Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: CJWalker on June 11, 2012, 11:11:06 pm
-
Firstly i'm new to the forum, so please bear with me, and some of these questions might sound stupid, but here it goes, lol...
I'm looking to start in the domestic window cleaning sector, and plan to drop 5000 leaflets in my local area, expect it to take me around 1 week to complete, i know the expected return rate is only 1%-2%, but i can cover more households quicker using this method...
I have about a £200 startup budget, so going traditional, but thinking about using a Ettore Back Flip Window Cleaning Applicator / Squeegee with pole, instead of ladders, for 2nd floor windows, whats your views on this method... the only reason im considering this is currently i dont have access to a vehicle, and a pole would be easy and lighter to carry, allowing me to cover a larger area.
Also how would you price? I think my mums window cleaner charges £6 for a 3 bed terrace, but i was going to start around £4.50 - £5.00, this hopefully would gain new customers
Look forward to all your responses.
-
Firstly i'm new to the forum, so please bear with me, and some of these questions might sound stupid, but here it goes, lol...
I'm looking to start in the domestic window cleaning sector, and plan to drop 5000 leaflets in my local area, expect it to take me around 1 week to complete, i know the expected return rate is only 1%-2%, but i can cover more households quicker using this method...
I have about a £200 startup budget, so going traditional, but thinking about using a Ettore Back Flip Window Cleaning Applicator / Squeegee with pole, instead of ladders, for 2nd floor windows, whats your views on this method... the only reason im considering this is currently i dont have access to a vehicle, and a pole would be easy and lighter to carry, allowing me to cover a larger area.
Also how would you price? I think my mums window cleaner charges £6 for a 3 bed terrace, but i was going to start around £4.50 - £5.00, this hopefully would gain new customers
Look forward to all your responses.
the other windies in leeds will love you ;D
-
Firstly i'm new to the forum, so please bear with me, and some of these questions might sound stupid, but here it goes, lol...
I'm looking to start in the domestic window cleaning sector, and plan to drop 5000 leaflets in my local area, expect it to take me around 1 week to complete, i know the expected return rate is only 1%-2%, but i can cover more households quicker using this method...
I have about a £200 startup budget, so going traditional, but thinking about using a Ettore Back Flip Window Cleaning Applicator / Squeegee with pole, instead of ladders, for 2nd floor windows, whats your views on this method... the only reason im considering this is currently i dont have access to a vehicle, and a pole would be easy and lighter to carry, allowing me to cover a larger area.
Also how would you price? I think my mums window cleaner charges £6 for a 3 bed terrace, but i was going to start around £4.50 - £5.00, this hopefully would gain new customers
Look forward to all your responses.
Firstly a return of 1-2% on your leafletting is over optimistic. I doubt you will get better than 0.1 - 0.5 unless you follow up with a doorknock. If you are leafletting only (without follow up) you need to drop at least 15-20,000 to get anything like a worthwhile return.
Using traditional tools on a pole is a skill that could take months to perfect - how much practising have you done? Better by far to bite the bullet and carry a ladder about with you.
Pricing: the biggest mistake you can make is to underprice. If you start off too cheaply, it is extremely difficult to achieve a decent return on your efforts and trying to increase your prices in the early stages will lose you most of the jobs you got to start with. Aim for a minimum charge of £10 - you will get fewer jobs but make more money per hour.
-
Firstly i'm new to the forum, so please bear with me, and some of these questions might sound stupid, but here it goes, lol...
I'm looking to start in the domestic window cleaning sector, and plan to drop 5000 leaflets in my local area, expect it to take me around 1 week to complete, i know the expected return rate is only 1%-2%, but i can cover more households quicker using this method...
I have about a £200 startup budget, so going traditional, but thinking about using a Ettore Back Flip Window Cleaning Applicator / Squeegee with pole, instead of ladders, for 2nd floor windows, whats your views on this method... the only reason im considering this is currently i dont have access to a vehicle, and a pole would be easy and lighter to carry, allowing me to cover a larger area.
Also how would you price? I think my mums window cleaner charges £6 for a 3 bed terrace, but i was going to start around £4.50 - £5.00, this hopefully would gain new customers
Look forward to all your responses.
Firstly a return of 1-2% on your leafletting is over optimistic. I doubt you will get better than 0.1 - 0.5 unless you follow up with a doorknock. If you are leafletting only (without follow up) you need to drop at least 15-20,000 to get anything like a worthwhile return.
