Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: CleanClear on December 21, 2012, 08:08:19 pm
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This seems a very haphazard website and a good example of how not to do things correctly.
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/
There is a blanket method statement and risk assesment policy on offer..........
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
I just love this. Its designed to look professional. It just smacks incompetence. If a reliance on a blanket policy is the method then it suggests a thorough method statement and risk assesment will not take place and there will be a reliance upon this blanket statement. So basically nothing will be done to assess an individual risk other than refer to this document. Great start !!! It gets better. ;D
CRB check, now known as a DBS disclosure (Disclosure and Barring Service)
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesCRB.pdf
It suggests that although Lanes has been going since 2003 (according to the website) the CRB check has been due to an application for employment this year, to someone else ;D
Further to that this 'confidential' information which should be kept secure and only available to concerned parties seems to break every rule of the CRB guidance. Lets see what the guidance says........
1. Have a written policy on the secure handling of Disclosure information which, in the case of Umbrella
Bodies, should be made available to their clients;
Not seen one of them, may be available though.
2. Store Disclosure information securely;
Doesn't appear secure, as per link above. It seems freely available to the public.
4. Ensure that no reproductions of the Disclosure or its content are made, including photocopies or
scanned images, unless with the prior agreement of the CRB or as a result of a stipulated
requirement relating to the e-channel service;
I've no idea if permission was obtained.
5. Only share Disclosure information with relevant persons in the course of their specific duties relevant
to recruitment and vetting processes;
Hmm. If i can see it and i'm not relevant i'm not sure this is being complied with.
Now, which one of us is gonna contact the ICO office first to check all my claims out ?
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This seems a very haphazard website and a good example of how not to do things correctly.
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/
There is a blanket method statement and risk assesment policy on offer..........
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
I just love this. Its designed to look professional. It just smacks incompetence. If a reliance on a blanket policy is the method then it suggests a thorough method statement and risk assesment will not take place and there will be a reliance upon this blanket statement. So basically nothing will be done to assess an individual risk other than refer to this document. Great start !!! It gets better. ;D
CRB check, now known as a DBS disclosure (Disclosure and Barring Service)
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesCRB.pdf
It suggests that although Lanes has been going since 2003 (according to the website) the CRB check has been due to an application for employment this year, to someone else ;D
Further to that this 'confidential' information which should be kept secure and only available to concerned parties seems to break every rule of the CRB guidance. Lets see what the guidance says........
1. Have a written policy on the secure handling of Disclosure information which, in the case of Umbrella
Bodies, should be made available to their clients;
Not seen one of them, may be available though.
2. Store Disclosure information securely;
Doesn't appear secure, as per link above. It seems freely available to the public.
4. Ensure that no reproductions of the Disclosure or its content are made, including photocopies or
scanned images, unless with the prior agreement of the CRB or as a result of a stipulated
requirement relating to the e-channel service;
I've no idea if permission was obtained.
5. Only share Disclosure information with relevant persons in the course of their specific duties relevant
to recruitment and vetting processes;
Hmm. If i can see it and i'm not relevant i'm not sure this is being complied with.
Now, which one of us is gonna contact the ICO office first to check all my claims out ?
I'm sure you mean well but this isnt really the way to do it.
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Thanks cleanClear.
I'm a window cleaner-not a web guy. Suggestions welcome though.
Method statement-no matter where the job is-I use the same method, if any specifics are needed then they will get done as needed.
CRB-(DBS) yes, RE-done this year, they should only last 3 years at most.
Break a 'rule' of guidance? It's guidance-not a rule. It's easier to direct a customer to the website than forward documents to each individual.
The disclosure information is for the body asking for the CRB, not me. If I want to tell the entire world that I have no criminal convictions, I am legally allowed.
4-you are spot on-you have no idea.
5-again, you are not relevant.
Thanks for your interest.
www.laneswindowcleaning.com Rutland
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Thanks sunshine
www.laneswindowcleaning.com Rutland
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No problem.
I didn't read the RAMS but on mine I use a couple of phrases which are something like.
"A dynamic risk assesment will be carried out before work commences"
This means that you look at the risks anew before you start in addition to the written one as things change all the time.
Now I cant remember what the second one was...
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cleancare, do you know the saying "mind your own business" what odds is it to you how anothers website looks
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I'll check with the ICO myself, if its ok then i'll use it myself. If its not i'll let you know. It seems only fair that if we are going to use CRB as a tool to gain work over a competitor that it is indeed used correctly and not misused. If it was misused then that itself would make it a joke.
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cleancare, do you know the saying "mind your own business" what odds is it to you how anothers website looks
Its cleanclear Stu, 'cleanclear'. Not cleancare. I'll tell you why it matters, when people flout the law to make themselves look more law abiding i find it morally wrong (aside from the legal aspect). So when you break the law to show information you shouldn't in order to tell people you are law abiding it sticks in my throat. But thats just me. And i'm entitled to say what i like about it.
And when people post a bogus method statement and risk assesment without seeing a job, i think i'm correct to point it out as bogus. Which it is.
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Why the vitriol for me and my site?
The CRB was actually originally gained because I used to lecture/teach. But it helped me gain more work when I started cleaning educational premises even though anyone asking for a CRB is legally obliged to pay for the check. Hence the 'employed' part.
As for gaining work over a competitor, it's not used like that.
Work is gained on a number of factors-dotting the i's and crossing the T's of red tape and beurocracy are the last things to be sorted-long after the job has been 'awarded'- in my experience of jobs that require CRB's.
In case you're wondering, I'm still using CRB rather than DBS bEcause when my CRB was carried out it was a CRB and it was only 21 days ago that CRB changed to DBS and as such, no DBS have been issued yet to my knowledge.
Why have you not posted your site?
www.laneswindowcleaning.com Rutland
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Au shine-just looked at your site, nice!
We went walking in Hathersage this summer, went to Bluejohn cave (or something) very nice part of the world to be working in!
