Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Joe W Brown on September 16, 2012, 10:49:02 am
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I own a new carpet cleaning business in Norwich.
A few weeks ago I joined cleantalk forum, to ask advice and browse the discussions. I was very excited, since I am very aware that the information on the forum (as with this forum) is invaluable for a startup carpet cleaner and I saw a forum like that as being the make or brake of my business, if I am to use it to its maximum potential.
I quickly noticed all the rave reviews of a certain cleaning product (*-pow**) and was quick to get my card out and purchase some of the product. A few days later it arrived in the post and excitedly I tried it out on the job which I had that morning.
After following recommended instructions, i applied warm, agitated, let it sit for 10 minute. then rinsed it off the heavily traffic marked wool carpet (it was in particually bad condition) and was quite unimpressed with the results. Not much change at all.
When I got home i posted my results on cleantalk and asked how this particular product compares to microsplitter products by another company (this other company, was the company who I had completed courses with and had been trained with and always used their products)
A few hours later, to my suprise, I had recieved a really unkind and hostile reply on the forum from a moderator, claiming that his records showed I had not purchased the said *-pow** and accusing me of working for a competitor, in order to market their products.
I posted a lengthly reply back to that post which included my invoice number and date of purchase (a few days before) and explaining that I had trained and bought all my equipment from competing company, so have always used their products. I was now interesting in expanding my list of products, hence my order and questions.
Apparently my public replies now needed to be moderated before they where visable, so I waited for the moderators to approve. And waited. And then my reply dissapeared into thin air.
Meanwhile other people had joined the discussion - commenting that my lack of reponse proves that I work for the competitor.
I was getting quite upset by this time and was desperatly posting replies, but each one was getting deleted by the moderators, who made no explination to me or anyone else.
I sent an email to an active moderator, requesting a solution to this problem (scuse the pun) but still have not received a reply to this day.
I recieved a phonecall from an associate a few days later, who had seen the accusations on the forum. He explained that this sort of behavour is common on the forum. Apparently they do not like any good comments about other products on the market, but praise any downtalking of them.
What struck me the most is their distinct lack of respect for me - one of their own customers.
:-/
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Joe this is a problem with the forums, there are so many shills that its hard to see the real people who are genuine, i read your post on Cleantalk
what you need to do is show that you are a real person with a real company other wise people will just accuse you of being a trouble causer, just like this post unless you fill out your profile everyone will see this post as an anti-cleantalk post rather than a genuine grievance
whats your company name & web address?
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;D ;D
Now there,s a surprise, ::) having said that the forum is owned by the supplier , so you will discover any mention of other products are met with a fervent response, you may even discover a few of the members on here who occasionaly mention the said suppliers products with some suttle placment advertising, quite easy to spot when you know though ;)
Geoff.
ps. got to agree, not nice when they accuse of making things up !!
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thought you was on your way to Dubai today Mike?
Geoff
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tonight.
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Cleantalk is a vehicle to sell solutions products and many of us oldies know this, the way I personally look at it is that it 'their' forum and 'they' can do what they want with it, I appreciate your concern though but if you go onto mitey forum or any other manufacturers forum you'll find a simular attitude, relax and enjoy this forum it may or may not be to your liking it's sometimes referred to on other forums as 'shout it up' but there is no agenda probably less rules a bit more of a 'lads' get together things do tend to roll a bit most like it that way some don't but it's your choice.
So welcome and enjoy.
Shaun (moderator)
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Joe this is a problem with the forums, there are so many shills that its hard to see the real people who are genuine, i read your post on Cleantalk
what you need to do is show that you are a real person with a real company other wise people will just accuse you of being a trouble causer, just like this post unless you fill out your profile everyone will see this post as an anti-cleantalk post rather than a genuine grievance
whats your company name & web address?
thanks for all the replies.
My website is www.carpetranger.com
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Don't worry about it mate ( just don't promote your storm lol)
There is a lot of great guys on there who have a wealth of info to help you. I too have had problems with that M stuff and up our way I changed the dilution to 100/1 and allowed a bit more dwell which seemed to be better, however it's not the be all and end all sometimes we have not got the time to hang about when other products will work quicker and better. I think you just have to take what you need from that forum as you have noted they are not interested when anything else is mentioned machine or chemicals from another supplier.
