Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: geefree on August 24, 2010, 10:59:01 pm
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Once you get use to the basic methods of using wfp ,
I am really suprised how quick i can now work..
From , really taking my time.... carefully cleaning and rinsing the top of the frame, then washing all the frame, then washing the glass..... and being scared of dirty drips.
Nowadays its a breeze..... i whip round the whole thing, know exactly where the crucial parts are.... ..know where the drips will occur.. know where to wish over quickly to prevent it...
Does anyone else notice just how quick it can be done exactly right?
with minimum effort.
all the carefuleness , and the getting it just right, without leaving any dirt has now paid off,
Now its just the speed thing and the experience we gained that makes it so worthwhile.
its so easy now.
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I agree Gazza... Some of the houses I do are now so quick... I always take a bit more time if the customer is in though just incase they think I've rushed!
Andy
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i average 3 3 bedrooms an hour and i dont rush,
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Nothing worse than when youve done their house in about a minute because you think theyre out and then as you go to put ticket thru the door open lol
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Yes , me too ....but the end result is the same.. once you know what you are doing and you know all the areas of dirt drops.... its so easy....
I thought i was going too quick ... so i whipped over my own conservatory ... back and forth only once.... and a rinse...
and it is perfect (well wfp perfect) every time.
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Nothing worse than when youve done their house in about a minute because you think theyre out and then as you go to put ticket thru the door open lol
i did that today.. lol,
thought no one in and whipped over it.... dont get me wrong... i know it will be bang on, as i like to no dirt behind.....
but i was too quick... dropped a note and they opened the door...paid me....
oops.... but i thought oh what the heck.. yes i was quick, but it will be perfect and i never get any complaints.
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i average 3 3 bedrooms an hour and i dont rush,
you should easily do 4 per hour if they close ;)
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gazzap8
oh boy can i relate to this right now.....
From , really taking my time.... carefully cleaning and rinsing the top of the frame, then washing all the frame, then washing the glass..... and being scared of dirty drips.
im over paranoid at times i think coz a couple of houses of my first few cleans had a couple of windows that spotted - one i noticed and the second the customer noticed she was in. the thing was id scrubbed like hell - rinsed like hell - got in all the corners - rinse well over the top of the frame etc etc - so having worked that hard on them was surprised and dissapointed that there was these small spotted areas - must admit seldom notice on any now and i do go round to check how thier drying off - a 3 bed semi takes 30-40minutes but i have done one in 25 - so i am seriously lame compared to you go getters lol
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im just starting 3rd cleans with wfp and im starting to speed up! ;) ;D ;Di think itll take me another 3 months to really get the hang of it!
im starting to enjoy it a bit more now esp since getting my clx 22 footer!its really made a difference to my working day!
i could do with a few dry days now!im sick of getting wet!!! ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D
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the problem with been quick is 90% of custy dont care as long as windows are clean, do people complain when they take there car the cash and it is a bit quick no, as long as it is clean that is all that matter
if any questions wfp i explain a bit and then refer them to wikipedia window cleaning, and it bigs up wfp
To use the WFP system, the window and frames are scrubbed with a wet brush to loosen dirt and then rinsed with highly purified or deionized water. Because the water is pure, it leaves no marks when it dries. Some firms have a large container of deionized or purified water in the back of their vehicle, which is pumped up the WFP to the window.
The advantage of a WFP system is that it leaves windows and trim cleaner than with a squeegee, it removes more dirt from the grooves on window frames and it reaches windows in places too dangerous to put a ladder. Also WFD systems can be used in the rain as rainfall will not re-activate any soap residue that causes white rain spots.
Some window cleaners prefer expensive "professional" solutions as opposed to dish soap. However dish soap is still the most common cleaning solution used by professionals. Dish soap can leave a film which attracts dirt and dust to the window.
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Hi mark,
I was exactly the same, i made sure not one single drip , dropped....
i then was so careful , it was taking me half hour every clean....
i rinsed and rinsed again.
the most crucial part is the spine between the top two small openers
The reason the dirty water always drips down from there is because we cannot wash underneath the centre of the top openers.
Now, this is what i do.... first clean, customer is in.....
i ask them to open the top two small windows and wipe the spine with a cloth..... they always oblige....
problem gone immediately.!
you are doing things the right way mate, now you just need to speed up, but that will come naturally, and you know you have started the right way....
Having said that , i always, always do a first clean twice.
and check for drips.
Never ever leave a grill or a top frame, as it will come back later and bite you....
take your time , clean it all... get it right, and you will fly through them all.