All the best, Darren
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Why the vitriol for me and my site?
I don't have any vitriol for you and your site, i'm just pointing out the errors of it. Finding or seeing your site wasn't hard because you advertise it in every post you make.
The CRB was actually originally gained because I used to lecture/teach. But it helped me gain more work when I started cleaning educational premises even though anyone asking for a CRB is legally obliged to pay for the check. Hence the 'employed' part.
I fully understamd how CRB works.
As for gaining work over a competitor, it's not used like that.
Work is gained on a number of factors-dotting the i's and crossing the T's of red tape and beurocracy are the last things to be sorted-long after the job has been 'awarded'- in my experience of jobs that require CRB's.
If a job requires a CRB then they need to do it and not rely on what you replicate to them, so it seems superflouous to advertise your self as 'crb checked' .
In case you're wondering, I'm still using CRB rather than DBS bEcause when my CRB was carried out it was a CRB and it was only 21 days ago that CRB changed to DBS and as such, no DBS have been issued yet to my knowledge.
I wasn't wondering.
Why have you not posted your site?
I didn't want anyone nitpicking mine so i never posted it.
www.laneswindowcleaning.com Rutland
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cleancare, do you know the saying "mind your own business" what odds is it to you how anothers website looks
Its cleanclear Stu, 'cleanclear'. Not cleancare. I'll tell you why it matters, when people flout the law to make themselves look more law abiding i find it morally wrong (aside from the legal aspect). So when you break the law to show information you shouldn't in order to tell people you are law abiding it sticks in my throat. But thats just me. And i'm entitled to say what i like about it.
And when people post a bogus method statement and risk assesment without seeing a job, i think i'm correct to point it out as bogus. Which it is.
thanks for clearing up your name, mine is Stuart not Stu thanks ;D as far as I can see it is just an example of his method statement and risk assessment, and an individual one would be given to the client, as far as the legality's of CRB I don't know but to be honest he is to far away from me even to worry about it ;) he is fair distance from you as far as I can see as well.
but if you feel he is breaking a law in displaying something and you are concerned for him why not just send a private message via his website instead of publicly trying to show him up. I don't get your gripe with him.
ps looked at your website and I can't believe you use a karcher for internal glass and do domestic cleaning for £9 a hour ;D but I wouldn't dare slate you for it ;)
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Throwing stones while your own 'glasshouse' is well hidden. Each to their own.
You understand CRB-I'll sleep we'll tonight.
It is superfluous but knowing I have it helps some customers.
Sorry to have assumed you were able to wonder.
See first sentence.
If I ever make a wrong turn and unfortunately end up in Merseyside, I'll make sure to not pop in for a brew.
Good night and god bless.
www.laneswindowcleaning.com Rutland
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Fair play Stuart! How did you find CleanClaire's website?
£9p/h?! No wonder you're aggy! Claire, do you wanna borrow a tenner?
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ps looked at your website and I can't believe you use a karcher for internal glass and do domestic cleaning for £9 a hour ;D but I wouldn't dare slate you for it ;)
Ssshhh!!!!! Did you see the CRB check bit ? But to be correct its not my website and you'll find the bloke that it is is called Gary. My names Mike . ;D You'll have to look harder for mine. Mine doesn't do domestic cleaning. I'm CRB checked too. Oh, mine reads like a dictionary, but i never mention that bit. But i am CRB checked and could say just so...but i don't. Look, its either right or its wrong. Legally producing your crb docs on a website is illegal, thats not guidance, thats a fact. Producing a method statement and risk assesment on your website whilst not illegal is not worth the screen its written on, its worthless. I'm just pointing out the futility and illegality of such actions for the greater good of window cleaning and the whole trade in general. I'm a good guy like that.
So in summary we have what looks like a legit method statement and risk assesment backed up with a CRB check and on face value you'd think everything is top job. The actual fact is that is all a sham and a con.
There is no such thing as a blanket method statement/risk assesment with out seeing the work, there is no such thing as CRB checked unless YOU check them. Its a swizz. If it looks like a duck, swims like one and quacks then its a duck. That page is a technical swizz, designed to over rate the operators qualifications.
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Fair play Stuart! How did you find CleanClaire's website?
£9p/h?! No wonder you're aggy! Claire, do you wanna borrow a tenner?
He never found my website. HTH's.
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Sorry Claire.
Ill wait for SWAT to come knocking.
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Do the Rutles live near you?
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Just had to google that!
I'm 30-wasn't born then.
No, they can't afford to live near me.
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All the best Witt hat sweetheart.
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I think I did find the right website, but hey I could be wrong and if I am, should you not be worried about your competition falsely claiming warrant's will be void if solar panels are not cleaned every six months? I find that hard to believe
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I couldn't find the solar bit.
I found this website that I thought was his website...
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co.uk/home
Course, it could all be an elaborate ruse to direct web traffic to his page.
Quite like the site tbh.
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I think I did find the right website, but hey I could be wrong
You never. And you're wrong. My names Mike. SteM from here knows me as does Colin purewater. They've met me. Now you go ring that number on that site or ask them if thats my number? Also Gav has my number !! ;D As do a few others, ad they definatley know my names Mike. And non of them vehicles on that site are drivcen by me or are mine ;D
and if I am, should you not be worried about your competition falsely claiming warrant's will be void if solar panels are not cleaned every six months? I find that hard to believe
I've no idea, i've not seen it.
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I couldn't find the solar bit.
I found this website that I thought was his website...
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co.uk/home
Course, it could all be an elaborate ruse to direct web traffic to his page.
Quite like the site tbh.
You found me !!!! But unlike you, there is no misleading claims on mine. Put mine in your sig and get me a few more google hits !!!
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I couldn't find the solar bit.
I found this website that I thought was his website...
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co.uk/home
Course, it could all be an elaborate ruse to direct web traffic to his page.