Using traditional tools on a pole is a skill that could take months to perfect - how much practising have you done? Better by far to bite the bullet and carry a ladder about with you.
Pricing: the biggest mistake you can make is to underprice. If you start off too cheaply, it is extremely difficult to achieve a decent return on your efforts and trying to increase your prices in the early stages will lose you most of the jobs you got to start with. Aim for a minimum charge of £10 - you will get fewer jobs but make more money per hour.
agree with everything Ian has just said apart from the % on leaflets, this will depend soley on the marketing hooks used on the leaflet get it worng then what % Ian says is true get it right and you may hit the 1%, 2% would be very lucky and not repeatable all the time imo
-
Leafleting will work for you but slowly ... door knocking will work faster for you ................. just depends how much of a hurry you need an income .... if your on your own and no big bills then time prob not an issue. leaflets followed by a doot knock few days later best combination though.
Are u working at moment if yes keep job for long as you can ... I took 2 weeks holiday followed by a few sickies to get my ball rolling but had about 50 odd customers before I went full time.
DO NOT UNDERPRICE JOBS ........... 3 good reasons for this ......... you be working hard for little money .... tricky to increase in price and I should know as now 2 years in and only just proper pricing some of my early work .... you will be able to look any "geroff my patch" idiots in the eye and tell em your not undercutting.
Pole work very tricky unless your very experianced ... yes it can be done but not by a newbie I rekon .... get some lightweight titan double ladders £150 I seem to recall but u can have these on your shoulders all day long and after a while not even notice them.
Good luck but remember only u can make it work ............ or fail ......... all down to you mate ;)
-
Ian lancaster is absolutly right. I think its safe to say that we deliver more leaflets each year than anyone else on this forum, and if you get better than 0.5% return then your doing very well. 1-2% is a total dream. On pricing, if your mum gets hers done for £6 what is the reason to be any cheaper than that.?
-
Ian lancaster is absolutly right. I think its safe to say that we deliver more leaflets each year than anyone else on this forum, and if you get better than 0.5% return then your doing very well. 1-2% is a total dream. On pricing, if your mum gets hers done for £6 what is the reason to be any cheaper than that.?
how many leaflets have you put out so far this year Lee ?
it also has a lot to do with what is on the leaflet as this will affect the %
-
Using traditional tools on a pole i have yet to practice, did not want to purchase the equipment to find out that i wouldn't be able to achieve a good standard of work.
Also how safe are ladders?
Regarding my leaflets, im not in a great hurry, to turn them into customers, and decided to set my price at £5.50... but offer a 4 week promotion to new customers of £4.50, then this hopefully will stop the old round wars... :P
-
Using traditional tools on a pole i have yet to practice, did not want to purchase the equipment to find out that i wouldn't be able to achieve a good standard of work.
Also how safe are ladders?
Regarding my leaflets, im not in a great hurry, to turn them into customers, and decided to set my price at £5.50... but offer a 4 week promotion to new customers of £4.50, then this hopefully will stop the old round wars... :P
you should aim for 8 pounds minimum and if you do undercut at 4.50 think you might upset a few window cleaners.just wondered have you ever cleaned any windows?
if so how long does it take to do a house?
how many a hour?
-
Doc, never been a window cleaner, well just for the wife, and she's never complained :P but £8, i dont think people in this area can or will pay that much... i understand what you are all saying, but if i overprice i wont get the business started. When i do my own home, (downstairs) takes me about 10 minutes, but that's going at my own pace. I must also say, i'm very good with website design and seo work, i sold a domestic cleaning website around 6 months ago when i got to page 1 in google, and gained a page rank of 4 ;) so it wont just be leaflets... in total i plan to drop 10,000 - 15,000 leaflets within the first 4 - 6 weeks. To start with all i need is around 50 customers, this will be enough to cover what i need to pay out.
-
I'm not a windy, I just like reading all the banter, but I agree that you shouldn't undercut - if there is a going rate for your area then stick to it.
Another reason, other than those mentioned above, that you don't want 'price shoppers' is if they already have a window cleaner that charges say £6, and they are happy to ditch him/her because you've come along charging £4.50, then you will be ditched if someone comes along charging less again.
Whereas, if the customer values quality of service, reliability, politeness, punctuality etc then they won't care about switching to somene else just because they are a quid or so cheaper.
-
Dont undercut.Just dont.Not only will you regret it for working for little,you will get loads of backs up,not only for undercutting to gain work but also because people who undercut bring prices down in the area.
You cannot possibly start a business charging prices like that.
