Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Shaun_Ashmore on May 31, 2012, 04:48:26 pm
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For those who do use and sell 'scotchguard' etc what % of jobs do you sell protector on?
Shaun
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Hi Shaun,
Something like 5% this year. (only when requested)
I just don't push it anymore.
When I was a few years ago maybe 15 to 20% (guessing here)
Craig
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That's very simular to me Craig, I was hoping Allan Simmons would give us an honest answer.
Shaun
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For us about 30% of carpet & upholstery jobs, but I mention when they book and when the guys go to clean. So they get offered twice, and it's amazing the amount of people who say no but then go on to have it when asked on the day .
Can't see why you wouldn't, while your there it's money for old rope :)
Steve
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It might be money for old rope, but only a very small percentage of carpets actually need protector, which calls into question the morality of selling it willy nilly to anyone daft enough to say yes to it, IMO, that is.
Simon
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Plain pale coloured wool carpets I offer it near enough to 100%. Take up is about 50%
Pattened wool carpets take up is about 20%
I don't tend to offer it on PP/Synthetic although there is always a small % who want it if for no other reaason than it makes it easier for the client to remove a stain.
Rog
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From my own experience and trials I have found even synthetic carpets benefit from
Protector, not as much as wool carpets but nonetheless it does afford some extra protection,
This is what I tell the customers, so it's their choice at the end of the day.
I'm completely happy to offer it to all as I know I've informed them.
Steve
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The only truly worth while protector is on a new carpet and using solvent based protector.
What I mean is, a just cleaned carpet is not clean like a new carpet, so to an extent your just locking in any un-removed soil. Add that to the fact that if it's just cleaned your be using water based protector which is not as good by a long way as solvent based protector.
I'm merly stating facts, not judging.
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Dont offer it much here either.
If a client does ask for it then i will apply and sell it..
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The real issue for me is protectors don't stop the kind of stains that people think they do and that leads to disappointment and resentment towards the person who sold it to them. While we were in Scotchcare we had big problems with customers ringing up complaining that there carpet had got dirty again :o or that there were stains on the carpet. We hadn't oversold it, never have, but it is what people are lead to believe about these products that causes the problem. We now only sell it if the customer asks and if they actually need it, which imo most don't. We lost a lot of good customers to Scotchgard and learned a big lesson because of it.
Trouble is, people don't tell you why they don't come back, they just don't come back, not good when you're trying to build a business.
Simon
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Simon is spot on. I have picked up clients from good carpet cleaners all because they didn't hammer home exactly what their expectations should be.
I even have a repeat customer who ditched a carpet cleaner who protected her carpet because 12 months later it was dirty. :o
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We are in a trade that is based on results that's why expectations have to be managed well obviously the other cleaner didn't do that very well, I used protector on my carpets and it has saved me loads as my daughter has a tic like Jack Douglas when she is carrying anything as we carpet cleaners percieve to be as dangerous.
Shaun
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Ive got 2 CCers near me who advertise FREE STAINGUARD on all jobs.
I doubt very much that they are putting it down,really pees me off as its a bad gimmick in my opinion.
Am I right in thinking that for it to work the carpet is unusable for about 6 hours whilst the stainguard cures?
I bet they dont tell that to their clients.
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Depends on how much your charging in the first place.
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;D Shaun gets paid for starting these posts ;D
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I don't get paid at all something I'll have bring up at the secret moderators ball ;D
When I first started water based protectors were very much the same price as they are sold for now they get cheaper and cheaper not sure if they get better though, the best protectors or should I say the easiest to apply and demonstrate were the solvent or silicone ones.
Wayne most protectors take 24 cure.
Shaun
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Shaun
You slipped up there when negotiating your contract ;D ;D ;D
On Protectors although I am learning South Yorkshire i could not make out if you are for or against.
And how do you manage expectations people only hear what they want to hear and twist it anyway if something happens.
I think in future I will leave a written sheet.
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Why would you not offer Protector on every domestic job , explain the product and its advantages how long it will last etc etc and "upsell" it to your customers, it they don't buy from you at least you have tried, at the end of the day you are in business to make money, profit and upselling are not a dirty words !!!!!!
I brought a pair of shoes yesterday, and the sales assistant ask me if I would like to purchase a tin a protector, when you go out for a meal , they always ask if you would like to see the sweet menu , these are both upselling techniques.