Quite like the site tbh.
could be, not the one I found
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co/
who knows ;D
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im CRB Checked and i advertise it, i think its a great thing to have on your portfolio, got me a few bigs jobs because of it,
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I think it's the same bud.
The image of a red/orange fibreglass pole cleaning some white UPVC cladding is the same.
Not sure about the picture of his Mum on there.
And surely there can't be many people charging £9p/h?
Like you say, who knows?
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ok ok I believe you and you are correct no dodgy claims on your site :D sorry, but check the one I posted I find that claim hard to believe, not that it bothers me ;)
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Richard, how dare you!!!
I'm calling ICO right now!
No, wait...
They couldn't give a toss.
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I think I did find the right website, but hey I could be wrong and if I am, should you not be worried about your competition falsely claiming warrant's will be void if solar panels are not cleaned every six months? I find that hard to believe
not having them clean dose not void the warranty's! thats just a scare tactic!
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Richard, how dare you!!!
I'm calling ICO right now!
No, wait...
They couldn't give a toss.
lol
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who is the ICO anyway ???
yes richard I agree on the scare tactic
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who is the ICO anyway ???
yes richard I agree on the scare tactic
Information Commissioner's Office
like saying that if you dont clean your windows the warrenty is void!
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Stuart, definitely the same site. The image of the funny little on/off road Barbie jeep thing is on them both. Before and after gaudy signwriting.
Agreed though, invalidating warranty?!
"Sorry sir, we can't fix the problem in your 7 month old BMW because you appear to not have had it valeted in some days"
I think we should all try and run our own businesses and help the people we meet on this site. Cussing people isn't the way forward.
Especially as (sorry if you haven't) we have got best part of 2 weeks r&r in front of us.
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Stuart, definitely the same site. The image of the funny little on/off road Barbie jeep thing is on them both. Before and after gaudy signwriting.
Agreed though, invalidating warranty?!
"Sorry sir, we can't fix the problem in your 7 month old BMW because you appear to not have had it valeted in some days"
I think we should all try and run our own businesses and help the people we meet on this site. Cussing people isn't the way forward.
Especially as (sorry if you haven't) we have got best part of 2 weeks r&r in front of us.
Lets see what the ICO says........I'll keep you posted.
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ok ok I believe you and you are correct no dodgy claims on your site :D sorry, but check the one I posted I find that claim hard to believe, not that it bothers me ;)
I'm not sure you know what day it actually is, but i'll give you the benefit of the doubt !! ;D ;D
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The method statement looks ok to me, just a generic example, when we submit quotes we are asked for generic ones as an example of what we include
As for the crb, you have a duty to keep your employees crb s private, but what you do with your own is a different matter,
I just find this whole post petty, really can't understand the motive of picking in a fellow Wc
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Stuart, definitely the same site. The image of the funny little on/off road Barbie jeep thing is on them both. Before and after gaudy signwriting.
Agreed though, invalidating warranty?!
"Sorry sir, we can't fix the problem in your 7 month old BMW because you appear to not have had it valeted in some days"
I think we should all try and run our own businesses and help the people we meet on this site. Cussing people isn't the way forward.
Especially as (sorry if you haven't) we have got best part of 2 weeks r&r in front of us.
Lets see what the ICO says........I'll keep you posted.
think someone has had one to many tonight!
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Thanks David. It is mine, not an employees. Thanks for clarification.
All the best for the new year to everyone. Even Claire-chill out bud, life's too short.
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Stuart, definitely the same site. The image of the funny little on/off road Barbie jeep thing is on them both. Before and after gaudy signwriting.
Agreed though, invalidating warranty?!
"Sorry sir, we can't fix the problem in your 7 month old BMW because you appear to not have had it valeted in some days"
I think we should all try and run our own businesses and help the people we meet on this site. Cussing people isn't the way forward.
Especially as (sorry if you haven't) we have got best part of 2 weeks r&r in front of us.
I'm helping you, i'm telling you your risk/method is not worth the paper its written on if you're using the one on your site, and i'm telling you that your CRB check is probably illegally displayed on your site and not only that , for anyone who actually does require a crb check it still does not fulfill their criteria, i.e they have to check themselves. Of course i reckon you know this already and you leave it there as a marketing advantage. Maybe i'm wrong and you don't know this and you'll remove it? Who knows? !!
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deary me, all he is doing is showing a risk/method statement and the fact he is CRB checked, so potential clients will know he will pass if they have him checked ;) nothing sinister in that surely, I advertise I am police vetted as part of the licensing process in scotland, but if someone needs me crb checked I know I will have to do it again
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deary me, all he is doing is showing a risk/method statement and the fact he is CRB checked, so potential clients will know he will pass if they have him checked ;) nothing sinister in that surely, I advertise I am police vetted as part of the licensing process in scotland, but if someone needs me crb checked I know I will have to do it again
So you clearly havn't looked at his method/risk assesment? Its rubbish, and i mean muppetstyle !! Go look ,read it. Risk..bucket, ladder, trip no mention of using a squeegee or ladder in the method !!! You could of just writ a poem there !!!
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
CRB is a whole different kettle of fish. Its illegal to display the cert up without permission, and anyone who requires one needs to request one themselves not rely on some internet copy. Of course being a Scottish licensed window cleaner you'll appreciate that everything should be in order, in order to protect the public. Its not in order here.
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I just find this whole post petty, really can't understand the motive of picking in a fellow Wc
Fellow ? Sorry, if i was going to advertise myself as being a cut above the rest by providing HSE docs and the like i think i'd get it right. Thats what i'd like to think. I wouldn't take umberance at someone pointing out what i got wrong.
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deary me, all he is doing is showing a risk/method statement and the fact he is CRB checked, so potential clients will know he will pass if they have him checked ;) nothing sinister in that surely, I advertise I am police vetted as part of the licensing process in scotland, but if someone needs me crb checked I know I will have to do it again
So you clearly havn't looked at his method/risk assesment? Its rubbish, and i mean muppetstyle !! Go look ,read it. Risk..bucket, ladder, trip no mention of using a squeegee or ladder in the method !!! You could of just writ a poem there !!!
