Clean It Up

UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 08:57:32 am

Title: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 08:57:32 am: seems a post about the tyrannical moderators has been deleted...................

By a tyrannical moderator..

so much for freedom of speech

human rights infringements etc
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: wynne jones on August 29, 2011, 09:14:17 am: To be fair to Ian and all the mods, whatever decision you make someone will think it's wrong, who would want to be a football referee?

But.....

This pattern is seen with lots of other things, for instance Restoremate's new products like their new encap product and no mod locked that and why should they. No, the reality is the owner of CM came on here some time back and naively thought he could promote it through the forum in an open and honest way. When he didn't want to advertise they have had it in for him ever since which is a bit of a shame because I'm sure the vast majority of members would be interested in knowing about it.

I use CM, like it and it makes me money. Whenever the subject comes up sure I'm going to sing it's praises, it's called recommendation.

Also watching the rolling news this morning I'd say 70% of the stories they are broadcasting were all lifted from PR releases from charities, government departments, record companies, film companies... etc etc. Just imagine if ITV told them all to go buy TV advertising. If it wasn't for this approach, they would be hard pressed to have a programme. So even if this theory is true he's probably doing the owners of the forum a favour, unless on a slow day you would prefer another 'Which is the best Porty?' thread ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Gunn on August 29, 2011, 09:19:49 am: I got warned off Mike Boxall about this sometime ago with a ban, posting links to special offers or new products was a no no as some suppliers pay to advertise.I disagree because as a carpet cleaner if I or someone else finds a new product or a fantastic deal on something then why should we not let others know about them.

I can understand if a supplier does this but we are cleaners who most are always on the look out for a bargain.If anything there should be a new section where links or products can be posted after careful moderation or wording slightly changed by MB himself. I mean a lot of companies have special offers on that no one knows about as they might not deal with a particular company hence the reason for a posting.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Ian Gourlay on August 29, 2011, 09:23:42 am: Enough said

Steve has explained policy

Yes it is a fine line which is why original post was not completely deleted.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 09:25:49 am: so why delete my post/thread complaining about deleting posts ??
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Ian Gourlay on August 29, 2011, 09:31:16 am: In think the reason is obvious
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 09:33:12 am: not to all those who never saw it...............
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Gunn on August 29, 2011, 09:37:04 am: Quote from: Ian Gourlay on August 29, 2011, 09:23:42 am
Enough said

Steve has explained policy

Yes it is a fine line which is why original post was not completely deleted.

So why delete my thread if it explained the policy??
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: derek west on August 29, 2011, 12:13:43 pm: mr gerrard has been banned for jovial banter. what is this forum coming to, hey ho. me next probably.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Glynn on August 29, 2011, 12:46:41 pm: What ?, Mr Gerrard has been banned, thats unbelievable. He must create the most traffic on here.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: wynne jones on August 29, 2011, 02:29:30 pm: Simon I'm sure was responsible for probably the longest and most influential threads on here, the Truckmount thread. Think quite a few people took the plunge after that and never looked back.

Just been watching Mutiny on The Bounty with Trevor Howard. ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 02:53:46 pm: Quote
Just been watching Mutiny on The Bounty with Trevor Howard.

very poignant Wynne ;D ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 03:03:03 pm: Simon does have very strong opionions, however just because a fragile ego gets a little dented, there is no reason to ban him.

People need to learn to accept critisism when they do something as a knee jerk reaction and find that the majority disagree.

This really is becoming the kindergarten, however not from the members ........................ in my opinion..... Not fact of course oh no.

facts and discussions and recommendations are seemingly banned.

So we can all have discussions as long as only paying advertisers products are mentioned. Oh yes and Pierre de Wett of course.......
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Mike Halliday on August 29, 2011, 03:41:25 pm: from what i can gather Simon has been banned for 7 days for childish posting, he started stupid topics and made childish comments on other topic.

if anyone wants to abuse the hospitality of this forum then they should expect to be denied access, this is not the moderators being heavy handed its just common politeness, this forum is open to anyone who wants to share information, help or ask for help or general chit-chat, but some see the forum as a a way to have a laugh and cause trouble, these people are tolerated but why let them tarnish the positive nature of this forum with their childishness.

we are here to help each other, some of the topic posted today have served no purpose apart from to cause trouble so they have been deleted,

what i suggest is that all those that think the moderator have been heavy handed or tyrannical should show there objections by a mass resignation of membership.... vote with your feet.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 03:49:00 pm: voice of reason there Mike.

