Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Dave_Lee on March 25, 2011, 03:21:35 pm
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Well I become a State Pensioner in a couple of weeks time, and received a couple of Tax codes today, in the post.
It makes you question the worth of carrying on working after the age of 65.
For myself I have no choice but to carry on, I am fit and able to do so, and am not bothered about the actual work aspect. It's the Tax aspect that bothers me, really bothers me.
Upon reaching 65 years the taxation personal allowances for 2011 to 2012 are £9,940.
However if you carry on working and earned over £24,000 your personal allowance is reduced by over £2,000 to £7,922.
Your full time earnings are taxed along with all your income from pensions etc.
In my case My State pension, plus my Army pension and small private pension, all add up to an annual excess of income after deduction of personal allowance of £510.
This £510 will be added to my Self Employment income and ALL of the total will be taxable.
What this actually means is that regardless of what self employment income I achieve, the taxation on my three pensions will be £1,186.
The point I am trying to make is that because I choose to carry on working, and paying tax at the same time on my income, I am penalised by way of reduction of personal allowances to the sum of £2018. This means I will pay an additional £500 or so in tax, unless I purposely reduce my self employment income to below £24,000.
I mean, bloody hell haven't you paid enough into the system, when you've worked and paid taxes all your life, without them scrounging every penny they can out of you, for as long as they can.
Dave.
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That is a tough situation , though I cannot nderstand why you would want to earn more than 24k , plus about 10k in pensions , surely you dont have kids or a mortgage to pay for ?
I hope that once I reach 50 the earnings from my properties will pay a pension and i can pick and choose work , down to less than 20 hours a week . Then I can spend time with family and my hobbies .
I am not critiscizing , just curious why you want to earn so much?
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Bare with me it's been along week :) so may have misread your post Dave.
Lets say you are not going to work at all, will you still get taxed on your pensions?
If £24k is the top limit you can earn, does this include your pensions?
If so then I would deduct my pension value from the £24k and not more earn than the remainer, after all who wants to carry on full time into retirement? Keep fit keep agile, but not full time working :)
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I'd tell them you've retired.
Any money earned is cash in the hand, to put under my carpet.
I was always an advocate of paying my dues, and boy, I've paid them. Then you look at how our taxes are wasted, £7 Billion in overseas aid whilst people on the front-line are being given their P45's.
We have to send planes from Norfolk to bomb Libya, because we don't have a single aircraft carrier.
And not finally we got MP's saying they've had to sleep in their offices because they couldn't afford a Travelodge, so we the tax payer give them more money for expenses.
Honesty is this country is a bye word for taxing you until the pips squeak
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Retire and keep your stuff and just clean for your regular customers and get them to pay cash, this country is unbelievable.
Mark
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reduce your profit to under £24k, i would start having work related holidays to far away places, perhaps attend the connections convention in las Vegas, have you seen the rug cleaning plants in India?.
easy to cut down your profit with legitimate beneficial perks to yourself
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That is a tough situation , though I cannot nderstand why you would want to earn more than 24k , plus about 10k in pensions , surely you dont have kids or a mortgage to pay for ?
I hope that once I reach 50 the earnings from my properties will pay a pension and i can pick and choose work , down to less than 20 hours a week . Then I can spend time with family and my hobbies .
I am not critiscizing , just curious why you want to earn so much?
Well Jason, good luck to you, you have obviously got it more right than I have.
Like I said I have no choice but to carry on working, and want to get our mortgage paid off quicker than the 6 years still left on it.
There are also other private reasons for wanting to earn as much, but my point was not about why I want to do so, but the way you are penalised Tax wise if you do.
I am not a 'sitter' anyway and would have to do something, so may as well get paid at the same time.
Dave.
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Id think about the cash jobs dave too.
Lots out there doing it from car and motorbike mechanics and they get paid in cash.lots of other trades too do that mate
Bit like the beatles song when am 64 ::)
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I would contact AgeUK and see if they have a tax specialist you can speak to, i would guess there are loopholes that can be exploited.
