Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Jim_77 on February 01, 2012, 03:15:01 pm
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Normally I don't get involved in discussions on pricing, as it is such a complex and varied beast.
But my blood is boiling at the moment. I've just received a very begrudgingly written cheque from an old customer.
I've been working for her for over 6 years - Married couple in their 50s, big house, two Mercedes in the garage plus a run-around for shopping, basically the type with plenty of money who don't mind showing it.
Just before Christmas she booked me in, and as usual gave me a big list of jobs to do. It's always on the basis of just sending the bill afterwards, which has never ever been a problem.
However this time she phoned up saying it was an unbelievably high amount. I think this is actually a case where the TM has worked against me because although I managed the work in one day (9.30 - 5.30 with barely a break) it would have been at least a day and a half with a portable.
I've done all of the items below on previous visits over the last few years and I haven't increased the individual prices of them over that time either.
I wrote a very polite letter to her explaining this, plus the fact that the TM meant I got it all done in one day rather than two... she wrote a letter back basically insulting me by inferring I'm "just a cleaner" and the rates are very high "for the type of work involved"
So let's see how people would price up this work excluding VAT:
Ercol suite (mostly cushions, a bit less work than a standard suite)
Protector applied to suite
8x5 pure wool Tibetan rug, cleaned & protected
9x3 Persian runner, cleaned & protected
400ft² 80/20 cut pile carpet (downstairs hall & upstairs bedroom)
Protector applied to carpet
Roughly 10m² Amtico flooring, stripped & sealed
Bundled in to the deal as part of my special offer at the time, she also receive FREE:
5L neutral floor cleaner
500ml trigger spray of carpet & upholstery spotter
carpet mats cleaned & protected (4 of them, about 30ft² in total)
A free return visit (up to 30 minutes) for a spot clean should it be needed over the next 12 months.
This'll be interesting hopefully :)
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I dont do hard floors but for the suite, rugs and carpets I'd be about £400 give or take.
Don't know how this compares to others but id be happy with that.
Oh and thats less than a days work for me. ;)
Fran
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Jim, I'll leave the pricing bit to the boss when he gets in, but.........how dare she >:(
"insulting me by inferring I'm "just a cleaner" and the rates are very high "for the type of work involved"
My blood would be boiling too and after 6 years without a hitch I presume.
Personally if she wants work done this year, I would now change her terms and say you'll go and provide a written quote against requirement and give her the price first. Make clear any additions to this list will be at extra cost.
I wouldn't answer her back this time, as I do not respond to insults(well most of the time :)) just bank the chq and enjoy her money :)
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Just noticed all the freebies you included.......that would stop as well :)
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490 maybe..
A hard day too, and the time taken is about right and shows you work to a good standard.
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when a customer asks for a lot of small jobs to be done, and i can do them in one day, i throw out the item rate and charge a day rate.
so my answer would be what ever your day rate is.
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I dont do hard floors but for the suite, rugs and carpets I'd be about £400 give or take.
Don't know how this compares to others but id be happy with that.
Oh and thats less than a days work for me. ;)
Fran
I worked it out at approx £380-£450 so Fran and I are on the same wavelength (I dont do hard floors so never included that in my estimate either)
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£650
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Would imagine 6 hours max not including the
hard floor.
£280 w/o the hard floor.
John
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Basing it on how long it would take, I would have said anything between £450 and £600.
I would always insist that a price was agreed before starting the work though, just so everyone knew where they stood.
I have even had to explain to some repeat customers, that it doesn't take me as long as it did last time due to improvement in equipment and methods.
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Although the price of the protector different people
use would make a big difference in price charged.
John
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£550 + vat
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£385 individually priced.
Would probably do a job lot deal for £300 if it took me just one day.
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How much Jim?
