Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Granny on March 15, 2013, 08:45:11 am
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Britain is facing a growing shortage of tradesman following a dramatic fall in the number of plumbers and bricklayers, new research reveals today.
Figures for skilled tradesmen plummeted by seven per cent in the last year alone after being badly hit by the economic downturn and depressed housing market.
Independent businesses are dwindling and plumbers have been the worst hit, with a 25 per cent drop in numbers the last four years.
Growing crisis: The number of independent tradesmen such as plumbers, carpenters and window cleaners has fallen in recent years - with the number of bricklayers down 19% since 2009
Bricklayers are down 19 per cent, window cleaners by 18 per cent, and the number of joiners has fallen by 17 per cent in the last three years, the UK's biggest small business insurance provider Simply Business found.
Only cleaners, chimney sweeps and female-run businesses are bucking the trend, the findings from more than 300,000 small businesses show.
Can't believe this really - I've never seen so many window cleaners in my life!!!!!!!!
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2293096/Britain-faces-growing-skilled-tradesmen-crisis-drastic-fall-number-plumbers-bricklayers-carpenters.html#ixzz2Nb1QL28s
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''Can't believe this really''
Daily Mail?
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No danger is the number of window cleaners falling.
No danger.
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maybe there not all registered with taxman :o
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when this recession ends all the part timers will go back to "proper" jobs .............. like that fella Bob Plumb ;)
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
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The article was written my a small business insurance provider and why would he be crying so loudly. Simple`s , they are not buying insurance polities for there small businesses. Shame, the boot in on the other foot and its about time insurance chaps start earning there keep. I feel nothing for that industry, and I wonder why? Rip off comes to mind.
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
O.D.F.O. = oh do f##k off
Am i right do i get a blue peter badge ;D ;D
Paul
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
You forgot to mention they are taking jobs from the millions of unemployed as the minimum wage doesn't apply to them, remove your head from your a*se and wake up :o
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
You have shown you clearly know nothing about this subject judging by your comment.
I rest my case.
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There is no shortage of tradesmen at all. There is just not the market now for as many as there were not so long ago. It's just a natural rebalance and when things pick up the tradesmen will return. Simple!
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very true most workers have scattered around doing other jobs until there trade picks up
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
You have shown you clearly know nothing about this subject judging by your comment.
I rest my case.
OK, I'll rise to the bait
Your first contribution to this has been a vaguely negative comment about Romanians and Bulgarians.
I gave an example of the behaviour of another bunch of Eastern European immigrants of whom I have experience and that is probably relevant.
Your response - a sarcastic comment with no added information or argument.
I pointed out what I was trying to say in my first point as it appeared to me that you'd wilfully misunderstood.
Your response - a sarcastic comment doubting my knowledge and with no added information or argument.
Bit one sided in terms of input for my liking.
If you have anything to say about Romanians and Bulgarians, say it. If you're not prepared to back it up, that's fine, but until then I'll treat you as the racist you currently appear to be. Please feel free to dissuade me as to this conclusion. Nothing you have said do far is giving me any hope on this front.
By all means tell us all:
Why will Bulgarians and Romanians be significantly different from my Polish experience?
How many will arrive?
What will they do when they arrive that scares you?
Alternatively, give me another sarcastic response.
I care not.
Vin
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That survey is gauged by the trades who have p.l.i. Ipso facto,very inaccurate, especially on the south coast
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Many moons ago I migrated to Denmark to work because the British work ethic was better than the Danish. :o :o
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That survey is gauged by the trades who have p.l.i. Ipso facto,very inaccurate, especially on the south coast
What's the reasoning that on the South Coast less people have Public Liability Insurance?
Is it 'cos life is so cushy down there - the Sun always shines - it hardly ever snows- and they're all rolling in money or they just don't give a ****- or they are so busy giving the Essex girls whatever - or there are so many Eastern European "tradesmen" who wouldn't know what PLI is!!!!
G.
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It's because we don't fry Mars bars down here.