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Dave
You mention class 4 in your original post, I assume this is Nat.Ins.
I thought one you receive your state pension you dont pay NI, or is class 4 something outside of that.
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My advice to everyone is to make sure you have a good pension set up for your future, either by way of investments or in property like Jason and a few others that I know.
The older you get the faster time seems to pass so don't put it off until tomorrow.
Don't get the wrong idea though, I am quite happy working, my dad still does and he's 88 this year, and not doing it for the money.
I do intend slowing down work wise in a couple of years, but certainly not easing up on my active pastimes, in fact I intend on getting out in those hills, more than ever.
The cash thing sounds a good idea, but the Tax man will be keeping an even keener eye on those things very soon.
Helen, yes the £24,000 does apparently include ALL income, including pension, so that's even worse than I thought.
That now means my self employment income has to be below £15,568 to get the additional personal allowance.
Dave.
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Dave
You mention class 4 in your original post, I assume this is Nat.Ins.
I thought one you receive your state pension you dont pay NI, or is class 4 something outside of that.
Yes Joe, sorry for the error, once 65 you are exempt from Class 2 & 4 contributions.
Dave.
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Hi Guys
There was talk before the Budget that N.I might be put on retirement income but I don't think their brave enough.
However when Tax and NI are merged together what happens?
It's a recent thing that people are working in retirement but will be the reality for many of us.
Keep fit!!
Doug
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Dave
If you still have a mortgage for 6 years plus other personal reasons you need to work, then its a tough story, and does seem unfair.
End of April 2012, just 13 months I will be in the same position as you.
My mortgage has finished, but we downsizing now to reduce outgoings. I want to continue carpet cleaning for one or two years after I am 65 and if the ceiling works out at £15.6k then thats fine, I only want enough work to bring in maybe £100 a week.
Just on another point but related I suppose.
I was talking to a guy on Wednesday. He is from Turkey and his wife from Germany.
He said he wants to go back to Turkey because they fed up paying taxes over here just to see scroungers who dont want to work getting the benefits hes paying for.
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Hi
How about charging twice as much and doing a third of the work?
Dave
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Thanks think I am with you now :)
1)So if you don't work they don't tax your pensions.
2)If you do work and keep the income and pension under the £24k the tax allowance will be £9940
3)If you do work and the income and pension goes over the £24k the tax allowance will be £7922
Think I would opt for (2) for a couple, maybe 3 years on a part time basis ;) and then go for (1) :) (hopefully this would pay your mortage off and relieve you of that)
but I agree it is wrong for any pension entitlement to be taxed, just because you decide you are fit enough to carry on and work into your more mature years.
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I am not worrying about a pension because by the time i get there i dont think state pensions will exist. I am investing in property and land things to an extent i can control. I am reluctant to pay into a private pension which to an extent is out of my control. So basically i am trying to build my mini empire up and my portfolio of property which will see me through my retirement and hopefully by 55 i will be able to stop working and play golf everyday in the sun
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Exactly Richard , when you pay into a pension company , they invest your money into commercial property and shares anyway , so I take the attitude that I may as well do it myself. Next year I am getting it all put into a SIPP which means it is all more tax efficient , and my personal returns will be better.
Having said that I do not think that i wil ever fully retire , our line of work makes it simple to be part time.
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Whilst unfair, that is the nature of "marginal rates of tax".
No different really to when you bump up against the VAT threshold. If you don't add VAT to every job because you're afraid you may lose jobs then your disposable income reduces considerably until such time as your total T/o increases considerably.
It's also the same with the old-age allowance for pensioners with higher income from pernsions. Once their income hits a certain level then the personal allownance drops by £1 for every £2 income above that threshold. (50% marginal rate.)
And probably the most extreme example....
The Duke of Westminster was once accosted in the late 70's by an obviously jealous person who was moaning to him that it was all very well for the Duke to be going out for a £20 per head meal which most people could never truly afford. As the Duke pointed out his marginal rate of tax was that he had to earn £1000 to pay for that £20 meal as his marginal rate was 98%.
Was that fair?
Rog
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Again a variety of comments.