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i would charge £500 for a long day like that
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£585 Without the hard flooring and none of the freebies ;D ;D
What about you Jim
Tony
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Looks like I need to put my prices up a bit ;D
Individual prices of all those items tot up to £520+vat, but I took off a 20% volume discount taking it back to £416+vat (£499 inc VAT). I thought that was more than fair, seems as I was running a special offer at the time)
Increased the discount to 25% for her after her complaint (£390+vat/£468 inc vat)
Normally I wouldn't do that but she has been spending that much money with me on an annual basis for the last 6 years so thought it worth compromising my principles slightly in this case :-\
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And you wonder why she complained.
She's just seen you do a days work then
charged her £500.
Even tradesmen don't get that.
John
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£400 I would have charged , but I always quote first since getting ripped off by chubby brown over a flood in his garage fitted with Axminster carpets . He had 2 mercs parked in there too!
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The point is John she has paid me exactly the same prices without the discount for all of those things over the last few years, just never all in one big lump together.
"Even tradesmen" Funnily enough, she said something similar. If you have low self worth that's your problem, but I am not "just a cleaner" :)
Your argument is a load of bollox John because although a carpenter's day rate might be £250 that's just his labour, during that day he might have installed £1k's worth of kitchen units, so that day's work has cost the customer £1,250.
I run at a profit margin of around 50% before tax and NI so do the maths.
If I parked my van up on her drive, opened the doors and said to her "there you go..... you do what I've just done using all the correct equipment, products and techniques, in the same time as I did it to exactly the same standard".................. she wouldn't even know how to turn the machine on.
Now, imagine a painter & decorator turns up and does the same... I can paint as well as, or better than, any decorator... probably not quite as quick... hell I've even got most of the same kit in my garage. This is the point, we are not "just cleaners", we are skilled tradespeople in our own right.
What sets us a part is that NOBODY who wasn't a carpet cleaner could take my van out for the day and do the same job I do to the same standards. Very few would even be capable of setting up the equipment correctly. It's impossible without training, experience and the right work ethic. This makes us worth the money we charge.
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the way I see it.....
Ercol suite (mostly cushions, a bit less work than a standard suite) £140
Protector applied to suite £80
8x5 pure wool Tibetan rug, cleaned & protected £100
9x3 Persian runner, cleaned & protected £75
400ft² 80/20 cut pile carpet (downstairs hall & upstairs bedroom) £100 (the bedroom was upstairs so would tale as long as a T/L )
Protector applied to carpet £60
Roughly 10m² Amtico flooring, stripped & sealed ( a guess!! ) £80
maybe i'd give a discount...... but i was thinking as you said she moaned about the price you had charged what a professional such as your self is worth :) :)
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Jim,
I think your pricing is fine!!!
i would of gone in for £435 + Vat £522 total!!
John,
I think your outlook is wrong!
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Not low self esteem Jim just realistic.
What's the joiner argument about.
The customer realises that materials are
extra.
By the way the average day rate for a joiner
round here is a lot less than £250.
If you can get work at that price fair enough
but if they moan 'cos they find out your charging
£500 per day is it any wonder.
What was the actual labour cost?
About £350.
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Sounds fair.
Thing is with the tradesmen comparison, my brothers a plasterer and he does not spend anywhere near what I do on advertising and business running costs.
She got a bargain with that after complaint reduction.
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I think there's a bit of a geographical difference to be fair John :)
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Bit late but I would have gone in at £495 without looking at all the other posts!
Sounds a right old cow!
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Just a little ;D
Brother's a builder and I was talking to the joiner
who was doing the roof trussing yesterday dinner.
He reckoned round here if you can get £150 a day
your doing well at the moment.
Not knocking anyone's prices, if you can get it go
for it.
But I'll bet there's one or two out there sat on their
bums most of the week and not because the phone
'aint ringing.
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My mate is a wood butcher/joiner and he charges £200 plus 10% on materials, he recently did a attic bedroom conversion and made just as much on the materials as the labour.
Shaun
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My dad is a joiner and yes he gets £150 a day but do we all really think the bloke who he subbies for only charges £150 to the client.
I think we all have to take into account overheads, tax liabilities (more for ltd) etc.
