Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: poleman on March 02, 2011, 11:37:44 pm
-
New year and more deaths in our industry :(
I have put this photo up in the hope that it will make you stop and think about your safe working practise!!
This is the death scene of a fellow window cleaner (some years back)
PLEASE BE ADVICED ITS GRAPHIC VIEWING
-
It is a real shame to see such accidents are still happening when there are safer methods out there for reaching heights safely.
-
Accidents will never be completely eliminated, whatever system we use. We could fall off our ladders or someone could trip over a hose. Any accident is due to human error when all is said and done.
I am trad, and yes, I have had some ladder slips in the past (every one my fault). I now take more time to position the ladders correctly, and risk assess constantly.
John.
-
i saw a window cleaner yesterday smoking and cleaning a window one handed!no hands on the ladder at times! ::)
we know how dangerous they can be.most of us who have been trad years have had a few near misses or falls.i was lucky the first 2 times i fell off.lucky not to shatter my heels both times!! :( :(.
i still use ladders a few times a week.not every day though.im thinking of binning a few of these jobs simply because im getting too lazy and find it a chore to get the ladders of the van!!!!
some guys i see on main roads cleaning above shops are the ones where i think "thats dodgy!"but half the guys out there cleaning windows dont give a hoot about spending money on wfp.they are either too set in their ways and are tight as scrooge! ;) ;D ;Dor they simply dont earn enough money to invest in safer equipment.
also there are still a lot of window cleaners that are still very sceptical about wfp.more fool them!
it takes some of these guys all their time to buy a decent ladder!usually waiting until theres 2 rungs missing before buying a new one!! ;D ;D ;D
dazmond
-
Accidents will never be completely eliminated, whatever system we use. We could fall off our ladders or someone could trip over a hose. Any accident is due to human error when all is said and done.
I am trad, and yes, I have had some ladder slips in the past (every one my fault). I now take more time to position the ladders correctly, and risk assess constantly.
John.
Yes but there is a higher fatality rate with ladders than with WFP.... There is nothing wrong with looking at improving the safety of where you work... I remember when cars did not have to have seat belts in the back .... I would love some smart person to say well even if you put seat belts in the back you will not stop accidents .... And that is true but the death rates went down when seat bets are introduced......
I would just like to say I still use ladders but would encourage all window cleaners that use ladders all the time to think about WFP....
You said that accidents are a result of mistakes with the equipment ... So you should think about WFP or do trad windows think they will never make a mistake ::) ( we both do )
Adders
-
WANRING!! Anyone who can't spell will be condemned to a life of window cleaning!! LOL
-
I agree with Johnny B. I'm a trad and I'm always careful when positioning my ladders. But guys all the wfp pics Ive seen on here I only seen one with a warning sign about there hose... Common sence lads
-
My god.
-
So the ladder is still upright, but the poor chap died, how was this the fault of the ladder? You would assume it was down to user error
If you crash your car because you are not paying attention because you are on the phone or something else that has taken your attention off the road, and you crash and die, is it the cars fault? should cars be banned? No, its user error.
-
wasnt this one of ocs staff,
-
How about another theory..........he COULD have been shot! That's not the ladder or windies fault!
-
people keep on posting this crap about ladders but alot of trade jobs have there risks even with proper h&s checks done,go find the stats on how many window cleaners die each year compared to other trades i bet its low in comparison,
every job iv had before has had it risks of deaf,for instant i worked a JCB (digger giant) and it has all the h&s crap in place but me and other work mates working under diggers when some numpty jumps in a drives off in it nearly squashing us,if us ladder monkeys want risk our lives going up ladders its our stupid fault,its nearly always the users fault not the equipment :P
-
I cleaned windows 14 years ago, then it was an unwritten rule between Window Cleaners not to talk about what COULD happen. We all understood the risks associated with the job we were doing and all tried our very best to avoid the worst happening.
Those risks still remain in the job for those who choose to still clean windows in the traditional way! Why do we talk about what could happen now?
For those who choose to clean windows using a new method will encouter different risks associated with the job.
Phil
-
I would say a large number of "new" wfp window cleaners are more at risk using a ladder occasionally as they dont have the experience or confidence to use a ladder properly.
