Clean It Up

UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Windae Cleaner on October 14, 2005, 06:57:31 pm

Title: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Windae Cleaner on October 14, 2005, 06:57:31 pm: How many of us in Scotland have a window cleaning licence as required by most Local Authourities ?
If you have any other comments to make about this please do so.

Paul
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: H h20 on October 14, 2005, 07:03:32 pm: Why is the law so strict about window cleaners in Scotland and so different in England,what difference does it make,will it become law in England to have a licence,Gaz.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 14, 2005, 07:17:55 pm: I would welcome these licences because it would ensure a standard throughout the industry. By standard I mean fully insured, registered with the IR etc etc.

Historically our industry has been a magnet for seasonal and undeclared w/c which impacts on every legitimate w/c company. Demand for licences w/c's would be higher and eventually would be more profitable as we could demand higher prices.

I have nothing to fear from licencing as,like most guys on this forum, run a fairly tight ship by conforming to everything expected of us.

Bring it on I say.

Regards,

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: H h20 on October 14, 2005, 07:21:48 pm: Well done Sarah,thats the exact answer i wanted to read,i second your opion,we need to make this profession a well respected one and keep all those flyby nights out,Gaz.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: gaza on October 14, 2005, 08:24:28 pm: I third it,motion passed licences for all w/c ,max sentence should be £1500 fine or to watch a week of coro and Eastenders.

SERIOUS NOW:I wouldnt mind using the licence to prove your a pro w/c £200 for 2 yrs licence thats two squid a week,with a training day with a h/s/e rep.it would give the council the power to work the same way as licences for Taxi drivers,except no police
checking your vechicle.

GAZA
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 14, 2005, 08:26:57 pm: Hi Gaza,

Dont want to start another debate on COWBOYS.................... but would'nt
this sort that little problem out. ;D

Regards,

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Paul Coleman on October 14, 2005, 09:00:58 pm: Quote from: Sarah Sarill on October 14, 2005, 07:17:55 pm
I would welcome these licences because it would ensure a standard throughout the industry. By standard I mean fully insured, registered with the IR etc etc.

Historically our industry has been a magnet for seasonal and undeclared w/c which impacts on every legitimate w/c company. Demand for licences w/c's would be higher and eventually would be more profitable as we could demand higher prices.

I have nothing to fear from licencing as,like most guys on this forum, run a fairly tight ship by conforming to everything expected of us.

Bring it on I say.

Regards,

Sarah

I have no problem with licensing per se. I would have a problem if local authorities regarded the money for it as another tax rather than a small fee to cover the costs of producing it. I would also feel put out about it if a license restricted someone's work area - i.e. if you want to work in five towns you would need five licenses. Worst case scenario. Local authorities want to make a big profit from window cleaning license so charge £100. Work spread over five towns = £500 a year. Those four x's in town halls would do it too if they thought they'd get away with it.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Ben Walker on October 14, 2005, 09:09:54 pm: yeh, i'm in glasgea and i see from time to time young lads hanging on the ledges of tenement buildings. wouldn't reckon they have licence, insurance etc
mind you they are often doing jobs i wouldn't be so keen on. like first floor flat jobs that would be all ladder work and you have to hoik the ladder all the way round the block and down the service lane to do the backs. (easier wfp i suppose). and i don't suppose they charge very much, so they have a niche market.

regulations are good but you can't regulate everyone. and would you want to. i like to be able ring up 'Jim' and get a crate of beer delivered at 2 in the morning, and all the best music wasn't made by guys who said 'drugs, they're so evil'
always two sides to a coin.
a young lad who goes around window cleaning for half a year, i'd say perhaps good for him.

i'm licensed etc, though not got round to IR registration :o (cos i'm newbie)

In scotland Licensing i think is good, but i noticed that if a w/c is based near the boundary of two local authorities or even three, they might be a bit ped off having to pay more than on licence! >:(

