Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Sir Squeaky on October 27, 2010, 06:39:14 pm
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I'm well aware this will start a Trad vs WFP debate, but that's part of it.
My point is this...
Are customers running out of patience with water fed pole cleaning?
It seems to me that's case, certainly in my experience.
I'm still gaining more work than I'm losing, but I have lost a fair few this year.
Most have said they're not happy with wet or "unfinished" windows.
I know it's not a quality thing, as no-one has any particular complaints, just the initial result.
When I've mentioned it to neighbours or friends of these people they've all said "Well I'm happy enough, but if I'm honest I preferred the old way"
Or "I did prefer the proper job you used to do, but understand you have to use this method now"
Now most of these are customers who I've had for years and have been done WFP for 3 and a half years now.
Could it be that they put up with it at first to avoid conflict and try to get on with it, but now the patience is wearing thin and they've had enough...? :-\
I'm not overly concerned, as I get new work all the time anyway, but I can see many more who are "putting up with it" and will surely cancel soon.
I see a big opening for local trad cleaners...
Thoughts...? ???
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the only issue i think is price, if the windows look better when theyre dry and last longer staying clean, then they cant say anything, i wouldnt worry mate,
if your still trading then your either skint, or too stingy to invest in better safer tech.
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maybe they just cant stand the sight of you mate ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
only jesting Roger, I suppose its not for everyone but I have quite a few who love it,
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know what you mean sqeaks;i like both methods and charge a bit more for trad
bit more up market here than down south ;D
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the only issue i think is price, if the windows look better when theyre dry and last longer staying clean, then they cant say anything, i wouldnt worry mate,
Well of course they can say something, many already have!
Usually "can you wipe them or squeegee them off please"... then cancel then or shortly afterwards.
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I suppose its not for everyone but I have quite a few who love it,
I do too, but I think a large majority of others just "put up with it"
For so long...
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its all good WFP or goodbye :)
You wont catch me up and down a ladder again death trap
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I'm only relatively new but if they don't wont wfp then I can't be arsed to do it. I trad some shops but apart from that all wfp. I sometimes think customers don't know what they're talking about, they just say the first thing that pops into their heads. It [wfp] does a marvelous job nearly (99.9%) all of the time why wouldn't you want really clean frames, glass and cills?
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If you want the feel good factor trad the bottoms and you'll feel loads better.You'll also be knackered and skint.
Yet again this is about your low self esteem.Start believing in yourself and stop projecting your inadequacy onto others.
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best thing going is wfp,picking up new work all the time with people wanting trad ;)
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Im not sure what planet your on mate my customers love pure water cleaning and zero complaints in 6 years
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the only issue i think is price, if the windows look better when theyre dry and last longer staying clean, then they cant say anything, i wouldnt worry mate,
if your still trading then your either skint, or too stingy to invest in better safer tech.
what a stupid comment im not skint or stingy, i want to go wfp at some point to,but only thing stopping me is i no i could proberly lose a fair few custys and i dont want take that chance at the moment
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has the wfp v trad arguement sarted properly yet . come on get some insults going ;D
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What a negative thread this started out as.....!
Wfp is the way forward, everyone of my customers love it... new and old.
I think this is a ploy to stop more trad guys reading this , turning to wfp..... competition etc.
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i would say in the last month i have picked up 30 jobs that arent happy with there trad window cleaners because they dont clean sills and miss upstairs windows and have lame excuses!
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I havn't lost a customer due to WFP for at least 6 months...infact I get more requests for cleaning using the pole nowadays, even bungalows because of the frame cleaning.
I picked up a new customer today who asked me if I would use the "magic water" lol
But......some will never get there heads round it, especially older folk ???
Didnt you say before, that most of your customers are oldies??
bob
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If you want the feel good factor trad the bottoms and you'll feel loads better.You'll also be knackered and skint.
Yet again this is about your low self esteem.Start believing in yourself and stop projecting your inadequacy onto others.
Low self esteem? lol ;D
What are you on about you clown? If you can't contribute without being silly, please go away and leave the adults to talk. There's a good lad. ;)
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But......some will never get there heads round it, especially older folk ???
Didnt you say before, that most of your customers are oldies??
Wouldn't say most no, but some have been.
Well I think people have got the wrong end of this as expected... ::)
Wasn't complaining about WFP, nor do I have any intention of not using it.
Nor do I have any work worries. I just simply stated what I've noticed lately.
God this forum is hard work sometimes...
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How many times have you been to a restaurant, had a meal but thought "I am not going back there".