-
people keep on posting this crap about ladders but alot of trade jobs have there risks even with proper h&s checks done,go find the stats on how many window cleaners die each year compared to other trades i bet its low in comparison,
every job iv had before has had it risks of deaf,for instant i worked a JCB (digger giant) and it has all the h&s crap in place but me and other work mates working under diggers when some numpty jumps in a drives off in it nearly squashing us,if us ladder monkeys want risk our lives going up ladders its our stupid fault,its nearly always the users fault not the equipment :P
Most fatalities and serious injuries that are a cause of LADDER falls are either in the window cleaning or construction trades!
It's all about eliminating the risks! yes you could fall over a hose and bump your head on the pavement and die from a blood clot, but that its EXTREMELY unlikely, on the other hand falling from ladders whilst working on first floor windows WILL increase the chances of serious injury if not death!!!!!
How many of you ladder uses actually have the ladders serviced?
How many of you use scaff tags on their ladders?
How many of you have actually had adequate training?
How many of you actually use the correct ladders for the job in hand?
Matt
-
there are risks even when ladders are banned from use. I personally know 2 lads who have been killed in cherry pickers (seperate incidents) and quite a few more who have injured themselves.
-
to die from wfp'ing takes some doing
-
How many of you ladder uses actually have the ladders serviced?
How many of you use scaff tags on their ladders?
How many of you have actually had adequate training?
How many of you actually use the correct ladders for the job in hand?
Matt
Matt,
1) I think an intelligent trad WC'er would only use a ladder 'fit for purpose'. I consider myself reasonably intelligent but still wouldn't have a clue where to take a ladder for a service! I guess I take it to a guy who holds a bit of paper which confirms to me he is trained to check my rungs are not loose and I have rubber feet on the bottom.
2) Scaff tags, are these not applicable to the scaffolding industry?
3) I'm sure most WC'ers are aware of the 4-1 rule I guess the 'centering your weight' and '3 points of contact' & various 'safety' devices which are available, are soon learned.
4) I think most WC'ers use a ladder which gets them up to the window which requires cleaning.
Why do the 'converted' WFP users find it necessary to fill this forum with 'scare' tactics in an effort to convert those who CHOOSE to clean windows the way they do?
Beats me!
-
How many of you ladder uses actually have the ladders serviced?
How many of you use scaff tags on their ladders?
How many of you have actually had adequate training?
How many of you actually use the correct ladders for the job in hand?
Matt
Matt,
1) I think an intelligent trad WC'er would only use a ladder 'fit for purpose'. I consider myself reasonably intelligent but still wouldn't have a clue where to take a ladder for a service! I guess I take it to a guy who holds a bit of paper which confirms to me he is trained to check my rungs are not loose and I have rubber feet on the bottom.
2) Scaff tags, are these not applicable to the scaffolding industry?
3) I'm sure most WC'ers are aware of the 4-1 rule I guess the 'centering your weight' and '3 points of contact' & various 'safety' devices which are available, are soon learned.
4) I think most WC'ers use a ladder which gets them up to the window which requires cleaning.
Why do the 'converted' WFP users find it necessary to fill this forum with 'scare' tactics in an effort to convert those who CHOOSE to clean windows the way they do?
Beats me!
because they no custys prefer the trad method and are scared that trad guys will take there work ;D
o no another trad vs wfp thread :o
-
Seriously, what is the point of posting this photo?
What does it even show?
It is in bad taste and for what reason?
To get an opinion across.................
Using ladders involves a number of risks, assessing and understanding these risks alongside using correctly eliminates the risk of user error almost entirely.
Crossing the road is dangerous, riding a motorbike is dangerous, scuba diving is dangerous, shouting 'come on West Brom' in Wolverhampton is dangerous / suicidal ::)
-
Seriously, what is the point of posting this photo?
What does it even show?
It is in bad taste and for what reason?
To get an opinion across.................
Using ladders involves a number of risks, assessing and understanding these risks alongside using correctly eliminates the risk of user error almost entirely.
Crossing the road is dangerous, riding a motorbike is dangerous, scuba diving is dangerous, shouting 'come on West Brom' in Wolverhampton is dangerous / suicidal ::)
You're spot on, using ladders does involve a risk. However, cleaning them windows in the photograph can be done risk free. I guess thats the point he's making......why take the risk? I don't know for sure i'm just reading it like you.