I guess my wife and myself are just too honest, and it simply doesn't seem to pay, to be so.
My wife had to take early retirement due to medical conditions a few years ago. She should have finished years earlier but we needed her income, so she struggled on until she started having Epileptic seizures at work. This led to being off for almost a year but eventually went back, then began to have difficulty with damage from a broken wrist. Over the next year gradually compensating for the weak wrist, led her to finally seeking a doctors appointment. She never went back to work after that.
Her Statuary sick pay had long run out and she was on Incapacity Benefit for a short time. She was then called in for a check up by the Benefits people. I knew before she went that they would take her off it, because although she was still struggling she wouldn't in-dignify herself by spinning them a sob story and exaggerating things. She was quite upset when she received the latter telling her that she hadn't scored enough points for Benefit. They scored her zero for her Epilepsy, because she wasn't falling over every day, and that made the difference. They absolutely have no idea. However she refused to appeal the decision and we decided to just think 'Stuff them', rather than do any pathetic pleading.
I know guys are talking about cash jobs and money in the biscuit tin, but I have never done that, I do declare everything, even jobs done for friends. Some may think I am crazy doing so, but I had an in depth Tax investigation after I had only been in business for two years.
Everything was above board apart from a single invoice for a Grey carpet, which the Tax lady waived at me and asked me to explain its presence in my books as it couldn't be accounted for. I owned up that I must have included it in mistake, as that was a carpet I purchased for my own use.
I received two penalties as a result, something I don't wish to repeat, and anyway employees can't fiddle their tax so why should self employed, everyone has to pay tax on income. I just don't see why they should reduce personal allowances, if you carry on working past 65, especially when the threshold is so low.
As already mentioned working beyond retirement is becoming a norm for a lot of people and I think this will drastically increase, either that and/or some will join the ever increasing number of people who have to take Equity Release from their property in order to supplement their pensions.
Dave.
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Have you paid a Tax Consultant
Could be a good idea
I would suggest form a limited company pay yourself a limited amount and accumulate the surplus in a Company Cash Pile
Then when you are ready to hang up your boots liquidate the company.
And pay yourself a fantastic termination package
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Sounds tough Dave , how about selling your business as a going concern , if you earn ove 24k it will be worth a tidy sum , at least 3 years earnings.
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Dave
I have not looked into this option myself yet, but there is provision to delay your state pension, but you get an increase when you do draw - have you looked into that. You could possibly do the same with your private pension.
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Jason,
I have always thought the valuation for our kind of business less equipment and van, was equal to 6 months profit, not 3 years as you say?
Joe,
I have been drawing my private for some months now and is that small it barely counts. As for deferring State Pension.
If you deffer claiming for say 3 years, then take take an enhanced pension. It will take almost another ten years of drawing that higher pension to make up for the 3 years that you were not receiving any.
Another way of deferring taking it, is rather than having an eventual enhanced pension you can take the extra as a lump sum. Of course they are not daft and make it more attractive you longer you defer it. If I deferred by this method for just one year the lump sum at at the end of that year would be £186 more than I would have drawn if I had not differed it.
If I differed it for 5 years, the lump sum would be £5,006 more than I would have drawn if I had not differed it.
Going of that it is better to take a lump sum rather than an enhanced pension.
Of course at the end of the day you are still taxed on it all, and if you die within the differed period, you lose out on all of it.
Dave.
Dave.
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I sold my Chem dry in 2001 for 59k , it had a turnover of 125k and a net profit of 29k the previous year, the asset value was very low , less than 10k worth of kit .
Scary reading that is ,,formal pensions look like a bad deal , I did not know the bit about dying meaning that you lose whatever is left in your fund.
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If you cant get a big lump some for selling the business, why not train up a couple of wipa-snappers (probably spelt wrong) and let them do the graft while you market the business further (increasing turnover) anwser the phone, fill the diary, general customer service roll and make sure everything runs smoothly. Maybe help the guys out if they have a tough stain or something.
Would that not be an option?