Later ! ;)
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a tip i have found for first cleans, is if they have a out side tap i was all there windows down with the pressure out of the tap, clears all the cobwebs and a lot of the dirt, by the time u get around and set up wfp it is pretty easy then
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Hi Darren,
done that before now, but by the time i have messed about i could have one window done ... but its good to do it if your set up allows very quickly.
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Averaging 4 detached per hour and 5 semis... without a sweat...
so for me all the little training up things work.
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i find it ok as a lot of houses i do are out in the country and havent been done for years, so i can take my time, i then find that a lot of my cleans after are really easy, i havent done my hall window for about 3 months and it is only just starting to get dirty, but every one has different ways and it is all about finding there own way
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Yes, thats true.... we can pick up little pieces of advice and use that... but crucially ,we all work in our own way and find the best method for ourselves.
you are right Darren.
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the only thing i woudl recommend to any who id wfp is to practise on there own windows before they go out, so they dont look stupid and get a tech they like
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i average 3 3 bedrooms an hour and i dont rush,
not picking but that cant be too compact as i can do that trad?
on the other hand i worked with wfp cleaner with a trolley yesterday and noticed how fast it is on the right work , changing over very soon i know you lot say how much better it is constantly but on domestic ive had my doubts for a long time but changing over now - mainly at first for safety but now seeing the potential and less effort too !!
happy days
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I was the first in my local area to go wfp, as far as I am aware at least. Have to be honest though, I don't think I ran the business in the right manner for the first 3 or 4 years wfp. It wasn't until the 4th year that I actually made more money than when I was trad, in terms of net profit. I presume most of you hyper pro wfp guys never did trad? It seems many are unaware how much a man with a ladder can earn with the right work. I think thats the key for both methods, do the right work for the method to be most effective.
In those first few years of wfp, 30 or 40% of the work was simply no quicker, or even slower than trad. The odd job was twice as quick. Overall, I got round roughly 3 hours quicker per week using wfp once I was up to speed. I never really thought about it, £75 quid a week better off, happy days I figured. In reality it was just the tip of wfp's potential.
It kind of hit me that commercial work where was where the money was. After 3 years of a 90% domestic round I started taking the day off fridays to canvas commercial work. I even became a council approved contractor. The reality was this was when wfp became worth it.
I don't think a domestic only round really benefits from wfp much, in the case of what mine was, not at all. Those 3 hours got eaten into by the "out of hours" hassal that wfp brings. The extra running costs also eat into the extra dough you think your making. I lost some very well paid work on the domestic front due to the method I was using, it hurt.
From what I have read, I think this site is a bit of a wfp convention. Probably a fair number of young guys who have never really given working off a ladder a shot, and don't know much about it. My business is now wfp, and suited in the main, to wfp. You know what though, the window cleaner who has done best in my local town is 1 guy with a ladder. He told me he has averaged 62k gross profit over the last 5 years. You see his motor and house, you would believe him. He does work his ass off mind, 10 hour days in the summer. There is a firm with 3 employees, the boss lives in a bog standard 3 bed semi, and is financed up to the eyeballs with his flash vans and ionics systems. He used to work for them, and started wfp just after me. Doesn't appear to be doing that well on face value.
There are a lot of polers round my way living in rabbit hutches, just getting by. I don't think its about being quick, or a "busy fool". Get the right work and keep it, thats my message. Applies to either method.
I think the way forward in our trade in to go wfp now, all in all. But if your not intending to get the right work, and just solidier in with a round made for ladders, I wouldn't even bother.
Sorry to go on, tell its raining here eh! ::)
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yeah i agree.
takes longer to get the hose n pole set up than doing the job itself! 8)
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Just up the road from me Martin, I'm from a place called Bisley.
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62k net profit for 5yrs off ladders. ??? you miss the point of wfp. how much is he gonna earn if and when he has a bad fall. it happens
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Just up the road from me Martin, I'm from a place called Bisley.
chippenham aint it? we used to do a few office blocks that way - tesco offices ....
good to know someone in and around the area.
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Fellows remember what they paying for ...........................Clean windows ...................not time!!!!!!!!! ??? ???.
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62k net profit for 5yrs off ladders. ??? you miss the point of wfp. how much is he gonna earn if and when he has a bad fall. it happens
No, 62k gross profit average, over a 5 year term. Man, you sound like a worry mongering salesman. I'm sure it happens, but you could kill yourself falling over a plant pot. Someone who is experienced is low risk with a ladder. It usually noobs, or idiots taking risks who hurt themselves with ladders.