-
why risk your life when there are safe ways now... :-\
-
wasnt this one of ocs staff,
Yes your right George, it was a contract they was doing in Hull for a high street bank! the chap had been on the floor for some time (Early start) before a passer by phoned for a ambulance!
-
wasnt this one of ocs staff,
Yes your right George, it was a contract they was doing in Hull for a high street bank! the chap had been on the floor for some time (Early start) before a passer by phoned for a ambulance!
always carry a mobile ;)
I think your find he was unconscious and bleeding to dealth and was fighting for his live!
-
we used to do an ocs site and knew the manageress realy well, we were cancelled as they said they were going to do them, i found it funny when she told me that someone from head office came to see her and he was realy exicted about wfp and explained for about half an hour the benefits of wfp when eventually she said to him thats the way we had been doing for about 2 years and wondered when ocs were going to catch up he was realy surprised and didnt know it had been out for so long, my wife used to work there and said the look on his face was priceless. ;D ;D
-
largest ladders I use are class 1 5.5 triples, thats 48 foot extended.
even though all my ladders get a pre use and monthly check ( all tagged) when I'm up those my heart is in my mouth, even when they are top secured and I'm in a full harness with twin lanyards every movement is look, think, move !
and no I'm not cleaning windows at that height...
I have seen a lot of local Windy's using class 3 ladders, OK there light but not made for day to day use. I have seen them with sagging or bent rungs, foot rubbers missing and even bent or deformed stiles.
and they wonder why they have accidents!
OK say it might cost you a couple of hundred quid to replace some ladders but hey it costs more to bury you. ladders are at there safest when looked after, treated right and used right.
-
GOOD GRIEF!!!...WFP'ers give it a rest with the ladder thing. We all know you do not like using ladders,some of us prefer it, for all different reasons, JUST GET OVER IT!!!
MOAN MOAN MOAN SCARE TACTICS SCARE TACTICS MOAN MOAN.....IF WE WANT TO DO TRAD WE WILL ...NOW SHUT-UP.............................................................pleeeeeeze....sigh!!!!
-
anyone who does not take these precautions in the industry are fools mate they open themselves to injury
-
Seriously, what is the point of posting this photo?
What does it even show?
It is in bad taste and for what reason?
To get an opinion across.................
Using ladders involves a number of risks, assessing and understanding these risks alongside using correctly eliminates the risk of user error almost entirely.
Crossing the road is dangerous, riding a motorbike is dangerous, scuba diving is dangerous, shouting 'come on West Brom' in Wolverhampton is dangerous / suicidal ::)
Thats the last time i go scuba diving with my ladders, not worth the risk.
-
This poor chap died before WFP was widely available.
Had this been within the last few years then no major company could legally put an employee at such risk, when avoidance was possible.
& it's the law that ladder use should be avoided where an alternative is available & rightly so.
A mate of mine almost died when he fell 9ft off a ladder onto his head & now he has part of his skull missing as well as multiple bone injuries, depression & loss of memory. The fall was not his fault & caused by another worker.
Not worth the risk
-
This poor chap died before WFP was widely available.
Had this been within the last few years then no major company could legally put an employee at such risk, when avoidance was possible.
& it's the law that ladder use should be avoided where an alternative is available & rightly so.
A mate of mine almost died when he fell 9ft off a ladder onto his head & now he has part of his skull missing as well as multiple bone injuries, depression & loss of memory.
Not worth the risk
If i remember rightly we had bought our 1st wfps way before this happened, if a small company could buy one then im sure the bigger companies could, they just didnt, it wasnt as wide spread as now but you would thin big companies would be at forefront of new technology,
-
I know i'm a bit of an anorak, but when people are using or working off ladders on TV, they always get the angle wrong, overstretch, don't hold the rungs etc etc etc & tv always shows there use in a casual manner.
When you think of the foot contact of a ladder, it's like standing on your tip toes with the option of sky diving.
Personally i have fallen twice due to my own stupidity without major injurie (only through luck)
I am now ladder trained, more safety aware & WFP & use ladders only where necessary & safe.