Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: David Kent @ KentKleen on December 22, 2012, 11:04:03 pm
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When the clx was available it was the talk of the forum. What is going on with the phoenix range? is it mainly getting sold abroad or is it just the fact that only a few have bought them and there hasn't been a serious review about them yet? They where advertised as THE next best pole.
I have asked numerous times on here for a review and cant seem to get any substance in a reply. Are they any good? This is not a post having a go at the phoenix range, i just want to know what is going on with them.
They seem to have a problem with there tolerence's and the top section snapping. Am I right or wrong?
Thanks in advance
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Well when I get them I'll let you know.
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But richard you already know they have issue's.
Do you have money too burn lol
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I have only heard of 2 poles with problems.
Can you 100% say that if you buy any brand of pole that it will never have problems?
I heard more people complain about the clamps on the Gardiner poles having to be replaced, friend of mine has to replace some of his clamp arms on his slx poles.
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you didnt have to replace the clamps it was a glue issue on the early poles. you have only heard of 2 poles with problems, IMO they have only sold 10 - 20 poles to the uk market so thats a bad percentage. I might be wrong and they may have sold 100's in the uk but my guess is they have not. we would of had loads of reviews by now if thay had.
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you didnt have to replace the clamps it was a glue issue on the early poles. you have only heard of 2 poles with problems, IMO they have only sold 10 - 20 poles to the uk market so thats a bad percentage. I might be wrong and they may have sold 100's in the uk but my guess is they have not. we would of had loads of reviews by now if thay had.
Its not the glue its the plastic threads they use on the clamp arms that he has to replace.
To be fair they are new out and a lot of people have the Gardiner poles, so they happy with them why would they buy one just to try them out, it's the guys that need new poles that are buying them at the minute and they have sold loads of them not just in UK.
I have had a play with them and they are imo better than gardiners poles with some of the improvements they have.
So that's why I'm getting them. If no one is will to buy them then you won't get reviews will you.
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what are the improvements? and plastic thread problem is from overtightening the bolt. not a design fault
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what are the improvements? and plastic thread problem is from overtightening the bolt. not a design fault
It is a design fault, for using plastic, everyone knows plastic threads don't last long.
Have you seen the videos of it from the pros?
http://youtu.be/VeCUDAmyXP4
http://youtu.be/VeCUDAmyXP4
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where is Mr Fox? ;D
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where is Mr Fox? ;D
Probably in bed! Lol
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The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.
That newest Unger contraption was supposed to be a whole new level in WFP, world beater etc etc.
This Phoenix the same, both hyped up to the hilt & adverts splashed all over the place.
Like you say- virtually zero impact upon reality!
Why? because the buying wfp public have become wise to marketing manure! ;D ;D
Gardiners advertising budget- ZERO, impact upon reality- MAXIMUM! ;)
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The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.
That newest Unger contraption was supposed to be a whole new level in WFP, world beater etc etc.
This Phoenix the same, both hyped up to the hilt & adverts splashed all over the place.
Like you say- virtually zero impact upon reality!
Why? because the buying wfp public have become wise to marketing manure! ;D ;D
Gardiners advertising budget- ZERO, impact upon reality- MAXIMUM! ;)
Every new product has to be advertised! Otherwise no one will know about it!
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The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.
That newest Unger contraption was supposed to be a whole new level in WFP, world beater etc etc.
This Phoenix the same, both hyped up to the hilt & adverts splashed all over the place.
Like you say- virtually zero impact upon reality!
Why? because the buying wfp public have become wise to marketing manure! ;D ;D
Gardiners advertising budget- ZERO, impact upon reality- MAXIMUM! ;)
Every new product has to be advertised! Otherwise no one will know about it!
Can you read Richy? ;D
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The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.
That newest Unger contraption was supposed to be a whole new level in WFP, world beater etc etc.
This Phoenix the same, both hyped up to the hilt & adverts splashed all over the place.
Like you say- virtually zero impact upon reality!
Why? because the buying wfp public have become wise to marketing manure! ;D ;D
Gardiners advertising budget- ZERO, impact upon reality- MAXIMUM! ;)
Every new product has to be advertised! Otherwise no one will know about it!