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Many moons ago I migrated to Denmark to work because the British work ethic was better than the Danish. :o :o
and we let you back in.never should have happened ;D ;D
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I was chatting with a guy today {Landy owner} who drove up from Shropshire to do a day's plumbing. Wouldn't have thought it would be worth the trip but obviously is. {I am in Sale}.
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
You forgot to mention they are taking jobs from the millions of unemployed as the minimum wage doesn't apply to them, remove your head from your a*se and wake up :o
"The minimum wage doesn't apply to them"?
Really? In what way would that possibly be true? If they are employed by British companies in Britain, they are not subject to the minimum wage laws?
Vin
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Many of them work for agencies who take a cut which effectively leaves the employee with less than the minimum wage.
These agencies are not U.K. based so they make up their own rates often at local i.e. eastern european levels.
Many work for "gangmasters" who charge for accomodation, transport, and a fee for getting the job often paid on on ongoing basis which once again - effectively leaves the employee with less than the minimum wage.
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Many moons ago I migrated to Denmark to work because the British work ethic was better than the Danish. :o :o
and we let you back in.never should have happened ;D ;D
;D
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Many of them work for agencies who take a cut which effectively leaves the employee with less than the minimum wage.
These agencies are not U.K. based so they make up their own rates often at local i.e. eastern european levels.
Many work for "gangmasters" who charge for accomodation, transport, and a fee for getting the job often paid on on ongoing basis which once again - effectively leaves the employee with less than the minimum wage.
ref minimum wage:
https://www.gov.uk/agency-workers-your-rights/your-rights-as-a-temporary-agency-worker
Interesting.
And where's any evidence for the concept that they are working for foreign agencies? If there is, I'd genuinely like to see it, as I'm unaware of it. All the guys around here are employed by a local agency.
Lots of "Daily Mail" type arguments coming out on this thread. Some of what you say used to be the case but hasn't been so since the start of 2012. I'm interested in what's happening now. (And the legislation is pan-European, so foreign agencies would be covered)
Vin
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You forgot to mention they are taking jobs from the millions of unemployed as the minimum wage doesn't apply to them, remove your head from your a*se and wake up :o
Seven out of this guy's last nine posts have been in response to posts of mine or threads of mine.
I think I have a stalker!
It feels like being savaged by a dead sheep.
Vin
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
You have shown you clearly know nothing about this subject judging by your comment.
I rest my case.
OK, I'll rise to the bait
Your first contribution to this has been a vaguely negative comment about Romanians and Bulgarians.
I gave an example of the behaviour of another bunch of Eastern European immigrants of whom I have experience and that is probably relevant.
Your response - a sarcastic comment with no added information or argument.
I pointed out what I was trying to say in my first point as it appeared to me that you'd wilfully misunderstood.
Your response - a sarcastic comment doubting my knowledge and with no added information or argument.
Bit one sided in terms of input for my liking.
If you have anything to say about Romanians and Bulgarians, say it. If you're not prepared to back it up, that's fine, but until then I'll treat you as the racist you currently appear to be. Please feel free to dissuade me as to this conclusion. Nothing you have said do far is giving me any hope on this front.
By all means tell us all:
Why will Bulgarians and Romanians be significantly different from my Polish experience?
How many will arrive?
What will they do when they arrive that scares you?
Alternatively, give me another sarcastic response.
I care not.
Vin
Oh right, i've just logged back on and seen you have written an essay. (roll eyes).
I will take the time to reply seeing as you seem to have a bee in your bonnet.
And your O.D.F.O was uncalled for and rather childish. So go and wash your mouth out with soap you silly little boy.
Firstly your comment in response to my post was a barbed one, full or assumption and factually incorrect.
You wrongly asssumed I have some kind of axe to grind with Romanians or Bulgarians. Wrong!
If you read any of my back posts in the Off Topic section you will see I am an advocat of controlled immigration.
I do not agree with the EU open borders policy and make no excuse for my opinion.
And I am someone who has knowledge and experience of how the UK visa and immigration system works, unlike yourself.