Tony
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If you cant get a big lump some for selling the business, why not train up a couple of wipa-snappers (probably spelt wrong) and let them do the graft while you market the business further (increasing turnover) anwser the phone, fill the diary, general customer service roll and make sure everything runs smoothly. Maybe help the guys out if they have a tough stain or something.
Would that not be an option?
Tony
I started up 31 years ago with that idea, however I soon realised that to provide a top quality job in the domstic market, you had to do it yourself. I have seen several fail quickly once changing to what you suggest.
The graft aspect does not bother me in the slightest, I am known as unusual for age at our running club and although not as fit as I was in general as 3 years ago, I still shift a bit when working with no ill effects.
Last September, I set one of the fastest ever times for the Coast to Coast walk from St. Bees to Robin Hoods Bay, carrying all my own gear with a full camping pack and almost certainly (although hard to verify) a record for an over 60 year year old, and possibly over 50 year olds. All walking with no running, I averaged over 42 miles per day and finished in 4 days 15hrs 48min, for the 190 miles. The average crossing with camping gear is 15 days.
I reckon physically wise I could carry on at the same level for another 5 years if i wanted before maybe slowing down (all things being equal).
Dave.
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I am not trying to be a scrounger, but since you mortgage still has 6 years to go, it has been missold. See a financial advisor and am 100% sure you wont have to pay a penny more, now you are a pensioner. I know people who its happened to, the did not have to pay last 10 years.
idealrob
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There is a carpet cleaner on here who sometimes posts , he told me 3 months ago that he has been diagnosed with cancer aged 49 . That was a wake up call to me . Life is too short to be working at full tilt, I have had problems with debtors the past couple of years that have left me short
Once I have paid a few people off I will be cutting back and spending more time with family and friends and my hobbies. Life is just too short, surely there must be a way to wind down at 65.
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we work in an industry that can pay £400 for a days work, I ( foolishly) believe this will stop me ever being on poverty's door. my wife has worked since leaving school as a nurse and has paid into a pension since day one, she will still not get a better pension than me working 2 days a month.
the biggest indicator we have to how long we live and how we will physically be is to look at our genetics, my father is 83 and is fit and mentally sound. he still rides his bike every where. my grandfather was the same, I believe if it was not for a bad fall he would have lived alot longer than the 88yrs he did.
I have no pension or any provisions for my old age, I will work until i die.
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Why Mick ? My birth mother retired last October when she turned 60 , she died on Jan 2nd this year.
My step mother retired 5 years ago , aged 55 , sold her bungalow in Loughborough and has built a beautiful house on the Silver coast in Portugal , lives a lavish life style on a small pension , comes to England every couple of months and is loving life .
My wife is a nurse too , works really hard, for a pittance , and a 50% final salary pension.
Leisure and family have to take priority surely?
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My dad is self employed and has been paying into an index linked pension for 20 years. When he retires, he would have been paying around £360 a month into it and would then only receive £180 a month upon retirement. His new financial advisor advised him to stop paying into it, cash it in and get rid of his various debts that he had running (not much but they add up).
My point is that before my dad took on this new advisor, he would have had no clue about the very small return on his pension and would have been devastated to reach retirememnt with a crap pension. Food for thought. Mike is right - a couple of days cleaning carpets can make a huge difference.
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I get you now Mick , yes carrying on part time is a good idea , just not at full tilt.
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jason....but that my point, family& leisure can take priority, I can work part time still earn a good living.
if i am 70 and working max 2 days a week or perhaps working 4 days a week during the summer/xmas then the 4 winter months in Gambia, the money we make gives us lots of options
but in some ways i have no choice :-\
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You’re not taking advantage of tax relief if you’re not putting money away into a pension. Whatever you put into your pension before your tax year ends, up to a certain figure, comes directly off your profit and your taxed on the remainder.
YOU GET 100% TAX RELIEF ON YOU PENSION CONTRIBUTIONS UPTO A CERTAIN AMOUNT.