Soon you will need a van/car and will regret charging so little as tax/mot/ins/fuel plus NI/tax equipment and upkeep of the vehicle will mean your working for around £5 per hour.
Also,if you gain customers from undercutting,then that is the worst type of customer in my eyes,as in 3 months time,whats to stop somebody else coming and undercutting you? thus losing the customer!
I would never recommend using a squeegee pole for upstairs,that would take forever,as you cant see what your cleaning/detailing properly.
Add this very slow method to your price plan and you cant possibly make it worth while.
Sorry to sound harsh but thats the facts.
-
Doc, never been a window cleaner, well just for the wife, and she's never complained :P but £8, i dont think people in this area can or will pay that much... i understand what you are all saying, but if i overprice i wont get the business started. When i do my own home, (downstairs) takes me about 10 minutes, but that's going at my own pace. I must also say, i'm very good with website design and seo work, i sold a domestic cleaning website around 6 months ago when i got to page 1 in google, and gained a page rank of 4 ;) so it wont just be leaflets... in total i plan to drop 10,000 - 15,000 leaflets within the first 4 - 6 weeks. To start with all i need is around 50 customers, this will be enough to cover what i need to pay out.
I promise you that they will pay £10.
Start professional. Look neat and tidy. In your literature and in every first chat with a customer, tell them that you know they have had window cleaners who come once and are never seen again. That tells them that you know why they are sick of windys. It will also tell them you're serious about coming again (and doing a good job so they will want you again) and they will pay for that.
I took a £20 customer from a £3.50 (or £3, can't remember) guy because he did a crap job and turned up when he felt like it. He told me he'd lost the customer because she'd not got the money any more. In truth, she didn't care about the price, just the service.
You're getting consistent advice on this thread not to underprice. There just might be a reason why everyone's saying the same thing. Either we're all out to fool you or we're telling the truth.
Vin
-
Heres something i posted last year to somebody,and also what i started with.
"Buy a set of ladders,mop,squeegee,bucket on a belt,scraper,bucket,A frame,scrims and cut up some old towels.
Buy a escort van or similar size get a good roof rack fitted and summat to secure the ladders.
Print some leaflets,and take them door knocking-Simply say-"Hello,do you need a window cleaner??" If door not answered post a leaflet.
Start small and work your way up.
Most of all,be confident in your approach to it."
Furthermore,price accordingly,if the going rate is £6,then do it for £7-that way you will not upset anyone,and if you get undercut then you know theyre not worth bothering with anyway,as the loyal ones will stay if your regular and do a good job.
HTH
-
Cheers guys, i totally understand what you are all saying, so i'll price correctly for the area, and not undercut to gain customers, then i suppose this will make my round more profitable :), so not many like the idea of a pole, just i got the idea from a youtube video, any body used telescopic ladders? just trying to find the best solution for me, once i have the equipment i'm going to practice on my own home, before running the business, so which ever method i go for, it will be tried and tested...
-
I paid £137 posted for a set of double 17's (3 storey easily) and £92posted for a set of double 12's which do any of my 1st floor work.Brand New.
Theyre light,and good strong sturdy ladders.I'll look through my invoices to find where theyre from and link you.
A pole will be too much messing,plus,how will you wipe the sills clean?? which is one of customers biggest gripes with wc's who dont clean sills
-
What size ladder would you suggest? are these safe? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-8m-Teletower-Telescopic-Ladder-/190640074234?pt=UK_H_G_Ladders_RL&hash=item2c6308adfa (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-8m-Teletower-Telescopic-Ladder-/190640074234?pt=UK_H_G_Ladders_RL&hash=item2c6308adfa)
-
I wouldnt use them all day everyday.No way.
Heres the link
http://www.laddersandaccess.co.uk/trade-extension-ladders/prod_125.html
-
befor you spend any money have you thought about winter if you aint got enough custys your gonna strugle, are you still working? if you are why not do it part time ie saturdays until youve got the hang of it you may find window cleaning aint for you
-
Thanks for the link, What size ladder would you say is suitable for a standard 2 story house?
-
dave f - thanks for the post, not in full time work, was working at tesco for 5 years, but left 6 months ago due to the stress of working nights, and the company cutting back, increasing an allready impossible work load to save costs and increase profits, and then just before i left i was attacked with a glass bottle on the way to start my night shift...
I've been in secure jobs for the past 10 years, but i'm finding getting a new full time job, that pay's well, a very hard task, so not really got much to loose, my nanna is paying my equipment costs, so would you suggest i just go for it :-), and would it be quite during the winter months? dont you just do the same amount of work?