Can you read Richy? ;D
Yep perfectly thanks.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSXW1KIiP1Y
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSXW1KIiP1Y
thats not a review
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The proof is in the pudding, so to speak.
That newest Unger contraption was supposed to be a whole new level in WFP, world beater etc etc.
This Phoenix the same, both hyped up to the hilt & adverts splashed all over the place.
Like you say- virtually zero impact upon reality!
Why? because the buying wfp public have become wise to marketing manure! ;D ;D
Gardiners advertising budget- ZERO, impact upon reality- MAXIMUM! ;)
Winpro=tells it how it is ;)
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Kentclean what would you like to know I have the carbon except base 17 6" are what ever the exact length pole
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Not got one yet, but to me they look good.
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I really don't get it. Without a doubt my Gardiners CLX is a much better pole than the Xtel it replaced, but I have had to reglue three clamps and I have two spinning sections in 6 months of use. Anyway, let's get to more important issues: tiswas or Swapshop?
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Formed, thank you for your reply. I have been asking for a decent review on here since the phoenix came out. I value the reviews on here as they are from the real world, with the poles been used day in day out. I really like the look of the phoenix range and think some of there features look great.
A good honest review by yourself would be excellent.
My original question was a genuine one not a pop at phoenix.
I understand all poles can have issues when first released as the clx did with the wrong glue being used.
please post a review including what it is like in day to day use.
Thank you
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When the clx was available it was the talk of the forum. What is going on with the phoenix range? is it mainly getting sold abroad or is it just the fact that only a few have bought them and there hasn't been a serious review about them yet? They where advertised as THE next best pole.
I have asked numerous times on here for a review and cant seem to get any substance in a reply. Are they any good? This is not a post having a go at the phoenix range, i just want to know what is going on with them.
They seem to have a problem with there tolerence's and the top section snapping. Am I right or wrong?
Thanks in advance
Kentkleen, if you have a look a past threads the Phoenix has been the talk of the forum! I think one thread has had more views than any other pole (apart from the Harris pole is action,!)
We have sold hundreds the Phoenix poles already and it's been the fastest selling pole we have ever had. Currently in UK terms alone, we have just over 200 out there with more going out everyday.
Tolerance wise things are fine and no reports of any sections snapping. The tiny percentage of issues have been with the thread adapter breaking on the first batch, mainly with using an Aquadapter and users drilling through the fitting, with one or two cases of this not being the case. We have just modified this part, upgraded it so those issues should be eliminated.
As any pole manufacturer will tell you problems always occur and sometimes lead to better products because of it. We will constantly be improving the range to make it the best possible.
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When the clx was available it was the talk of the forum. What is going on with the phoenix range? is it mainly getting sold abroad or is it just the fact that only a few have bought them and there hasn't been a serious review about them yet? They where advertised as THE next best pole.
I have asked numerous times on here for a review and cant seem to get any substance in a reply. Are they any good? This is not a post having a go at the phoenix range, i just want to know what is going on with them.
They seem to have a problem with there tolerence's and the top section snapping. Am I right or wrong?
Thanks in advance
Kentkleen, if you have a look a past threads the Phoenix has been the talk of the forum! I think one thread has had more views than any other pole (apart from the Harris pole is action,!)
We have sold hundreds the Phoenix poles already and it's been the fastest selling pole we have ever had. Currently in UK terms alone, we have just over 200 out there with more going out everyday.
Tolerance wise things are fine and no reports of any sections snapping. The tiny percentage of issues have been with the thread adapter breaking on the first batch, mainly with using an Aquadapter and users drilling through the fitting, with one or two cases of this not being the case. We have just modified this part, upgraded it so those issues should be eliminated.
As any pole manufacturer will tell you problems always occur and sometimes lead to better products because of it. We will constantly be improving the range to make it the best possible.
yes i second that, i have had mine for couple months now, and its a great pole, all i say is that you need buy it, use it, and just love it. :)
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When the clx was available it was the talk of the forum. What is going on with the phoenix range? is it mainly getting sold abroad or is it just the fact that only a few have bought them and there hasn't been a serious review about them yet? They where advertised as THE next best pole.