We should never judge each others price as we dont know each others overheads.
Fran
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Jim your price is fine mate. I would have charged the same.
I have had a few occasions where the customer is about to say the same ( but so far never has) I did a easy suite 2x rugs, hall way,lounge and bedroom carpets last week, she is a customer i have done twice before. Still went and quoted the job before hand at 255 quid . It took us 2 hours taking it easy. The suite and carpet had been done 18 months ago by me and where not very dirty. Because we did it in 2 hours (2 of us)i felt a little guilty takind 250 for 2 hours. But as Dean always says to me, thats the price you have quoted and she was happy with that.. you have done an excelllllent job, but just because you have a truck and are very experienced means that you work smarter and easier for your money.
Dean is correct. (My son who works with me)
So Jim dont lose any sleep over it. You have spent thousands on kit and training and your are now at the top of your trade,so take your money and be happy..
One tip though going forward. Always quote before hand, it does not matter who it is or how many times you have cleaned for them. You will never, ever, be in this situation again then ;)
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Sometimes people will ask us to come and clean without asking the price before hand this occassionally can be dangerous my preference is to pre qualify price before I start and I break it up to per room etc then add it all together so the customer can see where and how I came to my figure (I guess you already know this you're a smart bloke :o) the trick is to learn from your experience just bloody annoying and YOU are partly to blame!!!! as it's your business and you can't blame anyone else.
Shaun
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I don't see anything wrong with your price Jim..broken down it works out at £50 p/hr....she got a very good deal....put it to bed and move on..(has her old man just lost his knitghhood, might expalin her mood)
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I can buy a servicemaster franchise in anyone of about 20 areas and in a month clean with your equipment. Hardly skilled .
Carpet cleaning is not a skilled job , it is low skill, electricians , plumbers, joiners , they are skilled trades .
Lets take your days work , it is worth £150 at best , plus £150 to hire van and equipment , plus materials and fuel £100 , plus profit , that is where you get the £500 from .
Your customer is quite correct in saying you are just a cleaner , what she needs educating in is the fact that she is hiring a lot of expensive kit too , not a couple of grands worth of tools that a tradesman will have.
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Ercol suite (mostly cushions, a bit less work than a standard suite) £120
Protector applied to suite £40
8x5 pure wool Tibetan rug, cleaned & protected £60
9x3 Persian runner, cleaned & protected £40
400ft² 80/20 cut pile carpet (downstairs hall & upstairs bedroom) £120
Protector applied to carpet £60
Roughly 10m² Amtico flooring, stripped & sealed (don't do don't know)
Total £440 (£366.67 before Vat)
But this is only a rough guess as each job along with attitude of customer and general condition of items can effect final price.
What some people don't realise it's not just labour they are paying for, there's fuel, products, knowledge and to a degree a guarentee as to quality of work.
Alternatively get a pikey in for £99 and don't expect any of the above.
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Carpet cleaning is not a skilled job , it is low skill, electricians , plumbers, joiners , they are skilled trades .
Skilled as in a 4 year apprenticeship it is not but skilled as in knowing materials, products, machinery and limitations it is.
How many on here can publically state they use a steel wire brush on some carpets? And of course going by the book you shouldn't. I have and I do and have yet to muller a carpet to the point of a complaint or claim. That's because I have knowledge and time learnt skill to know the limitations.
Therefore there is a skill but more so knowledge.
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it really annoys me when people say its "only cleaning".....if we ruin your £50 per sq mtr carpet ...you expect us, quite rightly, to put it right. Ok you can go and buy a RD and call yourself a carpet cleaner and not do any apprenticeship.
A lot will do it properly, get training, invest in good machines, go on forums and get advise etc and in time you gain knowlege...you then have to market your business, insure your equipment etc do estimates, talk to customers etc...so you are more than "just a cleaner"
With expenses including chemicals used i think Jim's price is a very fair deal.....the thing that kills it is the VAT, which we can do nothing about.