(just noticed The Shiner's post)

also had to wait for weeks for my licence! not good service >:(

ben-san
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Paul Coleman on October 14, 2005, 09:15:46 pm: Quote from: Ben-chan on October 14, 2005, 09:09:54 pm

i'm licensed etc, though not got round to IR registration :o (cos i'm newbie)

In scotland Licensing i think is good, but i noticed that if a w/c is based near the boundary of two local authorities or even three, they might be a bit ped off having to pay more than on licence! >:(

(just noticed The Shiner's post)

also had to wait for weeks for my licence! not good service >:(

ben-san

Regarding the IR registration, they penalise you if you don't register within 3 months of start-up.
Also, regarding working in several areas. I work in West Sussex, East Sussex, and Surrey because I live near the border (Gatwick area). If you let a jobsworth have a little control, they end up taking the urine. One of the reasons I started window cleaning was to get away from all that.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Chris Cottrell on October 14, 2005, 09:17:50 pm: Maybe this is something the PWCA could arrange as part of membership?
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Moderator David@stives on October 14, 2005, 09:21:53 pm: whatever next

They will be banning smoking in public soon and charging a local income tax . :o
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 14, 2005, 09:22:33 pm: From what I understand about these licenses in Scotland you do pay a fee per local authority because its a money earner.

Personally I think it would be best ran on counties rather than authorities. That would give most small w/c enough scope. The financial impact would then be on bigger companies who cover many counties. As a % of earning though it should equal out.

At the end of the day it would be introduced for the councils financial benefit but to the benefit of our industry so I'd be happy to pay £100 per county if that's what it would cost me to trade in a professional industry .

Lets wait and see how this one developes but one thing is for certain - the highest objectors will be the fly-by- nights !!!!!

Regards,

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 14, 2005, 09:24:49 pm: Quote from: david@ St-Ives on October 14, 2005, 09:21:53 pm
whatever next

They will be banning smoking in public soon and charging a local income tax . :o

Be a bit more specific David.

Are you against sorting out our industry or just to paying a licence fee ?

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Moderator David@stives on October 14, 2005, 09:31:53 pm: If it was a national licence i wouldn`t mind ,but if you live on the corner of four areas and need 4 licenses well that is outrageous .
when i was taxi driving years back there was the same thing .licenses for different areas ,but that was routinely flouted without much come back.

Dave
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 14, 2005, 09:33:28 pm: Excuse my ignorance.

Would a Window Cleaner in Scotland mind explaining to me why the law specifies that a window cleaner requires a Licence?

Are you required to carry it with you when at work?

Is it specifically for windowcleaners or all service trades people?

Before too many issues get caught up in this political whirlpool. ;)

Pj
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: gaza on October 14, 2005, 09:33:48 pm: No Sarah its not because of that reason you mentioned but why your on the subject ;D

I believe it would shut out the scum who break into other peeps rounds by under cutting only tyo dissapear when the weather turns,
leaving the poor w/c to pick up the pieces,and not able to put his prices up because of it,because the customers believe that a price that is way under priced is the correct price,it would show you are proffessional at what you do and demand a proff wage.

GAZA
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: brett walker on October 14, 2005, 09:55:24 pm: Yes there should be a window cleaning licence

and get rid of the TV licence

Brett
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Ben Walker on October 14, 2005, 10:05:22 pm: Quote
Excuse my ignorance.

Would a Window Cleaner in Scotland mind explaining to me why the law specifies that a window cleaner requires a Licence?

Are you required to carry it with you when at work?

Is it specifically for windowcleaners or all service trades people?

Before too many issues get caught up in this political whirlpool.

