Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Paul-pp on October 15, 2010, 06:03:34 pm
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
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Why would he be topping up his dole just because he works out if a car. I have worked out of a mondeo estate for 6 years, there are plenty of wc's in my area who have been going fir years working out of a car.
This is a case of the wfp guys thinking that all trad guys are on benefits and just want some money for a beer
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
Unbelievable arrogance ???
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Unbelievable arrogance ???
What he said
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When I started in 1997 I was using my Mini for work. I wasn't then, and have never been a 'doleboy'.
I used what I had then to get me started and have progressed to a Fiesta van (not sign written or expensive, but clean and tidy.
I have probably annoyed others who feel that expensive kit/van etc are what customers really want to see, rather than a regular guy who does a good honest job for an affordable price, irrespective of their choice of equipment.
I don't look over my shoulder worrying what other w/c's are doing. As long as my customers are happy with me, and I continue to do what they pay me to do for the price I ask, I will not see the need to change my view of things.
Just an afterthought. My previous van was a 1988 mk2, resplendent in rust and two tone paint job, which I (reluctantly) replaced earlier this year for a mk4 model. Since then, I have had many comments from customers and non customers alike who told me how much they miss the old van, as they always knew I was about. Not one comment was ever demeaning.
Moral: Let us respectfully mind our own business and let others mind theirs. :)
John
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I use a WFP and work out of a Volvo v40 so not all water fed pole guys have vans and a mondeo is a great cheap car for window cleaning and I know you can wfp with a fiesta.I know a couple of guys work same streets as me and get round on a bike.AS long as you do a good job doesnt matter how you get there and what you use.
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I use a WFP and work out of a Volvo v40 so not all water fed pole guys have vans and a mondeo is a great cheap car for window cleaning and I know you can wfp with a fiesta.I know a couple of guys work same streets as me and get round on a bike.AS long as you do a good job doesnt matter how you get there and what you use.
Agreed. (I neglected to mention that I am trad though!)
John.
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if i see em in an old car ;) do think dole or fireman both same i supose
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true dave...me thinks these firemen our worse the doleys at least the firemen have jobs and should have enough money to feed there kids..
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Not sure if you can assume anything really, on the surface, might look like one thing, in reality could be completely different
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nobody with any class would drive a mondeo these days ;)
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seen a guy the other day with old clio and ladder hanging out the back.. had bucket and belt on :o
you gotta start some where...
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Thing is cant judge, because as you say everybody has to start somewhere.
You have the corporate van image, latest gear, logos, websites.
Then you have people trying to make a go. Think there is room for all.
In any business there is a starting point, if there were not, then there would be no room for progression. If you have capital great, if you dont, you have to have a starting point
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Just having a brand spanking new van, all sign written, the best wfp set up available means nothing; yu can buy that any where. It looks good but you may be just starting out and have no customers to clean yet ;)
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Mondeo estate, 18 yrs cleaning.
Its my living!!!!!
Why would he be topping up his dole just because he works out if a car. I have worked out of a mondeo estate for 6 years, there are plenty of wc's in my area who have been going fir years working out of a car.
This is a case of the wfp guys thinking that all trad guys are on benefits and just want some money for a beer
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I work out of a citreon synergie with wfp and do trad too and another window cleaner i know work out of a old rover, he is trad only and another window cleaning I know works out of a citreon piccasso, he is trad only too.
And neither of them or me are on the dole as the taxman sends me a nice letter at the end of the year for there bit.
Guys with new gear and vans are more likely have those vans on the never never and never owns it. I prefer not to be in debt and like to sleep with ease, having no worries.
The only way is to save for what you want in life and not try to keep up with jones in which most can't afford it.
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I worked out of our family Tyota estate for first year or so then R reg escort van amd now T reg Movano SWB, all brought and paid for, same with all my trad and wfp gear, i started with nothing and built it up without loans or finance and i bet i have more work than a lot of the new van wfp cleaners i see driving around.
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He was proberbly looking over at you thinking , what a wally
must have wasted thousands of ££££ on all that kit .
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THE WINDY WITH THE MONDEO MIGHT BE A PROPER JEDI, WINDOW CLEANING FOR YEARS....SHOW SOME RESPECT. A SHINY VAN WITH LOTS OF TOYS DOESNT MEAN WE ARE ANY BETTER.
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;D I know window cleaners that don't even have cars they walk the rounds and are legit,
last year I saw a young lad licensed and insured and legit, about 4 miles from his home walking up the steepest longest hill in town at 7.30am going to work
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I quite often see a window cleaner cycling through my town in Oxfordshire with his ladder over his shoulder. George Formby eat your heart out!
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I quite often see a window cleaner cycling through my town in Oxfordshire with his ladder over his shoulder. George Formby eat your heart out!
good on him I say ;)
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Yes but, no but, The original question is not wrong, there are lots of dole boys out there.