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;D ding ding ding
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Sounds like you got a raw deal there Joe.
Maybe worth phoning Nick and asking him whats going on? I'm sure he'll find it hard to blatantly lie to your face regarding your purchase of the product.
Just use this forum, you'll get a ton more information from a ton more members with no agenda! (apart from a small few trying to plug certain products... ;))
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My advise if still use both but realise the limitations of each
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Hi Guys
It always helps to know who pays for something as it allows a certain circumspection to some of the answers.
Personally I don't post on Cleantalk because I want to be free to say what I think.
You have a choice which to use but I know which I prefer.
Cheers
Doug
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If anyone Googles 'carpet cleaning forum UK' , its top of the listing ! ..
It poses as a normal CC forum ... but Its a Venus flytrap !
It lures the unsuspecting for grooming and corrals the already indoctrinated . :o
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I would'nt worry about it mate, he banned me for telling someone on this forum that he was once involved with a business that went bankrupt. truth hurts.
by the way john kelly sells nemesis which is the same type of cleaner as mpower and his company has a good reputation.
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Cleantalk used to be a really good forum....then Solutions took it over and they ruined it. As you have already noticed they dont like you talking about chemicals unless its ones they make / sell and dont dare mention you got poor results from his chemicals if you do you end up having to have your posts moderated before going public or banned. Many people have been banned by Nick. I understand he bought the website to promote his own company but i think he went a step to far and as i said he ruined the forum.
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In reply to john Martins comment.......that is very true, in fact i call the CleanTalk / Solutions followers "SHEEP" :) They all follow what Nick tells them to do
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I take forums as a bit of light entertainment many people on here are duplicated or use pseudonyms how can you take members on their true word?
Solutions take their forum very seriously and defend it vigorously as they do their products but life is all about opinions I use cleantalk I abide by their rules but I dont use their products it's my choice.
Shaun
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Thing is they say Cleantalk is a open forum but in fact it is NOT. How can it be open if your not allowed to talk about other products or say you cant get a good result with one of their products.
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I believe we should just give and take what we need from both forums, good guys on both willing to help, you will always get someone who rubs you up the wrong on any forum. As for chemicals etc, we have to make our own informed choice, yes I use some of their chemicals not because I have been brainwashed but because I like them and they work well. Having said that I also use Cleansmarts, Prochem, Chemspec because I also like them and they work well.
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In the interest of fairness here Joe, you received lots of helpful answers from various people and you left this reply...
Thanks everso much for your advice and kind welcomes.
I use the sebo duo to agitate. Normally i simply run it over once as if I was using a wand, but slightly slower. Maybe this is not enough for this kind of job?
I have HD-x by CS. Can i assume this is not going to have the same effect as Solution HD if sprayed over?
It was mentioned that m-power is not compatible with other additives to mix. Normally I add orange-x to almost all my presprays (in the CS range) to increase solvency, as I find it makes them so much more effective on traffic lanes. Am i wrong in doing this?
Its helpfull to know dwell time can be 10 mins and start on application rather than agitation. That makes
Ife simpler. I like the tea and cake idea. Maybe too much!
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Garry, I dont see whats wrong with that reply?
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nor do i
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Nor do I.
Everyone seemed to be getting on well at that point and Joe was made quite welcome. I would say the majority of people on the forum were trying to be helpful.
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Maybe you could add a post on the post in cleantalk to say Joe isnt a supplier and isnt able to post because the moderators of cleantalk will no longer allow him to post. That way people will know why he hasnt replied or been able to defend himself.
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One of the moderators had stated that Joe's account had been blocked
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even though i've bought stuff from this company and been pleased with them . reading the posts here it does seem like one boss and his band of followers on cleantalk . just joined tonight but it'll probably be blocked once they read this . i can also understand joe's frustration if nick can say anything on there but block joe from replying . but who is to say their in the wrong surely a moderator from cleantalk can come on and put their case accross or apologise . it would clear the matter up as not all their customers are on cleantalk . surely it would be in their best interest as they could lose business over this
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Thanks everyone for your kind replies. Its nice to know im not alone with this.