Pj

just found this: http://www.scotland.gov.uk/library5/society/tglp-14.asp, haven't read it yet, i'm 'off licenced' and 'take awayed' now ;D

ben
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: busydaffodil on October 14, 2005, 10:07:18 pm: I agree with the licencing of windows. In my opinion, it would cut out the rogue, unofficial businesses to a degree and allow the homeowner to know it was a legal business. It could even be incorporated into the license application that the applicant prove they are insured. (though there will always be some homeowners willing to take the risk by using "cowboys" to save a few pounds). As for adopting location type licenses, surely a license could be purchased in the area the business is registered but would allow national coverage? Could possibly work, but I suppose there could be other issues to consider.
Also, to make it fair to all, each window cleaner to be licenced, not each company. This would make it fair for the smaller businesses.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: busydaffodil on October 14, 2005, 10:08:20 pm: Quote from: busydaffodil on October 14, 2005, 10:07:18 pm
I agree with the licencing of windows.

Opps...it should read "I agree with the licensing of window cleaners" LOL
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 14, 2005, 10:23:25 pm: just found this: http://www.scotland.gov.uk/library5/society/tglp-14.asp, haven't read it yet, i'm 'off licenced' and 'take awayed' now ;D

ben

Quote

Thanks Ben

It would seem that the purpose of a licence is to protect the client, from rogue traders. The licence identifying that the person on the householder's premises is bona fide, who they say they are and the licence is paid proof.
So not much more than an identity card. No big deal, as long as the fee is justifiable. We should all have one.
Only trouble is the crooks will always be one step ahead.

My opinion...forget all your other soap box issues, a one off reasonable fee for a licence is a good thing. I would pay max £100 pa for it.
But, sadly it doesn't prove very much.
My work does. I'm glad I'm not just starting out

Pj
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: stevef on October 15, 2005, 09:54:11 am: Are you all MAD! is there not enough legislation around already without creating more. What good would it realy do? do you think it will stop roge traders? No its hasn't in any other trade so why should WC's be any different. all my clients have my full address home and mobile number. I can provide upon request fed membership, insuance cert, proof of training,method statments and risk assesments what more can they possibley want? I allready pay out enough without this thank you wery much
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 15, 2005, 10:08:50 am: Do you know sometimes I just resent being a woman - its the inability to 'let it go' that gets me in trouble all the time !!!! :D

My biggest grunt about the w/c industry is the ease at which some people can tap nto the market, earn some extra cash and never get caught. In the 7 years we have been trading in our town there has been in excess of 20 who undercut because they do pay for any insurances, safety equipment etc etc.

When I say undercut I mean HALF your fee so even the loyalest of customers try them out.

On top of that they claim benefits, live in paid for rented houses, drive disabled cars and dont pay any taxes at all !!!

If my £100 got rid of that alone I would think it worthwhile - both in terms of professionalising the industry and increasing our profits due to the lack of w/c's.

I suspect (although the link did not say it) the licence (or ID Card) system must be more than just that. I pressume you would have to conform to other criteria to become a window cleaner. For example, be registered with the IR, be fully insured etc. This ALONE would stop rogue traders in their tracks. So pressuming this is the case I still say:-

Bring it on.

If not its a useless, beaurocratic waste of time.

Rant over - I rest my case (or do I !!! )

Regards,

Sarah

PS: Dont know who said it but it would be something the fed/BWCA could introduce and or consult on. Another helpful and beneficial reason to join for )
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: busydaffodil on October 15, 2005, 10:12:35 am: Way ta go Girl!

Definitely agree with you.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 15, 2005, 12:19:37 pm: You will never stop rogue traders, cowboys etc.
They couldn't give a Rat's ...... about law,licences, ID cards, H&S, etc.
Look how a certain level of lowlifes behave when there are disasters. New Orleans,
or anywhere else in the world, including here. Don't give me any garbage about it being different here.
So if your only reasons for supporting a law on licensing is to stop the bad guys, forget it.
An ID card/licence has it's advantages, but none of us wants any more restrictions than necessary.
I agree with stevef, all my customers know me, how I work, I've been local for 18 years! Indeed what more do they want? I have the security codes to a number of houses etc. already, they tell me to lock up when I'm done!
As for all you activists, militants or whatever..you will all go on inventing and re-writing laws to enforce for your own protection, as long as no-one does the same to you, people are just lawless these days, just watch them on the roads, in supermarkets, at carboots, on public transport, when theres a sale on in the shops.
It makes me sick! I'm never going out again! I'm gonna switch off my telly, turn on my media player and listen to some Hendrix, or Howlin' Wolf, or Albert Collins, or Dylan on full volume...(it's ok the neighbours are cool, they can't hear, so no issues to settle there).
Finally, if I lived in Scotland I would buy the licence and pass the fee on through my charges, as with everything else.
Have a good Saturday
Be good to people
And yourselves
8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8) 8