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Hi,
Generally WFP guys have to have a van to accommodate there gear, they have no choice but to have a van. I think if they were traditional many would have a car as this is all they need. Besides a sign written car stands out more then a van.
Kevin WINDOLENE.
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Spot on ;D
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I saw someone walking their ladders around balanced on a bike, bucket and tools on the handlebars. I just thought good on him for getting off his backside and trying to work.
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doesnt matter how you get to each job - car or van
doesnt matter how you clean the windows & frames - just aslong as you do a good job.
what does matter is some of the following - a good attention to detail of your work, a pro look - mainly workwear wise, being insured and not being a tax cheat.
having a crappy car really doesnt matter at all, end of the day if this guy is just trad and just domestic work - when he pulls up in a road to do say 3/4 houses, 9/10 the customer wont even see the rust bucket outside or down the road ...
yes a sign written van helps to give a more pro image but plenty of wc that have a very very pro image but there work is bad ....
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i had a mondeo for years and it was a great car.poor mans jag! ;D ;D ;D ;D
i miss it sometimes as ive just got a van now and usually its weighed down with pure water so sluggish at best!
im gonna have to buy another mondeo next year for pleasure purposes!they are fantastic comfortable cars!
the guy who started this thread A WINDOW CLEANER LOOKING DOWN HIS NOSE AT ANOTHER WINDOW CLEANER!!
PLEASE!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
dazmond
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what makes me laugh is if a wc is working out of a car, then ever one is saying so what, but as soon as they lose custy to dole boys undercutting, as they dont need to run a van pay insurance etc they start moaning
this industy is being held back from being classed as professional becasue of the people who work in it, how can it be a professional business when people turn up in a old car, pair of jeans and a football top, if some one came to price a job at my house like that i would think they where cowboys and would want to pay a lot, not matter how good a job they do,
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Why are people stereotyping others, at least you should be applauding the guy for working.
Probably some may not like competition as it should be a good thing.
And most of these new wfp vans I have seen doing one house then they move on to do another one a lot of running around.
At least mine are compact work in one place working 3 to 5 days in same place and not moving around alot.
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need a new van wfp to get about travel broadens the mind ;)
the original post put it out there car = dole tax cheat a lot by there anwers have agreed
discus
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need a new van wfp to get about travel broadens the mind ;)
the original post put it out there car = dole tax cheat a lot by there anwers have agreed
discus
A bit hard to understand, do you mean you have a broad mind? You also think alot of posters in this thread agree with what you've said? Guys using cars and not vans, are usually tax dodging dolies?
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I personally would not admit it if I owned A Mondeo!
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I personally would not admit it if I owned A Mondeo!
Why? Are you a better WC than one using a Mondeo?
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Nothing to do with window cleaning, I just wouldnt admit it! God take A joke.
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Nothing to do with window cleaning, I just wouldnt admit it! God take A joke.
How did I know that was coming. ::)
So Dave, where are all those who agree with your point in this thread? I can't see any.
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All the gear and no idea
Some lads are just supporting families with an easy wage in low hours not everyone takes up window cleaning to build an empire
Sometime you have to ask whether your spending is justified your in business to make money if you can make the same money out of your old car than buying a new van as well as a car and running both just to keep up appearances with the people on ciu that say thats what he should have its a bit of an expensive way to impress some idiot behind a keyboard
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yea i could tell dazmond would be a mondeo man. You do like a smiley dazmond hey. I see you admit you need to up your crap prices...top man
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just because a guy works out of car doesnt make have a cowboy I know plenty of bricklayers,plumbers,electricians and other trades that work out of cars because a guy slaps some ladders on his car and a bucket in the boot and tries to earn a living instead of sitting on the dole,he probably has nt got charge loads per house because he has low over heads unlike the guy who takes out a loan to buy a van and shinny toys at the end of the day its only cleaning windows.And i say again i put all my water fed pole gear in my car.
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what makes me laugh is if a wc is working out of a car, then ever one is saying so what, but as soon as they lose custy to dole boys undercutting, as they dont need to run a van pay insurance etc they start moaning
this industy is being held back from being classed as professional becasue of the people who work in it, how can it be a professional business when people turn up in a old car, pair of jeans and a football top, if some one came to price a job at my house like that i would think they where cowboys and would want to pay a lot, not matter how good a job they do,
Completly right - In what other job could you employ someone without knowing if he was treating it as professional business or just as a free ticket to beer money - by undercutting people that want to bring their trade in at a proffesional level.
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true dave...me thinks these firemen our worse the doleys at least the firemen have jobs and should have enough money to feed there kids..
