Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: SPE on December 23, 2010, 09:08:13 am
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Hi guys, not window cleaning I know, but thought someone on here may have the answer for me.
I have a peugeot expert and lately with cold mornings it wont start, battery runs flat trying to turn it over. Battery's only a year old. If I take it off and bench charge it for an hour it starts first go.
Question, is it the battery ? or posssibly the glow plugs ? the coil light does go out as quick as it always has. When the temp does'nt fall below freezing at night I dont seem to have a problem. Any advice please would be great , thanks
and Happy xmas to you all
Simon
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Battery i'd say, if it was the glowplugs you'd have trouble even if your battery was new! would also change the glowplugs for good measure though, unless they're relatively new.
Steve
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y transit connect the same this year and never let me down before, i can only assume its as ped off as me with this weather.
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id go with battery aswell,iv had same before where its ok if not to cold but flat on really cold days,cant you take it back or has guarrentee run out,
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thanks for replies, as luck would have it there is a quick fit at bottom of my road, saw me refitting battery and offered to test it (must be good willed xmas spirit ).
70 % efficiency printed out for me so theres my problem, taking it back to shop later sure it has a 2yr guarantee,
Thanks again
Simon
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hi i beleive its the heater plugs, it happended to the movano, if it goes under zero or the minus 2 say, it will have great difficulty in starting..does it start later in the day, when its a little warmer.
new glow plugs will combat this as they are stronger for a few months...
advice from garage on mine
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When i was doing my homework on this type of van the cold start problems were nearly always remedied by putting in a new starter motor(thats after all the glow plug/battery messing).This seemed common on vans around the 04/54 plate.It seemed starter inefficiency was the root of the problem for various reasons and the battery was a symptom rather than the cause.
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i got a citroen dispatch and done my glow plugs 4 months ago, couldnt get it started a few weeks ago, jumped it off a other car, thought it was battery turned out glow plugs knackered, get ur plugs replaced as well, and check connections on started motor incase they have come lose
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What you need to do disconnect your air intake pipe before your MAF air flow meter and spray some cold start into the intake as you crank it over.
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Hi
I would suspect glowplugs.
But the first 'port of call' is to ensure that the earth cable from the battery to the engine is ok engine side. The cable is usually secured to the alloy gearbox housing. The combination of ali alloy. steel studs and high current can cause corrosion at this point. Unbolt it, clean it up with water paper/sanding paper and put it together again with a bit of copper grease.
Spruce
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same happend to me 4 weeks ago i have a citrroen dispatch
is your engine turning over slower than normal if so its the starter motor
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Change the glow plugs if you ever need to start using cold start, ok for short term, but long term no no. Defiantly the battery mate, easy start will allow your engine to crank over faster but if your batterys tip top then you should be ok.
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Hi
I agree with Steveo22. Stay away from cold start. It is strange how engine quickly become addicted to that stuff and that soon becomes the only way of starting them.
What I found interesting is the number of electrical parts that are replaced in the garage every day which cured the customers fault. When those 'faulty' parts were later tested, most of them were in perfect working condition. Most of the problems are attributed to bad connections and bad earths. Removing and replacing those items solved the connection problems automatically.
Spruce
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Definitely check all the connections and if you are ham-fisted get a mechanic/fitter to do it, watch out for overtightening nuts especially on the starter motor solenoid as they like to crack loose(speaking from experience here) and disconnect the battery before poking spanners down the engine bay or you will end up welding something together or burning a hole through things,done that as well.
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can of easy start m8 3 quid ;D ;D ;D
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
No, you are not the thick one! add to the thicker engine oil, thicker gearbox oil as well which further adds to the drag. The colder it gets the less efficiently the battery works as well - all factors which make cold engine starting even more difficult.
To make matters worse, a Citroen Hdi engine needs to be spun faster than the earlier 1.9d to get it to start.
Spruce
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Engine block could be frozen, make sure youve got the anti-freeze in there.
If everyone posts all the problems that it may possibly be, then we shall find the solution! ;D
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
No, you are not the thick one! add to the thicker engine oil, thicker gearbox oil as well which further adds to the drag. The colder it gets the less efficiently the battery works as well - all factors which make cold engine starting even more difficult.
To make matters worse, a Citroen Hdi engine needs to be spun faster than the earlier 1.9d to get it to start.
Spruce
The thickness of the gearbox oil will have no effect on the starting of an engine.
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Hmmm interesting - i didn't post my van problem here as i thought it wasn't suitable, but some interesting answers
my combo has almost identical prob, altho it still will not start from a jump straight away - the leads need to be on for
five minutes then it fires up - after that its a good un - even if i stop it straight away, so the batt has life - just not first thing in the cold ::)
ps - it did require new glow plugs at the start of this cold spell - only 1 out of 4 working ... :-X
it has to be down to a loose connection
Darran
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
No, you are not the thick one! add to the thicker engine oil, thicker gearbox oil as well which further adds to the drag. The colder it gets the less efficiently the battery works as well - all factors which make cold engine starting even more difficult.
To make matters worse, a Citroen Hdi engine needs to be spun faster than the earlier 1.9d to get it to start.
Spruce
The thickness of the gearbox oil will have no effect on the starting of an engine.
If you start your engine with the gearbox in neutral and your foot off the clutch, then the oil that lubricates the spigot shaft and gearing will cause additional drag.
Spruce.