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
CRB is a whole different kettle of fish. Its illegal to display the cert up without permission, and anyone who requires one needs to request one themselves not rely on some internet copy. Of course being a Scottish licensed window cleaner you'll appreciate that everything should be in order, in order to protect the public. Its not in order here.
ok took a look, no not how I would do a risk or method statement, but that is up to the client to look and judge, I think dave covered the legal side of the displaying the CRB, unless he has it wrong,
but my main original point is why do you care? he is miles away from you and no threat to your business, if you are genuinely concerned for him, you could have done it a lot better than slating him on an open forum,
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deary me, all he is doing is showing a risk/method statement and the fact he is CRB checked, so potential clients will know he will pass if they have him checked ;) nothing sinister in that surely, I advertise I am police vetted as part of the licensing process in scotland, but if someone needs me crb checked I know I will have to do it again
So you clearly havn't looked at his method/risk assesment? Its rubbish, and i mean muppetstyle !! Go look ,read it. Risk..bucket, ladder, trip no mention of using a squeegee or ladder in the method !!! You could of just writ a poem there !!!
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
CRB is a whole different kettle of fish. Its illegal to display the cert up without permission, and anyone who requires one needs to request one themselves not rely on some internet copy. Of course being a Scottish licensed window cleaner you'll appreciate that everything should be in order, in order to protect the public. Its not in order here.
ok took a look, no not how I would do a risk or method statement, but that is up to the client to look and judge, I think dave covered the legal side of the displaying the CRB, unless he has it wrong,
but my main original point is why do you care? he is miles away from you and no threat to your business, if you are genuinely concerned for him, you could have done it a lot better than slating him on an open forum,
I'm right about everything i said. I didn't just open my mouth and guess. But to why do i care? I've no idea. But sometimes you just read stuff and think ...thats bolloxs and i'm going to say its bollox. And thats exactly what i've done. I'm not genuinley concerned for anyone here, but the guy is not on his own, there is a trend towards websites saying all this crap, HSE risk and method statement, CRB check blah blah blah, and then all that CITRB, CHAS, CHAP, CLAP, CLAP HAP CHAP accreditation which in itself is another joke and another subject. And someone
needs to say, its bollox.
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deary me, all he is doing is showing a risk/method statement and the fact he is CRB checked, so potential clients will know he will pass if they have him checked ;) nothing sinister in that surely, I advertise I am police vetted as part of the licensing process in scotland, but if someone needs me crb checked I know I will have to do it again
So you clearly havn't looked at his method/risk assesment? Its rubbish, and i mean muppetstyle !! Go look ,read it. Risk..bucket, ladder, trip no mention of using a squeegee or ladder in the method !!! You could of just writ a poem there !!!
http://www.laneswindowcleaning.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/LanesMethodStatement.pdf
CRB is a whole different kettle of fish. Its illegal to display the cert up without permission, and anyone who requires one needs to request one themselves not rely on some internet copy. Of course being a Scottish licensed window cleaner you'll appreciate that everything should be in order, in order to protect the public. Its not in order here.
ok took a look, no not how I would do a risk or method statement, but that is up to the client to look and judge, I think dave covered the legal side of the displaying the CRB, unless he has it wrong,
but my main original point is why do you care? he is miles away from you and no threat to your business, if you are genuinely concerned for him, you could have done it a lot better than slating him on an open forum,
I'm right about everything i said. I didn't just open my mouth and guess. But to why do i care? I've no idea. But sometimes you just read stuff and think ...thats bolloxs and i'm going to say its bollox. And thats exactly what i've done. I'm not genuinley concerned for anyone here, but the guy is not on his own, there is a trend towards websites saying all this crap, HSE risk and method statement, CRB check blah blah blah, and then all that CITRB, CHAS, CHAP, CLAP, CLAP HAP CHAP accreditation which in itself is another joke and another subject. And someone
needs to say, its bollox.
By the sounds of it you don't even give a s**t about hse stuff and how to protect your business and yourself,
Lots of guys , including me, spent the time to do all this and to fully comply with the hse.
Just go to bed and sleep it all off.
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right, banging my head against a table, I will try again, why didn't you do it it a more polite fashion?
I have no problems with his site or anyones, but if it really annoyed you why not just a FAO lanes, just noticed your site and I think you may breaching a few rules blah blah then explain what to do about it,
but your OP was a total random attack at his website and a bit uncalled for
that is my point, and I am not sure he is breaching any rules anyway, even you said probably displaying illegally, I don't think he is, but I could be wrong, I do know(think) you should have an address on any website and I very rarely see that on anyones :-\
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By the sounds of it you don't even give a s**t about hse stuff and how to protect your business and yourself,
Lots of guys , including me, spent the time to do all this and to fully comply with the hse.
Just go to bed and sleep it all off.
Richard, i tried to ignore you, but i'll indulge you now. I've nothing to sleep off. I.e i havn't had a drink if thats what you're refering too. You've a problem with me spouting bollox? Or peoples websites that are bollox? Ok, i can live with that.
I'm very aware of HSE and its issues, and how it protects me and my business. Now i'll assume you are too, look at Lanes method/risk statement statement and tell me if you'd use that.
Hang on.................STOP PRESS>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Richards website................
http://rcpropertymaintenance.vpweb.co.uk/?prefix=www
Now i was bedazzled by the city and guilds logo, then the big CRB checked logo with a tick in it, i'm curious about that, i'd like to learn more about it. And the best is................the Disclosure Scotland Logo...for a company that operates in Northampton. Now Richard, lets assume its me thats ped and i'm simple, why does a company in Northamptonshire , England promote a 'disclosure Scotland' logo ? What category was your CRB disclosure for?