. Since iam a fireman I'll take issue with this quote. I've got my insurance , I pay more tax ( because of a second income ) and everything I do is legitimate. To class me has worse than a doley is quite frankly an insult. At the end of the day my goal in life is to provide a decent living for my family. I'll ask you one question craig James . If you earn x amount per year then the following year you fast approach passing that amount, do you say to yourself , I better stop taking more work on because it's not right that I've got off my backside and provided a decent living for my family ?........ At the end of the day we are all window cleaners, regardless of our backrounds and modes of transport. If you are legit all I say to anyboby , is well done .
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I know a cleaner who works from an old Mondeo estate, 35 years in the job, still works what he has retained of his round off ladders ( the rest he has sold to me).
I can gaurantee that he is the best cleaner around, with absolute tip top prices.
Just because he works from an old car doesn't mean he is a doley, I think his window cleaning skills would put most of the younger upstarts to shame, that is why he charges top dollar for ALL his work.
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LOL, nothing wrong from starting out using the family car for business. But if you can’t find or don’t have a reason for buying a small van for your business after a few years, you don’t have a business.
wrong just because you don't have a van don't mean you haven't got a business
im looking a spending £8000 on a new motor for work after winter, am i going to buy a van no im going to get a berlingo multispace why ? because i like having the extra seats to take my 3 daughters out on my days off its all about what you need. plus some cars/mpvs look better than vans :D
If someone has got a datsun sunny for work who cares worry about your own bussiness ::)
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A good example happened last week when a friend of the family said she wanted me to become her w/c, she lives in a 2bed modern house for which i would charge my min rate of £8 - her current w/c does it for £3. I am all for competition, but how do you compete with that without "buying" the work?
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LOL, nothing wrong from starting out using the family car for business. But if you can’t find or don’t have a reason for buying a small van for your business after a few years, you don’t have a business.
I cannot agree with that. There are some top class trad cleaners out there who have been in the biz 20 years+ and use cars to get around in.
I know someone in my area like that and he has more work than he knows what to do with as his customers will never drop him.
Sorry but your statement is nonsense Ewan ;D
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i would just like to say sorry to evrybody on here for my coments about working;
out of a car ;i know its wrong to look down your nose at people as dole cheats
just cos they have a car and a low class car at that sorry but i carnt help it ;D
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I see the point your making
But you don’t see mine, I can’t be bothered to explain in any detail but if/when you sell your business………….
i know what you are trying to say but it seems that people think you need to have a van to suceed why to be a sucess do you need a van NO i clean residential only so with a multispace i have enough room for a wfp trolley plus a 125 ltr tank and on my days off i can take the tank out and put the seats back.
if i was going after commercial work or jet washing i would buy a van but for residential cleaning their isn't any need for it.
at the end of the day its all about what you need to do the job when my daughters dont need running around and picking up from school then i will buy a van but until then i will stick to having a car/mpv.
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i use a volkswagen passat estate and im 98% wfp,i was using asmall van
but two vehicles made no finanicial sense to me especially with
me being the only driver in the household.
i take 200ltrs of water out with me in the morning and if need
be top up for the afternoon all my work is within a few miles
radius of my home and is all residential so its totally managable
i wouldnt say its ideal but its workable and in the summer
i shall move onto a multispace and when the youngest
has left home for university following our eldest lad i will
go back to using vans.
just because people use other vehicles than vans dont
assume they are either dole dossers or no hopers.
i may be no empire builder but i make more than a decent
living from what im doing.
if your on about the professionalism of window means you
must have a sign written van ive come across plenty
of all the gear and no idea cowboys who couldnt wipe
their own arses never mind clean windows ;D ;D
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Cant get a ladder rack for all cars, mine included!
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Cant get a ladder rack for all cars, mine included!
get a Mondeo you buy a cheap rack in Halfords ;D
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Theres room for everyone, sometimes it does hurt when you have spent thousands, and Mondeo man is cleaning up with beer towels and beats you to that prized job
nothing wrong with that.
Its not his fault you feel like a wounded Lion, If you are going to invest in your expensive work equipment, its up to you to market to the clients where you think it will make a difference.
Theres approx 30 Million properties in this country, I would concentrate on getting your fair share rather than what Mondeo man is up to.
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I agree with that attitude. There are enough custies if you go find them.
What a strange situation it is though on this topic. We are all in the maintainance cleaning service. If we don't go to work on Monday, the country wont come to a grinding halt will it? I mean, we supply a service, but it's not really hard to get into.
What's happening now is, some window polishers have a pole, others use squeegies. Now it's an issue for some of us.
I know how it felt when I first got into this malarky. Down the pub, someone asks you what you do for a living and you answer, "Oh I've got a cleaning firm and do mostly commercial work" blah blah .
Some guys need to get over their own image here. So long as you earn enough to live the lifestyle you want, where's the problem?
By the way Ewan, when you leave Sainsbury's and start your business, try and remember all that advice you gave. ::)
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Some guys need to get over their own image here. So long as you earn enough to live the lifestyle you want, where's the problem?