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Its the protector thats upping the price a lot on this job. Perhaps the discount should be here and not the cleaning labour directly.
Its really a business decision what you charge a full day at but for the customer it will seem high. Im paying my tradesmen £80-£120 a day to renovate my house so this is where the skilled argument comes in, and they work for it!!
Sometimes IMO a TM can work against you!!
Mark
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My dad is a joiner and yes he gets £150 a day but do we all really think the bloke who he subbies for only charges £150 to the client.
I think we all have to take into account overheads, tax liabilities (more for ltd) etc.
We should never judge each others price as we dont know each others overheads.
Fran
That's the most sensible comment I've read on CIU.... :)
To add, not all of us are the bread winners either. I know a few C/C's who clean carpets to top pensions up and use the money for the odd luxuries.
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Jim,people are getting very tight,plus there are a lot of leaflets advertising cheap prices splash and dash,cowboys.She uses you every year,if they are protected they cannot be that hard to clean,and do they even know by now,if you apply it.I never said that.You know you are a pro,if you lose the job,will it effect your bissiness,do you need her and her recommendations.Anything above 300 plus your chems a day sounds good to me.Its your biz you know the answers
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Jim,
The only rational explanation is that your customer has hit upon hard times, many have, even the apparently well off.
Simon
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Not me!
Ive been put on this earth to pay for the missus it's god's way of saying that I'm not the messiah but just a very naughty boy.
Shaun
Ps supply and demand sets pay rates in this economic climate electricians etc can be 10 a penny as it is a recognised trade but you don't need business acumen so a customer can find one easily where a carpet cleaner sells his services and is more of a businessman/ salesman who just happens to clean carpets.
Pps my mate Steve hasn't got a recognised trade but everyone thinks so highly of him they go out of their way just to see him row his boat every 4 years albeit he has gold medals for it the thing is this has made him a sir all for rowing this boat faster than others, no real trade?
Ppps piers Morgan what's he ever done? Sacked by the mirror newspaper then turns up on a talent show as a judge and earns millions,
Pppps what about Kim and aggy they have done rather well out of cleaning one went on a reality show and earned some and the other just wrote about cleaning and has done nicely
There's only you that can reach for the stars.
(motivational speech over)
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I did a job for a lady a few week ago, this would be my 4-5th visit over the years, never had a complaint.
Last visit, she got me to take 3 small stains out in 3 rooms.
The job was at other end of Ullswater lake, 14 miles but takes 1/2 hour (bloody crag rats) tourists. Took me 15-25 mins with tm.
Told her 65+ vat and she said, gosh your dear compared to the lady who cleaned my oven, she had travelled from North cumbria, about 1 hr 20 min each way, cleanned 1 Aga and another average oven and grill, she had told her she used fairy liquid in dip tank, showed me oven and she had done a top job and took 3 hrs.
Total 5hrs 40 min and charged £90.
I told her she couldnt compare the 2 as my van and tm and machinery is 60k to buy,
and the oven cleaner used fairy liquid.
I think carpet cleaning is easy to pick up with correct training, and a half decent brain for marketting helps.
Even a lot of builders, joiners and plumbers dont have as expensive a kit as some of us.
Building trade is on its knees at the moment, plus migrant builders are keeping rates down.
Andrew
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But can Mrs Cumbria get stains out of carpets, I doubt She will make that journey again, including fuel.Will she F.Prats only charge too low once.
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Fairy liquid in the dip tank.... ???
I might have to try that.... :D
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Maybe you have outgrown her.
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Intriguing how many have quoted prices "plus Vat"
Once we have bought our equipment and allowed for depreciation/replacement cost how much do you want to make for a days work?
Compared to what I charge the chemical cost is pennies, how much do you want to make for a days work?
Why do so many have be VAT registered, I do nothing near £70,000 per year but make a living working 4 days a week with 6+ weeks a year off, £200+ per day 4/5 days a week makes me a decent living!