Pj
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 15, 2005, 01:03:08 pm: There should be no window cleaning licence for various reasons, in other trades when local councils have brought in licences for the public good, they have got out of hand.

Every year the councils will add more requirements that they want you to comply with.

It will not stop one single case of fraud happening, the people who commit this types of crime know the punishments for commiting these crimes and adding another punishment is not going to stop them.

There is a national identity card coming out soon, its going to cost anything up to £85.00 to have one, now this card will have all your personal details on it including what benefits you are claiming, so "pc plod" will be able to know who is working illegally.

Don't forget that the councils can start to dictate how much we charge our customers, when we can put our prices up and by how much, what equipment we use and where we get it from, what we wear, what we drive, how long we work etc etc.

Once pandoras box is opened you can't close it again.

There was also a report carried out that came to the conclusion that the "Black Ecomony" is good for the country.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: baldeagle on October 15, 2005, 01:43:35 pm: A friend of mine was knocked over by a young lad driving a car the other week, the said lad has no licence.

I know a person living about 100 yards from here, that has no TV licence - but his TV works fine without it.

I can obtain a firearm for about eighty quid if I want one - it will take me about two hours, and the seller isn't going to ask to see a licence.

Licences allow the authorities to control the licence holders, never those without!

Because of my medical condition, I limit my windowcleaning work to 6 days a month, so whilst the clever ones amongst you are interfering with my business, and organising my licence arrangements, perhaps you would be so kind as to let me know what discount I'll get, only being a part timer?

Oh yes, somone further up the thread mentioned "disabled badge" I think in the same sentence as "fiddlers".

I'd like to point out that I hold such a badge, I wonder what, exactly, was the point you were trying to make?

Perhaps those of you that you like to bring yet more licensing would care to stop now, whilst you are losing, or at least attempt to think first?

Baldeagle
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 15, 2005, 02:38:32 pm: You should have a licence just for that terrifying monster in your picture Baldeagle!
;D

I fully agree with you.

Pj

mmmmm no more posts from the ladies?
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 15, 2005, 02:57:09 pm: Baldeagle

I agree with what you said, I am registed disabled and have been for over 20 years, I shouldn't be working at all, but I can't stand people telling me what I can and cannot do.

I have a disabled bus pass which comes in handy and I could get a badge for my vechicle, but what will people think if they saw one of them on a ruddy great big van.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 15, 2005, 03:38:19 pm: Tax, what tax?

If you have a very good accountant then you won't pay any tax for the first 5 years of trading, and very little thereafter.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 15, 2005, 06:48:04 pm: Quote from: The Cleaner Service on October 15, 2005, 02:38:32 pm

mmmmm no more posts from the ladies?

Hi everyone,

There is always going to be very different opinions on things that get so close to being political and moreso ones which affect our businesses directly.

As you have all realised from my posts I feel very strongly about people (in whatever industry) who cheat the system when the majority do conform by operating legitimate business ventures.

Quote from: williamx on October 15, 2005, 01:03:08 pm

There was also a report carried out that came to the conclusion that the "Black Ecomony" is good for the country.

Are you suggesting that if people are allowed to do this without penalty it may benefit us all to de-legit as it would benefit the country and our own pockets !!