MY CRB checks where done by a Nigerian company, i have a disclosure Nigeria logo, i just need to get a minute to upload it, i've no doubt i'll get time over the holiday. Whilst you like Scotland so much, did you mention you are NOT licensed like all the Scottish window cleaners, or maybe that point wasn't to important?
Anyway aside from all that, hows the monthly draw going? Is it generating new leads for work and how are you coping with the Berlingo van ? Has the hot water system you fitted nearly put it overweight?
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CleanClear can we see your website please?
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right, banging my head against a table, I will try again, why didn't you do it it a more polite fashion?
I have no problems with his site or anyones, but if it really annoyed you why not just a FAO lanes, just noticed your site and I think you may breaching a few rules blah blah then explain what to do about it,
but your OP was a total random attack at his website and a bit uncalled for
that is my point, and I am not sure he is breaching any rules anyway, even you said probably displaying illegally, I don't think he is, but I could be wrong, I do know(think) you should have an address on any website and I very rarely see that on anyones :-\
Stuart, please dont hurt yourself on account of me. Do not hit your head on a table, it hurts and could cause untold amount of damage later in life. Even for the short amount you have left. At the very best his HSE doc is not worth the paper its written on, and his CRB is illegally produced and worthless to anyone who requires one. At worst the HSE doc is a fraud and the CRB is totally misleading and preying upon peoples fears, and infact misleads people into trusting the operative without a proper check them selves. Thats actually how it is.
Now i'm sorry its random,or maybe its not so random. I get his website in every post i read of his so thats how i got to see it. Ok, whats next?
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CleanClear can we see your website please?
You can if you can find it, should be easy reading this thread as even a moron could work out what it is. The clue is where i say ...yes you found me. But other than that mate, no. I'm not putting mine up for public scrutiny.
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But you'll shoot anyone elses down who you choose to scrutinise?
If you see fit.
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By the sounds of it you don't even give a s**t about hse stuff and how to protect your business and yourself,
Lots of guys , including me, spent the time to do all this and to fully comply with the hse.
Just go to bed and sleep it all off.
Richard, i tried to ignore you, but i'll indulge you now. I've nothing to sleep off. I.e i havn't had a drink if thats what you're refering too. You've a problem with me spouting bollox? Or peoples websites that are bollox? Ok, i can live with that.
I'm very aware of HSE and its issues, and how it protects me and my business. Now i'll assume you are too, look at Lanes method/risk statement statement and tell me if you'd use that.
Hang on.................STOP PRESS>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Richards website................
http://rcpropertymaintenance.vpweb.co.uk/?prefix=www
Now i was bedazzled by the city and guilds logo, then the big CRB checked logo with a tick in it, i'm curious about that, i'd like to learn more about it. And the best is................the Disclosure Scotland Logo...for a company that operates in Northampton. Now Richard, lets assume its me thats ped and i'm simple, why does a company in Northamptonshire , England promote a 'disclosure Scotland' logo ? What category was your CRB disclosure for?
MY CRB checks where done by a Nigerian company, i have a disclosure Nigeria logo, i just need to get a minute to upload it, i've no doubt i'll get time over the holiday. Whilst you like Scotland so much, did you mention you are NOT licensed like all the Scottish window cleaners, or maybe that point wasn't to important?
Anyway aside from all that, hows the monthly draw going? Is it generating new leads for work and how are you coping with the Berlingo van ? Has the hot water system you fitted nearly put it overweight?
e being self employed, you can only get a Scottish disclosure which is the same as a CRB.
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
If your CRB was done by another country then they won't be recognized here in the UK.
As for the berlingo its going very well thank you, as for the weight limit I fully loaded it up with all my equipment and 2 sets of ladders, 1 being triple but I never carry them as I only use them once or twice when I'm not doing any window cleaning, just gutter cleaning.
Then I took it down to a weigh bridge and got it check and it's still under the payload, with me in it!!!
Can scan the certificate and post it if you want to see it?????
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I presume this is it
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co
The search function doesn't work. Not that anyone should need one.
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nah try the other one risenshine, my head is fine by the way ;D
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This?
https://sites.google.com/site/cleanandclearcleaninggbbo00/
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I presume this is it
http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co
The search function doesn't work. Not that anyone should need one.
You need a search function to find an address in a thread? God help us. You go for it kid, you found me. OK , now go !!!
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This?
https://sites.google.com/site/cleanandclearcleaninggbbo00/
Quandry eh?
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I havent read the thread. These threads on CIU are too predictable. Someone comes on here with an inferiority complex and kicks off, someone else responds, they get personal, the details are irrelevant.
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I guess any attention is good attention to a scouser with an inferiority complex, bit like an 8 year old ADHD sufferer.
Still, you crack on big boy.
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e being self employed, you can only get a Scottish disclosure which is the same as a CRB.
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
Hang on we're getting somewhere, self employed, Scottish discosure you say? Only ? Is Lanes one a Scottish one?
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I guess any attention is good attention to a scouser with an inferiority complex, bit like an 8 year old ADHD sufferer.
Still, you crack on big boy.
You keep up the good work doing your charity bike rides, then making fun of people in mugger masks. You're one of the good guys. Ignore me.
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e being self employed, you can only get a Scottish disclosure which is the same as a CRB.
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
Hang on we're getting somewhere, self employed, Scottish discosure you say? Only ? Is Lanes one a Scottish one?
Depends. If you have a registered company Ltd then you can get a full on as it's the company getting it not you.
If I made my company a Ltd then I can get hold of a full crb!
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e being self employed, you can only get a Scottish disclosure which is the same as a CRB.
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
Hang on we're getting somewhere, self employed, Scottish discosure you say? Only ? Is Lanes one a Scottish one?
Depends. If you have a registered company Ltd then you can get a full on as it's the company getting it not you.
If I made my company a Ltd then I can get hold of a full crb!