You tried to imply that I was somehow against Eastern Europeans and made some jumped up comment about Polish people.
Which was not even relevant, and quite idiotic.
Im sure a Bulgarian or Romanian would be offended at your assumption that because they come from Eastern Europe they must be the same as Polish people.
I mean I suppose if you took away their national anthem, native language, history and culture and look at one in a darkened room with one eye closed maybe,just maybe you might be close. (roll eyes)
How stoopid can you be?
And anyone who knows me will tell you I am not a racist as that would be rather difficult, being married to a woman who is both a "foreigner" and of a different race from myself.
So go and sit in the corner and put your foot back in your mouth you prat!
MOD NOTE: PLEASE DISCUSS THE TOPIC WITHOUT RESORTING TO SILLY NAME CALLING. THANK YOU.
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I predicted a sarcastic response. Well done.
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That survey is gauged by the trades who have p.l.i. Ipso facto,very inaccurate, especially on the south coast
What's the reasoning that on the South Coast less people have Public Liability Insurance?
Is it 'cos life is so cushy down there - the Sun always shines - it hardly ever snows- and they're all rolling in money or they just don't give a ****- or they are so busy giving the Essex girls whatever - or there are so many Eastern European "tradesmen" who wouldn't know what PLI is!!!!
G.
The reasoning behind the south coast comment was that there isn't a shortage of work or trades down here,big mouth
MOD NOTE: PLEASE MODERATE YOURSELF!
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
You forgot to mention they are taking jobs from the millions of unemployed as the minimum wage doesn't apply to them, remove your head from your a*se and wake up :o
How can they be taking jobs when they go through the same interviewing process. Most Europeans I know work harder and longer than their British counterparts. You wake up,tw@t
MOD NOTE: PLEASE MODERATE YOURSELF.
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Think this is getting a bit out of hand name calling etc...
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''Can't believe this really''
Daily Mail?
I stepped on a Daily Mail this morning, but luckily enough there was dog poo handy to wipe it off on.
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Please discuss the topic without calling each other names. It actually makes for a better discussion too, if you just stick to the facts, or anecdotal evidences, rather than trying to put the other guy down.
Cheers.
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Please discuss the topic without calling each other names. It actually makes for a better discussion too, if you just stick to the facts, or anecdotal evidences, rather than trying to put the other guy down.
Cheers.
Well said Tosh :)
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Well said Tosh :)
Thank you; it's possible to discuss a subject without resorting to name calling; otherwise it just turns into this:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v737/tosh0987/Funny%20stuff%20for%20forums/2013-02-01_12-15_handbagsatdawn_zps8d5d59a0.jpg)
Besides, the best insults are low key; inference is more fun. ;D
Oh, for the Daily Wail readers, have a look at this, it's great fun:
http://www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail/
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.
Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
+1
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
You have shown you clearly know nothing about this subject judging by your comment.
I rest my case.
OK, I'll rise to the bait
Your first contribution to this has been a vaguely negative comment about Romanians and Bulgarians.
I gave an example of the behaviour of another bunch of Eastern European immigrants of whom I have experience and that is probably relevant.
Your response - a sarcastic comment with no added information or argument.
I pointed out what I was trying to say in my first point as it appeared to me that you'd wilfully misunderstood.
Your response - a sarcastic comment doubting my knowledge and with no added information or argument.
Bit one sided in terms of input for my liking.
If you have anything to say about Romanians and Bulgarians, say it. If you're not prepared to back it up, that's fine, but until then I'll treat you as the racist you currently appear to be. Please feel free to dissuade me as to this conclusion. Nothing you have said do far is giving me any hope on this front.
By all means tell us all:
Why will Bulgarians and Romanians be significantly different from my Polish experience?
How many will arrive?
What will they do when they arrive that scares you?
Alternatively, give me another sarcastic response.
I care not.