But the restaurant is still busy and always full. You just can't please everybody, just as long as you please enough thats all you need to do.
I find window cleaning is 90% dealing with the customers , being bright and cheery, asking about their holiday, their kids or commenting about their new car.
If you are turning up with this attitude about WFP they will sense it.
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I find window cleaning is 90% dealing with the customers , being bright and cheery, asking about their holiday, their kids or commenting about their new car.
If you are turning up with this attitude about WFP they will sense it.
No, not at all, I think it's great.
I have the same attitude as you.
And if that was the case, why has this only started this year?
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i think a lot of custy might be thinking that u r not earning your money like you use to when you was trad,
i bet if you reduced your prices then no one would ahve a problem lol
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the only issue i think is price, if the windows look better when theyre dry and last longer staying clean, then they cant say anything, i wouldnt worry mate,
if your still trading then your either skint, or too stingy to invest in better safer tech.
what a stupid comment im not skint or stingy, i want to go wfp at some point to,but only thing stopping me is i no i could proberly lose a fair few custys and i dont want take that chance at the moment
well excuuuuse meee!
will add that on the end to keep you happy chump,
you may lose some custys if you convert!
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Wfp is the way forward, everyone of my customers love it... new and old.
Really?
Isn`t it just a means to an end? Getting your windows cleaned.
Do you really think all customers love having their windows cleaned?
I`m just imagining all your customers lying back,glowing with satisfaction and lighting a cigarette after you wfp`ed their windows.
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Wfp is the way forward, everyone of my customers love it... new and old.
Really?
Isn`t it just a means to an end? Getting your windows cleaned.
Do you really think all customers love having their windows cleaned?
I`m just imagining all your customers lying back,glowing with satisfaction and lighting a cigarette after you wfp`ed their windows.
compared to the old way.... you know,... dirty frames , dirty sills, dirty door, dirty window cleaner peering through bedroom windows,....
So they found a means to an end...
The water fed pole.,.. and pure water.... yes they like it very much indeed.
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It amazes me nearly 4 years on with wfp, customer off of work ,"Are't you going to dry them?"
Something I've noticed this year is a lot of is the can you wipe the water off of the ledge question. I do think a few just put up with the method but more love it and most love me or my Mrs as thats what being a wc is all about, being customer friendly.
Simon.
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Wfp is the way forward, everyone of my customers love it... new and old.
Really?
Isn`t it just a means to an end? Getting your windows cleaned.
Do you really think all customers love having their windows cleaned?
I`m just imagining all your customers lying back,glowing with satisfaction and lighting a cigarette after you wfp`ed their windows.
compared to the old way.... you know,... dirty frames , dirty sills, dirty door, dirty window cleaner peering through bedroom windows,....
So they found a means to an end...
The water fed pole.,.. and pure water.... yes they like it very much indeed.
Is there something you`d like to tell us? ;D
Sounds like you have a great round, with great customers; boring but great.
Fair play to you.
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squeeky seem to agree with you mate at the end of the clean are you satisfied with wfp is balls and we all know it trad is a art and custies like the effort put into it convert to trad is the way forward
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I think most see the advantages, but it doesn't always outweigh their view that it's unfinished.
If it had happened from the start I could understand, and a few did, but as others have taken this long I wonder if it's a case of having had enough...
Strange.
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squeeky seem to agree with you mate at the end of the clean are you satisfied with wfp is balls and we all know it trad is a art and custies like the effort put into it convert to trad is the way forward
No, I'm very happy with the job I do, and the majority are satisfied.
Just noticed a few moaners lately that's all.
Wouldn't go back to trad even if it was more money (but it's not).
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i stand by my post mate ad a few who do moan but seem to put up with it rather then av a go it works on certain jobs con roofs and facias cleans
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sounds like sour grapes to me by all you lads that have shelled out for wfp,tried both , customers do not like wfp,very messy they say and can be dangerous in the winter for the old folk when water ices up.just saying as i find,could be a change in the air,thank god someone was brave enough to bring it up. ;)
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squeeky seem to agree with you mate at the end of the clean are you satisfied with wfp is balls and we all know it trad is a art and custies like the effort put into it convert to trad is the way forward
No, I'm very happy with the job I do, and the majority are satisfied.
Just noticed a few moaners lately that's all.
Wouldn't go back to trad even if it was more money (but it's not).
They may have always thought it but never said anything before.
It could be coincidence that you`re getting your cancellations/moans at the same time too. And some just follow a lead.