Since all this happened I have had more luck with mpower. In ive been using it less diluted as a spotter (maybe 20:1) all day today and its been working wonders with makeup.
I used warm mpower 100:1 side by side with a high ph heavy duty prespray the other day and mpower proved far more effective.
I suppose im gonna have to put my pride aside and try out some more solutions products. They certainly havnt done themselfs any favours on the customer service side though.
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Mpower is hit and miss for lots of guys. Works better for me as a deodorisor.
Why don't you post the invoice on here to prove your innocence. Maybe they will have second thoughts.
Mark
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http://db.tt/8LhL7lMW
http://db.tt/Nh0XcYzS
As can be seen on the second link - invoice address was of a friend who assists my funding.
The shipping name and address was, however, me.
This invoice number was sent by public post and email to cleantalk, however they neglected to approve the post or reply to my email.
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Is Jim Neal still a mod on Cleantalk surprised he hasnt anything to say usually cant shut the guy up.
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Well there's proof enough although i never doubted you Joe.
LMAO @ Darrens comment to Jim Neal :)
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Yes but I can see why Nick thought you were not customer as your friend paid.
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I dont see what that has to do with it though. At the end of the day its all down to the fact Joe posted a negative comment about M Power......Cleantalk / Solutions obviously cant take negative comments about their chemical range. So if your on their forum you say good things or nothing at all.
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But as I understand it Nick checked to see if Joe had actually bought the product and because his friend had it might had looked as if somebody was just having a go for the sake off it.
Nick does protect is company and does challenge negative posts.
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Thats the point though isnt it....Nick does challenge negative posts. Surely the best way to go about it would have been to contact Joe directly, if there was a doubt over Joe's purchase then he should have asked for proof instead of going out and basically calling him a lier.
Nick can be a decent guy when he wants to be but what he has to realise is that not everyone will rate his chemical range and he should take the negatives on the chin instead of jumping in feet first. Look through the forums, someone will say a negative about every chemical from every supplier but you dont see those other suppliers jumping in feet first and calling people liers.
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But as I understand it Nick checked to see if Joe had actually bought the product and because his friend had it might had looked as if somebody was just having a go for the sake off it.
Nick does protect is company and does challenge negative posts.
It still doesn't explain why he deleted any public posts by me and too this day has not replied to my email.
I am pretty sure he is aware of this thread, but is still yet to make an apology or offer an explanation.
It's quite saddening customer service, however you look at it.
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Well there's proof enough although i never doubted you Joe.
LMAO @ Darrens comment to Jim Neal :)
Thanks mate.
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Look through the forums, someone will say a negative about every chemical from every supplier but you dont see those other suppliers jumping in feet first and calling people liers.
No you don't Richie.... However those chemical suppliers do NOT own the forums where the negative comments are being made...
Nick does own cleantalk and as such has the right to not have negative comments about his products..
Not saying I like it.... but it is his right... His playground and his rules...
I don't go on there any more (cleantalk) ... too closed a shop for me and a lot of sycophants.... I do still however use the products...
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Well im guessing he deleted your public posts because as i have said he does not like negative comments and more often than not.....if Nick gets a bee in his bonnet he sticks with it and wont reply to any form of contact (been there done that).
As far as i can tell you you have done everything within your power to resolve the issue without any kind of response, that in itself speaks volume to me.
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Hector i see your point but the point i made earlier is Cleantalk was supposed to be a open forum......haha yeah open providing you up-talk Solutions chemicals and other products.
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yup different versions of "OPEN" :o :o
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LMFAO
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Joe if you really want to stick with chemicals that are like M Power then why not try "Nemesis" from Restormate. John from Restormate wont jump down your throat if you dont like it :)
http://www.restormate.co.uk/epages/15094.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/15094/Categories/Nem
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Another £3 spent Joe and you would have had free carriage.