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'up selling' is a dirty word when you sell someone they don't need, or will benefit from.
The vast majority of carpets clean up like new and that's after possibly years of abuse, so if they manage to survive that onslaught and clean up like new, why would the carpet, or the customer benefit from a protector? Surely logic says that those carpets are stain repellant int here own right, otherwise they wouldn't clean up like new.
Unlike the shoe shop scenario, we are trying to develop an ongoing relationship with our customers and hopefully that relationship will stretch many years into the future and that relationship has to be based upon one thing - trust. If you recommend a product, it has to be to the benefit of the customer and not just a grab for extra money. If you sell protector and it doesn't work, or do what the customer thinks, or believes it will do, they'll blame you and that vital bond of trust will be broken.
One way to get people to trust you is if they ask you about protector to say, 'no, your carpet doesn't need it.'That doesn't mean we don't sell protector, but we only sell it to customers who actually need it and they are very few.
Simon
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Simon,
You seemed to have a lot of bad experiences with selling protector and that seems to make you hold back from offering it.
My experience has been the opposite, I have lots of customers who have the scotchgard every time they have the carpets cleaned, both on wool & synthetics and are happy with it. I'm pretty sure on the Staingard we use it says it can be used on synthetics with some benefit to the carpet.
My point is surely its the customer who decides if they want it after getting the right information rather than us deciding for them.
Otherwise we're just forcing our opinion on them. I have several customers who have their carpets cleaned when they don't look dirty, but I don't refuse to do them as its upto them.
I also have some who expect their carpets not to get dirty after being cleaned but I still go and clean them. it's about giving them the choice and letting them decide.
As long as they have the correct info then it's better in my opinion to offer the services, because only they know if it's a benefit to them or not.
Regards
Steve
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Simon,
You seemed to have a lot of bad experiences with selling protector and that seems to make you hold back from offering it.
My experience has been the opposite, I have lots of customers who have the scotchgard every time they have the carpets cleaned, both on wool & synthetics and are happy with it. I'm pretty sure on the Staingard we use it says it can be used on synthetics with some benefit to the carpet.
My point is surely its the customer who decides if they want it after getting the right information rather than us deciding for them.
Otherwise we're just forcing our opinion on them. I have several customers who have their carpets cleaned when they don't look dirty, but I don't refuse to do them as its upto them.
I also have some who expect their carpets not to get dirty after being cleaned but I still go and clean them. it's about giving them the choice and letting them decide.
As long as they have the correct info then it's better in my opinion to offer the services, because only they know if it's a benefit to them or not.
Regards
Steve
So Steve, just to be clear on your view, say a custy rang up with a brand new polyprop carpet and said they wanted it protected. You say it doesn't need it and they say they want it doing anyway. Would you go ahead and do it?
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That's never happened, but would be a bit silly wouldn't it ;D
But I believe on used polyprops the fibres become abraided after a while and a coating of protector does afford a little more protection so in that scenario I would let the customer choose.
I've also carried out my own experiments on used synthetics and have found the carpets protected stayed cleaner a lot longer, so it may not be scientific but based
On my own experience I'm happy to offer it to the customer to choose while passing on my findings with them.
Steve
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Thats why I used the NEW carpet scenerio. ;)
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Ok you got me on that one ;D
But if they got me in & locked the door and wouldn't let me leave till I did it then I suppose I'd just have to ;D
Steve
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Steve,
It's not that I've had a bad experience with protectors, more that I have a 'learning experience.' I've enjoyed a great deal of success during my time in this industry and much of that success is based upon putting my customers needs before my own. The truth about protectors is that they don't stop the stains people believe, or are lead to believe they do.
The logic of it is that if the carpet cleans up like new (as most do) then why does it need a protector?
Also, why do carpet cleaners offer protector in the first place? As a way of making extra money, or as a customer service issue.
Simon
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Tough call this protector stuff.
As a business we are duty bound to try and maximise our sales, but on the other hand why would I want customers to sub consciously believe that their carpet that previously became dirty every 6 months would now become bomb proof.
If people ask me about it I explain it's limits, and not to believe all those pictures they see of half a glass of spilt red wine sitting on the surface of a white carpet like some teflon frying pan. ;D
By now I have the trust of the customer for not 'hard selling an upgrade' and I either get a larger ticket price if they still want to go that way or I'm back for another clean within 12 months.