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sounds like sour grapes to me by all you lads that have shelled out for wfp,tried both , customers do not like wfp,very messy they say and can be dangerous in the winter for the old folk when water ices up.just saying as i find,could be a change in the air,thank god someone was brave enough to bring it up. ;)
What winter? We make so much stinking cash during the summer with the wfp we lay in the scratcher all winter. Ha ha. Laughing all the way to the Leeds. hey, You missed a spot buddy.
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As a customer what would you choose? Two window cleaners turn up and quote the same price and are both experienced and very good at their chosen method, one is WFP the other is trad, I know which one I would choose, the one which leaves instant results without having to wait hours for you windows to dry :P and yes I am WFP :o If I was never in until evening then I would probably not give a toss but choose trad anyway :)
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in the last few weeks ive had 2 new customers ask for the pole system(as they put it).... me thinks theres a change in the air..happy days
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Mixed reactions to this then...
Yes I can understand the "not finished" reaction, but those with some sort of intelligence or understanding don't have a problem.
And as has been said, those who aren't in get everything. They don't see the wet windows and get great results on frames, sills, doors, the lot.
I think it is a case of some people being more tolerant, as like I said, even those who were fine with me "preferred the old way if they were honest"
Wouldn't take much to lose them in theory...
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r the ones you are losing in when u do there windows
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I'm still gaining more work than I'm losing, but I have lost a fair few this year.
Most have said they're not happy with wet or "unfinished" windows.
Maybe these customers, and I bet there's only a very few of them, have just felt the 'pinch' of the current economic climate and cancelled. But they find it easier to find fault than to say, "I'm sorry, but I can't afford to have my windows cleaned".
I've lost a few, but those have been due to being skint, relationship breakdowns, moving, and lost jobs. I'm also chasing a few late payers, and I haven't had to do that for a long time.
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im defo finding windows,frames and sills coming up much better than trad and staying cleaner for longer!!i do think some custies would prefer me to dry them off esp in winter as they take hours to dry!
i do blade the odd kitchen window of the old folks if they want to admire their garden!i also make sure i dont wfp doors and doorways in winter as i think this could annoy the odd custy! ;) ;D
to be honest i usually find that squeaky seems to have a glass half empty attitude to things in general!his total bloody mindedness against wfp a few years ago was great!(read his backposts!).classic. ;D ;D ;D
maybe theyve just found a much happier window cleaner that makes them smile eh squeaks?? ;D ;D ;D ;D
regards
dazmond
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Mixed reactions to this then...
Yes I can understand the "not finished" reaction, but those with some sort of intelligence or understanding don't have a problem.
And as has been said, those who aren't in get everything. They don't see the wet windows and get great results on frames, sills, doors, the lot.
I think it is a case of some people being more tolerant, as like I said, even those who were fine with me "preferred the old way if they were honest"
Wouldn't take much to lose them in theory...
this^
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squeaky this is for you mate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-rJ-6hBfSo
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r the ones you are losing in when u do there windows
Oh yes, that's what I mean.
The ones who aren't are perfectly pleased.
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maybe theyve just found a much happier window cleaner that makes them smile eh squeaks?? ;D ;D ;D ;D
Nah, rubbish mate. I'm probably the most chatty and friendly one in my area. I get on great with my customers.
I've done people jobs most of my life.
Nothing to do with me or what I've said.
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u might just be unlucky mate, but it seems odd that it is only the ones in that are cancelling, do u collect on the day
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I havent read through all the thread, but one customer that springs to mind, i picked them up and cleaned it for about 6 months and they were out every time. Anyway, the one day i go, and theyre an elderly couple. I do the fronts, go round the back and the lady comes out
"erm are you going to do the fronts?"
"hi, ive done them"
"no you havent youve just wet them all"
"yes thats how we clean"
She looked well miffed and in dis belief. So i finished the backs and knocked for money, they both come to door.
"are you going to finish the windows then?"
"i have, theyre all done"
"no you just wet them, we want you to get up there and polish them"
"this is the method i use, its fine youll see when they dry"
she then says to her husband "are you happy about this"
He mutters no and they paid
So next month im doing all the neighbouring houses and think i cant be doing with the hassle ill leave them out. Next minute the elderly lady comes out
"im so sorry for last month, we've never seen this system before and couldnt beleive how good it was. We're so sorry. Please can you do ours"
She could not apologise more...so moral of the story is, WFP is better than trad lol
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I know old slumps doesn't "say it with flowers", Rog but he is right. It's your low self-esteem. Look, jump on the couch and Sigmund "Gold" Fraud will explain - sitting comfortably?