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
ha ha ! funny you should say that, had never changed the oil in over 3 years, a mate suggested that and had it done last week, my logic too would suggest so, but the problem still prevailed
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Hmmm interesting - i didn't post my van problem here as i thought it wasn't suitable, but some interesting answers
my combo has almost identical prob, altho it still will not start from a jump straight away - the leads need to be on for
five minutes then it fires up - after that its a good un - even if i stop it straight away, so the batt has life - just not first thing in the cold ::)
ps - it did require new glow plugs at the start of this cold spell - only 1 out of 4 working ... :-X
it has to be down to a loose connection
Darran
Hi
Maybe another thing to try is wait for the heater coil light to go out, switch the ignition off and then on again, and then try to start the engine when the light goes out a second time. This may give a little extra time for tired glowplugs to reach the required temperature.
Then sorry to ask, (not insulting anybody's intelligence) but are you waiting for the heater coil light to go out before trying to start it. The trouble with the new diesels is that we tend to start our diesels exactly the same way as we start a petrol engine. In the summer the new diesel will usually start straight away, but in winter we need to wait until the light goes out.
I mention this because I had trouble adapting back from an Hdi to a 1.9d Engine.
Also should ask if you have checked that there is current to the glowplugs in the first place. A relay is used to actuate these through a fuse. Any issues here will cause poor starting.
Spruce
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Just a thought, could it be that the engine oil may be thicker due to the cold, making it more difficult for the battery/starter to cope?
Or am I the thick one!
John.
No, you are not the thick one! add to the thicker engine oil, thicker gearbox oil as well which further adds to the drag. The colder it gets the less efficiently the battery works as well - all factors which make cold engine starting even more difficult.
To make matters worse, a Citroen Hdi engine needs to be spun faster than the earlier 1.9d to get it to start.
Spruce
The thickness of the gearbox oil will have no effect on the starting of an engine.
If you start your engine with the gearbox in neutral and your foot off the clutch, then the oil that lubricates the spigot shaft and gearing will cause additional drag.
Spruce.
I stand corrected.
I'll shut up now. ;D
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my last reply was before I had finished reading all the posts, which have all been good and could well have been contributing factors to cold start problems, glad to hear I am not alone anyhow !
Ok well I popped in this morning to where I bought the battery from just over a year ago (2YG) , just like quick fit he tested battery too, he then syringed out the distilled water from one of the cells, it was black. He said that running a split cahrge relay from the battery to my leisure battery for pump and short trips and stop / starts had all taken their toll on the battery. Taxis apparantly change their batteries every few months because of this added wear. So solution was a new battery, not under guarantee as battery was not at fault, well a second hand one for £20 instead of £50, he reckoned a new one was pointless as the way its being used would only give a years use, honest enough of them I feel and I may well just change to a fresh second hand battery every beginning of winter as a matter of course in future.
So for time being I'm a happy bunny again, a few frosty mornings and time will tell though I guess.
Thanks all
;)
Simon
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just call in local filling station
can of easy start job done ;D
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my last reply was before I had finished reading all the posts, which have all been good and could well have been contributing factors to cold start problems, glad to hear I am not alone anyhow !
Ok well I popped in this morning to where I bought the battery from just over a year ago (2YG) , just like quick fit he tested battery too, he then syringed out the distilled water from one of the cells, it was black. He said that running a split cahrge relay from the battery to my leisure battery for pump and short trips and stop / starts had all taken their toll on the battery. Taxis apparantly change their batteries every few months because of this added wear. So solution was a new battery, not under guarantee as battery was not at fault, well a second hand one for £20 instead of £50, he reckoned a new one was pointless as the way its being used would only give a years use, honest enough of them I feel and I may well just change to a fresh second hand battery every beginning of winter as a matter of course in future.
So for time being I'm a happy bunny again, a few frosty mornings and time will tell though I guess.
Thanks all
;)
Simon
Thats a faulty cell and they have palmed you off and out of the 5 or 600 taxi`s known to me i have never heard of anyone changing every few months,thats nonsense and most probably an outright lie.Get back and give them another chance to replace it.
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Not a mechanic and no knowledge but when did that stop me.
It's a tight engine.Put some thinner oil in.End of problem.
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my last reply was before I had finished reading all the posts, which have all been good and could well have been contributing factors to cold start problems, glad to hear I am not alone anyhow !
Ok well I popped in this morning to where I bought the battery from just over a year ago (2YG) , just like quick fit he tested battery too, he then syringed out the distilled water from one of the cells, it was black. He said that running a split cahrge relay from the battery to my leisure battery for pump and short trips and stop / starts had all taken their toll on the battery. Taxis apparantly change their batteries every few months because of this added wear. So solution was a new battery, not under guarantee as battery was not at fault, well a second hand one for £20 instead of £50, he reckoned a new one was pointless as the way its being used would only give a years use, honest enough of them I feel and I may well just change to a fresh second hand battery every beginning of winter as a matter of course in future.
So for time being I'm a happy bunny again, a few frosty mornings and time will tell though I guess.
Thanks all
;)
Simon
Thats a faulty cell and they have palmed you off and out of the 5 or 600 taxi`s known to me i have never heard of anyone changing every few months,thats nonsense and most probably an outright lie.Get back and give them another chance to replace it.
Oh bugger ! really ? I honestly would'nt know, it sounded a plausable explanation to me.
£20 and its a bigger battery than before, cheaper than replacing glow plugs and if it gets me through the winter without any more problems it was worth it. But would like to know if ther was any truth in what he was saying :-\
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I would get a garage to check glow plugs.
and yes i think they've pulled a fast one with the batt.
Spruce - cheers, i do on extra cold mornings do the ignition 3 times - just to help it along - if the garage has fitted new
plugs surely they would have checked the current ?? ( wouldn't they.... :-\ )
Engine block could be frozen, make sure youve got the anti-freeze in there.
The last AA man did mention the Anti freeze looked a little weak .....
Darran
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My Movano has been slow to start since weve had the cold weather, when it does start there's a load of diesel smoke so i reckon ive got at least one dodgey glow plug, its fine stopping and starting all day after that.