Would you have any objection if I were to set up a poll on whether the members think certain moderators have been heavy handed?
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Ian Gourlay on August 29, 2011, 03:52:33 pm: I certainly wood

As Mike says if you do not like it walk
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: D Ingram on August 29, 2011, 03:59:00 pm: You pair having a laugh, you want to be the last 2 on this board or what ???
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Shaun_Ashmore on August 29, 2011, 04:00:47 pm: This is what can happen when policing of dual personalities isn't adhered to (not that it hasn't been said already) I'm sure that some discussions are manufactured to cause trouble.

I've taken a back seat on posting because it can get a bit confrontational and perhaps that's why some of the older posters don't post anymore, it just needs a bit of sorting out with dual personalities.

Shaun
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus) on August 29, 2011, 04:01:57 pm: What a mature, moderate attitude to take !

I wouldn't give you the satisfaction by deleting my account - you started this nonsense by locking a perfectly harmless thread.

Be careful what you wish for, already a great number of experienced carpet cleaners don't bother with this forum.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:02:52 pm: I agree with shaun............

and so do I .................
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:04:16 pm: Quote from: Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus) on August 29, 2011, 04:01:57 pm
What a mature, moderate attitude to take !

I wouldn't give you the satisfaction by deleting my account - you started this nonsense by locking a perfectly harmless thread.

Be careful what you wish for, already a great number of experienced carpet cleaners don't bother with this forum.

good post Steve
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Mike Halliday on August 29, 2011, 04:06:01 pm: hector no point starting a poll, some think we have, some think we haven't...... it will serve no purpose apart from fueling the ill feelings that has been created.

the best thing is to just to agree to disagree and get on with doing what we should be doing.... discussing carpet cleaning,
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Mike Halliday on August 29, 2011, 04:10:38 pm: Steve, you posted as I was typing, i guess you are referring to my mass resignation sentence, this was said tongue in cheek, do you think I really want anyone to resign their membership? to be truthful I think the deletion of the cleaners mate topic was questionable but we have 3 independent mods who take action as they see fit...... we don't have to agree with it but its how the forum is ran.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:10:57 pm: Fair enough Mike.

How is your application with the diplomatic corps of the UN??

should be a breeze after today.... ;D ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: richy27 on August 29, 2011, 04:20:28 pm: why is it this forum has so much confrontation most of which is started by people who dont use their real name dont think i have ever seen moderators having to get involved on other forums they seem to self police themselves.

i am starting to post less and less on here now as it seems to be the same old sh** all the time .
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:24:14 pm: Quote
i am starting to post less and less on here now as it seems to be the same old sh** all the time .

well don't post the same old sh** all the time then ;D ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:26:24 pm: Speaking from the dark side of this forum, (The window licking section ;D ) I can honestly say that being a regular poster on there, I got bored answering the same old questions all the time and watching the same old moans and topics week in, week out. IMO, the main reason "Older posters" don't come onto any section is boredom with the same old stuff.

I've seen window cleaners come over here and ask the same old question nearly every week. "Thinking of having CC as an add on" blah blah. Most of you can't be bothered to answer, and I don't blame you. Moderators have slapped a 7 day ban on me for being naughty and childish (In their opinion) and that happens when they think the forum could be dragged down or damaged. That's their job. Some can do the job well.............

Sometimes they will delete or lock threads and posts and upset some of us. So what? Just start another thread and modify it. In other words, it's their train set, and they run it as best they can. Nobody is perfect, just accept that they make mistakes.

Having said that, a moderator that says "If you don't like it, cancel your account" may one day regret typing that. The tone of a forum is made by the people who run it. 20,000 members is no so great if only 25 bother posting. Arrogance isn't a sign of a good moderator.

By the way, people like myself, who use a nickname, aren't hiding if we put our details on our profile. If you know how to look at a persons profile, you will see my tel number, web address and full name.

In a forum, it doesn't matter what nick name you use, as long as you don't try to hide IMO.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Doug Holloway on August 29, 2011, 04:27:16 pm: Hi Guys

The real names thing is something all the moderators would like to see implemented as there is no doubt almost all the mischief comes from people posting under psuedonyms.

It is down to Mike Boxall in the end and would be difficult to implement.

Until then we will continue to do the best we can with what we have.

It's also worth bearing in mind no one gets suspended for one childish or inflammatory post, it is always a build up.