I'm well aware this will start a Trad vs WFP debate, but that's part of it.
My point is this...
Are customers running out of patience with water fed pole cleaning?
It seems to me that's case, certainly in my experience.
I'm still gaining more work than I'm losing, but I have lost a fair few this year.
Most have said they're not happy with wet or "unfinished" windows.
I know it's not a quality thing, as no-one has any particular complaints, just the initial result.
When I've mentioned it to neighbours or friends <see, you've brought it up because you are unsure of the method yourself> of these people they've all said "Well I'm happy enough, but if I'm honest I preferred the old way"
Or "I did prefer the proper job you used to do, but understand you have to use this method now"
Now most of these are customers who I've had for years and have been done WFP for 3 and a half years now.
Could it be that they put up with it at first to avoid conflict and try to get on with it, but now the patience is wearing thin and they've had enough...? :-\
I'm not overly concerned, as I get new work all the time anyway, but I can see many more who are "putting up with it" and will surely cancel soon.
I see a big opening for local trad cleaners...
Thoughts...? ???
If you remember squeaks you fought a long and hopeless rear-guard action defending trad and telling this forum why wfp won't work and now you have reverted to type in your head and quickly assigned all cancellations to "hate wfp" when in reality it could be "skint-itis" - or that you put the thoughts into their head by asking the damnfool question. ;D
If you think you are earning too much for easy work then what do you think the custies will think? Now if you want to show some attention to detail when the custy is in then blade their front door glass and wipe all the bottom cills.
Then if they bring up wfp just tell 'em it'll dry perfect and to remember their gleaming frames and they'll love you.
That will be £120 please - the best Ton-twenty you'll ever spend! ;D
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I havent read through all the thread, but one customer that springs to mind, i picked them up and cleaned it for about 6 months and they were out every time. Anyway, the one day i go, and theyre an elderly couple. I do the fronts, go round the back and the lady comes out
"erm are you going to do the fronts?"
"hi, ive done them"
"no you havent youve just wet them all"
"yes thats how we clean"
She looked well miffed and in dis belief. So i finished the backs and knocked for money, they both come to door.
"are you going to finish the windows then?"
"i have, theyre all done"
"no you just wet them, we want you to get up there and polish them"
"this is the method i use, its fine youll see when they dry"
she then says to her husband "are you happy about this"
He mutters no and they paid
So next month im doing all the neighbouring houses and think i cant be doing with the hassle ill leave them out. Next minute the elderly lady comes out
"im so sorry for last month, we've never seen this system before and couldnt beleive how good it was. We're so sorry. Please can you do ours"
She could not apologise more...so moral of the story is, WFP is better than trad lol
Moral of the story- make `um beg ;D.
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Gold - superb mate are you sure your a w/c ?
There has been some great points made on this thread, i think it's more a combo of things that you are getting
cancellations - time of year ( the leave till spring brigade - esp those who you have taken on this year ) those who
are not normally home then see 'wet' windows as they have the day off and think you've done half a job. ( had 2 of these myself ) but realise it's fine when windows are dry. and lastly as WFP cleans SO well - windows and frames etc
that people forget the initial stunning results and get used to permament shiney frames and glass thinking they have always been this way.
Darran
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I find trying to work customers out can be tirsome. There is no consistancy and i believe most are just plain crazy ;D don't give them a second thought and just replace them. By dwelling on it the only person you hurt is yourself
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I know old slumps doesn't "say it with flowers", Rog but he is right. It's your low self-esteem.
Oh my god! ;D What is this self esteem crap?
One minute Tosh is telling me I think too much of myself, next you're saying the opposite. ::)
Please be serious. It wasn't a jokey thread, it was a serious question.
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If you think you are earning too much for easy work then what do you think the custies will think? Now if you want to show some attention to detail when the custy is in then blade their front door glass and wipe all the bottom cills.
Already do that thankyou. Not always the sills, but always the front doors.
Then if they bring up wfp just tell 'em it'll dry perfect and to remember their gleaming frames and they'll love you
Yes, obviously I do that too.
Any more silly ideas Malc? Or can we get back to serious replies?
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If you think you are earning too much for easy work then what do you think the custies will think? Now if you want to show some attention to detail when the custy is in then blade their front door glass and wipe all the bottom cills.
Already do that thankyou. Not always the sills, but always the front doors.