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Just up the road from me Martin, I'm from a place called Bisley.
chippenham aint it? we used to do a few office blocks that way - tesco offices ....
good to know someone in and around the area.
More Stroud way actually, few miles east of.
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ok, used to do one of renishaws offices that way but dont really go that far into the sticks anymore :)
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When people say they can do 4 detatched houses an hour,are they talking all round or just fronts?I must be doing something wrong,I'd be lucky to get 2 two detached houses done all round in an hour.
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All houses are different. I have a patch where I can do 4 in an hour, all new 3 bed detached with small windows. All next to each other. Very rare to do that many though. Providing you price well 2 an hour isn't so bad. I reckon I average 2.5 standard 4 bed detached houses per hour.
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yeah it can be very different in time with certain jobs.
have a social club i do in an hour £110 and then on the other hand have a shop i do which takes 30 mins £15.00
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£110 for an hour Martin, holy crap. Did you know it would only take an hour when you quoted? Surprised you haven't been undercut quite honestly. Is it like a once a year thing?
I feel particularly uneasy sometimes when I know I'm creaming it in, kind of wonder what the person who is paying me is thinking. Very rare I earn even half of that in an hour.
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no its 4 weekly mate - doesnt matter if i get undercut as we do a good job and the clients are happy, so they wouldnt change over anyway.
end of the day you get what you pay for.
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Sorry mate, don't buy that. Most of us would do a good job for half that price, you know that.
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what! you dont agree you get what you pay for?
you may not agree but at the end of the day i have 5 staff 3 vans ... and i very good reputation from many many customers.
so i must be doing something right!
dont see how you can charge half the price when you dont even know the job! muppet!
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People that have come into window cleaning the wfp route probably don't realise how fast a ladder monkey can go. 3 or 4 semi's an hour is reasonable. However wfp is faster once the work is converted. It's very rare that I'd choose trad because it's faster on my work, my rounds are really varied as well.
As for going too fast, I always take a lot longer on the first clean and use up a lot more water, I then tell the customer that we will use a lot less water next time and be a lot faster. From then on I go as fast as physics will allow even if the customer is in. Rather than work slower if the customer is in, I will spend the time having a brief chat with the customer asking how they are and what their holidays have been like ect. That's a much better use of time than deliberately working slower so you feel the customers getting their moneys worth.
Simon.
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what! you dont agree you get what you pay for?
you may not agree but at the end of the day i have 5 staff 3 vans ... and i very good reputation from many many customers.
so i must be doing something right!
dont see how you can charge half the price when you dont even know the job! muppet!
LOL, an hours work is an hours work? If you meant all 5 guys are there at the same time, I misunderstood. If your talking one man, £55 will get you an excellent service from a window cleaner. Pay me £110 per hour or £55, I do my best, every time. So no, you don't get what you pay for.
I also have to chuckle that you gloat about the size of your company. You must be doing something right eh? Read about the busy fool I was discussing just a few posts back. The guy with loads of flash vans on finance living in a rabbit hutch. Sounds familiar? Its about your bottom line. Reading back through your own posts you admit yourself your not doing so well.
but think what we could do with all that money we spend on it - nearly every month there is something to buy for wfp. i sometimes fell wfp makes things complicated/faffing around but at the end of the day it safer. scary to think how much money you would of had.
Classic mistake of trying to run before you can walk. Expansion does not equal profit...it also is nothing to gloat about. Your no better than the rest of us mate.
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we are losing track now lads, come on now , no need for calling names or slagging people off, we all have a view on how our business's should be run....
And we all run them differently, some share on here how they run theirs, and thats fine.
But we dont need to put monetary figures down , its a topic about speed , not earnings. ;)
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well nigel im enjoying wfp and id say 90% of my round is domestic.to be able to get round on time without too much struggle/the safety aspect/the extra windows im now cleaning for extra money.im ALREADY doing better than i was trad and ive been trad for 16 years!
after the first/second cleans are out of the way its so much quicker and easier than trad IMO!I will of course take on more commercial and bigger residential as time goes on!!
oh and martin if you do clean a social club for 110quid and it takes you an hour on your own you will lose it mate one day.thats a total rip off!id happily clean it for half that price! :P :P
regards
dazmond
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Its the guys price !
What right do any of us have to pull him down for that... tell you what... i would not do a social clud on the cheap... its commercial.... its funded by a fund .