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I think the problem was they had it done all at once. It often causes problems when quoting
People often throw in a rugs thinking they will not be charged. They do not appreciate the value of protector
They have probably spoken to their family who have no idea and as someone said read a cut price leaflet.
As you are Franchise and have top equipment your price will not be lowest. So you overhead cost is probably £100 a day plus your day rate plus charge for protector
Regarding Day rates I find it amazing when I have to pay my Solicitor a £100 plus an hour for filling a form in an arguing the case where I have already researched the relevant points of law.
You said two Mercs what line of business are they in. ,
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Jim, this was a loyal customer so why on earth did you not apply your daily rate + protector ?
I think your customer has every right to complain, If however, you had priced it up before hand no debate completion time down to your discretion. As for cars etc you should know by now it makes little difference.
The harsh reality is we are just cleaners, skilled and trained, But still CLEANERS!
It amazes me that alot of people on here still dont except this fact.
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Jim, this was a loyal customer so why on earth did you not apply your daily rate + protector ?
I think your customer has every right to complain, If however, you had priced it up before hand no debate completion time down to your discretion. As for cars etc you should know by now it makes little difference.
The harsh reality is we are just cleaners, skilled and trained, But still CLEANERS!
It amazes me that alot of people on here still dont except this fact.
I tend to agree with this statement and ultimately, that's how were are seen by most people... That is of course, until they have a stain that they have tried to tackle with just about anything with poor results, then we turn up and save the day... That's when we become heroes.... :D
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the job description is cleaner, but we're far from it, well most of us are. do you clean all red wine stains out? or do you render some invisible?
been going 4 years now and still learning. everyday on the job and in the classroom when i get chance, so much to learn,
its quite simple really, you either take this job seriously and see it for what it really is or your just a cleaner.
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I think you have to accept that other people see us as "Just" cleaners and let it go over our heads. We know there's so much more to it but lets face it, I bet a hell of a lot of us started carpet cleaning because we seen it as an easy buck....
I know I did.... :-\
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I think we are a good deal more skilled than people appreciate, but our skill is acquired rather than learned, in other words it is experienced based. You grow into this job, so that after a good few years you can walk into almost an situation and just know what to do - that takes skill.
But should we be charging brain surgeon prices - nah!
Simon
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Intriguing how many have quoted prices "plus Vat"
Why do so many have be VAT registered, I do nothing near £70,000 per year
In my case I had a much larger operation which incorperated staff and window cleaning which meant we went passed the point so had to be, I have since 'got rid' of that part and although we are now below the point if we were to chop and change being vat registered or not then IR would take a long hard look into what we were doing.
But also you can volunteer to be vat registered at any point if it serves a purpose and if you are after commercial then some prefere vat registered businesses.
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So because I never went to university for four years means I should never earn over 25k for the rest of my life!
Only people who went to uni should morally be allowed to earn good money. (because they dossed around for four years)
You may want to stay in 'your place' I won't.
There's a myth that the media like to put forward that people who earn really high work extra hard for it..
In reaility some people earn high salaries for doing very little and some people work extremely hard for minimum wage.
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Lord Sugar didn't go to Uni.... ;)
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Jim
Excluding the hard floor I'd have been about £400+vat. I woouldn't have offerred a day rate.
Obviously your client hasn't cottoned onto the fact that if all the work is done in one day as opposed to spread over a number of visits then it will "seem" more expensive. Also since you have visited several times you will be naturally quicker because you are familiar withthe house and also the items you are cleaning.
I've got good at heading off that sort of comment at the pass before it becomes a problem although I will admit htat I've have lost at least one client to this problem. I'm not worried though as there are plenty more clients coming along to replace them.
I'm vat registered simply because there is too much work coming in for me to keep my work below vat threshold. And as you can see I'm not particularly cheap in my pricing.
Is it annoying-yes. But in another week filled with other clinets who appreciate you and pay top wack you'll stop worrying about it.
As Ian said-they may just have had a bad day or had some other expensive bills.