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I wouldn't worry Joe, don't take it personally, you wasn't the first and wont be the last.
BTW £100 seems a lot for a 5ltr tub and a 500ml spotter.
How far does that 5ltr go?
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Yeah its for sure he wont be the last. As for the order he had 1 5ltr M Power (or sea water as most call it) :) and 1 case of 500ml spotters (12 per case).
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:)
Amazing how people talk like they know all the facts when they know little or nothing :)
Carry on, mildly amusing :)
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not sure who that is directed at Jim but i know what i personally saw on CT and as Joe has given no reason for us to not believe him....i believe what he has said on here........cant speak for others though :)
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Must say I use both forums and like oth forums.
Seriously though, you lot sound like a bunch of babies!!
As someone said. Nicks playground, Nicks rules.
If you don't like it then don't go on there!!
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I honestly don't see what the issue is.
When you go onto the VW forum you talk about VW's
Perhaps the confusion comes in that it's called Cleantalk and not Solutions Forum but its very much a supplier run forum for mainly their customers. Nothing wrong with that.
Perhaps they should make that clearer ( even thought its states "sponsored by Solutions" as to avoid confusion and brand bashing moving forward.
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Yes thats all fine regarding talking about Solutions solutions on Cleantalk :) but even when you do talk about Solutions solutions you still feel the wrath of Nick or his merry men unless you say positive things and that is mainly what this subject has been about......
........then regarding Nicks Playground so Nicks rules.....again thats all fine except how was Joe to know he was not allowed to say he couldnt get a good result from M Power, thats all he did.....gave a honest opinion.
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:)
Amazing how people talk like they know all the facts when they know little or nothing :)
Carry on, mildly amusing :)
I dont claim to know much about much Nick. Ive been in the business 6 months and am still very much finding my feet.
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lol , i might take look at CT every once in a while to see whats up ...
someone started a thread called .. ' new alltec evolution ' 6.6 with heat , a few minutes ago
i thought .. this should be interesting to see what they make of it ... couple of replies
i checked back and its gone :D
God that place really is a joke .
EDIT - and oddly it reappears today ;D
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Ding Ding Ding ;D
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:)
Amazing how people talk like they know all the facts when they know little or nothing :)
Carry on, mildly amusing :)
lets talk about facts, nick is the kind of guy that is involved in a company that goes bankrupt then gets involved in another company that starts up in an almost identical business having probably not paid off his previous debts (how many of you know that) . yeah a man of principles who runs his forum like a south american dictator. stick to the tried and tested guys in the business thats what i say, you at least will know that the person you are doing business with will be there next week to sort out your problems. thank god free speech is still allowed on this forum
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Pure comedy ;D
More please :)
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He'll set straker onto you!!
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A simple miss understanding is turning into a witch hunt... come on fellas Nick has apologised for the mix up... and i can see how may of looked to him... lets just move on...
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KEEP IT UP, I haven't laughed this much in ages ;D ;D ;D
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Just a quick observation, I don't know the geezer but if someone has gone bankrupt then has the balls to start over again surely they should be applaude instead of castigated.
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Just a quick observation, I don't know the geezer but if someone has gone bankrupt then has the balls to start over again surely they should be applaude instead of castigated.
I agree Hilti... He also does very good products and provides excellent customer service...... In my experience that is.....
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Joe;
Sorry I got in on the tail end of all the replies above; however, I agree with most above in that BOTH boards are very good and very well monitored. Mike does a great job here. Sometimes ;however, things may go a bit off track for whatever reason; all it takes is someone mistakingly takes something the wrong way, and......well, you know what I mean . My advice is to visit that board once again and re-introduce yourself. There are just as many Professionals on that board as this one and everyone can surely benefit from both.
Anyways, best always; ;)
Ed Valentine
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I have a friend who went bankrupt 2 large customers went bankrupt and didn't pay monies ode to him sending him under there's always another story.
Shaun
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Might be worth a look at the thread in question as it seems to be resolved now.