Vin
+1
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Around here it is difficult to get any decent employees. My blokes ( and one lass) get paid between £9 and £11 ph depending on t/o. We have 2 english lads and the others are from Poland, as is my wife. We recuited them from her home town. If you put an ad in the job centre the quality of the potential employees is just awful, maybe 1 in 100 would possibly be any good. I dont have time to conduct 100 interviews to get 1 worker.
Anyone who is prepared to uproot their family for a chance of a better life has a veated interest in making that decsion correct.
Dont get me wrong there are some very lazy in Poland but they tend to stay there
MOD NOTE; LOOK SWEARING AINT ALLOWED EITHER, EVEN IF YOU DO USE ASTERIXES. I REALLY DON'T WANT TO OVER MODERATE, BUT LET'S TRY AND KEEP THIS PLACE FRIENDLY.
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Tosh, is that you??
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I suppose it will justify the uncapped numbers of Romanian and Bulgarian migrants due to hit our shores.
O.D.F.O.
I live in a town with an estimated 10% Polish population. They are polite, decent, hard working, reliable, friendly and end up extremely rarely in court.Bluntly, anyone prepared to up sticks and move across Europe is doing it to work. When I compare that to the attitude of the British blokes I see milling around all day in this area doing nothing, I know who I'd rather have here.
Vin
Polish?
Who mentioned Polish? ???
No-one. But if you can't see anything in common between different groups of Eastern Europeans who have the guts to get up and try and start in a new country, then I give up.
Vin
You have shown you clearly know nothing about this subject judging by your comment.
I rest my case.
OK, I'll rise to the bait
Your first contribution to this has been a vaguely negative comment about Romanians and Bulgarians.
I gave an example of the behaviour of another bunch of Eastern European immigrants of whom I have experience and that is probably relevant.
Your response - a sarcastic comment with no added information or argument.
I pointed out what I was trying to say in my first point as it appeared to me that you'd wilfully misunderstood.
Your response - a sarcastic comment doubting my knowledge and with no added information or argument.
Bit one sided in terms of input for my liking.
If you have anything to say about Romanians and Bulgarians, say it. If you're not prepared to back it up, that's fine, but until then I'll treat you as the racist you currently appear to be. Please feel free to dissuade me as to this conclusion. Nothing you have said do far is giving me any hope on this front.
By all means tell us all:
Why will Bulgarians and Romanians be significantly different from my Polish experience?
How many will arrive?
What will they do when they arrive that scares you?
Alternatively, give me another sarcastic response.
I care not.
Vin
Good to see your still talking b*llocks onion man, you don't live in the real world do you? You just live in your own disillusional world, you might be able to pull the wool over other peoples eyes onion but you can't bullshoot me but you already know that don't you? I make know distinction between poles, romanians, bulgarians or martians I really couldn't give a thuck ;D Fact is if you are a business and you want to hire staff in a recession and you're given the choice between paying someone £3 an hour or paying someone else £5 an hour who you going to employ? Yes I call that racism Onion breath racism agains the many unemployed people of this country trying to support their families you fool >:(
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Enrique,
Nine out of your last eleven posts have been directed at me. Is it love?
Vin
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Sort of regret posting this now :(
Find it hard to believe how some on here get so bitter and twisted about something and nothing.
Conflicted - have issues - low self-esteem - anger management - early onset of dementia - or whatever just get over it ;D ;D ;D
G.
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Enrique,
Nine out of your last eleven posts have been directed at me. Is it love?
Vin
That will increase onion you're an attention seeker so I'll see to it you get plenty you should be flattered
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Sort of regret posting this now :(
Find it hard to believe how some on here get so bitter and twisted about something and nothing.
Conflicted - have issues - low self-esteem - anger management - early onset of dementia - or whatever just get over it ;D ;D ;D
G.
No issues at all he trolled andy m on page one of the topic, it's obvious the trolling will provoke reactions he does it all the time, his uncontrollable temper led him to do the same to me on another forum, trouble is they haven't seen through him on there yet but they will.
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In order to stop this silliness, I'll take another break from commenting on this site. You don't need this kind of stuff from someone who has a personal issue with me.
Vin