Rog
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the job description is cleaner, but we're far from it, well most of us are. do you clean all red wine stains out? or do you render some invisible?
been going 4 years now and still learning. everyday on the job and in the classroom when i get chance, so much to learn,
its quite simple really, you either take this job seriously and see it for what it really is or your just a cleaner.
What a strange statement ???
Rest my case ;D ;D It is quite simple Derek you clean carpets your a cleaner...
And yes must be the customer who is at fault they must of had a bad day or maybe you have out grown them - please!
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Jim, this was a loyal customer so why on earth did you not apply your daily rate + protector ?
I think your customer has every right to complain, If however, you had priced it up before hand no debate completion time down to your discretion. As for cars etc you should know by now it makes little difference.
The harsh reality is we are just cleaners, skilled and trained, But still CLEANERS!
It amazes me that alot of people on here still dont except this fact.
I tend to agree with this statement and ultimately, that's how were are seen by most people... That is of course, until they have a stain that they have tried to tackle with just about anything with poor results, then we turn up and save the day... That's when we become heroes.... :D
No Colin they phoned a professional carpet CLEANER and the carpet CLEANER quess what.... cleaned the carpet ;D ;D ;D
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To be honest we can all carry on typing on here all day long with these arguments!!!!
If you think your just a cleaner and want to carry on earning what you earn, then carry on! no skin off my nose!!! I'm happy with what i get! If your happy with what you get who gives a crap!!!!!
;D ;D
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hi jim
i think your price is spot on even before discount. i think your problem is you have got so quick and efficent it doent seem good value even though it is.
I think the tradesman argument is ludicrous, we are tradesman. most trades havnt got 4 years training they have done a couple of night classes at the evening college of spiritual healing ;D paid 1500 quid to napit or gas safe and of they go.
my mate plasters for a national building firm taught himself in a few weekends, helped out a mate on a refurb and of he goes. owns two trowels. thats it.
how is that more skilled than us, especially jim who is a the top of his game.
as jason says they also turn up with 100 quid makita drill a pack of screwdrivers and a stanley knife.
thats a bit different to your setup what 20-30 grand.
john
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Well, it's been very interesting indeed reading peoples comments so far! Thanks for everyone's input, really appreciated :)
This topic has highlighted something that I think many of us realised already, but doesn't get discussed much - how we view ourselves.
I most certainly do not view myself a "just a cleaner". As I've already argued previously, you could not drag any person off the street, give them the keys to my van and send them out to do a day's work that I do. They wouldn't know where to begin. On the other hand, you give anyone a duster, mop and bucket and they'll instinctively be able to use those tools as well as pretty much any other able bodied person.
I work to live; I don't live to work. I get some customers making comments that they are surprised my work doesn't cost more. I also get the ones who wince at the price but I don't care because they're obviously not my market.
I think it is perfectly fine for people in our industry to value themselves however they want to - high or low. At the end of the day there is a market spanning all the way from top to bottom, price-wise. I just know which bit of it I enjoy working in the most :)
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the job description is cleaner, but we're far from it, well most of us are. do you clean all red wine stains out? or do you render some invisible?
been going 4 years now and still learning. everyday on the job and in the classroom when i get chance, so much to learn,
its quite simple really, you either take this job seriously and see it for what it really is or your just a cleaner.
What a strange statement ???
Rest my case ;D ;D It is quite simple Derek you clean carpets your a cleaner...
And yes must be the customer who is at fault they must of had a bad day or maybe you have out grown them - please!
i rest my case mike, you are obviously just a cleaner or you would get my point.
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I most certainly do not view myself a "just a cleaner".
Even if you did, people would do well to remember what Ken Livingstone said whilst Mayor of London. If every cleaner in London went on strike the capital would grind to a halt within a couple of days.
At the end of the day we are cleaners although there are many levels of cleaners, from those who's limits might be a mop & bucket to those who abseil buildings in London to clean the windows to those who clean up highly valuable ancient works of art using cotton buds. All fall under the umbrella of 'cleaner' but some require expensive machinery, knowledge and skills gained by much study and experience which makes them 'specialists.'
