Are they light?
no
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I thought I was the tightest one on here and even I don't diy a brush.
Extend2wash do them for about about £12
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I see your point lads but I have 2 reasons why I will still DIY mine.......
1. Cost - £30 will get me 10 brushes from Asda (OK then there's the tube, T peice and jets)
2. Light as a feather - I borrowed a Superlight of a mate.........soon as I picked it up I gave it straight back....much heavier.
The one reason why I was asking and looking for a Proper brush was because, like most of you, I don't want to spend time making brushes.
Thanks
David
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I see your point lads but I have 2 reasons why I will still DIY mine.......
1. Cost - £30 will get me 10 brushes from Asda (OK then there's the tube, T peice and jets)
2. Light as a feather - I borrowed a Superlight of a mate.........soon as I picked it up I gave it straight back....much heavier.
The one reason why I was asking and looking for a Proper brush was because, like most of you, I don't want to spend time making brushes.
Thanks
David
Depends of course which Super-lite you were trying.
As far as I can remember the Bentley brushes were about 215g (correct me if I have remembered wrong). The standard Super-Lite brush is about 250g plus socket. and the Super-Lite Sill brush is about 225g. However the Xtreme brush (which in my opinion, having used both, is far better than the Bentley) is only 165g which is a good bit lighter than the Bentley.
We have a new range of Xtreme brushes coming out that will be even lighter at about half the weight of the Bentley (105-110g)
Of course if the Bentleys work for you why not - cheap, easy to get hold of and lightweight.
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
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It's was only half way through this thread I realised the OP was for real!
Homemade brushes?! OMFG. If you can't afford a brush then you'd probably be better off employed.
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It's was only half way through this thread I realised the OP was for real!
Homemade brushes?! OMFG. If you can't afford a brush then you'd probably be better off employed.
So why does a brush from a company work better then a home made brush? It's not always a question of being able to afford something or not.
I've got an aldi special I use quite often for windows above conservatories etc. It's far lighter than any commercial wfp brush, cost me 99p and it works fine.
For most windows I use the red Vikan brush. It weighs a ton but I prefer the shape of it. If Gardiners did a brush that shape and it was lighter than the Vikan, I'd use that instead. Likewise for Lidl's, Aldi or any shop, if they did what I want, I'd buy it there.
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
lol ;D
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Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
Best thing ever said on here LMAO .Mike
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs ............................. :)
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs ............................. :)
And while your diesel van isn't running, the horse is still burning up fuel also doing nothing in its stable ;D
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Dear David. This is a site for professional window cleaners, operating in this century. Why should one hanker after the past years. Maybe the time has arrived to move into the 21 century. I would at a guess expect you to be on horse back as its a lot cheaper that diesel. ??? ??? ??? ???
But you didn't include vet bills into their running costs ............................. :)
Or farrier costs of about £70 a month
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Alex , do you have a lighter version of the sill brush in the pipeline ?
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Hi David,
The first bentley brush I converted lasted ages. The second wasn't as good. It appeared to me that the flocking at the bristle ends was knotting up and giving a poor cleaning result.
We had only used Vikan flocked brushes before that which worked fine but were too heavy.
The crunch came when I looked at a window I had cleaned that faces the seafront one winter's morning. After the window had dried, I saw cleaned lines down the window where the bristles had cleaned but left uncleaned lines next to them. I concluded from this that there was no splay on the bristles and it was only the tips of the bristles that were cleaning the glass.
I changed the brush and pole back to the original Vikan and Unger Teleplus pole did the whole job again without issue. I ordered a superlite flocked which Gardiners had just started to sell and never looked back.
Before the Gardiner brush arrived I took another new bentley and cut a couple of the inner rows of bristles a bit shorter to try to get the outer bristles to splay. The weather the following day was poor so I never when out, and as the Superlite arrived that day, fitted to my pole and went on to using it.
I still have the unused, untested cut bristle bentley brush somewhere. Now we have the extreme brush, I don't see the point of messing with making my own that didn't do a good job for me TBH.
Sometimes Smithie can be a bit course in his way of expressing himself :). English isn't his first language, but I understand what he means as I come from the same culture. South Africans aren't great preservers of the past - we tend to knock down and replace with new. You won't see much of the last 100 - 150 years still in existence.
Years ago we modified carbon fibre Thompson modular fishing poles and the superlight was the best brush for the conversion due to it's lightness. If my memory serves me we did a complete conversion for around £25.00 - £30.00.
Why don't we still do it? I guess as Smithie says - we have moved on to carbon fibre SLX's and Superlight brushes. Yes they cost more, but they also work well, allowing us to focus on other things.
We also proudly use Aquadaptors on the end of our poles. Yes they add weight and cost more that a cheap on/off tap, but they save us water and reduce the amount of messing around switching water off and on.
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The old Bentley brush was pants as the rough hard edges of the stock would scratch the sills something rotten and customers weren't impressed with scratched sills!!!! The bristles melted at the crushed ends when using hot water as well.
Some DIY brushes are okay-ish but in general they're meant for sweeping floors not cleaning cars or windows.
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Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike
There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.
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Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike
There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.
+1 Matt you know what happens on that Basingstoke job, the brush is not good enough.
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Because their aint nothing better than a Gardiners Xtreme brush . Mike
There's plenty of brushes on the market better than an extreme. It's horses for courses, the extreme excels at height for me. I'd love to think they're good enough for everyday use but realistically they're not 'man' enough.
I don't see why you think it's ok for working at height, but not everyday use?
Surly you would want a more substantial brush to scrub better as you cannot get the pressure the higher you go.
Also why is an extreme not any good for everyday use? There is virtually no dirt on regular cleans, and it only needs a tickle to loosen what's on there.