WE ALL HAVE UNDER AND OVERPRICED WORK. ##
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Been wfp over five years and still Learning
Anyone who thinks they know it all is heading for some probs
Our commitment this year is to continuous improvement and that really makes you understand your equipment the tasks and increases speed and profit
An expert ? Only in your own mind
Each new day is a day anyone can learn something new even someone as old as me
Gordon
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How old are u gordon ;)
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HOW CAN YOU STILL BE LEARNING AFTER 5 YEARS WFP?? ::) :P :P
surely you must know it all by now or have you got alzheimers? ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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im a expert and im quick ( AS YOU NO GAZZA )
DAZMOND we all learn after 5 years , every new property is a learning procees .
you will learn , where your hose will snag , any bad windows ect .
im doing a new property in the morning and i will learn its something as long as i want to will not stop doing LEARNING .
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Gazza I am 48 years old
unfortunately the way of the world is the older you get the wiser you get
when younger i thought i was the bees knees now older and wiser i realise i was right i am i just dont need to shout about it
god it must be so frustrating being young and realising how wrong you usually are
oh the time it took me to type this i made a pound
48yrs and getting better wiser and richer all the time
when i was a lad blah blah blah..........
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well nigel im enjoying wfp and id say 90% of my round is domestic.to be able to get round on time without too much struggle/the safety aspect/the extra windows im now cleaning for extra money.im ALREADY doing better than i was trad and ive been trad for 16 years!
regards
dazmond
Hi Daz, yes absolutely its quicker. I don't think many people would argue with that. As I said in my long drawn out post, you have other things to factor in before you can say your in the black.
* How much time do you spend buggering around, when as a ladder monkey you could do that extra job.
* How long do you spend filling up?
* Have you lost any work due to wfp yet? You will. You would of kept it trad.
* Factor in the extra overheads.
* Are you really making more money? I tended to be smug with myself about how quick I was, rather than go get the extra work needed to fill the week. I took it easy as I had completed my work.
I'm sure you know all this already, but factor it all in.
I was particularly quick trad granted, but I can't honestly say I could make wfp pay with the domestic market. It wasn't until I got the commercial work that it really was worth the extra money and hassal. I have been wfp nearly 8 years now, every job is a new challenge. I am still very partial to trad though, and if all things are equal I will trad domestic work as most customers prefer it. 8 times out of ten the pole is quicker though, once you have the overheads you may as well use it.
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If its quicker 8 out of 10 , then the overheads certainly be money well spent....
I cant see how it does not pay doing domestic?
90% of w/c on here will have mainly domestic work .
i wont go into earnings, .. but it sure pays
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IVE LOST ONE NIGEL OUT OF 340 CUSTIES!
you even said yourself you d not really made any more money in the first four years! ::) ::)
that might be your story but i bet by this time next year ill be 5grand up AFTER expenses than i was before wfp!
i take my business seriously and im well established.also i implement price rises every april for most of my custies.also im pricing new work higher and getting most of the jobs!
i have a very good domestic round and i have the scope to add very large country properties to it.
as for the faffing around its takes me around 40 mins to fill up at night and after the initial outlay of wfp its virtually a few pound here and there for spares etc.im earning 30-40% more most full days than i was cleaning off ladders!
i let you know as i go on!a lot of my custies are well happy with wfp!the frames and glass have never been cleaner and i clean the extra windows now that were too awkward of ladders.
i think your attitude is all wrong!im finding the more positive i am about wfp and my business the better it gets!roy hardings done very well just on mainly domestic work and im banging a similar round into shape!(i wish!) ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
ill get there in the end!
dazmond
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into my third year of wfp and i still have the odd
tweak here and there on my existing work to improve
biggest difference between me now and me three years
ago is when i approach a new job i know 99%of the time where i
will and wont have any probs
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when younger i thought i was the bees knees now older and wiser i realise i was right i am i just dont need to shout about it
Im 25 and i know im the bees knees ;D
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best ever day today.£250!i would of never been able to earn that on ladders! :D :D :D
im well chuffed!
im really getting into my stride after 3 months wfp.
onwards and upwards
dazmond
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best ever day today.£250!i would of never been able to earn that on ladders! :D :D :D
im well chuffed!
im really getting into my stride after 3 months wfp.
onwards and upwards
sweeeeeeet. How long was you out for and how many houses was that daz
dazmond
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if all things are equal I will trad domestic work as most customers prefer it.
Not my experience at all Nigel. I find they like it more as it cleans the frames out etc..