Richard, you've come here to defend Lanes CRB. Its not in his company name, its as an employee (for someone else). You're aware it illegal to disclose an employees details without their consent. In any case its illegal to reproduce them other than to concerned parties and they should be secure. You're also aware you can;t (easily) get your own CRB without doing the scotland stint. Somehow, you think him producing a CRB from a previous employer (in England) and producing it as his own , whilst stating he's been going since 2003 is a bonafide use of the CRB status?
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e being self employed, you can only get a Scottish disclosure which is the same as a CRB.
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
Hang on we're getting somewhere, self employed, Scottish discosure you say? Only ? Is Lanes one a Scottish one?
Depends. If you have a registered company Ltd then you can get a full on as it's the company getting it not you.
If I made my company a Ltd then I can get hold of a full crb!
Richard, you've come here to defend Lanes CRB. Its not in his company name, its as an employee (for someone else). You're aware it illegal to disclose an employees details without their consent. In any case its illegal to reproduce them other than to concerned parties and they should be secure. You're also aware you can;t (easily) get your own CRB without doing the scotland stint. Somehow, you think him producing a CRB from a previous employer (in England) and producing it as his own , whilst stating he's been going since 2003 is a bonafide use of the CRB status?
As the crb is still valid yes he still can use it. As he is crb checked.
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Get a life Claire,you're probably strugglin for work, so feel the need to NIT PICK
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never mind all this pish, Rutland Lake has to be the best trout fishing in Britain, I have flown back from Germany just to fish there :D I even slept in the back of vans to fish there after many hours drive :D love the place
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Being the season of good will I would like to wish you all a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.
Graham
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What a strange thread ??????????????????????????????????????????
i can't get to grips with this 'attack' most of which seems inaccurate - but hey ho different folks different strokes
Mr Lane - chin up mate
Darran
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Can you answer one question, Cleanclear? What the **** has it got to do with you, a Liverpool window cleaner, what a Rutland window cleaner is doing?
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I can't believe that I've just wasted 25mins of my saturday morning reading through that poope. I must be one sad individual to even put myself through it. ;D
I think that everybody who has posted on here, including me, needs to take a good long look at themselves in the mirror and get a life. 8)
I'm going to finish my porridge and get back to playing on my football manager 2013 game now.
Merry Xmas,
Dean. :-* :-* :-*
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I don't know who owns the site: http://www.cleanandclearcleaning.co.uk but the incorrect use of grammar APPALLS me ;). For example, "We are a Window Cleaning Service based in Liverpool". Since when has Window Cleaning Service been a proper noun requiring the use of capitals? It should be "window cleaning service", surely.
Indeed to go on... I believe that Clean and Clear Window Cleaning mean to say that they offer a window cleaning service and are not themselves "a window cleaning service". If they were that would be breaking the laws of particle physics or some such rule, which would have this forum aflame with resentment. I think its just bad grammar myself.
If I were a customer i'd think, "How uprofessional, they can't even get the grammer right", but that's just me - no malice intended to the site's owners. Whoever they are.
You know Cleanclear it's not really what you said in your original post, but the way you said it that has us all wondering about you. All of us could have benefitted from your razor like insight had you had the decency not to slag off someone's website in the way you did. But you've managed to alienate people. Well done chum.
Lane - you have my vote bud.
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:)
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Having just read the method statement I don't think it's actually that bad, the guy has covered the main points and identified the risks. A rams package does not need to be war and peace, it can all fit on half an a4 sheet if needs be, a risk assessment for window cleaning only has to be a few lines long. Identify the risk, record, then put in any control measures to reduce that risk.
Anything more than the basics and the rams becomes useless, because those at risk will not read it
One sheet of a4 IMO is the best way to display the ms
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Its threads like this that really put me off forums. :-[
Your a Troll just pointlessly picking a fight with someone who has no impact on your own business. Why bother?
Instead of reading stuff that does not concern you try something of use next time.
http://tinyurl.com/dxhyroh
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Its threads like this that really put me off forums. :-[
Your a Troll just pointlessly picking a fight with someone who has no impact on your own business. Why bother?
Instead of reading stuff that does not concern you try something of use next time.
http://tinyurl.com/dxhyroh
Fantastic book that. ;D Works wonders on customers, but best ignore it if you're on here picking fights ;)
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Lanes website mightn't be the best I've ever seen, & neither are the h&s bits - but they're far from the worst! Lanes should be praised for making more of an effort than 90% of all the cleaners I know.
Cleanclear - this thread really comes across as an unprovoked & random attack,.. you owe Lanes an apology & you need to cop on!
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Chris
Is that really you in your avatar ?
If so your hair isn't straight and needs reporting to the fringe police
I am surprised clean care didn't spot that
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>:( My mum spent hours cutting and styling my hair. I come on here and all I get is abuse!!! You're all out of the picture when it comes to new trends :(
My mum is a very successful hair stylist, she does her own hair too. Here's a pic of her.
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1356172470_mingin bird.jpg)
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Mr Bacon your mother is a drug dealer in Amsterdam, which explains your haircut and apparent immunity to penicillin. Something only children of street prostitutes inherit due to the parental needs to combat STDs and their dependancy on antibiotics.
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You could probably qualify for fringe benefits.
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cleancare, do you know the saying "mind your own business" what odds is it to you how anothers website looks
Oiii! dont drag me into this its cleanCLEAR who needs to wind his neck in ;D
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Fair play Stuart! How did you find CleanClaire's website?
£9p/h?! No wonder you're aggy! Claire, do you wanna borrow a tenner?
a bit too close for comfort that one but very funny ;D
I will have to get my legal team on this, I cant help but feel my good name has been besmirched a little by this thread :-\ ;D
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>:( My mum spent hours cutting and styling my hair. I come on here and all I get is abuse!!! You're all out of the picture when it comes to new trends :(
My mum is a very successful hair stylist, she does her own hair too. Here's a pic of her.
(http://www.cleanitup.co.uk/smf/1356172470_mingin bird.jpg)
I've had her.
I didn't go to bed with her when I left the pub but that's the one I woke up with.