IF YOUR NOT INVESTING HEAVILY IN YOUR BUSINESS, SHOVE AS MUCH AS YOU CAN INTO YOUR PENSION, FAIL THIS AND YOU MIGHT AS WELL GIFT WRAP YOUR MONEY TO 'SILVER SPOON BOY' CAMMERON.
Life is a very cruel journey of growth, progression and promise to decline, demise, deterioration and death. You need more security for your demise than you do in your progression .
Matt
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well sad man
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Full tilt? I don't feel like Ive worked at full tilt for some time, I could always be busier than I am.
My outside interests are Cycling, Fell and Long Distance Walking, Ultra distance Lightweight Backpacking, and I'm just getting back into road and Fell running. Just did 11 miles over country this morning.
If I want time off I take it, no hesitation, I'm taking a week and a bit off in a couple of weeks to attempt a fast Coast to Coast again, only this time East to West. I will do several similar things this year as well a few long weekends and a holiday with my wife. Hoping for a long haul month long trip early next year, so full tilt, definitely not.
I am sure many guys in their 30s and 40s have in their mind that by the time they are 65 they will creaking old men. I once couldn't imagine to be still doing carpet cleaning after the age of 45, however if you look after yourselves there is no reason why you can't go on for as long as you want to.
When I was serving my apprenticeship with ICI back in the 60s, the Fitters that managed to stay alive to reach retirement, were indeed crinkley, hunched up old men. Times have changed and there is no reason why this should be the case anymore, although I must admit I still come across guys in their 40s and 50s who are knackered, because they have become 'Comfortable' far too early in life.
Going out for a regular walk or jog, as being advised to do, following a heart attack, is leaving it a bit late imo.
Dave.
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Well good luck then Dave. Looks like your minds made up :)
Cheers
Tony
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Lump sums aren't taxable and you get your full
allowance, £6000 ish, on your monthly pension.
Downside is you pay 20% tax and 8% NI on
everything you earn so you got to be a bit canny.
John
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Lump sums aren't taxable and you get your full
allowance, £6000 ish, on your monthly pension.
Downside is you pay 20% tax and 8% NI on
everything you earn so you got to be a bit canny.
John
John,
The lump sums I mentioned are State Pension lump sums from deferring your pension. I think you are getting confused with private pension lump sums, which as you say are not taxable on 25% of the fund.
See- http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/pensioners/pension-later.htm
Dave.
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dave sell everything house business the lot set up a bank account outside the eu transfer the funds and then live life in the sun change your name to Lee Dave job sorted LOL ;D
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Even better idea! get into canoeing!! ;) ;) Remember not to pose for any estate agents photos tho.... ;D
Tony
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I am not trying to be a scrounger, but since you mortgage still has 6 years to go, it has been missold. See a financial advisor and am 100% sure you wont have to pay a penny more, now you are a pensioner. I know people who its happened to, the did not have to pay last 10 years.
idealrob
explain more please?
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I am not trying to be a scrounger, but since you mortgage still has 6 years to go, it has been missold. See a financial advisor and am 100% sure you wont have to pay a penny more, now you are a pensioner. I know people who its happened to, the did not have to pay last 10 years.
idealrob
explain more please?
If you look on money saving expert . com you will see on the forum that lots of people were sold mortgages that ended after retirement age , this can be seen as mis selling , because one cannot be expected to pay a mortgage whilst not working .
The mortgage term should have been set to end at retirement age Dave probably has a god case too. they judge these cases on the regulations now , not at the time of sale my
financial adviser insurance salesman is getting pulled on cases he sold 5 years ago.
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I am not trying to be a scrounger, but since you mortgage still has 6 years to go, it has been missold. See a financial advisor and am 100% sure you wont have to pay a penny more, now you are a pensioner. I know people who its happened to, the did not have to pay last 10 years.
idealrob
explain more please?
If you look on money saving expert . com you will see on the forum that lots of people were sold mortgages that ended after retirement age , this can be seen as mis selling , because one cannot be expected to pay a mortgage whilst not working .
The mortgage term should have been set to end at retirement age Dave probably has a god case too. they judge these cases on the regulations now , not at the time of sale my
financial adviser insurance salesman is getting pulled on cases he sold 5 years ago.