Quote from: baldeagle on October 15, 2005, 01:43:35 pm

Perhaps those of you that you like to bring yet more licensing would care to stop now, whilst you are losing, or at least attempt to think first?

Baldeagle

Losing what ? I always think before I post and unlike many others stick to my opinions which may or may not be right - but still mine.

Finally, I fully respect all the opinions on this forum - even though we dont agree on this one. I respect even more the ones who have the guts to stand by their convictions like me !!!

Great debate though guys and girls ;D

Much respect to you all,

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 15, 2005, 07:19:20 pm: Sarah

I am not saying it is right, it just happens to be a fact that we all benefit in someway because of the "Black Economy".

The same applies to those that smoke, if every one stopped the goverment would have to find over 10 billion pound every year just to replace the money it would lose.

Sometimes we benefit from bad habits.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: busydaffodil on October 15, 2005, 08:16:35 pm: Holy Moly......a girl takes a few hours off to watch the X Factor......and, oh well.
(Oh, wasnt Dan FAB- but thats off topic so forgive me).

I stick by my agreement to license Window Cleaners.

Quote
A friend of mine was knocked over by a young lad driving a car the other week, the said lad has no licence.

I feel very sorry for your friend. Sadly, there will always be people who attempt to ignore laws. But imagine the carnage if NO-ONE had licenses or were required to take a driving test? Surely you do not mean you do not support the driving lessons, test & license?

Quote
I know a person living about 100 yards from here, that has no TV licence - but his TV works fine without it.

Until all his neighbours get wind, resent him for getting away with it & report him. OR the nice big detector van pulls into town. Would like to see his face when hes hit with a £1000 fine. Additionally, our TV license payment helps pay BBC, etc. Imagine the number of adverts that would have to be played to make up for all that money! Eastenders would be 2 minutes long with a 28 minute advert break!!!

Quote
I can obtain a firearm for about eighty quid if I want one - it will take me about two hours, and the seller isn't going to ask to see a licence.

You really agree with not licensing the holding of fire-arms? The seller is risking prison, the buyer risking his kids, neighbours kids, etc, finding this illegal gun, cos rest assured, if its bought illegally, its probably being stored incorrectly, and the kids possibly killing themselves or someone else by accident. I know I would prefer fire-arm regulations.

Quote
whilst the clever ones amongst you are interfering with my business, and organising my licence arrangements, perhaps you would be so kind as to let me know what discount I'll get, only being a part timer?

Life is about choices. If a business is set up then if its viable, it should support all expenses. Oh, and who are the clever ones around here you refer too? I'm sure they would like to know they are interfering in your business by holding this debate on the World Wide Web!!!!!

Quote
It will not stop one single case of fraud happening

Please can I have next weeks lotto numbers....... ;)

As said before, I agree that window cleaners should be licensed. I stand by my opinion but respect that others have their own views.

Have a fab night all. Oh, and what time are the X Factor results on?? LOL
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Moderator David@stives on October 15, 2005, 09:50:41 pm: 1984 George Orwell
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 16, 2005, 03:25:14 am: Additionally, our TV license payment helps pay BBC, etc. Imagine the number of adverts that would have to be played to make up for all that money! Eastenders would be 2 minutes long with a 28 minute advert break!!!

Yes we pay for the beeb, but we also pay for cable, and Eastenders is one long advert for " The Samaritans" - "Child Line" and "Crimewatch".

Have your licence, and see that it will not help you in anyway whats so ever, except take more money off you.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 16, 2005, 11:19:58 am: Quote from: david@ St-Ives on October 15, 2005, 09:50:41 pm
1984 George Orwell

"Big Sister is watching" :(
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: matts on October 16, 2005, 11:40:14 am: Hi everybody, concerning these window cleaning licences the cost in north lanarkshire is £107,not only do you have to state which streets you are going to operate in but you also have to state the days and hours you propose to trade and if you ever expand enough to start other employees it is your responsibility to ensure they also have a licence.You also need a copy of your p/l insurance which is obviously a good thing.Although i do agree with all these measures i also think this should be national so you can cross over into other council areas as we all live close to borders and boundaries and this obviously restricts you from making a decent living
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: busydaffodil on October 16, 2005, 01:52:34 pm: Matt, I totally agree with you.