Then if they bring up wfp just tell 'em it'll dry perfect and to remember their gleaming frames and they'll love you
Yes, obviously I do that too.
Any more silly ideas Malc? Or can we get back to serious replies?
That was a bit harsh wern't it? He was only giving you a few pointers
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If you think you are earning too much for easy work then what do you think the custies will think? Now if you want to show some attention to detail when the custy is in then blade their front door glass and wipe all the bottom cills.
Already do that thankyou. Not always the sills, but always the front doors.
Then if they bring up wfp just tell 'em it'll dry perfect and to remember their gleaming frames and they'll love you
Yes, obviously I do that too.
Any more silly ideas Malc? Or can we get back to serious replies?
That was a bit harsh wern't it? He was only giving you a few pointers
He could use them and go back trad.
I agree with you though Steve, why try and guess what is going on in customers` heads. They are not a single entity.
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If you think you are earning too much for easy work then what do you think the custies will think? Now if you want to show some attention to detail when the custy is in then blade their front door glass and wipe all the bottom cills.
Already do that thankyou. Not always the sills, but always the front doors.
Then if they bring up wfp just tell 'em it'll dry perfect and to remember their gleaming frames and they'll love you
Yes, obviously I do that too.
Any more silly ideas Malc? Or can we get back to serious replies?
That was a bit harsh wern't it? He was only giving you a few pointers
Yes, very funny I'm sure.
Go back trad? I'd rather pack the job in than that! ;D
Wonder why window cleaners are so hard to have conversations with?
I wasn't asking for "help" or what to do about it, just pointing out what I've noticed recently.
I'm sure I've already said this, but it doesn't sink in does it? ;D
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i'm lost.
The way i read it was he was just giving you a few tips on maybe keeping your customers happy?
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i'm lost.
The way i read it was he was just giving you a few tips on maybe keeping your customers happy?
You've got a lot to learn about Malcolm then Steve.
He's always on the wind-up or offensive. I'm known him on here long enough to know when he's being sarcastic! Trust me, it wasn't nice. He knows I didn't need anyone's "help", that's why he did it. ;)
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i like a little sarcasm myself ;D i didn't read it that way. i've only been on here 5 years so what would i know? (that was sarcasm) ;D
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Oh my god! ;D What is this self esteem crap?
One minute Tosh is telling me I think too much of myself, next you're saying the opposite. ::)
No, you're getting confuddled. You can have a big ego and a low self-esteem. They're different concepts, but they tend to go hand-in-hand.
Does that help?
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Roger,
You can always pass them my number. I'm happy to do them trad! ;D
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As a customer what would you choose? Two window cleaners turn up and quote the same price and are both experienced and very good at their chosen method, one is WFP the other is trad, I know which one I would choose, the one which leaves instant results without having to wait hours for you windows to dry :P and yes I am WFP :o If I was never in until evening then I would probably not give a toss but choose trad anyway :)
I'd choose WFP,... I wouldn't want to risk a ladder monkey falling & suing me,.. ::)
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i'm lost.
The way i read it was he was just giving you a few tips on maybe keeping your customers happy?
You've got a lot to learn about Malcolm then Steve.
He's always on the wind-up or offensive. I'm known him on here long enough to know when he's being sarcastic! Trust me, it wasn't nice. He knows I didn't need anyone's "help", that's why he did it. ;)
Malc Gold be sarcastic?????
Nah, never ;D
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As a customer what would you choose? Two window cleaners turn up and quote the same price and are both experienced and very good at their chosen method, one is WFP the other is trad, I know which one I would choose, the one which leaves instant results without having to wait hours for you windows to dry :P and yes I am WFP :o If I was never in until evening then I would probably not give a toss but choose trad anyway :)
That can depend on the house ::) if the trad window cleaner came to clean a house and said sorry I can not clean the one above your conservatory and in the winter the roof is too wet to go on so we'll just do bottoms and I missed that one out this time because there was a car in the way ........... and the WFP cleaners says not a problem and windows will stay cleaner for longer as well
Then which one do you think is offering the better choice ?
Squeaky Clean is not negative just honest the most people would prefer trad and trad is a excellent tool.....
if you go over to WFP you will lose customers but you will pick up work more suitable for WFP...
WFP is my prefered method to clean the windows ... But I have both tools and use what tool I need for the job ;)
Adders
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I'm well aware this will start a Trad vs WFP debate, but that's part of it.
My point is this...
Are customers running out of patience with water fed pole cleaning?
It seems to me that's case, certainly in my experience.