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I see your point lads but I have 2 reasons why I will still DIY mine.......
1. Cost - £30 will get me 10 brushes from Asda (OK then there's the tube, T peice and jets)
2. Light as a feather - I borrowed a Superlight of a mate.........soon as I picked it up I gave it straight back....much heavier.
The one reason why I was asking and looking for a Proper brush was because, like most of you, I don't want to spend time making brushes.
Thanks
David
sounds like you're on to something here. you should go into production and sell them 8)
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I am a great believer in people doing things themselves as long as they have a bit of spare time on their hands. You just got to weigh up the time spent doing so, and how much you could earn in the same time cleaning windows. Different story if you can't buy something off the shelf that you can make yourself. I have used the Bentley brushes myself and don't rate them for window cleaning. Bristles are too soft and hold on to the dirt, they do clean windows though. Even at 15 minutes a brush, and if you use 4 brushes compared to a ready made brush, then that's an hour you have spent making your brushes up. How much can you earn in that hour cleaning windows? More than enough to buy a brush, and you also have the cost of the Bentley, jets, etc. like I said its a different story if its better than, or something you can't buy off the shelf and get delivered to your door all ready to use.
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I buy gardiners brushes cos they fit my gardiner poles and for the money spent makes me many times more back plus they come in black so match my poles and my black uniform ;D ( if gardiners made uniforms I would buy them as well )
plus who wants to go to asda amongst all them shopping trolleys argh do me head in >:(
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For some time I used a Harris pole and Bentley brush but found my cost of keeping a home produced pole and brush cost more to maintain than purpose make tools.
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I don't see why you think it's ok for working at height, but not everyday use?
Surly you would want a more substantial brush to scrub better as you cannot get the pressure the higher you go.
Also why is an extreme not any good for everyday use? There is virtually no dirt on regular cleans, and it only needs a tickle to loosen what's on there.
I do nth think the extreme is man enough at any height. If there's bird strikes or mess on the glass you just as well go home if you're trying to use an extreme. At height I consider an extreme as its the height issue (my own well being) that is my primary concern on a job 30' +
I love using an extreme, they feel great, looks good the way the two rows of bristles span out, but there are always jobs, everyday, where they're not up to it.
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I never understand why so many use the extreme. Surely the standard sl will scrub better and so do a better job. Our job is to actually clean the window, not use the lightest possible brush.
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I never understand why so many use the extreme. Surely the standard sl will scrub better and so do a better job. Our job is to actually clean the window, not use the lightest possible brush.
They average window does not need a good scrub, it just needs something the agitate the layer of dust/dirt, which is all it needs. If you think about traditional cleaning, how much scrubbing is involved with that? Virtually nothing, yet the windows get cleaned.
Obviously there are windows that will have bird poo on, but soak it when you see it then come back too it.
I don't see the point of having a heavier brush on the pole for what might only be needed for a couple of windows, anything more that an extreme is an over kill for 99% of the glass you clean in a day, so having a heavier brush for 1% of glass is an unnecessary use of energy.
The extreme is the fastest lightest brush available, so you can work faster and longer, so the little bit of extra time spent getting rid of a bit of bird poo can easily be made up by being quicker throughout the day.
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If the majority of your work is monthly then maybe. Most of mine is every 2 months and the only Gardiners brush I find that works well is the sl flocked. Tried the sl medium mixed on Alex's suggestion, but found this did not work nearly as well as the flocked.
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I found the scrapper along the front of the brush is ok although I usually tend to use the side edge of the brush for those hard bits.
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This is my brush of choice
http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/the-super-lite-brush-dual-trim-original-flocked-0-degree-splay.html
(http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/Super-Lite_Flocked_00deg_125.jpg)
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2 years ago, I bought a Vikan brush, a heavy brush when compared to gardiner brushes, so I took it round to a mate of mine who is a carpenter by trade. He has all sorts of weird and wonderful machinery in his workshop so I asked him to trim the stock down to bare minimum to reduce weight.
I still use that same brush to date with no signs of wear whatsoever. In between, I have bought gardiner brushes but have always returned to the Vikan.
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This is my brush of choice
http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/the-super-lite-brush-dual-trim-original-flocked-0-degree-splay.html
(http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/Super-Lite_Flocked_00deg_125.jpg)
I did try that brush Matt, I got one with my new pole, though I would use it for first cleans, but I couldn't get on with it, I felt the inner bristles were too stiff for me personally. I have now got the SL medium mixed for first cleans, and that feels really nice on the glass, glides really nicely, the inner bristles feel a little softer too, don't know if that's my imagination or not.
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Lee, if I could believe the extreme was reliable on certain jobs I'd plump for it. It feels great to work with, in that sense i love it.
I do however feel a certain amount of compromise is needed to be able to guarantee our work, and the price for that is the extra 100 gram weight.
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This is my brush of choice
http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/the-super-lite-brush-dual-trim-original-flocked-0-degree-splay.html
(http://www.gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/acatalog/Super-Lite_Flocked_00deg_125.jpg)
Why do you prefer that to the standard splay version?
Tried the 15 degree splay (no longer available) but found that you had to press very hard to get the inner bristles in contact with the glass.
Ref. Lee I found the sl dt medium mixed feels very nice on the glass and seems to glide evortlesly over windows, but unfortunately for me it really did not scrub nearly as well as the flocked brush.
Wonder what a sl flocked single trim would be like?
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i diy harris poles and fishing poles...but never diy brushes
for me they are the most important component generally the lighter
the better and i buy the best quality i can get for the job
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Tried a broom head, didnt like the bristle layout, plus to hard or soft, hard to get it right.
you know when you buy a wfp brush from a reputable company like (gardiner) its designed for wfp use.