Also , can we keep this as a debate on "window Cleaning licensing", instead of making it into a "gender war". Its not very constructive is it? Its not original (yes, most women have heard this stuff more than once), and its not on the subject theme. If your unable to reply or add to this debate, please do not try to turn it around into something its not : Women V Men.

Regards
Liz
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Moderator David@stives on October 16, 2005, 02:03:11 pm: Quote from: busydaffodil on October 16, 2005, 01:52:34 pm
Matt, I totally agree with you.

Also , can we keep this as a debate on "window Cleaning licensing", instead of making it into a "gender war". Its not very constructive is it? Its not original (yes, most women have heard this stuff more than once), and its not on the subject theme. If your unable to reply or add to this debate, please do not try to turn it around into something its not : Women V Men.

Regards
Liz

wwooooooooooohhhhooooooo :-X
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Newwfpgatherer on October 16, 2005, 02:13:57 pm: This is not a "DEBATE", it is a "Topic" on a "Forum" ;)

The guy who started this, asked a "Question", and kindly asked for "comments"

Quote from: The Cleaner Service on October 16, 2005, 11:19:58 am
Quote from: david@ St-Ives on October 15, 2005, 09:50:41 pm
1984 George Orwell

"Big Sister is watching" :(

Apologies, in view of PC this should now read, "Big person is watching". Doh, can't say big!! Someone will start raving, "A person of no particular description is watching". That's got a striking tone to it!! ;D

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Quote from: alan_t on October 15, 2005, 10:23:01 pm
this thread is getting boring now.
moderators close. :P
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: williamx on October 16, 2005, 02:53:51 pm: To make sure that the licence works, and to stop the "cowboy" its needs to be enforced correctly.

Now the only way you can do this is to make it an offence to hire a window cleaner unless he is licenced, that way the customer is responsable for policing the licence.
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Sarah Sarill on October 16, 2005, 05:21:54 pm: Great idea williamX.

A lot of personal and political opinions have be posted on this thread and I was just wondering if the guys in Scotland feel the licencing/ID thing has been of value to their industry or not.

As they have been operating under it for a while now - what are the pitfalls, can rogue traders bypass the system and have they any ideas to improve it (such as yours WilliamX). There have been 11 votes so there are at least 11 opinions to state. Noticably there are 6 of you who dont have one - why is that ? Please be honest - you have read our thoughts here and would appreciate the reality and true picture of the situation as is.

I think us southeners have more than given our opinions as asked, and would like to see some thoughts form the people its affecting at present.

Great thread by the way !!!!

Regards,

Sarah
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: dai on October 17, 2005, 08:00:43 pm: A licence maybe but not another money making racket. When they have you over a barrel they don't let go easily. I payed £265 for my wifes visa when she came to this country, 2 years down the line they want another £335 to let me keep her here.
What happens if you don't pay up? They would split you up and send her back.
They have just introduced licenses for Kokkle pickers round here. there is no fee to pay for this. Why then should you have to come up with a tidy sum in order to carry out your trade. This could well be a human rights issue if challenged in the courts. Dai
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: Windae Cleaner on October 17, 2005, 10:43:20 pm: There you have it. A draw !!
I personnally think a few points came out loud and clear.

1. Most WCs would welcome a licence scheme if it ensured a standard ( Pub Lib Insurance/IR Reg)nationally. (Scotland or UK)

2. Have one national licence. Not one for every town or district you work in. Currently I work in two different towns in same district and 3 other districts. I am required therefore to have five licences? Do I ? mmm, not telling. Although I will say I am a Licenced window cleaner.