I'm still gaining more work than I'm losing, but I have lost a fair few this year.
Most have said they're not happy with wet or "unfinished" windows.
I know it's not a quality thing, as no-one has any particular complaints, just the initial result.
When I've mentioned it to neighbours or friends of these people they've all said "Well I'm happy enough, but if I'm honest I preferred the old way"
Or "I did prefer the proper job you used to do, but understand you have to use this method now"
Now most of these are customers who I've had for years and have been done WFP for 3 and a half years now.
Could it be that they put up with it at first to avoid conflict and try to get on with it, but now the patience is wearing thin and they've had enough...? :-\
I'm not overly concerned, as I get new work all the time anyway, but I can see many more who are "putting up with it" and will surely cancel soon.
I see a big opening for local trad cleaners...
Thoughts...? ???
I think you have a point but maybe for a different reason. Maybe as things get tighter customers feel that WFP is the expensive option as they see all the tools needed. And with new trad cleaners about who don't know how to price for sustainable income, maybe they are hoping for a cheaper job.
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Roger,
You can always pass them my number. I'm happy to do them trad! ;D
I'd be happy to if that's what they want mate. No probs.
And thanks Stuart and Cat. Good replies.
I think that's a very good point Stuart, it's probably them trying to cut corners.
On the opposite side of things I picked up two good sized ones today in the same street as a moaner, and they were both happy with the pole.
That said, so were the others at first... we'll see!
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is ur area being knocked and you losing to new people, who are cheaper
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is ur area being knocked and you losing to new people, who are cheaper
I think areas are always getting knocked really.
Possible in some cases, but I don't think so in some, as they've said they're going to try and find a trad cleaner.
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they might have already found one, a newbie starting out who does trad, i have had custy say they want to cancel for what ever reason, then find out they got a cheaper wc
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We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened and let him come around to it when he was ready.
If the customer doesn't like it we don't use it on their windows - simple as that. If there are dangerous access windows we just use it at that and explain why - no issue.
Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp - whether people on here like it or not. At it's best it's fantastic - but sometimes the result is quite poor - for a variety of reasons.
The other thing that people on here should consider is that customers don't always complain they don't like wfp - they just look elsewhere and stop their wc without explanation. We have been approached several times by customers who don't like wfp and asked if we'll do it trad - I bet they hadn't said a word to their window cleaner - just stopped him.
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We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened and let him come around to it when he was ready.
If the customer doesn't like it we don't use it on their windows - simple as that. If there are dangerous access windows we just use it at that and explain why - no issue.
Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp - whether people on here like it or not. At it's best it's fantastic - but sometimes the result is quite poor - for a variety of reasons.
The other thing that people on here should consider is that customers don't always complain they don't like wfp - they just look elsewhere and stop their wc without explanation. We have been approached several times by customers who don't like wfp and asked if we'll do it trad - I bet they hadn't said a word to their window cleaner - just stopped him.
Not true there are windows that give problems i.e Spotting and so on
But there are ways to get this up to trad standard ;)
adders
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Thing is - it isn't always a perfect finish with wfp
Not true there are windows that give problems i.e Spotting and so on
Same thing mate
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my answer to original statement by squeaky. is in this
economic climate some are going to feel the pinch and will
find any excuse to cancel and wet ledges and windows is
a covenient excuse especially with the ladder boys still around.
more and more are turning to wfp locally by me so will be
become a less opportunistic excuse in the long term.
only problem with more wfp,ers is more competition i would
of rather stayed a rarity, with more cleaners using wfp the
standard of there work will come up and less will want to
switch to me! :'( :'( ;)
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You make a lot of sense when you're not talking about football Gary! ;D
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You make a lot of sense when you're not talking about football Gary! ;D
how dare you!! from a chelsea glory hunter...err sorry.. fan!
and all ::) ::) ;D
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We had one customer who absolutely refused to let us use wfp - so we did it trad. Today he was at his daughters who we do wfp - he was so impressed he said he would give it a go. The key thing is we listened...
I love tradesmen like that. Last year when I had my chimney swept, the chimney sweep tried to use a new fangled brush on a pole; ruddy big bog brush it looked like to me; so I refused to have them done like that.
Luckily enough he was a right soft touch and he brought round his four-year-old son and we did it the good old fashioned way, fnaaar fnaaar.
I love telling the plumber we use how to do his job too; it really brightens up his day.