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DAD!!! :D :D :D :D It's me!!
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Lanes website mightn't be the best I've ever seen, & neither are the h&s bits - but they're far from the worst! Lanes should be praised for making more of an effort than 90% of all the cleaners I know.
Cleanclear - this thread really comes across as an unprovoked & random attack,.. you owe Lanes an apology & you need to cop on!
Hmm. One of your mandates is to....
• To provide information and help to window cleaners.
I'm amazed at the lack of knowledge of a CRB check shown here. But here's some facts.
Window Cleaners do not need a CRB. Infact a prospective employer requesting one for such a position could find himself on the wrong side of the law. Advertising 'CRB checked' is very misleading, its uneccesary, its not required it also incorrectly sets a standard . i.e if you have been checked you are more kosher than someone who hasn't been. Its being used by many others too, not just Lanes, as a marketing/selling point. The information contained in a disclosure form is confidential.
Now of course, you can choose to ignore that information. BTW its not the first time this topic has arisen on here, i've mentioned it before.
Anyway, time to go shopping now and then get on the lash . Happy xmas all !!!
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I ask again, what has it got to do with you? He's 150 miles for you and you're telling the world about your view of his website. You're also threatening to refer him to the ICO.
You're coming across as pretty pathetic.
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Lanes website mightn't be the best I've ever seen, & neither are the h&s bits - but they're far from the worst! Lanes should be praised for making more of an effort than 90% of all the cleaners I know.
Cleanclear - this thread really comes across as an unprovoked & random attack,.. you owe Lanes an apology & you need to cop on!
Hmm. One of your mandates is to....
• To provide information and help to window cleaners.
I'm amazed at the lack of knowledge of a CRB check shown here. But here's some facts.
Window Cleaners do not need a CRB. Infact a prospective employer requesting one for such a position could find himself on the wrong side of the law. Advertising 'CRB checked' is very misleading, its uneccesary, its not required it also incorrectly sets a standard . i.e if you have been checked you are more kosher than someone who hasn't been. Its being used by many others too, not just Lanes, as a marketing/selling point. The information contained in a disclosure form is confidential.
Now of course, you can choose to ignore that information. BTW its not the first time this topic has arisen on here, i've mentioned it before.
Anyway, time to go shopping now and then get on the lash . Happy xmas all !!!
No a CRB check in not needed, but it helps, i've picked up schools, homes and other things because of it.
It won't get you into trouble with the law if the employer requests one for such a position, many cases in some homes and where children are about the place is bound to protect the children or elderly, so them going to some one that has already been checked is saving them money to start with as they don't need to do it. I think it's you that needs more knowledge on the subject!
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Reminds of that turnip that used to frequent this place, Ewan.
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lol, Ewan the Sainsbury's trolly collecter that pretended not to work for a supplier on here. ;D
Turnip, good description. ;)
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Reminds of that turnip that used to frequent this place, Ewan.
;D ;D ;D ;D
I remember him well. Did you know he was actually Richard who owns Tecbuk?
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Really? Was his surname Head?
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Reminds of that turnip that used to frequent this place, Ewan.
;D ;D ;D ;D
I remember him well. Did you know he was actually Richard who owns Tecbuk?
Really??
I didn't know that, but it sure does explain a lot!
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Reminds of that turnip that used to frequent this place, Ewan.
;D ;D ;D ;D
I remember him well. Did you know he was actually Richard who owns Tecbuk?
Really??
I didn't know that, but it sure does explain a lot!
Yep. ;)
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He had another alias, "Alex." if I remember correctly.
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And another, CleanClear.
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And another, CleanClear.
No, this definitely is not him! ;)
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wasnt it the guy who got banned before,called mike???? of cleancaire!!!!!!!!!!
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wasnt it the guy who got banned before,called mike???? of cleancaire!!!!!!!!!!
dont you start ;D
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he onlys come on a friday/saturday night after the his two pints down the pub
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Have you really got nothing better to do in life. Mr CC??? You really come across as an internet bully. For gods sake leave the bloke alone. Build a bridge and move on. :)
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Its Mike Cam. Pretty sound guy if you ask me.
Dean.
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Its Mike Cam. Pretty sound guy if you ask me.
Dean.
Youre saying it's Mike Cam with the original post?
If so then whether you think he's sound or not hes coming across as a bit of a pillock. Do you think his post is reasonable, picking on someone 140 miles from home who has done him no harm?
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Its Mike Cam. Pretty sound guy if you ask me.
Dean.
Youre saying it's Mike Cam with the original post?
If so then whether you think he's sound or not hes coming across as a bit of a pillock. Do you think his post is reasonable, picking on someone 140 miles from home who has done him no harm?
It seemed a little strange to be honest but I'm drinking so I'm not too fussed.
Dean.
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Tried to igore this but honestly you must be some kind of a saddo to come out with something like this!
If you have a serious concern the way to do it is to take the man aside - PM him or email - a quiet word in his ear - welcome word to the wise as sincere advise kind of way not try to humiliate someone in front of the whole WWW!!!
Happy New Year anyway - doubt you'll have one with an attitude your showing now.
G.
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he onlys come on a friday/saturday night after the his two pints down the pub
I onlys do. You can't whack coming on here after the his two pints. ;D
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I see the budding private detective removed his post. LOL !!!
Come on, if i'm posting half shot i at least expect you to keep up with me ;D
-----------------------------
For anyone who's wondering what i'm on about i'm refering to a post from this thread that has been deleted by its author.
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Im a little amazed by some of the replies to this post to be honest, i know Mike very well and I understand what his point is, the persons web site is flawed and he has pointed this out, its not bullying nor is it attacking the man, why have so many people jumped on this thread ? you all go on saying he is bullying someone over 140 miles away, no he aint he is helping him by pointing the flaws, illegal someo f them, on his site and instead of replying with a thanks and ill go alter them he just gets abuse in return.