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knowledge and skills gained by much study and experience which makes them 'specialists.'
[/quote]
thats what its about...................
yep were all cleaners but I think where it gets under peoples quicks is what type of cleaners we are .
People use the word as a put down or out of snobery.
BUT!!!!!!
you dont go to someones door and say ' THE SPECIALIST cleaners here'
Because we train and become proficient in what we do I think we kind of expect to be treated with more respect than Mrs mop but yep the be all and end all of it is we are cleaners of some description.
Jim we charge what the market allows us to charge or what we rate our services to be worth, thats never going to be what everyone perceives this to be but ive found even the loyalist of cuzzys need an up front cost,
By the way I have trained and have life experience in what I do and rank myself as a 'SPECIALIST CLEANER' not just a cleaner, but if anyone wants to call me just a cleaner that fine, My invoice will change that impression.
people dont call 'just a cleaner' to remove stains, people dont call 'just a cleaner' to talk about how the smoke damage from a protein fire can be dealt with and there precious picture of great aunt may is not ruined and can be returned to its full glory again.
And people dont call 'just a cleaner' to rectify the damage caused by 'JUST A CLEANER'
But hey hoe you can call me 'The Cleaner' if you want.
have a good day folks
Regards Mark
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the job description is cleaner, but we're far from it, well most of us are. do you clean all red wine stains out? or do you render some invisible?
been going 4 years now and still learning. everyday on the job and in the classroom when i get chance, so much to learn,
its quite simple really, you either take this job seriously and see it for what it really is or your just a cleaner.
What a strange statement ???
Rest my case ;D ;D It is quite simple Derek you clean carpets your a cleaner...
And yes must be the customer who is at fault they must of had a bad day or maybe you have out grown them - please!
i rest my case mike, you are obviously just a cleaner or you would get my point.
Derek, like other cleaning companies on here, we employ all types of cleaners from general office cleaners to IPAF trained operators (who use machinery costing well over £50,000 )
It does not matter if you clean carpets, buildings F**king sky scrapers you are a cleaner trained / skilled in that area but still a 'cleaner' - I am proud to be a cleaner get over yourselves!
I do however treat each 'cleaner' and other 'tradesman' with the 'respect' which they are due individually and for the cleaning task they complete - this respect is clearly lacking in your statement and others on this forum. Time and time again I see posts on here where 'window cleaning guys' are slated as anyone can do that - really respectfull.
Back to the post - Jim clearly failed with this individual customer (what was it 6 yrs?) to explain his cleaning credentials + his incurred costs.
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Hi Guys
It is a problem we all experience when old customers are resistant to move with the pricing stucture of our businesses.
We invest in expensive equipment which allows us to clean quicker and dare I say better, but to our old customer we are the same person who has always cleaned their carpets well.
Sometimes one just has to accept a lower price if we wish to keep them.
As for being a cleaner, I would describe myself as a specialist cleaner working at the top end of the cleaning market.
I am also a part time chemist and website entrepreneur !!
Cheers
Doug
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the job description is cleaner, but we're far from it, well most of us are. do you clean all red wine stains out? or do you render some invisible?
been going 4 years now and still learning. everyday on the job and in the classroom when i get chance, so much to learn,
its quite simple really, you either take this job seriously and see it for what it really is or your just a cleaner.
What a strange statement ???
Rest my case ;D ;D It is quite simple Derek you clean carpets your a cleaner...
And yes must be the customer who is at fault they must of had a bad day or maybe you have out grown them - please!
i rest my case mike, you are obviously just a cleaner or you would get my point.
Derek, like other cleaning companies on here, we employ all types of cleaners from general office cleaners to IPAF trained operators (who use machinery costing well over £50,000 )
It does not matter if you clean carpets, buildings F**king sky scrapers you are a cleaner trained / skilled in that area but still a 'cleaner' - I am proud to be a cleaner get over yourselves!