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Now now Tosh - you'll be on Roger's "naughty-step" with me if you carry on like that! ;D
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this a good debate on what is a simple situation to a thread what the custie want they get and shown by a few comments posted that a few should grow up a bit
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Roger, I bet the ones that moan are the ones you converted from trad, probably in their 70's. I have had the same mate, in fact lost quite a few to a new young trad guy.
The younger ones are OK about it, and as stated elsewhere most of them are out when their windows get done.
The newer clients are no problem either, they knew what they were going to get.
Some of those fussy old uns hate WFP, you know the ones that used to inspect every window for the slightest squeegee kick, these now have to wait until the glass dries, by which time your gone.
I am amazed by how quick people forget that their frames are being done every time, you would think they were self cleaning.
Forget about them Roger, they belong in the past.
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You're spot on Dai.
Like I said, I'm not bothered. I pick up more than I lose anyway, just pointing it out in case others had seen similar happen.
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Roger, I bet the ones that moan are the ones you converted from trad, probably in their 70's. I have had the same mate, in fact lost quite a few to a new young trad guy.
The younger ones are OK about it, and as stated elsewhere most of them are out when their windows get done.
The newer clients are no problem either, they knew what they were going to get.
Some of those fussy old uns hate WFP, you know the ones that used to inspect every window for the slightest squeegee kick, these now have to wait until the glass dries, by which time your gone.
I am amazed by how quick people forget that their frames are being done every time, you would think they were self cleaning.
Forget about them Roger, they belong in the past.
that could be the problem, they have paid u have gone and they forget by the time u come back
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Not read all of the replies so may have missed something but the way I see it (I know i've only been going since June this year and still a newbie really) and this is no way a high and mighty comment / go stuff yourself mr/mrs customer type of reply or a rant of any sorts BUT what has it got to do with the customer how we choose to clean their windows ??
would they tell a plumber how to plumb (well apart from Bob Plumb ;) ;) ) in their new bathroom or the gardener how to mow the grass or what type of mower to use ??
Its OUR safety and OUR choice of work method .... i'm currently still on ladders but will be WFP very soon and cant wait to sell me ladders on ebay as will only do WFP from the change over day .... Ive been getting concerned over how my customers are going to take the change but now the way Im looking at it is I firmly beleive that I can do just a good a job with WFP as I do with trad and if I had an accident would they give a stuff about me - a few would im sure but most customers concern would be findind another windie ;D
So who cares if theyre tiring of WFP - not me .... I CARE too much about my safety ... my long term well being and providing an income for my family ...
Some windies on here may say its got a lot to do with the customers as its their windows that are getting cleaned however I would not want to do business with a customer whos priority is their choice of window cleaning method over my safety.
Like I say not meant to be a high and might reply but if the odd one dont like it then fine no worries let them go find another windie .... me I will go and find 2 more customers that are ok with it :)
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Nice one Ian but i would keep your ladders if not as a reminder of all those near falls we have all had.
i told a farmer i want my wheat hand pick not one those new combine harvester machines ;D
Times move on so what if the windows are left to dry I bet they'd moan if it was your blood drying on the glass.
If they want someone clean their windows off a ladder because it turns them on then good for them.
And yes i am only in it for the money ::) I have enough excitement in my life without using ladders
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Very well said ian :)
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Anyone who thinks they can dump their ladders just coz they got a new system will find themselves sorely mistaken. The system will do away with cherry pickers and maybe even abseiling. But your ladder is part of your 'bag o' tricks, and always will be.
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Anyone who thinks they can dump their ladders just coz they got a new system will find themselves sorely mistaken. The system will do away with cherry pickers and maybe even abseiling. But your ladder is part of your 'bag o' tricks, and always will be.
Neil ...im sure ur correct but ive made concious decision no more ladders - sure may cost me a few customers either because a ladder is still needed or because they prefer trad but to keep it simple only doing WFP when I change over. ... any trad work will be sold off ..... jusy my choice but been ummming and arrring about it for last week that decided for simplicity just doing wfp plus spending too much time thinking about it.
however will miss the ladders at first as get some stunning views around these parts and nothing beats that feeling on a sunny day cleaning windows with great scenery when up a ladder.
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Anyone who thinks they can dump their ladders just coz they got a new system will find themselves sorely mistaken. The system will do away with cherry pickers and maybe even abseiling. But your ladder is part of your 'bag o' tricks, and always will be.
What would you want a ladder for? ???
I've always stuck up for working with the squeegee, but the minute a got a pole I stopped carrying ladders.
They simply aren't needed.
Besides, I don't want to have ladders on my nice van and look like a pikey.