I have asked numerous times on here for a review and cant seem to get any substance in a reply. Are they any good? This is not a post having a go at the phoenix range, i just want to know what is going on with them.
They seem to have a problem with there tolerence's and the top section snapping. Am I right or wrong?
Thanks in advance
Kentkleen, if you have a look a past threads the Phoenix has been the talk of the forum! I think one thread has had more views than any other pole (apart from the Harris pole is action,!)
We have sold hundreds the Phoenix poles already and it's been the fastest selling pole we have ever had. Currently in UK terms alone, we have just over 200 out there with more going out everyday.
Tolerance wise things are fine and no reports of any sections snapping. The tiny percentage of issues have been with the thread adapter breaking on the first batch, mainly with using an Aquadapter and users drilling through the fitting, with one or two cases of this not being the case. We have just modified this part, upgraded it so those issues should be eliminated.
As any pole manufacturer will tell you problems always occur and sometimes lead to better products because of it. We will constantly be improving the range to make it the best possible.
yes i second that, i have had mine for couple months now, and its a great pole, all i say is that you need buy it, use it, and just love it. :)
Dani, what pole did you have before the pheonix, how does it compare? Do you know or use an aquadapter with it, this is a must for any pole I buy.
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Dani J - great pole love it buy 1 - what sort of review is that ?
it's this sort of response that Kent is trying to get past and get a full picture of the pole.
the problem for facelift on here ( and this is by no means a large section of the window cleaning market ) is that
gardiners have strived to provide fantastic and quality products that others so far can only equal either in quality or
price - none seem to beat gardiners on either or both items
Also over the years i know Alex has not only tested his equipment out personally but given out items for testing and evaluation, this has given him great feedback from those on the frontline.
While i'm sure the phoenix pole is great it appears it is neither better ( i'm talking 22 ft with the rather odd ( and part time ) extension piece or cheaper - so what is the insentive for me to buy anything other than gardiners ?
They ( facelift ) may have been better to have actually 'given' out 10 poles to members here to review and used under normal
working conditions than splashing out on Ad's
At least in this case the forum would then truely be buzzing about facelift.
Darran
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Steve Fox
Can I buy one of those upgraded threaded adapters with some glue please.
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Smudger thank you for a great response. YOU have grasped what I am looking for.
Stephen, I am not having a go at you or Phoenix. You always seem to go into defensive mode.
I stated why havn't phoenix had the IMPACT (not forum talk) in my original topic title.
I am after a proper review from lets say 10 users. (200 poles sold in the uk so that shouldnt be too hard surely 10 buyers of those 200 use this forum)
I also commented that I understand all new poles have some issues when first put to market.
When first starting out with WFP I took a lot of time to research on this forum for what 'gear' especially poles that more experienced operators where advising. I think it would be helpful for newbies to be able to read a 'good' full review of a new product, rather than, 'its a good pole you should buy one'
That is all I have been asking for for the last 2 months.
I have read 1 really good review and read one post mentioning the top pole breakage on the 26ul.
IF anyone starts slagging phoenix poles off on this thread I will lock it. But that will be a shame as a good set of reviews will benefit all involved.
Hope this covers the 'intension' issues of why I started this topic.
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Talk of the forum lol ;D
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When first starting out with WFP I took a lot of time to research on this forum for what 'gear' especially poles that more experienced operators where advising. I think it would be helpful for newbies to be able to read a 'good' full review of a new product, rather than, 'its a good pole you should buy one'
i was exactly the same when going WFP the SLX was the pole to have and more importantly WHY - i got loads of info 99% good
1% bad of practicle use of the pole/useage/wear etc..
all my poles are gardiners - some due for replacement but with the info on the phoenix i, AS YET see no reason to try
another make which means a different set of spares and compaterbility problems
Darran
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i'd b interested in buying one but wanted to know how it handled the day to day rigours of a proffessional window cleaner over a period of several months before i invested.... with gardiners everyone knows they are getting top gear.. just look at the rep he has on this forum
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IMO Pheonix are totally missing an opportunity.