By the way Ewan, when you leave Sainsbury's and start your business, try and remember all that advice you gave. ::)
quality comment ;D ;D ;D very funny nice one cozy
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What a hilarious presumption to make.
I'm all for running a van, but it doesn't instantly make you a business.
My van troubles have been well documented this year and currently use the family car and a trailer.
One customer thought I had "gone all posh" because of using a car rather than the van.
Another presumed I had bought into a franchise because of how I presented myself, he said this after complimenting my trailer set-up and "new" vehicle.
Moral: Don't presume anything or you could end up looking like a fool.
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I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
And that is YOUR problem. You've invested thousands. Its possible for very minimal investment to do this job (window cleaning). Infact if you already have a car its possible to get going with £200 worth of kit. Are you sure you researched your business well before you embarked upon it? Oh, and i must be one of the ones who drag the trade down too, because if i can undercut you and it pays me to do it, then i will do it. ;D
You might be better spending your time and concentration on what YOU are doing and not everyone else you see.
I feel better now !!!!!!
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Sure i could of invested peanuts & looked like a monkey, ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Sure i could of invested peanuts & looked like a monkey, ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
thats exactly what you've done bubbles. ;D ;)
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Sure i could of invested peanuts & looked like a monkey, ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
But you're the one bleating, ::) Get a grip and get over yourself. Mondeo man maybe earning more than you. He could even know how to clean the insides too. ??? There's a funny concept, a WC that can clean insides too.................
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Sure i could of invested peanuts & looked like a monkey, ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
what ever make you feel good its your bussiness.
I use my 06 plate fiesta for work, i have a nice uniform polo, fleece & jumper with logo and phone number on it, i am a traditional window cleaner with a point ladder (getting purefreedom trolley in Feb ) and i have never had a customer say i don't want you to clean my windows because you use a car residential customers don't care most of the time my car is parked up and i walk round to do my rounds
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From an outsiders point of view, from what I read, all I can establish is that you all work different methods, ways, vehicles, marketing, expansion. None of which are to say is wrong. Whatever works for everybody is fine, because we are all in diffferent situations, with different expectations. It all depends ultimately where you end up, or want to take the business. Do you want to make provisions now should you want to sell, if it were the case, then you would be having hindsight, thinking forward. I think everybody has a separate level of what they want to achieve, and I think that should be respected
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mikecam, a business purpose isn’t only to make money. Some who only invest a few hundred pounds in what they like to think is a business are usually a bit deluded and often compare themselves to a real business always looking for similarities, when in fact there are far more differences.
You decide yourself the point where the balance changes from someone who cleans windows for money to someone who has a business, a lot get it wrong simply because they don’t put into there business they just want to take out (cash)
Ewan, the most basic business principe is to make money. The most basic business model may be borne from someones love or hobby and turning it into something that pays, but it is there primarily to make money, if it doesn't then you don't have a business. You'd just be doing something.
A car and a ladder can (and often does) take as much if not more than someone who has invested thousands of pounds in the latest 'reach and wash' technology. If you don't understand that then you need to do the opposite of what i told the OP, you need to have a look at what is going on around you.
Investment into a business is no guarantee of automatic or deserved success.
Trick question for you.......
who earns the most
A) £2000 a month ladder round with car
B) £2000 a month round with local fitted WFP system for 2.5K in purpose bought van
C) £2000 a month round with latest reach and wash technology for 7K in purpose bought van
Now remember, the question is who earns the most and not whats nicest to drive round in.
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No Kate, if you're not WFP and drive a van, you are looked down on by the expert WC's on here . ::) It's always been like that in this trade. Some can't live with the fact they are window clewaners and not fighter pilots ;)
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Did someone want me?
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Well put Mike, The problem is, Ewan isn't a window cleaner. If they start arresting window cleaners, he'll be OK, due to lack of evidence.
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Sure i could of invested peanuts & looked like a monkey, ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Yeah you could of done. But you invested thousands and you are wondering what fellas are doing in Mondeos with ladders. How do you feel? Do you feel like a monkey or do you feel in control of what you are doing, or do you feel that what others are doing is affecting you?
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Did someone want me?
;D ;D ok sswc ;)
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Hi Cozy,
Just a shame that people dont concentrate on their own business rather than whatever anybody else is doing. Each to their own, live and learn take advice if its given. Assess things for yourself, who on earth is to say whats right and wrong if it works for them. Some are happy doing as they do, some want to expand, wide mix of personalites, goals and dreams.
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Yeah Kate, forums are great fun though. It just amazes me that a window cleaner can try to look down on another window cleaner. ;) Seen it all now aint ya? ;D
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
This is really an unbelievable post from someone who has less than 2 months window cleaning experience.
Your back posts tell the whole story.
This 'Mondeo Man' prob has a full round and pays his taxes.
Come back when you have earnt more than you have spent.
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Did someone want me?
;D ;D ok sswc ;)
How very dare you Oor Wullie!