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Im a little amazed by some of the replies to this post to be honest, i know Mike very well and I understand what his point is, the persons web site is flawed and he has pointed this out, its not bullying nor is it attacking the man, why have so many people jumped on this thread ? you all go on saying he is bullying someone over 140 miles away, no he aint he is helping him by pointing the flaws, illegal someo f them, on his site and instead of replying with a thanks and ill go alter them he just gets abuse in return.
If you read the very first post, Mike insults him & then threatens to report him. Now, which part of "genuine, honest advice" do you refer to?
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nope, dont see the insults, i see someone pointing out flaws, he also says 'which one is going to report him' id imagine thats called tongue in cheek, hey its christmas though and im sure were all in need of some christmas spirit
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Mike insults him & then threatens to report him. Now, which part of "genuine, honest advice" do you refer to?
Look, CRB checks are there for employers to make informed descisions as to who they can employ, and who is suitable for a job. (i'll try make it brief because it bores everyone when it goes to long, asides from that not many here have the equiptment to deal with the info)
Window cleaning is not subject to CRB checks. Not even if you clean a school or oap's home. That doesn;t stop some agencies taking the money and doing the check illegally for you. Even councils are starting to ask for this crap when it is of no concern to them. Infact its been so much abused and the system has been so heavily critiscised that the whole CRB thing has been disbanded and renamed the Discosure and Barring Service (its been amalgamated with other agencies).
This joker from the thread thinks its fine to advertise this..............
http://rcpropertymaintenance.vpweb.co.uk/?prefix=www
Richard Clues the owner of the site says............
There isn't any category for any CRB, they are against you as a person, it would be the same if it was a prison, hospital, school or any other job.
Of course there's no categorys of CRB's Richard. The different disclosures of information are just a figment of my imagination. I thought a basic one that you can obtain from disclosure scotland only discloses unspent convictions, and it does not disclose spent convictions, it does not disclose any attention you have recieved from the police (wether or not it resulted in a charge) it also importantly does not disclose anyone who is one the sex offenders register. Standard and enhanced are other options but they have to be warranted.
So thats where we are with that one. But you reckon it gets you work in schools etc ? LOL !!!
The Standard or Enhanced one can only be asked for if the position warrants it, thats a legal obligation. Just going in a school isn't enough, nor is just going in a OAP's home. BTW, if you get this wrong with an employee they can sue you. You also need to be registered to hold this info, and you can't disclose it willy nilly. If you get it through a third party as Lanes have done you're bound to the confidentiality agreement. Which he hasn't adhered to, its a criminal offence to ignore it. Maybe we can over look some crimes, and data protection issues to say the holder is sound? Or maybe we can just flout some laws to say we're law abiding?
Many people do not understand the whole CRB issue, thats amongst the reasons the whole system has been changed. The reason why i take umberance at anyones misuse of it is that i think we are all in a danger of sleepwalking into requiring it uneccesarily. Now that might seem hard to understand. Look at this recent debacle...................
http://www.swindonadvertiser.co.uk/news/9956891.School_wants_CRB_check_to_let_dad_watch_rugby_match/
Now of course the school are acting over their remit, what you gonna do? Call the Police? Don't think so, our convoluted legal system works like he'll have to take them to court to be allowed to go.
Now Richard got his own CRB from disclosure scotland, so it cannot be a standard or enhanced one. But Richard reckonsd it hepl him get jobs in schools , OAP homes etc..
Lanes got his through a third party, and its confidential but he uses it without confidence for his own purpose. See how flawed the whole system is? And when someone asks you (outside of their remit) are you crb checked and you say, nor do i need to be. They say, oh how come...Lanes window cleaning is, and Richards property maintainance is......... They're making a rod for our backs.
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I advertise that we are crb checked, which we all are, we have over 100 sites where we need crb, we even need crb just to quote certain sites without being accompanied
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Well he doesn't knock you dave cos he thinks lanes being newer will be an easier target. ;)
Didn't tosh ban mikecam for racism or something?
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I advertise that we are crb checked, which we all are, we have over 100 sites where we need crb, we even need crb just to quote certain sites without being accompanied
There's an anomally there. The results of a CRB check are confidential. So i would assume that wether you have a list as long as your arm on it or its as clean as a whistle you're not a liberty to say. If you did say it would compromise your employees privacy. But allow me to guess here, you are not a registered data controller, yours is done through a third party provider? I'll also guess even further, i'll bet probably not one job of yours is actually subject to being put through CRB checks. But they ask, you not wanting to rock the boat just comply?
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If you are going to quote me then quote the whole thing that I said not just bits and pieces of it.
You do need more training and understanding on all this before you comment on things like crbs etc, as what you say isn't right at all.
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You do need more training and understanding on all this before you comment on things like crbs etc, as what you say isn't right at all.
I'm open to any corrections in what i said Richard. If somethings wrong it can only benefit us all, point out whats wrong and we can look at it. There's no point in me saying any old crap and leaving it uncorrected.
And so we're clear you have a 'basic' self produced CRB check. That does not list spent convictions, does not list if you are on the sex offenders register, does not list any of your interactions with the Police.
How we doing so far, have i got anything wrong?
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I think Lanes and the other targets of ClearCare would be as well to simply ignore any thread from him. Looking at his back posts well over half are confrontational and none seem particularly helpful.
You get these sorts of posters from time to time. Maybe they do want to help but their interpersonal skills are lacking somewhat.
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I think Lanes and the other targets of ClearCare would be as well to simply ignore any thread from him. Looking at his back posts well over half are confrontational and none seem particularly helpful.
You get these sorts of posters from time to time. Maybe they do want to help but their interpersonal skills are lacking somewhat.
thats very true, jealous types that people are/ can go that extra mile in there business, or maybe he cant get a crb due to reasons what would show on it!
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Well done mate
Trust Dave,st Ives :-*
I didn't notice this was locked, I can still post with no notice to tell me that it is locked,
now unlocked, I didn't lock it in the first place
Happy now ;D