We've got Gardiners tried and tested fantastic products.
Pheonix may have good poles as well.
Phoenix want use to buy poles off them at roughly the same price.
It's not going to happen in any great numbers unless they give us a real financial incentive to do so, therefore they will remain a long way behind Gardiners.
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Talk of the forum lol ;D
Yeah, and for what reasons?!! ;D ;D
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My review the Phoenix 18 carbon except base section is a great pole I prefer it to the slx because I can work faster due to the lateral clamps on the slx.
The slx is probably slightly more rigid
The Phoenix is well made no clamp issues.
At present I do not get black hands from the Phoenix and it does not require constant wiping I only clean the hose that goes inside pole.
I have had the pole since the first batch released and it does have slight wear to the finish on the the first 2 section but this is to be expected.
This is all I can really say and that I will be buying another when the slx retires which will be early next year .
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Does it have positive end stops?
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Steve Fox
Can I buy one of those upgraded threaded adapters with some glue please.
Mart, no problem will get some out to you FOC, along with one for the prototype section - will have to be the end of the week though because of hols etc.
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My review the Phoenix 18 carbon except base section is a great pole I prefer it to the slx because I can work faster due to the lateral clamps on the slx.
The slx is probably slightly more rigid
The Phoenix is well made no clamp issues.
At present I do not get black hands from the Phoenix and it does not require constant wiping I only clean the hose that goes inside pole.
I have had the pole since the first batch released and it does have slight wear to the finish on the the first 2 section but this is to be expected.
This is all I can really say and that I will be buying another when the slx retires which will be early next year .
This is pretty much the same reports we been getting from customers. They can work a lot faster due to the clamps as it is quicker to retract and extend.
I can see you had one from the first batch, if you would like the upgraded adapters please drop me an email fox@faceliftcleaning.com and i can get these out to you as well.
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Smudger thank you for a great response. YOU have grasped what I am looking for.
Stephen, I am not having a go at you or Phoenix. You always seem to go into defensive mode.
I stated why havn't phoenix had the IMPACT (not forum talk) in my original topic title.
I am after a proper review from lets say 10 users. (200 poles sold in the uk so that shouldnt be too hard surely 10 buyers of those 200 use this forum)
I also commented that I understand all new poles have some issues when first put to market.
When first starting out with WFP I took a lot of time to research on this forum for what 'gear' especially poles that more experienced operators where advising. I think it would be helpful for newbies to be able to read a 'good' full review of a new product, rather than, 'its a good pole you should buy one'
That is all I have been asking for for the last 2 months.
I have read 1 really good review and read one post mentioning the top pole breakage on the 26ul.
IF anyone starts slagging phoenix poles off on this thread I will lock it. But that will be a shame as a good set of reviews will benefit all involved.
Hope this covers the 'intension' issues of why I started this topic.
Kentkleen, how dare you say i'm defensive!! haha!
I think most people are waiting to see how they perform over time, which is pretty wise. There are always comments on forums from people who've bought something then review it the same day, saying how great it is and it's the best thing they've ever bought..... then problems occur a few weeks down the line and suddenly it not as good as they first proclaimed.
Over time a lot more reviews will pop up giving you a more rounded view of the range against what is also out there.
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Thanks
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When the clx was available it was the talk of the forum. What is going on with the phoenix range? is it mainly getting sold abroad or is it just the fact that only a few have bought them and there hasn't been a serious review about them yet? They where advertised as THE next best pole.
I have asked numerous times on here for a review and cant seem to get any substance in a reply. Are they any good? This is not a post having a go at the phoenix range, i just want to know what is going on with them.
They seem to have a problem with there tolerence's and the top section snapping. Am I right or wrong?
Thanks in advance
Kentkleen, if you have a look a past threads the Phoenix has been the talk of the forum! I think one thread has had more views than any other pole (apart from the Harris pole is action,!)
We have sold hundreds the Phoenix poles already and it's been the fastest selling pole we have ever had. Currently in UK terms alone, we have just over 200 out there with more going out everyday.