-
That ladder in the link i posted will be fine for 2 story.
Winter,i lost 5 over winter ("come back in spring"),regained 3 from march.
-
Yeah going to purchase the ladders from them, but do i need them that long? wouldnt one size down still be suitable (Open Height 4.88m)
-
Those will be fine,any smaller and you can guarantee you wish you had bigger,They will reach up to gutters on most 2 story houses so you can do gutter cleans with them also ;)
-
Cheers for the heads up, did consider even smaller, but it would probably just reach, well not going to order the equipment for around 2 weeks, just in the middle of moving home, which is a bonus, because wifes mum lives in the area, and shes not seen a window cleaner for a number of years, and in the middle of the estate, a brand new development started about 6 months ago... so this should make it easier to start up...
So going the ladder route thats decided, now what about the equipment, any good http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ettore-Window-Cleaning-Starter-Kit-/390236095575?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item5adbe24457 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ettore-Window-Cleaning-Starter-Kit-/390236095575?pt=UK_HomeGarden_CLV_Cleaning_CA&hash=item5adbe24457)
-
Will be cheaper from here ;)
http://www.soapnational.co.uk/
-
10k leaflets
1% return = 100 Calls / Customers ... Min @ £8 (say)... = £800 (per 4 weekly)
0.5% Return = 50 Calls / Custmers ... Min @ £8 = £400
Plus one offs etc... maybe in the return rate
10k Double sided leaflets (150gsm Good quality) shop round and you'll get them for £124! (for 10k)***design extra***
then you have to dish them out....
Its all about the ROI (return on investment).. and 0.5% on the above prices may break you even after month 1....
Then you'll have referals .. people who see you working in the street doing a good job etc... so from that leaflet drop you may inherit a few extras ...
You have to do the maths... cover your costs....price right....and keep at at it...
Good luck
-
I'm not a windy, I just like reading all the banter,
what are you the tax man or even worse an escapee from the carpet beaters section ? ;D ;D
-
for the OP where ru based as maybe someone on here who will be happy to take you out for a day or 2 ......... if your local to me then Bob Plumb will take you out on Day 1 then I will show you how its really done on Day2 ;D
-
Ian lancaster is absolutly right. I think its safe to say that we deliver more leaflets each year than anyone else on this forum, and if you get better than 0.5% return then your doing very well. 1-2% is a total dream. On pricing, if your mum gets hers done for £6 what is the reason to be any cheaper than that.?
how many leaflets have you put out so far this year Lee ?
it also has a lot to do with what is on the leaflet as this will affect the %
120,000 so far this year. Ordering another 50k in the next 2 weeks. next question ;)
-
Customer numbers from that many leaflets?
-
Customer numbers from that many leaflets?
who knows? several hundred so far
-
Cheers guys, this must be the best forum i've ever used, some great comments ;D
lee pryor - Not based near you, infact im based in Leeds, so you believe leaflets really do work?
What make's a leaflet stand out from the usual rubbish :P
-
Cheers guys, this must be the best forum i've ever used, some great comments ;D
lee pryor - Not based near you, infact im based in Leeds, so you believe leaflets really do work?
What make's a leaflet stand out from the usual rubbish :P
Yes I do. Canvassing also has its place especialy at the start. we canvass a bit still but its mostly all leaflets now. There are pros and cons to both. Leaflets require high volume, so dont expect to be swamped from 10,000. Hmmm what makes it stand out?? good question. I think that if you put your mind to it you can probably answer that. What works for me might not work for you. Why not save up all the leaflets that come through your door over the next few weeks and see what you can learn from them when designing yours. Then you can tell me what stands out 8)
-
Customer numbers from that many leaflets?
who knows? several hundred so far
Lee I find it hard to believe you dont know exactly how many have come from the leaflets....
I know you like to think you are protecting your business but it feels like its not gone as well as you hoped..... Cos you are not shy of telling everyone how very good you are....
-
Hi Cj
A couple of points from some of your posts
Prices, check what the local cleaners are charging in your area and charge the same, this is not to stop other cleaners getting upset with some newbie undercharging but because that is the rate for the job. Where I work if someone started up, charging what you are thinking of, I would not lose one customer and there will be a time when we meet up, but while you are cleaning your customers house for £4.50, while I will be cleaning the neighbours and earning almost 3 times as much.
Ladder safety
All ladders are perfectly safe if they are in good condition, the problem though is the user, a ladder will not cause an accident, but the user causes all of them.