SSWC indeed ::) ;D
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Cozy, just think its about respect thats all.
Now whose up for my calendar?
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
This is really an unbelievable post from someone who has less than 2 months window cleaning experience.
Your back posts tell the whole story.
This 'Mondeo Man' prob has a full round and pays his taxes.
Come back when you have earnt more than you have spent.
Your joking?? CLASSIC ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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9 weeks on the job with all the shiney kit you can buy on credit! Don't tell me...... every time you pull up outside one of your 30 custies, you can hear the theme music from 633 squadron playing in the background PMSL. Then you turn up on here and talk the talk, can't even walk the walk ::) ::) ;D ;D ;D
I love this forum 8)
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
Point proven.
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
This is really an unbelievable post from someone who has less than 2 months window cleaning experience.
Your back posts tell the whole story.
This 'Mondeo Man' prob has a full round and pays his taxes.
Come back when you have earnt more than you have spent.
Yup, I`ve got a full round but I draw the line at paying taxes :o. That`s a mugs game.
And what`s wrong with beer towels? Best not to wash them and they keep the smell of stale beer.
I must apologise for dragging the industry down though chaps.
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
You could afford gaffa tape?
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Ewan, egg, window, 35 quid. Shall we go there? What's the going rate at Sainsbury's now? 7 quid an hour?
You don't see a problem with the guys attitude to his fellow WC's?
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
You could afford gaffa tape?
You were lucky................. 15 of us livin in a shoe box in t'middle of the road..........................
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flipin mondeo man ;D ;D ;D ;D
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;D ;D ;D
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Well he has a head start on you Ewan, you aren't a window cleaner yet.
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
You could afford gaffa tape?
You were lucky................. 15 of us livin in a shoe box in t'middle of the road..........................
You could afford a shoe box!!
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Think best thing is just to calm down.
Best thing is to agree to disagree. It will go on forever.
Just different aspirations and theories, circumstances without factoring in these questions, the subject is wide open to labelling everyone the same
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Well I say shoe box, more of a damp newspaper really. ;D
So you think blokes using cars are crap dolies too Ewan?
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I wasn’t talking about principals of business, I said purpose. If you’re going to stick with that view, stay with ladders and a car. It’s flawed because window cleaners using wfp make more money.
Answer to your ‘open question’ mikecam, not a trick question
Depends on the window cleaner but definitely the wfp system.
Can you tell me why, I have given you that answer?
I can't stay with ladders and a car i have a van kitted out with a WFP system. I do this to make my life safer, i very well know the earning difference between ladders and wfp.
No i can't tell you why the cleaner with the WFP system earns more per 2k round than the ladder guy, its exactly the opposite to what i thought and knew anecdotally. You may care to explain? Also would you care to add which one of the WFP guys would earn the most from it, the 2.5k system or the 7k system ?
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kids are watchin a movie and want to know why im laughing ;D ;D keep it up guys its quite funny ;D ;D
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Ewan doesn't do direct answers Mike. He doesn't know the answer.
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I wasn’t talking about principals of business, I said purpose. If you’re going to stick with that view, stay with ladders and a car. It’s flawed because window cleaners using wfp make more money.
Answer to your ‘open question’ mikecam, not a trick question
Depends on the window cleaner but definitely the wfp system.
Can you tell me why, I have given you that answer?
I can't stay with ladders and a car i have a van kitted out with a WFP system. I do this to make my life safer, i very well know the earning difference between ladders and wfp.
No i can't tell you why the cleaner with the WFP system earns more per 2k round than the ladder guy, its exactly the opposite to what i thought and knew anecdotally. You may care to explain? Also would you care to add which one of the WFP guys would earn the most from it, the 2.5k system or the 7k system ?
The question was carefully asked, it revolved around earning £2k per month, the difference is with the outgoings!
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From an outsiders point of view, from what I read, all I can establish is that you all work different methods, ways, vehicles, marketing, expansion. None of which are to say is wrong. Whatever works for everybody is fine, because we are all in diffferent situations, with different expectations. It all depends ultimately where you end up, or want to take the business. Do you want to make provisions now should you want to sell, if it were the case, then you would be having hindsight, thinking forward. I think everybody has a separate level of what they want to achieve, and I think that should be respected
Very diplomatic answer Kate, but times move on and the old ways do become wrong or if you prefer outdated.
Making the mistakes and then correcting them looking for improvements and always keeping up to date is the least you should be doing.
Arguing the case for outdated methods, consistently looking for justification and support from the likeminded is for losers.
Window cleaning isn’t a guaranteed ticket for success, financial or otherwise its hard work, just like anything else it requires planning and thought. The easier alternative is to be a window cleaner, you know get yourself a bucket and ladder and go to work in the family car.