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only think i can think of squeaky is for access issues ?
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flat roofs??
there are some jobs were a ladder is needed!
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only think i can think of squeaky is for access issues ?
Never had any problems in the first 3 years or so!
Locked gate? Front only it is then. Or alternatively...next...!
Anything you can't get to doesn't get done. Same as trad guys who can't do some windows.
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Anyone who thinks they can dump their ladders just coz they got a new system will find themselves sorely mistaken. The system will do away with cherry pickers and maybe even abseiling. But your ladder is part of your 'bag o' tricks, and always will be.
Neil ...im sure ur correct but ive made concious decision no more ladders - sure may cost me a few customers either because a ladder is still needed or because they prefer trad but to keep it simple only doing WFP when I change over. ... any trad work will be sold off ..... jusy my choice but been ummming and arrring about it for last week that decided for simplicity just doing wfp plus spending too much time thinking about it.
however will miss the ladders at first as get some stunning views around these parts and nothing beats that feeling on a sunny day cleaning windows with great scenery when up a ladder.
Its just Murphy's law, the ladder is still part and parcel. Maybe not every day but I would'nt go sticking up on E bay. Whats the harm in having it up on the racks? Its there, do you not do gutters? The pure water can leave water blotches, especially on wet damp days like we get this side of the world, this time of the year. If the water can't evaporate due to moisture, cold and damp it can leave mark. One pane can be brilliant, and the one beside it can show a dried in droplet. What does that droplet want? >:(It takes a while to get the knack of getting around that. It comes instinctively, its awkward to explain.
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my ladders sit on my rack all week but occasionally i might need them,getting excess to a flat roof reaching a bolt on gate one of my customers ask me to adjust her security lights.Everyone has a different round stay safe and be sensible up there.
don't know about customers but I'm getting tired of WFP ;D
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For all you newbies (and oldies comming out of the dark) out there........get a leaflet explaining how the wfp system works!! and post it or better still give it to your custys by hand!
Worked for me..........and then a few months down the line....give 'em another one ('cos they wont read the first one).
George.
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For all you newbies (and oldies comming out of the dark) out there........get a leaflet explaining how the wfp system works!! and post it or better still give it to your custys by hand!
Worked for me..........and then a few months down the line....give 'em another one ('cos they wont read the first one).
George.
Agreed. Worked when I changed over.
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Rog,
Dont you do gutter cleans? You surely need ladders for that
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Rog,
Dont you do gutter cleans? You surely need ladders for that
No, my pole goes way higher than that.
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Rog,
Dont you do gutter cleans? You surely need ladders for that
I already said that about the gutters! Read my post. Too busy with your ovens eh?
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Don't need ladders for gutters. Doing it by hand is much harder work and bloody high as well!
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Its funny that the post is called customers tiring of wfp ::)
I have picked up new work today off a trad WC not because he is a bad WC or that he is to highly priced. But the customers have caravans on the drive and the window cleaner has to miss them out when it is parked there ...
I really do think more people are seeing the benefit to having a WC that does clean WFP ;D
Adders
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I really do think more people are seeing the benefit to having a WC that does clean WFP ;D
I think you're probably right in general, but seems to have been a few more moaners in recent months, definitely.
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My van is high, so I need a ladder to reach the rack, to get the ladder off; if you know what I mean.
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My van is high, so I need a ladder to reach the rack, to get the ladder off; if you know what I mean.
I'm telling health and safety.
You should be getting it off with a pole now. ;D
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My van is high, so I need a ladder to reach the rack, to get the ladder off; if you know what I mean.
I'm telling health and safety.
You should be getting it off with a pole now. ;D
;D
But I need a ladder to reach my pole, which I need to get my ladder off....
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But I need a ladder to reach my pole, which I need to get my ladder off
Risk assessment needed! ;D
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But I need a ladder to reach my pole, which I need to get my ladder off
Risk assessment needed! ;D
Of course! But I`ve left my risk assessment paper work in the attic, so I need a ladder to get in the attic........
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But I need a ladder to reach my pole, which I need to get my ladder off
Risk assessment needed! ;D
Of course! But I`ve left my risk assessment paper work in the attic, so I need a ladder to get in the attic........
This has been a genuine laugh! ;D
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not for u yr losing custys ;D ;D
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not for u yr losing custys ;D ;D
Not as many as I pick up! ;)
And I meant the last few posts, not the thread in general anyway.
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wfp is better than trad method and always will be ....... yipp ip horray yipp ip horray!