I do however treat each 'cleaner' and other 'tradesman' with the 'respect' which they are due individually and for the cleaning task they complete - this respect is clearly lacking in your statement and others on this forum. Time and time again I see posts on here where 'window cleaning guys' are slatted as anyone can do that - really respectfull.
Back to the post - Jim clearly failed with this individual customer (what was it 6 yrs?) to explain his cleaning credentials + his incurred costs.
so when i repaint a leather chair and apply a finish, am i still just a cleaner mike?, or when i suck all the flood water out of a house and then install dehums and airmovers while keeping an eye on the humidity, am i still a cleaner? no doubt i am so i'll leave it there.
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i used to be a soldier...(albeit a specialist)... i was just a soldier
i am now a cleaner... or carpet cleaner..
like a window cleaner is ...a cleaner
why pretend to be something you're not..
i'm happy to be a cleaner of carpet and dont give a f&^K what anyone else thinks or sees it as.. and above all i dont try and make into sounding like you need a degree or have the ability to fly the shuttle to the moon to be.... a carpet cleaner..
we are what we are .. be happy at what you do and making your customers happy with a good job and service...
someone said eralier and i think you'll agree when have good weeks / months in this "just carpet cleaning"...its very very lucrative... £££
thanks
Paul
"just a carpet cleaner"
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The problem is the perception of some customers is that cleaning toilet bowls at minimum wage is the same as cleaning a carpet or Turkish rug, or silk upholstery. How you think about yourself, what you call yourself and how you talk to customers really DOES make a difference as well as what you do.
Being self employed you can choose who you work for. Work for people who appreciate what you do. I will often explain why something can't be done the way they think it should be done and at a certain price. If they ain't having it I don't want to work for them.
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Jim, Derek,
You both have truckmounts. I'm wondering how much stone cleaning you do?
The reason I ask is I had a conversation with someone who has pretty much given up carpet cleaning to concentrate on stone cleaning (he's fully trained on the stone side).
He told me he was getting three to four times the money for stone cleaning than he got from carpets - using almost the same kit.
The only difference was that stone cleaning / restoration was perceived to be a high ticket item by customers.
Same guy, same equipment, much better income..
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think i'll just leave everyone to be what ever they perceive themselves to be. and maybe, just maybe they'll let me do the same. or maybe not. ;D
yes gary, stone restoration and sealing is very big tickets but not as common to come across than carpets, about one a week for me, all though i don't market stone as my primary work. i've got a travertine floor to clean next friday, about 30 sq meters, £300 just clean. its quite a skilled job if you go into it. done a couple of stone courses but looking at doing mike philbins, heard good things about it.
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I class myself as a full cleaning and restoration company (cleaner)
Means i can clean and fully restore
carpets
Rugs
upholstery
leather
hard floor
wood
Flood restoration
Fire restoration
odour neuralisation
protection application
Training
repairing
reweaving
etc etc etc
Do i consider myself as a specialist YES
Do i charge a higher price than the rest of the cleaners around me YES
Do i worry about price NO
Am i busy all year round YES
Its about YOU and YOUR business and what YOU charge, not any body else.
I k ow of cleaning SPECIALISTS that clean very expensive paintings (valued at millions) like me they are just cleaners, but they charge accordingly ;)
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Mossy,
You're spot on with that post.
Simon
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i took one of my customers shopping for carpets in December, does that make me a floor-covering acquisition specialist
In my opinion we are what we do most of.... which makes me a carpet cleaner.
what people call me or think of the profession I have chosen makes no difference to me and has no effect on my quality of life
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i took one of my customers shopping for carpets in December, does that make me a floor-covering acquisition specialist
In my opinion we are what we do most of.... which makes me a carpet cleaner.
what people call me or think of the profession I have chosen makes no difference to me and has no effect on my quality of life
I agree... I could give a rats hoop what people think, I enjoy doing what I do....