Good point Ewan. Why don't you take your own advice and actually take the plunge and start a window cleaning business. It's got to be better than working security at Sainsbury's
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Nope I stand firmly by what I said
I have no clue as to what the situation is and the expectations of people on here. We are all different, yes idealistically we would all want to be doing massive contract cleaning jobs, corporate image, but all that takes time.
Budgets, time and manpower factor into this.
Ultimately we would all like to be at that goal point.
Im diplomatic, because I dont know individual situations. I dont know family circumstances, I dont know financial circumstances either, I dont know if anyone sets aside a budget for certain things. Its a very open field
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Very diplomatic answer Kate, but times move on and the old ways do become wrong or if you prefer outdated.
Making the mistakes and then correcting them looking for improvements and always keeping up to date is the least you should be doing.
Arguing the case for outdated methods, consistently looking for justification and support from the likeminded is for losers.
Window cleaning isn’t a guaranteed ticket for success, financial or otherwise its hard work, just like anything else it requires planning and thought. The easier alternative is to be a window cleaner, you know get yourself a bucket and ladder and go to work in the family car.
You still havn't answered the question Ewan, who earns more per 2k round? And i'm not arguing for an out dated method just tell me simply who earns/pockets the largest amount of cash.
The OP seems to measure his proffesionalism and input into the job by the amount of cash he's injected into the latest state of the art equiptment when me and you know that really theres a lot more to it than that. Thats if you don;t take any notice of advertising and marketing bumf.
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Welcome to the virtual world of window cleaners. Anyone can post what they like. Hide whatever they like and claim to be as big, clever and successful as they like. Good 'ere, innit? Ewan just jumps into threads like this to promote the company he works for. He is the best kept secret in window cleaning. Try and find evidence of his firm or real situations he got into.
It's the pure snobbery that cracks me up. A 2 week wannabe windy with an attitude to his fellow WC's. You couldn't make this up. ;D ;D ;D
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Nope I stand firmly by what I said
I have no clue as to what the situation is and the expectations of people on here. We are all different, yes idealistically we would all want to be doing massive contract cleaning jobs, corporate image, but all that takes time.
Budgets, time and manpower factor into this.
Ultimately we would all like to be at that goal point.
Im diplomatic, because I dont know individual situations. I dont know family circumstances, I dont know financial circumstances either, I dont know if anyone sets aside a budget for certain things. Its a very open field
Hi Kate,
did you ever do PR for Nu Labour at all in the past?!!! ;D
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This is like soap opera for window cleaners ;D
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Yea Mike only on a Sunday
More interested in me Calendar though
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;D ;D ;D I might be fairly new to this line of business - but have i now achieved the most posts on this forum for one subject ever or what!!!! 8)
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Er ..........no.
Apart from that, it's the reaction you got from the arrogance you showed in the first place. Shame we don't get to meet people face to face isn't it?
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Crikey Mike have I just turned into Ms M
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Yea Mike only on a Sunday
More interested in me Calendar though
Youre ticking all my boxes Kate.
Less paperwork, more time with my family,able to access my business 24/7 and you'll help me expand it. I'm feeling lucky to have found you, they are all the things i wanna do !!! ;D ;D
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Yea Mike only on a Sunday
More interested in me Calendar though
i would like a calendar but aren't calendars outdated now most people use posh vans to keep track of oppointments. ;D ;D ;D
plus i don't want to see half naked window cleaners on a calendar unless they are female window cleaners ;D
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the pennys just dropt ;D ;D to some on here
realy should have a smiley face stiring a pot to make it more plain ;)
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;D ;D ;D I might be fairly new to this line of business - but have i now achieved the most posts on this forum for one subject ever or what!!!! 8)
YOU SOUND LIKE A numpty!!!
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the pennys just dropt ;D ;D to some on here
realy should have a smiley face stiring a pot to make it more plain ;)
David, do us a favour and try to stick more than 4 or 5 words together that make sense? There's a good lad.
Might be a good idea to use your fingers to type, instead of your forehead.
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Paul pp
just admit it you first posted for help on 10th sept 2010 asking for help setting up a traditional window cleaning company, and you were talked into going wfp by forum members, and now your are annoyed because your original plan would have worked just as well and saved lots of money, that could be spent once established
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the pennys just dropt ;D ;D to some on here
realy should have a smiley face stiring a pot to make it more plain ;)
David, do us a favour and try to stick more than 4 or 5 words together that make sense? There's a good lad.
sorry son will try harder tomoz
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It’s an open question mikecam; I gave you an open answer.
Put you question differently and I will answer that, alternatively explain your reasoning behind what you think is the answer to that question.
Ewan its simple. The guy with ladders and a Mondeo may be a thouroughly reliable and proffesional guy who does a great job and is well liked and trusted by his customers. He has less out lay than the other two. He gets to keep most of his cash. I'm sure everybody with any sense knows this. I know, he takes a risk on a ladder but thats not the question. The best system in the world cannot buy you a good, intimate, trusting, regular clientele and by servicing them with a ladder off your car you aint exactly dangerous, a dinosaur or anything else untoward.