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"Nick's forum, Nicks rules" thats a lovely attitude to have..... :-\
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I'm banned from CT, have been for years, can't think why :o
There also used to be a lot of bad blood between me, Nick and others, but we get on now and I buy a lots of his products and we now have a mutual respect for each other.
Nick runs his board as he sees fit, just as Me and Glyn run Truckmounters as we see fit. Everyone knows what Ct is, take it or leave it - simples
Simon
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It's because you've mellowed Simon, your almost likeable now. ;D
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Have to admit I've been guilty of judging a book by its cover, there's always a person behind your first impression of them. You live and learn, as they say :'(
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No Comment :)
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A friend and fellow carpet cleaner rang me a few weeks ago, with a problem he was having with M Power! The guy is called Stu Clemments, some of you may know Stu as he comes on here occasionally, Anyway he said after pre conditioning with M Power he noticed a very Strong Odour coming from the piece of Upholstery a bit like Vomit, He istantly dismissed it as he thought there must be somthing on the suite
Later that day the same thing happened again, but a different piece of furniture at a different location after rinsing out , it appeared ok but when he got home , he rung me and asked if i had any problems with m power, I said I diddnt but I had two unopened five litre containers on the shelf in my garage! I had noticed when i took delivery of them they seemed much lighter in colour, not the dark amber colour that they are normally, I telephoned solutions but they dismissed it saying it was a colour batch only but diddnt effect the cleaning in anyway!
Anyway I did a few tests on two pieces of carpet, one mixed at 100 to 1 and the other at 80 to 1 ! they wasn't any apparent smell other than the usual soapy smell but thats normal
The next day the two pieces of carpet had a mild sour milk odour! but when i rinsed them the odour disapeared! I mentioned this on CLEAN TALK and was critised by Nick White, so much in fact he publicly tried to humiliate me and implying i was making it all up ! why would I ? I have spent well in exess of £15,000 with his company in the last five years, I treated him as a friend although i have never met the man, And this is how he treats one of his Best customers all because i critisised his beloved M Power!
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I do'nt like nick and i do'nt supose he likes me because i like to tell all the newbies about him being involved in a company that went bankrupt (CHANGES THEIR PERCEPTION OF HIM). yes there are some who admire him for starting up again saying it takes balls, but i believe he went bust for well over 100k and i doubt anyone got their money back. as for the other sypathetic guys that believe the line that he must have got ripped off for loads of cash and suffered the knock on effect well ask yourself how much do you owe him on credit ? he supplies carpet cleaners and most pay as they go, he's a middle man who sells to the end user what sort of business would he have to supply to on credit to get himself into that much debt, no it was possibly bad management or living beyond his means. chinese takeaways are expensive too.
I would admire and support him if he went bust and cleared all his previous debts because then i would call him a man of principle .
why do i persist in posting this information , well its because one of his cowardly followers likes to call me up anonymously and i am getting ped off with it. the more calls i get the more i'll mention it. so carry on whoever you are your not doing him any favours.
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Stuart, the fact you have spent so much with Nick and yet he still treats you that way is no surprise. I know a few people that have been treated in the same or similar manner.
Creighton, fair play to you for making those posts if thats the grief you get.
One thing i will say.....it may seem that i have it in for Nick but i just say it how it is and how i see or hear things. Yes Nick and i had a disagreement many years ago on CT because i mentioned Prochem Pure Clean.....but since then i have made numerous attempts to contact Nick via phone and email just to talk to him and to say LOOK THE PAST IS THE PAST, but he never returns my calls or emails.
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The main reason all this happened is because Joe was accused of not purchasing the product when he did. Then his posts were moderated and deleted so never got to the public forum. Joe attempted to contact Nick but APPARENTLY Nick never received the emails (very questionable).
What makes me laugh is those that comment on Cleantalk having a bit of a dig at some on this forum yet come on here and are all nice (there's a word for those people isn't there), and there's those that don't come on here any more but still go on Cleantalk and say "I left that forum some 15 months ago because of the mush that is said most of the time (but not all) and have no intentions of going back on to find out what the latest argy bargy is about." Things like that make me laugh because the amount of dribble that's said on CT is very laughable :)