Can you give the link please? I am intrigued as to how anyone could sign such an important agreement and not realise that the mortgage would go into retirement ::)
The written mortgage offer itself which you get now, will state all the terms,
If you don't agree then you have the 7 day cooling off period to say so :)
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http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3031076&highlight=mortgage+misselling
The issue is mis selling , not mis buying , the burden is in the seller /adviser to ensure the buyer has the correct product for their circumstances , the FSA take the view that the experts should push the best thing for the customer. In reality when I , and probably most other people want a mortgage they only consider the monthly payment and what the house is like . I took out a mortgage 6 years ago which will end when I am 59 . At the time I did not care about the end date .
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Also one of the biggest parts of the mis-selling, was where the advisor would tell you that your endowment part would have enough in after 15 years to pay off the mortgage, so not to worry about the last 10 years as you would be mortgage free.
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Some assumptions there in the last few posts.
I was well aware that my mortgage would last for the term that it does. Don't assume that everyones mortgage ends by retirement age because it doesn't. Everyone's circumstances are different and thinking that is being narrow minded imo.
Making a claim for mis sold loans, payment protection policies etc can only be actionable if taken out during the last ten years, since when they have been regulated.
Still don't think it's fair not to get the full personal allowances if carrying on working and earning.
However Tax wise, it works out that I will be paying roughly the same amount as I do now, for the same self employed income plus the amount I will receive in my pensions.
This is because on reaching the age of 65, you are no longer liable for class 2 & 4 National Insurance contributions.
Class 2 has just gone up to £2.50 per week, and class 4 (paid on profits) has gone up from 8% to 9% based on profits
between £7,225 and £42,475, plus 2% on profits above that.
Dave.
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http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3031076&highlight=mortgage+misselling
The issue is mis selling , not mis buying , the burden is in the seller /adviser to ensure the buyer has the correct product for their circumstances , the FSA take the view that the experts should push the best thing for the customer. In reality when I , and probably most other people want a mortgage they only consider the monthly payment and what the house is like . I took out a mortgage 6 years ago which will end when I am 59 . At the time I did not care about the end date .
Thanks,
This is about an interest only mortgage, which in my opinion should not be touched with a barge pole for normal house purchase and is more suited to under 40's than older people. :)
Quite aware that this is about mis selling, but on such a big commitment as having a mortgage, it is down to the purchaser to ask questions and fully understand the T & C's as much as the seller should advise on them. IMO if anyone signs something they didn't fully understand, then more fool them and they are partly to blame. You didn't worry about the end date when you took yours as sub consciously you knew it would end before retirement :)
Like carpet cleaning, anyone buying a mortgage on price alone, may not get such a good deal ;D
Dave, If you meant me, sorry I didn't make assumptions as your financial business is your own business and I was talking in generals and not specifics. I am sure that with what you and yours have been through that you check everytjing out to the last detail. :) I hope that in the next couple of years that fortune really favours you and you can pay off the mortage more quickly than you hoped to and YES I agree it is unfair not to get full personal allowances and more when you get to be a wrinkly ;D ;D ;D
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Sorry if I offended Dave , I think this is a lesson to us younger ones to make provision and plan for retirement , and to beware the tax man !
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http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=3031076&highlight=mortgage+misselling
Dave, If you meant me, sorry I didn't make assumptions as your financial business is your own business and I was talking in generals and not specifics. I am sure that with what you and yours have been through that you check everytjing out to the last detail. :) I hope that in the next couple of years that fortune really favours you and you can pay off the mortage more quickly than you hoped to and YES I agree it is unfair not to get full personal allowances and more when you get to be a wrinkly ;D ;D ;D
Sorry Helen I misunderstood you and thought you were referring to the mortgage I took out.
Jason, no offence taken at all, it is a discussion at the end of the day and opinions differ.
It's amazing though how a post starts with a statement or question and ends up somewhere else totally.
Dave.
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Just finished with our Mobility Business and have seen first hand pensions and property used to keep you in care if you become ill,this can be at any age and these costs can be £400-£500 per week or more, So spend it now.