Anyway, there's the answer the ladder guy keeps the most cash, the guy with the latest most expensive WFP system loses the most cash. Basic economics.
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the pennys just dropt ;D ;D to some on here
realy should have a smiley face stiring a pot to make it more plain ;)
Did it drop in a bucket ;D
Is that some Sainsbury's joke that window cleaners don't get Ewan? ???
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In 2006 I was worse than Mindeo man I was clapped out sierra man. It was that bad all my doors had gaffer tape to hide all the rust holes
`Ey up Clapped Out Sierra Man, long time no see. But what makes you think you`re better than ne now :o.
You might be doing well for yourself but I don`t judge success materially. They are just things. So on that note, you can keep that gaffer tape I leant you about 4 years ago ;).
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i would like a calendar but aren't calendars outdated now most people use posh vans to keep track of oppointments. ;D ;D ;D
plus i don't want to see half nacked window cleaners on a calendar unless they are female window cleaners ;D
Us reach and wash guys use our Blackberrys to keep track of our appointments, and if you wanna see a 'nacked' window cleaner you need to catch a glimpse of me anyday around 14.30 hours !!! ;D ;D
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mikecam I wouldn’t say you are 100% wrong there are the exceptions so will saying your 5% correct a better way to put it?
Listen mate. you're not the easiest guy to sway so for me thats a massive plus, that'll do me !!! ;D ;D
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i have a blackberry 8520 great phones for email, web and calendar
and know i don't want to see a naked male cleaner :-X please put it away :o
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mondeo man wins Paul-pp has left the cleaning industry ;D ;D
Paul-pp has left cleanitup or he will set up a new account :-X
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there was no need to delete himself ::)
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We already do all that Mike :) got our first Aussie customer the other day
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maybe he will venture over to another cleaning forum UK :-X.
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five weeks in the game and having a go at another windowcleaners professionalism who has more than likely been trading alot longer...disrespectful. trad or wfp, car or van!
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im montego man.
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No youre not! you are Maseratti Quattroporte man
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;D
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I have been reading this thread this morning and it really pee me off that other window cleaner think they are above other cleaners
Ive been working from from my estate car now since the start off the year as i have two children and am the only driver in the house. I have had my car rear and side windows cover with graphics the same colour as the car and a lot off people think its a van and I'm happy with that.I work both trad and wfp from a back pack i can carry 118 litres off water plus my trad gear with out a problem plus a 30 ft pole on the roof with ladders and an 18 ft pole in the car . I think i run a professional window cleaning company I'm picking up work all the time and do a dam good job and now I'm starting to pick up bigger commercial jobs just got one last week office block inside and out. And I'm waiting to hear back from some more near by. Also my business owns everything from the car to my window cleaning ,power washing and carpet and upholstery cleaning equipment i have saved money i have made and reinvested it on equipment and courses and when i do get a van it will be bought out right with money i have saved which hopefully the begin off next year . I see lots off window cleaners in my area working from cars and pick ups and i never look down at anyone as i know how hard it starting off i always try to have a chat with them . I will post some pictures later off my motor .
thanks for reading Gavin
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That doesn't matter to the mongs on here Gavin. One bod reckons if you aren't working out of a van, you don't have a business at all. Although this forum only has about 1% of all window cleaners in the UK using it, some on here think what is written on here represents the "Bible" of WCing.
Even though we are all window cleaners, some are "Special" window cleaners. Their custies would never have a WC who works out of a car !!! Wonder why some complain about WC's working out of cars poaching their work ??? There are some proper chunks posting all sorts of dross about what tools to use. Funny old world, innit? ;D
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That doesn't matter to the mongs on here Gavin. One bod reckons if you aren't working out of a van, you don't have a business at all. Although this forum only has about 1% of all window cleaners in the UK using it, some on here think what is written on here represents the "Bible" of WCing.
Even though we are all window cleaners, some are "Special" window cleaners. Their custies would never have a WC who works out of a car !!! Wonder why some complain about WC's working out of cars poaching their work ??? There are some proper chunks posting all sorts of dross about what tools to use. Funny old world, innit? ;D
Some even, spend hours on the net trying to work out how to save 35p on a pole/brush etc etc on doing a diy which will also take hours, when they could buy a purpose made tool from a bespoke supplier and spend them hours working earning more than they saved.
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What's that got to do with my post?
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just about it being a funny old world. madness!
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Oh, right DOH! ;D
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I my self can not understand why some people go out buy a brand new van and brand new system and spend the next five or so years paying for it . I my self looked at van and system when i was starting off and there was no way i could aford to do it that way im pleased the way i have done it , i find nothing wrong when working out of a car .