Cheers

Doug
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:28:18 pm: Quote from: Richard Basey-Fisher on August 29, 2011, 04:20:28 pm
why is it this forum has so much confrontation most of which is started by people who dont use their real name dont think i have ever seen moderators having to get involved on other forums they seem to self police themselves.

i am starting to post less and less on here now as it seems to be the same old sh** all the time .

The main reason the other forums police themselves is because they are dull and have very few posters and threads. This forum rocks and that means people happy and unhappy. People that don't like this place wont use it. Simple as that.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:30:07 pm: Oh , forgot to say, kindest regards, Richard Powell. ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:33:01 pm: Quote from: Cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:28:18 pm
Quote from: Richard Basey-Fisher on August 29, 2011, 04:20:28 pm
why is it this forum has so much confrontation most of which is started by people who dont use their real name dont think i have ever seen moderators having to get involved on other forums they seem to self police themselves.

i am starting to post less and less on here now as it seems to be the same old sh** all the time .

The main reason the other forums police themselves is because they are dull and have very few posters and threads. This forum rocks and that means people happy and unhappy. People that don't like this place wont use it. Simple as that.

I agree Cozy, this is (used to be) the fun forum and yet informative at the same time.

The other channel is good for technical info but not for the fun.....
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:34:14 pm: ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

see
FUN
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:43:58 pm: Quote from: Hector M on August 29, 2011, 04:24:14 pm
Quote
i am starting to post less and less on here now as it seems to be the same old sh** all the time .

well don't post the same old sh** all the time then ;D ;D

Now look what you've done!!!
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:46:36 pm: sense of humour failure alert :P
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Gunn on August 29, 2011, 04:48:01 pm: There lies the problem 3 moderators all with different views,1 with an itchy finger who cannot wait to delete/lock posts,1 whose tongue in cheek quotes can be taken differently by different people,then 1 who is the voice of reason.

While I appreciate the difficult job they have and cannot spend 24hrs a day on here moderating hence the reason for 3 I guess but they all don't seem to sing from the same song sheet. Ultimately issues should be addressed to Mike Boxall its his forum
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 04:48:21 pm: and he did leave himself wide open for that one

8) 8)
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 04:51:53 pm: Quote from: Topgunn Cleaning Services on August 29, 2011, 04:48:01 pm
There lies the problem 3 moderators all with different views,1 with an itchy finger who cannot wait to delete/lock posts,1 whose tongue in cheek quotes can be taken differently by different people,then 1 who is the voice of reason.

While I appreciate the difficult job they have and cannot spend 24hrs a day on here moderating hence the reason for 3 I guess but they all don't seem to sing from the same song sheet. Ultimately issues should be addressed to Mike Boxall its his forum

But that defeats the object of having mods. If Make Boxall has to sort every issue out himself, he would have to put hours into a bloody forum. People are people, and 3 people will never see everything in the same light. When all's said and done, it's not life and death. Sod it. I'd make a great mod, pass me a hammer!!! ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Sharon Gerrard on August 29, 2011, 05:03:41 pm: Quote from: Ian Gourlay on August 29, 2011, 03:52:33 pm
I certainly wood

As Mike says if you do not like it walk
Ian,
What incredible arrogance.
If I were you I'd speak to the forum owners who may take objection to you getting rid of some of it's biggest contributors. You might be happy to have people walk, but will the owners be as happy if the advertisers do likewise because you've ruined the place by stifling quite legitimate debate, the very stuff of forums, if you kill that you kill the reason for anyone to log on. I think you are acting way beyond your authority and if you don't mind me saying so making yourself look a rather silly.
Sharon
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Colin Day on August 29, 2011, 05:33:46 pm: To be fair Sharon, Simon could sail close to the wind as most of us can, difference being though, most of us know when to wind our necks in.

I'm not having a dig at Simon because some of his posts were spot on, though I always vowed never to get into another argument with him ever again, because he is like a dog with a bone. ;D

I dunno what has gone on leading up to Simon's departure, but it's obvious that at some time or other, a good few CIU members lock horns with a Moderator. I suppose it's human nature.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 05:39:23 pm: he will be back Colin in 7 days......
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Mike Halliday on August 29, 2011, 05:39:58 pm: Quote from: Topgunn Cleaning Services on August 29, 2011, 04:48:01 pm
There lies the problem 3 moderators all with different views,1 with an itchy finger who cannot wait to delete/lock posts,1 whose tongue in cheek quotes can be taken differently by different people,then 1 who is the voice of reason.