Tolerance wise things are fine and no reports of any sections snapping. The tiny percentage of issues have been with the thread adapter breaking on the first batch, mainly with using an Aquadapter and users drilling through the fitting, with one or two cases of this not being the case. We have just modified this part, upgraded it so those issues should be eliminated.
As any pole manufacturer will tell you problems always occur and sometimes lead to better products because of it. We will constantly be improving the range to make it the best possible.
yes i second that, i have had mine for couple months now, and its a great pole, all i say is that you need buy it, use it, and just love it. :)
Dani, what pole did you have before the pheonix, how does it compare? Do you know or use an aquadapter with it, this is a must for any pole I buy.
Hi Lee
All my poles are gardiners.
I bought phoenix 22ft just to try as they advertised it on here, any new product comes on the market I always try it out.
Yes the pole is as good as my gardiners 22ft. but the advantage which tops any pole on the market is the clamps.
These clamps are great, so far I haven’t had any issue on that.
As regarding to Aquadapter, well, I had it on the pole and yes it works perfectly but I have gone off of Aquadapter now, because it just makes the pole too heavy so now I just use it without Aquadapter.
Over all it’s a great pole.
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My review the Phoenix 18 carbon except base section is a great pole I prefer it to the slx because I can work faster due to the lateral clamps on the slx.
The slx is probably slightly more rigid
The Phoenix is well made no clamp issues.
At present I do not get black hands from the Phoenix and it does not require constant wiping I only clean the hose that goes inside pole.
I have had the pole since the first batch released and it does have slight wear to the finish on the the first 2 section but this is to be expected.
This is all I can really say and that I will be buying another when the slx retires which will be early next year .
Thank you. At last something with substance.
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Again thank you, interesting, Facelift seem to have nailed the clamps, so to speak.
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I think the problem is only a very small percentage of window cleaners post on this forum, so if 200 have been sold very few on this forum actually own one.
Personally I think the clamps could make the phoenix a little quicker to use over lateral ones and the problem I have with gardiners clamps is they regularly need adjusting through the day. I have taken to not fully closing sections 1 and 2 and this does help.
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I think the problem is only a very small percentage of window cleaners post on this forum, so if 200 have been sold very few on this forum actually own one.
Personally I think the clamps could make the phoenix a little quicker to use over lateral ones and the problem I have with gardiners clamps is they regularly need adjusting through the day. I have taken to not fully closing sections 1 and 2 and this does help.
well since i have had mine, i have only adjust the clamps twice, which was a minor thing. :)
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I think the problem is only a very small percentage of window cleaners post on this forum, so if 200 have been sold very few on this forum actually own one.
Personally I think the clamps could make the phoenix a little quicker to use over lateral ones and the problem I have with gardiners clamps is they regularly need adjusting through the day. I have taken to not fully closing sections 1 and 2 and this does help.
Hi dd
I would have replied directly via email but cannot find an email address for you.
Adjusting the clamps through the day is not normal and can be easily remedied. Drop me an email on alex@agardiner.co.uk.
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ok i didnt really want to get involved because stephen and mike have been excellent , i was one of the first to review the phoniex and in my opinion it is a brilliant pole it ticks all the boxes and i cant live without it HOWEVER it does seem a bit brittle to me [ bear in mind i usually work with a brodex which is bullet proof ] after a few days i leaned it against a wall and it slid down and the neck snapped , i told stephen and mike and about 14 hours later the new parts arived and i was back in buisness , a week later as i was lowering the pole as the clamps hit each other one just split , again i informed the powers that be and about 16 hours later again free of charge i recieved my parts including glue , about a week later the top clamp just gave away , again next day free of charge im back in the game , and then last week i rested pole on a wheelie bin it slid of and the neck snapped , which was my own fault , so now i have decided to give gardners clx a try and i will look at getting phoniex fixed in new year , so in my opinion the pole is excellent the customer service is beyond excellent , i just feel as though its all a bit brittle , but as i say mine was one of the first batch and im not the most carefull of pole users , i hope i havnt given to bad a review because these guys are really trying and to me customer service is just as important as product .... just read this back to my wife who reminded me that stephen and mike did say that the second batch of clamps were stronger and the 2 new clamps i have had no trouble with , so there you go and before you all reply remember its christmas ;D ;D
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Your right Paul, no issues with the new parts.... Some never experienced anything with the first batch but the revised parts are all top notch...