3. If we required to obtain a licence to carry out trade , the least we expect is that the authourities enforce this.
My main complaint is that they dont and never have. This allows the cowboys (: Definition _WCs who are not licenced ,not insured and not registered self employed ) to carry out work for funny money in our areas and generally not giving a good impression of our trade.
This is one of the main reasons why self employed WCs dont get a licence.
They think it`s a con and a waste of time and are willing to take risk of not being pulled up. It is therefore in the best interests of Local Authourities to have a fair and workable scheme in place that will attract WCs and that will make it easier for them to stop the cowboys ; not 100% but better than doing nothing I`m sure you will agree.

Finally,who is going to do something about this wholly unsatisfactory system?Not the licence itself, which I am in favour, but the Local Authourities who abuse it and restrict the work of legitimate WCs
The Nat Fed it seems have been unable too . In response to a complaint about the scheme earlier on this year in Window Talk, all they did was reprint a letter they sent to an MP years ago. Not good enough.
Maybe if we are to have a new organisation (PWCA ?)looking after our needs , they can take these comments on board. They will surely attract WCs here in Scotland if they can actually do something to help us.
Thank you for all who voted and aired an opinion on this topic
Paul
Title: Re: Window Cleaning Licence
Post by: AuRavelling79 on October 18, 2005, 11:00:02 am: Quote from: baldeagle on October 15, 2005, 01:43:35 pm
1. A friend of mine was knocked over by a young lad driving a car the other week, the said lad has no licence.

2. I know a person living about 100 yards from here, that has no TV licence - but his TV works fine without it.

3. I can obtain a firearm for about eighty quid if I want one - it will take me about two hours, and the seller isn't going to ask to see a licence.

4. Licences allow the authorities to control the licence holders, never those without!

5. Because of my medical condition, I limit my windowcleaning work to 6 days a month, so whilst the clever ones amongst you are interfering with my business, and organising my licence arrangements, perhaps you would be so kind as to let me know what discount I'll get, only being a part timer?

6.Oh yes, somone further up the thread mentioned "disabled badge" I think in the same sentence as "fiddlers".

7. I'd like to point out that I hold such a badge, I wonder what, exactly, was the point you were trying to make?

Perhaps those of you that you like to bring yet more licensing would care to stop now, whilst you are losing, or at least attempt to think first?

Baldeagle

Taking your points one by one baldeagle. (Which I have inserted in your post)

1. Your friend can approach the uninsured losses bureau who consider claims for the victims of uninsured motor accidents (I was carrying an eighty year old gent in a company car ten years ago and we were hit by an uninsured driver, I was OK but he suffered breathing difficulties and shock and spent the night in hospital - being an "old soldier" - both literally and by nature - he got over a grand for his pain and suffering from the bureau.)

2. I'd shop the guy with no TV license.

3. Scary but true. Prices have come down then? All such dealers should be punished severely. (Whatever that means.)

4. I agree.

5. Sorry to hear that - perhaps a discount based on your disability when you declare it (perhaps along with producing medical proof) to the licensing authority. If any part time window cleaner does it through choice well, I might only drive my motor bike once a week but I don't get discounted road tax.

6. Perhaps some people have fraudulently obtained or used a disabled badge - that would make them a fiddler in my view. My mother - who is over eighty and has had two seperate heart by-pass ops has angina and cannot walk very far has a blue badge - but if I were to put it in my car to go to the shops without her then I would also be a fiddler wouldn't I?

7. When you obtained your disabled badge, what did the producing authority say when you told them you were window cleaning part-time? Did they not assume you'd be climbing ladders?

My father in law was registered disabled because he could not walk without stumbling due to a neurological disease - yet he could stand still and drive without assistance. Wanting to keep active he would go with a builder friend digging holes and sawing wood from a stationary position and he could legitimately use his badge when in the vehicle.

Of course anyone who obtains a disabled badge or similar without declaring what they can actually do demeans the system for those that genuinely need it. IMO