While I appreciate the difficult job they have and cannot spend 24hrs a day on here moderating hence the reason for 3 I guess but they all don't seem to sing from the same song sheet. Ultimately issues should be addressed to Mike Boxall its his forum

steve I think having 3 different mods is the best option, we are different with different approaches but like you say singing from the same songsheet.

no one can get it right all the time and we can bounce ideas of each other to try and do the right thing. some might not think it but we are trying to do the right thing and keep CIU a good resource for carpet cleaners,
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Colin Day on August 29, 2011, 05:44:14 pm: Quote from: Hector M on August 29, 2011, 05:39:23 pm
he will be back Colin in 7 days......

I hope so, although the man can be a complete potato at times (and so of course, can I!) he is a valuable asset on this forum.... And I'd buy him a pint, and as anyone who knows me, that is a very privileged honour... ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: cozy on August 29, 2011, 05:46:24 pm: As long as you don't try and give him the golden rivet!!
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 05:47:33 pm: what kind of potato colin?

there must be different kinds of potatoness :o

All Wafu's have deep pockets and short arms ;D ;D
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 05:50:08 pm: Colin denies all knowledge of rivets (golden or any other kind) :-X

not sure whether it is true or not yet though :P :P
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus) on August 29, 2011, 05:59:36 pm: Mike - my post wasn't directed at you. You didn't lock the cleaners mate thread.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: justin 88 on August 29, 2011, 06:46:29 pm: i had a bollocking for praising a certain someone as IMO that person has helped me alot (see, not even allowed to give his name as i am told it's a testimonial!!) .............i agree hector, the rules apply for some and not others, asked for an explanation and got zero response........TYPICAL
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 06:50:20 pm: guess we have to just suck it up,
or vote with our feet.

like it or lump it seems to be the order of the day
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 06:53:55 pm: maybe your helper was not a recognised "guru"
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: garyj on August 29, 2011, 07:31:45 pm: I think to be fair the moderators do a pretty good job, and a thankless one at that.

They are more than fair and well it might look petty to ban someone for 7 days for what was a harmless post the reality is it wasn't just that ONE post, it is also for the 100 before he got away with.

A lot of people (me included) come on here and say things we wouldn't say on the other forums! Strange but true. Most of us on here see it as harmless fun, but every now and then it just needs pulling in to line a bit, and when it's the same posters who cheese everyone off then its a pretty big clue to them.

Is there really a Sharon Gerrard or is it what Simon is known as on Bank Holidays?
Whichever it is, neither is in a position to call Ian arrogant. In fact I think its arrogant of you to call him such.

One thing I really don't understand though, so feel free to tell me.. CM has been given an airing on here over the years and at one point was done to death. Why don't they just advertise on the banner? It can't cost that much and you're marketing to your EXACT target audience, just pay up and everyone wins. Its a commercial venture to make the owner money, why shouldn't they pay?
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 29, 2011, 07:41:02 pm: where did that come from Gary ??
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Neil Williams on August 29, 2011, 10:19:23 pm: I really must learn to log onto carpet cleaning forums on Bank Holidays instead of taking a break from the industry :D
I takeit the root cause of all this was something to do with Coffee mate, although I can't see why coffee mate should be such a problem. Personally I much prefer Cows Milk, oh drat that's got the same initials
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Steve Rothwell on August 30, 2011, 06:36:14 am: The root problem Neil, was a member of Mr J Henson's crew with inflated ego, who's sensibilities were hurt.
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: Mike_Boxall on August 31, 2011, 07:00:53 pm: Can I just take this opportunity to thank all the moderators for doing what is often a thankless task. I accepted a long time ago that you can't please all the people all the time and I'm happy that any reasonable member will be able to see that the forum is usually disrupted by the same few posters and the moderators do a great job trying to strike the right balance between allowing open and balanced debate and not allowing a handful to take advantage.

There are always going to be differences of opinion with so many people on a forum like this but there's absolutely no justification for personal attacks or insults. If you think this is unreasonable please spend your time elsewhere. Otherwise, please just accept that sometimes things aren't always black or white and it's often very difficult to draw a line between acceptable and unacceptable.

Regards

Mike Boxall mike@i-clean.info
Title: Re: still can't discuss things
Post by: craignozza on August 31, 2011, 07:54:11 pm: Why did my post get deleted from this thread it wasnt offensive to anyone ?? !!