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my car is much more comfortable than any van and i see lots of other trades using cars and looking professional and I quite enjoy building my own brushes,poles and fiddling with my gear usually dont save any money though but i get exactly what i want built a trolley system with a 35ft carbon pole for less than £350 not just a saving of 35p 2hrs scanning internet and 1hr buying and couple of evenings putting it together..I drive a Volvo that i paid £700 if guys want to go out out and spend 20k on setting up and cant make it pay and moan about Mondeo man under cutting them then they should nt waste there time on here or get out there and promote there business to potential customers
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I have been reading this thread this morning and it really pee me off that other window cleaner think they are above other cleaners
Some of there are.
In an ironic sort of way them up ladders ;D
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ive spent 4 grand on van and system and i can do my work faster/safer/easier than i ever could with a ladder and mondeo! :D :D :D
but ill be buying another mondeo next year.........................for pleasure purposes!
i think there great cars and quite a few windys near me use volvos/estates etc.i have no problem with them!im just a bit wiser in terms of how i clean windows as wfp is really the way to go because of speed and safety.
good luck to those with wfp in the back of cars!i personally think you need either a van or trailer.i couldnt get 300-325 L IN THE BACK OF MY OLD MONDEO!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D.
dazmond
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I work out of a van and cozy works out the back of a black london cab round the back of kings cross station, dont you mate ;D ;D
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When I'm not sniffing ladies bike seats like you. ;)
Shame that Paul PP decided to leave us, I'm sure his wisdom and attitude would have made this place that ittle bit richer. ::)
I think the point was made about us all being in the same trade.
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Sorry Cozy, that comment about the blackcab made me chuckle, no offense or anything - good to see some humour turning the post around.
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you could get a large tank in the back of a black cab use bus lanes and go cabbing at night instead of using the mondeo mini cabbing ;D
A van is great but I dont understand why some one would choose to trad out of a van when you can build a good wfp cheaply and be safe but prefer to dismiss WFP completely may be fool. Every one has a choice and until there is a complete ban on using ladders to clean windows.
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You'd have a job getting gutter-vac in the back of a mondeo, I think a trad guy working out of a nice van is just someone who is trying to raise their profile, nought wrong with that.
I know, someone is going to come on here and tell us he has his guttervac in the back of his family saloon.
Along with 27 immigrants and Cruella De Ville no doubt.
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the mondeo is a very under rated car
i had one for around 4 years, second gen estate
i loved it , went well utterly reliable and its the only car i ever pined for when i sold it ;D
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I think the main issue here is not the man in the mondeo , but the people on the DOLE (BENEFIT CHEATS).
The simple solution is to have a licencing system like in scotland,
that would stop anyone trying to do window cleaning on the side.
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I think the main issue here is not the man in the mondeo , but the people on the DOLE (BENEFIT CHEATS).
The simple solution is to have a licencing system like in scotland,
that would stop anyone trying to do window cleaning on the side.
no it does not trust me,
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I don`t think you should judge anyone by what they drive. Even those that drive a flashy,new van will be looked down on by some.
So those of you looking down at a bloke in a Mondeo, will be getting the same from someone as you drive your van.
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its not up to us on here to judge;joe public judges and they see a bloke in a car
and think he eats baked beans and goes to rodeos all the time ;D or am i being a mong
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its not up to us on here to judge;joe public judges and they see a bloke in a car
and think he eats baked beans and goes to rodeos all the time ;D or am i being a mong
Have you heard of a "white van man" David?
Think parachutes and open your mind.
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its not up to us on here to judge;joe public judges and they see a bloke in a car
and think he eats baked beans and goes to rodeos all the time ;D or am i being a mong
your being a mong.a total waste of time mong.is that ok?heres the cheesy grin. ;D ::)
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I think the main issue here is not the man in the mondeo , but the people on the DOLE (BENEFIT CHEATS).
The simple solution is to have a licencing system like in scotland,
that would stop anyone trying to do window cleaning on the side.
The issue is the man in the Mondeo, thats what the title says.
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its not up to us on here to judge;joe public judges and they see a bloke in a car
and think he eats baked beans and goes to rodeos all the time ;D or am i being a mong
your being a mong.a total waste of time mong.is that ok?heres the cheesy grin. ;D ::)
is it your time of the mth or has your team lost again ;)
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would it be same if he drove a rover
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Working on a main rd Thurs, spotted a windy working opposite with ladders & shiny new Unger pole, working a couple of houses in the rd, looked for his van etc - turns out he's working out the back of an old mondeo - if the guys a genuine windy then fair enough, but over the last few days have seen several blokes with old ladders over their shoulders or stuck on old saloon car roof racks, with builders buckets & dirty chams etc.
Do the toppin up the dole boyz really annoy you or do you just let them get on with it?
I find it really annoying that ive invested thousands in decent kit/van/insurance/training/marketing etc for them to turn up & undercut me & drag down this trade >:(
i take it this is the view through nookie bears eyes then.