You won the pole at the demo evening so it was a really early model... Maybe even as early as the one's Alex Gardiner bought!!
Drop me a text if need anythin now Paul and I'll sort it out.
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Cheerx for the honest post Paul
And i'm not turning this into a phoenix bashing post/thread but the thin top section snapping IS exactly my concern
on the 26UL
AND is the reason why this item should have had field trials for upto a year before release - every new product can
have tething problems and certainly be modded over time.
It will be interesting to see how they fair this time next year
Darran
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Paul, you need to speak as you find.
In all honesty it was my fault on the first batch of poles. In reality, the first run is a test to make sure the mold is correct as they usally need adjustment. I called off over 200 of first runs instead of the usual 6 or so sets as the prototypes were great and I wanted to get them out there ASAP! Well I've learnt my lesson, but we will refining and developing to make the best product out there. So far so good.
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Cheerx for the honest post Paul
And i'm not turning this into a phoenix bashing post/thread but the thin top section snapping IS exactly my concern
on the 26UL
AND is the reason why this item should have had field trials for upto a year before release - every new product can
have tething problems and certainly be modded over time.
It will be interesting to see how they fair this time next year
Darran
Darran,
Paul has only had the 22ft first release glass pole not the UL26. We have had no reports of the UL26 snapping at all. We've tested before release and had no issues and none so far. But as you say time will tell.
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Paul, you need to speak as you find.
In all honesty it was my fault on the first batch of poles. In reality, the first run is a test to make sure the mold is correct as they usally need adjustment. I called off over 200 of first runs instead of the usual 6 or so sets as the prototypes were great and I wanted to get them out there ASAP! Well I've learnt my lesson, but we will refining and developing to make the best product out there. So far so good.
I would suggested to make the top neck from carbon fiber or light aluminum, this way less risk of braking.
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thanks paul for the review. and thank you stephen for your honest reply. It seems teething problems are getting sorted and people love the clamps.
I think we should have a product review section on here. What do you think?
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I would suggested to make the top neck from carbon fiber or light aluminum, this way less risk of braking.
The improvements in the new top collar is a massive step forward... This makes a big improvement even at this early stage!!
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thanks paul for the review. and thank you stephen for your honest reply. It seems teething problems are getting sorted and people love the clamps.
I think we should have a product review section on here. What do you think?
Yeah, CIU should set us up our own section in the suppliers arena....
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thanks for the clarification
Darran
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Yeah, CIU should set us up our own section in the suppliers arena....
It's such a sensible idea and I don't know why it hasn't already been done.
I'm looking to buy a new pole in the new year and it'll be a Gardiners simply because their poles are tried and tested.
However, if there was a review section then I might be thinking otherwise but as it is, if I want to read any comments or pro's and con's about other makes, then it's a whole thing wading through piles of postings.
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mike i think its a new top collar and top clamp i need i didnt facebook you , because i thought you would be getting sick of me ;D ;D ;D as you say i did get it free after all so i was just going to cut my losses on it
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mike i think its a new top collar and top clamp i need i didnt facebook you , because i thought you would be getting sick of me ;D ;D ;D as you say i did get it free after all so i was just going to cut my losses on it
Cool... The feedback is what we need.. I want get you back up and runnin ASAP...
The parts will be en route after the holidays..
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thank you mate ;D ;D
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They've done the hardest bit; getting a brand.
Then again so did the 'makers' lol of Magica.
I'd certainly consider one when the time comes to upgrade. Got no reason not to to be honest.
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sounds to me as facelift have really got their act together .. to get the teething problems remidied is a great reasurrance to prospective buyers... impressive to see their after sales is getting a massive thumbs up. keep up the good work guys...
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Thanks Guys!
Luckily for me the team behind me here are second to none...
Products and service will only ever improve!!
Keep the feedback coming!!