Regards Rob
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Hi Robert
Why have you finished with the mobility business?
Long time no speak.
Rog
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Hi Roger,had to scale down, been fighting Cancer for last six months,in remission at moment and working part time. Both Sons help now.
Regards Rob
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Sorry Helen I misunderstood you and thought you were referring to the mortgage I took out.
jeez no, that would not be my place too :) even if you had put details on here, which you hadn't.
The post that mentioned the mis selling and compo etc set me off.
The following is not pointed at anyone in particular.
We live in a compo and blame culture and it hacks me off when on things such as big and inportant as a mortgage going wrong is "someone" elses fault.
Yes there may be some dodgy financial guys around still, but in my opinion the onus is on the person applying for it. I used to be a mortgage advisor and I could see when things weren't quite right, so I would explain, explain and explain again to clients. I would point out the pitfalls of what they wanted and would advise them against certain things. If they really wanted to go ahead with their way of doing it, I would either butt out or get them to sign a disclaimer which set out the pitfalls as explained etc etc.
Any way as I said hope you get yours paid off earlier than you expect then you can tone down the work and enjoy your "wrinkly"years ;D
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Rob
Sorry to hear that. you and me could fill a medical encyclopedia between us!!
Glad to hear your in remission. Together we'll beat the world.
Chin up.
Rog
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]
We live in a compo and blame culture and it hacks me off when on things such as big and inportant as a mortgage going wrong is "someone" elses fault.
Yes there may be some dodgy financial guys around still, but in my opinion the onus is on the person applying for it. I used to be a mortgage advisor and I could see when things weren't quite right, so I would explain, explain and explain again to clients. I would point out the pitfalls of what they wanted and would advise them against certain things. If they really wanted to go ahead with their way of doing it, I would either butt out or get them to sign a disclaimer which set out the pitfalls as explained etc etc.
Helen
You are so right. I had the same thing when I worked in the financial industry. All some customers were interested in was getting the property they had set their heart on and would do anything to fit the lender's criteria. They'd take an over-long length of loan, explain that their contribution was from their own resources when at best it was borrowed from family and at worst had been advanced off a credit card or just plain lied. And if you didn't lend them the money they would then just try the next lender down the street. But of course it was never "their" fault when it all came crashing down round their ears.
Rog
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Sorry Helen I misunderstood you and thought you were referring to the mortgage I took out.
jeez no, that would not be my place too :) even if you had put details on here, which you hadn't.
The post that mentioned the mis selling and compo etc set me off.
The following is not pointed at anyone in particular.
We live in a compo and blame culture and it hacks me off when on things such as big and inportant as a mortgage going wrong is "someone" elses fault.
Yes there may be some dodgy financial guys around still, but in my opinion the onus is on the person applying for it. I used to be a mortgage advisor and I could see when things weren't quite right, so I would explain, explain and explain again to clients. I would point out the pitfalls of what they wanted and would advise them against certain things. If they really wanted to go ahead with their way of doing it, I would either butt out or get them to sign a disclaimer which set out the pitfalls as explained etc etc.
Any way as I said hope you get yours paid off earlier than you expect then you can tone down the work and enjoy your "wrinkly"years ;D
I agree , the onus should be on the borrower , but it is not , most of the responsibility for the right product being chosen is now with the adviser , which of course is wrong.
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The way the markets change and things beyond anyones real control, can have a big effect on life and living.
I was 40 when we took out the mortgage on our home, we could afford the repayments at the time although higher than the rent we had been paying, that was in 1986. After a couple/few years interests rates started to rise (the last time rates went through such a high change) and seemingly in no time our payments had almost doubled, the market collapsed and loads of people in negative equity, we had no choice but to change our mortgage to interest only. The thinking was that when interest rates go down and business picks up we would change back.
However simple things like that don't always work out. Time flies by until circumstances lead to a remortgage which gets us back onto repayment, but with a shorter timescale and hence the six years still to go.
Oh, happy days, or something like that.
Dave.