There are over 5000 falls from ladders each year and not one of them was planned, you will find that the user takes a shortcut or gets complacent, so treat a ladder with respect, you also need to use some safety devices with them as well.
Leaflet or getting work in.
There have been a few numbers bounded about about how mny customers you will get from x amount of leaflets, this is great and some of the figures are spot on, the only problem is, it takes time for all of these customers to get in touch, my fastest time for a call froma leaflet is 20 minutes while the longest is over 3 years.
Dropping 10000 leaflets, should produce about 20 customers, but it could be weeks or months before all of them phone you, with leaflets you need to keep on putting them out on a regular basis, I would recommend that you drop 5000 every week to start with, after about a month you should be getting 8 to 10 calls a week.
The best way to get started at first is to network all your contacts, these can be friends, relatives, ex work mates etc, get in touch with all and expain what you are now doing, ask for their help to sprea the word, also ask them if they need a cleaner, you will be surprised how much work this produces, also ask them if they can pass on your details, someone worked it out once that we all know at least 200 people, so if they also know 200 and they pass on your details in theory you will soon get you name around the local area.
Leaflet design
Keep it simple, always have your mobile and landline number.
-
Customer numbers from that many leaflets?
who knows? several hundred so far
Lee I find it hard to believe you dont know exactly how many have come from the leaflets....
I know you like to think you are protecting your business but it feels like its not gone as well as you hoped..... Cos you are not shy of telling everyone how very good you are....
How can I give an answer at this point of the year when the summer hasnt even started. It shows how little you know about this kind of marketing. Lets say 10,000 leaflets get droped. It can take 3 months to see the true picture of those results.
Of course I know exactly how many we have, the figure changes daily. I have always planned to give the results when the year is closed. To do it now tells us nothing.
I will say that it is going as well as I hoped and we are on target for the year. I employed a new team member who started yesterday and another will be starting in 2 weeks.
One more thing................ I am good, very good. Now go knock some doors.
Yeah I love this forum to! ::) ;)
-
your too cheap at those prices! and i personally would never never never undercut on purpose! you need all the friends you can get in this business mate and doing what you suggest will only find you enemys! rethink if i were you!
george
-
Customer numbers from that many leaflets?
who knows? several hundred so far
Lee I find it hard to believe you dont know exactly how many have come from the leaflets....
I know you like to think you are protecting your business but it feels like its not gone as well as you hoped..... Cos you are not shy of telling everyone how very good you are....
When we leaflet, a fewer than 25% of responses are in the 7 days following. Similarly, more that 25% come in four or more weeks after leafletting, so if you're doing regular drops rather than isolated ones (where thos figures came from) it's pretty tough to give a sensible reposnse rate.
The only exception was a drop in our local freeads paper, where over 95% of the response was on the Monday after the drop. Lively day, that was.
Vin
-
HYDRO Cleaners - thanks for the great post! you talk about ladder safety devices, what would you suggest...
Yes it seems your all saying the same, dont undercut, if anything charge a little more, just might do that :P
Also you talk about doing regular leaflet drops, would you say drop 5000, weekly in the same area, so technically each household would get 4 leaflets within 1 month? then move onto a different 5000 households and repeat the process?
-
HYDRO Cleaners - thanks for the great post! you talk about ladder safety devices, what would you suggest...
Yes it seems your all saying the same, dont undercut, if anything charge a little more, just might do that :P
Also you talk about doing regular leaflet drops, would you say drop 5000, weekly in the same area, so technically each household would get 4 leaflets within 1 month? then move onto a different 5000 households and repeat the process?
see... now your getting the idea! ;)
-
Cheers GB Window cleaning, only took 3 pages of comments lol, and thank you all for comments and ideas, hope to start in the next 3 weeks ;D
-
Should any body else wish to add any suggestions, been a newbie please feel free :P
-
Should any body else wish to add any suggestions, been a newbie please feel free :P
yes the most imprtant thing i think is to not start off too cheap, dont get me wreong we all do itbut try to keep it to a minimum because i will gaurantee you'll resent doing the cheap work in the end! i still have cheap work i do even now! :P
-
Hi CJ
Good luck - have you considered buying some work to get you started - there was work for sale recently on this forum in Headingley.
I'm in Huddersfield you can have a trip out with me if you like but I'm mostly pole work now.
Granny
-
Cheers granny, yeah ill defo keep my eyes out for any rounds for sale, and thanks for the offer, just might take you up on that at some point ;D, just need to get this house move completed first, so stressful :P