The alternative to this is could result in disappointment for the customer when the upcoming party (you weren't told about!) ends up with food, beer and wine stains in the carpet.
Depends on your ethics really, not withstanding if the customer wants x,y,z add ons then that's their decision.
And ask yourselves this. Do you always buy the insurance that's offered with every electrical item (no matter how small or cheap) you buy? Why don't you? Isn't this what some are doing with carpet protector?
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Actually it's very easy.
Use your judgement to advise what's in the customers best interest and communicate it.
Don't be swayed either by greed or fear.
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I think the leading trainers tell you sell it on all carpets.
I did get a shock once when I went to NCCA stand at Excel a few years ago and there was a guy representing Carpet Manufactures saying they disproved of protectors, this was to a Seminar. Interestingly D Bolton was chairing it and he did not challenge it . Maybe I misunderstood, although I did say I felt he was suggesting we loose the jam on our income
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You have to lower customers expectations of the product, we all ways tell them its not bullet proof but it will give them additional time to deal with a spill but if left will still stain the carpet, we also tell them that it will help us to remove soil from the carpets on future cleans there by prolonging the life and appearance of their carpets.
We have also included it in the price of cleans on special offers but be careful on this it used to be a scam used by bait & switch merchants that the protector was in the tank with the cleaning solution,I have lost count the amount of times I have been told this by new customers disappointed that the protector did not seem to work. Of course it was rubbish and they just upped the price for the privilege of applying water as protector and when explained to the customer how they had been scammed you generally get that customer for years.
We dont do a great deal of the stuff now, many years ago the older cleaners on here will remember, in the 90's there was a period when every other house had an off white suite, they were all the rage and they were crap to clean but they were a good source of revenue for Scotchgard applications, our local John Lewis used to get them done by us before they went to the customer, as they were always been called in for rapid soiling not surprisingly. We did bundles of them loved the protecting hated the cleaning.
John Lewis paid for the protector and we had gallons of the stuff over so could pass that on to customers as special offers on carpet cleans etc, unfortunately once the white sofa craze died down John Lewis no longer required the protecting. Although I have to say I would not be sorry if we never saw a white/off white sofa again but I suspect as always happens with these things they will be back :'(
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Hilton - your first two lines - exactly my policy and what I remember over ten years ago during the selling spiel prochem give out as part of their carpet cleaning course - prochem product flouroseal in those days (now called f-plus) the amazing thing I remember was Prochem wanted us to PAY for the colour leaflets that promoted their product, unbelievable - I used to produce my own with a disclaimer on it - if you are at the sharp end you need to cover your arse to allow for poor application (if you haven't done it yourself) Ideally I would rather delay a decision to sell the protector untill just after the clean until you see how the carpet feels to the hand and how effective it will be as a treatment - pc say all carpet types on the label!
Like you it annoys me to see those ads from the cheapie-cheapie lads with claims that the protector can be applied as part of the cleaning operation - that is just stupidly illogical - spraying a residual treatment and then extracting it - seriously how does that work then? rip-offsville IMO - I think it comes from the treatments sold with the scotchgard label for use in those crappy bissell wet carpet cleaners
People I meet usually refer to Scotchgard and very occasionally stainguard when they remember a trade name at all - but PC f+ is 30 for 5 litres whereas SG is 40 for same - not worth the extra when you've explained the dupont/3m similarities - do it properly (i.e. the application and it does have a value - you dont get big US corporations putting out products that have NIL science
ALSO as the market leader is essentially a US product and the US market is apparently just 1% in terms of wool installs for carpet the product must have been developed primarily for synthetic carpets... thats just my take on things!
dave
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So what about Dry Fusion. They're protector is part of the cleaning process is it not? And if your quoting against a person who uses DF the protector can maybe sway the decision against you.
Are there any products that clean and have an inbuilt protector?
thanks
Mark
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So what about Dry Fusion. They're protector is part of the cleaning process is it not? And if your quoting against a person who uses DF the protector can maybe sway the decision against you.
Are there any products that clean and have an inbuilt protector?
thanks
Mark
Do they call in protector or 'soil retardant'? Stands to reason a product that has a protector in it, it's only going to be a small amount and less effective as a two stage process. But sure you get to mention the word protector in your sales pitch along with dry in 30 minutes.
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mark - yep right I was not talking about df or lm I was talking about extration cleaning so wind yer neck in! cheers
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Never even read your post.
Mark